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Scientists Offer 'Overwhelming' Evidence Terran Life Began in Space
An anonymous reader writes "Using data from recent comet-probing space missions, British scientists are reporting today that the odds of life starting on Earth rather than inside a comet are one trillion trillion (10 to the power of 24) to one against. That is, we're not originally from around here. Radiation in comets could keep water in liquid form for millions of years, they say, which along with the clay and organic molecules found on-board would provide an ideal incubator. 'Professor Wickramasinghe said: "The findings of the comet missions, which surprised many, strengthen the argument for panspermia. We now have a mechanism for how it could have happened. All the necessary elements - clay, organic molecules and water - are there. The longer time scale and the greater mass of comets make it overwhelmingly more likely that life began in space than on earth."'" jamie points out that the author of this paper has many 'fringe' theories. Your mileage may vary.
That's where God lives.
The great anthropologist Dr. Douglas Adams already showed that we did not originate here. In fact, we were passengers on the 'B' Ark that crash-landed here. Our ancestors come from an ancient civilization called Golgafrinchans. It is a shame that Dr. Adams's work is so widely ridiculed as a "humorous" bit of "fiction" in wider scientific circles.
I for one welcome... uh, myself.
Dewey, you fool! Your decimal system has played right into my hands!
In a manner of speaking, didn't everything start in space?
There was never a better time to tag a story nevertellmetheodds!
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
Soooooo, they used two numbers (mass of clay & # of comets) to generate a 1e24 to 1 odd against life having started here? Seems like they might have left one or two variables out of their equation. Hopefully this is just junk reporting rather than junk science.
1984 was supposed to be a warning, not an instruction manual.
So the odds of a combination of clay + radiation was only to be found inside comets and the chances of that surviving a fiery impact at many kilometers per second are _higher_ than the same combination occurring naturally, peacefully, here on earth ? Somehow my bullshit meter goes all bananas.
Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
Please before you mod me troll, listen. The Theory of evolution does not explain the origin of life, just the origin of species. Most folk who believe in things like ID (I= intelligent or idiotic depending on your perspective) confuse the issue and attack science. Let us not make the same mistake on the science side. Even the most ardent supporters of the Theory of evolution, like Dawkins, have only proposed very tentative speculation about the origin of life. They readily admit that right now science does not have any definitive theories about the Origin of Life.
This has nothing to do with evolution. Let us keep the discussions straight.
sed -e 's/Chuck Norris/Rajnikant/g' joke > fact
Is there any evidence that comets have such isotopes at such concentrations? This sounds like the sort of thing Lex Luthor would be involved in.
What I'm listening to now on Pandora...
It's much worse than that. Like all panspermia advocates, and like a good many Creationists, they essentially crib the "odds" argument. This looks no different than any other pro-panspermia "study" in that it starts with a strawman of abiogenesis.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
It's junk science. Wickramasinghe and Hoyle are the same two who concocted the absurd probabilistic "tornado in a junkyard" argument against evolution. Hell, during the SARS outbreak, Wickramasinghe suggested that SARS was an alien virus. Yep, it just happened to have a sequence remarkably similar to other earth-borne viruses, and just happened to fall to earth in a region where similar viruses infected wild animals. Yep, that's the ticket.
Hoyle at least used to be a real scientist. I'm not sure if Wickramasinghe ever was. He said "
"The chances that life just occurred are about as unlikely as a typhoon blowing through a junkyard and constructing a Boeing 747" in 1982, so he's been a crackpot for a long time. This guy's just one step less crazy than Behe and the other 'intelligent design' crackpots. The only difference is that the intelligent designer posited by Wickramasinghe and Hoyle is a natural one, not a supernatural one; all the other problems with their claims are the same.
want to tell us that life was created by random comet falls?
i demand equal time for the godly and righteous theory of intelligent comet placing!
comets did not just fall randomly to earth and create life!
god himself intelligently directed comets to come to the early lifeless earth 6,000 years ago!
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
British scientists are reporting today that the odds of life starting on Earth rather than inside a comet are one trillion trillion (10 to the power of 24) to one against.
That they can even presume to put a number on the probability of life is evidence enough that they have no idea what they're talking about.
Anyway, the odds of life are totally irrelevent to anything. See: anthropic principle.
Sometimes it's best to just let stupid people be stupid.
Panspermia: When God masturbates.
What is an "old" comet? No comet we're going to encounter is going to be any older than the solar system itself. Most of these comets would, in fact, only be a few hundreds of millions of years older than the Earth itself, and quite likely would have spent a great deal of their time on the outer bounds of the solar system.
We know that life was here between 3.5 and 3.9 billion years ago, with some iffy evidence suggesting it was even older. That gives us a net time advantage for any given comet of no more than about 500 million years. That sounds like a lot, but in reality it really isn't that big a span. Beyond that, considering that our knowledge of cometary history is still rather sketchy, and that our sample size is exceedingly small, this is nothing more than a pretty substantial "what-if", itself based upon one particular abiogenesis theory, which has been somewhat supplanted in recent years.
If we're going to start talking about interstellar comets, to add more time to the equation, someone is going to have to a) provide evidence of such bodies and b) provide evidence that radioactive decay is going to produce heat long enough for liquid water within the body to act as an incubator for the VERRRY long stretches of time that some organisms or proto-organisms are going to survive.
Now, weight all of this against the fact that the early Earth had all the ingredients for life to develop; *plentiful* amounts of liquid water and lots and lots of energy (in the forms of solar radiation, atmospheric conditions like lightning and geothermal energy from oceanic vents and vulcanism). Can someone kindly explain to me how a comet, even with clays or clay-like crystaline minerals and some sort of low-level radioactive decay (it has to be pretty low-level too, because anything too energetic or in too high a quantity is more likely going to be delerious than helpful) is going to provide this more wonderful environment.
As with every generation of panspermia advocates, the underlying argument is essentially "We don't think there was enough time for life to develop on the early earth, so we've got to find a way to add more time." Even if we give them this part of the argument (and I frankly think even that is FAR too generous), they still have to explain how conditions elsewhere (comets, other planets orbiting other stars) are somehow more environmentally-friendly to abiogenesis than Earth was.
This is not to slight the largely unrelated idea that comets could have been the source of organic molecules that could have been some sort of organic "seeds" for early self-replicators to develop and to use as raw materials and energy.
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
I had Prof. Wickramasinghe was one of my Pure Maths lecturers during my first year at Cardiff. He was dreadfully hard to understand.
t icity
My flatmate, who was a paleobotany postgrad at the time, had some very disparaging things to say about him. He had co-authored a few papers claiming the Archaeopteryx was a hoax, based on his poor understanding of the subject matter.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeopteryx#Authen
Quite right. Hell is referred to as "the outer darkness" or "the outside" much more often. Essentially, Christians fear the separation from God because communion with God is seen as the ultimate goal. I suppose a Buddhist would look at that and say "desire for heaven is what makes separation from God into Hell"