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Intel to Sample Flash-killer PRAM This Year
Station writes "Intel's new phase-change memory technology (PRAM) will begin sampling this year. Samsung, IBM, and Hitachi are all working on phase-change memory as a successor to flash as it has a lower (~20ns) read latency than flash (50-90ns). 'Intel says they plan to ship the first PRAM modules as a straight-ahead NOR flash replacement so that they can work the kinks out of the design before trying to move it up the memory hierarchy. The company claims a much higher number of read-write cycles (100 million) than flash, as well as a potential 10 years' worth of data retention. NOR flash is typically used as program storage memory for mobile devices like cell phones, while more durable but slower NAND flash is used for mass storage in devices like the iPod nano.'"
Killer Pram? Won't somebody think of the children!!
one of the later steps in fixing technical glitches in mac systems is to zap the pram..
.. one fixes your computer, the other breaks your flash device..
imagine the confusion between 2 friends when one says "i zapped my pram"
VLC FOR MAC IS DYING! IF YOU DEVELOP, PLEASE SAVE IT!!
Geez, twenty-five years of Parameter RAM and the name gets to mean something else like *snaps fingers* that. There oughta be a law.
It's like when "frontside" became "backside" </old_skater_grumble>
In the UK, "pram" means a baby stroller.
Fortunately the rest of the industry is calling it PCM for Pulse-code modulation^w^wPhase-change memory.
Will it be cheaper per megabyte than current NOR flash?
Will it mean that devices like mobile phones (or devices like the Lego Mindstorms which also stores programs/data on NOR flash) can have more memory space in them?
I really wish they would stack it in 3D to get humonguous memories, f.ex. like this:
http://memory.oyhus.no/
I kind of got tired of these product-or-technology killer... most of them aren't killer at all and those that manage to get a decent marketshare or acceptance over the "killed" one do it just because the old one gets old... kind of same way smoking kills - it might or you just might die anyway.
speed or latency.. (and what about heat exchange issues?)
even with considerably slow throughput though.. it might be have useful applications in storage media..
i'd love to replace a set of hot spinning platters with a tiny cartridge about the size of a gamecube memory card.
VLC FOR MAC IS DYING! IF YOU DEVELOP, PLEASE SAVE IT!!
Isn't that one of the Mac repair myths? Repairing permissions and PRAM resetting are two things that are often recommended even though it usually doesn't fix anything. I haven't heard of anything that was fixed by doing either.
Do they like to push it a lot?
34486853790
Connection too slow for X forwarding? Try "ssh -CX user@host"
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
well.. i had it recently fix a fan that wouldn't shut up even after a reboot (it got stuck on max after roughly 3 months of uptime)...
(of course it could also have been the PMU reset i did while i was at it)
VLC FOR MAC IS DYING! IF YOU DEVELOP, PLEASE SAVE IT!!
Flash is now fairly cheap, it's in widespread use and it's a known quantity. Good luck trying to replace it.
Only 10 years? Are these things going to have a rejuvenate button?
Libertarian Leaning Political Discussion Forum.
Generally speaking, cost will be similar to NOR flash, if volume manufacturing picks up, and especially if Intel, Samsung, and other biggies get into the act. The key questions to ask are reliability/life of data and speed (and power consumption, if it is drastically different). From Intel's claims, reliability (or longevity) of data looks amazing for PRAM, but speed is still an unanswered question... both read and write speeds.
My other lay question is how Intel and others are managing this chalc* glass manufacturing in their usual silicon DRAM process. Is this glass fused/bonded to silicon or something?
Resetting the PMU often does fix things. I had a machine that was overheating after about an hour of use and then crashing. Resetting the PMU made it turn the fans on at the correct time and keep working.
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
Customer: (goes to door, runs his finger down the list of adverts) Pram for sale. Any offers. I'd like a bit of pram please.
Shopkeeper: Ah yes, sir. That's in good condition.
Customer: Oh good, I like them in good condition, eh? Eh?
I hope this doesn't kill ATMEL, I really like their AVR microcontrollers. That would be sad.
It's not wasting time, I'm educating myself.
"rhetoric": a label used by the intellectually dishonest to dismiss valid points which they are incapable of countering.
Now, I'm no poly-tician, but that there's rhetoric, ain't it?
Please stop stalking me, bro.
imagine the confusion between 2 friends when one says "i zapped my pram"
No sig for you. YOU GET NO SIG!
NAND is faster and less reliable. NOR is slower and more reliable.
The article mentions that the period for data retention is 10 years with PRAM, which seems to be about the same as what's claimed for writable discs (the ones with organic dye.) I was under the impression that flash memory could retain data for a longer period of time? How long can flash memory hold data until it mysteriously disappears?
It can be up to 20 years under ideal conditions. Flash that's been erased many times will have a shorter data retention time, as will Flash stored at higher temperatures. A Google search on Flash Data Retention will lead to many pages from various semiconductor companies discussing the performance of their particular parts. There's a nice easy-to-read table in this document:e tentn_AN_A0.pdf
http://www.spansion.com/application_notes/EndureR
[cue operatic voice]
I get to push the pramalot...?
Never liked flash anyway
what ? you say it's memory?
OH, nevermind
First it is the jpeg killer and now it is FLASH killer. Any use of the term "killer" in a headline is a joke. Ok so Intel introduces PRAM, but at what price point? Flash is surly going to drop in price. For any *real-life* application - does it really matter? Probably not. So is a manufacture going to choose a lower priced Flash memory chip or a new and more expensive PRAM memory chip? It speed was the only concern everyone would be attaching serial attached SCSI hard drive to their computers. The gamers - the speed demons - cant even get serial attached SCSI in their high end pre-built machines(alien wear). As with everything it is cost per megabyte, performance per dollar, and Watts per hour. Flash will be around for a long time. PS3 was going to be the dominant player in the console market and what happened? Zune was the iPod killer, where does Microsoft rank in the MP3 player market? It is not like this is a new technology in a general sense (to the average consumer), to be announced as "killer" it must be a new technology that will instantly replace all existing technology in that particular nitch. DLP/LCD tabletop TVs were the "RPTV CRT killer". CRT based RPTVs vanished overnight.
How about density; can I get more or less space with the same physical size?
Obviously I'd like to see something with more capacity than flash.
Yes, please help protect Young Sebastion!!!11one
A couple of points. 1) Phase Change memory chips are already commercially available from BAE. One of the advantages of PCM not mentioned in the Intel announcement is radiation tolerance. BAE has been selling PCM for space applications since last summer. Rumor is they cannot keep up with demand. See: http://www.baesystems.com/Newsroom/NewsReleases/20 06/autoGen_10703020214.html
2) All of the memory manufacturers are licensing the basic tech from Energy Conversion Devices. It all derives from Stan Ovshinsky's patent number 5,166,758 more than a decade ago. Check it out.
Disclosure: I own some ECD stock.
Dag
I've been waiting for this to finally come out, as noted in some of my other slashdot comments. Not onyl does this have better latency, but the write/read cycles are exponentially larger, in the trillions range, cmopared to maybe 250,000-500,000 of Flash. Perfect for making storage drives with, and it's small, uses mostly pre-existing fabrication techniques, and once production ramps up it'll be CHEAP!
Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.