Slashdot Mirror


EBay's Bid To Go Beyond Auctions Disappoints

Carl Bialik from WSJ writes "eBay is having trouble attracting online shoppers with its new fixed-price sales site, the Wall Street Journal reports. From the article: 'Jonathan Garriss, executive director of the Professional eBay Sellers Alliance, an independent group of eBay sellers, estimates eBay Express accounts for less than 1% of sales for the group's more than 1,000 members, who together sell more than $1 billion a year in merchandise. And while eBay's main auction site attracted more consumer visits than any other online retailer in November, eBay Express was at No. 87 on the list of top shopping and classified sites, according to research firm Hitwise Pty. Ltd.'"

15 of 83 comments (clear)

  1. What was the point? by Thansal · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I never did get why eBay express was instituted.

    If you want to sell an item at a specific cost, just put in a buy it now option. I admit, I don't use eBay, but couldn't you just place the buy it now and reserve at the same point?

    --
    Do Or Do Not, There Is No Spoon, There Is Only Zuul. Everything in the above post is probably opinion.
    1. Re:What was the point? by dgatwood · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You could, but people would think you were a complete jerk. You should just do a fixed-price auction. That's what they're for. This, however, appears to be targeted towards eBay stores. As such, prices seem comparable with eBay stores, i.e. not very good. And as someone else mentioned, this hasn't been advertised well at all.

      One of the biggest reasons I wouldn't shop here, however, is paranoia. I don't trust eBay merchants when it comes to large purchases. I haven't been burned, but I've gotten close enough to make me uncomfortable. I'd rather deal with a known brick-and-mortar store. If the seller has spent real money setting up a web storefront, they're less likely to turn out to be some child selling stolen goods....

      For anything over about $100, I get nervous buying on eBay, and over about $300, I won't touch it. For products under that $300 limit, an eBay merchant has to undercut the best price from a real merchant by at least 15-20% for it to be worth the added risk of buying it from a zero-initial-cost merchant. Since that almost never happens, I almost never buy from eBay merchants. A quick perusal of the eBay express pro microphone category showed Froogle beating their prices on everything but the Peluso, and the eBay Express price was only $4 less on a $1600 mic. A quarter of a percent price difference is inconsequential when weight against my peace of mind.

      I buy from auctions a lot more often than from eBay stores because I'm much more likely to actually come out ahead. That said, if an auction isn't at least 30% off Froogle, I won't touch it. With an auction, you have the added risk of having to trust the seller to accurately represent the condition of the product, and I build that added risk into the purchase price that I'm willing to pay.

      The combination of those factors is, IMHO, the reason that frugal buyers have largely ignored eBay Express. It's the same products at the same prices as everybody else (plus or minus a tiny percentage), but from eBay---a free seller storefront that has a reputation for representing shady sellers and a history of not recouping people's losses when transactions go wrong. Buying online is all about trust, and eBay doesn't have mine.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    2. Re:What was the point? by Grishnakh · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I use Ebay frequently, but almost always for used and obscure items. I too do not see the point in buying brand-new items there; the auctions usually end at higher prices than I could get it from Amazon or Newegg for, and the sellers always gouge on shipping.

      However, for some of the items I purchase, Ebay has been a boon, although I really wish Google would make its own auction site to compete with them, because I hate their high fees, and Paypal's high fees and terrible reputation.

      For instance, I recently bought a used iRiver H320 digital audio player which I've been very happy with. It needs a new battery (which I can get for $20 from newertech), but considering how little I paid for the player that's not a problem.

      I've also bought and sold some old (20-30 years) electronics test equipment on Ebay, such as Tektronix 400-series oscilloscopes and old function generators and power supplies. Items like this can be found easily for under $150 (and around $50 for the power supplies), and are great for hobbyist-level electronics projects. Furthermore, they're rugged and dependable, even at 25 years old, and simple to fix by someone with a little electronics knowledge when they do fail (usually the problem is a bad electrolytic capacitor; electrolytics have a finite lifetime unlike most other components).

      I've also bought and sold various auto parts.

      For items where you're specifically looking for used/discontinued/obscure items, ebay is wonderful (aside from its horrible fees, shipping price gouging, etc.), because it gives buyers and sellers a way to meet that they just can't otherwise. Before the internet and ebay, if you wanted to buy, for instance, a 1935-model Weston voltmeter (something I bought a while ago for a little project), you'd have to hope to find one in an antique store somewhere, maybe. Good luck with that. But I see them all the time on ebay, and they're dirt cheap. Want a 1975-model oscilloscope? You can buy them from test equipment dealers for very high prices, but good luck finding someone with one in serviceable shape, maybe needing a few bulbs replaced, for less than $100. Looking for a 60V power supply, and you don't mind if it's dead because you intend to fix it in your spare time and just want it cheap (like $10)? There's no store for that kind of thing. Need a seat bracket for your car? Have fun calling all the junkyards for it. With ebay, all these things are easily available from all over the country, and depending on demand, usually quite cheap. Want to sell some old junk? You could waste your Saturday setting up a garage sale, and getting $0.25 for each item (if anyone even wants it), or you can sell it on Ebay to a collector in Maine for far more because he's bidding against some guy in Wyoming. None of this was possible before Ebay came along.

      Ebay was really great back in the late 90s because of all this. Lately, however, it's been turning to crap. The main problem I see is that they're a publicly-traded company (which I generally hate), and as such, seek to continue "deliver more shareholder value" by constantly expanding. Of course, you're only going to make so much money by being a venue for buyers and sellers of used and obscure low-cost items. So it seems they cater far too much to the high-volume sellers who inexplicably sell brand-new stuff for just as much as Newegg.com. However, I think this is eventually going to fail as people slowly but surely wise up to this idiocy. But this seems to be making the site not as good for the small-time sellers who are also frequent buyers, such as myself. It also makes it harder to find what you want because it gets "lost in the noise" of all the brand-new crap. The second problem is all the sellers who have low starting bids but pad their profit margin by charging ridiculous shipping charges. This adds up to turning people off of ebay altogether. Finally, the other big problem is the high (and increasing) fees that Ebay/Paypal charge for their services. By charging too

  2. Advertising? by tonsofpcs · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Ever think it may be because of advertising? This is the first time I'm hearing of eBay Express.

    1. Re:Advertising? by dgatwood · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This is advertising.

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

  3. But they are having no trouble... by Billosaur · · Score: 4, Informative

    ...attracting scammers, cheats, and frauds. My wife has had so many problems with eBay, and I'm so unimpressed with them anymore, that I wouldn't bother with their Express site. I can certainly get stuff cheap enough off of Amazon.

    --
    GetOuttaMySpace - The Anti-Social Network
    1. Re:But they are having no trouble... by 0100010001010011 · · Score: 3, Informative

      I'm selling a Dell E1505 on eBay. Lowest end model. I picked it up for $800 last spring and now I got a MacBook Pro (After starting a full time job).

      The highest 6 bids are between 3 people for: 1200, 2000, 2500.

      Immediately I got a SEND TO NIGERIA letter. I figured I'd have some fun so I extended second chance offers to the other bidders. I've been going back and forth with them a few days via e-mail.

      Some pretty good fake PayPal e-mails have come through. I keep checking my account and sadly it's at $0.00. (I feel sorry for real people in Nigeria trying to buy stuff). They even have a good excuse for why it's at $0.00.

      "This PayPal payment has been deducted from the buyer's account and has
      been 'APPROVED' but will not be credited to your account until the shipment reference/tracking number is sent to us for shipment verification so as to secure both the buyer and the seller."

      I can see how some newbies would be confused. But I know how PayPal works.

      I think they've given up on me.

      --

      As per people's questions on why not use "Buy It Now" Because of listing fees. If I have 50 Dell Mice to sell for $5. I don't want to create auctions every 7 days hoping one will sell. Instead I set up a market place that is permanent. I have a quantity listed at $5.

      (Although if I *really* had something to sell. I'd make my own website and use google checkout. They may not be completely 'not evil' but I haven't had $1600 of my funds locked out by them yet)

    2. Re:But they are having no trouble... by stile99 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      But that's just false. Well, not the siding with the seller thing. I won't bother relating my story because it is exactly the same story as so many others post daily all over the net. Actually, technically speaking, the eBay makes their money from the sellers thing isn't false either, it just isn't the full story.

      When eBay screws the buyer, that buyer doesn't return. That's where the sellers make THEIR money, so you'd think eBay wouldn't be so casual about pissing on the buyers. This whole "you have the whole internet as your target market" is nothing short of fraud (which considering the people they associate with, it isn't surprising coming from eBay). They are now using the same fake numbers AOL used to toss around. You don't have X million customers, you've given out X million free discs. You don't really have Y customers either, you've got Y minus Z% who have tried to cancel and you just won't let go.

      Now eBay is using the same accounting math. "We have X registered users, therefore your customer base is X!" No...you have X registered users...a large percentage (and growing daily) of which no longer would 'shop' on your site if someone else were paying the bill.

      Which incidentally...you DO have a large percentage (and growing daily) of people who ARE shopping with someone else footing the bill.

      I trust the guy in the alley more than I trust eBay. Bolex watch anyone? Sure, I know I'm not really getting a Rolex, but at least the alley guy gives me SOMETHING, which is more than I can say for you.

  4. USA Only by CohibaVancouver · · Score: 4, Informative
    I'm in Canada, and the pool of online retailers here is still fairly small, so one of the first things I do with an eBay search is look for items 'located in Canada' (no duties, no customs brokerage fees, no incorrectly filled out waybills etc.). It's a great eBay feature which allows me to find things I might not otherwise locate from a Canadian e-tailer.

    However, eBay Express doesn't support transactions outside of the USA, so I visited the site once and never went back.

  5. Express = Bad buy-it-now by Salvance · · Score: 3, Insightful

    eBay works because people are always looking for fantastic deals, and the auction format provides a sense of urgency. eBay express is really only a buy-it-now subsection of eBay, except the products don't have an expiration date, and aren't displayed prominently in searches.

    Search seems like the express product's major downfall. Most eBay users don't want to shop by store, they want to shop by product (and typically via a search). eBay express only comes up at the very bottom of main eBay searches, or if nothing was found during the search. Sometimes eBay express items also come up as "related items" when clicking on an auction item. But this really isn't going to drive significant traffic ... it's seems more like an afterthought.

    Also, for some reason the express site seems SLOOOOWWW. It took about 1 minute for the main page to come up just now (from 2 different locations on 2 different networks), ugh.

    --
    Crack - Free with every butt and set of boobs
  6. eBay doesn't get it by Electric+Eye · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The problem with eBay (and it being a public company) is that it is under constant pressure to drive more and more revenue its way. eBay was successful at ONE thing: online auctions. Now that shareholders demand more, it has to keep looking for more and more businesses. PayPal was a great buy. But the rest? Eh. If they had done all this 8 years ago, that would have made sense. But eBay is synonymous with auctions and nothing else. Same reason why Amazon isn't associated with auctions. The brand has been defined in stone.

    They've also done a piss poor job of keeping their sellers happy. They raise fees twice a year, regardless of what people say and always say it's being done for the "health of the marketplace." Their spokesman Hani Durzy says the same shit over and over. yet, eBay is FLOODED with goods and sellers The marketplace is so diluted on eBay now that it's very difficult for sellers to make money anymore.

    I don't know what the solution is, but eBay certainly doesn't have it. eBay Express is a dog. They threw in the towel in China (which was a HUGE initiative for them the past two years that has failed miserably), their stock is flatlined and every initiative outside of auctions has essentially failed.

    1. Re:eBay doesn't get it by rcastro0 · · Score: 4, Interesting
      I'm even more amazed at eBay sellers that sell for more than the best prices on Froogle or other search sites. The shocking thing, though, is that people actually buy this stuff at those higher prices.... Apparently, there are still plenty of suckers out there.

      Well, there are a lot of suckers out there for sure. But plenty of people in the other end of the sucker scale are paying those higher prices you are talking about. For instance the smartest Brazilian buyers will pay higher prices to eBay sellers because they will ship to Brazil, and be flexible on what they declare to the post office as the package contents. Oh, and before you get too imaginative, it just needs to be declared as worth less than US$ 50 so that it goes through customs without the 60% import taxes. How smart is that ? Well, an unlocked Treo 650 will cost, shipping included, less than 50% of what you would pay at a Brazilian cell phone store.

      Even if I could convice pricewatch and froogle stores to ship to Brazil, they certainly would not be flexible on what they declare for customs, and the "Sender" label not being "John Smith" would also be a magnet for customs inspection/taxing.

      I do not really know how much this "international consumer arbitrage" is a factor compared to regular suckers, but I can tell you it is a factor that will only grow over time, as people get used to it.
      --
      Quem a paca cara compra, paca cara pagará.
  7. Half.com? by hal2814 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Isn't this why eBay bought out half.com? I remember before eBay got their grubby mits on half, they actually enforced that something sell of 50% of its sale value. Sure the site didn't have as many items but just about everything on there was a deal. Back to the point, why have an eBay Express at all? They already have a fixed prices sales site.

  8. Ebay's buy it now was in jeapordy by mrshowtime · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The reason why ebay express was created was that ebay faced a very distinct possibility that they were going to lose the buy it now feature from their auction site, as the company that won the patent infringement lawsuit sought not only damages, but a permanent injunction against ebay. So ebay was trying to steer the "buy it now" portion to ebay express AND attempt to legitimize the tainted image of high profile "buy it now" auctions. Fortunately for ebay, the Supreme court ruled in favor of ebay, and it happened to be a landmark blow to "patent trolls" everywhere.

    I am curious though, how long ebay can continue to raise it's fees and continue to offer LESS features and service and still maintain it's business model. Personally, I think the worst thing ebay ever did was to go public. It never needed to go public, it was a cash cow and was one of the few initial Internet businesses that actually made a LOT of money by doing essentially nothing, but hosting servers. Now ebay's future is dictated by the stockholders.

    --
    "Jeremy, you need to get to an internet cafe and cut and paste some appropriate sentiments about me from the world wide
  9. Inevitable... by crossmr · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Ebay's glory days are long since passed. There came a point where they went from being the cool little niche pseudo-yardsale, to being some clearing house for every piece of crap some wholesaler from hong kong can get a hold of.

    They do everything they can to screw the buyer, and are surprised when a new initiative fails? Issues I've spotted, reported and gotten bullshit form letters in response to:
    1)Sellers charging too much for shipping - They give an example of someone charging $20 to ship a DVD as bad. I found someone charging $60 to ship a USB Thumb drive via the slowest cheapest USPS method possible.
    2)Sellers setting their "handling" fee as a percentage of final sale - I found a fellow who'd listed all his auctions stating that the handling fee was 4% of the final sale price or something of that nature.
    3)Keyword spamming - How many times have you seen an item listed as: DLink NOT Linksys
    4)Misrepresenting items - A linksys befsr41 is not a modem. Funny how that descriptor appeared only in the title and nowhere in the description.
    5)Listed multiple entries for the same item - I once came across a seller who had about 30 of the identical item, carbon copy listings, all listed at once all ending at the same time. Their ToS either limits to 5 or 10.

    These are just some of the things that I've seen in violation of the ToS, but all from "powersellers". Each time I get a bullshit form letter about how they trust their sellers to do the right thing.

    I've also seen numerous examples of abuse of the feedback system. "Powersellers" hold it hostage until you leave yours to ensure they can retaliate if they mess up. I've seen constant entries like this:
    Buyer leaves: "Item took 3 months to be delivered from 1 state over. Item was broken, not even the the right item and I think the seller urinated on it before sending it. Seller doesn't respond to e-mails."
    Seller leaves in response: "Bad ebayer stay away!!!!!!!11!!!omg."

    Ebay was supposed to be a buyers market, but its turned into a wholesalers market where they rule the roost. More and more people are realizing that and when a solid replacement comes along I think you'll see it pick up quite a bit. Hopefully it won't fall prey to the same issues Ebay did.