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FBI Arrests Neteller Execs
Alcibaides writes "In a follow-up to the 2006 law attacking Internet gambling, the FBI arrested two former Neteller executives in 'connection with the creation and operation of an Internet payment services company that facilitated the transfer of billions of dollars of illegal gambling proceeds.' Apparently, the execs were 'ambushed' as they passed through the U.S. on connecting flights. Consequently, Neteller has dropped all gambling-related activity to U.S. customers, a move not expected for several months."
...the solution for these people who want to run a business like this is to never go to or trade within America. Ever.
What a sad state of affairs.
"It does not do to leave a live dragon out of your calculations, if you live near him." - Tolkien
Not only that, don't fly near US air space in case you are grounded due to an emergency.
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http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?sec=he
The U.S. Internet Gambling laws were only passed because British companies were dominating the market. If it the law was passed for moral reasons as its proponents (and much of the press) reported, then why not shut down Las Vegas too?
It shows how one sided the U.S. is when it comes to trade. Britain is a loyal (sickeningly loyal) friend of the U.S., and look how they get treated. With friends and enemies alike, the U.S. like thugs and wonders why it's become so unpopular.
BTW U.S. = government and big business. Not talking about your average Joe, who is as much a victim as everyone else.
As a former employee of Neteller, I've got to say that this is a pretty scary situation.
Neteller wasn't a sketchy operation being run in some warehouse. It employed over 500 people in Canada and paid taxes to the government here.
The company had a lot of dealings with various state governments in the US and had agreed to several restrictions long before the recent bill passed that made online gambling in the US completely illegal.
The firm employed nearly 100 software developers, many were consultants and contractors that were flown in from california. I'm sure that I'm not the only ex-employee now concerned about having to deal with the US government in the future.
because people who were criminals under US law passed through the United States?
They wont do anything. I have a friend who works for a poker book publishing company who have an online poker site. His boss has been warned by other people in the business, not to travel to the US because if they arrested him, there would be no help.
Seriously, Lefebvre is known here in Calgary (where he is from) for donating lots of money to various social causes and institutions. Now all he'll be donating is a lot of spare time to the US 'PMITA' system. What a shame that those backwards Americans are so high and mighty with their 'morals' and 'values' and what not. It's not like gambling is a huge crime either. Can't someone enjoy a night of online gambling in the privacy of their own home without big brother poking around? Where's the harm? If Lefebvre had been arrested here in Canada he would have got house arrest at the most. I'm sure he'll do some jail time in the states though. Sorry, it's not very often that Canada is good for too much. I have to flaunt it a bit.
For those of you screaming that the US is engaged in trade protection because they don't outlaw gambling completely I would like to point out a few things. The US is a republic composed of individual states which have more power and authority than our federal government. As a result of this 99% of all the vices (gambling, alcohol, etc..) are controlled at the state level. What this means is that in the US there are certain localities that have approved gambling, but many others (in fact the majority of the country) that doesn't allow it (much like alcohol, yes there are dry counties in the US).
As a result of trying to maintain state harmony, US federal laws have long held the position that gambling by wire is Illegal. This current law is just an extension of that long historic policy (existing since the days of the telegraph). Not only is this to appease the states and localities that don't allow gambling but it's also because gambling draws organized crime, and without heavy regulation (and even with it in some cases) cheating by the casinos becomes the norm.
So contrary to what you may think, if online gambling were legal in the US it would be absolutely dominated by the large corporations that run the casinos in Vegas. These casinos would JUMP at the chance to be involved in online gambling if they could (as 10 years ago they tried quite extensively to lobby congress to allow it), so any lobbying by the industry now is simply to allow a fair playground of enforcement of the US gambling by wire laws that already exist. Regulation of an enterprise historically and currently used as the single largest source of illegal money laundering isn't a bad thing, and you will have trouble getting sympathy from any significant percentage of US citizens who are bombarded by stories of lives destroyed by gambling addictions. And really, much like any crime, if you market your crime to citizens of another country and knowingly break that countries laws you need to be careful where you travel. For example, if I was going to go to China I wouldn't want to have ever been tied to anti-china activity as it would likely get me arrested. As another example, lets consider the south American drug lords, they don't bring drugs into the US personally nor do they in some cases do anything illegal in their own countries (at least that they are willing to prosecute them for), but many are sought for extradition to the US because they engage in an activity that creates crime in the US. In reality this is no different, as gambling online is unequivocally illegal in the US, but there are corporations and casinos engaged in actively breaking US law. Much like the drug lords they will pursue them for creating the market to violate US law although I doubt they will seek extradition of anyone.
Lets just be clear, it had nothing to do with Britain dominating the industry, it had everything to do with preserving the current laws by adapting them to the internet. The industry is a victim of it's own success, had it remained small there might have never been action by the US congress, and the FBI wouldn't be trying to make an example of someone to try to scare the rest of the industry into not being active participants in the breaking of US law.
Finally, it's apparent whoever arrested them didn't really know what was going on. They couldn't bring a case against the men simply for the fact that it would violate habeas corpus. With no current active role in the company (if true) their case won't go past the preliminary hearing.
When U.S. forces are stationed in foreign countries, they are usually subject to a Status Of Forces Agreement, which states which country has jurisdiction for which crimes. I don't know if we have a SOFA with the new Iraqi government, but if I had to guess, I would guess that we do, and any military member raping an Iraqi woman would be subject to the U.S. Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ).
Neteller is not a casino. It's an eWallet company that (as far as I understand) was not breaking any laws before the Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act (UIGEA) passed. It is listed in the London Stock Exchange.
The current issue (arrests of Neteller founders) is not really about gambling, they are not charged under the UIGEA. The charges are for money laundering. A quote from the press release:
I think the charges are bull, but at least they weren't stupid enough to go with the UIGEA charges. Also I think parent poster has his head up his ass. According to everyone but the US, Neteller was doing legitimate business (unlike Kazaa or AllOfMp3).
Of course many countries have long-arm statutes - however your examples are plain wrong.
Pinochet was charged by Spain for crimes against Spanish citizens living in Chile. Spain tried to have him extradited from the UK but failed. He returned to Chile where he died.
Milosevic was indicted by the United Nations International Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia for crimes against humanity and charges of violating the laws or customs of war and grave breaches of the Geneva Convention. The trial might have been in the Hague however the Netherlands was not the country prosecuting him.
So both these cases had very little to do with long-arm statutes.
I know that back in the 70's, when I flew from Vancouver to Melbourne, I spent about 6 hours in a locked terminal in Hawaii, waiting for my plane to come in for the next leg from Dallas or somewhere like that, and there was no thought of putting the pax through immigration - we were all just in transit, and so effectively we were treated as never having entered the country.
I understand that since September 11th, everyone going through the U.S. must pass customs and immigration, even if they are in transit only.
For example, in January 2002, I travelled from Vancouver to Hawaii, on a plane headed down under. They made all the Aussies/Kiwis get off the plane and pass through U.S. immigration with us, even though they were turning around and getting right back onto the exact same plane they had just got off.
I also understand that Mexicans, for example, can no longer travel to Canada with a stop-over in the U.S. without a proper U.S. visitor visa issued by the embassy, whereas prior to September 11th, they would stay in the holding areas that you speak of.
One thing that seperates Australia from the rest of the world is we don't pay income tax on gambling earnings. The only main cavert is as long as the winnings weren't gained as a professional gambler.
It makes it trival to do this in Australia.
Our recent poker champion took home $1 million AUD and didn't pay a cent in tax - World Series 2005.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Hachem
I'm not sure about his current status, he probably pays tax now given his elevated income and career changes.
Win/lose rations aren't determined by "rigging the decks", not in blackjack, poker, roulette, anything. They are determined by the rules of the game. There is NO need for any casino, live or online, to "rig" anything - the rules of the game dictate the house edge, and that's it. You don't make any corrections, you don't have to make anything "feel natural for the players" - that's just FUD in disguise. If a casino wants to make more money on Blackjack, they either get players to play more hands, for more money, or they alter the rules of the game (for instance, and a real-world example, start paying 6-5 on a Blackjack instead of 3-2). The law (for instance, of Antigua) says that a certain game (say Blackjack) should have a theoretical house edge of X% - that means that the online casino is not allowed to alter the rules too much, or they will not be allowed to keep their license. The law does not, and of course requires you not to, interfere with the randomness of the game, or let you make any "corrections".
Left something out there pard'.
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http://www.heritage.org/Research/InternationalOrg
"Both the Clinton Administration and the Bush Administration concluded that the ICC is a seriously flawed institution that the U.S. should not join. Regrettably, the Rome Statute establishing the ICC broke with long-standing international legal precedent by asserting ICC jurisdiction over nationals and military personnel from states that are not party to the treaty. This forced the U.S. to take unusual steps to protect its people from the ICC."
I could be wrong, but my understanding of the bill in question is that it makes the transfer of money by a financial institution for the purpose of online gambling illegal. Not the activity itself. Most of the breakdowns of the bill on poker forums (often by lawyers, sometimes not) arrived at the same conclusion.