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Canadian ISPs Send Thousands of Copyright Notices

Posted by Zonk on from the you-there-off-the-internets dept.

An anonymous reader writes "The CBC reports that Canadian Internet service providers are passing along thousands of copyright infringement notifications to their customers. These notices are coming, not from Canada, but from US copyright lobby groups such as the Business Software Alliance under a system called notice and notice. Michael Geist comments that unlike the U.S. takedown approach, the Canadian system is proving effective while protecting privacy and free speech. Downloaders take the hint, and alter their behavior before they receive a more serious letter in the mail."

39 of 184 comments (clear)

  1. First, how do they avoid these messages being ... by ArsenneLupin · · Score: 3, Interesting

    ... caught in the users' spamfilters?

  2. Altering behavior... by rovingeyes · · Score: 3, Insightful
    "Downloaders take the hint, and alter their behavior..."

    By altering behavior, if they mean using encryption, poxies, tor etc etc then it is a welcome change.

    1. Re:Altering behavior... by shmlco · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Have to wonder how this works in a "home" situation where the kid has download tons of crap in the basement and his parents get the notice. Bet there's some potential for "behavior alteration" there...

      --
      Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
    2. Re:Altering behavior... by daeg · · Score: 5, Funny

      That's what belts are for.

    3. Re:Altering behavior... by CABAN · · Score: 2, Funny

      I am Canadian. I received a notice from my ISP because my wife downloaded an MP3, something she rarely does because I subscribe to Napster.

      We altered our behavior by not doing it again. Piracy is theft.

    4. Re:Altering behavior... by gobbo · · Score: 2, Informative

      I am Canadian. I received a notice from my ISP because my wife downloaded an MP3, something she rarely does because I subscribe to Napster. We altered our behavior by not doing it again. Piracy is theft.

      Well, if you're canadian, and you've paid for cassette tapes or blank CD's, then you've paid a levy that goes back to artists (in theory and law). You can download mp3's, it ISN'T piracy, it's just like borrowing a CD from a friend to copy a song--it's allowed, and you're paying for it. You cannot, however, upload or redistribute that copy (which some software does by default). And even if you were engaging in copyright infringement, it certainly wouldn't be theft, since you are not claiming to be the author.

      If you're curious, here's the relevant section from section 8 of the copyright act:

      80. (1) Subject to subsection (2), the act of reproducing all or any substantial part of (a) a musical work embodied in a sound recording, (b) a performer's performance of a musical work embodied in a sound recording, or (c) a sound recording in which a musical work, or a performer's performance of a musical work, is embodied onto an audio recording medium for the private use of the person who makes the copy does not constitute an infringement of the copyright in the musical work, the performer's performance or the sound recording.
      --
      Damn those pesky terrorists
  3. Media fees by Joe+The+Dragon · · Score: 4, Interesting

    So what are the fees that people pay for media for?

    1. Re:Media fees by Bin+Naden · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So what are the fees that people pay for media for?

      Protection money.

      --
      There should be a "-1:Groupthink"
    2. Re:Media fees by stratjakt · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's not a fee, it's a tax. It is to compensate those industries hurt by piracy, not to give you a license to pirate.

      Your logic goes as follows:

      "tax money goes to womens relief shelters, I pay taxes, therefore I have the right to beat and rape women."

      --
      I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
    3. Re:Media fees by m0rph3us0 · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's not a tax, it is a levy.

      Because you can't levy an illegal activity with out a conviction they had to make personal copying of music legal.

      The levy currently applies to recording media for audio. I believe it is something like 15 cents per tape , and 25 cents per "Audio CD". Normal blank CDs for "data" are not covered by this levy.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Private_copying_levy# Canada

      It's already gone to court and in Canada P2P is legal for music.

      The rest of the IP spectrum is still off limits.

    4. Re:Media fees by --daz-- · · Score: 2, Interesting

      But the reality is more like this:

      Greedy Media Companies bilk consumers, consumers get angry and frustrated, turn to piracy to get the products they want, GMC's continue bilking, but now lobby Gov't for extra fees and taxes to recoup cost of piracy thus bilking consumers EVEN MORE and driving them to pirate more, etc, etc, etc...

      The GMC's have created an artificial problem because they have essentially monopolized content distribution and colluded to create a huge barrier to entry where a consumer's only choice becomes to buy, not to buy, or to pirate.

      Fortunately the Internet has helped with the Barrier to Entry problem, but, unfortunately, dramatically increased piracy.

      The GMC's could solve the problem of piracy very easily, while simultaneously increasing good will of consumers (and therefore number of purchases and therefore profits) but they simply choose not to -- instead content to bilk the consumer and punish them for considering any alternative.

    5. Re:Media fees by inoyb · · Score: 3, Informative

      The levy currently applies to recording media for audio. I believe it is something like 15 cents per tape , and 25 cents per "Audio CD". Normal blank CDs for "data" are not covered by this levy. Normal CDs are covered. In fact it's mentioned in the link you included. They're 21 cents.

      It's already gone to court and in Canada P2P is legal for music. The court case concluded that it was legal to download. It is still considered illegal to upload.
  4. Re:First, how do they avoid these messages being . by GiovanniZero · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I dunno but hopefully the subpoena will also be caught in the spam filter...and all the fines

    --
    Mod me up, mod me down, do your worst you modding clown.
  5. Altered Behavior by Apocalypse111 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Alter their behavior? Like installing Peer Guardian? Or maybe a Tor client? Or perhaps just opening up a WAP?

    What do these US lobby groups (note: not law enforcement agencies) think they can do against Canadian citizens?

    --
    There is no mod option "-1: Disagree" for a reason. "Overrated" is not an acceptable substitute. Post something instead.
    1. Re:Altered Behavior by phalkon30 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I see many people recommending Peer Guradian, but I question its usefulness. From past experience, it blocked many sites that I found useful, and tended not to block a whole lot else. Because it relies on user submited IP's. From their website: "How safe is PeerGuardian, really? Well, it is accurate in the sense that it blocks everything on your blocklist. It is impossible to know _all_ the addresses to block so while it will increase your safety to a good extent, it can never be perfect." IMO its like sticking your head in the sand and hoping noone sees you.

    2. Re:Altered Behavior by stratjakt · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Exact same thing they can do to American citizens. They could take you to court.

      This "US lobby group" shit is slashdot spin to whip you into an anti-US frenzy. Arrr how dare bush interfere!

      The BSA is an international group, and the BSA certainly had a presence in Canada when I lived there.

      --
      I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
    3. Re:Altered Behavior by MightyMartian · · Score: 2

      Except that, at the moment, people downloading music in Canada aren't breaking the law. This message is little more than empty harassment. It doesn't matter what kind of organization they are, they simply have no legal leg to stand on, so they can go piss off.

      --
      The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
  6. There Are More Important Things To Do by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    Canada could instead be more concerned about things that really affect people. Perhaps they could send troops to a place where terrorists have trained, election fraud has been widely believed to have happened, and attacks of mass destruction area fairly frequent. And while the mounties are in Florida, they may not be able to do much about the hurricanes, but they can enjoy some orange juice and sunshine!

    Dudley Do-Right for President!

  7. So much for the canadian slashdotter's stance by fotbr · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You know, the one where its legal to share files because they pay taxes.

    Then again, I also can't think of any country's borders the **AA actually respects. So welcome to the club.

  8. Ha Ha Ha.... by Bullfish · · Score: 4, Funny

    Come and get me RIAA! Sixty miles from town on highway, 25 miles via dirt road, 10 miles via dog sled, and 6 by snowshoe... fourth igloo on the left with the green satellite dish... oh, and windchill is -45 today, very balmy

    1. Re:Ha Ha Ha.... by corychristison · · Score: 3, Interesting

      If only we (Canadians) actually lived in igloo's, eh? The part about the weather is true though. Just sometime last week it was -45 in my area. Today it's -10 or so... Shorts and T-shirt weather for Canadians. :-)

      Judging from your post, I don't think you are Canadian. We use the metric system for large distances. But props on your post anyway! Was a good laugh when I needed it.

    2. Re:Ha Ha Ha.... by Bullfish · · Score: 3, Funny

      Translating for our American friends... I am as Canadian as Don Cherry, large bottles of Brador, flannel shirts, screech and Tim Horton's... I cried when the Victoriaville stick company burned down eh...

      Let them come visit up here in Lake Malaki Ontario north of Kenora... if they come in the summer, they will need a canoe to do the portages and a Deet heavy repellent

      Do you think I should tell them we are like... a whole separate country eh? Like the Dog the Bounty Hunter who came up here to find his profession was illegal, could be a culture shock eh...

  9. Re:Please post it by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    Notice Of Copyright Complaint - name - email - ip - mac We are writing to inform you that TELUS has received a complaint that alleges that your TELUS Internet Service account has been involved in copyright infringement. This complaint was traced back to your account based on the IP address used at the time of this activity. Please note that TELUS has not provided any of your personal account information to the complainant. It is TELUS' policy to disclose such information to a complainant only if ordered to do so by a court of law, which has not happened to date. We do, however, want you to be aware that this complaint was received by us and offer you the following information that may be of help to you: If you are unaware of this type of activity originating from your account, you may wish to inquire with others who have access to your account. If you are using a dial-up account, change the account password to ensure that only authorized users have access to it. You may also want to check your system for viruses, which may explain why this sort of activity is originating from your account. If you are not aware of our Acceptable Use Policy, which strictly prohibits use of our Service to infringe the copyrights of others, you may review at mytelus.com/internet. Please be aware that violation of this policy could result in disconnection of your Service. Below is an excerpt from the complaint that we received regarding your account. We include it in this notice in an effort to help you identify the activity that is in question. Karen TELUS Internet Services Internet Abuse Team abuse@telus.com http://www.telus.net/aup.html http://www.telus.net/policies * Please include the original email in any reply. ~~~ Excerpt from complaint: --- ------- Title: some movie Infringement Source: BitTorrent Initial Infringement Timestamp: 4 Mar 2004 05:11:41 GMT Recent Infringment Timestamp: 5 Mar 2004 03:04:13 GMT Infringer Username: Infringing Filename: blah blah blah Infringing Filesize: big Infringers IP Address: yep Infringers DNS Name: uh huh Infringing URL:

  10. Re:Ignore them by Dunbal · · Score: 5, Funny

    Ignore them... or bill them?

          Dear RIAA,

          It has come to my attention that you have accused me of illegally downloading file xxx, in an electronic letter received by you on xx/xx/2007. As a Canadian citizen I pay tax on recordable media so that you may be compensated for any losses incurred by downloads. I take it that you currently wish to alter this agreement, since you no longer wish for me to download your media.

          Therefore I enclose a bill for CDN $54 which is the amount of tax I have paid on the CD's I have purchased in these past 3 months. I can continue to bill you quarterly if you wish. I expect payment by certified cheque from a Canadian bank within 2 weeks of the date on this letter. Thank you!

    --
    Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
  11. Re:I thought this was serious until the last sente by gordgekko · · Score: 2, Informative

    Michael Geist is Canada's version of Lawrence Lessig.

    --
    You want to know who isn't running Firefox 2.x? They spell it "definately" and "rediculous".
  12. My letters from the ESA by My+Iron+Lung · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I've gotten two letters from the ESA in the last 6 months like this.. I don't think they hold a lot of water, they were sent to my ISP who forwarded them to me. My ISP was awfully nice, they offered a link to their site showing how to disable uploads on many popular P2P file sharing apps (made me laugh), covering damn near everything except BitTorrent. Now the first time they caught me was OK, I was downloading software I shouldn't have been, it scared me straight for about 15 minutes till I give it some serious consideration. The second one just made me laugh, it was for downloading an ISO of Starcraft (no cracks or anything, just the ISO), which I do have a legit copy and serial for but left my original copy at work.. Anyways, I'm rambling, but my only real point here is that the only one you should be afraid of is your ISP in cases like this. The ESA/RIAA/MPAA, whatever, holds little to no jurisdiction here in Canada (afaik noone in Canada has ever been convicted along these lines, please enlighten me if you've heard otherwise), but your ISP can easily give you the boot for violating their own terms of service.

    1. Re:My letters from the ESA by My+Iron+Lung · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Close, but no: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entertainment_Softwar e_Association Here's the first email I received: http://keeptalking.homelinux.net/esa.txt And this is the second: http://keeptalking.homelinux.net/esa2.txt

    2. Re:My letters from the ESA by HappyDrgn · · Score: 4, Informative

      Not sure how all ISPs handle this but a few years back when I would get these letters to the NOC at the provider I worked for we would send out one boiler plate mail to the customer letting them know we got the complaint along with a copy of the complaint and another to the **AA, BSA, etc acknowledging we received their letter and that we would not provide them any of the additional information they wanted without a court ordered subpoena. For each letter we would get the customer would also get a letter from us, mostly just as a heads up to the customer. We where a common carrier, and not obligated in anyway to act on these letters.

    3. Re:My letters from the ESA by the_humeister · · Score: 3, Funny

      You can play Starcraft at work??? Where do you work, and how do I apply?

  13. Re:I thought this was serious until the last sente by urbanriot · · Score: 2, Interesting

    This might seem crazy or funny to you, but it's completely true. This tactic is to scare the casual downloader and it works. I've had numerous friends receive these letters in the past and they'd completely altered their download patterns ranging from installing RIAA/MPAA/BSA filtering software (such as Peerguardian) all the way up to stopping completely and removing all pirate software from their computer. Maybe to the more enlightened user this might sound crazy, or perhaps to those that haven't received these letters, but to most people receiving an official looking letter that's singling you out for software piracy... it can be a little worrisome.

  14. Re:First, how do they avoid these messages being . by rikkards · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I got one from Rogers for downloading a copy of Flight Sim X that I wanted to check out before buying. It was an email they got from the BSA. It had the specific IP, DNS name and torrent I was downloading from. Freaked the wife out but whatever. Normally my bittorrent behaviour is downloading tv shows i.e ones that Rogers PVR decided not to tape or to get widescreen version of shows that are displayed only in 4:3 like BSG but I wanted to see how Microsoft's new version fared.

    The result of my trial was that I am not buying FSX as it runs too slow on the hardware I have and it isn't that much better than FS 2004.

  15. ...then open up the online viewing of past episode by MikeOrr · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I'm not going to get into the topic of sending notices via ISPs... one thing from that news article that caught my eye, was the mention of NBC/Universal sending a notice, because they felt someone was downloading a TV show episode.

    Well, on NBC.com most/all (I haven't checked every show) offers you to watch the entire episode the very next day of airing, for free.

    But not for Canadians (and I assume anyone outside of the US). Instead, we get "We're sorry, but the clip you selected isn't available from your location." - what's the point of this artificial restriction? If you're making it available for free to some people, why not everyone? If NBC.com won't make it available, then why shouldn't I be able to just download the episode via BitTorrent? If I have a PVR so I can tape a show and watch it later (skipping all commercials), why shouldn't I be able to just download the show and watch it later?

  16. Why Email and not a little blurb on monthly bill? by a1mint · · Score: 2, Funny

    Email? Woof, the wife won't see that one, relief... I don't even use the crappy email accounts of Crogers or Chimpatico. Perhaps they should include a suspected illegal activity rating/score on the monthly bill - the wife *would* notice *that*. They could base it on funny-port-use ratio or something. They could take the number of gigabytes uploaded/downloaded through ports they think are not used for "legitimate use", and translate it through a formula and provide a "whole-some" rating. 0 'd be 0% chance you're doing anything illegal. This is the person that only reads and writes email, visits ordinary websites like cnn and cbc. This person should downgrade to a basic account - no need for 5+ Mb/s speeds here. ISP will not want that... 10 'd be someone who visits porn sites. 20 'd be someone who runs the odd limewire. 50 'd be someone who runs bittorrent to do stuff, whatever stuff. 75 'd be someone who runs bittorrent 24/7 with an average of 25 KB/s (Rogers mames connection speeds, forget about 300+MB/s downloads, it aint happening no more). 100 'd be someone who looks like he's running a freenet node, and imminently faced the rcmp running down the front door on a sunday morning. We might as well move to China - it'd be a freeer nation over there...

  17. obSimpsons by Rob+T+Firefly · · Score: 3, Funny

    Is that the Apu school of threats? "Hey! I have asked you nicely not to mangle my merchandise. You leave me no choice but to... ask you nicely again."

    --
    Slashdot Burying Stories About Slashdot Media Owned
  18. Post: Rogers/BayTSP by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    Dear XXXXXXXXXX

    Rogers Cable (Rogers) has received a notice stating that activities associated with your IP address are infringing copyright in material(s) owned or exclusively licensed by others.

    The full notice is appended to this e-mail below.

    Under section 4(d) of the Rogers Yahoo! Hi-Speed Internet End User Agreement (EUA) and Acceptable Use Policy (AUP), you are prohibited from using the Rogers Yahoo! Hi-Speed Internet service to engage in illegal activities, including activities that infringe copyright. Copies of our EUA and AUP are available at:

    http://na.edit.client.yahoo.com/rogers/show_static ?.form=terms&.intl=ca

    Where there has been a violation of our EUA and/or AUP, including the unauthorized distribution of copyright-protected material, Rogers has the right to take appropriate action against you.

    If you have any questions about the attached copyright notice, please contact the sender of the notice using the contact information provided in the notice. Please do not reply to this e-mail.

    We trust you will comply with our policies and all applicable laws in using the Rogers Yahoo! Hi-Speed Internet service.

    Rogers EUA Management Team
    Sincerely,

    EUA Management Team
    Rogers Yahoo Hi-Speed Internet

    http://na.edit.client.yahoo.com/rogers/show_static ?.form=terms

    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
    Hash: SHA1

    Notice ID: XX-XXXXXXX
    XX XXX XXXX XX:XX:XX GMT

    Rogers Cable

    Dear Sir or Madam:

    BayTSP, Inc. ("BayTSP") swears under penalty of perjury that Paramount Pictures Corporation ("Paramount") has authorized BayTSP to act as its non-exclusive agent for copyright infringement notification. BayTSP's search of the protocol listed below has detected infringements of Paramount's copyright interests on your IP addresses as detailed in the attached report.

    BayTSP has reasonable good faith belief that use of the material in the manner complained of in the attached report is not authorized by Paramount, its agents, or the law. The information provided herein is accurate to the best of our knowledge. Therefore, this letter is an official notification to effect removal of the detected infringement listed in the attached report. The Berne Convention for the Protection of Literary and Artistic Works, the Universal Copyright Convention, as well as bilateral treaties with other countries allow for protection of client's copyrighted work even beyond U.S. borders. The attached documentation specifies the exact location of the infringement.

    We hereby request that you immediately remove or block access to the infringing material, as specified in the copyright laws, and insure the user refrains from using or sharing with others Paramount's materials in the future (see, 17 U.S.C. 512).

    Further, we believe that the entire Internet community benefits when these matters are resolved cooperatively. We urge you to take immediate action to stop this infringing activity and inform us of the results of your actions. We appreciate your efforts toward this common goal.

    Please respond indicating the actions you have taken to resolve this matter. The provided link has been assigned to this matter http://webreply.baytsp.com/webreply/webreply.jsp?c ustomerid=XX&commhash=XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX XXXX. For email correspondence, please reference the above Notice ID in the subject line mai

  19. We're way to nice by CiRu5 · · Score: 4, Funny

    "unlike the U.S. takedown approach, the Canadian system is proving effective while protecting privacy and free speech. Downloaders take the hint, and alter their behavior before they receive a more serious letter in the mail."

    RIAA: Don't download that

    Us: Ok, sorry

    Man up fellow Canadians :)

    --
    "Some of the worst mistakes in my life have been haircuts." - Jim Morrison
  20. Re:Please post it by QuickFox · · Score: 3, Informative
    With the original formatting magically restored (except some blank lines removed):

    Notice Of Copyright Complaint - name - email - ip - mac

    We are writing to inform you that TELUS has received a complaint that alleges that your TELUS Internet Service account has been involved in copyright infringement. This complaint was traced back to your account based on the IP address used at the time of this activity.

    Please note that TELUS has not provided any of your personal account information to the complainant. It is TELUS' policy to disclose such information to a complainant only if ordered to do so by a court of law, which has not happened to date.

    We do, however, want you to be aware that this complaint was received by us and offer you the following information that may be of help to you:

    If you are unaware of this type of activity originating from your account, you may wish to inquire with others who have access to your account.

    If you are using a dial-up account, change the account password to ensure that only authorized users have access to it.

    You may also want to check your system for viruses, which may explain why this sort of activity is originating from your account.

    If you are not aware of our Acceptable Use Policy, which strictly prohibits use of our Service to infringe the copyrights of others, you may review at mytelus.com/internet. Please be aware that violation of this policy could result in disconnection of your Service.

    Below is an excerpt from the complaint that we received regarding your account. We include it in this notice in an effort to help you identify the activity that is in question.

    Karen

    TELUS Internet Services
    Internet Abuse Team
    abuse@telus.com
    http://www.telus.net/aup.html
    http://www.telus.net/policies

    * Please include the original email in any reply.

    ~~~

    Excerpt from complaint:
    ---
    -------
    Title: some movie
    Infringement Source: BitTorrent
    Initial Infringement Timestamp: 4 Mar 2004 05:11:41 GMT
    Recent Infringment Timestamp: 5 Mar 2004 03:04:13 GMT
    Infringer Username:
    Infringing Filename: blah blah blah
    Infringing Filesize: big
    Infringers IP Address: yep
    Infringers DNS Name: uh huh
    Infringing URL:
    --
    Terrorists can't threaten a country's freedom and democracy. Only lawmakers and voters can do that.
  21. Service terminated due to false accusation? by necro2607 · · Score: 2

    I received a report just like this article refers to, from my ISP. The thing is, the infringment report indicated that I was sharing a foreign-language version of a Hollywood movie, which I absolutely 100% had never done. They had the correct software I had been using (for downloading files OTHER THAN movies), correct IP and filesharing-network-user-ID, but I have NEVER downloaded the movie that I was being "reported" for, nor have I ever shared it or anything even resembling it (or any other movies, actually).

    So, my question is, what would happen if my ISP disconnected me because of this? There are really only two main ISPs around here, and the other one is definitely not desireable. Because some automated bot made up a completely false "infringement" report, I could lose net connectivity? Am I no longer allowed to use p2p software even if what I'm downloading is legally OK to download?

    "If you are not aware of our Acceptable Use Policy, which strictly prohibits use of our Service to infringe the copyrights of others, you may review at mytelus.com/internet. Please be aware that violation of this policy could result in disconnection of your Service"

    What about alleged and unsubstantiated violation of this policy? What about when a bot sends mostly-correct infringement notices, but there was NO actual copyright infringement occuring? How can the ISP know whether anything illegal actually occured?

    Just because they know my IP, username and user ID and then add the name of a hollywood movie with a .AVI at the end, doesn't mean there's ANY truth to the report. This really really bothers me, because I pay for high speed access and have been a customer of this company for years, but could magically have my services cut off permanently with them because of incorrect, falsified and effectively fabricated copyright infringement notices!

  22. This strikes me as odd by thewils · · Score: 2, Interesting

    So will Rogers, for example, be sending letters to themselves for stuff that's hosted on their own Usenet servers?

    --
    Once I was a four stone apology. Now I am two separate gorillas.