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Computer Job w/ No Computer Degree?
Peterus7 asks: "I posted here a few years back, complaining that I couldn't code worth beans, but I wanted to get into computer science. Well, I'm back- with a psychology degree. However, I hear there's still hope since a lot of system admins and the like have liberal arts degrees. In the mean time, I've been working as a Macintosh digital media tutor, freelance tech support, and an assistant system admin at the campus library. Now that I've graduated, I want to find a job that will accept someone who knows a fair amount about computers, but is pretty much self-taught. Where should I start? Are there any classes I should take?"
I once worked in the IT department of a major multinational. Major. One of the managers in charge of software development was, as far as I could gather, quite proud of the fact that they could not program anything, not even a SQL statement, to save their life.
The manager was regarded as one of the best in the department. Major.
There's hope for you yet.
May the Maths Be with you!
I reviewed your original submission, and I gotta say that being a sysadmin is not for you. Well, maybe Windows, but in general a sysadmin has to be extremely good at problem solving. If you couldn't get into Java then you're gonna be banging your head against the wall on a daily basis with the kind of problems sysadmins face. No, they don't necessarily write any code, but the analytical skills required to learn to program are the same as debugging complex interactions between software.
Being self-taught really has nothing to do with it. There are people that never took a single class but were able to pick up programming form a few simple tutorials and a language reference. Likewise, some people take the Intro to Programming class several times and simply fail to ever grasp the abstract nature of code. A computer science degree is valuable because of the ideas it exposes you to, and because employers may value it, but it doesn't really say much about your ability as a computer professional.
My advice would be to look for a job centered around specific applications. Something concrete with good documentation that you learn to perfection. Another possibility is building or repairing computers. It sounds like you've already been doing quite a bit, so you probably have an idea of what you enjoyed and what you didn't. The next step is to simply apply for some jobs and see what pans out.
I started a CS degree and quit about 9 credit hours into it. I suck at math, but I've been programming since I was 12. I've had about 4 jobs doing computer/sysadmin work (two of them at large colleges), have programmed freelance for some time, and I'm now writing a book for Manning Publications on programming (along with a self-published book also).
All while getting a degree in Theology. :)
Don't fret about the degree; you just need the skills and mindset to do it.
[ check out my ruby book @ http://ww
Want to design web sites? You won't believe how many artists and companies want web sites. Make some. Do them for friends and relatives. Make them nice, make them do neat things. Now you've got a portfolio. Look for companies wanting web sites and sell yourself. Make a business out of it.
If you work for yourself (web sites, tech support, whatever) then the hiring manager won't care you don't have a degree. Work your way up and prove you can do what you say and you can get jobs.
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
Without the skills on paper (relevant coursework, certifications, similar work experience), you're at a severe disadvantage at the resume stage. People are going to spend their time with the people who say they can do it and have something to back it up before they spend their time looking at people who only say they can do something.
You're going to have to meet people and get yourself promoted almost exclusively by word of mouth. Even then it's going to be an uphill battle, because there's always going to be somebody more qualified who's going to get one of the precious interview slots before you. Then you have to be absolutely sure you know what you're doing in the interview, because while somebody who has experience or other qualifications that they can point to may be granted a little bit of slack if they can't do something right off the top of their head (as long as they know, procedurally, what's going on), without anything like that, you have nothing to point to other than your word that you actually do have some kind of background in it.
It's not impossible by any means, but you have it a lot harder than anybody else out there, and you're probably going to be looking for a long time before you find that job you want. And when you do, you're likely going to be hired on the recomendation of one of the people you know in one of your placeholder jobs.
Rule number one is to never apologize for not having a Comp Sci degree in an interview.
(Rule number two is that you don't want to work anywhere that strictly requires it)
I have a Liberals Arts degree and I'm a completely self-taught, working Java developer. The only thing I did do to help my job search was get a Sun Certified Java Programmer certification. Almost no experienced developers give any merit to the thing, but during my job search it was useful to "prove" to the skeptical that I really do know Java.
Posting anonymously for obvious reasons. But it all boils down to how well you sell yourself, how well you learn under fire, how well you can adapt, and most importantly who you know. I dropped out of high school (early nineties) my Senior year of high school and moved to the closest metro city. Three months later, at age 18, I was making $35/hour as a jack of all trades systems administrator. A year later I had been jacked up to Senior Network Analyst and was pulling in $60k. Two years later I was a systems administrator for a Fortune 100 company with full benefits. Now, only a decade later, I'm pulling in six figures between my systems administration position at my day job and the freelance projects I'm doing on the side.
;)
Standard headhunters and sites like Monster.com and CareerBuilder.com proved to be utterly useless and every position I've held since entering the professional workforce has been a referral from a close friend or colleague that got me an in with the company and allowed me to bypass conventional hiring channels. This is the most important thing to remember -- managers hire internally first, take referrals second, and then read external resumes; if another employee highly recommends you then you'll be first in line in the interview process.
Keep track of every professional contact you've ever made. I have two or three hundred page binders to keep business cards in chronological order of each professional contact I've made. Each page holds 16 cards and I write details of the conversation or relationship with each person on the back of each card. My brain works on mnemonics so scanning/inputting each contact's info doesn't work for me; I remember each contact based on where in each binder their business card is and which business cards surround it on the page. So I can say, "yeah, that security guy I met in the bar at PumpCon 1996 was red and was in the binder right after the blue graphic designer's card, I think I'll give him a call".
So yeah, don't know if this braindump is any help to you, but there is hope out there for degreeless geeks.
The best position to be in is one where they are not looking to hire anyone but you. Networking is one means to achieve that end.