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What If Apple Made A Cell Phone And No One Cared?
PreacherTom writes "Prudential Equity Group analyst Jesse Tortora penned a note saying that Apple is readying a music phone — and a separate, combination video and music phone. He expects Apple to introduce the devices in January at Macworld, a conference for Mac enthusiasts where the company typically debuts new products. At least one of the phones will offer Wi-Fi connectivity and both will become available in the March quarter of 2007 ... but will anyone care?"
What would be neat is if the extended features like playing music, using cameras, etc., could all draw their power off of a separate battery than the phone. That way you could use as much of the extra features without worrying about killing the phone itself. Naturally during the "recharge" process both batteries would be rejuvinated.
It's true no man is an island, but if you take a bunch of dead guys and tie 'em together, they make a good raft.
I've been holding off on a phone purchase in anticipation of an Apple phone. Why? Because I know they will nail the human interface and Mac integration. I wouldn't be surprised if they manage to get the phone size way down and do something clever about input as well. The Nokia Series 60 phones are pretty good and are the only other alternative for me, but we only get the E62 here in the US. If, for some reason, Apple disappoints, that will be the route I take.
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That's not how it works.
You (yes you!) are continually paying for phone upgrades, whether you get one or not. Those people who do not upgrade their phone on a regular basis are subsidizing those upgrades for everyone else - the amount that one pays for a service plan is computed, based on the percentage of people who will get phone upgrades, to pay for the subsidization. I'm guessing they guess a little high on that percentage so there's some money left over, and they use it to give out upgrade specials, but it's just a guess.
Regardless, it's not that they're so cheap that the phone company can offer them for free. It's that the phone company buys pallets of them in an unconfigured mode and configures 'em themselves, then handles distribution to their stores themselves, and meanwhile is charging every subscriber on their network for all those phone upgrades. If you don't get a phone upgrade every time you can, then you're just subsidizing someone else's upgrade.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
That depends on your definition of "better." For most people, I suspect "better" means "works with iTunes" or "has a large selection of accessories" or "has a simple interface." In this case, the iPod actually is the best DAP.
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Maybe they could just abandon the American market and make their phones only for Europe and Asia. Over there, everything is GSM, and phones can be easily switched between providers by switching SIM cards. Also, I believe it's customary over there to purchase your phone separately from your cellular service.
If Apple's smart, they'll just go straight to other markets with their nifty new phone, and not even bother selling it to us stupid Americans. Leave us with our crippled and overpriced phones which only work with one provider and require us to pay through the nose for every add-on or download.
...to wit, people spend $300 (and up) on video iPods, people buy third-party, licensed iTunes phones without the ability to play iTunes video content, yes, I think its quite likely that people will care about Apple-made phones with iTunes and, especially, iTunes video capability, particularly if they have the kind of data capacity that video iPods have.
Heck, I'd replace my current SLVR for one in a heartbeat, assuming it was a good phone as well as an iPod: the SLVR is a nice phone, but the storage capacity is really limited.
Exactly what I was thinking. Apple targets the USA aggressively, to the extent that their products often feel like they just don't care about the rest of the world (don't believe me? Check the hold switch on the iPod corded remote; it's upside down everywhere except the USA). The US mobile 'phone market sucks; there is far too much network lock-in for hardware manufacturers to care about it. On the other hand, the USA has a lot of large WiFi deployments, and more are springing up all the time.
If I were in Apple's position, I would release an iPod with 802.11/b/g/n that could download from the music store while mobile and make VoIP calls to iChat (AIM/Jabber) and iPhone users. Maybe offer a service to allow calls to POTS units, but primarily aim it at the IM generation. I suspect there is a huge market consisting of teenagers who can persuade their parents to buy a gadget, but who can't afford calls on a cell-phone as easily.
If it could do some form of mesh networking with ZeroConf person-discovery then this could well be a killer feature (a mesh network over a campus-sized area could work nicely).
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Why does apple need to sell the their phone through a carrier? They could just release a SIM-Free device for the GSM customers out there (like the ROKR).
There was nothing crippled about the "ROKR" attempt, other than the company chosen to partner on it - Motorola. The interface was slow, you couldn't buy form ITMS OTA (over the air), had limited builtin storage, and could not have external upgraded storage, it just plain sucked etc etc etc.
Since the original ROKR couldn't buy music OTA (infact you sync'd with it in itunes just like a normal ipod), why do you assume they'll force you to use their network? It makes no sense, unless you never used the device.
Last, google for Sony Ericsson W810. There's a good walkman phone for $350 unlocked, no contract, plenty of storage, upgradeable storage, 850/900/1800/1900mhz GSM, 2 megapixel cam, uncrippled yet $150 less than you claim.
Actually, a good percentage of the Macs sold at my campus computer store are being sold with Windows pre-loaded, at the customer's request. People don't seem to mind paying the additional $120 or so for an OEM copy...
Don't people get tired of writing these and being proven wrong a month later? I guess after the 90s "Apple is dead" FUD didn't work, and all the "iPod killer" FUD articles of the last 24 months didn't have an effect, so now it's time to go after the iPhone?
Where is BusinessWeek's "Zune, yawn" article? Wouldn't that make more sense given Apple's staggering financial success announced this week and their path toward supplanting Gateway as the #3 U.S. computer maker?
"Sufferin' succotash."
The thing that the author just doesn't get is that Apple fans will buy or at least hype anything that Apple releases(I know because I'm one of them). Steve Jobs could shit in a box, Jonathan Ives will shape it into a cube, they will sell several million units and get a ton of attention. Time would have the iShit on the cover and Walt Mossberg will say that it is the ultimate in human excrement.
This isn't like the PC market where Dell == HP == Gateway == Lenovo and you are buying purely on price or half-baked feature x. Apple has a dedicated fanbase with a common respect for clean design and seamless integration and they know that any product coming out of Cupertino will offer that as a base, plus something that is at once totaly obvious, and completely new (or at least implemented in a sane way).
I guarantee that if Apple announces the iPhone at MacWorld 2007, there will be at least half a million people with their credit-cards out before the next slide in Steve's presentation.
Why can't they just make their own network a la MVNO (like Virgin Mobile, for example)? Apple has always been about the entire experience, that's why they make/design both the software and the hardware for every other product they make.
It would only make sense for them to provide the entire experience, by starting their own virtual network.
Zing!
It's good to have more choices for consumers on the market. Every new idea that Apple introduces to the market will inspire others to make more of their own and that will result in a richer marketplace and provide us with more choices.
There weren't as many MP3 players on the market before the iPod. Apple made everyone else step up their game and add new features and reduce their prices.
I'm not going to buy one, but thanks for giving us more choices Apple.
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
It's not like Apple has discovered the one magic look that makes electronics sell. What they did was make MP3 players cool. The look played a part, the marketing played a part, the timing played a part, etc. The thing was that prior to the iPod, MP3 players were widely available but they were geek toys. Sorority girls walked around with disk/walkmen and the like if they even had a portable music player. Apple succeeded in making it fashionable to have an MP3 player, in particular an iPod.
Other than looks (meaning the physical looks and the UI), there wasn't anything special in terms of ability about an iPod. It didn't make MP3s sound better, or provide special features that others didn't. It was just a good looking, well built MP3 player. The fact that it became cool and trendy was what did it. When people had to have not just an MP3 player, but an iPod as a fashion item.
Ok but the cellphone market is different. It is already completely saturated in the hip market. It is extremely trendy to have a cell phone so they are everywhere. Also there are already many companies competing in the "Hip cool phone" market like Motorola with the RAZR.
That's not to say Apple couldn't succeed there, but that it's really different. They aren't walking in and essentially creating the market, they have to break in. Unless they have something we don't know about, then they aren't going to be really different. An iPod looking phone isn't different. Nor is a phone with features (my phone has EVDO, WiFi, Bluetooth, an MP3 player, a video player, e-mail, and so on and it's not even one of the new models). So if they produce an iPod looking phone with some features, great you have another KRZR. Maybe it does ok, but that's not going to change the cellphone world. They can't do it on hip factor alone, as that's already heavily a part of the cellphone world.
WHAT IF APPLE MADE JUST A CELL PHONE?
and not an iPod phone
- better battery life
- no cutting into iPod sales
- simple, elegant, Mac-like interface
If you want a music player, buy an iPod
if you want a world-class, desirable phone, buy the Apple iPhone
Why does this seem to be such a no-brainer?
All-in-one devices are all about compromise
They are not elegant, simple, easy-to-use or lightweight
They are usually left behind at the airport too
APPLE - JUST BUILD ME A CELL PHONE
LEAVE OUT THE MUSIC PLAYER, PDA, CAMERA, VIDEO PLAYER
THANKYOUVERYMUCH
Roger Born
Writer, Teacher, General Troublemaker
"Sorry, no refunds."
I have an ipod. It's nice but basically Apple got lucky (not denying it's good, but that isn't enough, right?). They're pretty, they're dumbed down enough that the average moron can sort of use it. This is mostly due to the fact that they have no features, nothing to get lost in, nothing to explain. The one thing I give credit to Apple for is they must not design by committee, because their products have a certain consistency to them - a sort of philosophy, I guess, that bigger companies have a really really hard time doing. A product designed by a committee is bound to suck in certain ways because of the differing objectives and mindsets. Other mp3 players I've handled (not many) have a more haphazard feel. They work, but they try to do features (since every committee member contributes theirs). The features don't play well, aren't logical, etc. They don't seem like they were DESIGNED. The ipod was the right player at the right time - but it's only a little better, really. Obviously that "little better" is worth a lot of money, so I'm not knocking it! ITunes in particular always seemed kind of half assed to me - the genius was of course getting the music industry to agree to particpate, the software is nothing unique for skilled developers. Again, other companies may not think skilled developers are important - and this cost them a lot of market share in this case.
I work for Motorola - NOT in phones. I would kill myself if I worked on the phones. How boring. The phones have a gazillion features, because they are designed by people trying to think of EVERYTHING a phone could ever do in order to attract the one freak who wants that feature. The service provides want to be able to cripple the phone to match their desired list of half-baked features / profit sucking crippleware. This results in basically crappy user interfaces and crappy inconsistent features that cost too much or you don't want. I haven't every phone, but I've never thought any were particularly better than others - they're just all different. But phones are high volume, so there is plenty of room to make 100 versions, each sucking in a slightly different way, with a different shell for different demographics.
The thing is, people KNOW how to use phones - the one on their desk which hasn't changed in forever works fine. There is no need to make it different. Same goes for playing music - you have play, pause, skip, and you are set. If you made a phone with these basic features - a keypad, and play/pause/skip - you'd have a killer phone. Shoot, throw in a camera too - add one button for that, and a flash. The battery, a hard drive, etc, they could all fit. Obviously it would be bigger than a phone without a hard drive, but not much. Phone batteries are as small as possible. Make it just a little bigger, you could do everything - but for awhile, people wanted smaller and smaller phones. They are plenty small now, but no one has stopped the downward spiral with common sense. Tape an ipod to a small phone, and is it too big? Of course not - and it would be smaller if the two batteries were merged, no extra display, etc.
Thing is, no provider would want to sell you that perfect simple phone. Because once you realized that's all you need, you would be done - no more need to upgrade. No more service plan lock-in. You'd have your phone, and you would be happy. How often do you replace your desk phone? Plus they wouldn't be able to sell you music - you'd have it the same way you put it on your ipod, from cds and from stealing, so you wouldn't download it from your provider for $2 or more (ringtones anyone?). But wait - Apple would hate this too. Suddenly they are cannibalizing their high profit margin ipod line. If you have an iphone, you don't need an ipod. And they would definitely make less on an iphone because of the other players at the table and the additional competition from the much much larger phone market (remember, Apple is really a small niche company, even if you love them - they aren't GE)
Are you sure this had anything to do with what Apple wanted? You know those American cell phone companies like to charge customers great fees for every little download on a phone. Maybe the cell phone companies threatened to bad the phone if there was no song limit.
why buy an Apple cell phone when you can buy a Nokia phone for less money?
I was in mobile phone sales for a short while. I was surpised to find that many people will buy a phone on a higher cost plan than they use to get a phone they percieve to be fashionable. I didn't take any stats, but a significant portion of people will do this, even paying $20/month higher than their call usage. Not surprisingly, mobile phone bills were at the time a leading cause of personal bankruptcy (here in Oz). If there is another market where Apples strategy of high priced fashionable hardware is mainstream, it's mobile phones.
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i'm surprised nobody linked to the fake iPhone ads some people made.
I don't know...
My interest is a little peaked, but they made no mention of details.
If it happens to have either a good amount of fixed storage or expandable storage I'll be happy. Provided the sound quality is good and comes in stereo. Toss in some external controls and I'm a happy camper.
I flipped through some reviews a while back and the only few details reviewers fixate on are either mp3 playback and whether or not it has expandable storage. (no reviews on quality, controls or if it's capable of anything but a single earbud.)
With all of that, I admit the article isn't very newsworthy as it seems to be just an industry buzz piece, but it did get my attention. So now I'll probably peak around for Sprint phones that meet my humble requirements.
"You should always go to other people's funerals; otherwise, they won't come to yours." -- Yogi Berra
You know those American cell phone companies like to charge customers great fees for every little download on a phone. Maybe the cell phone companies threatened to bad the phone if there was no song limit.
That's not a bad theory, it's amazing how they try to get people to pay for things (ringtones, backgrounds, stupid songs/videos) that are freely available if they didn't make it such a pain to put them on the phone.
I just got the Sony Ericsson W810i - only took Cingular about 6 months to finally offer it. Great Walkman phone & decent 2MP camera. But I have to say the syncing software is just barely usable. If Apple made a phone anywhere near the quality of the W810i but usable with iTunes it could destroy these nice-phones-with-horrible-software-support.
But can it play music from the iTunes Music Store?
... no. My standard $10 Portable CD player to tape deck adapter works fine though.
Who the fuck cares? I never have used it, and I never will.
But can it interface with a car stereo, and have the car's controls work? An iPod can, but every other DAP can't because automakers are standardizing on the iPod's dock connector and control protocol.
Can I afford a car that has this?
But does it include an easy way to find the song you want to play? Can it synchronize its playlists with your desktop jukebox program? Can it use "smart" playlists?
With 512 MB of flash memory, I put my own playlists together, and it is pretty elementary to thumb through. Before you talk about how much more space an iPod has, remember these three things:
1) I do not have close to 30 GB of music.
2) I may have 2GB of music I want to access more than occasionally. I don't keep 20 GB of dead weight on my DAP.
3) 8 hours of music is plenty long enough for anything I do.
Let me ask you a few questions:
1) Does your iPod use standard USB/mini-USB connections on the DAP itself, or do you have to pay for some propriatary connection?
2) Can you replace your battery?
3) Can you use regular alkalines if you get stuck without your AC adapter to recharge?
4) Did you pay more than $50?
I wasn't going to buy a DAP until they got under $50, and I will not buy a DAP with a hard drive. iPods are ridiculous. They are simply status symbols, and their price far outpaces their utility.
Even during its darkest years in the nineties, Apple had a loyal fan base (probably in the 7 digits) who would buy an Apple branded commodity product over others. And since the return of Jobs to the mothership, that number has grown.
In addition, these days the iPod/IntelMacs/OSX halo is strong for Apple.
So I'd be really surprised if iPhone doesn't out-sell that just about every other cellphone model in the US market (RAZR is #1 in the US. Globally, three Sony Ericsson models supposedly rank #1, 2, and 4, while RAZR falls to 5th place.)
The author of TFA either knows diddly about the Apple fan base (wrt their buying Apple branded stuff), or knows the Apple fan base quite well (wrt their click-throughs to anti-Apple articles). Or he could just be a shareholder concerned about the future returns from his Moto shares.
Softbank purchased Vodaphone's Japan operation and they have a hugely advertised campaign in which you get a free iPod Nano with their music capable phone. Their campaigns are all based on "+ othercompany = Softbank", i.e. tieups with other companies i.e. Sharp's AQUOS high quality flat panel television added to make a rotatable portrait display on a phone. Unknown if the price point will be enough for the U.S. but for elsewhere the answer would be not only yes but they probably already are ramping up distribution.