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HD DVD's AACS Protection Bypassed

Mr. BS writes "Playfuls.com is running a story how HD DVD's AACS protection has been compromised. Although the video of the hack leaves much to be desired, the source code has already been made available. Feel free to start backing up your HD DVD's whenever you feel the need."

161 comments

  1. Dupe by rrohbeck · · Score: 5, Informative
    1. Re:Dupe by nacturation · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Half-dupe. The last story said source coming in January. This one provides source.

      --
      Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
    2. Re:Dupe by Aladrin · · Score: 1

      While this is partly a dupe, at that time, the source code had not been released. It has now. So the headline really should have reflected that, instead.

      --
      "If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you." - DM
    3. Re:Dupe by i_should_be_working · · Score: 1

      It also caters to my insanely short attention span (brought on by the jolt/halo/porn):

      "hey, cool, the new-fangled dvds have been cracked, I'll read about it now.. Oh wait, the youtube video in the next tab is starting"

      (2 minutes later)

      "That sure was funny, now back to the porn"

      (two days later)

      "hey, cool, the new-fangled dvds have been cracked..."

    4. Re:Dupe by evilviper · · Score: 2, Interesting
      The last story said source coming in January.

      You should pay more attention before you "correct" other people...

      The source was linked in the Doom9 thread the /. story linked to. I have the zipfile on my hard drive to prove it, and a large number of the comments in that thread revolve around a review of the source.
      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    5. Re:Dupe by SoVeryTired · · Score: 1

      I've never drunk a jolt in my life....

      --
      Slashdot: news for Apple. Stuff that Apple.
    6. Re:Dupe by Digital+Vomit · · Score: 1

      We've cracked the copy protection on Slashdot articles!

      --
      Modern copyright is theft of culture from everyone and it retards the progress of the useful arts and sciences.
    7. Re:Dupe by FranklinDelanoBluth · · Score: 1

      I, for one, welcome our new jolt-drinking, halo-playing, pornography-downloading, whacked out overlords...erm...fellow ./ers.

    8. Re:Dupe by FranklinDelanoBluth · · Score: 1

      Looks like all jolt, halo, and porn got to me.

      s!(\.)(/)!$2$1!

    9. Re:Dupe by Curtman · · Score: 1
      I've never drunk a jolt in my life....

      K5 called, they need you back.
    10. Re:Dupe by dascandy · · Score: 1

      I'm offended. Halo only runs on XBoxes and I'm averse to Microsoft.

    11. Re:Dupe by Lectrik · · Score: 1

      perhaps Slashdot should attempt some form of copy protection... it is retaining all of our copyrighted material after all. and I hate having to dupe my comments for every dupe article. so much extra work

      --
      --- As to make my comment seem, by comparison, more intelegent... doodie doodie doodie poop poop poop!
  2. Dupe by dominick · · Score: 2, Funny

    This also just in...

    slashdot seems to be posting stories more than once to demonstrate
    the real effect of deja vu on the jolt drinking, halo playing, pornography
    downloading whacked out crowd it caters to.

  3. And the winner is.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    I guess HD DVD just won the war against blu-ray!

    1. Re:And the winner is.. by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 1

      And it will be locked out of many things forcing Blu-ray to the top.

    2. Re:And the winner is.. by Workaphobia · · Score: 2, Informative

      Why?

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AACS

      "The specification was publicly released in April 2005 and the standard has been adopted as the access restriction scheme for HD DVD and Blu-ray Disc."

      Blu-ray IIRC had room for additional DRM methods as well.

      --
      Evidently, the key to understanding recursion is to begin by understanding recursion. The rest is easy.
  4. The source is not for the "break" by plover · · Score: 5, Informative
    The source code provided is simply code to decrypt the stream. It's an implementation of the AACS published standard for decrypting a stream. What it does not do is provide a way to extract the keys from the disks.

    The author is waiting till some time in the new year to reveal how he got the keys, but the evidence suggests to me that he used some kind of debugging hook into Power HD-DVD.

    --
    John
    1. Re:The source is not for the "break" by Workaphobia · · Score: 1

      Right, it's not even "breaking" or "cracking" the encryption if you *have* the key. DeCSS didn't crack CSS; it simply applied a key that they obtained elsewhere to decrypt the dvd normally. In contrast, something like libdvdcss will make use of the fact that CSS keyspace is extremely small, and brute-force it (if the library was not compiled with a player key).

      On that topic, would anyone happen to know why libdvdcss successfully brute-forces some titles, but halts and fails on others? I ran into that problem and was forced to set my dvd drive's region code so it could decrypt using the normal method instead.

      --
      Evidently, the key to understanding recursion is to begin by understanding recursion. The rest is easy.
    2. Re:The source is not for the "break" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
      On that topic, would anyone happen to know why libdvdcss successfully brute-forces some titles, but halts and fails on others? I ran into that problem and was forced to set my dvd drive's region code so it could decrypt using the normal method instead.

      Do you have broken-by-design Matsushita (Panasonic/Technics/National) DVD drive? Many laptops have those.

      Matsushita's current drives don't allow libdvdcss to read the raw encrypted stream from the disc if the region code doesn't match. This behaviour is against the CSS specs.

    3. Re:The source is not for the "break" by ToxicBanjo · · Score: 1

      True, DeCSS took it's key from another legitimate software player for windows. AACS has sufficient complexity that brute force may be unrealistic. I can't wait to hear how he found the key.

      --
      There are only 10 kinds of people in the world. Those that understand binary and those that don't.
    4. Re:The source is not for the "break" by Gyorg_Lavode · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Pretty simple. He identified the encrypted key. He probably debugged the player and looked for routines that accessed that part of thefile. When he found them he ran the routine and pulled it's output out of memory.

      --
      I do security
    5. Re:The source is not for the "break" by Workaphobia · · Score: 2, Informative

      Actually that's true of most dvd drives these days. The industry made a major push a few years ago to make sure newer drives enforce region codes in hardware, so it's not just that one brand that's defective by design. I don't know if it violates the CSS specs or not.

      From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regional_lockout

      "DVD Video discs are the most infamous and visible example of regional lockout. Computer DVD drives come from the factory with RPC (Regional Playback Control), either RPC-1 (older drives) or RPC-2 (newer drives). The difference between the two is that RPC-1 means the player software has the responsibility of enforcing the region control, while in RPC-2, it is enforced by the drive's firmware.

      It means that RPC-1 drives can play DVDs from any region (0-7) while RPC-2 drives play only from a particular region (although the region code can be changed 5 times after which it is locked)"

      Sucks, doesn't it. After those five times are up, you're screwed unless you can reflash the firmware. That's your money at work.

      --
      Evidently, the key to understanding recursion is to begin by understanding recursion. The rest is easy.
    6. Re:The source is not for the "break" by geminidomino · · Score: 1

      Just gotta be selective in your drives. First thing I do with any DVD drive I buy is reflash to RPC-1.

    7. Re:The source is not for the "break" by RMH101 · · Score: 1

      yes, we know *all* of this. the difference is that crappy drives like the matsushita in my macbook *can't* be regionfree-flashed. they are terrible drives: intolerent of blank media, can't deal with the slightest scratches, rip at a glacial speed. presume apple aren't stupid with hardware design (although you could differ with the MB i guess! mine's fine so far bar the dvd drive) so i'd guess there's a reason for this. personally i've just bought a usb 2.0 external enclosure into which will go a pioneer dvr-111 or similar with RPC-1 firmware...

    8. Re:The source is not for the "break" by alext · · Score: 1

      Yes, it is essential to avoid Matshita drives, however it can be tricky as I believe they may be the only source of 1/3 height units used in small laptops.

      Anyway, I just escaped having one inflicted on me as part of a Sony SZ and bought an Asus W3J with a Toshiba/Samsung drive instead.

  5. Re: /. New Years Resolution by Friar_MJK · · Score: 0, Redundant
    Could of sworn I saw this somewhere already... http://hardware.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/12/ 28/0259244/


    /. New Year's Resolution? Cut back on the dupe addiction. (they make patches for that sort of thing you know)

  6. AACS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Doesn't Blu-Ray use AACS as well? Sounds like a blow to both formats w/r/t crippling the use of their discs.

  7. It needs a name... by jakedata · · Score: 5, Funny

    How about AACS-Hole?

  8. Should read: by Swimport · · Score: 5, Funny

    Feel free to back up your hd-dvds once you get some.

  9. To be honest, I've missed the dupes by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    When you have Alzheimer's, dupes are fantastic!

    1. Re:To be honest, I've missed the dupes by miyako · · Score: 1, Funny

      Hey! I may have Alzheimer's, but at least I don't have Alzheimer's.

      --
      Famous Last Words: "hmm...wikipedia says it's edible"
    2. Re:To be honest, I've missed the dupes by TommydCat · · Score: 0

      That was so funny I forgot to laugh...

      --
      This comment does not necessarily represent the views and opinions of the author.
    3. Re:To be honest, I've missed the dupes by AlHunt · · Score: 1

      >When you have Alzheimer's, dupes are fantastic!

      Plus you can hide your own Easter eggs.

      sorry ....

      --
      1 in 4 Maine children in struggle with hunger.
    4. Re:To be honest, I've missed the dupes by geminidomino · · Score: 1

      That was so funny I forgot to laugh... Just FYI, I audibly groaned at that one...
  10. Kinda wish they hadn't by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Redundant

    An unbroken copy-protection scheme makes for a far better incentive for people not to buy the DRM laden shit.

  11. It's only partially broken by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    That source code does nothing without title keys.

  12. source code link by quakehead3 · · Score: 1
    1. Re:source code link by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
  13. Ironically.. probably a boost for the format by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 2, Insightful

    the mfg's won't understand of course.

    --
    She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
  14. Check out MPAA's wrongdoing! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    It's right here: http://malfy.org/

    1. Re:Check out MPAA's wrongdoing! by RobertLTux · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      sorry folks about the OT but pArdon me sir but

      RadioShacks listing is a bit off base
      1 Its not RSs fault that the OEM for the cleaners changed the formula without permission (but yes it is RSs responsibility to fix the problem) oh and btw RS has had a few recalls
      2 EVERYTHING in the Riverside Campus is driven by E-Mail and "the List" was known for quite some time (and talked about and memoed about and ...)
      3 i will give you the third

      --
      Any person using FTFY or editing my postings agrees to a US$50.00 charge
  15. Par for the course by fireproofjew · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Every encryption/DRM scheme that the companies think up will inevitably be cracked/hacked. All they need to do is realize that and then they can save money instead of pursuing a futile effort. I, for one, would buy the stuff if it was worth the money they charge.

    Maybe they could charge less if they didn't take the time or spend the money developing newer DRM?

    1. Re:Par for the course by arminw · · Score: 4, Insightful

      .....Maybe they could charge less if they didn't take the time or spend the money developing newer DRM........

      Maybe the movie and music moguls are duped by the inventors and purveyors of these harebrained copy protection schemes. The latter KNOW that the laws of physics and mathematics GUARANTEE that *any* copy protection scheme WILL be broken. After all, in order to use the content, the key has to be given to the consumer in order to play it. There is NO way to hide a key, if it is needful to be able to use it at some point in order to view the movie or play the music. Perhaps some sane crypto expert can convince the content producers that they have been lied to by these crooked, money grabbing "experts" who know deep down that none of their schemes can ever work for long. The hollywood and the music industry have been sold the equivalent of a certain bridge labeled DRM by these companies who make money selling their DRM schemes to the content producers. Content makers would likely make more money if they did NOT pay these liars a dime.

      --
      All theory is gray
    2. Re:Par for the course by rob_squared · · Score: 2, Insightful

      The point has never been to make an unbreakable DRM scheme. The point is to use in in conjunction with the DMCA to get more control. DRM and the DMCA go together like bullets and handguns. The bullets (DRM) are useless themselves, but with the handgun (DMCA) they can get you to follow any restrictions they want.

      --
      I don't get it.
    3. Re:Par for the course by gutnor · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "The latter KNOW that the laws of physics and mathematics GUARANTEE that *any* copy protection scheme WILL be broken."

      Ah, they don't want the protection to be completely unbreakable. They just want to make breaking the protection costing too much for average Joe to make copy of DVD to his friends.

      The real value of a DVD for Joe user is something along the line of 20-50$ to purchase and will cost probably around 5$ to rent. If the protection is worth more than 5$ of pain for Joe user, then the mission is already a success. At 50$ worht of trouble, Joe will take its car to walmart and buy the DVD.

      If Joe user cannot make an easy almost free copy, he needs to get it from
      - P2P: Perfect, this channel is closely monitored by RIAA already. Moreover, the power of P2P is what allows the RIAA to buys mandatory taxes on blank CD/DVD in most countries.
      - Lower quality copy with camcorder ? For people not interested in HD 'quality', there is VHS or DVD. So this side is also covered.

      That's the same philosophy you use to secure your house. You don't build a bunker, but you put enough security in and around to make sure it is not worth the pain to break in.

    4. Re:Par for the course by arminw · · Score: 1

      ....The point has never been to make an unbreakable DRM scheme.....

      True. However anyone who wants to, can back up their DVD or play it on some other playback device, because the encryption scheme has been broken. I like to be able to watch a movie on my laptop, the DVD drive of which doesn't always want to give the disk back. Therefore I copy the decrypted DVD onto an external HD connected to a desktop system. After that I can copy it to the HD on the laptop. After I am tired of watching (usually once) it gets erased from both drives. I have never copied a DVD onto another disk and I don't see the need to, since I take care of my purchased disks very carefully. I like to think that the vast majority of people who use a decryption program do something similar. I can see that copying a DVD might be useful, so the kids can get a copy which usually becomes damaged soon. In that case, another copy can be made for them from the original kept in a safe place. Bottom line: Plenty of DVDs are sold legally and the producers thereof are not really losing a ton of money.

      --
      All theory is gray
    5. Re:Par for the course by arminw · · Score: 1

      .....Joe will take its car to walmart and buy the DVD.....

      And then copy it to play it so he/she can watch it on the laptop or iPod on that plane trip or or other place away from the big screen TV in the living room. Most copying of legally purchased DVDs is done for the purpose of device/place shifting. Few DVD's are copied onto other disks and passed around to others.

      --
      All theory is gray
    6. Re:Par for the course by jusdisgi · · Score: 1

      ...anyone who wants to, can back up their DVD or play it on some other playback device, because the encryption scheme has been broken.

      Well, not quite. Granted, nearly all of us use DeCSS to do our (fair use!) backups. But it is quite possible to back them up without any decryption at all, so saying the backups are possible "because" of the crack is not quite right.

      --
      Given a choice between free speech and free beer, most people will take the beer.
    7. Re:Par for the course by arminw · · Score: 1

      .....But it is quite possible to back them up without any decryption at all,......

      Really? Does this work on Mac? I tried making a disk images of movie DVDs, but when mounted, would not play like a real disk. Only Mac the R1pper would make a playable copy.

      Content makers have always figured out eventually how to make money from the new technologies. In time, DRM will become extinct. Someone will figure out how to make their content available more conveniently for a fair price. This someone will make a killing and the rest will then follow suit. iTunes is an ALMOST good example of this. I say almost, because it is still encumbered by DRM. They could do an experiment: Remove all DRM for a short indeterminate time from all material and see if this has an effect on sales, one way or another.

      Some people will still go the inconvenient route of getting their material for free, but the vast majority will pay for convenient easy to use digital material that will freely play on all devices. The sooner companies figure this out, the more money they will collect in their cash registers from the vast majority of customers.

      --
      All theory is gray
    8. Re:Par for the course by GWBasic · · Score: 1

      The sellers of DRM are trying to guide the MPAA/RIAA in a feasable direction. The problem is that the RIAA/MPAA control so much content! It's impossible to invent any kind of playback device without their blessing.

      Want to sell a non-DRM internet-based movie service? All you'll be able to carry are indie movies that no one's ever heard of.

      My employer, (which is involved with DRM,) tells us that they are patiently trying to explain to the MPAA/RIAA that "pay" media needs to be easier (and cheaper) then pirate media. I interpret this to mean that eventually pay downloads will be so cheap & easy that P2P networks won't be worth the time & effort.

    9. Re:Par for the course by arminw · · Score: 1

      ....I interpret this to mean that eventually pay downloads will be so cheap & easy that P2P networks won't be worth the time & effort......

      Probably the present generation of those running the content business will have to die off first. They will be replaced with people who grew up with the Internet and try new things. Among those new things will be DRM free content paid for by viewers. For generations now, the public has lived with content supported by advertising. Perhaps ad supported downloads might work also, just as ad supported "free" over the air broadcasting has been with us for years now. This would be used by those who now watch regular TV broadcasting and listen to the radio.

      --
      All theory is gray
    10. Re:Par for the course by GWBasic · · Score: 1
      Probably the present generation of those running the content business will have to die off first. They will be replaced with people who grew up with the Internet and try new things. Among those new things will be DRM free content paid for by viewers. For generations now, the public has lived with content supported by advertising. Perhaps ad supported downloads might work also, just as ad supported "free" over the air broadcasting has been with us for years now. This would be used by those who now watch regular TV broadcasting and listen to the radio.

      If I had spare money I'd buy up the internet rights to old TV shows and distribute them through BitTorrent with commercials. (The commercials would be skippable.) I envision the the day when NBC, ABC, ect do the same.

  16. Linux for the coarse. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    "Every encryption/DRM scheme that the companies think up will inevitably be cracked/hacked. All they need to do is realize that and then they can save money instead of pursuing a futile effort."

    I agree. That's why I've stopped trying to secure my Linux server.

  17. Hello? Article submitter? by Jugalator · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Feel free to start backing up your HD DVD's whenever you feel the need

    Not only do we skip RTFA quite often, the article submitters seem to as well.

    What he says in that quote is simply not possible; you still need the keys, and that hack doesn't cover that problem.

    We may have something for that too in the future, but this is not the hack for piracy-at-will.

    --
    Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
    1. Re:Hello? Article submitter? by ortholattice · · Score: 1
      We may have something for that too in the future, but this is not the hack for piracy-at-will.

      You mean this is not the hack for extracting your legally purchased content into a sensible format that allows you to skip all the mandatory previews etc. and actually watch it without shackles.

    2. Re:Hello? Article submitter? by nacturation · · Score: 1

      What he says in that quote is simply not possible; you still need the keys, and that hack doesn't cover that problem. Any software player also needs keys in order to play it. Until the time comes that hardware decryption is done in the video card itself, it'll always be possible to hack the software and get the required decryption keys.
      --
      Want to improve your Karma? Instead of "Post Anonymously", try the "Post Humously" option.
    3. Re:Hello? Article submitter? by shaneh0 · · Score: 1

      Actually, FWIW, an HD-DVD starts playing the movie immediately. You can then, if you wish, access the menu features.

    4. Re:Hello? Article submitter? by jZnat · · Score: 1

      Will they always be like that? Because that's actually a pretty good thing going there improvement-wise.

      --
      'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'
    5. Re:Hello? Article submitter? by shaneh0 · · Score: 1

      Yes, from what I understand. It is very nice. Every HD title I have (all 7 of them so far) the movie plays instantly.

      It's funny, I first heard about this feature when watching a regular DVD a few months ago. The dvd plays, and a preview starts for HD-DVD. One of the big things they featured is that the movie starts playing immediately. So basically they were saying "Upgrade to HD-DVD and you won't see any of this crap."

      However, I think that previews can/might/will still be added to the movie. But I think that you'll always be able to skip them, none of this "the disk will not let you press this button" crap that you get with DVDs.

      That inability to ff/skip thru some of that crap is probably the biggest example of VHS superiority over DVD. There's not much. In fact, the only 2 things I can think of is the can't-skip-stuff thing and the fact that a dvd with a scratch in the wrong part can make the entire movie worthless. This also affects rentals. VHS wear out after lots of use, but the very first person to rent a DVD can destory it without much effort for everyone else that comes after. Doing the same to a VHS is a lot more tricky.

  18. yes, it's a dupe... by Bullfish · · Score: 1

    But sometimes people miss stories. Now, if it is a dupe of a dupe, then that's something else (it does happen). It should be no surprise the copy protection is broken. For every team of programmers coming up with this stuff, there are 40 million teenagers in basements hacking it. Law of averages says someone will stumble on to something. The crack is not very good right now. So what? Someone else will refine it. The chain gun was once a flintlock. If the associated groups were smart, they would do away with the protections and just factor in the cost of losses into the end product.

  19. Slashdot's dupe-protection bypassed by noidentity · · Score: 0, Redundant

    Oh, wait, there isn't any! Nevermind.

    1. Re:Slashdot's dupe-protection bypassed by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 0, Redundant

      "Oh, wait, there isn't any! Nevermind."

      You're the fifth person in this thread to bitch about the dupe, hypocrite.

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

  20. This was on NPR Friday by OurNewOverloard · · Score: 1

    Marketplace http://marketplace.publicradio.org/shows/2006/12/2 9/PM200612294.html No excuse for the Big Media companies not to know - DRM will not work!

    1. Re:This was on NPR Friday by westlake · · Score: 1
      No excuse for the Big Media companies not to know - DRM will not work!

      because this so-called "hack" is based on the published algorithm for AACS decryption? what matters is where and how he got the keys.

  21. The Format Wars are OVER!!!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The winner is HD DVD.

    Sorry Sony. Servers you right for using better crypto people.

  22. The ultimate drm by LinuxGeek · · Score: 1

    Coming in the near future...

    It will require a drop of your blood to authenticate the customized drm. As an added bonus, it will also perform a pregnancy test, which will be handy seeing as how you've just been fucked...

    --

    Kindness is the language which the deaf can hear and the blind can see. - Mark Twain
  23. too soon by nothermark · · Score: 1

    He should have sat on the public notice for another year to let the fools get really entrenched in their latest sheme to protect themselves. ;-)

  24. Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by kimvette · · Score: 4, Informative

    Now that it's cracked, I might consider buying your media in HD-DVD and Blu-Ray formats, since now I can take care of Fair Use when it comes to format shifting and making backups. Until it was cracked there was absolutely ZERO possibility that I would ever consider purchasing HD-DVD and Blu-Ray media.

    Don't you think it's high time that you quit trying to block Fair Use now, especially since the real pirates in China are totally unaffected by DRM in the first place?

    Thanks for listening.

    Signed,
    A paying customer

    --
    The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
    1. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by edschurr · · Score: 1

      Fair use doesn't give you the right to break the encryption on copyrighted works. I know you know that but I thought I'd mention it for others. I'm thankful the music CD format doesn't work with encryption, otherwise I possibly wouldn't get to listen to any Beethoven...it's a hassle to download those songs and in good quality!

    2. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by bky1701 · · Score: 1

      It did - before the DMCA - and should still.

    3. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by kage.j · · Score: 1

      I've purchased many CD's, and the first thing I do, is rip them to FLAC for my computer and transcode them to decently high quality MP3 for my iPod. It's about using our purchases the way we want, not about pirating.

      --
      he demonstrated by A plus B minus C divided by Z that the sheep must be red, and die of the rot
    4. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by fourchannel · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Fair use doesn't give you the right to break the encryption on copyrighted works. Sure doesn't. But did you also know that copyright restrictions don't even apply in the first place if you are using the media for private use. Copyright only comes into play if someone is trying to publish the work of someone else. It's not even fair use to be able to do what you want to with your legally purchased DVD in your own home, in fact, that's just called plain old use.

      No matter how much bullshit these companies try to control your every move, realize that once I purchase that little plastic disc, and go home, I can do whatever the fuck I want to, as long as what I do only stays in my own private house.

      Now, on a completely different note, breaking encryption schemes falls under the long arm of the DMCA. My opinion of the DMCA is that the piece of legislation is not even worthy to wipe my ass with.

      --
      ---FourChannel---
    5. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by Babbster · · Score: 0

      Blah, blah, "fair use," blah, blah. Unfortunately, there are any number of people in the world who feel perfectly empowered to illegally copy and distribute whatever material they want. What, exactly, are these people - who spend millions upon millions of dollars to generate this content (well, at least in the case of movies - music, apart from marketing, has relatively low overhead) - supposed to do to try to prevent this? Everyone gets uppity if the MPAA/RIAA files suit against someone for "sharing" their movies and/or music online and people like you tell them they shouldn't have copy protection. They can't win coming or going on the Interwebs in general or Slashdot in specific. I suspect that the only way they COULD win is by just giving away everything they produce for free and asking nicely for donations, you know, if you feel like it.

    6. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by edschurr · · Score: 1

      Weird, I never thought of copyright like that. But having just skimmed the Copyright Act and the Governments FAQ it seems you are right. Fair Dealing appears to only be relevant when you don't own your copy or you are in some way "giving" it to someone else. It isn't explicitly clear however. I don't feel like looking up the American parallels.

      Luckily for Canadians, the Canadian DMCA allows us to break the encryption on their copy of a work.

    7. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by edschurr · · Score: 1

      Well yeah, I didn't mean to imply you were going to distribute anything. I forgot I'm Canadian however, because our DMCA allows us to break encryption like that. (Not to mention we can copy CDs if we use an audio CD, for which royalties have been paid. Presumably one can download music too if you pay the royalties, but how you do so in such a case I do not know.)

      I've ripped seven of my classical CDs to WAV, and I have two more to go. I'll be encoding them to FLAC and then adding metadata fields, because classical doesn't fit well into the standard, and finally filling them all in. I'm not looking forward to all that work. I found out too that classical performances are often very old, and it turns out much of my collection has a static-like noise that is apparent when I turn the volume up. So I have to run audio software over all of it...

    8. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by Krakhan · · Score: 1

      What Canadian 'DMCA' are you talking about?

    9. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by kimvette · · Score: 1

      Actually, if format-shifting for the purpose of interoperability or even bypassing for viewing on Linux, it (the DMCA) absolutely DOES specifically allow exemption for interoperability purposes.

      --
      The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
    10. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by fishbowl · · Score: 1


      >Fair use doesn't give you the right to break the encryption on copyrighted works.

      Cite chapter and verse, and underline the letter of the law that makes it illegal for the end user to decrypt what is encrypted. Cite this law, it does not even need to stipulate anything about "copyright."

      Your statement is in terms of laws giving rights. But laws do not confer rights. Either the people have a right or they do not. A law can limit rights, or it can assert that people have rights and that they may not be abridged. It cannot grant rights. The people have *all* rights unless expressly limited.

      --
      -fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
    11. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by edschurr · · Score: 1

      Bill C-60, which hasn't passed. However it looks like I consulted obsolete information and the bill is actually contrary to what I thought on encryption, but the Wikipedia says it's effectively dead anyway. Apparently nothing new has been suggested, and Michael Geist says the appropriate government body is busy with CBC so nothing will happen for a while. I guess that means we can still break encryption for private use but I'm not at all certain.

    12. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by dryeo · · Score: 1

      In Canada all blank CDRs include the levy. Also DLing music is legal though I don't think uploading is.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    13. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by dryeo · · Score: 1

      Perhaps the one that will get passed if Harper wins a majority in the next election. Also in the case of a conservative majority expect a rewrite of the copyright laws to harmonize with the USA.

      --
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
    14. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by tftp · · Score: 1
      1. In this information age the data can be easily sent from anywhere to anywhere else, at negligible cost.
      2. People want to have certain types of information (movies, music, books etc.)
      3. People do not consider it immoral to access such information even if they haven't paid for it
      4. People actually consider it immoral to charge so much money for a movie or a music
      5. Movies and music can be made available in unencrypted digital formats

      Nowhere here you can see the concern for well-being of United Artists, Warner Brothers or star actors. This is because people are selfish, and in part because they consider those companies and those people overpaid already, and because the value of a viewing of a movie is really low. In other words, if entertainment programs can be p1rated they will be, because The People want it this way.

      And what the poor studios should do about it... that I do not know. It's their problem. Selling movies for cheap, on DVDs, and without any encryption whatsoever, will be probably popular - it beats the need to find, download and store a fairly large set of files, and then keep copying them on one media or another if you want to keep it. Much better to get a 7 GB factory-pressed DVD for a couple of dollars, like iTunes. But that's just my thought. And they probably shouldn't pay too much money to the actors, they aren't worth it to begin with.

    15. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by edschurr · · Score: 1
      I was referring to this:

      US Code : Title 17 - "COPYRIGHTS"
      CHAPTER 12 - "COPYRIGHT PROTECTION AND MANAGEMENT SYSTEMS"
      1201. Circumvention of copyright protection systems
      • (a) VIOLATIONS REGARDING CIRCUMVENTION OF TECHNOLOGICAL MEASURES-
        • (1)(A) No person shall circumvent a technological measure that effectively controls access to a work protected under this title...
        • (3) As used in this subsection--
          • (A) to `circumvent a technological measure' means to descramble a scrambled work, to decrypt an encrypted work

      I'm not really interested in the definition gripes.
    16. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by franl · · Score: 1
      Nowhere here you can see the concern for well-being of United Artists, Warner Brothers or star actors.

      Touché. Should the early adopters of passenger plane technology have had any concern for the airship manufacturers? Should early users of automobiles have had any concern for makers of horse-drawn carriages? Should people who used the first scientific calculators have had concern for the slide-rule makers?

      The answer to all of these questions is obvious.
    17. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by fishbowl · · Score: 1

      How does that law differentitate my decrypting the same DVD with my set-top player, with WinDVD, or with libdecss, for instance?

      If merely using the third item is a crime, so it is for the first two. Is there any case law that clarifies this rule?

      --
      -fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
    18. Re:Hey MPAA/RIAA cretins! by edschurr · · Score: 1

      Good point. I don't know of any case law because it doesn't interest me that much and since I'm in Canada it doesn't affect me. That might be covered by this:

      Section 1201
      (c) Other Rights, Etc., Not Affected.(1) Nothing in this section shall affect rights, remedies, limitations, or defenses to copyright infringement, including fair use, under this title.


      I guess one would have to know about the rest of the Copyright title.

      Title 17, Chapter 12, Section 1201.
      Rulemaking on Exemptions from Prohibition on Circumvention of Technological Measures that Control Access to Copyrighted Works

      That latter link is about what the Librarian of Congress has made excemptions from the DMCA for, as per 1201 (a)(1)(C). It's kind of interesting, because there are barely any excemptions at all. The only one that would really come up I imagine is that people can break DRM on ebooks that don't exist with accessibility features, if there are no other versions of that ebook that do have accessbility features.

      (I should note I'm not a lawyer and may have interpreted this wrong. Don't act on my interpretation.)

  25. Even Worse by Frans+Faase · · Score: 1

    It does not even contain the actual decripting code, but simply calls some system routines.

  26. Actually... by raehl · · Score: 5, Funny

    This was just a backup of the last article.

  27. This is like Fox News covering Iraq by heroine · · Score: 0, Troll

    Every day the kids say they cracked AACS and every day the reality is they didn't even scrach it. Is it because they know they can't win and are desperate to sound like they own AACS?

    The first time, they discovered how to use JMF to play a BD movie on a BD player, as if the whole idea of BD-J wasn't a trick to keep them busy thinking they cracked it. Now they claim to have at least part of an AACS decryption algorithm, assuming it isn't just another JMF call they got out of a BD player.

    It still sounds incredible that the IPod generation even knows what an AACS decryption algorithm is. You wouldn't think, being infactuated with big corporations, CEOs, and marketing, they would want to break encryption like the Walkman generation did with DVD.

    Now all you need is 50 years to reverse engineer one of the millions of keys.

  28. HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by derrickh · · Score: 4, Informative

    Unlike DVDs, HD-DVD's have dual keys, 1 for the title, and 1 for the player. At the most, this guy has managed to make 3 titles playable on a single player. What will happen next is Cyberlink will have it's PowerDVD keys revoked and new keys will be provided with a patch.

    So at most, you'll be able to 'back up' (or Pirate) the current batch of Full Metal Jacket HD-DVD's to play on an older version of PowerDVD.

    So dont go around yelling about how HD-DVD is cracked, cuz it's not.

    Here's an article that has a few more facts and less sensationalism.
    http://videobusiness.com/article/CA6403011.html

    D

    1. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by Utopia · · Score: 1

      Actually DVDs also have title keys and player keys.

    2. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by DamnStupidElf · · Score: 4, Informative

      Unlike DVDs, HD-DVD's have dual keys, 1 for the title, and 1 for the player. At the most, this guy has managed to make 3 titles playable on a single player. What will happen next is Cyberlink will have it's PowerDVD keys revoked and new keys will be provided with a patch.

      And when PowerDVD is re-released it will have to load its brand new decryption key into memory and use it to decrypt the data from the disk. If they're smart-asses, they'll only use the decryption key for key setup or even completely skip the AES 128 key and directly build the AES decryption key schedule by some other obfuscated process. If they really want to get wild, they'll continually decrypt and reencrypt the key schedule so that its never fully intact in memory at any given point in time, and integrate the last decryption steps into the first huffman decoding steps for the mpeg process (since it's just a bunch of XORs) to further annoy crackers. Unfortunately, the fact that unencrypted material ever exists in PowerDVD proves that they must have the entire AES decryption key schedule available for any given decryption, and it will be relatively trivial for crackers to pull the key schedule out and just pick the first 128 (or 192 or 256) bits of the key schedule which is the original AES key. Trying to hide encryption keys within an executable's memory space is probably one of the silliest ever conceived. All an attacker has to do is try every K-bit (K is the size of the key) sequence of memory as a test key at several points in the program. That is in fact what this article's attack accomplished. The key schedule can be dynamically encrypted and decrypted as each word is required, but this is just a stopgap measure and slows encryption down significantly.

    3. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by supersat · · Score: 2, Interesting

      That article is wrong is one regard: "CSS relied on a single set of keys that were used to encrypt every DVD and were provided to every DVD player, both hardware and software."

      CSS also uses different player keys. The three big differences between AACS and CSS is that AACS has many more player keys (CSS only had ~400), once one player key was discovered, you could easily discover all of the other player keys, and weaknesses in the encryption algorithm made it possible to discover the title keys without any player keys.

      As the video said, the real story isn't the software released (it merely implements publicly-available standards), but that title keys could be obtained from PowerDVD.

    4. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by Kjella · · Score: 1

      So at most, you'll be able to 'back up' (or Pirate) the current batch of Full Metal Jacket HD-DVD's to play on an older version of PowerDVD.

      No, the title key is sorta the holy grail for that title. It means that anyone with access to the encrypted file (i.e. anybody) can decrypt that HD-DVD and any from the same batch, for all intents and purposes irreovcable. And if they got it for that key, they presumably got it for all past and current keys. It is not broken in the sense that all future keys are broken - AACS can't be broken that way - but it's still a serious breach.

      --
      Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
    5. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by franl · · Score: 1
      At the most, this guy has managed to make 3 titles playable on a single player.

      I beg to differ. He has managed to extract the video data in unencrypted form. He can now watch those 3 titles forever by playing them from his hard disk or by burning them unencrypted to a writable HD-DVD. He can also seed a torrent of those titles so others can watch/burn them too.

      As others have pointed out, revoking title and player keys will not prevent every single HD-DVD from being decrypted in time. That may not be what you mean by "HD-DVD is cracked" but it's close enough for me. The vast majority of people will never manually crack an HD-DVD. They'll either use automated tools (that are continuously updated to cope with revoked keys) or simply download an already-decrypted copy of the disc using a BitTorrent client.
    6. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by r3m0t · · Score: 1

      "Trying to hide encryption keys within an executable's memory space is probably one of the silliest ever conceived."

      Except with Trusted Computing.

      Memory Curtaining allows a program to protect its memory from being read by other processes and the kernel.

      If a driver has to be signed to be loaded (as in 64-bit Windows Vista*) then none of the drivers will be able to look at the curtained memory (unless you're able to pay Microsoft some money /and/ slip the debugging functionality of your driver past their noses). The next version of PowerDVD could require all unsigned drivers to be unloaded.

      There's more to this, such as HDCP, prevention of screenshots, etc.

      If record companies are willing to take the plunge and go all the way in DRM (requiring TC, using the ICT http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image_Constraint_Toke n, revoking keys of cracked players, shutting off most of their current market) it could be the end of piracy and fair use too.

      * I think there are some exceptions for developers, and you may also be able to bypass this restriction (which is against the EULA) or to load a new root certificate to sign your drivers. Also, it's worth noting that 32-bit Vista has an API to check if any unsigned drivers are loaded.

    7. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The analog hole beats trusted computing any day.

    8. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by oyenstikker · · Score: 1

      Ok, so the o/s won't let me read the memory. If I run a TC o/s in a virtual machine, I can read it, no?

      --
      The masses are the crack whores of religion.
    9. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by GiMP · · Score: 1

      I believe that with Trusted Computing in a virtual-machine, the TC commands must be passed back to the hardware. At least until someone comes up with a software emulated TC chip. However, I'm not an expert on this -- the whole idea just makes me sick.

    10. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by jZnat · · Score: 1

      Although, who would want to seed a 20+ GB torrent for a single movie? Maybe for an entire large anime or all the seasons of a TV show, but not a single movie. Unless we actually get the bandwidth we paid the telcos for (taxes), torrenting something like that just isn't worth it right now.

      --
      'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'
    11. Re:HD-DVD is -NOT- cracked by DamnStupidElf · · Score: 1

      There's more to this, such as HDCP, prevention of screenshots, etc.

      HDCP is cryptographically broken to begin with, and there are already consumer devices available to output HDMI from a supposedly secure HDCP device.

      Memory Curtaining allows a program to protect its memory from being read by other processes and the kernel.

      If a driver has to be signed to be loaded (as in 64-bit Windows Vista*) then none of the drivers will be able to look at the curtained memory (unless you're able to pay Microsoft some money /and/ slip the debugging functionality of your driver past their noses). The next version of PowerDVD could require all unsigned drivers to be unloaded.


      I'll begin to take this possibility seriously as soon as anyone is able to make perfectly secure software from the kernel all the way down to each device driver loaded in kernel mode. How much do you want to bet that by buying X-brand device with a shoddy driver and plugging it into your Vista media PC you'll suddenly have a huge backdoor to exploit? My guess is that will be one of the first easily available breaks. Memory curtaining is only effective after the program has been loaded and has turned on curtaining for itself. Having a backdoor driver allows the movie player process to be modified before it executes, removing its desire to curtain itself.

      If record companies are willing to take the plunge and go all the way in DRM (requiring TC, using the ICT http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image_Constraint_Toke n, revoking keys of cracked players, shutting off most of their current market) it could be the end of piracy and fair use too.

      All piracy needs is one cracked player kept in secret. It's nearly impossible to watermark a disc so that one can tell which player key was used to extract the unprotected media, since it would be an obvious thing like a playlist changing based on the vendor ID of the player or something equally transparent. Since there's only enough room on the disc for one encrypted movie, what matters is whether any player can obtain that master key by any means, and it's virtually untraceable. All fair use needs is an exploitable kernel driver or software player, or a combination of a working player and HDCP->HDMI converter, or a cryptographic attack on the player as described in "A Cryptanalysis of the High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection System", or a list of encryption keys extracted from players. Note that fair use is actually harder than piracy, because it assumes the open sharing of knowledge which can be used by the media companies to counteract exploits by revoking drivers and keys for weak players. As usual, normal customers suffer while true pirates have it pretty easy.

  29. Cost Effectiveness? by I'll+Provide+The+War · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Feel free to start backing up your HD DVD's whenever you feel the need.

    Is it really cost-effective to do so at this point? HDDs seem to be at around $0.25/GB best case, so we are talking about $7+ per movie. That means 1/3 of your collection would have to be destroyed just to break even, assuming you value your time outside the office at $0/hr.

    Maybe people are backing these up for other reasons such as skipping the 10 second FBI warning or saving the 20 seconds it takes to locate a disc and physically place it in the player?

    I really don't see the utility, especially when giganews et al have 90 days retention now.

    1. Re:Cost Effectiveness? by CastrTroy · · Score: 1

      You could just back them up to regular DVD. Given that BluRay is better quality than DVD, you could probably reencode it to DVD size without losing much over the DVD. You could even use MPEG4 to back it up, and store HD content on the DVD, you would probably have better quality than the DVD. You can't back up to BluRay for a good price, but a back up to DVD is better than no back up at all.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    2. Re:Cost Effectiveness? by donaldm · · Score: 1

      If you can see it and hear it you can copy it, however the copied result may not have the same quality which may not be an issue to some people.

      Since HD-DVD and Blueray are proposed for High Definition TV's (720 and 1080 using interlace or progressive scan) you will notice the difference between Standard Definition TV and HDTV. Consider a small HDTV (normally 720i,p) at approx 12in (30cm) you can hardly tell the difference between SD and HD content but now consider a 40in (101cm) and above HDTV (720p,i or 1080p,i) displaying SD and HD content and you will really pick the difference. In fact for HDTV's above 40in (101cm) you can start to see significant differences between 720 and 1080.

      If you are happy with SD content and have a SDTV then fine, but once you get a HDTV and like it or not you will eventually get one then you will pick the difference so your rip which would contain the basic content will appear grainy and possibly intolerable to watch.

      From my personal perspective if I watch a movie on DVD then it would be rare for me to ever watch it again and I cannot see this changing when HD content becomes available so if I would like to watch the latest movie I would rent it. It is unfortunate from my perspective that most movies today are rehashes of shows made over 10 years ago and it is rare to see an innovative show or movie.

      Now music is a different matter and this is so much harder to to protect against copying since it does not make much of a difference if you have it on CD, DVD, HD-DVD or Bluray media, it can be copied with very little degradation in content that it can be listened to again and again as well as being re-copied for the rest of your life.

      --
      There ain't no such thing as proprietary standards only proprietary formats. Standards are by definition open.
    3. Re:Cost Effectiveness? by smallfries · · Score: 1

      or saving the 20 seconds it takes to locate a disc and physically place it in the player Dude. Those 20 seconds are away from the couch. That's not what I paid good money for...
      --
      Slashdot: where don knuth is an idiot because he cant grasp the awesome power of php
    4. Re:Cost Effectiveness? by robo45h · · Score: 1

      Just back up the one's you're going to lose. Duh.

  30. Bandwidth by TwstdTrndo · · Score: 1

    Sheesh, I hope my internet provider steps up my bandwidth so I can download one of these things within a reasonable time. 24 gigs isn't something to turn the other cheek to. Plus I need to upgrade my 400GB drives in RAID 1 to something over 2TB

  31. That is how DIVX won ?? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Remember how Dinsey was only going to releas on DIVX, as it provided better DRM and other control than DVD?

    But, no a Disney lockout made no difference.

    Part of the reason some early adopters liked DVD was because they new it was MPEG2, so possibly transferable.

    The idea of a black-box format is less appealing.
    Yes, the mass market does not care about the format. But they won't buy the next Laser Disc either.

  32. Universal availability by symbolset · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If I paid for the content, I feel I'm entitled to play it when and where I want. That includes on my cell phone, my mp4 video player, streaming onto one of my pc's from my server, or even on a monitor that's attached with a VGA cable instead of a HDRM cable. And I feel I'm entitled to keep it safe from harm, watching the related movie while the shipping container disc is secure in its plastic box. I'm also entitled to watch just the content and skip the advertising, FBI threats, extras, menus and other crap that detract from the movie experience I paid for. Being threatened with prison for exercising my rights under fair use is distasteful to me, and doesn't leave me in a good mood to enjoy the dramatic experience.

    People are backing these things up to their USB external HDDs so they can take their movies with them, or watch them how they like. The cracks for both of these formats will be available and people will transcode them to open formats. That's the way it is because the studios won't sell us content in the format we want, or their terms are otherwise unacceptable. I don't approve of people sharing the content with people who haven't paid for it, but, well, the penalty doesn't get any worse does it?

    Oh, and usenet was cool once. I wonder what it's like to download a 25GB movie. That SSL encrypted subscription looks like a winner. Maybe it's time to look into that again.

    --
    Help stamp out iliturcy.
  33. [Possibly OT] Wikipedia Copying? by stevenm86 · · Score: 1

    I like how that article just blatantly copied the wikipedia page on AACS:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Access_Conte nt_System
    Look under System Overview. It is possible that the text may have come from a common source, but wikipedia cites no references and a google search for the text takes you to the wiki page. Still no direct indication that the author of the text is the same person who put it in wikipedia, but still interesting.

  34. I don't think there is much they can do by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The key and the content has to be decrypted at some point. I don't think it's going to be long before
    someone figures it out and automates the retrieval of the key or the content from memory. In either case it will make key revocation much more difficult for the studios.

  35. hide the keys! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    'if attacker doesn't publish the compromised player key, the AACS licensing authority doesn't know which key is compromised, and it can not revoke it. An attacker can use his/her player key to get title (or media) keys of several movies, and publish the title/media keys or the decrypted movies, without risk of revoking of his/her player key.' http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advanced_Access_Conte nt_System#System_overview

    1. Re:hide the keys! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      His attack gets the keys from the players installed on the PC (the Cyberlink one in this case I believe), the keys for those programs will likely be revoked.

  36. Dance Dance Revocation by tepples · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Pretty simple. He identified the encrypted key.

    Which will be the first revoked key.

    1. Re:Dance Dance Revocation by discojohnson · · Score: 1
      Which will be the first revoked key.
      ..and you've only touched the surface. this can be the end of this scheme before it's even really started. what about a standalone player? unless it's connected to the web and can auto-update, i've got to burn and feed it updated keys every month or so whenever new keys are used. how many times do you figure i'd put up with that because i bought a movie and can't play it until i update my keys? twice? how many times do i have to hate the format because it simply doesn't work every time? as if the financial price wasn't a high enough barrier for the format, now i have to pay the annoyance price of updating my stuff on the regular. no thanks.
    2. Re:Dance Dance Revocation by Watson+Ladd · · Score: 1, Informative

      The disk keys *cannot* be revoked as they are burned into the disk. That is what is being used to decrypt.

      --
      Inventions have long since reached their limit, and I see no hope for further development.-- Frontinus, 1st cent. AD
    3. Re:Dance Dance Revocation by tepples · · Score: 1

      what about a standalone player? unless it's connected to the web and can auto-update, i've got to burn and feed it updated keys every month or so whenever new keys are used. how many times do you figure i'd put up with that because i bought a movie and can't play it until i update my keys?

      It is expected to be more difficult to extract keys from a dedicated set-top player than from a software package for PCs running Windows.

    4. Re:Dance Dance Revocation by Workaphobia · · Score: 3, Informative

      This point has been mentioned a lot in this article's comments and the last one on this topic, but I'll karma whore and reiterate it:

      There's a difference between the title key and the player key. The title keys are used to directly decrypt the contents of the dvd (or hddvd or blu-ray), and differ between discs. They are not revoked because they are never reused to begin with. The player key is what's licensed to the companies and stored in players. This is the key that allows access to the title key, and if compromised, this key can be revoked by simply not allowing it to decode any more title keys on future discs. So if this guy has obtained a player key, he can continue to decrypt future title keys up until the powers that be catch on, which may never happen if he doesn't publish it.

      But he may not even have a player key. He might have just read the title keys, after they were decrypted by powerdvd, out of memory. I think that's what the GP meant.

      I heard a suggestion in another thread that the title keys alone might be useful enough - the idea was that they could be exchanged freely across a p2p network, but the player keys that yielded them would remain in private hands to ensure their usefulness. I think the people discussing that missed one important point (although I could be wrong): the title keys should be unique not just to each movie, but to each disc containing that movie, as they are derived from the serial number in the disc. So your title key is useless to anyone else. It's a shame if that's true.

      Guess the only thing to do is go back to trading gigabytes of movie data over bittorrent illegally, instead of a couple kilobytes of key data so you can view a legal copy. ;)

      --
      Evidently, the key to understanding recursion is to begin by understanding recursion. The rest is easy.
    5. Re:Dance Dance Revocation by tepples · · Score: 1

      the title keys should be unique not just to each movie, but to each disc containing that movie, as they are derived from the serial number in the disc.

      How is that possible? If a set of discs are stamped with the same data, then how can they be encrypted with different keys? Where can I learn about serial numbers in AACS?

    6. Re:Dance Dance Revocation by Workaphobia · · Score: 1

      I'm not sure, information on wikipedia (and hence, everything that rips content from wikipedia like TFA) is a bit sparse. It does seem strange that the data on every disc would be different, encrypted with a different key. But if that were not the case, wouldn't it be trivial to make an image and distribute this rather than the unencrypted movie data, since people can just burn the image illegally and play it in a liscensed player to accomplish the same goal? At least if the title key and cypherdata are different between all discs, this isn't feasable, because a legitimate player will notice the discrepency between the title key and volume id (serial number) and will refuse to play.

      Not sure what the manufacturing process would be.

      --
      Evidently, the key to understanding recursion is to begin by understanding recursion. The rest is easy.
    7. Re:Dance Dance Revocation by tepples · · Score: 2, Informative

      But if that were not the case, wouldn't it be trivial to make an image and distribute this rather than the unencrypted movie data, since people can just burn the image illegally and play it in a liscensed player to accomplish the same goal?

      Even in DVD-R, the consumer burners can't burn the player key block, which is preset to the unencrypted state on all consumer blanks. Special "authoring" burners are prohibitively expensive for the typical low-scale pirate's business model.

  37. bogus reasoning by oohshiny · · Score: 1

    The article in Videobusiness is correct in what can be done to revoke keys, but it's wrong in what that means.

    It only takes a single compromised player to copy content, and once compromised, that player can be used in perpetuity to rip any and all disks published up to that point. There is no way to undo that.

    Furthermore, if players like this get compromised every few months, we know that it's a fairly high probability event. Together with the previous observation, that means that pretty much every disc will be perfectly rippable by pirates using simple software (no need even to hack into hardware).

    What this sort of nuisance DRM protects against is consumers backing up their HD-DVDs, watching them on iPods, etc. That's a shame, really. But I think, in the end, that will just mean that the formats are at great risk of simply being overtaken by on-line distribution. If people have to put up with DRM anyway, they might as well go to iTunes and other sites like that. And downloaded content at least can be backed up even if it is protected by DRM.

  38. DirecTV by tepples · · Score: 1

    There is NO way to hide a key, if it is needful to be able to use it at some point in order to view the movie or play the music.

    Tell that to people trying to pirate DirecTV signals. Have the P4, D1, and D2 access cards been broken yet?

    1. Re:DirecTV by franl · · Score: 1
      There is NO way to hide a key, if it is needful to be able to use it at some point in order to view the movie or play the music.
      Tell that to people trying to pirate DirecTV signals. Have the P4, D1, and D2 access cards been broken yet?
      I see your point, but tamperproof hardware offers different challenges to the crackers than a software-only DRM scheme. If software can get the key, then the DRM system is doomed to failure.
    2. Re:DirecTV by arminw · · Score: 1

      ....Tell that to people trying to pirate DirecTV signals.....

      The difference here is that the keys can be changed and are being changed constantly, whereas once a DVD is recorded and/or a player is sold, nothing can be changed. That is why the new HD players have revokable keys. However I doubt whether the content providers will mess with a huge number of installed players. If millions of Joe consumers get a popular movie DVD as a gift or purchase and then cannot play it, then the producers will not be happy when these DVDs are returned as defective.

      --
      All theory is gray
    3. Re:DirecTV by tepples · · Score: 1

      once a DVD is recorded and/or a player is sold, nothing can be changed.

      And why studios don't immediately release entire back catalogs in new formats, so that the keys that are going to leak have leaked and been revoked before the crown jewels of the catalog are released.

      If millions of Joe consumers get a popular movie DVD as a gift or purchase and then cannot play it, then the producers will not be happy when these DVDs are returned as defective.

      Even if the error message contains explicit instructions to blame the player, not the disc?

    4. Re:DirecTV by arminw · · Score: 1

      ....Even if the error message contains explicit instructions to blame the player, not the disc?.....

      Most likely the disk will still get blamed. Here is the scene:

      Customer: "But all my movies I have bought in this store worked and still do, as do all my friends disks. It's only this ONE I bought yesterday, out of all of them that doesn't. it is obviously no good."
      Store clerk: "Ok we will give you another copy"
      Next day---> Customer (now angry): The new one doesn't work either. Give me back my money!
      Clerk: " We think it is your player that is the problem in that its license has been revoked by the movie maker. However, it is store policy, we only want satisfied customers. Here is your refund."

      This scene is multiplied for EVERY copy of that great new movie. End result: Word spreads that DVD movie release xyz will not play on 'popluar brand abc' player. It therefore is defective and nobody buys it. The producer who was deceived by the DRM 'experts' is screwed out of real money twice. First the movie guys paid good money to the DRM sharks and then second, they lost sales because of the DRM they were conned into putting on the disks.

      --
      All theory is gray
  39. PVP-UAB by tepples · · Score: 1

    Until the time comes that hardware decryption is done in the video card itself, it'll always be possible to hack the software and get the required decryption keys.

    Windows Vista has a mechanism where media files can request decryption in the video card. See Protected Video Path User Accessible Bus.

  40. Patience, young Jedi. by tepples · · Score: 1

    because this so-called "hack" is based on the published algorithm for AACS decryption? what matters is where and how he got the keys.

    That will come later. Each piece of AACS shall be disclosed and disseminated in its own time, on a schedule that limits the ability of the MAFIAA to enforce the standard form contracts encoded in the DRM system against customers.

  41. Universal City Studios v. Reimerdes by tepples · · Score: 1

    if format-shifting for the purpose of interoperability or even bypassing for viewing on Linux, it (the DMCA) absolutely DOES specifically allow exemption for interoperability purposes.

    Even if 1201(f) does allow embodying the capacity for circumvention for interoperability purposes into a device and distributing it, the US Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit ignored it in Universal City Studios v. Reimerdes .

  42. Chapter and verse by tepples · · Score: 1

    Cite chapter and verse, and underline The subset of HTML permitted in Slashdot comments does not permit underline or similar text-decorations.

    the letter of the law that makes it illegal for the end user to decrypt what is encrypted. 17 USC 1201(b):

    No person shall manufacture, import, offer to the public, provide, or otherwise traffic in any technology, product, service, device, component, or part thereof, that--

    (A) is primarily designed or produced for the purpose of circumventing protection afforded by a technological measure that effectively protects a right of a copyright owner under this title [17 U.S.C.A. S 1 et seq.] in a work or a portion thereof;

    (B) has only limited commercially significant purpose or use other than to circumvent protection afforded by a technological measure that effectively protects a right of a copyright owner under this title in a work or a portion thereof; or

    (C) is marketed by that person or another acting in concert with that person with that person's knowledge for use in circumventing protection afforded by a technological measure that effectively protects a right of a copyright owner under this title in a work or a portion thereof.

    In patent case law, "manufacturing" has been interpreted to include installing on a hard drive, transforming a general-purpose computer into a machine that performs a patented process. Likewise, installing circumvention software would "manufacture" a circumvention device from raw materials that include a computer. The allofmp3 case is based on an interpretation of "importing" that includes downloading a copy from a foreign server across the Internet. "Otherwise traffic in" appears intended to encourage courts to interpret the restriction on the rights of users broadly rather than narrowly. "Another acting in concert" would include someone on IRC who gives you a link to optical disc authentication and decryption software. "A right of a copyright owner under this title" is defined in 17 USC 106 to include the right to exclude reproducing or preparing derivative works and in 17 USC 602 to include the right to exclude importing copies from another region.

    I am not a lawyer; nothing you read on Slashdot is legal advice. I encourage other people to look over my analysis and point out errors. If you plan to sell something, talk to your attorney first.

  43. Because 1201 nullifies 107, 108, 109, and 117 by tepples · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Unfortunately, there are any number of people in the world who feel perfectly empowered to illegally copy and distribute whatever material they want. What, exactly, are these people - who spend millions upon millions of dollars to generate this content (well, at least in the case of movies - music, apart from marketing, has relatively low overhead) - supposed to do to try to prevent this?

    Unfortunately, there any number of people in the world who feel perfectly empowered to use litigation against others who reuse their material in critical ways, to withdraw material from distribution, and to make material that has been distributed useless. What, exactly, is the public - who spends millions upon millions to preserve this content - supposed to do to try to prevent this?

    A problem occurs when the conditions imposed by digital restrictions management interfere with the public's right to make parodies and other fair uses that would be protected under 17 USC 107 were it not for 17 USC 1201. A problem occurs when the conditions imposed by digital restrictions management interfere with libraries' and archives' right to make backup copies that would be protected under 17 USC 108 were it not for 17 USC 1201. A problem occurs when the conditions imposed by digital restrictions management interfere with users' right to resell copies that would be protected under 17 USC 109 were it not for 17 USC 1201. A problem occurs when the conditions imposed by digital restrictions management interfere with users' right to platform-shift computer programs that would be protected under 17 USC 117 were it not for 17 USC 1201. If the MAFIAA wants to run a legit business, how can it help preserve the traditional balance between the rights of the copyright owner and the rights of users?

  44. For the secondary TV(s) by tepples · · Score: 1

    From my personal perspective if I watch a movie on DVD then it would be rare for me to ever watch it again

    From my personal perspective it is more likely than not that you do not have single-digit-year-old children. They tend to watch the same G-rated (or foreign counterpart) animated film once a week or more often. The use case that the MAFIAA member studios want to prevent is that someone buys a copy of Pinocchio in Outer Space on an HD format and backs it up to DVD-R for the smaller SDTV or EDTV set in the kids' room.

  45. 2ndMIX by tepples · · Score: 2, Informative

    The disk keys *cannot* be revoked as they are burned into the disk.

    They can be revoked in future titles and in remasters of existing titles. What use is circumvention software that can break only a few months of releases?

    1. Re:2ndMIX by Nasarius · · Score: 1
      What use is circumvention software that can break only a few months of releases?
      And then somebody else will extract another key, ad infinitum. It's a bit like the Linux model of reverse-engineering device drivers; only the newest stuff will be , everything else will be fine. And I'm sure a good cracking group or two will grab a key and not publicize the fact, so it won't be revoked and they can do instant releases. DRM, like all forms of copy protection, is broken by design. You can add all the layers of encryption and obfuscation you want, but you still need to give the keys to the user in some form or another.
      --
      LOAD "SIG",8,1
    2. Re:2ndMIX by mike260 · · Score: 1

      Plus, the next guy will release keys, but not the details of how he got them. So no-one will know which keys to revoke, and that's the ballgame.

    3. Re:2ndMIX by ClamIAm · · Score: 1

      Before posting more, please learn the difference between "player keys" and "title keys", kthx.

    4. Re:2ndMIX by tepples · · Score: 1

      If a player key is disclosed and revoked, then the player key becomes useless for finding new releases' title keys, right?

    5. Re:2ndMIX by iainl · · Score: 1

      1) It will be a software player for Windows, or maybe OSX at a push.

      2) ALL HD-DVD players, software or hardware, have a net connection - it's in the spec just like which codecs they need to handle and so on. So they can get updated ones too. The keyspace is huge.

      --
      "I Know You Are But What Am I?"
    6. Re:2ndMIX by ClamIAm · · Score: 1

      Even if a player does get revoked, there's nothing stopping you from buying another player. Further, if someone manages to devise a deencryption algorithm that works universally, your entire argument here is a non-starter.

    7. Re:2ndMIX by tepples · · Score: 1

      Even if a player does get revoked, there's nothing stopping you from buying another player

      If a widespread player model gets 0wned, the company that made it is going to have a lot of unhappy customers.

    8. Re:2ndMIX by ClamIAm · · Score: 1

      They're one step ahead of you here. This was a problem with CSS, as there weren't many keys. With AACS, each player has a unique key.

    9. Re:2ndMIX by jrockway · · Score: 1

      > What use is circumvention software that can break only a few months of releases?

      Uploading the release to Usenet. And ince it's up on Usenet in full quality, what's the point of having DRM anyway?

      --
      My other car is first.
  46. No DRM! by cciRRus · · Score: 2, Funny

    That's what happens when Slashdot articles are not protected by DRM. You get dupes, lots of them!

    --
    w00t
  47. This is going to sound silly to some... by petrus4 · · Score: 1

    ...but I honestly believe that piracy has divine will behind it. That's why no matter what protection scheme or form of encryption is implemented, it always gets broken. It gets broken because the greater majority of the human population depends on it being broken.

    The GNU/advocates on this site need to understand something about me. I don't oppose you people because I oppose your underlying cause in many instances; quite the opposite. I oppose you because I feel that your leader and his second, Bradley Kuhn, are themselves authoritarian megalomaniacs...I also disagree with the level of fear I see among people within the FSF and its' supporters. I feel there needs to be a lot more faith expressed...faith in human beings, and faith in the concept that if the cause is just, its' justice will be self-evident and will prevail naturally for that reason.

    1. Re:This is going to sound silly to some... by thethibs · · Score: 1

      And I have a bridge you may be interested in buying.

      --
      I'm a Programmer. That's one level above Software Engineer and one level below Engineer.
    2. Re:This is going to sound silly to some... by Slashcrap · · Score: 1

      The GNU/advocates on this site need to understand something about me.

      That presupposes that they would care who you are and what you have to say. You might want to work on that part before asking people to read your incoherent, paranoid ramblings.

      I suggest that you commit suicide in some kind of horrific and interesting way in order to draw attention to your opinions.

    3. Re:This is going to sound silly to some... by petrus4 · · Score: 1

      Wow.

      It's been a while since I've been subjected to a level of vitriol with that degree of purity and intensity. I'm genuinely impressed.

      I'm reminded of the Emperor at the end of Return of the Jedi telling Luke to, "surrender to his hate." It sounds as though even if Luke didn't take that suggestion to heart, that you sure have. ;-)

    4. Re:This is going to sound silly to some... by petrus4 · · Score: 1

      One other thing. Irrespective of what you might think of me, one thing I would *never* do is tell someone to commit suicide. I would suggest for your own sake that you refrain from doing that in future as well, since if you make a habit of it there could well come a time when one of the people you tell to do that listens to you.

      If you're any sort of human being at all, the guilt that you would likely experience from that would be formidable...so you might want to try and avoid such a scenario.

      Also...if disagreeing with the party line on Linux earns me this kind of response, it can only lead me to conclude that maybe I'm actually *not* as paranoid as you claim after all...since said response is a fairly clear indication of how you feel towards people who express dissenting opinions.

    5. Re:This is going to sound silly to some... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you're any sort of human being at all, the guilt that you would likely experience from that would be formidable...so you might want to try and avoid such a scenario.

      A sociopath isn't going to feel guilt or remorse.

      Also...if disagreeing with the party line on Linux earns me this kind of response, it can only lead me to conclude that maybe I'm actually *not* as paranoid as you claim after all...since said response is a fairly clear indication of how you feel towards people who express dissenting opinions.

      You need to realize that just because someone posts on Slashdot doesn't make that person a free software advocate. A significant portion of the Slashdot population falls into the troll category, plain and simple.

      Regardless of that, I think your opinion is going to be in the minority. Even with people of faith, you'll often hear "God helps those who help themselves". If we all sat around trusting that a higher power would provide the outcomes we want, we'd be in for a lot of disappointment.

  48. HDDVD will win, but this is not the reason by Dion · · Score: 1

    Bluray has as you said an extra layer of gunk before you get to the content: B+

    As far as I can tell it's an extra bunch of code that can be used to further check the player for compliance before finally decrypting the AACS title key.

    That means that bluray is more complicated to play because you have to implement an extra virtual machine to fool the B+ code into thinking that it runs on a real player.

    The reason that HDDVD will win, is that it's easier to play for Open Source players and other user-loyal players.

    --
    -- To dream a dream is grand, but to live it is divine. -- Leto ][
  49. Re:Now the truth can be told... by MightyYar · · Score: 1

    "Hey, turn on JavaScript!"

    Um, yeah right...

    --
    W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
  50. not as usefull as it sounds by ILuvRamen · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I heard those discs can hold about 50GB so back them up all you want, you sure can't save more than a very few images. I'm not a big fan of disc to disc backups cuz the point is to back it up to a medium that isn't easily destroyed or scratched so maybe the best DRM is making the movie too big to save. Combine that with super-protection against players playing burned discs (or don't make a 'civilian' burner for the disc format at all) and movie pirating is over.

    --
    Google's Super Secret Search Algorithm: SELECT @search_results FROM internet WHERE @search_results = 'good'
  51. DOS attacks by MountainBoiler · · Score: 1
    Since they (PTB) can revoke certain keys, couldn't somebody attack a specific brand or model of player by simply finding its keys and publishing them so they get revoked?

    So somebody could squash PS3 and subsequently Blu-Ray by getting existing models' keys revoked? Repeatedly?

  52. Breakdown of the hack by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    For those who can't be bothered reading all the articles and threads (38 pages and counting). The application works by implementing acss to decrypt the data, it was written using the specifications found on the AACS website.

    The two things that are required to decrypt a dvd, a disk key (specific to a printing run of a disk) and a player key. Both have a revoke system in place.

    A disk key can be revoked by future disks you use in your player, the player must store a list of revoked disks, when you insert a new disk the revoke list must be updated. If the disk key was revoked it would cause consumer backlash as their disks would not work anymore, they could get everyone to replace their disks that could be a hassle. Keys for several movies have been found, some released. One flaw with this is If the disk key is found and is public It is still possible to use the backuphddvd to decrypt the disk.

    A player key can be revoked by not encrypting the disk with a compromised player key anymore. Once a player key is compromised all future disks will not work on that player but all current disks will still decode. A software player would need to be updated but this may not be possible if a player key for a hardware device is compromised. A key for windvd (japan) may have been found but not released yet. It is likely that this will be revoked and an update released.

    In post 691 are the keys for Serenity, King Kong, and 12 Monkeys. More are most likely found but not posted. They where found using windvd (japan as the english version is not yet released). It is likely that they also have the player key. There have been confirmations that it does work.

    There are a few problems with this hack, it does not work out of the box, instead you need to find a working volume or device key. It is not going to be fast finding ether key once they start revoking device and disk keys as each update of the player needs to be compromised. Also redistributing the keys could also become a problem, there would need to be a website that keeps track of keys for each printing of the disk, it could be a central website that the decrypted checks or a peer to peer system but it is something that would need to be worked out in the future. Another problem is you need the same disk as those people that finding them, there is no automated solution currently and they have a limited selection of disks.

  53. To contain the damage by tepples · · Score: 1

    And ince it's up on Usenet in full quality, what's the point of having DRM anyway?

    To prevent future releases from being uploaded to Usenet in the same way. DRM that revokes player keys that have been broken contains the damage caused by those broken keys.