Sony, NEC to Merge Optical Drive Teams

illeism writes to tell us The Register is reporting that Sony and NEC are planning on merging their optical drive divisions. From the article: "Sony will be the bigger of the two stakeholders in the joint venture. It will own 55 per cent of Sony NEC Optiarc, to NEC's 45 per cent. Indeed, the JV will be run by Sony staffer Shinichi Yamamura, currently deputy president of Sony's Video Business Group."

Comments

HD vs Blu

[Brushfireb]

The move may pave the way for reconciliation between the two next-generation optical disc formats, Blu-ray Disc and HD DVD.

I guess that means that Sony has learned since the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BetamaxBetamax Fiasco

Although, in this case, I would tend to think that Sony buying their standards competitor, would mean that their Blu-Ray will win. Unless someone else wants to take up the HD DVD cause...

Re:HD vs Blu

[macdaddy357]

They aren't merging with Toshiba. They are still the main force behind HD DVD. I won't buy either format as long as they are DRM crippled.

Re:HD vs Blu

[pomo monster]

I don't know about that, necessarily. Last time this story appeared on Slashdot, it did so under the title "Sony May Sell HD-DVDs".

It's true, however, that it would only have been 10% less accurate--and about that much less inflammatory--to have said "NEC May Sell Blu-Rays."

Um.

[BadAnalogyGuy]

So?

Stop the presses! I'm going to take a leak.

Re:Um.

[B3ryllium]

I think they're going to have double vision for a while :)

Merged format or multi format?

[gbulmash]

I wonder if this will mean a reconciliation between the Blu-Ray and HD-DVD formats or just that the joint venture will end up building multi-format players. I'm probably oversimplifying things, but it seems that multiformat has been the way the industry has gone in recent years... look at all the 7-in-1 card readers, DVD burners that support both DVD-R and DVD+R, etc. Would have been nice if Beta/VHS multiformat VCRs had become the standard way back when.

Re:Merged format or multi format?

[detritus`]

Unfortunately for us i dont think you're going to see a HD-DVD/Blu-ray combo drive anytime soon. The laser technology is completely different between the two, unlike the fiasco with DVD-R/+R as this was more of a data layout issue, not a change in wavelength (at least to my knowledge). those drives that are going to be multifunction are going to require 2 sets of optics, and i'll give you one guess as to what the most expensive part of a CD/DVD system is. This is why HD-DVD has yet another advantage over the blu-ray spec, especially as the HD-DVD format is designed with future expansion in mind (ie. increased data density)

Re:Merged format or multi format?

[TheRaven64]

The laser technology is completely different between the two

Both Blu-Ray and HD-DVD use 405nm blue light. The lasers are identical. You will need a different focussing lens for each disk, since they have different data densities (15GB Vs 25GB per platter). Most of the optical system, however, can be shared between the two drives. Both types of drive are expected to read DVDs and CDs as well, however, which requires a 650nm red laser as well.

If both sides are planning on manufacturing dual-laser systems to be backwards compatible, I think it quite likely that drives that are sideways compatible as well will appear relatively quickly.

Re:Merged format or multi format?

[Kjella]

look at all the 7-in-1 card

7-in-1? How old school. A quick browse through my fav webshop shows 8-in-1 to 10-in-1 and rising. Top claim goes to a 29-in-1 reader which supports the following:

Secure Digital (SD) Card
Multi Media Card (MMC) Card
Multi Media Card (MMC 4.0)
Reduced-Sized Multi Media Card (RS-MMC) Card
Reduced-Sized Multi Media Card (RS-MMC 4.0)
Secure Digital (SD)Ultra II
Secure Digital (SD) Extreme
Memory Stick (MS) Card
MS-DUO Card
MS-PRO Card
MS-PRO DUO Card
MS-Magic Gate Card
MS-PRO Magic Gate Card
MS-DUO Magic Gate Card
MS-PRO DUO Magic Gate Card.
MS-Select Function Card
MS ULTRA II Card
MS PRO DUO Ultra II
MS PRO Extreme
MS ROM Card
Compact Flash (CFI)
Compact Flash (CFII) Card
IBM Microdrive (MD)
Magic store
Compact Flash (CFI) Ultra II
Compact Flash (CFI) Extreme
Smart Media (SM) Card
Smart Media RAM(SMC) Card
XD Picture (XD) Card

Of course, this one lists essentially the same several times - but it seems to be a helluva mess. My camera takes a very standard compact flash. It is one of the reasons I chose it...

Re:Merged format or multi format?

[ivan256]

You will need a different focussing lens for each disk

Not necessecarily. The distance between the lens and the data is the key, because you really want to focus your laser as tightly as possible regardless of format. It's the physical media that distorts the beam and reduces the density in HD-DVD, not the lens. BluRay gets around this by placing the data layer much closer to the surface, making the disc more expensive and holding more data without making the drive more expensive.

Re:Merged format or multi format?

[twofidyKidd]

I think it means Sony is hedging their bets.

Re:Merged format or multi format?

[gbulmash]

Allowing programmers to name serious 'flagship' Linux applications is right in line with letting marketing write them.

*Love* the .sig.

Extra features

[NiteShaed]

And will the rootkit now come directly from the drive, before you ever insert a CD/DVD?

Re:Extra features

[ScrewMaster]

No, it will be supplied as a driver for Windows Vista. Don't bother looking, it won't show up in Task Manager.

Re:Extra features

[niXcamiC]

Its funny that slashdot is filled with continual microsoft bashers and people that keep bashing sony for a rootkit that only runs on microsoft OSes, I mean, if your gonna bash windows, why are you useing it, and if your not using it, why do you care about a problem that only affects it? Blab on about civil libertys, but a corperation can not take them from you, only the goverment can by making laws like the dmca that make reclaiming your liberties illiegal. I say instead of boycotting sony, boycott the u.s.

Re:Extra features

[Firehed]

Well I would hope not, or else it's one of the most poorly-coded rootkits in the history of rootkits.

Well I guess

[aztektum]

Time to break down and buy a new NEC dvd writer before they are jacked up the ass with DRM restrictions

Universal Disc player

[snib]

Is this the first step toward a drive that plays HD DVD and Blu-Ray? Is this even possible?

Re:Universal Disc player

[cynic10508]

More likely just Sony trying to shore up its sagging position with Blue-Ray.

Re:Universal Disc player

[dtsazza]

Is this the first step toward a drive that plays HD DVD and Blu-Ray? Is this even possible?

Yes. Really, all you need is different lasers to read the surface - all the rest of the hardware is there to spin the disc, and manage communication on the bus, etc. Once you've got to the point of "I read these 0s and 1s from the disc", drives are identical. (Probably an oversimplification, but valid in principle.)

We currently have DVD+R and DVD-R combo drives, and IIRC these formats are as distinct as HD-DVD and Blu-Ray. Also, IANAODM (I Am Not An Optical Drive Manufacturer), but Samsung is, and they seem to think it's possible...

Re:Universal Disc player

[ivan256]

Yes. Really, all you need is different lasers to read the surface

That's old info.

BluRay and HD-DVD are almost identical on the drive side now. BluRay ditched the caddy, and HD-DVD went to a blue laser. Both format use the same laser now. The big differences are all in the construction of the media.

lovely

[Tumbleweed]

Prepare to pay twice as much for future NEC optical drives. :(

Re:lovely

[beast6228]

why twice more? A Sony drive isn't any more expensive than an NEC drive.

In fact, I just did a pricecheck on Newegg.com and found a Sony for $38.99 while an NEC was almost one dollar more $39.75

Lite-On

[Ray Radlein]

Sony currently uses Lite-On as the OEM for most of their DVD drives (some older ones are Ricohs; and a few are even Sonys). I suppose this means that they won't be doing so for much longer.

Looks like CDFreaks will have to rename their Lite-On/Sony Drive Forum soon.

Re:Lite-On

[code65536]

I'm surprised to see this on /. since I clearly remember news of this merger making waves at the CD Freaks forums many months ago.

Anyway, so the forum is still named that? Renaming the forum was seriously discussed a long ago when Sony started using BenQ and again when Sony-NEC was announced, so I'm a bit surprised that it still hasn't changed. Wow. Hehe. ;)

Re:Lite-On

[Ray Radlein]

Actually, your memory is probably better than mine on this, as I only drop by CDFreaks on occasion (usually when I'm looking for something specific, like Firmware news, or reviews of a drive I'm considering). That particular link was the serendipitous result of me Googling "Sony Lite-On OEM DVD" because I no longer trust my memory worth a damn, and wanted to make sure that I hadn't just imagined that Sony rebranded Lite-On drives.

What I should have done, of course, was simply declare my assertion without bothering to check my facts. I mean, this is the internet, after all.

REMEMBER: You can some of the people some of the time, but Slashdot is full of dupes.

Re:Lite-On

[code65536]

My comment about /. was about the article appearing on the /. main page.

My comment about CDF was just an expression of surprise at their slowness. I hadn't visited there in months.

Re:Lite-On

[Ray Radlein]

Sure, de nada. I'm a bit surprised at the timing of the front page article, too... or maybe not, given that news events from the past, presumably caught in bobbles, do seem to crop up on the front page of Slashdot with some regularity.

Oh well. I guess it just serves to demonstrate Edna St. Vincent Millay's classic observation, "It's not true that life is one damn thing after another; it's one damn thing over and over."

HVD

[kitejumping]

Both formats are obsolete compared to HVD which already has working equipment. Expect to see it on the market in June 06' http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holographic_Versatile _Disc

Re:HVD

[kesuki]

the $15, grand is for a drive development kit. not a drive itself, as the drives themselves are still in the 'research' phase, and cannot be 'bought' unless you're working with the drive developers to 'field test' the drives. good old wikipedia i'm too lazy to edit it though.

the media costs are because they're being produced at very low production runs. how fast the price of media comes down with mass production is anyones guess. paying 50 cents per gigabyte is pretty spendy compared to DVDs, but they only have to get the media price down to about the $30 and below range to be on a 'cost per gigabyte' range equivalent to good quality DVDs.

Yeah, i realize $30 a disc seems inanely high priced, but how often are 'consumers' going to even need 300 gb? other than people working with a lot of uncompressed video, there aren't a whole lot of people. the drives themselves can probabbly be made popular, but more than likely people won't need a whole 100 spindle of the media for quite a few years yet. dvd burners have been around for years, and the media finally started getting cheap.

Then again, VHS beat out betamax because it could hold 6 hours of video, and betamax couldn't.

then again, bd will be in ps3's hvd's and simmilar technolgies won't have the production volumes that bd will have because of that. at anyrate, it won't take long for us to find out what price point the holographic drive lists at when aimed at the consumer video/backup market.

You think BD-ROM will work on Linux?

[tepples]

people that keep bashing sony for a rootkit that only runs on microsoft OSes

BD-ROM drives will probably have fully working drivers only for Microsoft operating systems.

I say instead of boycotting sony, boycott the u.s.

How do you suggest that I find a decent job and learn another language (I'm past the so-called critical period) so that I can emigrate?

Re:You think BD-ROM will work on Linux?

[SleepyHappyDoc]

I think they will. BD-ROM films might not work 100%, but the media and drive will likely be well-supported. Unless Sony plans to abandon their Linux hobby kit plans.

Besides (and correct me if I'm wrong), won't the PS3 be using the linux kernel in some form?

Re:You think BD-ROM will work on Linux?

[Manmademan]

BD-ROM drives will probably have fully working drivers only for Microsoft operating systems.

Apple is a huge backer of Blu-Ray, so expect any drivers to fully work under OSX and it's variants also.

Why does everything have to be abbreviated?

[spectre_240sx]

Would it have been so hard to just type "joint venture"?

Re:Why does everything have to be abbreviated?

[Mr2001]

Oh, now you've done it. Some poor guy in a library in Kansas isn't going to be able to load this page now, because it contains the word "joint".

Re:Why does everything have to be abbreviated?

[spectre_240sx]

How unfortunate. I seem to have spit coffee all over my monitor.

Re:Why does everything have to be abbreviated?

[SpaceballsTheUserNam]

He has carple tunnnel syndrome you insensitive clod!

You must be new here!

[Spy der Mann]

Its funny that slashdot is filled with continual microsoft bashers and people that keep bashing...

They're called "trolls". By the way, welcome :)

Damn!!

[eledu81]

this can't be good... NEC makes excellent inexpensive drives.. Sony putting their hands on that only means new expensive drives bundled with DRM and rootkits...

Isn't this kind of merging...

[TheGreatHegemon]

...called a takeover?

Great!

[Tubetalkerx]

So now NEC gonna suck! You know the old addage "Mix 10 pounds of Ice Cream and 10 pounds of Sh!t and you get 20 pounds of Sh!t."

P.S. An RCA rep I know usually says "Sony, just another 4 letter word begining with S"

Optiarc?

[dubl-u]

Wow, Optiarc is a terrible name. Perhaps we could get them to call it Optigrab?

Re:Optiarc?

[Rob T Firefly]

You mean the blue laser will always be this color???

Geez...

[rodm13]

Just because Sony is merging with NEC doesn't mean DRM for all. I have a nice Lite-on dvd writer I've been using for about a year and a half, and it has a chip MADE BY SONY. And, get this, IT HAS NO DRM WHATSOEVER EMBEDDED. Seriously, things aren't this bad. Yet.

Re:Geez...

[sconeu]

IT HAS NO DRM WHATSOEVER EMBEDDED.

Two words: Region Coding.

This line placed here to defeat the lameness filter.

Re:Rootkit = not buying SONY optical drives

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

Uuuuuuuuuuuuuh.

Like Sony's optical drive division has anything to do with the DRM Rootkit...

Wake the hell up! This was announced in November!

[Anonymous Coward]

This merger was announced November 17th, 2005. It's OLD news.

http://www.necus.com/companies/11/NECCORP_NEC_SONY DiskDrives.pdf

Thanks Scuttle Monkey! With some work, you will eventually find a calendar and learn it's now 2006.

Re:get to Canada

[pomo monster]

As a New Yorker, I tell you this city is better than anyplace in Canada, Europe, or the United States.

Wait, what?

Sony optical drives?

[ceeam]

Are we talking about computer equipment here? 'Cos almost all Sony drives are LiteOn OEMs (with occasional BTC model). At least I have not seen a true Sony drive for.... ever?

Re:Yeah, I bet

[Isotopian]

Guess they call it anonymous coward for a reason.

Re:Rootkit = not buying SONY optical drives

[B_Realll]

Who cares? When you lie with dogs... Screw ALL divisions of Sony until they clean up their act. How else will they ever learn?

Sony Lessons Learned

[thedletterman]

I guess that's why in 1990 they bought MGM, so they could provide their own stable of content regardless of vendor support. Just look at the success of the UMD movie. It's a hugely profitable business for Sony, because they profit on the entire operation from end to end, from device to media. That's the idea with the BlueRay technology. The only reason I see for Sony to merge with NEC is to gain a foothold in a unified standard, and to lower their BlueRay drive manufacturing costs.

Re:Sony Lessons Learned

[thedletterman]

In 1990, the MGM Studios in Culver City was purchase by Sony Entertainment of Japan. It also houses both Columbia Pictures and TriStar Pictures, which are both a division of Sony. In September of 2004, MGM announced that is would merge with Sony Corporation of America. Sony purchased MGM for $5 Billion.

Obviously buying MGM Studios in 1990, and expanding their movies division worked out pretty well if it coughed up $5 billion to buy MGM within 14 years.

Not about blu-ray

[hrm]

This is not so much about blu-ray vs HD-DVD, but more about the fact that optical storage technology is becoming increasingly irrelevant. These kind of scale-increasing joint ventures are typical of a dinosaur business.

Lacking a major technological breakthrough that would make optical storage more attractive than other solutions like hard disks, flash memory and network systems, there will be no successor for Blu-ray and/or HD-DVD.

When CD-ROMs came out, one CD had 10 times the storage capacity of a typical hard drive. Now when blu-ray comes out, it has 0.1 times the storage capacity of current HDs. Irrelevant. Content providers are looking at streaming models, so they don't necessarily want a Blu-ray successor. Much safer if data is not in the consumer's hands.

This joint venture confirms it: optical storage is dying.

Re:Not about blu-ray

[edremy]

Umm, are you really so sure about that?

Yes, HDs have far more capacity. They are also fragile, expensive and usually fairly large for decent size. Carrying a portable HD around (other than in something like an iPod) is a royal pain, and last I checked iPod sized drives don't store that much more than Blu-ray.

As far as streaming, until FIOS shows up everywhere get real. It might work for office programs, but not games or high-def video. I've got 1.5Mbps DSL at home and decided to try out the Everquest2 demo. It took six hours to download, and that was for the tiny trial. (I never found out how tiny since it complains about not having DirectX 9.0c. Odd, since I have it.) MMORPGs can get away with downloading pieces as needed, but most other games can't. As far as video, I move NTSC-resolution video files around on our campus network a lot. 100 Mbps Ethernet is *not* sufficient, even GigE suffers under the load. The thought of copying HD video gives me shudders.

There is a market for cheap, replacable storage, both on the delivery and backup sides. Too bad I probably won't end up buying either one in a futile protest against DRM.

This TROLL is getting old...

[pedestrian crossing]

-NT-

Well that's just great

[BestNicksRTaken]

Sony's the one that's going to benefit from this, as they couldn't make a DVD burner to save their lives, NEC however is top of the market (especially with the hacked firmwares) along with BenQ.

Could make life difficult for other vendors who rebadge NEC drives.

Of course, this does mean that we can't buy NEC anymore because it's giving money to Big Bad, so better head off and grab a few ND-4551's before the takeover.

Ugh.

[beavis88]

I like my NEC DVD writers - cheap, reliable, and very quiet. I assume that at the very least the "cheap" part will change, and if we're lucky, we'll get some bonus "DRM up the ass" to boot.

Sony? Optical?

[evilviper]

I don't get it. What "optical division" does Sony really have? They've just been re-branding OEM drives (Lite-on) for the last decade.

I suppose they've been making Blu-ray drives on their own, but I'm sure they'll just be re-branding OEM drives in a short while, when the price on next-gen drives drops to reasonable prices.

I get the feeling Sony is just finding a creative way of cutting their losses in the PC market.

end of an era

[poot_rootbeer]

Does this mean that I'll have to upgrade by TurboGrafx-16 system to a Sony Playstation?

Oh Great

[timothykaine]

Now I can look forward to seeing Sony's ultra-low standard of quality in my I-bought-it-to-get-rid-of-my-Sonys DVD drives.

Anyone, Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?

[umbrellasd]

Anyone know if this is related to the Blue-Ray consortium's unresolved issues that are delaying the receipt of my PS3?

The end of the $40 DVD burner at NewEgg ?!?!

[Phantom_24]

This blows....Guess I'll have to get a few before Sony jacks up the price just because some board room schmuck wants too!

If I'm gonna pay more for a drive, give me Plextor before Sony !!

Re:Rootkit = not buying SONY optical drives

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

I sure hope that Jeopardy and other shows filmed at Sony Television studios doesn't install a root kit into your tv too.

Re:Rootkit = not buying SONY optical drives

[RyuuzakiTetsuya]

Okay. more consumer goods for me.

*shrug* I see no reason to hate a company for various stumbles and fuckups.

Re:Rootkit = not buying SONY optical drives

[2old2rockNroll]

When a company tries to screw me once, I figure they will probably try it again. It's why I no longer use Turbotax or Windows. It's self-protection, not hatred.

This is Recycled Old News from 2005

[StateOfTheUnion]

This was announced in November 2005 . . .

Apparently its just hitting the register now . . .

Aha!

[umbrellasd]

Apparently so as one of the next posts this morning is the announcement by Sony of a Blue-Ray timeframe.

Learn to read then open your mouths

[Gardum]

Have any of you losers actually learnt how to use a search engine? At least have a browse around and learn a little before blowing of at the mouth about loser comments like everything that is wrong in the world is Sony's fault ? Here is a little piece from the DRM site :- The Digital Millennium Copyright Act was passed in the United States in an effort to make the circumvention of DRM systems illegal. It was passed without debate, and without even token opposition, Congress being lobbied by the content industries and apparently under the impression that it was a "technical" enactment, without significant public policy implication. It has been widely imitated by governments elsewhere. Now since Microsoft and Quite a few other American companies use and promote DRM how did it become only Sony's ? Because they used DRM on some of there Audio CD's wow how dare they , now if the majority of you losers had Autoplay disabled on your PC's you would never have known about it. Now get a life and STFU and learn to live in a world where USA is not the be all and end all and switch of your TV's unless you only watch programs from other Countries as boy are they trying to keep you Guys in a constant state of terror. The absolute Bullshit they tell you and you gits are stupid enough to believe them lol By the Way did you know that the Xboxes use DRM ;) Damn Sony how did they sneak that in there without any one seeing :(

Re:Learn to read then open your mouths

[hkmwbz]

"Now since Microsoft and Quite a few other American companies use and promote DRM how did it become only Sony's ?"

Because they were caught installing spyware and rootkits on their customers' PCs.

In addition, they tried to lie and deny, but the evidence was overwhelming, and they responded by basically going "if people don't know that there's spyware on their computers it won't hurt them".

They screwed up big time, and the consequences are that I and many others will point out Sony's spyware fiasco as often as possible, to prevent people from buying their potentially spyware infected products.