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Avatar-Based Marketing

hempman writes "This article (which I wrote!) from the current issue of Harvared Business Review offers a new perspective on marketing real-world products in virtual worlds to virtual consumers with the aim of generating real-world revenue. It examines the frontier of marketing. Although companies are beginning to see the potential of marketing in 3D games and virtual worlds, it's important that they think not just about the 'where' of this new market but also about the 'who.' That is, when marketing in virtual worlds, do you target the flesh-and-blood user who controls the real-world wallet? Or do you target the wallet-wielding consumer's avatar, which likely represents a powerful but hidden aspect of his personality and could influence his purchases -- or at least provide a window into his hidden desires and preferences?"

52 comments

  1. So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by eldavojohn · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Only to be prompted with a the 1.11 patch. I wait for it to install and then get into the game with my level 55 priest. I summon my undead horse but for some reason it's no longer called an undead horse, it's an "Undead Ford Mustang." Oh well, I can live with small changes to make my game cheaper.

    I ride out of town and instantly am killed by a level 60 alliance rogue. Wait a minute, was he wearing a Starter jacket? And for some reason, instead of scrambling everything he's trying to say to me, he's just repeating "Do the Dew! To the EXTREME! etc."

    My priest trainer is no longer a priest trainer but instead a "Scientologist Enlightener" that offers me an application for Scientology. Well, those high in-game ad bidders should make this game free, right?

    I suddenly realize I'm no longer using Traveler's Backpacks but instead have "Jansport Bookbags." My alt's Boots of Swiftness are now "Nike Airs." In certain instances, you don't kill monsters, you kill Democrats and Ragnaros has been replaced with Hillary Clinton.

    My chracter's rings have all been renamed "Stones of Jostens (GooooOOO Jostens!)" and everytime I disembark from a zeppelin or boat, the goblin tells me "Thank you for floating United Airlines!" and I realize why "ted" is painted all over the boats. My engineer can now make T-mobile phones for players with personalized ring tones because they're too annoying to be contained only in real life so let's add them to the virtual world!

    I no longer "mail" items but instead have to visit the Fedex shop in major cities and stand in long lines. Oh, and when I get the mail, a huge AOL symbol appears on my screen with the "You've Got Mail" soundbite. And I no longer have a repair bill as long as I purchase my AllState equipment insurance at the bank in each city.

    What's going on!? Well, at least the log-in server is stable ... right? Then again, it doesn't really matter how stable it is if everyone stops using it.

    So ... tell me why this is a good thing again?

    I once read an article on how to market to everyone--even poor people--by selecting key traits of their demographics. It's essentially profiling a user of an already existing product and identifying them as a key possible consumer for your product. And it makes me f*cking sick to see it so far widespread that it's going to happen in freaking video games which we're probably going to end up paying for anyways. Don't try to cover up your attitude towards the rest of mankind. It's evident that you lack a soul and will stop at nothing to market a product ... whether it require you to destroy communities, communication, the environment or even a kid's gaming experience.

    From the article:
    Advertising has always targeted a powerful consumer alter ego: that hip, attractive, incredibly popular person just waiting to emerge (with the help of the advertised product) from an all-too-normal self.
    To which I reply, you make me sick.
    --
    My work here is dung.
    1. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by MrSquirrel · · Score: 2, Interesting

      My sentiments exactly -- I always try to buy the unmarketed (or at least less-marketed) products [unless it's inferior] just because I hate marketing so much. I'm sorry -- I hate marketing METHODS so much. I have no problems with marketing telling me the facts, but marketers seem to be all too geared toward fact/reality-twisting.
      Dear marketers: you're going to ruin my game experience to plaster "BEST BUY" or "FedEx" all over?... I already know Best Buy and FedEx exist, throwing it all over my world when I'm trying to frag some zombies or save the princess or whatever I want to do in my own little gaming reality will only upset me; the gaming world has NOTHING to do with your crappy product. please die, kthxbye.

      --
      A computer once beat me at chess, but it was no match for me at kick boxing.
    2. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I agree. The point of video games is to escape from the real world into one that is entertaining. The idea of in-game advertising is sickening.
      The companies that buy these adverts are doing what they should be doing: generating a profit. However, any game developer willing to insert advertisements in the virtual canvas of their game should be shot. ;)

    3. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by RingDev · · Score: 2, Interesting

      While your sample is a bit extreme, is it that different then advertising for ingame services ingame? I used to play DAoC, back before housing. I had a LGM weapon smith, I had a huge stock pile of weapons to sell, but no way to inform people. So I had a friend who loved going on raids, I gave him a 5% commission for each person who contacted me and said they heard about it from him. So he would go on raids and advertise (in character, it was a RP server) for my weapon sales.

      Like whys for a messaging service, if WoW didn't have a artificial mail service, and some independant group of players created their own ingame mail company (ala Fed-Axe!) would it be wrong of them to advertise in the major cities?

      I guess my problem is not with advertisement, it is with advertisement that breaks immersion. I think doing burnouts in a bestbuy parking lot while playing Need for Speed is awesome. I think buying a mana potion at a Rite-Aid is far from ok.

      -Rick

      --
      "Most people in the U.S. wouldn't know they live in a tyrannical state if it walked up and grabbed their junk." - MyFirs
    4. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by tomhudson · · Score: 1

      I'm sure there are scenarios you wouldn't complain so much about.

      For example, avatars designed by different porn shops/sites, with extra bonus "previews" or credits, redeemable at their web site. At the very least, you know THOSE avatars are going to be real eye-candy.

      Its all about how you do DEW DEW DEW it. [/smack on sid eof head]

    5. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by kickedfortrolling · · Score: 1

      best 1st post EVER

      --
      --AlexC
      Just because I dont agree with climate change doesnt make me a troll
    6. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by WillAffleckUW · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Like whys for a messaging service, if WoW didn't have a artificial mail service, and some independant group of players created their own ingame mail company (ala Fed-Axe!) would it be wrong of them to advertise in the major cities?

      I remember getting sick in Diablo with all the pop-up trolls who would advertise for the place to buy a special Diablo sword, etc. All scripted.

      It annoyed the HELL out of me. I HATED it.

      The problem is every advertiser acts like he's the only one. But he isn't. Once one person does it, five thousand people do the same thing.

      The only solution is context-sensitive ads - want an ad in a fantasy game? It has to be a faded banner on a wall in a place that normally would have ad banners and fits - e.g. Nike could have an ad that said "Ye Olden Nike - Shoes and Sandals fur ye Actif Trolle or Gobline" on the side of an Arena building, or Pepsi could have an ad on a torn weathered poster made of old style paper in a Wild West game that said "Reward: $500 for Pepsi Drinking Sam - Dead or Alive - with a charcoal picture badly done of a guy with a hat with a Pepsi color bandanna". But only one ad per town.

      --
      -- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
    7. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by RingDev · · Score: 1

      I'm right there with you on the context-sensitive ads. If a company wants in-game advertisement to out-of-game products, it better be extremely refined, appropriate for the environment, and severly limited.

      -Rick

      --
      "Most people in the U.S. wouldn't know they live in a tyrannical state if it walked up and grabbed their junk." - MyFirs
    8. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by aufecht · · Score: 1

      Reminds me of the late Bill Hicks where he onced asked a crowd if there were any advertisers/marketing people present, to which a few people responded yes. He then promptly told them to kill themselves, they of course laughed since this was he standup routine after all. He then reiterated, seriously, please kill yourself, you are the fucking scum of the earth. It was pretty damn funny. But anyway, I have to agree with you, these people make me sick.

      just lending my support

    9. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by nEoN+nOoDlE · · Score: 1

      Now put your fictional scenario into a game setting like Grand Theft Auto, and it sounds like a great addition to making the game more realistic. If I'm wandering around a massively multi-player urban cityscape, I wouldn't mind if I'm doing it in Nike's with a Starter jacket on. As games get more realistic, it's not surprising that real products are making their way into them.

      You see this stuff in movies all the time. Does it really break the story when Bond rides around in a BMW? No, because that's what I'd expect him to be doing. So far, advertising in film has worked pretty well. I haven't seen a guy in Ancient Rome drinking a Coke as of yet, so your example is pure hyperbole.

      --
      Don't trust a bull's horn, a doberman's tooth, a runaway horse or me.
    10. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by WWWWolf · · Score: 1

      ...and just as you're finishing up your ad-ridden tour, a blonde guy in chainmain and a shirt with a golden ankh appears, tosses you a bubblegum-machine ankh pendant, and says "Hey, try Ultima Online. We still don't have in-game ads. ...I mean, not yet." And then that Everquest chick appears and beats him to pulp, and you realise it's wiser to log off before she starts her spiel.

      =)

      (Okay, I was just kind of excited when I saw the "Avatar-Based Marketing" headline. Sorry. Got a bit carried away.)

    11. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by Lord_Dweomer · · Score: 1
      While your example is VERY extreme, I wrote an article about how marketers might actually try to cross over into the Fantasy MMO world. While their products make sense in a modern day themed game, fantasy games offer a distinct challenge.

      You can read my article here. While it will inevitably be intrusive in some shape or form, at least they can make it entertaining.

      --
      Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!
    12. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by bit01 · · Score: 1

      Does it really break the story when Bond rides around in a BMW?

      Yes. In "Tomorrow Never Dies" the quantity of pointless BMW's floating around and their general obtrusiveness greatly decreases movie immersion. It wrecked it for me.

      Not surprising. An unnoticed ad is an ineffective ad. You're dreaming if you think advertisers are willing to be unobtrusive.

      ---

      Modern marketing - a great substitute for a quality product.

    13. Re:So I Log Onto Warcraft ... by hempman · · Score: 1

      I failed to mention when I posted my self-promoting item that I was looking for feedback to my argument -- and I sure got it! But I'm not just interested in whether "avatar-based marketing" is a force for good or evil. I'm also interested in whether it even makes sense! // So, while I laughed out loud at your clever tirade, I'm more interested in your thoughts concerning a) whether companies can successfully (and they won't be successful if they generate more ill will than good) use the idea of avatar-based marketing, and b) whether they need to approach the market somewhat differently because their immediate targets are users' avatars. // What do you think? Would YOU accept in-game marketing if that lowered the cost of the game -- or even made it free to play? (That's the price we paid -- and a high one it's been -- to get access to free network television programming.) Are there situations, even in a fantasy game, where advertising could enhance the game experience? Are there, as I mentioned in my article (you should read it), situations where you could market to a game's avatars when they return with their users, tucked away in the users' psyches, to the real world? There's a lot to be said about why the idea of in-game advertising is evil. There's a lot more interesting stuff to say about whether it would even work! Thanks!!

  2. Seems pretty obvious by aftk2 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    You target the avatar - I mean, how could you even do it otherwise? If I'm playing a fantasy MMORPG, which am I more likely to do, for my character.

    Purchase some super elite sword for a couple bucks?

    or...

    Purchase Pepsi, because I drink Pepsi in real life.

    Now, I know this goes into more detail - who am I targetting? When I advertise the virtual items that can be purchased, am I making a commercial that might appeal to me as a person, or my Half-Elf as a character? Or something. I think the obvious answer is that you simply need to communicate the value that the item has, regarding the world in which it exists. If I'm playing a fantasy game, let me know that this is a kickass sword, whether through its abilities or just its appearance. If I'm playing a social game online, let me know that these virtual flowers might just woo the avatar of some woman with whom I'm playing. Communicate the purpose of the items in question, and I think the marketing takes care of itself.

    --
    concrete5: a cms made for marketing, but strong enough for geeks.
  3. As seen on a billboard in a MMORPG by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Nike (r) Boots of Escaping (tm)!
    Order yours today!

    Now you can be as cool and hip as you alway internally wanted to be!

  4. Harvared? by Leiterfluid · · Score: 1

    It's worth being modded down troll for, but I believe you mean the HARVARD Business Review.

    I've read the Harvared Business Review, and well, it's worth buying just for the pictures.

  5. If you can't get published ... by jamescford · · Score: 1

    I gave up trying to get published in the Harvard Business Review. Now I send my articles to the Harvared Business Review -- it's a lot easier.

    1. Re:If you can't get published ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      the Harvared Business Review -- it's a lot easier.

      Yeah, you don't need to be able to spell.

    2. Re:If you can't get published ... by Leiterfluid · · Score: 1

      That's what editors are for, usually.

    3. Re:If you can't get published ... by Rob+T+Firefly · · Score: 1

      And it's so much more prestigious than anything published by Yeale.

  6. Inevitable by The+Raven · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Games in modern settings are going to get advertising. It's just gonna happen, at least to some of them. However, games that are not in modern settings won't. Also, very simple. No idiot is gonna put a Nike in WoW or a Ford ad in System Shock. In games within their own alternate universe, it makes no sense to advertise, because it would only annoy. Games set in the real world are the market for this type of advertising. Historical games might go for historical ads... I wouldn't mind seeing an old Coca Cola sign on a shop set in WWII. Nor would I mind seeing a Ford ad on a billboard.

    My only request is that the ad art be distressed to match the environment. This means that (for example) a billboard ad should have some stains on it. A poster on a wall should have water marks, dirt and grime (if that fits the setting at least). In other words, the ad should not look artificially clean so that it looks out of place. In a clean settings, sure... but in a realistic setting, with graffiti, grimy walls, etc, it looks ugly when the ad itself is artificially clean like a browser popup ad.

    Summary: Fantasy ads bad, so they won't happen. Realistic ads fine, and we definitely will. Even historical ads are ok, if historical ad content is used (or historical LOOKING ads). And ads should fit the environment, via dirt/damage decals.

    Raven

    --
    "I will trust Google to 'do no evil' until the founders no longer run it." Hello Alphabet.
    1. Re:Inevitable by GrumblyStuff · · Score: 1
      No idiot is gonna put a Nike in WoW or a Ford ad in System Shock.

      Perhaps but how about idiots who get paid to do so?
    2. Re:Inevitable by RobotRunAmok · · Score: 1


      Summary: Fantasy ads bad, so they won't happen


      dude, if I could purchase a 1-Hand Blunt weapon with a delay below 25 and damage above 30 for under 15K plats for my EQ Paladin, I would not care in the least that it resembled a Pepsi Can on a Stick. If that bothers your "gaming experience," you are free not to group with me.

      And if Citgo wants to pay me to put their logo on my breastplate while I stand buffing the crowds in front of the Main Bank on the Plane of Knowledge on a Saturday Night, I am very much open to negotiations...

    3. Re:Inevitable by JayDot · · Score: 1

      I can think of a couple of games that actually improved the experience of playing because they did this sort of advertising so well. The best one was Need for Speed Underground. Everywhere you look, there's billboards, signs, etc... for various stores. But they were in the right places (like downtown, not in the posh upscale neighborhood). It made the game feel more realistic, like "Wow, I know all those stores. I must be really driving at breakneck speeds!" subliminal messages were playing in your head. Like Raven said, it has to fit in.

      --
      Meh, a real sig would take too long, and I have an MMORPG to play with....
    4. Re:Inevitable by Rob+T+Firefly · · Score: 1
      Summary: Fantasy ads bad, so they won't happen.
      I wish I could believe that, but as history has shown us time and again, marketing types tend not to be all that clear on the meaning of the word "bad."
    5. Re:Inevitable by sinij · · Score: 1

      Question you should be asking is not "does it makes sense to put adds here" and not even "do these adds detract from the game" but "will it make money". If money gained from having product placement surpasses money lost to disgruntled customers then it will happen.

    6. Re:Inevitable by ldd23 · · Score: 1

      It's too late. Oddworld: Munch's Oddysee had Sobe machines that you could buy energy drinks from to restore your health. Made no damn sense.

  7. Pepsi Powerups? by VGfort · · Score: 2, Funny

    Defeat the evil Hamburglar and you will be rewarded with the Pepsi Powerup! Invincibility magic for 10minutes when used.

  8. Really, now? by keyne9 · · Score: 1

    hempman writes:
    "This article (which I wrote!) from the current issue of Harvared Business Review [...]"


    You don't say?

  9. Really? by ShadowsHawk · · Score: 1

    So they're going to market lingerie to all those 'women' playing night elves? I somehow doubt that the characters that people play represent their true personalities.

    1. Re:Really? by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Last thing I need in a game is lingerie ads. While I may play young sexy female with a sniper rifle in some games, I'm just a fat and ulgy male gamer in real life. Besides, I hate G-strings. :P

    2. Re:Really? by fwwr5007 · · Score: 1

      With most long video games, I usually prefer to play as the female character if there's one available. If I'm going to be staring at a character's derriere for hours on end, said derriere may as well belong to a female.

    3. Re:Really? by __aaclcg7560 · · Score: 1

      Exactly! When I was at Atari testing UT2004, I always picked a female character since everyone else picked a male character. Whenever someone got taken out by a sexy female with a sniper rifle, everyone knew it was me. To add insult to the injury, I would play under the name of "Sunny Day" from Backyard Baseball. If my assistant was also in the game, he would the name "Abner Doubleplay" (Sunny's sidekick in BB) and we would work together. I can't tell you how many testers wanted to kill Sunny and Abner. :)

    4. Re:Really? by KDR_11k · · Score: 1

      I was never satisfied with the choices offered by the game. These days I frag people as Ayane from DoA.

      --
      Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
  10. nVidia already has an ad in WoW by metasecure · · Score: 1

    I remember people were pretty upset back in beta when it was introduced. Even though it's tucked away in the video settings menu!

  11. you'd target the avatar by abigsmurf · · Score: 1

    Because targeting the player himself opens up all sorts of nasty data privacy issues. Could you trust Blizzard/Squeenix/Codemasters not to sell/provide your registration info to in game marketers?

  12. Probably a dead end by Animats · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I suspect this concept will hit the "excessively annoying" level before it hits the "profitable" level. There tried this; you could pay real money to buy branded clothing for your avatar. It was a flop.

    Next bad advertising idea: discount widescreen TV displays which, when running 4:3 format content, fill the blank screen area with ads.

    (On an unrelated note, there's supposed to be a blank line between the paragraphs above, but the new, extra-complicated CSS based Web 2.0 Slashdot implementation is broken. Bulleted lists are even more broken.)

    1. Re:Probably a dead end by tomhudson · · Score: 1

      Re: b0rked formatting:

      (On an unrelated note, there's supposed to be a blank line between the paragraphs above, but the new, extra-complicated CSS based Web 2.0 Slashdot implementation is broken. Bulleted lists are even more broken.)

      The fix for it eating the first p tag between lines is to start your post with a p tag, before any text.

      You also have to do it before any line that changes its indentation, such as when you end a blockquote. This post, for example, starts with a p tag, and there's also one after the closing blockquote.

    2. Re:Probably a dead end by generic-man · · Score: 1

      Those displays already exist. The diner in my hometown has several of them. They're 16:9 displays which have two 4:3 input sources split to the left and right sides*. On the left side of the screen is a ballgame, CNN, or something else. On the right side of the screen is a PowerPoint-style slideshow of advertisements for local merchants. I'm sure the diner doesn't have to pay for the TVs, and they probably get some commission on the ads they agree to run.

      * Yes, this causes the video to be stretched vertically to the point where it's very hard to watch. The ads look clean though. No, they don't use the option to display two 4:3 sources with black bars on the top and bottom to make the aspect ratios correct.

      --
      For more information, click here.
    3. Re:Probably a dead end by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      oh shit! You mean we actually have to use validl HTML now instead of the kludges people have been using for years since they were too lazy to write paragraphs correctly?

    4. Re:Probably a dead end by tomhudson · · Score: 1

      No, we have to use extra html tags to fix the b0rked css.

      According to the W3C standard, the div tag is a block-level tag, unlike span, which is inline. On slushduh, this comment is contained in a div (view the page source) but the CSS screws around with the div and the first p tag, turning them both into inline rather than a block-level containers.

      Also, according to the same W3C standard, the closing p tag is not necessary. It's a waste, really. Semantically, paragraphs don't nest. Ditto with list items, etc.

      And the affectation of writing tags that don't have a closing tag and forbid having one (such as writing an img tag like this <img src="whatever.png" />) with the "/>" is also wrong. html != xml.

  13. Humor, Sims, and Avatars by WillAffleckUW · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Ok, so one of my first degrees was in Business (Marketing and Sales), and I used to design games back in the stone age.

    I think that the most effective advertising online is as follows:

    1. Humorous - If someone tries to sell me Coca-Cola while I'm online in say WoW, I might hate it, and In The Real World (ITRW) might even start to dislike Coke and choose Pepsi. But if they were to have the Coca-Cola symbol only it was Coca-Noca-Cola but otherwise the same, that's kind of funny, so it might give me a positive image of the real Coke, and ITRW I might buy more Coke.

    2. Appropriate - If I'm in the Sims and I see something for Bank of America, I'll be miffed. But if I see the BofA logo but it's Simlish and says Banca de Sim but is the same logo, I might enjoy it and think Good Things about BofA - especially if it's an ATM I can use an interaction like "Plead for money" on.

    3. Not irritating - If I'm playing a game and something pops up in the middle of a three-guild war when we're in a massive slaughterfest and it's an animated strobing ad that distracts me - I will become furious and actively boycott the MOFO who placed the ad - period. If it's a banner that looks appropriate (not sharp, fits in, does not get in the way, placed where a banner would be) that might be ok, so long as it's not animated, strobing, or otherwise wrong.

    4. Avatars - and Assumptions - just because my character in say Diablo is a female assassin who likes to dress in skimpy clothes, don't assume I'm interested in: a. skimpy clothes; b. female clothes; c. birth control pills; d. poison; or e. Hamster Death Heads. Um, wait, I might be interested in Hamster Death Heads.

    --
    -- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
  14. In WoW? by alexgieg · · Score: 1

    I guess that with proper artwork some stores and services, such as Weapon Masters, e-Gold and Garb the World, plus flower delivery and some kinds of foods and restaurants (but nothing in the "fast-" category), could be adversised without much trouble inside medieval settings. But other than the above, I think it would be very difficult.

    PS: I'm not affiliated with the above sites. I just happen to use them. :)

    --
    Conservatism: (n.) love of the existing evils. Liberalism: (n.) desire to substitute new evils for the existing ones.
  15. Something to think about for game developers by SmallFurryCreature · · Score: 1
    Just ask yourselve how many people in your audience are in your audience because they tried to escape from ad burdened entertainment like tv, radio, movies.

    Let the ads in and loose your audience. Ask tv execs what happened to their young male audience.

    Now I do realize that this is temporary state. Just as the net is slowly being taken over by the sheep who love brands (myspace) this too will happen in games. For games aimed squarly at the average consumer ads are okay, they will swallow them as they do elsewhere.

    But if your audience is that young male that stopped watching tv because of the constant commercials then beware, you wouldn't be the first person to ruin a product with to much commercialism.

    Oh who am I kidding. I for one welcome our old advertising masters may they ruin games as they ruin everything else.

    --

    MMO Quests are like orgasms:

    You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.

  16. Ob. Bill Hicks Quote by spun · · Score: 1
    I've used it before, I'll use it again.

    By the way if anyone here is in advertising or marketing... kill yourself.
    No, no, no it's just a little thought. I'm just trying to plant seeds. Maybe one day, they'll take root - I don't know. You try, you do what you can.
    Kill yourself.
    Seriously though, if you are, do.
    Aaah, no really, there's no rationalisation for what you do and you are Satan's little helpers.
    Okay - kill yourself - seriously. You are the ruiner of all things good, seriously. No this is not a joke, you're going, "there's going to be a joke coming," there's no fucking joke coming.
    You are Satan's spawn filling the world with bile and garbage. You are fucked and you are fucking us. Kill yourself. It's the only way to save your fucking soul, kill yourself.
    Planting seeds. I know all the marketing people are going, "he's doing a joke... there's no joke here whatsoever. Suck a tail-pipe, fucking hang yourself, borrow a gun from a Yank friend - I don't care how you do it. Rid the world of your evil fucking makinations. Machi... Whatever, you know what I mean.
    I know what all the marketing people are thinking right now too,
    "Oh, you know what Bill's doing, he's going for that anti-marketing dollar. That's a good market, he's very smart."
    Oh man, I am not doing that. You fucking evil scumbags!
    "Ooh, you know what Bill's doing now, he's going for the righteous indignation dollar. That's a big dollar. A lot of people are feeling that indignation. We've done research - huge market. He's doing a good thing."
    Godammit, I'm not doing that, you scum-bags!
    Quit putting a godamm dollar sign on every fucking thing on this planet!
    "Ooh, the anger dollar. Huge. Huge in times of recession. Giant market, Bill's very bright to do that."
    God, I'm just caught in a fucking web.
    "Ooh the trapped dollar, big dollar, huge dollar. Good market - look at our research. We see that many people feel trapped. If we play to that and then separate them into the trapped dollar..."
    How do you live like that? And I bet you sleep like fucking babies at night, don't you?"
    "What didya do today honey?"
    "Oh, we made ah, we made ah arsenic a childhood food now, goodnight." [snores]"Yeah we just said you know is your baby really too loud? You know," [snores] "Yeah, you know the mums will love it." [snores]
    Sleep like fucking children, don't ya, this is your world isn't it?



    I second that "you make me sick" comment.
    --
    - None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
    1. Re:Ob. Bill Hicks Quote by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      People who bought Bill Hicks - Rant in E Minor also bought... pretty much anything else by Bill Hicks.

      Damn, that man's a marketing machine.

  17. Hidden Desires... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That is, when marketing in virtual worlds, do you target the flesh-and-blood user who controls the real-world wallet? Or do you target the wallet-wielding consumer's avatar, which likely represents a powerful but hidden aspect of his personality and could influence his purchases -- or at least provide a window into his hidden desires and preferences?

    I can't wait for the Victoria's Secret thong-of-the-month ad marketed toward my female drow elf.

    1. Re:Hidden Desires... by KDR_11k · · Score: 1

      Nonsense. Their research shows that 86% of the female characters in the game are played by fat, sweaty nerds so they will show you ads for dating services, deodorants, videogames and porn.

      --
      Justice is the sheep getting arrested while an impartial judge declares the vote void.
  18. Great. ANOTHER medium to be ruined with ads by Avatar8 · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Remember when you went to a movie, you might see a short news reel or a cartoon and then you saw the movie you paid to see.

    Now it has gotten so bad that if you show up early to find a good seat, you'll suffer through either a series of slides of local advertisements or a hollywood "behind the scenes" documentary. Then you suffer through 15 minutes of movie advertisements and paid advertisements denouncing movie piracy. I often forget which movie I came to see.

    So I've almost completely quit going to movies. Next I began buying DVD's, most often of movies I'd seen before at least once and like, but sometimes I'd risk buying a movie I hadn't seen. Now DVD's are starting to have forced advertising. (Disney is the worst.) I can understand being unable to skip the FBI warning, but why should I have to watch commercials every time I play the DVD?

    So I've decreased my DVD purchases as well. I'm currently enjoying the video on demand my Verizon FIOS TV offers. Start, pause, rewind and stop when I want. No commercials at the beginning or within. I'm enjoying my DVR functions, too. I record something and watch it later so I can skip through the commercials.

    Gaming is my relaxation. The last thing I want to see in a game I'm paying for is blatant advertising whether it applies to me as a person or my avatar. I barely care if it fits with the theme or not. It's a possible interruption, distraction or reminder of the real world that I don't want. I really enjoy gaming, but if marketers start screwing with my last bastion of peace, I'll be seriously pissed. Not only would I stop paying and playing, not only would I personally boycott the companies pushing the advertising, but I'd also be publically protesting and getting as many others as possible to boycott them, too.

    Why can advertisers not understand: we're in a PULL generation now. If you try pushing anything onto me, you'll get nothing but my anger and resentment. If I want something, I know how to go look for it. Why does it take acts of congress to (unsuccessfully) get companies to stop calling us? For spammers to stop sending us their crap? For companies to stop pushing their drivel down our throats everywhere we turn?

    I DON'T WANT YOUR PRODUCT!! CAPEESH?!!?

  19. SPAM by GWBasic · · Score: 1

    We already have "Avatar-Based Marketing". It's called SPAM.

  20. Unobtrusive? No chance. by bit01 · · Score: 1

    To those people here claiming that "unobtrusive advertising would be okay". You're either dreaming or in advertising/marketing yourself.

    The whole point of an ad is to communicate a message. If you haven't noticed it then it hasn't worked. Doesn't matter if it's in context or not. Only ineffective advertising is unobtrusive i.e. pointless.

    The scientific evidence for subliminal advertising is close to nil.

    90% of modern mass media marketing is nothing more than an arms race to get mindshare. That's why advertising increases in every possible medium until saturation. Everybody loses except the largely parasitic marketing industry.

    ---

    Marketing talk is not just cheap, it has negative value. Free speech can be compromised just as much by too much noise as too little signal.