Spain Outlaws P2P File-Sharing

Section_Ei8ht writes "Spanish Congress has made it a civil offense to download anything via p2p networks, and a criminal offense for ISP's to allow users to file-share, even if the use is fair. There is also to be a tax on all forms of blank media, including flash memory drives. I guess the move towards distributing films legally via BitTorrent is a no go in Spain." Here is our coverage of the tax portion of this law.

Comments

why the tax?

[Anonymous Coward]

After they make P2P illegal they then tax one of its possible end-products? Isn't this like simultaneously outlawing heroin and taxing syringes?

Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens?

[Anonymous Coward]

"Did you really think that we want those laws to be observed?" said Dr. Ferris. "We want them broken. You'd better get it straight that it's not a bunch of boy scouts you're up against - then you'll know that this is not the age for beautiful gestures. We're after power and we mean it. You fellows were pikers, but we know the real trick, and you'd better get wise to it. There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What's there in that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced nor objectively interpreted - and you create a nation of law-breakers - and then you cash in on guilt. Now that's the system, Mr. Rearden, that's the game, and once you understand it, you'll be much easier to deal with."

- Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged, 1957.

Re:Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens?

[pla]

This is a pretty fucking stupid thing to say.

If by "pretty fucking stupid" you mean "right on the money", I agree.


A government has whatever power it is given, by whatever agreement or coercion it used to get it

No. A government has whatever power it can get away with up until its citizens revolt. Consider, as a trivial example, the NSA spying program. Blatantly illegal, yet since we haven't revolted, not only don't we see thousands of executive branch employees (as well as complicit corporate partners) going to the federal pen - We see a push to legalize such activity in one of the most blatant guttings of the 4th amendment in US history.

Furthermore, you have a missing modifier on "given" - Who has given that right? We all speed (and many would go even faster than they do if not for the legal risk), yet the government seems to believe it has the right to limit how fast we can drive. Over half the US considers current drug laws far too draconian, yet we still have an inmate population made up primarily of nonviolent drug offenders. We all recognize that our election system has more flaws than any so-called "democratic" system can bear, yet rather than fix it, we just switch to less auditable polling mechanisms.

Spit out the Kool-Ade and open your eyes.


Where does the Apollo program fit into this "criminal" idea?

The "circuses" part of "bread and circuses". Keep the plebes entertained, and they'll bear far more before rising up.


Research grants for improving crop yield?

The "bread" part of "bread and circuses". A starving population recognizes that it has little to lose by risking death a few weeks sooner than would happen otherwise.


What about the interstate highway system?

You do know why Hitler commissioned the Autobahn, right? And why Eisenhower copied it? However convenient the rest of us might find it in times of peace, it exists for the purpose of facilitating military deployments - Between existing military bases, to points of foreign attack, and, if necessary, to the location of any potential insurrection.


The post office? [...] The DARPA work that created the Internet?

If you don't see the need for a tyrranical regime to have efficient lines of communication, I don't have the words to explain it to you.


I guess you could twist each of them into the "criminal" idea, but I really think you'd be kidding yourself.

Well, at least one of us would kid themselves, but consider the cost of error... Incorrectly distrusting the government has basically no cost. Incorrectly trusting them - Well, Arbeit Macht Frei, right?



Now, before you dismiss me as a complete loony - I don't think the US has gone too far quite yet. The current Megalomaniac-in-chief has certainly pushed us closer to the edge than anyone since Lincoln (including Nixon - You'll notice that when he got caught with his hand in the cookie-jar, he had the decency to step down. Even Reagan at least still had the humility to lie about his actions). But we can still turn things around if we can wake up enough of the zombies. Sadly, I consider that unlikely, but at least still possible.

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

I call Dupe and FUD

[Anonymous Coward]

Not only is this a dupe it's pure FUD.

From TFA "banned unauthorized peer-to-peer file-sharing in Spain" authorised sharing is still allowed.

These new laws are really no more restrictive than those from other countries.

Re:WoW

[Arker]

The article also mentions forcing ISPs to block P2P traffic. Routers have no way of knowing if it's authorised or not. Sounds to me like an enourmous amount of perfectly legal filesharing will be shutdown here. Then on top of that, there's the media tax. "The money collected will be paid back to the owner of the copyright" my ass. If I burn a CD of my own copyrighted works, will I get the tax refunded? If you burn a GNU/Linux cd, do you think the copyright holders are going to get paid by the Spanish government? I really don't think so.

Re:So let me get this straight

[silvioh]

Modded Insightful? Why?

The linked article says "unauthorized peer-to-peer file-sharing". So you will be able to download your prescious WoW-Patches, you will be able to send your own videos to your friends... because its not "unauthorized". Where's the problem?

In other words: the summary was BS and you did not get it straight...

Keyword is CIVIL OFFENCE!!

[giorgosts]

Simply means that you can use the technology for whatever use you like, but if you are caught downloading unauthorized copyrighted material, by any means (client-server or p2p) you dont go to jail, but you pay money for the damage you have done to the people authorized to sell that material. Seems fair to me..

Re:SENSATIONALIST CRAP and LIES

[laughingcoyote]

And no matter how long you've been a member, it's nice to see you offering as little information as you complain about!

What's wrong? Where? How is it wrong and what's the correct version? Without offering such an analysis, you're just spewing hot air (hot bits?) yourself.

Now, as to that...

Saying that no content is downloadable is contrary to the article, which states that only the downloading of unauthorized content is banned. I agree that that is sensationalistic, factually incorrect, and should have been caught.

On the other hand, the article does seem to indicate that ISP's may be criminally liable for the actions of their users:

But the government is going after Internet service providers; it's a criminal offense for ISPs to facilitate unauthorized downloading.

Now, that still leaves open to interpretation what "facilitation" may be-but in this case, the summary does seem to match the article.

Also, it is stated in the article that despite this new regulation, blank media will -also- be taxed! It seems to me this is a bit of "having it both ways" on the part of the content providers-outlawing personal copying AND getting tax revenue. Again, it seems that the summary is essentially correct on this point.

While the summary is incorrect on one part, and it should have been caught (and should still be corrected), this is still a subject of interest to many of us who visit this site.

However, regardless, if you're going to make assertions as strong as you just did, it's generally helpful to back them up. If you can't manage that, don't let the door hit you, there's enough of those here.

Downloaded linux without paying?

[mrcaseyj]

Great idea! Linux distributors should register as copyright holders so they can get their cut of the media taxes!

Re:Spain is so backwards

[Anonymous Coward]

Seems better than killing retarded people legally and having hundreds of people waiting in the death row.

Wrong Wrong Wrong

[Thomas Miconi]

The amount of crap that gets modded +5 insightful on /. is annoying enough in general, but when it comes to IP / P2P topics it really jumps through the roof. Here is a bit of information for those of us who have not yet been assimilated into the "information wants to be free" crowd.

1- The law explicitly bans "unauthorized P2P". Authorized P2P, despite the submitter's misleading assertions, is not concerned.

2- The blank levy is not a compensation for massive, indiscriminate filesharing on P2P networks. Rather, it is a compensation for the (perfectly legal) private, physical copying and sharing of copyrighted works, within the circle of family and close friends, and in low numbers, which I understand is definitely allowed in Spain. France and Canada have a similar scheme.

Basically you're allowed to make a few private copies, and in return you pay a bit more for your blank CDs. The money is they redistributed to registered copyright owners, proportionally to the royalties they earn from other, more easily quantifiable sources (sales, public performances, etc.). Not perfect, but that's the best way they could find. It certainly sucks for those of us who use CD for non-musical data, but I guess we're regarded as "collateral damage".

If I burn a CD of my own copyrighted works, will I get the tax refunded?

It's not a refund, it's a payment based on sales. The money levied from the tax is distributed to registered copyright owners, proportionally to their royalties. Note that anybody can register, including Joe Musician; in fact registering is a prerequisite to receiving any kind of royalties. So if you produce your own copyrighted works (and register to the appropriate body), AND some people buy your stuff or play it in public or use it for any other activity which involves payment of royalties, you'll definitely see some money from this tax.

If you burn a GNU/Linux cd, do you think the copyright holders are going to get paid by the Spanish government?

As I said, it's only for music, so basically no. However, I understand that the tax is only applicable to individuals, not corporations (a bit like VAT tax I suppose), so if $random_spanish_distro sends you a CD of their distribution, they won't have to pay the tax on the CD they burn.