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Keeping Time with a Mercury Atom

Roland Piquepaille writes "The National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) has announced that a new experimental atomic clock based on a single mercury atom is now at least five times more precise than NIST-F1, the U.S. standard clock. This mercury atomic clock 'would neither gain nor lose a second in about 400 million years' while it would take 'only' 70 million years to NIST-F1, based on a 'fountain' of cesium atoms, to gain or lose a second. But even if this new kind of optical atomic clock is more accurate than cesium microwave clocks, it will take a while before such a design can be accepted as an international standard. A ZDNet summary contains pictures and more details about the world's most precise clock."

38 of 153 comments (clear)

  1. unfortunately by legallyillegal · · Score: 5, Funny

    syncing to time.singlemercuryatom.nist.gov doesn't work yet.

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    ?giS
    1. Re:unfortunately by uglydog · · Score: 5, Funny

      maybe it's been /.ed?

  2. 400 million years by gfody · · Score: 2, Insightful

    It's easy to make impressive statements like that when you know nobody will be around to prove you wrong!

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    bite my glorious golden ass.
    1. Re:400 million years by gardyloo · · Score: 3, Funny

      Pfft. You'll regret saying that when the readers of the future see the article's 3.56*10^12th dupe.

    2. Re:400 million years by evilviper · · Score: 4, Insightful
      It's easy to make impressive statements like that when you know nobody will be around to prove you wrong!

      Complete nonsense. This isn't a "prediction", it's a mathematical number/time. Like any other number/time, you can easily convert it into shorter time-frames.

      1 sec in 400 million years is ==
          1/2 sec in 200 million years
          1/4 sec in 100 million years
          1/8 sec in 50 million years
          etc.

      That means it is accurate to 0.000000025ths of a second in 10 years... A more partical time-frame, which can be tested fairly easily.
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    3. Re:400 million years by Planesdragon · · Score: 2, Insightful

      That means it is accurate to 0.000000025ths of a second in 10 years... A more partical time-frame, which can be tested fairly easily.

      How, exactly?

      Only test that I can think of would be to build two of these, plus a control of some sort, and leave them right next to each other for ten years. Only the control will be less accurate than the device you're measuring...

    4. Re:400 million years by evilviper · · Score: 4, Informative
      Only test that I can think of would be to build two of these, plus a control of some sort, and leave them right next to each other for ten years. Only the control will be less accurate than the device you're measuring...

      The same way they've been doing it for many years with current atomic clocks... You don't just have a single clock, you have a BANK of numerous atomic clocks, and use statistical sampling to correct drift. And establish a very, very accturate time base.
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    5. Re:400 million years by Das+Modell · · Score: 4, Funny
      It's easy to make impressive statements like that when you know nobody will be around to prove you wrong!

      This man begs to differ.
    6. Re:400 million years by ceoyoyo · · Score: 2, Informative

      Having a very accurate clock can let you do all kinds of interesting things. For example, if you find it easy to measure time VERY accurately, but difficult to measure very small distances (which we do) then you can set up experiments where time is an indirect measure of distance (as in, how long does it take this laser beam to travel there and back?).

    7. Re:400 million years by John+Nowak · · Score: 2, Insightful

      They don't do that. Given a bank of 10 clocks, you'd have a 0.09765625% chance of them all losing time -- And then, not even at the same rate, so you'd not lose even a full second. Given a bank of 100 clocks, 7.8886090522101181e-29% percent. It's not really a problem.

  3. Great news for D-Link by GreggBz · · Score: 5, Funny

    Great news for those mission critical D-Link routers!

  4. Only problem is... by mrjb · · Score: 5, Funny

    They're treating time as if it were something absolute.

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    1. Re:Only problem is... by Umbral+Blot · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Relativity doesn't make clocks less useful, in fact it makes them more useful (because you can use them to figure out how fast you are going as well). And assuming that the clock remains under constant acceleration there is no reason to believe that relativity would make it less accurate.

    2. Re:Only problem is... by Lumpy · · Score: 3, Insightful

      That an it will help prove my Theory that there is a black hole in time here on the planet earth. AS we age we accelerate towards the black hole and therefore experience time distortion. Think about it. As a child summer took F-O-R-E-V-E-R. As a Teen it took about what felt like the right amount of time. As a Young Adult in college it seems like summer was shorter than normal. A person in their 40's summer feels like about 3 weeks and other effects of time distortion take effect.... Week-ends feel like they last ony a single day. And the inconsistancies also start showing as the time gravitional waves pass by you. A work week seems like it took a day to pass while a co-worker next to you in the same age bracket feels like it took much longer.

      As you get near your 80's the gravity of the black hole starts tugging not only at your time harder by at you in physical ways. Your skin starts sagging, you break bones easier because of the greater gravity in the physical dimensions.. How many people have heard old people complain it's hard to walk?? Huh! Observable proof!

      Mercury clocks would help here. We attach one to every newborn for a decade and then look at the time distortion as it happens so we can figure out how to defeat this terror.

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    3. Re:Only problem is... by Slithe · · Score: 2, Funny

      > Would you like me to give you a lecture about distance in Minkowskian geometry? Or perhaps a quick introduction to Riemann manifolds?

      Yes, please. I love free lectures!

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      ---- "XML is like violence. If it doesn't fix the problem, you aren't using enough."
  5. How much accuracy do you need? by tylernt · · Score: 2, Interesting

    So... at what point do you say that a clock is accurate enough? I mean, yeah maybe this thing is more accurate than current technology, but if it turns out to be way more expensive, why bother? How often do you need the accuracy that current technology can't provide?

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    1. Re:How much accuracy do you need? by gardyloo · · Score: 3, Informative
    2. Re:How much accuracy do you need? by Detritus · · Score: 2, Interesting

      We can always use more accuracy. Many communications systems rely on accurate clocks to keep the transmitters and receivers in synchronization. Frequency stability is also important for communications systems and test and measurement equipment. Any defects in the clock will degrade the performance of the equipment.

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      Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
    3. Re:How much accuracy do you need? by UnknowingFool · · Score: 2, Funny

      So... at what point do you say that a clock is accurate enough?

      When you can snipe anybody at will on eBay.

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  6. Why? by mh101 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Can someone explain why we even need this sort of precision?

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    1. Re:Why? by bmo · · Score: 2, Informative

      Like the other guy said, radar, lidar, but also add navigation and land surveying. Longitude is determined by time difference between UTC and local time. If you make this clock small enough, and replace the current constellation of GPS satellites with new ones based on this type of clock, you increase the resolution.

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      BMO

  7. Re:One small problem... by enrevanche · · Score: 4, Informative
    i'm sure that they use a stable isotope.

    the isotope you mention (194) is synthetic anyways

  8. The only problem arises... by viking2000 · · Score: 5, Funny

    ...from the Heisenberg uncertainly principle:

    The more precisely
    the MOMENTUM is determined,
    the less precisely
    the POSITION is known

    So this clock is unfortunately missing. And when it is found, it is not so accurate anymore.

  9. I'm registering domain names now by shidarin'ou · · Score: 2, Funny

    400 million years in the future, my descendents will profit unthinkable amounts from their ownership of y400002k.com

    Just in case the religious right get a further hold on our country in the future, I've also registered jesuswillreturn400002k.com and (hedging my bets) spaghettimonsterwillreturn400002k.com

    but we all know that by that time, humanity will simply be slaves to the powerfully accurate mercury clock.

    So, I for one welcome our new mercury atom overlords, and remind them that mercyatomoverlords.com can be had for the steal of 6.7 billion dollars, should cover the cost of registering the domain up to that point.

  10. but will it by p51d007 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Fit on my wrist??????????

  11. I Know I'm Missing Something Here... by stuffman64 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I'm just curious about something here. If a second is defined to be 9,192,631,770 oscillations of a Caesium-133 atom, then why is it said atomic clocks are accurate to within a second over 70 million years? Isn't that lost/gained second itself defined by the Caesium atom's transitions? I hope this question makes sense...

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    1. Re:I Know I'm Missing Something Here... by oskay · · Score: 5, Informative
      The trick is that the second is defined to be the frequency of an unperturbed cesium atom, which is about as real as that "frictionless plane" that you might have had in high-school physics.

      An example of the problem is this: for technical reasons, a small magnetic field is needed inside a cesium clock. Magnetic fields change the spacing between all atomic energy levels to some degree. For cesium, the relevant change is very small, but it is still there. What you need to do is measure the magnetic field, calculate how much it affects the frequency of the atomic transition, and correct your output frequency by the required amount. What ultimately sets the accuracy level of a given clock is how well the magnetic field shift (and dozens of others) can be corrected for.

      The same is true for the mercury clock. The difference is that the systematic frequency shifts that can affect accuracy of the clock are now understood, and controllable, at a higher level of precision.

  12. Upper Limit? by NexFlamma · · Score: 2, Insightful

    At what point do people simply say that our time keeping methods are good enough?

    We already have a clock that only loses 1 second every 70 million years! The odds of the current time keeping system (or mankind, for that matter) continuing in it's current form for the next 70 million years are rather low, so why do we really need one that only loses a second every 400 million?

    Sure, it's nice to be able to improve, but can't the research money go to something more useful? Like, maybe cancer research or studies into how we can build giant robots that transform into dinosaurs...

  13. Re:How did they make the clock, and will it break? by voice_of_all_reason · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Actually, the logical design of the clock will last 40 billion years until it produces an error. I'm quite sure we will never design any sort of mechanical device can actually last that long to find out.

    //unless you socket it with a zod rune...

  14. Accuracy by thorndt · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I'm suspecting that this level of accuracy would be quite useful in high-end scientific experiements--not so much for general wall-clock settings.
    For example, measuring the duration of extremely short events--like in particle accelerators.

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  15. Re:Universal clock? by pontifier · · Score: 2, Interesting
    --
    -John Fenley
  16. wristwatch by elmartinos · · Score: 3, Funny

    Can't wait to have a wristwatch with this. My atomic wristwatch is a bit too bulky.

  17. Re:How accurate is accurate enough? by rwwh · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Scientific American once had a nice paper about time. I remember these two facts:
    • At an accuracy of 10^-17, the earths gravity makes that two identical clocks, one of which is 5cm higher up than the other one, will start deviating from each other (i.e. time really IS different 5 cm up, at this accuracy)
    • At an accuracy for 10^-17, relativistic effects start playing a role at walking speeds (i.e. time really IS different at walking speed than at rest, at this accuracy).
    I think 5cm and 5km/hour are reasonable usability limits, hence an accuracy of better than 1:10^17 would not make much sense to me.
  18. Re:One small problem... by oskay · · Score: 3, Interesting

    The clock is based on mercury-199. Yes, it's a stable isotope.

  19. Re:How accurate is accurate enough? by oskay · · Score: 3, Informative

    The 400-million year figure is still limited by technical issues, not fundamental physics. It is expected that once a few more calibration methods are tried out, that it will be able to reach its theoretical limit, which actually does turn out to be pretty close to one second in five billion years. In any case, these millions-of-years figures are not really practical-- they're just the way that clock people phrase things so that they sound good in the popular press. What really matters is that the precision that can be obtained in a much shorter period of time is much higher. Right now the mercury clock has errors at the level of about a second in 400 million years-- but a second is a lot of timing error! Perhaps a more useful (but equivalent) figure would be 2.3 ns per year, or perhaps you would rather use 44 picoseconds per week.

  20. Re:Missing the point by Teancum · · Score: 2, Informative

    To add a more practical real world example to this line of thought....

    Clock accuracy is one of the key components of GPS systems and other navigational equipment. By having a much more accurate clock, you would be able to build devices that can determine with higher precision exactly where you are on the Earth... or for that matter in space even.

    If you aren't aware of the "data" that is streamed out of GPS satellites, all that is transmitted is a clock signal that simply says what time it is right now, and along with some identification information. When compared to other satellites and applying some fairly straight-forward mathmatics (that includes some relativity equations), you get your current position.

    In fact, while you might be able to determine within about 20 feet where you are at with current GPS technology and think that is "good enough" for the purposes of using that technology, navigation in the Solar System is going to need even higher clock accuracy in order to plot accurate trajectories to Mars and not get the current 30% failure rate of spacecraft trying to get there and accidentally crashing into the surface or other navigational mistakes caused by inaccurate plotting of the motion of both Mars and the Earth.

    In short, you life someday (perhaps even now) might litterally depend on the navigation equipment of the vehicle you are in (read airliner) knowing precisely where you are at, and a more accurate clock will give that vehicle better accuracy to keep you alive.

  21. Could someone please explain to me... by spiffyman · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I know I'm risking my own karma to ask this, but why was parent modded Redundant? The comment is funny, and it accurately illustrates why we might take time to do something seemingly useless. Because it might be useful, duh!

    Point is - parent should be modded up/funny. If I had mod points today I'd do it myself.

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    So you can laugh all you want to...
  22. Re:Closed Season by 1u3hr · · Score: 2, Informative
    How is his personal page any sleazier than ZDNet's summary?

    His blog IS what he describes as "ZDNet's summary". The same link he spams in every one of his submissions.