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Igniting a Programmed Fireworks Display?
seg9585 asks: "I am interested in setting up a programmable fireworks display this New Years, and I was wondering if anyone from the Slashdot community had any advice as to how to set one up easily, inexpensively, and safely by someone with little experience with electronics/wiring. I do have a VEX controller which I can use for digital output, but I would rather not have to buy a ton of relays and create a spark by just shorting out the circuit. Is there a better way to do this?"
Please move along or buy real ones :|
I'd suggest getting a professional to do it or having a professional teach and supervise you. Fireworks are essentially explosives so I'd be very cautious.
"When you sit with a nice girl for two hours, it seems like two minutes. When you sit on a hot stove for two minutes, it
I have a solution, but it involves midgets, whipped cream, and a tazer gun. Email me for info.
Have you considered using model rocket engine igniter? They're cheap, powered by electricity, and provide a decent flame.
Also, I am in no way liable for whatever you do here.
I like to tamper with the Ariane guidance software just prior to launch.
Do not try to read the dupe, thats impossible. Instead, only try to realize the truth
What truth?
There is no dupe
You could try using the igniters used in model rocketry instead of depending on a spark. They come cheap and are available at almost any hobby shop. They require only a low voltage current to ignite, if I remember correctly. Should be easy to burn a few to determine average timing delay, and then set up a timing script to control the display. Although I would definintely recommend going the professional route if you have any doubts at all of your competencies.
The rocketry community has had this under control for a long time. You can buy commercially made igniters for about $2 each that will fire nearly instantly with the application of a 12v power source. You can also buy (or make) low voltage igniters (called e-matches) for about the same price. In the US, you are required to have a Low Explosive User Permit(LEUP) to buy/store/transport e-matches but if you make them yourself and use them on your own property, then you only have to store them in a type-3 magazine (a good metal ammo box lined with 1/4 plywood counts as a type-3 magazine) In a pinch, you could use some 31 gauge nichrome wire that is connected to a 12v source but that will take 1 or 2 seconds to heat up.
The post made with 100% recycled electrons
Model rockets usually use electronic fuses that are basically a resistor that's designed to get hot and ignite when a little electricity goes through it.
You should be able to order a few dozen of them from any model rocketry place before the men in black show up.
If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
I had a friend who was a professional pyrotechnic for many years. On a job for a small new years eve festival something went wrong with the setup and he was killed. This was someone who had years of experience doing this, and was working with a group of other people who had been doing it for years. If you really don't know exactly what you are doing, the chance of you not only hurting/killing yourself, but others is there.
The sky above the port was the color of television, tuned to a dead channel...
http://www.blue-room.org.uk/index.php?showtopic=36 96
Off the top of my head...
For ignition I'd use the igniters that are used for model rockets, 9 volt dc (if I remember right). You will probably have to have one relay per event, and do a little bit of creative wiring (common ground for all, common hot for each event, and hope that the wire's resistance doesn't drop the voltage below ignition point).
From there should just be a matter of coding...
Schoolfriends of mine ignited a home-made rocket using a flashlight bulb with the glass carefully removed so the filament was exposed. The filament doesn't last long in air when it's turned on, but got hot enough to light a fuse.
I wouldn't recommend that for a large scale display though. Buy the proper kit, and get training.
There was a television special once - you know the kind, Discovery Channel or TLC or some such - on some fireworks experts. They were putting together a big display, something like the Washington, DC 4th of July fireworks, to be accompanied with some fancy-schmancy concert. After all the choreography business, and setting up the pyrotechnics, they wired it back to a control panel.
Now, this control panel wasn't actually your typical doohickey with buttons. It had a rows upon rows of exposed metal contacts (little stubs of wire sticking up vertically), and the guy in charge would activate them, one at a time, by touching them to a little hand-held device that I assume was wired up to the ignition current. I think he even had sheet music.
At first I wondered, "how disappointingly low-tech". But consider: you're dealing with pyrotechnics here. If it just takes a little current to ignite the high explosives, then you really don't want to hook everything up to an electrical circuit, microcontroller, electronics, any of that business. You keep the circuit open, until you're ready to close it. And if something goes terribly wrong, you really, really don't want anything to keep igniting rockets until you push a button to turn it off. You want to be able to just stop.
In summary, hands-free control is just not the way to go when dealing with pyrotechnics.
The World Wide Web is dying. Soon, we shall have only the Internet.
Take that, Intelligent Design!
Just because I can do it, should I do it.
No.
But...
No.
Go look up the story on Disney's patent on using air cannons for lauching fireworks- believe that they made it free for anyone to use.
III.IIVIVIXIIVIVIIIVVIIIIXVIIIXIIIIIIIIVIIIIVVIII
Off to top of my head. Don't do this yourself. You are essentialy playing with explosives. Experts die doing this type of thing every year. Either get some training or get an expert in.
Funny, I was going to post the same response to the thread about midgets, whipped cream, and a tazer gun.
That's about it. Something this serious needs a professional.
My first attempt used a TINI controller board hooked up to relays hooked up to model rocket igniters. This worked well, but relays are expensive and don't scale well if you want to do this on the cheap.
My next attempt used a Freescale GP32 controller with MOSFETs. This worked very well, and is a more scalable solution. Again, I used model rocket igniters. If you look at my pictures, you can see how I made a nice set of firing racks, too, complete with power distribution scheme and chainable serial control. I wrote a program in Java to send control signals to the controllers to shoot the shells off in sequence.
After these attempts, I finally got sick of playing with the small stuff and got my explosives permit so I can play with 1.3g display fireworks. When you have your explosives permit, you're no longer limited to crappy model rocket igniters. You can buy professional quality e-matches that are meant for the task. They're a bit pricey, but they already are the right length of leads, and work GREAT. Also, the larger shells are MUCH easier to electrically fuse, since they use quick match instead of visco fuse. But, no vendor is going to sell you those nice e-matches without first seeing your LEUP. (Low Explosives User Permit.) That takes a bit of work to get, so I'll assume that's beyond your scope. Of course, there are also professional systems available for control, but they're pricey.
So, I'm going to take a guess that you don't have a LEUP and just want to hack something together to shoot off your 1.4g consumer fireworks. Here's what I've learned from my experience doing the same thing. It's not that tough to do, but don't underestimate the amount of wiring you have ahead of you if you intend on shooting off more than a few shells. With only a few weeks from new years, you'll probably get a more impressive display by buying several nice cakes. But, since that's not the slashdot way, here's how you can do what you want to do...
Please be safe about this! It's a ton of fun, but observe sensible safety precautions. I highly recommend taking a class on display fireworks to learn how to do all this right. Premier Pyro gives great classes on this every year, and you'll have tons of fun to boot. At the very least, give NFPA 11
Life is but a mist upon the horizon.
>set one up easily, inexpensively, and safely
Pick any two.
You might also want to be thinking about your last words for your friends to remember you by. Some of the more popular choices from previous Darwin Award winners are:
Have a friend shoot the video from a safe distance for your In Memoriam web page.
Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.
I don't know the regulations where you are but in Canada you need to be certified by the government before you can purchase display level fireworks. For electronic firing, unless you need to be incredibly precise about timing, I would recommend using a nailboard. It's primitive but it works, and there is very little to go wrong. The ignitors used are called ematch or electronic match and are a more powerful version of a model rocket ignitor. If you can, I would recomend having someone work with you who has done shows before, there is a lot to consider to make a display safe to run and exciting to watch.
This is falls under the category of if you have to ask then you have no idea what you are doing.
This is nothing to mess around with even model rocketry can be very dangerous if and when something goes wrong.
Fireworks are orders of magnitude faster explosives they can kill you faster then you can blink.
All the setups that I have see there are contacts that are MANUALLY closed for every event. The technician(s) has a score that lists what and when to fire. If anything is out of place person/animal on the range, wind direction/speed shifts anything that THAT ONE PERSON feels is UNSAFE they will not set the event off. There are a few very very high end computer controllers that are used for very very large displays. these cost tens of thousands of dollars and have more fail safes then any standard controller/PC setup ever could. They all have a active kill switch someone has to hold the control arm trigger or the events don't fire.
The shells are specifically configured for electrical ignition not just a spark on a fuse.
This is heavy duty shit that can/will kill you faster then you can blink.
Leave this to the experts you might know computers you don't know shit about fireworks if you have to ask.
get a professional, and use google - first hit on searching for fireworks electronic blasting cap. I have worked with profesisonal pyrotechnicians in the past, and its tricky business. You really don't want to be playing around with this without proper training. First of all, you will have to replace all the fuses on the fireworks you buy, which will probably render about half of them useless. Pro pyrotechnics are actually built with the options of electric igniters. the stuff you buy in shops isn't. you are probably better off making or buying fusewire and timing it on fuselength.
for proper electric firing you will need the fireworks to go with it. this means digging a trench, getting firing mortars, and proper shells. Also, assuming you go ahead with this, despite everything (and you somehow getting hold of all the stuff required) you will need to comply with a bunch of regulations (for the US, but every country has similar regulations). Think. there is a pretty good reason for these rules.
you are playing with fire.....
People who think they know everything are a great annoyance to those of us who do.
All you need is some help from those "in the know"
http://www.pyrouniverse.com/forum
(also search the old forum)
If you're looking at making a firing system, there are a lot of enthusiasts at Pyro Universe who have done just that. My best advice to you is to educate yourself on the safety precautions when dealing with firworks so your system will not put others in harms way.
I'm a regular visitor to the forums and have learned a lot about e-firing systems that I've began to construct my own. It's worth your time to visit.
I'd recommend checking out passfire.com software. I don't know a lot about the field, but the software is impressive. You can drag and drop music, colors/types of shells, etc. into the 'stage' to see what the show will look like, and when you're done, export it to a laptop in a somewhat industry standard format to trigger and run the actual show. It will even generate the 'chemical recipes' for the shells you've specified, so you can go off and build them.
It's the type of thing that "professional" fireworks companies have done in-house in house for many years -maybe to prototype or sell a contract- but passfire lets the amateur do the same type of thing. In full disclosure, I used to work with the developer, and he's fscking brilliant...I think a demo version is available on the site.
Maybe it's not what the OP was looking for, but a stellar piece of software nonetheless. I don't remember the details, but because it's a very desirable chunk of code (at least for those in the industry), the source is heavily encrypted and obscured, and the full-featured app runs off a dongle-based authentication mechanism. Unfortunately the market for such a thing is fairly small, but in some ways, it's better than what the 'real' fireworks companies use in-house.
What's the best way to go about getting a pyro license?
(I'm in California.)
"easily, inexpensively, and safely " Pick any two.
First go out to an area than has no trees and no people for 25 Acres. Then Strap all of the fireworks onto yourself and light all of them.
There, you will give a few people if any at all a good fireworks show and then there would be one less fucktard in the gene pool.
On safety:
Plan on something going wrong and how you are going to survive it with minimal damage to you, others around you, and property.
Never wear flammable ( synthetic ) clothing when working with fire / pyrotechnics. Tight weave cotton is a good choice of common materials that will not readily burn. Wear long sleeve shirts, pants, and closed shoes.
Use protective equipment when doing anything more than moving the fireworks, such as cutting fuse and plan on something going off. See next:
Have fire resistant boxes ( preferably with lids that are chained such that they close when released ) . Keep all pyrotechnic material in the boxes that is not immediately being worked on or set up. This will minimize the fire if / when you set something off unintentionally so that you can tell the story later.
Be sure to use a non-sparking material such as brass when poking holes in the black powder lift charges mentioned above.
I have been involved with accidents related to each of the above involving 1.3g and have no marks to show for it. Have fun.
This is stupidest idea I've heard in a while. You are dealing with explosives. You are proposing writing (hands-off) software for controlling explosives. How often do people make programming errors? Often. But oftentimes those errors won't be affecting explosives being set off. This is soooo not a good idea. Also the 'hands off' aspect is worrying - as others have noted, you want constant positive input (i.e. holding a switch down) to allow the show to continue - if switch opens, the stuff stops. And this switch must literally be a switch in the 'hardware', nothing to do with the computer end.
Please, next time you get any smart ideas, run them by some adults again...
Ummm...Hi! I'm special agent Smith from the Department of Homeland Security. Got a minute?
My, there's a lot of proselytizing on Slashdot for this guy. One is lead to believe that Slashdot is frequented by pansies who've never set off fireworks before. I suggest that those who call themselves Geeks yet don't appreciate the "big boom" and that using a remote ignition system to gain distance on the explosion improves safety while simultaneously cranking up the Geek Factor - turn in your cards at the door.
My God, it's Full of Source!
OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
...is a valid, legal hobby in the US. And there are a lot of people who can help you. What you describe is quite achievable, and can be made quite safe. However, I do not believe you will be able to get it together in your extremely short timeframe, unless you have only a few fuses to light. And if you only have a few fuses to light, you don't need computer choreography.
I could (and do) write volumes on the subject of amateur pyrotechnics, but I'll try to keep this response short. Electrical firing systems for pytotechnics are designed to ignite a device known either as an electric match ("e-match," in the vernacular) or an igniter. Occasionally, someone will call it a "squib," but that is incorrect. E-matches are quite easy to fire, are typically wired in series when a lot of devices are fired at once, and are not legal for you to buy unless you hold an ATF license. You can legally make them, but there are requirements for storage and transport.
Hobby rocket igniters are legal for you to buy, store, and transport on the highways, and you should consider using them. But probably not for this New Year's eve. I suggest you work on your firing system for use later in 2007 (with resources I can point you to) and that you hand-light your current show.
You should get a trigger light propane torch. http://www.amazon.com/BernzoMatic-TS3000T-019028-T rigger-Propane/dp/B00008ZA0B It is also good to have a hat, eye protection, and (optionally, depending on your devices) ear protection. Wear long sleeve cotton shirt and cotton pants; jeans are great. On the issue of hats, a hard hat is best, but a cotton ballcap is okay. Synthetic cloth is bad; it offers very little protection. Tape or wire a penlight flashlight to the flame tube of the torch head so that when the light is on, it will show where the torch is pointing. This is so you can light the fuses in the dark without emcumbering both hands; it allows you to turn you body away from the pyro you're about to light.
Set up the devices you intend to use and secure them in place. For rockets, you'll need to build a simple rocket rack, for candles, you can affix lines of them to a board with wire or wire ties. Wire ties are safer, but candles rarely explode these days. Mortar tubes for festival balls should be mounted in a box or milk crate, affixed to a backing board that is attached to stake, or gang-taped and put into a bucket. Drive stakes in the ground and wrap tape around the stake and the outside of cakes (aerial repeaters); it can get a bit exciting if one of them falls over. And it happens frequently enough to make securing them worth the effort. Hang or drape crackerstrings from supported crossmembers; for a nice build up effect wrap them so that they lump up toward the one end of the board, then light a single string left hanging from the other end.
Basically, lay out the stuff to be shot so that you can walk fairly freely between the items. Put some thought into the arrangement so that you won't need to step between the viewing crowd and a row of devices already lit. If you work from front to back, you won't be as noticeable while you're firing the stuff. Work through your shoot order, draw a very simple site plan, and think about the effect each item produces. If you're going to have accompanying music, figure out some very basic time cues and light a group of devices on the cues. We're not talking precision here; just trying to spread the show through the music. IF you're not going to use music, then you can decide to light a new group of devices when the old ones begin to go out. In order to achieve some amount of synchrony, make sure you don't have to walk more than two or three steps to get all the devices in a group lit at the same time. Also, once you've done it a few times, you can light the very end of the first couple of fuses, the middle of the next group and the base of the final
I built a _simple_ launch system for 8 artillery tubes for 7-4-2006.
:-)).
The system centered around the 'launch panel'; an old phone display acrylic from Radioshack. We used 20ft. runs of 18awg wire to run from the panel to each tube. Alligator clips were soldered to the end of each set of wires. Each shell had a single strand of wire pulled from a 8awg power wire wrapped around the fuse. This small wire was ~26-30awg. Any smaller and the wire burnt through without igniting the fuse, any larger and I was worried it wouldn't burn through fast enough, and may start a grass fire. A single layer of wraps worked best. The alligator clips were then clipped to these igniters. Back at the panel one side of each of the wires were grounded together at the - side of the battery. The + side of the battery ran to a common terminal on the panel. From here there were 8 LEDs (and resistors) wired from the + side to the wires that ran out to the tubes. When the alligator clips were correctly connected to the igniters the LED would light, giving us the 'green light' to launch. These LEDs also gave off enough light to use the system in total darkness. To launch we simply touched a wire from this common terminal to the terminal for the tube we wanted to launch.
Right now I'm working on a PIC based field programmable launch controller that allows the user to program a launch sequence, or group at any time. The user is able to save 3 sequences in EEPROM, and have another in active memory. This system will be wireless to allow the operator greater safety (being in the center of a 20ft ring of artillery shells wasn't quite as much fun as I had hoped
-Daniel
slash.20.kd5uzz@spamgourmet.com
-Daniel
KD5UZZ
www.w5yj.org
Simply wrap a 30awg wire around the fuse (in a single layer, don't short the coil!) of the shell. Put about 12v@ a few amps through it and it'll light just fine....
-Daniel
KD5UZZ
www.w5yj.org