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U.S. Refuses to Hand Over Fighter Source Code to UK

orbitalia writes "The UK is heavily involved in the JSF (Joint Strike Fighter program) but has recently considered abandoning the project because the US refuses to share the source code. The UK had intended to purchase $120 billion dollars worth of aircraft to operate on two new aircraft carriers, but is now seriously considering Plan 'B'. This is likely to be further investments in the Eurofighter Typhoon project." From the article: "It appeared that Tony Blair and George Bush had solved the impasse in May, when they announced an agreement in principle that the UK would be given access to the classified details on conditions of strict secrecy. The news was widely seen as evidence that the Prime Minister's close alliance with the American President did have benefits for Britain ... 'If the UK does not obtain the assurances it needs from the US then it should not sign the Memorandum of Understanding covering production, sustainment and follow-on development,' the MPs insisted."

13 of 558 comments (clear)

  1. Poor Tony by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Flamebait

    Poor Tony the Poodle Blair. Kisses ass, and gets treated like a lapdog.

    Oh wait...

  2. Let them squabble by bogaboga · · Score: -1, Flamebait
    Let the Americans and Britons squabble. And as they do this, the Russians will give them a not-so-pleasant surprise. Who cares anyway?

    The American military machine, touted as the strongest, most efficient, lethal, modern and advanced, has just got a beating from AK-47 wielding thugs of IRAQ. The sad thing is that it has takes three years and almost 3,000 coalition deaths for the military authorities to acknowledge this. You no longer hear statements like "bring them on"..."We'll prevail"..."stay the course"...

    Who tells these military folks that the so called modern weapon systems win today's wars?

    Look, the Europeans and Americans can produce all the weapon systems they want...even with their massive debts and budget deficits. But in the end, a guerrilla with a reliable weapon like the AK-47, is more lethal than all those flying coffins. One incident that was reported were guerrillas who submerged themselves with their Ak-47s in a swamp, waited for the coalition forces to pass them, then they emerged and fired. Very few weapon systems can fire just after being under water.

    "Advanced" weapon systems are of limited value in todays wars. Just ask Donald Rumsfeld who just acknowledged a few weeks ago that things are really bad. To see how and more, point your browser to http://www.liveleak.com/.

    1. Re:Let them squabble by gb506 · · Score: 0, Flamebait
      Let the Americans and Britons squabble. And as they do this, the Russians will give them a not-so-pleasant surprise. Who cares anyway?


      Right, like the SU-27 is any match for the Raptor. Get a grip. And besides, even if the Russians had a competitive air superiority fighter, they don't have the most critical piece of air superiority - airborne command and control. Russians might be able to defend their airspace for a few days, but as for bieng able to project air power outside of Russia? No way.

      The American military machine, touted as the strongest, most efficient, lethal, modern and advanced, has just got a beating from AK-47 wielding thugs of IRAQ. The sad thing is that it has takes three years and almost 3,000 coalition deaths for the military authorities to acknowledge this.

      As opposed to how many terrorist/insurgents bagged? We take them out 10 to 1 or more. We're not getting our asses handed to us in Iraq, we're getting our asses handed to us by the American news media and the general impatience and lack of fortitude of the average American.

      An urban insurgency nullifies some of the technological advantage of some weapons systems, but by no means does that mean weapons systems like the JSF and Raptor are worthless.

    2. Re:Let them squabble by timmarhy · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      right and thats how you won against the vietcong. oh wait, they fucked you up remmeber?

      --
      If you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can imagine....
    3. Re:Let them squabble by bogaboga · · Score: 0, Flamebait
      Right, like the SU-27 is any match for the Raptor. Get a grip. And besides, even if the Russians had a competitive air superiority fighter, they don't have the most critical piece of air superiority - airborne command and control. Russians might be able to defend their airspace for a few days, but as for bieng able to project air power outside of Russia? No way.

      Air superiority, I dunno! One thing I know is that the Russians do not advertise themselves that much as compared to the Americans. Even when they were the *only* link to the ISS after the shuttle disasters, they were cool about everything. If Americans were in their place, they (Americans) would be "blowing their own trumpet." Look, just this evening, it was all over the news about the shuttle launch, but Russians do their thing quietly and without much fanfare.

      When it comes to projecting power abroad, let's examine what the US is getting in terms of results:

      • Afghanistan? The Taliban are back. Ask the British who had to hand control to the same Taliban they were fighting.
      • Iraq? It's a mess. Ask D. Rumsfeld.
      • N. Korea? The "dictator" over there now has the bomb. Bush knows that
      • Veitnam? Heck, the US was whipped hands down! Talk to any American.
      Americans have a problem. They think that if a country does not do things the conventional way, they that country is "not worth much." That's why they've been surprised in IRAQ. Mind you, IRAQ's command and control infrastructure was "destroyed" in the first two weeks of the war. So half of the mission was complete. Despite all the technology, IEDs are still hitting them hard. By the way, IEDs are 1940s technology.

      So you tell me how this power is really useful when widows and widowers are being created in IRAQ every single day. Tell me.

    4. Re:Let them squabble by Anonymous Coward · · Score: -1, Flamebait

      Americans are worth more.

    5. Re:Let them squabble by Planesdragon · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      When I balance up the "equation", Americans do not have much to show for the almost 3,000 coalition lives lost so far.

      We DON'T have a new tyranny. That's something.

      Do we have a strong, stable ally? No. Are we going to do something about that? Yes. Will whatever comes out of the rubble respect the US military? Only if they don't want to fall as quickly as Saddam.

    6. Re:Let them squabble by Broken+scope · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Fine you go into a fire fight with your dominant eye covered and hop on one leg. Lets see anyone in that position win a gun fight.

      --
      You mad
    7. Re:Let them squabble by mindstormpt · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      But the thing that puts Americans over the edge is the deaths of their troops?

      Their invading troops. It's not like they were home on a leave.

      Can someone be so kind as to explain that?

      If you've ever heard a speech by any american politician, especially in the period right after 9/11, you're probably familiar with the term "american lives". Some lives are apparently worth more than others, and the american ones are at the top.

    8. Re:Let them squabble by dcam · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Yeah. One American life is worth more than 20 non-American lives.

      --
      meh
  3. British should consider... by professorfalcon · · Score: -1, Flamebait

    Before buying into the Eurofighter Typhoon, the British should consider a few things about it:

    1. In order not to offend anyone, it contains parts from many different groups, including the Middle East and North Korea. All under GPL. (And you know the requirements of the GPL license.)

    2. The French parts tend to eject at the first sign of trouble.

    3. Everyone will have free access to it, on demand, but it will take 8 to 12 weeks to get to fly it.

    And finally,

    4. Of course, no weapons allowed. Or smoking. Or cheeseburgers.

  4. Re:All out rejection by Xonstantine · · Score: -1, Flamebait

    I think that it is clear that the UK need to follow most of the rest of the world, and get back to being self reliant, and formulating its own foreign policy, not taking orders and instructions from, or relying on a foreign power.

    Sure, and just as soon as the UK decides to spend more than 2.5% of their GDP on their military, they can start pursuing an independent path. By themselves, the UK don't have the money or the talent any more to develop state of the art military equipment across all possible spectrums. They have to "ally" with someone, and like the parent's parent said, who do you really trust? The US has gone to war twice to save the UK in the 20th Century. The UK has gone to war twice in the 20th Century to save France from Germany.

    As for the special relationship the US has with the UK, how many other countries has the US given access to the Trident II D5 missile?

    The UK is a sovereign country, and if they want, they can go forge their "own" path and jump into bed with the bureaucratic dictatorship that is the EU. More power to them if thats what they want. But they are hardly in a position to forge an independent path these days. Geopolitical power has shifted away from those who are no longer willing or able to use it to those who are, and those with the demographic momentum to sustain it.

  5. Re:All out rejection by Sponge+Bath · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    ...a few rocks with a few sheep

    I think you are being culturally insensitive.
    Maybe people from the UK are really fond of sheep.