TiVo Files Patent For RFID Schema

JamesAlfaro wrote to mention an article on the site TechWeb, which reports that Tivo has filed a patent for an RFID-based preferences schema. From the article: "The multimedia mobile personalization system would have a remote control that recognizes the viewer's RFID tag closest to the PVR. The remote control identifies and notifies the multimedia device through the RFID chip in the person's clothing or body to tailor the media content to their preferences. The remote control device would identify and link the viewer to the system using an 'RFID tag that is attached to a key ring, necklace, watch, in his wallet, or even a sub dermal tag inserted somewhere in the user's body.'"

Comments

Massive technological overkill

[Ithika]

Because choosing preferences onscreen or by pressing a button on a remote control is so labour-intensive and laborious. It's a wonder mankind manages to use things as they are.

Re:Massive technological overkill

[ergo98]

Because choosing preferences onscreen or by pressing a button on a remote control is so labour-intensive and laborious. It's a wonder mankind manages to use things as they are.

"It appears that Tom has entered the room. Shall I switch to Channel 54 - HotTeenAnal?"

Re:Massive technological overkill

[slashedmydot]

We've survived thousands of years without tv, tv-remotes, radio, computers, the internet, (mobile) phones, electricity, soap, toilets, toiletpaper, shoes, penicillin and the list goes on and on and on..... so that stuff is all "Massive technological overkill" (if we'd follow your line of thought) because we can survive without it.

My point is: Your kind of argument is soooo lame, it is even lamer than TiVo's patent.

Re:Massive technological overkill

[Ithika]

No, you managed to completely miss my point. The current solution (the remote control) has no flaws which this system solves. Television, toilet paper, the internet are all inventions to solve problems; this is just use of technology because it exists. And, use where it complicates the situation. Why not just have a button on the remote marked "Dad's prefs", "Mum's prefs", "Johnny's prefs"? That way conflicts can be managed sensibly (by talking about who wants to watch what) rather than some priority system which the TiVo attributes to different RFIDs. Why do *you* think this system is *not* overkill?

Re:Massive technological overkill

[dwandy]

No time to press so many butto

Re:Massive technological overkill

[slashedmydot]

"Why do *you* think this system is *not* overkill?"

1. Security. I don't want my girlfriend to be able to change my preferences. I don't want visitors (kids and/or family) to be able to select my "super ultra hardcore porn channel".

2. Speed. When I grab the remote with RFID-scanner my tv instantly knows who I am. I don't have to go through a list of users.

Disclamer: I actually don't think RFID is the best solution for this 'problem'. I think face-recognition is way better.

FRIST PSOT

[LordSnooty]

DUPE!!!!

Cor, that feels great, I've always wanted to do that.

Ert, sub-dermal tag?

[petabyte]

even a sub dermal tag inserted somewhere in the user's body.

I'll be getting off the ride now thanks!! I know they want to cover that in their patent but it gives me the creeps.

lame

[geekoid]

"The multimedia mobile personalization system would have a remote control that recognizes the viewer's RFID tag closest to the PVR."

with a system that uses a remote, why would you assume the person closest is the one whose preferences you need?

I find it humors(in a nervous laugh kind of way) that they assume we will all have rfid embedded in our cloths or person.

I remember reading about something like this

[LearnToSpell]

with Bill Gates's "new" house. (hah. You thought that was going to be a dupe joke, didn't you?) Anyway, he had/has a little tag you wear, and the TVs change as you move, only the closest phone rings, etc. Same thing? I don't know how far his "preferences" extended.

This patent is good

[alispguru]

Patenting the idea will discourage others from using it for this purpose. I like the idea of, say, having an RFID tag in your hospital bracelet, but this is just a way for advertisers to get their hooks even more deeply into us.

Just Overkill

[TubeSteak]

Do you know people who will spend inordinate amounts of time searching for a lost remote instead of just changing the channel by hand? :raises his hand:
I do

Re:Just Overkill

[ergo98]

Do you know people who will spend inordinate amounts of time searching for a lost remote instead of just changing the channel by hand? :raises his hand:

With hundreds of channel it really isn't convenient to use little up/down arrows on the television anymore - effectively the user interface is borked if you don't have the remote. Neither of my DVD players will allow me to play a DVD without the remotes (they have a play button, but no method of choosing items on the DVD menu).

Re:Just Overkill

[krakelohm]

Yes its stupid I agree, but on this subject... you cannot do anything with your series 2 tivo if you lose the remote control. There are some pretty lights on the front of the box, and thats about it. No buttons.

Re:Just Overkill

[Peaceful_Patriot]

"Do you know people who will spend inordinate amounts of time searching for a lost remote instead of just changing the channel by hand? :raises his hand"

This brings up an issue which has always bugged me: Why don't they put a 'page' button on the set so you can FIND the damned remote? Geeze. This seems like a no-brainer to me.

I'm sorry...

[barfy]

Isn't this like patenting using paint to protect the outside of your house?

Recognizing an identity and reacting to it, is a primary function and obvious function of RFID. You know like using lightbulbs to illuminate your closet.

Re:I'm sorry...

[back_pages]

You claim that "There must be a documented motivation to combine the technologies, or the practice of combining them must be known to a person of ordinary skill in the relevant art." But the "person skilled in the art" clause in patent law, does not refer to an actual person who has done it before. It asks that if an imaginary "person skilled in the art" was given the same task, would they have been able to come up with the idea?

The original poster is 100% correct. No offense, but I have no clue where "would they have been able to come up with the idea" question has any base in 35 USC, 37 CFR, or the MPEP. If you have any citations, I'd love to see them. I assure you that this is not the operative question when patent examiners are rejecting your application.

I advise that you become familiar with the Manual of Patent Examining Procedure because the original poster is clearly familiar with it.

Here are two relevant portions of the MPEP regarding how to prove something is "obvious", MPEP 2143 and 2143.01.

MPEP 2143

MPEP 2143.01

You will find the original poster's comments are completely in line with the Manual of Patent Examining Procedure. With all due respect, comments and opinions that diverge from what the MPEP states are either a) suggestions to improve the patent system or b) simply irrelevant, depending on the context. In both cases, these comments would have no relation to the current US patent system as it exists.

It is my intention to be informative - I hope you won't take offense. If you have other questions about the MPEP or how the patent system works, I'd be happy to cite what I can.

Use for targetting ads?

[HockeyPuck]

So if a company starts using RFID tags in their clothing http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4873013/ then it's POSSIBLE that the tivo remote control reads those RFID tags to then provide feedback to the TiVo box which then uplinks to the main network that you are wearing Levi Jeans and a corresponding ad appears on your TV...

Your remote control is now big brother...

Re:Use for targetting ads?

[confusedwiseman]

In that case I'll just keep a basket of Victoria's Secret stuff next to the TV.

Mooooooooommmmmmm !!!

[Anonymous Coward]

Johnny's sitting closer to ther Tivo than meeeeee !!

Re:Mooooooooommmmmmm !!!

[mobby_6kl]

Well now have more options available than previously:

-Wrap Johnny in tinfoil
-Lock him in a Faraday cage
-Microwave him
-Take away the tag (if it's externally attached to Johnny)
-Remove the tag (if it's not)

Obligatory ISR...

[Anonymous Coward]

In Soviet Russia, TiVo records you!!!

Recap:

[kryten_nl]

I want an RFID tag (Score:5, Funny)
by LilGuy (150110) on Tuesday November 22, @06:02PM (#14091831)
Embed me please! I want never again to have to manually pay for anything, prove my identity, or set my TiVo to my preferences. Thanks.
--

Ordering food (Score:5, Funny)
by nizo (81281) on Tuesday November 22, @06:28PM (#14092075)
Actually if they can have one that broadcasts food preferences (I hate onions and pickles) we might be on to something here. I wonder if it is worth some of my privacy to not have to pick off the onions and pickles because I always forget to ask the Wendy's cashier not to put them on? Pretty much applies to all my other food too; just forget adding onions or pickles please.
--

RFID + DRM (Score:4, Insightful)
by lenhap (717304) on Tuesday November 22, @06:08PM (#14091892)
Anyone else think of what would happen if this became a standard feature. Sure it may be nice to not have to touch a single button, but as soon as Hollywood can have a show DRM'd to a specific person rather than a specific machine, don't you think they would.

Tinfoil hats aside, Hollywood dictating per-person DRM doesn't seem to be too big of a jump for me. I certainly can't wait for the day that I can't watch a recorded show just because I wasn't the one to record it. Go tivo!
---

Does this mean that pr0n will just start popping (Score:4, Funny)
by digitaldc (879047) on Tuesday November 22, @06:44PM (#14092238)
...up in all different locations at the most inappropriate times?
--

This is terrible!! (Score:4, Interesting)
by dschuetz (10924) on Tuesday November 22, @06:12PM (#14091927)
This use of RFID tags will destroy my privacy! You just watch...overnight, we'll have a terrible Orwellian police state where we're all branded with the RFID tag of the beast on our foreheads!
---

Re:Well...

[east coast]

How long do you think it'll be before they track everyone with hypodermal RFID chips?

What? That's old hat. Now they inject you with tiny men, like on Fantastic Voyage, and they speak words of wisdom when "the others" become mean and nasty...

They tried to tell me it was some kind of schizophrenia or something but I scoff at their "medical science". I know the great Cthulhu is just helping me do what's best for me.

Where did I put that chainsaw.... hmmmm....

And if multiple people are in the room?

[Mr. Cancelled]

I agree with the 1st comment: This is ridiculous for Tivo, or any other home entertainment device! Way to sign away your privacy, just to save yourself from having to push a button.

But it also brings up a good question... What if I have 3 or 4 people aprox. the same distance away from the box? For that matter, what if the person closest to the box isn't the person who should be deciding what to watch at that point in time?

But really, this is just another example of why I built my own PVR instead of going the Tivo route: They just don't seem to get what "I" want in a PVR. At the top of that list is that I don't want Tivo controlling what I watch, and what I can record (and they do both). Under that top item though are lots of other reasons as ridicuous as this idea... they just seem so out of touch with what consumers want, and instead of finding out, and tailoring their offerings to what consumers want, they kiss ass to the media companies, allowing them to dictate what Tivo users can and can't do/have.

The Real Reason

[slarrg]

Of course, the real reason Tivo wants to have viewers identified by RFID is so they can sell the data to the television networks for advertising tracking. They already do this with the their data. Remember the Janet Jackson superbowl incident was said by Tivo to be the most rewinds of any event because they track everything their users watch/record/rewind. The obvious "holy grail" is to track it to an individual person, not just to the box.

Diagrams

[Spammy McGriddle]

Patent diagrams of two TiVo scenarios, one for remote control and one for sharing shows in hotels, can be found here: http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2005-11/tivos-rfid-rem ote-control-patent/