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Researchers Prove Existence Of New Type Of Electron Wave

Posted by ScuttleMonkey on from the welle-of-information dept.

ScienceDaily is reporting that physicists at the University of New Hampshire have discovered the existence of a new type of electron wave on metal surfaces. "The acoustic surface plasmon, which will have implications for developments in nano-optics, high-temperature superconductors, and the fundamental understanding of chemical reactions on surfaces. [...] 'The existence of this wave means that the electrons on the surfaces of copper, iron, beryllium and other metals behave like water on a lake's surface,' says Diaconescu, a postdoctoral research associate in the Condensed Matter Group of the physics department at UNH. 'When a stone is thrown into a lake, waves spread radially in all directions. A similar wave can be created by the electrons on a metal surface when they are disturbed, for instance, by light.'"

60 comments

  1. told you so by User+956 · · Score: 1, Flamebait

    Researchers Prove Existence Of New Type Of Electron Wave

    A ha... so that's how they accomplished that perpetual energy machine.

    --
    The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
  2. From TFA by Silver+Sloth · · Score: 4, Funny

    If this is the case, it is a great advantage that it is now possible to study the plasmons on surfaces, where they is much easier to probe them than inside the material. I'm sure it are.
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    1. Re:From TFA by moosesocks · · Score: 1

      I read that, and all I can think of is "lolcats"

      sigh...

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  3. Re:Obvious? by MadUndergrad · · Score: 1

    Ah, RingTFA tells me it's the former. I suppose that's what I get.

  4. Big Claims by Nom+du+Keyboard · · Score: 0, Troll
    which will have implications for developments in nano-optics, high-temperature superconductors, and the fundamental understanding of chemical reactions on surfaces

    Does it also defeat cancer, cure the common cold, disintegrate warts, and eliminate smelly feet? It seems like a lot of big claims are being made for something just discovered.

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    1. Re:Big Claims by jimbug · · Score: 1

      "Acoustic surface plasmons have long been predicted on merely theoretical grounds, their existence has been extraordinarily difficult to prove experimentally." Maybe that's why they have such high hopes.

      --
      Bite my shiny metal ass.
    2. Re:Big Claims by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Does it also defeat cancer

      Only in best two out of three.

    3. Re:Big Claims by grasshoppa · · Score: 4, Informative

      Does it also defeat cancer, cure the common cold, disintegrate warts, and eliminate smelly feet? It seems like a lot of big claims are being made for something just discovered.

      They've had theories for a while, and the theories indicate that some of the properties may be useful for these things. Now that they have established them as fact AND can reproduce them in a lab environment, they can determine if their guesses ( I would put any one of the researchers guesses against a million of yours ) are in any way accurate.

      Science; Gotta love it

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    4. Re:Big Claims by glitch23 · · Score: 0

      Does it also defeat cancer, cure the common cold, disintegrate warts, and eliminate smelly feet? It seems like a lot of big claims are being made for something just discovered.

      In many cases, theory leads experimental evidence so when experiments backup theory (and especially theory already being applied in other areas) the results of the experiments and their implications are already expected due to the implications provided by the theory. It was at least a decade I believe after Einstein's equations dictated that gravitational lensing should happen that Eddington traveled to the Pacific to witness a solar eclipse and was able to conduct an experiment that finally proved what Einstein's equations already told us.

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    5. Re:Big Claims by kestasjk · · Score: 0, Troll

      Scientists are definitely not known for playing down discoveries, but it is reassuring that it's a university and not a company.

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    6. Re:Big Claims by GanjaManja · · Score: 2, Interesting

      you may take notice that the 3 (yes only three) regions of interest they suggest the finding may have some merit within, are not exactly the "cures cancer!" type of hyped-up fields. If they'd said "it will make quantum computing possible and proves string theory" then I could see what you're saying...

      it certainly does have implications in photonics. a member of my research group will find this very interesting as she's dealing with surface plasmons and their interactions with 1550 nm light, and this shows a method with which to actually measure the plasmons themselves, as opposed to performing a whole lot of inference.

    7. Re:Big Claims by ace1317 · · Score: 1

      and it's the same physical phenomenon as light induced surface plasmons, which people have been using for quite some time, and is even being used in some commerically available systems (Biacore, for example).

    8. Re:Big Claims by hywel_ap_ieuan · · Score: 2, Informative

      it certainly does have implications in photonics. a member of my research group will find this very interesting as she's dealing with surface plasmons and their interactions with 1550 nm light,

      That wavelength is used for long-distance fiber connectivity in big, fast, expensive router cards, the kind that telcos and ISPs use. Think 10Gbps up to 80km without repeaters (Take a look at some of these Cisco links for gory details.) The possibility that this development could lead to cheaper or more efficient lasers on that wavelength is good news.

    9. Re:Big Claims by geekoid · · Score: 1

      no, almost all Scientist are conservative by nature, They often play down discoveries.

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    10. Re:Big Claims by glitch23 · · Score: 0

      Just wanted to set the record straight for those who may use this info as reference later on. Eddington traveled to the island of Principe off the coast of Africa (not the Pacific like I said before). Also, it occurred in 1919, 4 years after Einstein finished his general relativity equations. There was actually another team involved in the measurements who traveled to Brazil to witness the same solar eclipse. They compared their findings with their base set of photographs taken earlier to determine that gravitational lensing really does occur when light travels near a massive object.

      --
      this nation, under God, shall have a new birth of freedom. -- Lincoln, Gettysburg Address
  5. AHhhhh!!! Now all the speaker wire guys.... by Fallen+Kell · · Score: 1

    ...who have said that their speaker cable is designed to minimize "skin effect" have some science behind them. It has only take +20 years of this being touted as "science" in the speaker cable industry. Now there is some real science behind it.

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    1. Re:AHhhhh!!! Now all the speaker wire guys.... by foos_guy · · Score: 1

      ...who have said that their speaker cable is designed to minimize "skin effect" have some science behind them. It has only take +20 years of this being touted as "science" in the speaker cable industry. Now there is some real science behind it.

      FTA:

      ..."When a stone is thrown into a lake, waves spread radially in all directions. A similar wave can be created by the electrons on a metal surface when they are disturbed, for instance, by light." Skin Effect

      Seems like completely a different properties/behaviour, but, correct me if I'm wrong...
    2. Re:AHhhhh!!! Now all the speaker wire guys.... by GigsVT · · Score: 1

      The skin effect always was real. It's just irrelevant with small (i.e. less than an inch across) conductors at audio frequency range.

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    3. Re:AHhhhh!!! Now all the speaker wire guys.... by SlowDancing · · Score: 3, Funny

      A similar wave can be created by the electrons on a metal surface when they are disturbed, for instance, by light.

      New for 2008! 100% optically opaque insulation prevents distortion of your signal from ambient photon fields.

  6. Woot by zoomshorts · · Score: 1

    The SKIN effect , big deal , just because you cannot feel or hear
    the effect , does not mean it does not exist. Frequency people.

    1. Re:Woot by salec · · Score: 2, Informative

      Skin effect is effectively, in a nutshell, variation of conductor's resistance as function of signal's frequency. Strictly speaking, it ought to make harmonic distortions. However, this effect is quite negligible in signals whose frequencies are in audio spectrum.

      OTOH, there are people who can positively recognize the difference by listening. Obvious conclusion is that our theory of auditory experience is incomplete in some way. There is something somewhere we've chosen not to look.

      My first bet was on signal phase shift, as frequency response has been thoroughly "ironed straight" even more then is necessary, according to our tests. Fourier analysis can break down periodic signals into

      Another possibility is that we have neglected the fact that our auditory sensors - "hair cells" may have more then one mode of resonance: since they are basically little mechanical oscillators, they could probably resonate on overtones, too. Therefore, it could be possible for a human to hear certain discrete ultrasound frequencies as well, although much attenuated.

    2. Re:Woot by salec · · Score: 2, Informative

      Sorry, I had a large pause in the middle of writing the post. Unfinished sentence in the middle was meant to become: "Fourier analysis can break down periodic signals into harmonic components, but mixing all the ingredients back in may produce quite different signal envelope. That fact is deliberately used in DSP to simplify calculations."

    3. Re:Woot by FuzzyDaddy · · Score: 1
      Skin effect is effectively, in a nutshell, variation of conductor's resistance as function of signal's frequency. Strictly speaking, it ought to make harmonic distortions.

      It distort the equalization - higher frequencies will be attenuated more than lower ones - but it's a linear phenomenum, so it won't introduce harmonic distortion or intermodulation.

      --
      It's not wasting time, I'm educating myself.
  7. Makes intuitive sense by MECC · · Score: 1

    This actually makes intuitive sense, when think about the eddy currents that I've heard exist within a conductor's cross section - why a circular conductor works better that a rectangular conductor.

    --
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    - E.M. Cioran
  8. "new" electron wave? by Quarters · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Somehow I doubt the wave is new. It's only our understanding of it that is new.

    1. Re:"new" electron wave? by Markus+Registrada · · Score: 4, Informative

      Somehow I doubt the wave is new. It's only our understanding of it that is new. If you RTFA, you find that what's new is actually detecting evidence of it. Evidence is often (alas, not always) important in science.
    2. Re:"new" electron wave? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I wonder what we breathed before Priestly discovered whatever it was that he discovered... maybe we would have been better off had he not.

      The gp was pointing out that the wave is not "new". It is just recently discovered. The gp and I both put $ on it being here since the word go. The title of the article probably could have dropped "new" and been correct.

  9. Sorry, Not New by YetAnotherBob · · Score: 3, Informative

    Scientific American covered this in an article 2 months ago. (print version yet!)

    It is cool though. There may be some nice tech possibilities here. The SA article mentioned higher density HDDs and some chip interface effects. Maybe even a direct optical/electronic interface. Still, the work was done over a year ago. Reports have been coming in. Just not a new report here.

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    1. Re:Sorry, Not New by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I think they should have written an article on how something INTERESTING HAPPENED IN NEW HAMPSHIRE... hahaha

    2. Re:Sorry, Not New by kmac06 · · Score: 1

      It's being published in Nature today. That means there's something new going on here.

    3. Re:Sorry, Not New by theckhd · · Score: 1

      Not necessarily. The turnaround time between submission and publication of a paper in Nature can be on the order of several months. I haven't read the Scientific American article the GP is referring to, but it's entirely possible that they were reporting on the same experiment. It's common to give talks at professional conferences after the paper has been submitted and accepted, but before it's actually been published. Scientific American may have based their article on the proceedings from such a conference.

  10. Amazing Karnak Answers "The Plasmon" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    What state of matter was discovered by a rasta?

  11. 20 year old news? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Can anyone explain what's new here? My 20-year old text book on surface physics talks about
    surface plasmons, and I heard about acoustic (bulk) plasmons in my undergrad studies min the mid-90:s.

    What's new, the existence of acoustic plasmons at surfaces?

    I, who have a PhD in surface physics don't care, so I think 99.99% of even slashdot, don't care.

    1. Re:20 year old news? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The experimental evidence is new?

    2. Re:20 year old news? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ha ha, is this a new slashdot meme? If you don't think so, I, who may or may not have a phd, don't care.

    3. Re:20 year old news? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I, for one, welcome our new non-caring PhD-bearing overlords.

    4. Re:20 year old news? by Cervantes · · Score: 1

      I, who have a PhD in surface physics ... So, how's life as Lead Fry Cook at McDonalds?
      (I kid, I kid)...
      --
      If I knew the wedgies I gave you back in 6th grade would have resulted in this . . . I might have taken a moments pause.
    5. Re:20 year old news? by Walt+Dismal · · Score: 1
      I find it interesting that Ivor Catt discussed surface plasmons in capacitors in 1978: http://www.ivorcatt.org/icrwiworld78dec1.htm

      In column one of his article he states: "Electric current enters the capacitor through a wire and then spreads out across the surface of the plate in the same way as ripples flow out from a stone dropped in a pond."

      What's my point on this? Well, it's known in audio design that the design and construction of capacitors radically affects quality of the sound signals. There are hearable differences in performance of coupling capacitors. Perhaps consideration of surface plasmons from a capacitor materials science standpoint could lead to better capacitors for high-end audio.

  12. Continued Diaconescu... by autophile · · Score: 3, Funny

    'When a stone is thrown into a lake, waves spread radially in all directions. A similar wave can be created by the electrons on a metal surface when they are disturbed, for instance, by light.'

    Continued Diaconescu, 'This is sure to make a splash in the community. Our detractors have been trying to sink our efforts, and have been making waves at the conferences about this effect not being real, but this will certainly throw them in the deep end. The real lifesaver, though, will be our refined dataset, which is in stark contrast to our previous watered-down set. They will drown in the data.'

    --
    Towards the Singularity.
  13. Don't mix martial arts movies with research by syousef · · Score: 1

    "Be like water"
    http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Bruce_Lee

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    1. Re:Don't mix martial arts movies with research by fractoid · · Score: 1

      "Float like a butterfly, swim like a bee." - not Mohommad Ali

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  14. The real question... by Enderandrew · · Score: 1

    Can I also install Linux on this new electron wave?

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    1. Re:The real question... by IdleTime · · Score: 1

      Plasmon-0.1.0.ebuild can be found over at forums.gentoo.org...

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  15. Mayby it's the other way around by Bigg+Matt · · Score: 1

    maybe water surfaces behave like electrons.

  16. I did this in 1999 by EmagGeek · · Score: 1

    I modeled surface plasmons on PEC surfaces in 1999 using dirac-delta plane-waves and FDTD analysis. In fact, I think there has been a lot of research in using physical optics methods to better enhance numerical modeling of EM scattering and surface waves. The military has been conducting research in RCS reduction by using these methods to characterize how incident pulse radars set up radiating fields on surfaces.

    Absolutely nothing new here. Most of this stuff is in Junior-level EM texts.

    1. Re:I did this in 1999 by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I agree that the existence of such surface waves is completely expected. -- So calling it a new kind of electron wave is way off. Practical applications of this phenomenon is another matter. So far they just showed - uhhh -- yeah --- we can see something if we're really careful.

  17. A disturbance... by Anpheus · · Score: 4, Funny

    I sense a great disturbance in the force, as if millions of electrons cried out in waves, and were silenced by destructive interference.

  18. Disturbed by light... by ignavus · · Score: 1

    "A similar wave can be created by the electrons on a metal surface when they are disturbed, for instance, by light."

    I get disturbed by light too - like when I am asleep and someone turns on the light.

    But I don't usually wave, I am more likely to punch.

    --
    I am anarch of all I survey.
  19. Re:Obvious? by ILuvRamen · · Score: 0

    I'll do you one better and ask...would light hitting a metal and causing electrons to move be the most obvious solar panel ever? Must not be very efficient or they'd be using that already.

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  20. Chemicals, optics, electromagnetics... nuclear ? by Jesrad · · Score: 2

    "The acoustic surface plasmon, which will have implications for developments in nano-optics, high-temperature superconductors, and the fundamental understanding of chemical reactions on surfaces."

    What about the understanding of nuclear reactions on metal surfaces ?

    --
    Maybe we deserve this world ?
  21. Plasmon... yum yum by hashwolf · · Score: 1

    Gee, before reading this I used to think that Plasmon was some type of baby food. http://www.plasmon.it/

    --
    - "They misunderestimated me."
    1. Re:Plasmon... yum yum by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Here was me thinking it was a storage company.

  22. Semper fidelis by deetsay · · Score: 1

    Are these dual meanings are some kind of tradition with baby food makers? http://www.semper.fi/

    --
    "The looser the waistband, the deeper the quicksand", or so I have read.
  23. 20 year old news? Yes. by girolamous · · Score: 1

    This is true. Its just another piece of PR crap from a second-rate university. They have seen an already-observed phenomenon in a mew material...could have been predicted.

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    1. Re:20 year old news? Yes. by geekoid · · Score: 1

      Oh? can you name one other experiment that proved this? No? STFU.

      Yes, the idea has been around on the theoretical basis, but not observed.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  24. Ha! I KNEW it! by sribe · · Score: 1

    And you all made fun of me when I bought the $100/foot stereo cables after the sales guy explained surface electron effects to me. See, I knew he was as smart as he sounded ;-)

    1. Re:Ha! I KNEW it! by geekoid · · Score: 1

      UNfortunaly the plasmoidal capacitence fluxuation wears doen the smoth serface soi it is microscopically bumpopy, so you need to by some more.

      Luck for you I have some cables that don't experience those effects. For a mere 150.00 a foot I would be happy to sell you some...of course, at that price I'm cutting my own throat.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
  25. Re:Obvious? by bberens · · Score: 1

    Umm, I think that's pretty much exactly how solar panels work. Light causes the electrons to move (read: energy transfer), which is used to create electricity.

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