Hayabusa Probe Fails Landing Attempt

wschalle writes "Yesterday, at 3:46 PM EST the probe successfully dropped a small object onto the asteroid as a touchdown target. JAXA then apparently lost control of the probe for 3 hours. The probe went to an auto-pilot mode during the communications failure, collecting data about its flight and saving it for later transmission. The probe's exact location is unknown, but it is estimated to be between 10 and 100 kilometers from the asteroid at this time. The mission has been troubled by repeated failures, including the loss of a small robotic lander, and a gyroscope failure that was later repaired."

Comments

Close.

[Chickenofbristol55]

but it is estimated to be between 10 and 100 kilometers from the asteroid at this time.

That's kind of like that epidemiologist saying "the deaths from the bird flu could range from 5 to 150 million"

The point is we have no idea. It's easier that way, trust me.

I think that 'care factor = 0'....

[demondawn]

...really underscores people's interest in the space program in the United States nowadays. It seems that because Japan is interested in doing -science-, rather than flag-waving, it's not nearly as glamorous. Of course, the same could be said of the U.S. Space Program. George W. Bush said he wants us to go to the Moon again. I haven't heard anything about science in his statement on the topic; merely flag-waving.
Now don't get me wrong, patriotism is a great thing. I think there are many applications that could benefit any nation that goes into space, and I applaud the Japanese for undertaking such an ambitious project (which, if you read TFA, may still succeed!)

Re:I think that 'care factor = 0'....

[Pharmboy]

I haven't heard anything about science in his statement on the topic; merely flag-waving.

I have, but not from GW, who isn't a scientist anyway. Although Steven Hawking would disagree about going to Mars (or the moon), there is some logic to going back to the moon, if we ever expect to do hard core space exploration. We will need a place to launch from, and the moon fits the ticket. It is close enough that we can supply it and rescue from it (remember, we will have many more space crafts at that time). It is also close enough that we can more afford to have crews there. Also, it is easier to capture people's imaginations (and tax dollars) about a station on the moon, especially if it can be seen with a telescope.

It has 1/6th of the earth's gravity, so it will be easier to launch from, and there may be enough raw materials on the moon to use for fuel to begin with, reducing the amount of fuel we have to send to start with. It is the closest and safest place to test theories about space travel, which is not a safe business to begin with. There *IS* commercial potential as well. If commercial space travel seems far fetched, ask Burt Rutan of Scaled Composites, or Sir Richard Branson, the owner of Virgin Galactic, who is investing heavily in the concept of commercial space travel.

I'm not saying this is the best way (because I don't know...), but there is a fair amount of logic *IF* we ever expect to have regular space travel, more than once or twice a year beyond our own planet. Personally, I can't think of a better way for the science communities of all countries to get together, and every country could participate, even if in some small way.

Many people thought JFK was out of his mind for thinking we could go to the moon before 1970, but you don't hear about them any more since we actually did it.

DRM aboard

[k00110]

communications failure

The sony rootkit was calling home at that time

It's Rocket Science

[blueZhift]

This is just another reminder that this is rocket science and isn't an easy thing to pull off. I can't help but wonder how easy or difficult it is for more experienced groups like NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, to share information and expertise with newer groups. For purely scientific missions like this, global collaboration would probably have helped a lot. Not that there wasn't any of that at all, but I do wonder.

In any case, I hope they won't be soured on future missions. Failures are just a part of the learning process.

Re:It's Rocket Science

[cyclone96]

It actually can be legally very difficult to share information with foreign entities about how to fly things in space (even friendly ones). Under American law, a lot of space technology is considered "defense articles" and fall under the jurisdiction of the International Traffic in Arms Regulations (ITAR) laws.

Legally, JPL (or an engineer working for them) would need to make sure that they were not violating ITAR (i.e., get the lawyers involved) or get an exception made (which is NOT easy). This usually requires some sort of official collaboration that is in place before the mission begins.

For example, this exists to a limited extent on the International Space Station. I work for NASA on ISS as a federal employee. I have a specific exemption such that I can share information with the European Space Agency on how to design/fly a resupply vehicle to ISS. Some of my contractors do not have this exemption. It's actually a huge pain to work around, and the contractors are extremely protective of their interests (as they ought to be, Hughes was fined an enormous amount of money when they helped the Chinese troubleshoot a problem in the Long March rocket). In the worst case, you can in fact end up in jail for violating ITAR laws.

ITAR has been the subject of a great deal of debate. On one hand, space technology is a keystone of the defense of the United States and protecting it legally sounds like a good idea. On the other hand, ITAR laws have caused many satellite buyers to purchase non-American hardware, which hurts the industry and stifles the very innovation in space technology that gives the US such an upper hand.

Re:Well....

[Anonymous Coward]

"meat up"? Wha... ...eww. Just forget I asked.

Re:I hate to be harsh to the Japanese/JAXA, but...

[richdun]

As someone who has worked in/around Japanese space hardware (the JEM intended for ISS), I can say that JAXA knows how to build a great spacecraft, maybe even better, cleaner, and with more emphasis on absolute accuracy than some American spacecraft. Like parent said, this was their first time doing a lot of these things, so I'm sure they'll learn plenty from this and get it right the next time.

Experience helps

[Brett Buck]

I think there are an awful lot of excessively harsh comments here. These guys are trying to do a very difficult mission with virtually no applicable experience. Sure, there's a lot of information that, say, NASA (or more accurately, the contractors who work for NASA/DOD/other customers) has, but you simply can't effectively transfer the experience needed for this type of engineering.

      By the way, there are some very good reasons* that US space projects take so long and cost so much. It's because there are enough experienced engineers around to know where to worry and what to worry about. That didn't build up in a few tries. Some contractors have literally hundreds, bordering on a thousand, successful space missions under their belts.

      All the documents and "design processes" in the world cannot make up for having a few guys around with the necessary background to take a look at the design or implementation, and just see where the obvious problem areas might me.

        It's a tough loss, but it's just the cost traversing of the learning curve.

      Brett

    * Of course, there are some "bad reasons" for overruns and schedule slips, too - usually, overly-optimistic schedules and budgets! In fact, a lot of the time there is no one in the entire acquisition system that has a stake in getting the *real* cost or *real* schedule.

NOOOOO!

[Xaositecte]

Definantely the work of Jaquio...

Probe still alive; another attempt in a few days

[FleaPlus]

The summary makes it sound like it's over for the probe, which is far from the case. Emily Lakdawalla of the Planetary Society has been keeping track of the latest details. According to her posts, although it will take several days to get the probe back into the proper position, they should be ready for another landing attempt sometime next week.