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Recommendations for a 50" (or Larger) Display?
An anonymous reader asks: "What display device should I get for a conference room? It can't be a front projection and it should be >= 50" and somewhat slim. If I go plasma, it seems like the burn-in problem could be serious if the unit is used as a monitor -- I don't want to look at either a 'Start' or 'KDE' button until the end of time. LCDs don't impress me since I can only get them in sizes of 45" or less. What about DLP? They make noise, but will it drown out a person trying to make a presentation to a room of 10-20 people? Overall, am I really stuck with a max vertical resolution of 768? Are rear projection LCD's or DLP's slim enough to not dominate a room?"
i know you said it can't be front projected but any projector that you would use for a confrence room has the ablitlity to be mounted on the ceiling and also set so that it is to be rear projected .. so you ahve progjector on the screen and then people looking at the other side of screen..
go talk to a local av shop.. or msg me and i will give you part numebrs.. you can do it for a hell of alot lesss than a huge flat screen display..
'...if only "Jumping to a Conclusion" was an event in the Olympics.'
The "noise" a DLP makes is hardly something to worry about. I don't even have a top-of-the-line DLP from Samsung and I can only notice it when I'm straining to hear it. I own a 50" JVC that's doing very well for me and I would easily recommend a similar DLP if your only qualm is the noise.
Used to work for TI(The DLP creaters) so saw a lot of DLPs beginning from the very first models. Noise was never an issue and the image was great. But as with all projectors, the only downside is expensive bulbs, which can go poof after a couple of years of use. Make sure you get a warranty/insurance plan which covers that unless you got loads of money to spend
My Aurora : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o91ZsGwJYyg
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and don't mind spending the money and don't mind looking around a bit, you can/could get the Grand Canyon Display from Liebermann Inc.
;)
They used to reside at http://www.go-l.com/ but that seems to be defunct now. Last I checked they had one that was even bigger (5 1600x1200 monitors in one I believe), but since it's gone, I'm not entirely sure what it was called.
A teaser http://www.primidi.com/2003/09/25.html (that's a Roland link, sadly) for now though
We do not live in the 21st century. We live in the 20 second century.
I've found http://wwww.projectorcentral.com/ to be a very useful resource when wondering about projectors.
Oh, and http://www.google.com/ as well. Amazing what information is out there.
Put my fist through my alarm clock with its ding-dong death inside my ear. - The Blackjacks.
First off, all of these technologies are being implemented in rear-projection, so there is some extra space in terms of thickness between the screen and back edge of the sets. But, all three of them are still thin compared to CRT solutions and, if "money is no object" (we'll just pretend it isn't) there are 1080p (1920x1080) sets available in the 50-70" range. One possible snag is that you'll want to make sure that these 1920x1080 sets will actually take such a signal - several of them will only up-convert signals to 1080p. Of course, in the case of a 1080i signal it will still look darn good since it's a simple line-doubling issue. Looking at a slightly older technology, there is rear-projection LCD. Sony offers 1080p HDTVs of this ilk.
None of these items will be as sleek as a direct-view plasma or LCD, but none of them will approach the room-dominating size of an old-school CRT RPTV either. They also won't be inexpensive, though compared to direct-view plasma and LCD units in similar sizes (BTW- Sharp actually does sell LCDs in the 50+" range) they'll be at least competitive and often much cheaper.
Finally, "burn-in" isn't an issue with any of these technologies, though each can have its quirks (for example, some people are sensitive to the DLP "rainbow" effect, though supposedly it has been minimized in the latest 1080p sets).
Rear projection DLP is pretty good, and is less expensive than its alternatives. Whether or not it's appropriate for your requirements is up to you.
I just went to Samsung's site and selected the first rear projection DLP monitor that was over 50". I got this. Whether or not it's too deep is up to you. Samsung is claiming 16.3" deep in their specifications. Some are thinner than others though. As far as noise goes, manufacturers seem to be listening to what their customers want and are competing to make quieter units. You may want to go to a showroom and hear what kind of noise these produce. Also, plug a laptop into a few to see what your presentations look like.
It has been estimated that about 5% of people experience what is known as the DLP Rainbow Effect, where some viewers can see flashes of color separation on the edges of high contrast edges. To minimize this, manufacturers are speeding up color wheels and adding more segments to effectively increase the color wheel speed. As DLP chips become cheaper, I believe that we will begin seeing 3-chip solutions enter the consumer market to completely eliminate the issue. In any case, the rainbow effect is something that you may want to keep in mind when you consider whether or not to use DLP.
-Turkey
another technology out there that you didn't mention was LCOS. it's similar to a DLP in size. sony is just about to release thier a2000 series which will sport 1080p resolution and 1080p inputs (thereby satisfying your request for more than 768 vertical resolution). there are tons of input types, so you shouldn't have to worry about getting the video to it.
the 50" should be available in the next week or so. they have a 55 and 60 inch projected to launch in the near future. there are a few reviews available with a quick google search, but for the most part, people are waiting (and anxious) to see this new model.
I say DLP, without a doubt. Crisp color reproduction, higher resolution than lcd or plasma.
2 E16889253029
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N8
Dimensions : 18" deep. Unless your conference room is exceptionally crowded, a foot and a half shouldn't make any difference.
And best of all, plug in a high definition disk player and watch HD movies, or an Xbox 360.
Or, connect a PC up and the onscreen text readable since this is more of a monitor than a television.
My Toshiba 52" DLP TV makes next to no noise. The fan is almost inaudible over anything, and it's only after I've turned off the sound system that I can hear the fan for the few seconds it runs before shutdown.
http://www.chmodoplusr.com/
Why not a standard projector with a really clever system of mirrors and lenses? If you have room for a large non-flat device of any sort, certainly you have room to set up a projector reflecting back and forth once or twice before reaching the screen....
Check with the companies to see how big they are making LiteBrites these days....
Keep the faith, share the code
I'm hoping to get an HP 65" microdisplay with wobulation someday. Review here. Wobulation blends the pixels together to almost eliminate screen-dooring.
Not sure what your budget is, but a 58" inch version is also available.
Well here's a 57 inch lcd tvX XAA.asp?page=Features
http://www.samsung.com/Products/TV/LCDTV/LNS5797D
I have a 32' lcd TV from Samsung and I've been really impressed.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification
If you've been waiting to buy a fancy DLP because the prices are astronomical.. looks like they might just be starting to come down. Tigerdirect has a Samsung HL-R5078W 50" DLP with 1080p (yes, real 1080p!) for a mere $1600. Plus you can watch broadcast HDTV with the built-in tuner when no one's looking :)
Barring that, I'd go for a nice projector and a screen. Personally, I'm not such a huge fan of projectors, but they can be good with a proper setup (big, flat, custom-installed screen, everything aligned and focused correctly, etc.).
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As the subject title says, Sharp has a 65" LCD. It even has a DVI input so your computers will be able to easily interface... It is pricy though, but if you don't want burn-in then it is your best option. Can be found for around $18k.
We were all warned a long time ago that MS products sucked, remember the Magic 8 Ball said, "Outlook not so good"
It is both cheaper and more effective to get a pile of networked laptops, and have people look at their local copy. Other benefits include people being able to cut and paste, to participate and so on.
StoneCypher is Full of BS
Sharp also sells the PN-655U, another 65" 1080p LCD.
-Turkey
You could always use a screen saver, or the Auto hide feature on your task bar.....
hellboy1975 http://www.foutheye.net
They are brighter and have a higher contrast than the DLP's which means if you're in a board room with flourescent lights, then it will be easier to see around the room. 3000:1 Contrast ratio is just cool. It also comes in a 61" flavour.
If you haven't considered projection as an alternative, you could always go for an Optoma front projector. They are very very cool. Half of their lineup doesn't go under 3500:1 contrast ratio, with most around 4500:1, and they are VERY inexpensive to replace the bulbs. Alot of their lineup also contains DVI Inputs as opposed to the Component sets that the older projectors have. Great for dual monitor supports on a desktop. Laptops, you would probably just look for the wonderous VGA's on a similar model from them to the
Then there's the Optomoa BigVizion which is ... amazing? Awesome? Killer!! Check this baby out... BigVizion
Anyway you look at it, burn in is going to be a factor with a plasma, the bulbs will go in a projector, and you will get ghost images on an LCD with constant "dashboard" displays like the start menu. I do know that the panasonic LCD's have this "true black" thing, where in the blank pass in a progressive display mode, it does a black fill of the screen, so that when you go from say a dark room scene, to a snow scene to a dark room scene, the black is as black as possible when switching color brightness that way. It's hard to choose, but those are my pics anyway, I like them and I have been looking around for a product to beat it within the price ranges. $3,199 for the 61" 3LCD and $2,199 for the 52" is tough to beat for the brightness you get out of it. DLP's are a bit more money, but I do have to say that they seem to be a lot clearer on the 1080i than the 3LCD's, but they don't have the vibrant colors :/ So it depends if you're doing slideshows or movie clips heh.
Look at the new Sony KDS-xxA2000 line just starting to roll out ( http://www.sonystyle.com/is-bin/INTERSHOP.enfinity /eCS/Store/en/-/USD/SY_DisplayProductInformation-S tart?ProductSKU=KDS50A2000 ). They'll be sold in 50", 55", and 60" versions. Or, if you've got the dough to blow, you can look at the XBR2 sets that will have 60" and 70" screens.
They are all 1080p 3 chip rear projection lcos based displays with a 10,000:1 contrast ratio. They all have an HDMI input will actually accept a 1080p signal (all you need is a DVI->HDMI cable or adapter).
They are among the better displays on the market, though they certainly aren't the cheapest (the KDS-50A2000 MSRP is $2700).
How about Sharps LC-65D90U. 65" and 1080p.
Ask Slashdot! :D ...And in this case I think this question really does come down to 'I need that guys personal opinion' even if I'm not going to tell him the rough size of the room.
I ate your fish.
It's funny when you're in the parking lot at a big box retailer and you see someone is trying to shove a huge TV box into a very small vehicle. Around Christmas time, I've seen empty TV boxes in the parking lot since people had to get the TV home somehow.
...problem solved. (Most of the historical "issues" with LCD such as screen door, etc. have been solved and they are more than competitive with DLP.)
I suggest using a projector - it would be cheaper, you could carry it with you. Besides, you will be able to change the size of the image it makes. I mostly use those for my presentationt, and hardly have any problems ;)
Also, if you take him home, you can watch TV/DVD with it
If you are considering any type of projection system, you need to think about how dark the room can be made, and how much disruption you are prepared to put up with to darken the room. If you don't have blackout curtains, then you need to think about factoring in the cost of installing them. This may also be the case for LCD/Plasma solutions if you have a room with floor to ceiling windows where the sun hits the wall you want the screen to be on.
Another potential option is to use something like a 42" display at one end of the room and a pair of slaved 'repeater' 32"s at the sides of the rooms nearer the back. This can work out a lot cheaper than a single 65", solves the problem of a round boardroom table pointing people the wrong way and has the benefit of a bit of redundancy for the day something breaks.
Lastly, don't rule out renting a plasma screen for a few months, then swapping it. Prices of big displays are always going down, and quality is always going up, so this might prove very cost-effective as well as countering the plasma's possible burn in problems.
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
My first thought was 'why not sit closer to a normal TV?'.
I'm going backwards. Ten years ago I had a full Dolby Digital (or AC3 as it was back then) surround system, laserdisc player and a 40inch back projector. Now I'm stuck with an el-cheapo DVD player and a 30inch LCD screen and just the TV's built in speakers. I think the cause was wife & kids...
I want a list of atrocities done in your name - Recoil
It has been estimated that about 5% of people experience what is known as the DLP Rainbow Effect, where some viewers can see flashes of color separation on the edges of high contrast edges.
Much worse than the annoying rainbow effect that some people get with DLP is the headache effect! This goes beyond merely annoying to something approaching torture if you need to look at it for more than a few minutes.
The danger of fixed-spot icons burning in on LCD and plasma screens for all eternity is nothing compared to suffering a cracking headache every time you turn on a DLP. For some people it's just utterly unwatchable, quite painful as well as dizzying. If you have a varying audience where you can't guarantee that everyone is immune, this should be a matter of some concern.
My advice is to stay well clear of DLPs until they bring out 3-device solutions for direct RGB and so eliminate the multiplexing color-wheel. In any event, the wheel is just another moving component to go wrong, and belongs back in the day of Baird television before we had 3-gun CRTs.
I know you said 50" plus, but you might want to check out Westinghouse brand LCDs. They are absolutely amazing value for money. The top of the line is currently a 47" LCD panel, but they are rumored to be adding a 56" some time this year. I just picked one up and it's great - plenty bright enough even in a daylit room, good anti-glare coating on it. And best of all it's 1080P, which if you're using a PC or Mac to drive it means you get a really crisp and clear picture at a reasonable resolution!
They're relatively cheap too. Westinghouse is trying to establish itself and make a name in the consumer electronics market so they are consistently selling way under their competition. You might want to check out the AVS Forum on the topic. If you like what you see, you can pick it up from Crutchfield (30 day satisfaction guarantee and free shipping included) for $2499.
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If that's big enough for you.
What type of AV shop? If it is home theater, then that's no good unless they also sell presentation projectors. For others reading, home theater projectors are optimized for contrast ratio, presentation projectors are optimized for brightness for presenting in a lit room. You can mix the uses, but the results aren't necessarily as good, nor is the money necessarily as well spent.
DLP technology, as others have mentioned, is really cool and has a lot of potential. It is also less expensive than LCD/Plasma, but it is not without problems. (For anyone interested in really researching this, go to AVS Forum, the bible on this sort of thing.) If going DLP, I highly recommend looking into waiting for LED light based models. The first one is coming out right about now. Lots of DLP owners are having trouble with lamps breaking within 1 year at costs of >$200 -- sometimes as high as $400. Other complain about fan noise, rainbow effects, or breaking color wheels. LED based models, in theory, should solve all of these problems, and finally create a large 1080p wide screen tv technology that doesn't lose significant picture quality over time.
Laboratree - Scientific collaboration based on OpenSocial.
Actually, DLP and LCoS are all immune to burn-in as well and are much, much cheaper than an $18K direct LCD.
You only have to worry about burn-in with plasma, CRT, and (supposedly) projection LCD. Direct & projection CRT is a dying technology. Projection LCD is hard to find. All you really need to do is to avoid plasma, and you'll be fine on burn-in.
If it's for-profit but free, you're not the customer -- you're the product (e.g., the Slashdot Beta's "audience").
is a real technology. :)
Read about it at PopSci online
Well where i live the AV shops i am talking about are the ones that go into schools and biz to do full av install for classrooms.. It takes some hunting and you woln't find bargin prices - but there are alot of them out there and not to hard to find.. basicily if they have a retail store front.. you are in the wrong place.
'...if only "Jumping to a Conclusion" was an event in the Olympics.'
Too bad it looks like shit.
Woah! Why exactly is front projection not an option? People often throw out front projection because they want to stand in front of the screen to present and rear projection is not a good option.
Don't give up on front projection until you at least learn a little bit about short throw options. There are front projection systems that can deliver 100" diagonal images in as little as 2' (NEC WT610). If you are projecting from the ceiling to a 60" screen, you could be standing riciculously close (e.g. closer than one usually stands next to a wall) and not even cast a shadow.
...and is the same as a DLP or LCOS (or CRT RP) TV that is being discussed, but is custom made. They're very common in high end settings because you just have a screen built into the wall and the projector sits in a room behing the screen with a mirror. Practically all front projectors can be set to project a mirror image for RP usage. You are limited if you want 1080 resolution, as there are still only a few available. This may be more cash than the OP wants to spend, and he'll need space behing the screen wall, but it does fit his requirements.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
Aye, I'm using my projector at home ($899) with screen goo, and I've got a 126" HDTV, for $899. Need curtains though, but I'd need those without. Haven't hooked my computer up to it yet, mostly for playstation and TV/DVDs. Waaaaay cheaper than many of the alternatives out there, and for 120". =)
(I have tall ceilings, heh)
I dunno...the mixed uses ones are getting MUCH better. I just got an Optima EP739....good contrast ratio...and great even with ambient lighting...
Not to mention between 3000-5000 hours bulb life....
I got the whole thing for $1299, plus an extra bulb....no tax, no shipping.
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
I use HP's MD5880n 1080p 58" TV as the primary display for my home computer (which happens to be a Mac). It works spectacularly well, with the exception that if your eyes aren't quite good the 1080p resolution can be hard to read from 10-15 ft (fonts, especially on the web and particularly in web images, can be too small). I bought it for about $3000 shipped, but I think prices are coming down. HP also makes a 65" version, the MD6580n.
These TVs accept a 1080p signal over HDMI. I currently run ADC->DVI and then DVI->HDMI to get the signal from my Mac's ADC (Apple Display Connector, Apple's mix of DVI and power in one cable) output to the HDMI input on the TV. This works with the standard resolutions between 800x600 up to 1920x1080. The TV knows that it's getting its signal from a computer and has a special PC aspect mode, which makes the pixel mapping 1:1 and eliminates overscan. This means that there is a slight area of the screen that doesn't get illuminated, but it's hardly noticable. Apparently you can use one of the other aspect modes and a custom resolution to fix this, but it's not worth the trouble to me.
The HTPC forums at AVSForum.com (this is the Mac forum) and the HP 1080p DLP forum have been particularly good resources for me.
Good luck!
Samsung, Mitsubishi and Toshiba all have reliable DLP screens. I'd recommend Mitsubishi for an office environment strictly because of the numerous connections Mitsubishi's have. All are only about 18" deep and they're extremely light weight. My 50" is about 80 lbs.
Treat a DLP as you would a projector. 15 second lamp warm up time, there's a cool down time and you cannot turn it off and on quickly.