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Predicting Space Weather

eldavojohn writes "Recently, a new discovery has been made explaining how & predicting when space weather occurs. Hopefully this will allow us to predict when and where these extreme forces of magnetic flux occur so that we can prepare to repair satellites or shut them down for safety reasons. Recent activities on the sun have surprised scientists including the explosive "solar tsunami" that happened last week. From the article, "The new study shows that the Northern Lights, also called aurora, and other space weather near Earth are driven by the rate at which the Earth's and Sun's magnetic fields connect, or merge, and not just by the solar wind's electric field. The merging occurs way out in space, at a spot between the Earth and Sun, roughly 40,000 miles above our planet's surface. Researchers have now developed a formula that describes the merging rate of the magnetic field lines and accurately predicts 10 different types of near-Earth space weather activity, such as the aurora and magnetic disturbances.""

22 of 97 comments (clear)

  1. Space Weather by JeepFanatic · · Score: 5, Funny

    I have enough problems getting accurate forecasts for my LOCAL weather. How am I supposed to trust the "Space Weatherman"?

    1. Re:Space Weather by uab21 · · Score: 4, Informative

      I know that you were shooting for funny there, but actually it should be easier to predict this than your local weather. It is a much simpler system (two objects of interest) with reasonably well understood rules at the scale of interest. Local weather, OTOH, is influenced by a much more complex system (the global atmosphere) with myriad influences (many heat sources, water sources, pressure variations, friction), multi-phase flows, as well as poorly understood rules at influential scales (turbulence - see the Navier-Stokes millenium problem). I would think that this sytem would lend itself to accurate prediction far more easily (now getting enough accurate data to make that prediction may be where the difficulty lies, currently)

    2. Re:Space Weather by The_Wilschon · · Score: 2, Informative

      Plasmas, even very rarefied ones like the solar atmosphere, are very complex and chaotic systems. The atmosphere (of Earth) is subject to the laws of hydrodynamics. The solar atmosphere (the domain of space weather) (and yes, the solar atmosphere does extend out quite far, way past Earth's orbit) is subject to the laws of Magnetohyrdodynamics. I would say that space weather ought to be immensely more difficult to predict. You have essentially one source of heat, but sources of magnetic fields are plentiful, and affect the motion of plasmas in much more complex ways than heat does, because the plasma itself is a major source of magnetic fields.

      --
      SIGSEGV caught, terminating

      wait... not that kind of sig.
    3. Re:Space Weather by Aqua_boy17 · · Score: 2, Funny
      How am I supposed to trust the "Space Weatherman"?
      I know, but look at it this way. At least they'd finally deserve the title "meteorologists".
      --
      What if the Hokey Pokey really is what it's all about?
  2. Great! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Now I'll know way in advance when to put on my lead lined underwear!

  3. You hear about that new restaurant on Venus? by BadAnalogyGuy · · Score: 2, Funny

    They say the view is nice, but the atmosphere stinks.

  4. News Flash: Evidence of Space Warming by aquatone282 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Researchers have found evidence that human-based carbon emissions are causing a 0.000001% increase in background radiation throughout the known universe. This man-made change will cause the extinction of life-forms on other worlds sometime in the next 50 billion years.

    Al Gore will address the United Nations at 1 p.m. with a new 123-slide PowerPoint presentation outlining the new taxes that must be implemented immediately to stop Space Warming.

    --
    What?
  5. Not a waste! by bchernicoff · · Score: 5, Informative

    Wasting time? These forecasts and the associated warnings that are generated when solar events occur are critical for protecting satellites and astronauts in orbit, predicting intereferance in HF radio transmissions including GPS accuracy, etc.

    1. Re:Not a waste! by yanko22 · · Score: 4, Informative
      --
      The atheist,by merely being in touch with reality,appears shamefully out of touch with the fantasy life of his neighbors
    2. Re:Not a waste! by monopole · · Score: 4, Informative

      It doesn't stop there. Extreme space weather can induce failures in the electrical grid resulting in large scale blackouts.

  6. Tomorrow's weather: by Tribbles · · Score: 4, Funny

    Cold again, with a distinct lack of atmosphere.

  7. arecibo by Speare · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Sadly, although Arecibo Radio Observatory in Puerto Rico does a lot of "space weather" kinds of analysis, its funding is in danger of being reduced to begin paying for other observational projects that are still in development. I just visited ARO last week, it's mindboggling to look at the spherical primary reflector which covers nearly twenty acres of land, and to think it might be mothballed in the near future, just as people realize the importance of space weather in their daily lives.

    --
    [ .sig file not found ]
  8. Re:why this is so hard by uab21 · · Score: 2, Interesting
    But of course, the tranmission and the particles are traveling at the speed of light so the transmission doesn't get there in time

    Actually the particles are not travelling that fast, see http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/solarstorm_s peed_040614.html which states

    Potentially disruptive solar storms can't reach Earth in less than half a day, scientists have determined
    So there should be time.
  9. Re:And the universe begins to look more electric by ScentCone · · Score: 2, Funny

    And the universe begins to look more electric

    I don't think that theory is very well grounded. *rim-shot*

    Thank you, I'll be here all afternoon. Try the cold pizza.

    --
    Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
  10. Re:why this is so hard by timtwobuck · · Score: 2, Informative

    According to wikipedia, solar flares & the solar wind travel at around 1 million km/h.

    Just for reference, the speed of light is 1 billion km/h. We may not need to worry about subspace just yet.

  11. You avoid lightning by looking at clouds. by ScentCone · · Score: 2, Interesting

    But of course, the tranmission and the particles are traveling at the speed of light so the transmission doesn't get there in time

    You can't outrun lightning on the golf course, either. But you can check the radar before you book a tee-time. I suppose the point is that there are some indicators of when we will have some fast-as-light (or very-fast-particles) crap coming our way - based on other behaviors - and that, like predicting earthquakes (another thing you can't outrun), we can still take a few precautions when things look a little dodgy.

    --
    Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
  12. Re:And the universe begins to look more electric by pln2bz · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I don't have a citation, but it's not really the facts that are in dispute. It's the interpretation ...

    http://www.thunderbolts.info/tpod/2005/arch05/0511 09dustmars.htm:

    There is also another aspect to the interplanetary circuitry affecting Mars. The greatest storm on Mars (2001) occurred when the planet was nearing perihelion and was the closest it had been to Earth in about 12 years. At that time it was also being "tickled" by the Earth's plasma sheath, or magnetosphere, establishing a temporary electrical connection between Earth and Mars for the transfer of charge. It seems that Mars responded with an outburst of atmospheric discharges, these taking the form of monstrous dust devils--or more accurately, electrical tornadoes.

    At the same time the electric currents flowing in the Martian ionosphere will drive the high-speed winds in the upper atmosphere.

    In the two Martian dust storm images above, it appears that the dust is being jetted upwards rather than being blown along the surface. This is explicable in the electric tornado model and explains how dust is raised efficiently many kilometers into the thin air and suspended for a time electrostatically. The role of violent vortices on the leading edge of dust storms is particularly clear in the image we've placed here. Closer examination should show that these tornadoes form preferentially on high points and the sharp edges of craters or escarpments.

    Even though charged particles fill space and even though the electric force is the strongest force in the universe, we're told that currents cannot be moving through space to an extent that they actually *do* anything.
    --
    "A man cannot begin to learn that which he thinks he already knows." --Epictetus, 1st Century A.D.
  13. Summary a little misleading by Vellmont · · Score: 2, Informative


    The merging occurs way out in space, at a spot between the Earth and Sun, roughly 40,000 miles above our planet's surface.

    40,000 miles isn't really that far, relative to what we consider "home". Geosynchronous satellites orbit at roughly 26,000 miles, and the moon orbits at more than 200,000 miles above earths surface.

    In comparison to the average Sun-Earth distance is 93 million miles, so 40,000 miles is .04% of the distance. If your neighborhood grocery store is 3 miles away, .04% of the distance would be 6 feet.

    --
    AccountKiller
  14. Re:um ya by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Why cant they just send them up there with the proper shielding in the first place?

    Because (in addition to the weight issue) proper shielding for solar mass ejection events makes damage from cosmic radiation FAR WORSE. The small number of horrendous-energy particles, absent shielding, mainly pass through tissue causing litte damage. But run them through a "shield" and each kicks out a storm of lower (but still high) energy charged particles that are going slow enough to each cause a LOT of interactions in tissue.

    To shield against cosmics you need a mountain (though an atmosphere does an OK job). So it's normally better to keep spacecraft walls thin and let them shine through. But that leaves you unshielded against coronal mass ejections.

    So when the sun kicks up you shelter, and accept the temporary increase in exposure to secondary cosmic radiation to avoid the massive increase in exposure to a solar storm. Out of the bonfire, into the hot tub.

    But you want to BE in the hot tub when the bonfire starts, rather than be out on a spacewalk or up to your ears in some half-assembled space-station project. Thus the importance of prediction.

    --
    Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
  15. Re:And the universe begins to look more electric by danpsmith · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Take the red pill and learn about Electric Universe Theory.

    I took the so-called "red pill", and discovered the following: "Suffice to say for now that if science is what you are looking for, you will find none where the electric sun is concerned, save that which shows it to be an untenable hypothesis."

    Please don't push your misguided psuedo-science off as something grounded in reality. Remember, scientists look for facts and work them into theory, quacks make up a "theory" and then try to find facts to fit it. The electric sun is as much science as "creation science" or "intelligent design," and should be met with the same contempt by anyone logical enough to read a science book.

    --
    Judges and senates have been bought for gold; Esteem and love were never to be sold.
  16. The Space Weather forecast for next week. by autophile · · Score: 3, Funny

    Space Weather advisory week 2006.49:

    Sunday: Highs in the upper -270K, dark. Chance of atmospheric distrubance: 0%

    Monday: Highs in the upper -270K, dark. Chance of atmospheric distrubance: 0%

    Tuesday: Highs in the upper -270K, dark. Chance of atmospheric distrubance: 0%

    Wednesday: Highs in the upper -270K, dark. Chance of atmospheric distrubance: 0%

    Thursday: Highs in the upper -270K, dark. Chance of atmospheric distrubance: 0%

    Friday: Highs in the upper -270K, dark. Chance of atmospheric distrubance: 0%. Occasional space probe passing through.

    Saturday: Highs in the upper -270K, dark. Chance of atmospheric distrubance: 0%.
    --
    Towards the Singularity.
  17. Re:And the universe begins to look more electric by TapeCutter · · Score: 2, Informative

    Check out his posting history, logic and math will not alter this guy's rigid dogma.

    The EU theory preys apon the same ignorance as "Chariots of the Gods" did in the 70's. The entire "theory" is a book that uses real observations to demolish a straw man argument. The authour can be somewhat excused since he seems to be suffering from persecution complex concerning the "scientific establishment", however I do find it drepressing that he is dragging gullible people down with him.

    The best thing the GP could do for himself is to read Carl Sagan's "Demon haunted world", I have suggested this to him but he seems incapable of handling the "truth".

    --
    And did you exchange a walk on part in the war for a lead role in a cage? - Pink Floyd.