Slashdot Mirror


Technology Rewriting the Rules of Business

theStorminMormon writes "Fortune magazine is running a story describing the overthrow of Jack Welch's old rules of business. (Welch responds here.) Although the article lists Google and Apple as two paragons of the new rules of business, it fails to note that the old rules of business originated from straight manufacturing firms while the new rules of business are coming from the (more service-oriented) tech sector." From the article: "Steve Jobs has emphasized that Apple hires only people who are passionate about what they do (something that, to be fair, Welch also talked about). At Genentech, CEO Art Levinson says he actually screens out job applicants who ask too many questions about titles and options, because he wants only people who are driven to make drugs that help patients fight cancer."

31 of 200 comments (clear)

  1. It's about passion by thewiz · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If you are passionate about what you do, you'll get out of bed in the morning and actually look forward to going to work. Passion also drives you to do your best, not to just get by so you can collect a paycheck.

    --
    If "disco" means "I learn" in Latin, does "discothèque" mean "I learn technology"?
    1. Re:It's about passion by badfish99 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Passion also ensures that you will work long hours for little reward, while the CEO takes home all the company profits.

  2. What do folks like me do? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful
    "Steve Jobs has emphasized that Apple hires only people who are passionate about what they do (something that, to be fair, Welch also talked about)...

    I work to live not live to work. I will do my job to the fullest, but I want a life. I don't want to wake up when I'm old and find that I'm alone and regretting that I didn't live my life instead of wasting it in the office.

  3. Other methods of screening by TechDogg · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I surely hope they have other methods of screening applicants, because I think that some people are easily able to fool interviewers and sound passionate.

    They are are just waiting to get hired and once they are, they lay back and start making all kinds of demands.

    --
    Got MILF? It does a body good!
  4. The IP sector. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    "Although the article lists Google and Apple as two paragons of the new rules of business, it fails to note that the old rules of business originated from straight manufacturing firms while the new rules of business are coming from the (more service-oriented) tech sector."

    Of course the "service sector" revolves around IP and the creation and maintainance of it.* The other kind of "service" is "would you like fries with that", but you can't build much of an economy on that.

    *Billions and billions of dollars as compared to the "buggy whip" sector.

  5. Jack's still got it by Shivetya · · Score: 3, Insightful

    just a few people want to play with words to make ideas their own. As he pointed out in his rebuttal a lot of the ideas that are being set out for today are compatible if not part of the ideas he espoused.

    I do agree with one item, weed out your worst. It is true. You will come to find that that passionate ones will not be lost in this. I'm in a company which doesn't do this, its a good old boy club. As such we still make money but never really move forward. We have so much deadwood it stifles innovation. The only time things change is when someone dies or retires.

    --
    * Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
    1. Re:Jack's still got it by m-wielgo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Want change? Promote the person hindering it to a higher position in a different area. Works in more industries than you would imagine.

  6. Compensation is ALWAYS Important by muntumbomoklik · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Whenever I hear the phrase "passionate about what you do" I get this eery feeling that they're going to offer up far more "passion" in their compensation package than "salary". Passion is all and well, and enjoying work is naturally important, but a large number of employers (especially in tech sectors) love to use the "passion" card as a way of underpaying their staff. If employees ever complain about meagre wages the employer can always counter with "But you LOVE this work! You should be glad to be doing this for a living!"

    There's a fine line between passion and simple exploitation of that passion to get stuff done for cheap. And I don't trust most businessmen to look out for my best interests when cutting a deal.

  7. Maybe look of another line of work by erice · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I work to live not live to work. I will do my job to the fullest, but I want a life. I don't want to wake up when I'm old and find that I'm alone and regretting that I didn't live my life instead of wasting it in the office.

    If your mission in life is best accomplished at the office, then how can spending your time there be a waste? If you are genuinely afraid that, when you are old, you will regret the time you spent at work, then maybe you chose your career poorly.

    Many or even most people choose their career poorly. Sometimes this is avoidable. Sometimes it is not. Sometimes the best occupation is one that pays poorly or not at all. Too many don't even try. They just chase the money instead. But those who do manage to unify their passion with their career are more effective employees.

    1. Re:Maybe look of another line of work by drsquare · · Score: 2, Insightful
      If your mission in life is best accomplished at the office, then how can spending your time there be a waste?
      If your mission in life is to sit in an office so some CEO can sit on a yacht and decorate private 767s, then that is a sad thing indeed.

      Sometimes the best occupation is one that pays poorly or not at all.
      If you live in a world where everything is free, yes. It's not a good occupation when the bank repossesses your house and your kid can't go to the dentist when he has toothache.
    2. Re:Maybe look of another line of work by element-o.p. · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Perhaps, but...

      Excluding things like my wife, daughter and family, I basically have four passions in my life: music, rock climbing, kayaking and flying. About seven years ago, I did a six month stint as a flight instructor. When I was up with a student, I thought flight instructing had to be one of the greatest scams on the face of the earth--I mean, I was actually getting paid to do something that I had previously shelled out $$$$$ to do.

      Unfortunately, at the end of six months, I was burned up and burned out. While on paper I was making a decent hourly wage as a flight instructor, in the real world, I was getting paid one hour for every two hours I was really working...if I was with a student. I spent many, many more unpaid hours hanging out at the flight school waiting for potential students to show up. For three of those six months, I was at the flight school from nine to twelve hours a day, seven days a week. That's on the order of 90 days straight with no time off, no weekends, nothing. I finally started drawing a line and said that I was willing to work this much time, on these days, but when I wasn't getting paid, I would work at my discretion. It was still more time than your average employee spends at work, and a good deal of the time would still be off the clock.

      I got fired.

      I've logged maybe 30 hours of flight time since.

      In short, if there's something you really, truly enjoy doing, don't ruin it by trying to make a living at it. Find something you *like* and do it for a living, but don't take your *real* joy and make it work. When it becomes work, it's no fun any more.

      --
      MCSE? No, sir...I don't do Windows. Yes, I am an idealist. What's your point?
  8. What he really meant... by darthnoodles · · Score: 5, Insightful
    At Genentech, CEO Art Levinson says he actually screens out job applicants who ask too many questions about titles and options, because he wants only people who are driven to make drugs that help patients fight cancer.
    What he means is: "I don't want people who are interested in whay THEY'LL get from the job. I want people who are interested in nothing more than the good of the COMPANY!"

    How dare someone be interested in their own benefits!?!?!

    1. Re:What he really meant... by bladesjester · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I know. It's the companies I have interviews with that constantly talk of how "passionate" and "dedicated" their staff is that expect you to work 70-80 hours per week for a tiny salary. The ones who actually have a good work-life balance tend also to be the ones that pay a sane rate.

      --
      Everything I need to know I learned by killing smart people and eating their brains.
    2. Re:What he really meant... by nine-times · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I don't know... I think what's being said is pretty fair. It seems kind of like a crazy thing to say if you think of it as "people who are focused on their own good vs. people who sacrifice their life for the good of the company". On the other hand, it makes a lot of sense if you're trying to contrast "self-serving back-stabbing little pricks who are only interested in moving up" with "people who, even if they might like promotions and such, are a little more interesting indoing a good job where they are".

      I know I'd rather do a good job than have a small pay raise or slightly cooler title at a job I suck at. I wouldn't hire anyone who I thought held the opposite opinion.

    3. Re:What he really meant... by Shadowlore · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What he means is: "I don't want people who are interested in whay THEY'LL get from the job. I want people who are interested in nothing more than the good of the COMPANY!"

      How dare someone be interested in their own benefits!?!?!

      Should you ever have a daughter, I'm sure you'll respond the same way. Yeah right. If someone wanted to date your daughter you'd be very interested in whether or not he is interested in "his own benefit" or that of your daughter. There is no difference between that and looking for someone who is interested in doing the work you have for them. In this case curing cancer. How dare he want to pay someone to work instead of paying someone to loaf around. Of all the nerve!

      Of course, those who do what they enjoy ar emore likely to get work done, make things better, and be happier than those who are not.

      --
      My Suburban burns less gasoline than your Prius.
  9. passion vs. obsession by spykemail · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Some of you are confusing passion with obsession. A passionate employee loves his or her job and strives to do a good job - they don't necessarily devote their entire life to it. I know plenty of passionate people who have lives outside of the office. You can really love your job and try really hard without even taking it out of the office.

    In my experience some of the people who are obsessed with their job (spending nights / weekends) actually hate it.

    Does anyone else see a creepy Apple vs. Microsoft comparison here? I know a couple of managers at Microsoft, and the "old" rules sound exactly like what they do.

    1. Re:passion vs. obsession by radtea · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Some of you are confusing passion with obsession.

      Trust me, when a boss talks about wanting passionate employees, they don't mean someone who has a healthy work-life balance. They mean someone whose emotional attachment to what they do can be exploited for the good of the company--and the CEO.

      The cure for passion is professionalism, which is amongst other things is the attitude that high quality work deserves high quality compensation.

      --
      Blasphemy is a human right. Blasphemophobia kills.
  10. I'm Not Convinced by amelith · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Well they can say what they want but, in my experience, the corporate sector thrives on mediocrity. Most companies want to hire average people and pay them an average amount of money, or a bit less if they can get away with it. I don't claim that this is necessarily wrong, just hypocritical.

    They can go on about "passion" and wanting "the best people" but they know that passionate people can be difficult to deal with and the best people not only want the best money and benefits but they want some say in how things get done.

    And would they hire someone "passionate" in their late forties or is this merely another codeword for "naive new graduate"?

    Ame

  11. money for nothing, chicks for free by fermion · · Score: 4, Insightful
    I think this is like the perpetual motion machine. Everyone hopes they can circumvent the laws of the universe and create profit from nothing. The dot com philosophy was the unoriginal "we make up for in sales what we don't make in profit." Enron was an outshoot of this, and eventually though it had "sales", it ran out of money. The jury is still out on Amazon. It is scary to think that each order steals a few cents from investors.

    Apple on the other hand is so clearly old line. Make quality and useful products targeted to an audience willing to pay for the products. Charge enough for the product to create a good profit. Give good service before, during, and after the sale. Charge enough so that at the end one has enough to pay for fixed costs, manufactureing, service, overhead, and research and development. Do not be afraid to change the product to meet demands, and throw in a bit of flash. This probably had not changed since Ford innovated the car in on color Black, with evolved into the mustang of many colors. I think the old Ford put some big dogs out of bussiness as well.

    I understand what the article is saying, but the article is talking about established firm. Apple, as an established firm, did exactly what it was supposed to do. That is fixed itself. Apple has been, and is, a major manufacturer of consumer and proffesional intergrated computer solution. So is Dell. MS only supplies software. Apple is and will continue to be, at least in the near future, a to manufacuturer of high tech solutions. The have proven that they will adjust to meet new needs, just as old bussiness says they should. The article cites IBM, which also did what it needed to do. Refocus on the customer, develop customer oriented products that provided real value. They talk about how the iPod is unique, but how many new catagories of product did IBM help create? The selectric, the PC, SQL, GML, etc.

    It is ludicrous to think that anything other than good products or services matter, or that creating new products is something new. IBM exists because it started creating products and focused on customers.

    As far as google, that is a story yet to be wrote. They have an Enron like grasp on the ad market, unregulated, not transparent, unpredicatable. The success may be last remant of the dot com boom, or they may be able to leverage advertisers in the same way that TV did. If they are succesful, it will be nothing but bussiness as usual. Create a product, namely adwords, charge enough for it to generate a profit, and use some of the cash to innovate.

    I think what happened, especially in the 70's and 80's, was the sense of entitlement of the big corporations. That somehow Americans were obligated to purchase the products no matter how horrible they were. In a perverse way, they were applying the soviet model to capitalism, where the people had to buy what they state supplied, except in out case capatilism provided such an oversupply that we had the illusion of choice. This was illustated with the government bailout of chrysler. In fact, some of the few comapnies that haven't leared thier lesson are in the auto industry. Chrsyler has so given up and is running ads featuring it German owner. In the end what we may be seeing is not new rules of bussiness, but the return to the basics. Make a product, sell a product at a fair price, and realize the consumer is the boss.

    --
    "She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
  12. Re:Hire passionate people by ericspinder · · Score: 4, Insightful
    ...But Dave's the right guy to get this promotion, even though we only brought him in from that middle-manager position at Nabisco three weeks ago, and I'll tell you why. Frankly Bob, you just don't have Dave's passion."
    That's the great fear of being a long-term employee unjustly passed by a new guy who interviews well. I believe that the 'passion' which the author refers to cannot be captured in a cover letter, interview, or golf outing, but in one's day-to-day commitment to the work. If that passion is the one which his managers look for then I am certain that your 'Bob' would find himself well rewarded.
    --
    The grass is only greener, if you don't take care of your own lawn.
  13. Re:The Secret of Jack Welch's Success by hotdiggitydawg · · Score: 3, Insightful

    When I read his rebuttal:

    When has there ever been a divergence between shareholders and customers? No one is out saying, "Let's screw this customer today, and if we do, our share price might go up 20 cents." They're just not doing it.

    I thought "Well he's obviously never bought a Sony product"...

  14. Re:Yawn... by Daniel+Dvorkin · · Score: 3, Insightful

    For the vast majority of coders, business pays their salary.

    That being said, I agree that this is an article for suits (well, what do you expect from Fortune) and it's packed with business jargon that means very little. A lot of non-tech types make fun of techie jargon, but the jargon means something; when we say "TCP/IP," it's because it's a lot quicker than saying "transmission control protocol and internet protocol," and a whole lot quicker than spelling out, in detail, what each of those terms actually means. Suits have long had a habit of either taking technical jargon (from various fields, not just CS) and twisting it until it doesn't mean anything, or just making up jargon that didn't mean anything in the first place.

    "Six sigma," mentioned in the article, is a fine example of this. How many suits really understand what a "sigma" is in this (or any) context, or why six of them is an interesting quantity? Then the six-sigma crowd compounded their sins by using the phrase "black belt." And of course there's all the military talk they love to throw around, this bunch of lifelong civilians who wouldn't know which end of an M16 the bullet comes out of. As a mathematician, a martial artist, and a veteran, I find this particular combination to be the Holy Trinity of bad suit-speak.

    So the answer to the question, "Why should we care?" is, "Because that's where the money is" -- but that shouldn't keep us from pointing out what a bunch of jackasses they are.

    --
    The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
  15. Re:Yawn... by engagebot · · Score: 2, Insightful

    See, i disagree. If you got into IT for creativity, you should have looked into marketing. IT is about standards, best practices, and things 'just working' for your customers (ie the company's internal people). Yes, there are places where creativity is good, but no more than any other 'office job' at the same company.

    Lets see, i need a fool-proof disaster recovery scheme. Best practices or art? I choose best practices. File server? Yep, best practicies. Email? Exchange, please.

    Like i said, there is room for creativity, but only here and there. IT is not alchemy by any stretch.

    --
    Han shot first.
  16. The Gravy Train by Zobeid · · Score: 5, Insightful

    With regard to hiring. . . After a company reaches a certain level of success and public recognition, large numbers of people start applying for jobs just because they want to work for a successful company -- not because they want to help make the company successful. In other words, they want to ride the gravy train. Those are the ones you have to weed out.

    Start-ups and small companies rarely have this problem. It's after your company turns out to be Google, then everybody wants to climb on board.

  17. you miss the point by enjahova · · Score: 2, Insightful

    In your example Bob IS the passionate person. From the factors the manager listed there is no way he hates his job and can write top code and work well with everybody. Being passionate about what you do isn't about saying how much you love it, its about waking up in the morning and WANTING to go to work and get stuff accomplished.

    The manager you imagined is just an example of a bad manager, and not how I imagine hiring passionate employees at all. I would imagine the manager hiring Bob and hearing Bob talk with enthusiasm about all the ideas he has to implement. Hed probably pass over the cookie cutter from Nabisco ;P

    --
    "how can they call it a MINE if everything here is THEIRS?!?!" -Straight Jacket
  18. Re:Hire passionate people by PCM2 · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I believe that the 'passion' which the author refers to cannot be captured in a cover letter, interview, or golf outing, but in one's day-to-day commitment to the work. If that passion is the one which his managers look for then I am certain that your 'Bob' would find himself well rewarded.

    Sure, you believe ... it's easy to believe.

    Where's the benchmark for "passion"? How do I prove I have it? How does a manager evaluate me for it? If Dave was hired because of his passion, and Bob was hired because of his passion, which one gets to head up the project? Which one has more passion and which could work on his passion a little bit?

    For that matter, is it even possible to "work on" your passion? If you were hired with just a little less passion than Dave, is there some kind of program or training course the company can offer you that will increase your passion levels? Or are you just doomed to not succeed because, hell, it's about hiring the most passionate people you can find?

    This is what I mean by touchy-feely management. Yes, in today's more compassionate America, nobody wants to look like a bully. God forbid we should be competitive, or aggressive, or challenge ourselves and our coworkers to do better work even if we're working on something that we're maybe not all that passionate about. But come on -- do you really want to work for a company whose mantra is "Admire us for our soul?" I feel oily just thinking about it.

    I'd much rather work for Jack Welch than the people who wrote this list of tips. Jack's world may not be the most forgiving one, but at least he doesn't mince words with this kind of New Age garbage. At least he shoots straight.

    --
    Breakfast served all day!
  19. Re:Hire passionate people by ericspinder · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I'd much rather work for Jack Welch than the people who wrote this list of tips.
    Well that should be a no-brain-er, because I don't think that that people who wrote that list are hiring, as they are writers just trying to capture a perceived trend.
    God forbid we should be competitive, or aggressive, or challenge ourselves and our coworkers to do better work even if we're working on something that we're maybe not all that passionate about.
    In his rebuttal, Jack mentioned that he was quite proud of reducing the corporate hierarchy, and he believed that in general it should be reduced even further. In your well received example 'Bob' was a skilled coder, but he feels that in order to succeed he needs to have the job which 'Dave' took. I think, that this internal struggle for dominance is not the real point of most businesses. While some pressure is good, 'Bob' should be able to succeed without becoming 'Dave'.

    I think that you basic 'problem' is with the word 'passion', and I'll agree that it is just about the vaguest 'concept word', and open to interpretation. Grading someone an 'A', 'B', 'C', etc, is also highly subjective as well. Jack and his team picked, promoted, and nurtured some pretty good people, but others who have superficially implemented 'his style' have not been so successful. Articles like this are good for self-examination, and should not be used as a manifesto. Of course someone will use it as such, and will likely miss the meaning altogether, surely even resulting in yet another example of your complaint. I wonder how many good coders were rated a 'B' because they lacked 'managerial' qualities.

    Sure, you believe ... it's easy to believe.
    And I also believe that using one's moderating term of speech against them is rude. Particularly without a smiley :)
    --
    The grass is only greener, if you don't take care of your own lawn.
  20. Re:The Secret of Jack Welch's Success by drinkypoo · · Score: 2, Insightful
    but is there any objective way to measure how much the actions of one guy at the top really "grew the business by $400 billion during his tenure from 1981-2001?"

    If there were, you'd hear a fuck of a lot less of that.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  21. Same old story by Jerim · · Score: 1, Insightful

    This keeps getting repeated. "Old way is inferior to the new way." With the new way always being a more laid back, less money oriented approach.

    I have news for that will just shock the world. Companies like Google and Apple are run just like every other company. People are hired for what they can do, and are let go for not living up to their potential. CEOs do what makes them more money. The only difference, is the that "new way" hides their intent behind an "employee friendly facade." How can Apple be part of the new way when Jobs is notorious for being the typical power hungry boss who will ridicule you in front of your coworkers? How is that the "new way"?

    Google and Apple are not some awesome place where everyone just relaxes all day being "creative" and yet somehow still make money. At both companies, goals are set and if they are met people get in trouble or even fired. Just like at every other company. These companies also live and die by their stock value. Who was that bough an oversized company jet and decided to refit it? Was that some greedy boss at Bellsouth or Enron? Nope, it was the good natured guys at Google who don't care about money, right?

  22. Re:Hire passionate people by aadvancedGIR · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I worked twice for GE as a contractor and I can tell you having a 'A' there has nothing to do with talent, but more with 'visibility', in other word, powerpoint and buzzwords.

  23. You have to remember what a business is for. by Gallowglass · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The main rule is to remember what a business exists for. And that is not "to make money." Within three weeks of starting b-school we were being told that that was the route to disaster, because although that may be why people invest money or labour in the company, that is their reason, not the company.

    The real purpose of a company is satisfy the wants and/or needs of a market segment at a price that the market segment is willing to pay. If you can do this and turn a profit, the company will continue. The market (And here, I mean the customer base, not the stock market.) does not care if you are making a profit. It does not care that your shareholders want ever-increasing profitability.

    One of the thing about the "old rules" in the article is its emphasis on the stock price. This is to take your eye off of your market, and I contend that this is the major cause of most of the septic corporate behaviour in the world today.

    In fairness to the CEOs, the market and thus the boards of directors insist on this devotion to share price. From the article: "Never before has a CEO more needed to take risks, but rarely has Wall Street been less receptive. A recent Booz Allen study found that a CEO is vulnerable to ouster if his stock price has lagged behind the S&P 500 by an average of 2 percent since he took the top job." (God forbid we should take a momentary hit is stock price because we are developing a new market.) "Cisco Systems CEO John Chambers says he knows a number of colleagues who are planning to step down because of the difficulty of balancing the shortterm pressures of the Street with what's in the longterm best interest of the company."

    Despite what many people think about the "intelligence" of the stock market, the function of investment funds is only to make money. There is no incentive in the stock market to take the long view.

    In the book "Up the Organization", the author, Robert Townsend, relates that when he was hired to be the CEO of Avis, he insisted on one condition: "Don't talk to me about the stock price for two years!" He didn't want to be distracted from the long term goals by worrying about the vagaries of the stock market. I have alwys thought Mr Townsend to be a very smart man.