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Slashback: Google, Surveillance, Stardust

Slashback tonight brings some corrections, clarifications, and updates to previous Slashdot stories, including Brin's defense of Google's recent actions in China, DoJ criticizes Microsoft's delay meeting antitrust regulations, Bush allies defend NSA domestic surveillance, Wisconsin rolls back open-source voting, a look back at Pixar, and Stardust samples exceed expectations -- Read on for details.

Brin defends Google's recent actions in China. An anonymous reader writes "Fortune Magazine recently had a chance to talk to Google co-founder Sergi Brin and asked him about the company's decision to accept censorship in China. As you might guess, Brin defended the move. From the article: 'The end result was that we weren't available to about 50 percent of the users. [...] We ultimately made a difficult decision, but we felt that by participating there, and making our services more available, even if not to the 100 percent that we ideally would like, that it will be better for Chinese Web users, because ultimately they would get more information, though not quite all of it.' Human Rights Watch boss Ken Roth, though, wasn't impressed and had a few scathing remarks about the decision."

DoJ criticizes Microsoft's delay in meeting antitrust regulations. Rob writes to tell us that the US Department of Justice is complaining that Microsoft is dragging their feet on certain antitrust technical documentation submission guidelines. From the article: "Microsoft acknowledged the current problems and the steps it is taking to correct them in a recent status report but "has not detailed the seriousness of the current situation," according to the DoJ."

Bush allies defend NSA domestic surveillance. Jason Jardine writes to tell us News.com is reporting that Bush's allies are coming out of the woodwork to support the recently criticized NSA domestic surveillance program. From the article: "In a continuation of a full-court press that began a day earlier, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales on Tuesday told students at Georgetown University that a wartime president has the lawful authority to eavesdrop on Americans' telephone calls and e-mail messages without court approval." Forgive me if I don't agree.

Wisconsin rolls back open-source voting. Irvu writes "One day after the good news that Wisconsin was requiring open-source electronic-voting software was reported on Slashdot, it was gutted. According to BloackboxVoting.org the open-source public review provisions of the bill were removed and replaced with a version requiring the state to escrow the code and, unless a recount occurs, provide only internal examination. The final form of the bill reads: 'Sec 5.905 "...Unless authorized under this section, the board shall withhold access to those software components from any person who requests access under s.19.35...' Meaning that public review is not required and should be, by default, refused. The Legislation History [PDF]reflects the change and points to the final crippled bill. [PDF]"

A look back at Pixar history. An anonymous reader writes "With all of the recent press coverage of Pixar getting bought out by Disney it seems only fitting to take a look back at Pixar history. LowEndMac.com has an interested retrospective writeup exploring the beginnings of Pixar back in the 1970's by Dick Shoup through to the current day."

Stardust samples exceed expectations. carpdeus writes "MSNBC is reporting that the recent opening of the Stardust sample in a clean room appears to be a great success. From the article: 'It exceeds all expectations,' said Donald Brownlee, Stardust's lead scientist from the University of Washington. 'It's a huge success,' he said in a university statement released Wednesday. 'We can see lots of impacts. There are big ones, there are small ones. The big ones you can see from 10 feet away,' Brownlee observed."

22 of 339 comments (clear)

  1. You mean Brin defends his meal ticket by winkydink · · Score: 5, Insightful

    '...We ultimately made a difficult decision, but we felt that by
    participating there, and making our services more available, even if not
    to the 100 percent that we ideally would like, that it will be better for
    Chinese Web users, because ultimately they would get more information,
    though not quite all of it.'


    Meaning: "Thereby ensuring that we could sell ads that reach most,
    even if not to the 100% that we ideally would like, of the enormous
    Chinese market."

    Don't kid yourself. This has nothing to do with being evil or not and
    everything to do with making money. Great big piles of money.

    --

    "I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey

  2. Capturing The Stuff of Stars by ackthpt · · Score: 5, Insightful

    NASA/JPL explain how dust was captured in Aerogel

    alas, poor pixar! i knew him, horatio.

    So... how long before the forces of ennui at Disney get to Steve and John, driving them out like Roy? How long before Pixar films are littered with the dumb, ultra-hip Disney characters populate the films?

    --

    A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
  3. The US is not in a state of war by Eric+Smith · · Score: 5, Insightful
    "Attorney General Alberto Gonzales on Tuesday told students at Georgetown University that a wartime president has the lawful authority to eavesdrop on Americans' telephone calls and e-mail messages without court approval."
    Even if that Gonzales' statement was true (which it isn't), the United States is not in a state of war, so the reasoning is completely specious.

    For the United States to enter a war, Congress must exercise their constitutional authority to declare war. They have chosen not to do so.

    1. Re:The US is not in a state of war by X · · Score: 4, Informative

      Even if the Gonzales' statement was true (which it isn't)

      No, it really is:
      http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode50/us c_sec_50_00001811----000-.html

      the United States is not in a state of war

      No, it really is.

      For the United States to enter a war, Congress must exercise their constitutional authority to declare war. They have chosen not to do so.

      Actually they have. First, the US is at war "with those responsible for the Sept. 11'th attacks" and it is at war with Iraq. Both bills specifically invoke the War Powers Resolution.

      Given that the wiretaps are in theory being used to track down suspected members of Al Qaeda, they would appear to be authorized by and well within the scope of the Sept. 18th resolution.

      It's sad when actions with such significance are glossed over to the extent that people aren't actually aware of them.

      --
      sigs are a waste of space
    2. Re:The US is not in a state of war by X · · Score: 5, Informative

      Why oh why is this simple, yet critical fact so rarely spoken? Congress authorized funds, but NEVER declared war!

      It's not spoken of because it's not true. Take a look at Senate Joint Resolution #23 from Sept. 18th, 2001 (see link in my other comment in this thread). It very much authorizes the use of force, and most importantly invokes the War Powers Resolution. It doesn't mention one thing about funds.

      --
      sigs are a waste of space
    3. Re:The US is not in a state of war by david+duncan+scott · · Score: 4, Insightful
      Oh, you youngsters!

      The War Powers Act was created precisely to limit what the Executive could do in the absence of a war. FDR, for instance, had a real war, with a declaration of war and everything, and no weird "War Powers" thing.

      Nixon, on the other hand, had a police action, or an incursion, or whatever the hell they called it from week to week, and Congress finally up and said, "Look, without a war you can only shoot people for a little while, and then you have to come back to us get permission again." No such requirement exists with an honest-to-God war.

      In other words, the War Powers Act is exactly the indication that a state of war does not exist, and really, that shouldn't be a surprise -- neither Osama bin Laden nor "Terror" are nations, and wars are fought between nations.

      --

      This next song is very sad. Please clap along. -- Robin Zander

    4. Re:The US is not in a state of war by d34thm0nk3y · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's not spoken of because it's not true. Take a look at Senate Joint Resolution #23 from Sept. 18th, 2001 (see link in my other comment in this thread). It very much authorizes the use of force, and most importantly invokes the War Powers Resolution. It doesn't mention one thing about funds.

      From the link in your other post (re: suspension of habeas corpus): ...following a declaration of war by the Congress.

      Congress has not declared a war!. If you read the texts of the authorization for use of force (which you also linked):
      (1) SPECIFIC STATUTORY AUTHORIZATION- Consistent with section 8(a)(1) of the War Powers Resolution, the Congress declares that this section is intended to constitute specific statutory authorization within the meaning of section 5(b) of the War Powers Resolution.

      From the war powers resolution:
      (c) The constitutional powers of the President as Commander-in-Chief to introduce United States Armed Forces into hostilities, or into situations where imminent involvement in hostilities is clearly indicated by the circumstances, are exercised only pursuant to (1) a declaration of war, (2) specific statutory authorization,

      So as you can see they have authorized force by statutory authorization, not declaring war!.

      text of war powers act:
      http://www.policyalmanac.org/world/archive/war_p owers_resolution.shtml
      SJ 23:
      http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c107:1:./t emp/~c107sfwR8o::

  4. 4 kinds of information by Ark42 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    1. What you know you know.
    2. What you know you don't know.
    3. What you don't know you know.
    4. What you don't know you don't know.

    As long as Google tells people items where removed from their search because of their government, then Google is still providing information in the form of #2 instead of #4 like other search engines might, or the absense of any search engine would be.

    1. Re:4 kinds of information by Tackhead · · Score: 4, Funny
      > 1. What you know you know.
      > 2. What you know you don't know.
      > 3. What you don't know you know.
      > 4. What you don't know you don't know.
      >
      > As long as Google tells people items where removed from their search because of their government, then Google is still providing information in the form of #2 instead of #4 like other search engines might, or the absense of any search engine would be.

      Wow, I didn't know the Secretary of Defense had a Slashdot account!

      "Reports that say that something hasn't happened are always interesting to me, because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns -- the ones we don't know we don't know."
      - Donald Rumsfeld, February 12, 2002

    2. Re:4 kinds of information by Mrs.+Grundy · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Also:
      5. Things you think you know but are mistaken.

      Consider what Tiananmen Square stands for. Now look at the images google returns for the normal search vs the Chinese search and ask yourself what you think you would know from looking at these results:

      http://images.google.com/images?q=tiananmen+square
      http://images.google.cn/images?q=tiananmen+square

    3. Re:4 kinds of information by afree87 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      It's like the DMCA message you get when you search for things right here in the motherland.

      http://www.google.com/search?q=xenu (look at the bottom of the page)

      And now, the $1000 question... which local government is not censoring these results?

      http://www.google.cn/search?q=xenu

    4. Re:4 kinds of information by Jjeff1 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      An anecdote, but somehow fitting. A guy I worked with briefly was Chinese. He explained how his grandparents, who lived in Bejing, only within the last couple years learned what had occured in Tiananmen Square. They always knew that something had happened, but explained that the government controlled media simply told them there was a dangerous situation and that everyone was to remain in their homes or workplaces while the authorities dealt with the problem.

      It took over 10 years, and I'd imagine news from their western children/grandchildren, before they knew what really occured. I find this amazing. It's a level of goverment control that I don't think most of us can really grasp.

    5. Re: 4 kinds of information by Black+Parrot · · Score: 4, Funny

      > A guy I worked with briefly was Chinese.

      What was he at other times?

      --
      Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
    6. Re:4 kinds of information by cluckshot · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I worked from 2001 to 2005 in a company where I was privy to the bid requests of the DARPA, NSA, CIA and others regards information mining and technology related. I am sure somebody will want to disagree with me and call me troll for saying so, but the Bush Administration's NSA spying campaign which they call limited monitoring of terrorists is nothing of the sort.

      The Bush Administration undertook at various high levels in the US Government to secure every single communication and to process it for their use. That is a fact. It is not opinion. To be blunt this was securing a level of invasion of privacy that the German SS (1930's to 1940's) never imagined possible. It's only goal has to be the construction of a police state. I saw this in the bid requests! They wanted 100% of all data including to be able to evaluate photographs, many languages and even other issues. They wanted 100% of all commercial transactions and to pattern everything.

      Read this for what you will, it isn't toll to tell the truth. I am reasonably certain some party will think I am being partizan. I am not. I am reasonably certain that the Democrat leadership would do the same thing if given the chance. We in the USA have a real problem with our leaders. Seeking to understand their behavior through the eyes of their party propaganda machines is just nuts. Republicans all too often have a Karl Rove point of view. Of course the Democrats have their own propaganda team. We need to see that what is being stolen in the name of national security is all of our security. We have none if people like these destroy the US Constitution this way.

      For those who cannot read, I will spell it out for you. The US Constitution REMOVES from government the power to do anything not permitted. Specifically warrantless searches are prohibited in the US Constitution. The claim that there is no law prohibiting what is happening is just ignorant at the highest level of ignorance. This infinite seaching and invasion of privacy is ILLEGAL 100% no excuses. Excusing it because some Democrat did it or some previous crook did it is no excuse.

      --
      Never Politically Correct ~ I prefer the facts If you don't like what I say, get a life, or comment yourself.
  5. I just saw this on PBS.... by IAAP · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Sergi Brin and asked him about the company's decision to accept censorship in China. As you might guess, Brin defended the move.

    For one, on the bottom of the Chinese results they do show that the results were filtered according to local law. So, the Chiniese citizens are in fact informed that their results are being filtered indirectly by their Governement.

    For two, Google, after all, is a business. They are not a NGO, charity, or some other organization that's in existance to make this planet a better World (TM). They are here to make their shareholders (and themselves) a return on their investment.

    Three, Corporate citizenship, HA hahhahahahhahahhahahahhahahhahahahhahahhahahahhaha hhahahahha!

    Four, there is no Easter Bunny or Santa Clause!

    Five, you get my point.

    1. Re:I just saw this on PBS.... by linguae · · Score: 4, Insightful
      For two, Google, after all, is a business. They are not a NGO, charity, or some other organization that's in existance to make this planet a better World (TM). They are here to make their shareholders (and themselves) a return on their investment.

      To quote Milton Friedman:

      "The only social responsibility of a corporation is to deliver a profit to its shareholders"

      Corporations don't exist to be humanitarian organizations. Their job is to make as much money as possible, while remaining within the law.

    2. Re:I just saw this on PBS.... by no_opinion · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Right, despite their slogan of "Do No Evil" Google is still a corporation. Maybe their reality distortion field will start to lose its strength now.

  6. Gonzales is a funny man by Prien715 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Attorney General Alberto Gonzales on Tuesday told students at Georgetown University that a wartime president has the lawful authority to eavesdrop on Americans' telephone calls and e-mail messages without court approval.

    When asked when the war would started, Gonzales replied "September 11th, 2001". When asked when it would end, he said "Never".

    Gonzales, however, is wrong. The war on terror is over! We're now in the "struggle against Islamic extremism".

    --
    -- Political fascism requires a Fuhrer.
  7. Somebody should tell this jackass... by psykocrime · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Georgetown University that a wartime president has the lawful authority to eavesdrop on Americans' telephone calls and e-mail messages without court approval."

    Somebody needs to tell this jackass that WE'RE NOT F%#KING AT WAR!!! Unless I missed it when Congress issued a declaration of war, but somehow I doubt I slept through that.

    Just because a few morons in DC make up a fancy sounding name like the "War on Terror" or "War on Drugs" does not mean that we are magically at war.

    What a freaking asshat.

    --
    // TODO: Insert Cool Sig
  8. So, Google cowers to China, while resisting US? by mi · · Score: 4, Insightful
    They are fighting tooth-and-nail against a US government's request for rather innocent piece of statistics -- a million of randomly selected queries over the course of one random week in 2005 -- something no other search engine found in any way objectionable.

    And yet they agree to China's much more intrusive demands.

    No, I don't think they are "doing evil" with any of it. But heros they are not either.

    --
    In Soviet Washington the swamp drains you.
  9. Google Problem Is Easy by istartedi · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Tiananmen = "Lock say" (this is actually the westernized way of saying the date, which I found through my un-censored USA Google search).

    Other censored phrases can be replaced with more obscure stuff. lakfjdslkdj for democracy, etc. Of course the censors will just clamp down on that. It will be an arms race, just like spam, and just as spam always gets through, so will censored material. Come on, you know you want to enlarge y0\/r d3mocrasee p3nis.

    So yeah, the Google execs look like they caved in, but they probably realize this will work as well as... DRM. To the young Chinese hackers: Gentlemen, start your compilers.

    --
    For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
  10. K, Here it is, from the War Powers Resolution by TubeSteak · · Score: 4, Informative
    Your first link doesn't apply, since there was never "a declaration of war by the Congress."

    Your second link
    http://www4.law.cornell.edu/usc-cgi/get_external.c gi?type=pubL&target=107-40

    (b) War Powers Resolution Requirements-

    (1) SPECIFIC STATUTORY AUTHORIZATION- Consistent with section 8(a)(1) of the War Powers Resolution, the Congress declares that this section is intended to constitute specific statutory authorization within the meaning of section 5(b) of the War Powers Resolution.

    (2) APPLICABILITY OF OTHER REQUIREMENTS- Nothing in this resolution supercedes any requirement of the War Powers Resolution.

    And from the War Powers Resolution:

    SEC. 8. (a) Authority to introduce United States Armed Forces into hostilities or into situations wherein involvement in hostilities is clearly indicated by the circumstances shall not be inferred--
    (1) from any provision of law (whether or not in effect before the date of the enactment of this joint resolution), including any provision contained in any appropriation Act, unless such provision specifically authorizes the introduction of United States Armed Forces into hostilities or into such situations and stating that it is intended to constitute specific statutory authorization within the meaning of this joint resolution

    SEC. 5. (b) Within sixty calendar days after a report is submitted or is required to be submitted pursuant to section 4(a)(1), whichever is earlier, the President shall terminate any use of United States Armed Forces with respect to which such report was submitted (or required to be submitted), unless the Congress (1) has declared war or has enacted a specific authorization for such use of United States Armed Forces, (2) has extended by law such sixty-day period, or (3) is physically unable to meet as a result of an armed attack upon the United States. Such sixty-day period shall be extended for not more than an additional thirty days if the President determines and certifies to the Congress in writing that unavoidable military necessity respecting the safety of United States Armed Forces requires the continued use of such armed forces in the course of bringing about a prompt removal of such forces.

    From your third link

    (b) SINGLE CONSOLIDATED REPORT- To the extent that the submission of any report described in subsection (a) coincides with the submission of any other report on matters relevant to this joint resolution otherwise required to be submitted to Congress pursuant to the reporting requirements of the War Powers Resolution (Public Law 93-148), all such reports may be submitted as a single consolidated report to the Congress.

    From the War Powers Resolution:

    SEC. 4. (a) In the absence of a declaration of war, in any case in which United States Armed Forces are introduced-- blah (1) blah (2) blah

    (3) in numbers which substantially enlarge United States Armed Forces equipped for combat already located in a foreign nation; the president shall submit within 48 hours to the Speaker of the House of Representatives and to the President pro tempore of the Senate a report, in writing, setting forth--
    (A) the circumstances necessitating the introduction of United States Armed Forces;
    (B) the constitutional and legislative authority under which such introduction took place; and
    (C) the estimated scope and duration of the hostilities or involvement.

    SEC. 4. (b) The President shall provide such other information as the Congress may request in the fulfillment of its constitutional responsibilities with respect to committing the Nation to war and to the use of United States Armed Forces abroad

    SEC. 4. (c) Whenever United States Armed Forces are introduced into

    --
    [Fuck Beta]
    o0t!