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Pink, Blue, and Bad Science

DocDJ writes "Ben Goldacre writes an excellent column in The Guardian called Bad Science, which regularly demonstrates how poor the mainstream media are at reporting science. He recently pointed out the flaws in the reporting of research that purported to show the evolutionary basis of 'blue for boys, pink for girls'." Another Guardian writer, Zoe Williams, has an even more acerbic take on the research.

236 comments

  1. China prefers Pink by lecithin · · Score: 1, Informative

    I always wondered why people call them pinkos!

    "But within this study, was the preference stable across cultures? Well no, not even in this experiment, where they had some Chinese test subjects too. For these participants, not only were the differences in the overlapping curves not so extreme; but the favourite colours were a kind of red for boys and a bit pinker for girls (not blue); and they had more of a red preference overall. Red, you see, is a lucky colour in contemporary Chinese culture."

    --
    It could be worse, it could be Monday.
    1. Re:China prefers Pink by mr_mischief · · Score: 5, Informative

      "Red" and "beautiful" translate to the same word in Russian. Hence "red square". I would imagine then that red is pretty popular there, too.

      In anthropological etymology, it's common for the first two words for color in a language to represent warmer colors (reddish) and cooler colors (bluish or greenish, although which one of these comes first is split somewhat). They often appear just after the words for shades of light (light/dark). As a language evolves to have more vocabulary, it's typical that finer distinctions are made among colors and more words are added to represent them. Some languages today still share a name for blue and green, while others have two names for two different sections of blues.

      There are also psycho-linguistic differences as well. Russians can visually discriminate lighter blues from darker ones more quickly if they happen to fall across the divide for those two categories that is provided by their language. English speakers, having a word for blue and words for many shades of blue, but no distinct separate single-word categories for lighter blue vs. darker blue, were used as a control group. Another such experiment is between Tarahumara and English.

      It's possible the color words which are perceived differently by a particular race or which made the most difference to survival (think poisonous plants and animals vs. food sources) for people at the time and place of the language's early development lead to different color words coming about in different orders. It's being studied now whether the words and the groupings the words represent themselves limit and enhance color perception ability.

      Heck, in the book of Revelations in the Bible, Death rides a green horse in the original Greek. It's a black horse in most English translations. Why? Well, the "black death" plague and black being a symbol of death mean that's fitting symbolism in modern English. At the time, though, there wasn't embalming, and as this list of Bible translation corrections says, green's the color a dead body turns, just like any rotting meat. The symbolism is completely different, though, when green from the leaves of plants is considered the color of life.

      So there's a lot more to thoughts about color than gender. People's eyesight is involved, the colors in nature in different parts of the world, the language those people speak, the literature and symbols they know, and personal preference all figure in. Even if gender does play a role (other than through a societal reenforcement of perceived norms), it must be in conjunction with all of these other influences.

    2. Re:China prefers Pink by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Red" and "beautiful" translate to the same word in Russian.

      Got any evidence for that? Because it's not true.

    3. Re:China prefers Pink by Keebler71 · · Score: 3, Informative
      Got any evidence for that? Because it's not true.

      That's funny... my Russian textbooks say it's true. Well, technically the words themselves are different but they are derived from the same root "kras-" What "evidence" do *you* have to the contrary? Oh nevermind... let me just embarrass you.

      --
      "It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance." - Thomas Sowell
    4. Re:China prefers Pink by E++99 · · Score: 5, Informative

      Heck, in the book of Revelations in the Bible, Death rides a green horse in the original Greek. It's a black horse in most English translations. Why? Well, the "black death" plague and black being a symbol of death mean that's fitting symbolism in modern English. At the time, though, there wasn't embalming, and as this list of Bible translation corrections says, green's the color a dead body turns, just like any rotting meat. The symbolism is completely different, though, when green from the leaves of plants is considered the color of life.

      You have the wrong horse. The "green" horse is described by the greek word "chloros." Theyer's Lexicon defines it as 1) green, 2) pale yellow. By my brief review on biblegateway, most English translations, especially the most common ones, NIV and NKJV, translate it as "pale," following the KJV, which followed the latin vulgate, which did likewise. "Pale green" is a close second, and "ashen" a close third. So if "chloros" was translated to "pale" in the 382 AD vulgate, which was a revision of multiple older latin translations, I think it's safe to assume that the earliest readers made the same inference from the context, rather than picturing a bright green horse.

      The one who rode the black horse, who came before, wasn't Death, but the horseman who held the balances. The greek for his horse's color is "melas" which means black or black ink.
    5. Re:China prefers Pink by Bob-taro · · Score: 1

      In anthropological etymology, it's common for the first two words for color in a language to represent warmer colors (reddish) and cooler colors (bluish or greenish, although which one of these comes first is split somewhat) How the heck would you know which color words in a language were "first"? Given that languages more or less "evolve" how could you ever define the "first" of any type of word in "a language".
      --
      Prov 9:8 Do not rebuke mockers or they will hate you; rebuke the wise and they will love you.
    6. Re:China prefers Pink by snarkh · · Score: 1

      "Red" and "beautiful" translate to the same word in Russian. Hence "red square". I would imagine then that red is pretty popular there, too.


      That is not, strictly speaking, correct.
      Red is "krasniyj" while beautiful is "krasiviuj". The words derive from the same root, however, and perhaps (I am not an etymologist) were the same in old Russian.

    7. Re:China prefers Pink by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So let me get this straight. You claim that red and beautiful translate to the same word in Russian, despite the fact that they DON'T translate to the same word in Russian. Oh nevermind... let me just call you a complete idiot.

      No need to feel bad about that though -- idiot comes to us from the greek stem idio-, which by your reasoning makes the difference between idiom and idiot a mere technicality. So feel free to consider yourself a complete idiom instead.

      Incidentally if you wanted to be snarky and CORRECT, you could have just said that at one time or another krasnii has meant both "red" and "beautiful". Several hundred years ago (at the time Krasnaya Ploshad was named) it meant "beautiful", but the language has since evolved, and it now means "red".

    8. Re:China prefers Pink by snowgirl · · Score: 4, Informative

      It's possible the color words which are perceived differently by a particular race or which made the most difference to survival (think poisonous plants and animals vs. food sources) for people at the time and place of the language's early development lead to different color words coming about in different orders. It's being studied now whether the words and the groupings the words represent themselves limit and enhance color perception ability.


      Ok, you're falling into the same problem that the author was complaining about in that you're attributing to biology that which is generally cultural. The reason for the ordering of colors is likely not from biological or evolutionary constraints.

      Having words for light/dark (intensity) is the first and foremost necessary, as it distinguishes linguistically the difference detected by rods in the eye. Even with the rainbow of colors, we still distinguish between them internally with lighter tints, and darker shades.

      Following that is red, then blue/green (as one word) then following less reliably a progression of colors. When the list typically hits blue/green again, that is when the old word is concreted to one, and the newer word is given to the other.

      This does not mean that we can visually distinguish these colors better than other colors. In fact, we know by empirical biological evidence that humans can actually distinguish the variations of green the best of all shades.

      What has happened here is that a language by assimilating, aquiring or generating a new word for a color or concept is now able to linguistically distinguish color or concept. While we read the rainbow as: Red-Orange-Yellow-Green-Blue-Violet, Russians read it as Red-Orange-Yellow-Green-Cyan-Blue-Violet, and the Japanese natively read it as Red-Orange-Yellow-Green/Blue-Violet does not mean that one is able to distinguish the difference in the colors, but rather than mentally categorizing it allows that color to be compressed as information in a category, rather than remembered for the complexity of the color it really is.

      There have been tests looking for tetrachromats, people with 4 types of cones (essentially, a normal set of cones, and a color-blind set of cones) which can typically only occur in women (as the genes controling this are sex-linked onto the X gene. Yes there are males with more than one X chromosome, but of the 1:500/1000 births that rarity is, along with having only one X chromosome with color-blindness, and the mosaic property occuring in their eye... it's a vanishing small number.) Testing this, they asked women to pair colors together that match, notably giving a number of options that could only be distinguished if visually recognized by a tetrachromat. They found a few, however, the tetrachromats can't tell you why the colors don't match, because there exist no words to express the difference, despite their ability to recognize the mismatch.

      It's not that Russian speakers can visually recognize more types of blue than English speakers, it's that they have an easier time categorizing the difference.
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      WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    9. Re:China prefers Pink by rabiddeity · · Score: 2, Funny

      Ahh, now that's a horse of a different color!

    10. Re:China prefers Pink by NMerriam · · Score: 1

      How the heck would you know which color words in a language were "first"? Given that languages more or less "evolve" how could you ever define the "first" of any type of word in "a language".


      This is something anthropologists, linguists, and etymologists study because it tells a lot about a society's development. Much like the old canard about eskimos having a hundred words for snow, there is a clear procession as a language evolves that it adds more colors to the vocabulary. Most societies start out with either a word for red or a word for blue, then add the other. Then they start adding tertiary colors like greens and oranges. They add new colors in a pretty specific order as the society develops (It's been over ten years since i studied psychology of color so I'm sure some of the colors I mentioned were in the wrong oder).
      --
      Recursive: Adj. See Recursive.
    11. Re:China prefers Pink by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      hahaha, you know where you should stick your textbook ? implying that "kras-" is a root for both "krasnyj" and "krasivyj" words is the same as implying that "pretty" and "prick" mean the same because they share the same root "pr-" :-))) you ... pretty :-)))

    12. Re:China prefers Pink by Hucko · · Score: 1

      I am conviced you do not know what a root is.

      --
      Semi-automatic amateur armchair Australian philosopher; conjecture ready at any moment...
    13. Re:China prefers Pink by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Red" and "beautiful" translate to the same word in Russian. Hence "red square". I would imagine then that red is pretty popular there, too. Um, no. But they are close (red has an extra syllable in the middle). Red Square did used to mean "Beautiful Square" but it's name evolved over time as people carelessly dropped the extra syllable. Similar to how Times Square used to be Herald Square -- named for the newspaper, not a roving bard.
    14. Re:China prefers Pink by fractoid · · Score: 2, Funny

      That would be par for the course.

      This being Slashdot and all.

      --
      Rampant carbon sequestration destroyed the Dinosaurs' tropical paradise. I'm here to help repair the damage.
    15. Re:China prefers Pink by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It seems like you believe in linguistic determinism and the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis It's somewhat of a bullshit science.

    16. Re:China prefers Pink by kmike · · Score: 2, Informative

      That's funny... my Russian textbooks say it's true. Well, technically the words themselves are different but they are derived from the same root "kras-"

      It's not true for some hundred years already. Are your textbooks that old?
      Today "krasny" has only one meaning - "red", no beauty involved, period.

      Though when reading an ancient text and encountering "krasna devica" (literally "red damsel"), a modern Russian can get the meaning, but more because this phrase is an idiom used widely in the Russian fairy tales than because he understands "krasny" == "beautiful".

    17. Re:China prefers Pink by Bush+Pig · · Score: 1

      You're Australian, aren't you.

      --
      What a long, strange trip it's been.
    18. Re:China prefers Pink by Von+Helmet · · Score: 1

      "krasivii" means beautiful. Both "krasnii" for red and "krasivii" for beautiful begin with the root "kras".

      I'm not sure what you're arguing here...

    19. Re:China prefers Pink by Bob-taro · · Score: 1

      Most societies start out with either a word for red or a word for blue, then add the other. Then they start adding tertiary colors like greens and oranges. You didn't answer my question of HOW DO YOU KNOW WHICH WAS FIRST? It sounds like you would claim that "blue" is an older word than "green" in English, but how could you prove that? And even if you could prove that green is newer, can you prove it didn't just replace an older word for green? I'm not a linguist, but I do know that English and German are related languages, and that the German words for blue and green (blau and grün, IIRC) are very similar to the English words, so I think you'd have to go back at least to their common root language to find which was first. In other words, I don't see how it makes sense to claim that either blue or green came first "in English".
      --
      Prov 9:8 Do not rebuke mockers or they will hate you; rebuke the wise and they will love you.
    20. Re:China prefers Pink by mr_mischief · · Score: 1

      I believe that language evolves to describe life, and that in many primitive cultures the needs are similar. Therefore, it's understandable that early languages develop some basic vocabulary around roughly similar basic ideas at around the same rate. The Inuit wouldn't have so many words for snow if they lived in the tropics. Yes, environment has much to do with language.

    21. Re:China prefers Pink by kmike · · Score: 1

      I'm not arguing against the fact that the words "krasny" and "krasivy" are sharing one root "kras".
      But that doesn't make them equal in the lexical sense - their meanings are completely different.

      My point is that the grandparent thesis that "red" equals "beautiful" in the modern Russian language is wrong.

    22. Re:China prefers Pink by mr_mischief · · Score: 1

      Considering the whole post was about early development of language, I'm surprised there's such a fuss over this. Fine, though, read "translate" as "once translated". There, fixed.

    23. Re:China prefers Pink by Von+Helmet · · Score: 1

      Right. Looking back, that makes sense.

    24. Re:China prefers Pink by rthille · · Score: 1

      Would it really have been that much trouble for god to specify the wavelength of light comping off death's horse? I'm seriously, you're arguing about a book that says Pi = 3.

      --
      Awesome furniture, accessories and cabinetry in Santa Rosa, CA: http://humanity-home.com/
    25. Re:China prefers Pink by mr_mischief · · Score: 1

      It is true in the earlier Russian of which I was speaking. Sorry I didn't make that clear enough. It's not true in modern Russian. I guess I missed the 'd' on 'translated'.

    26. Re:China prefers Pink by mr_mischief · · Score: 1

      I never said, "Right now, in every Russian city, the modern Russian language works like this:". I was writing a post about the early development of language, and Russian is a quite old language. Sorry the context wasn't clear, but you're reading more into it than is there.

    27. Re:China prefers Pink by Richy_T · · Score: 1

      No it doesn't.

      Hint: Pi is a constant, the ratio of a circle's diameter to its circumfrence is not necessarily so.

      Rich

    28. Re:China prefers Pink by mr_mischief · · Score: 2, Informative
      The Boston Globe

      Wikipedia: Red Square, Origin and Name, which says it means both "red" and "beautiful" although the latter is an archaic meaning of the word.

      says specifically that "krasny" has lost the meaning "beautiful" over time and the meanign has been applied to red only

      Diary of a Russian Wife: Colors in Russian

      Moscow Life states the word means "beautiful" in Old Russian and only took on the exclusive meaning "red" in modern times.

      The synopsis for the book "Red in Russian Art" tells us that in earlier Russian, the two words carry the same meaning, and that red is still understood to symbolize beauty.

      NY Times travel section

      This page states that recently as the fifteenth century "red" and "beautiful" were always both exactly the same word. It has its own list of references, too.

      This Russian site states specifically:

      Red Square is located just outside the Kremlin, along it's Eastern wall. In the late 15th Century, people came to this square, called Torg or Market Square, to purchase food, livestock, or other wares. By the late 16th Century, it was renamed Trinity Square, and served as the main entrance to the Kremlin. It got the name Krasnaya Ploschad (Red Square) in 17th Century. In this sense Krasnaya (Red) means beautiful. The Pokrovsky (St. Basil's the Blessed) Cathedral, the Lenin's Mausoleum and the State History Museum are located on Red Square.

      Hotel-Rates.com page for Maxima Irbis hotel in Moscow

      This sites for a bell foundry in Russia states "Krasny" means "red", and "red" means "beautiful".

      Photo tour of Moscow, in which the phrase "Red Square (meaning beautiful square in Russian)" is written.

      Another tourist of Moscow reports, "Our first stop is St Basil's Cathedral at the end of Red Square. In Russian, it is Krasne square meaning red or beautiful."

      Russian traditional costume seller says, "The word "krasnoye" meaning "red" became identified in the people's minds with "prekrasno-ye" meaning "beautiful". Moscow's most beautiful central square is called "Krasnaya Ploshchad" (Red Square)."

      You may notice that Red Square isn't really red...it is paved with black and grey stones. In the Russian language, "Krasny"("red") also meant "beautiful", so "Krasnaya Ploschad" can also be translated as "Beautiful Square". The translation "Red Square" which is now used, was established in the 20th century.

      talks about the modern link that still exists between "red" and "beauty"

      Eduard Shevardnadze relays to the US State Department Chief of Protocol that krasny can mean "beautiful" as well as "red" -- in 1987.

      Russia

    29. Re:China prefers Pink by NMerriam · · Score: 1

      You didn't answer my question of HOW DO YOU KNOW WHICH WAS FIRST?


      I'm sorry I can't specifically answer your specialist question, I was merely confirming that the poster was right, and that in the course of my university studies I was made aware of this research.

      I'm confident that professional linguistic anthropologists are aware that languages share common roots. They quite depend on it, actually, as the change and drift of languages over time from a common root is one of the ways they study how language evolves, and by examining the commonalities and fundamental words, they can determine which words are oldest (and therefore more frequently shared). Yes, you can easily think of a hundred ways those assumptions could be wrong, and each of those ways has probably been examined as somebody's PhD thesis.
      --
      Recursive: Adj. See Recursive.
    30. Re:China prefers Pink by rthille · · Score: 0


      I know I'm wasting my time, but pi is defined as the ratio between a circle's diameter and it's circumference.
      http://www.google.com/search?q=define%3Api

      Bible claims about 30/10
      http://everything2.com/index.pl?node_id=701359

      --
      Awesome furniture, accessories and cabinetry in Santa Rosa, CA: http://humanity-home.com/
    31. Re:China prefers Pink by snowgirl · · Score: 1

      Hint: Pi is a constant, the ratio of a circle's diameter to its circumfrence is not necessarily so.

      If you're using a mathematical definition from Geometry, it is. A circle is defined as the set of points all equidistant from a center point. Under such a condition, it is mathematically provable that the ratio of the circle's diameter to its circumfrence is a constant with the value Pi.

      Approximations of these circles are the best that we can do in real life... but that's really why we have the acronym: "NTS" Not To Scale. You're working with the pure math, not with the error levels and confidence levels that are covered in higher orders of math in Engineering, and otherwise.

      --
      WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    32. Re:China prefers Pink by Frantactical+Fruke · · Score: 1

      "Ok, you're falling into the same problem that the author was complaining about in that you're attributing to biology that which is generally cultural. The reason for the ordering of colors is likely not from biological or evolutionary constraints."

      Indeed. For it is a geographical constraint. The various regions of the world have wildly differing color palettes in their landscapes. Reading accounts of artists from Europe's greyish north traveling for their first time south of the Alps, be it southern France, Italy or Algeria, you will inevitably find ravings about an "explosion of light and color". The Russian language will obviously have more distinctions for blue, grey, green and purple colors than the yellows and pastel shades of Mediterranean landscapes, because those are the colors their poets need to describe their surroundings - poets being the obvious professionals in this domain: Who else would get persistently stuck groping for a good, sonorous word to describe the color of the telephone pole across the road?

    33. Re:China prefers Pink by snowgirl · · Score: 1

      Indeed. For it is a geographical constraint. The various regions of the world have wildly differing color palettes in their landscapes. Reading accounts of artists from Europe's greyish north traveling for their first time south of the Alps, be it southern France, Italy or Algeria, you will inevitably find ravings about an "explosion of light and color". The Russian language will obviously have more distinctions for blue, grey, green and purple colors than the yellows and pastel shades of Mediterranean landscapes, because those are the colors their poets need to describe their surroundings - poets being the obvious professionals in this domain: Who else would get persistently stuck groping for a good, sonorous word to describe the color of the telephone pole across the road?


      Ridiculous comment... as absurd as the myth about Eskimos having a hojillion words for snow...

      Raise a Russian speaker in the US, and they will still be able to better remember distinctions between blue from cyan, as this is simply a feature of the categorization of language.

      Raise a kid speaking Shogunate Japanese, and he will describe the ocean as "aoi", and a field of grass as "aoi". (Modern Japanese has "stolen" the words "orange" and "green" from English, giving rise to the modern Japanese words "oranji" and "guriin".)

      I think the best example is to take a person who has had no exposure to vehicular engines, say most females (except those that were taught about engines from their father) point to the various parts of the engine and ask them to remember the differences between two cars. The likelihood that they could compare two engines and distinguish a carburetor from a fuel-injection system is unlikely. (Yes, even though I'm a girl, my father *DID* teach me something about cars.)

      The problem isn't that the people don't SEE what's there, they see all the parts, and they distinguish all the parts visually the same as anyone who knows car engines... the difference is that they don't know the words to remember and establish a level of abstraction beyond "this is what it looked like". They can't tell the difference between a V4, and a 4-cylinder boxter engine because they don't have the language to categorize the two as different. (Ok, this one is Gran Turismo.)

      The important distinction between this and the Sapir-Worf hypothesis is not that language limits the ways of thinking, but rather restricts a persons ability to abstract from one level to the next and thus understand in greater detail the levels above and below that level of distinction.

      Namely, Russian speakers can't distinguish anymore colors of blue than English speakers can, than Japanese speakers can... (as evidenced by Japanese conveniently borrowing the words "orange" and "green" when such a distinction became necessary in the modern age.) The difference is that if you ask them to recall what color an object was, the level of abstraction in storing the idea in a compressed format called language causes a collapse of categories, but not a variation of experience.
      --
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    34. Re:China prefers Pink by Bob-taro · · Score: 1

      I'm confident that professional linguistic anthropologists are aware that languages share common roots. They quite depend on it, actually, as the change and drift of languages over time from a common root is one of the ways they study how language evolves, and by examining the commonalities and fundamental words, they can determine which words are oldest (and therefore more frequently shared). Yes, you can easily think of a hundred ways those assumptions could be wrong, and each of those ways has probably been examined as somebody's PhD thesis. Well, maybe if we're lucky, a professional linguistic anthropologist will weigh in on the subject and give an explanation.
      --
      Prov 9:8 Do not rebuke mockers or they will hate you; rebuke the wise and they will love you.
    35. Re:China prefers Pink by Frantactical+Fruke · · Score: 1

      "Ridiculous comment... as absurd as the myth about Eskimos having a hojillion words for snow..."

      I don't know about Eskimos, but my mother tongue, Finnish, sure has at least four times more words for snow than English, to describe it in its various states between slush and packed. Used to be rather useful in a hunting society that tread on or through snow half the year. "What's the snow like? Do I take skis, can I still walk across the lake, will my feet get wet etc.?"

      And I was not saying that language could make you distinguish more or fewer shades, since the average speaker has neither the trained eye nor the vocabulary needed to describe what that eye sees. Average people anywhere don't use or need more than a half dozen words for colors. All I said was that the vocabulary of a language is massively influenced by the surroundings it is born in. I just bet Californian English has more words for shades of pink than I can imagine. Which Californian Russians probably import en masse as is, when they walk into a car pimping shop.

    36. Re:China prefers Pink by snowgirl · · Score: 1

      All I said was that the vocabulary of a language is massively influenced by the surroundings it is born in. I just bet Californian English has more words for shades of pink than I can imagine. Which Californian Russians probably import en masse as is, when they walk into a car pimping shop.


      This is again, the same sort of tautological statement that Boas was trying to speak to when he mentioned that Eskimos have a number of words for snow. Now here's the thing though, the Inuit language (Eskimos are Inuit) is an agglutinative / polysynthetic language. This means that they construct words from root morphemes, and then tacking on a bunch of morphemes to that word.

      As unlikely as it seems Eskimos have a near infinite number of words for Skyscraper...

      Also, it's unlikely that Finnish has more words for snow than English. As a non-native speaker of English you likely have not come across the various different words for snow-like precipitation, from sleet to slush, to grauple.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskimo_words_for_snow

      Choice quote:

      There are two principal fallacies in this myth. The first is that Eskimo languages have more words for snow than English does, when they may have a few more or a few less, depending on which Eskimo language. As in English, these words are related to each other: for example, blizzards and flurries are two different types of snow, but they are both recognized as 'snow' in the general sense. Speakers of Eskimo languages categorize different types of snow in a similar manner to English speakers.
      The second fallacy comes from a misconception of what are to be considered "words". As in other polysynthetic languages, the use of derivational suffixes and noun-incorporation results in terms or language codes that may include various descriptive nuances, whether describing snow or any other concept. Because Eskimo languages are polysynthetic, they describe concepts in compound terms or 'words' of unlimited length.
      --
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    37. Re:China prefers Pink by Richy_T · · Score: 1

      Assuming Euclidian geometry. Not necessarily the case otherwise.

      Rich

    38. Re:China prefers Pink by Richy_T · · Score: 1

      e^(i*pi)+1=0

      For a circle where you are sitting, the ratio of the circumference to diameter is not the same as the pi defined in the formula above (cf relativity).

      Rich

    39. Re:China prefers Pink by snowgirl · · Score: 1

      Non-euclidian geometry typically does not vary the definition of "circle" and "line". Rather, they define the ability of a triangle to have a total internal angular value of 180 (Euclidian), less than 180, or more than 180 (non-Euclidian).

      Certainly, one could define a circle as something different, however, ....................

      Actually, I'm going to think about this a little more first. :)

      --
      WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    40. Re:China prefers Pink by johndiii · · Score: 1

      As a thought experiment, imagine a circle on the surface of a sphere. If I remember correctly (and this was explained to me a *long* time ago), this is one representation of a non-euclidean geometry. The circle represents an intersection of a plane with the sphere, and the Euclidean representation of that circle lies in the plane. However, in the curved geometry represented by the circle and its defining center point on the surface of the sphere, the radius is somewhat longer than the radius in the planar geometry, meaning that pi on the surface of the sphere is somewhat less than the 3.141592654... to which we are accustomed, living in a world that is for the most part a flat geometry (to the limits of ordinary measurement).

      The Wikipedia article agrees roughly with my memory (and is somewhat more detailed). :-) The geometry that I described above is an elliptic geometry, as opposed to a hyperbolic one, since it's usually pointless to tell someone to imagine a pseudosphere. :-)

      --
      Floating face-down in a river of regret...and thoughts of you...
    41. Re:China prefers Pink by snowgirl · · Score: 1

      That's exactly the case I was thinking of, and why I so suddenly changed my stance. :) I was thinking about a circle on a sphere (my typical non-euclidian geometric surface also) and I was like, but the distance around the circle would be different from what I would expect, as the radius is potentially longer than the circle itself.

      With the example and clear detail that you gave, I can totally see what you're talking about, as I was already on that page. Thinking about it now, imagine a sphere of radius N. Select an arbitrary point on the surface, and construct a circle of radius 3N on the surface. It's pretty easy to see that the circumfrence would be a small fraction of the radius of the circle. Of course, once you grow a circle to radius 1/2 pi N, then there exists a second circle that scribes the same path, yet has a radius smaller than 1/2 pi N...

      Actually, for any circle of radius M on the surface of a sphere of radius N there exists another circle centered around a point one radian distance away in any arbitrary direction from the center point of the first circle with a radius of (N-M)... interesting... but it makes sense as the circumfrence of a circle is likely a form of radius times pi times a trancendental function of the radial arch length of the circle. Thus, any circle on a spherical surface would have two solutions. .... and they say girls can't do math :P pffff to that I say

      --
      WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    42. Re:China prefers Pink by johndiii · · Score: 1

      .... and they say girls can't do math :P pffff to that I say :-D My mother graduated summa cum laude with a degree in math. Being good at math, and intellectual ability in general, is a very attractive thing in a woman. :-)

      --
      Floating face-down in a river of regret...and thoughts of you...
    43. Re:China prefers Pink by snowgirl · · Score: 1

      You would think so, but in general, if the guy isn't an intellect himself, then they get very nervous and feel self-conscious around a girl who seems to be much smarter than them.

      But I'm still looking, and I guess it's true what they say "Where your heart desires to be, your legs will follow." *wink*

      --
      WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    44. Re:China prefers Pink by johndiii · · Score: 1

      Unfortunately, there is a lot of that. I had more of a problem with the fact that girls tended to hide their intelligence. I ended up marrying someone rather less intelligent, and it caused a lot of issues, many stemming from resentment on her part. You really live in a different world from someone who is noticeably less intelligent. Some people can handle that, some can't. But the second time around, I decided that I needed someone who could share all of my world. I think that I've found that, though fate has not so far been cooperative. We are working on it. :-)

      I very much believe that, being, well, somewhat of a romantic. ;-) Keep looking - you will find the right one. Ádh mór ort!

      --
      Floating face-down in a river of regret...and thoughts of you...
    45. Re:China prefers Pink by snowgirl · · Score: 1

      Oh, also, I think your sig is supposed to be "is áit led' chroí", the "led'" being short for "is áit le do chroí"... I'm not sure what "les'" would be short for... plus, the use of the possessive "do" in the first sentence would then align better with the "do" possessive of the second sentence. But who knows, you may know a dialect where "les'" is appropriate. But with S and D so close to the keyboard, I find a typo to be more likely.

      Oh, and no, I didn't even know what language it was in when I first saw it. First I had to figure out that it was Irish, then I had to learn a bit about Irish before I could even understand it. *laugh* It was kind of weird not being able to find "chroi" in the dictionary, then I realized that like Welsh, Irish is a Celtic language that would have initial mutation, so I went looking for that information, and found "croí"... I was much less confused at that point. *laugh*

      --
      WARNING! This girl exceeds the MAXIMUM SAFE standards established by the FDA for BRATTINESS
    46. Re:China prefers Pink by johndiii · · Score: 1

      You're right, the correct phrase is "An áit is áil led' chroí, leanfaidh do chosa." I copied it from a Foras na Gaeilge pamphlet without checking. Thanks.

      I took a year of Irish in college (quite a few years ago), and I'm working on re-learning the language. I'm not yet far enough along to recognize a mistake like that immediately. I'm impressed that you put it together so well. There is a useful English/Irish dictionary here (if you didn't find it already).

      I'd like to continue this conversation, though perhaps email might be better. Please use the address on my account, if you're interested.

      --
      Floating face-down in a river of regret...and thoughts of you...
  2. Pink is like 'pussy' by Tribbin · · Score: 4, Funny
    Reservoir Dogs quote:

    JOE: Okay, let me introduce everybody to everybody. But once again, at the risk of being redundant, if I even think I hear somebody telling or referring to somebody by their Christian name... you won't want to be you. Okay, quickly. Mr. Brown, Mr. White, Mr. Blonde, Mr. Blue, Mr. Orange, and Mr. Pink.

    MR. PINK: Why am I Mr. Pink?

    JOE: Cause you're a faggot.

    MR. PINK: Why can't we pick out our own colors?

    JOE: I tried that once, it don't work. You get four guys fighting over who's gonna be Mr. Black. Since nobody knows anybody else, nobody wants to back down. So forget it, I pick. Be thankful you're not Mr. Yellow.

    MR. BROWN: Yeah, but Mr. Brown? That's too close to Mr. Shit.

    MR. PINK: Yeah, Mr. Pink sounds like Mr. Pussy. Tell you what, let me be Mr. Purple. That sounds good to me, I'm Mr. Purple.

    JOE: You're not Mr. Purple, somebody from another job's Mr. Purple. You're Mr. Pink.

    MR. WHITE: Who cares what your name is? Who cares if you're Mr. Pink, Mr. Purple, Mr. Pussy, Mr. Piss...

    MR. PINK: Oh that's really easy for you to say, you're Mr. White. You gotta cool-sounding name. So tell me, Mr. White, if you think "Mr. Pink" is no big deal, you wanna trade?

    JOE: Nobody's trading with anybody! Look, this ain't a goddamn fuckin city counsel meeting! Listen up Mr. Pink. We got two ways here, my way or the highway. And you can go down either of 'em. So what's it gonna be, Mr. Pink?

    MR. PINK: Jesus Christ, Joe. Fuckin forget it. This is beneath me. I'm Mr. Pink, let's move on.
    --
    If you mod this up, your slashdot background will turn into a beautiful sunset!
    1. Re:Pink is like 'pussy' by Tribbin · · Score: 0, Offtopic

      Djeez.

      The summary mentions an article about how boys and girls prefer some colours over others.

      So it made me think about this funny piece from a great movie.

      Whoever rated that offtopic is a humorless... thing.

      --
      If you mod this up, your slashdot background will turn into a beautiful sunset!
  3. Heh by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    A slashbot article on misrepresentation. The ironing is delicious.

    1. Re:Heh by Dystopian+Rebel · · Score: 4, Funny

      The ironing is delicious.


      Alanis Morissette is your soul-mate. (Buy ear plugs.)
      --
      Rich And Stupid is not so bad as Working For Rich And Stupid.
    2. Re:Heh by Scrameustache · · Score: 4, Funny

      The ironing is delicious. If done right, yes :)
      --

      You can't take the sky from me...

    3. Re:Heh by SilverEyes · · Score: 1

      I guess you're too young or old to get the reference...

      --
      Interesting.
  4. Who knew? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    Journalists aren't scientists capable of peer-reviewing scientific work?

    1. Re:Who knew? by BSAtHome · · Score: 1

      Well, journalists will accept the fact that 2 + 2 = 5 for large values of 2. That is all one needs to know as a journalist. The rest is left to the imagination of the reader.

    2. Re:Who knew? by uglydog · · Score: 1

      2 + 2 = 5 for large values of 2 I never got that. Shouldn't it be 6?
    3. Re:Who knew? by Planesdragon · · Score: 1

      2 + 2 = 5 for large values of 2 I never got that. Shouldn't it be 6? No. 2.4 + 2.4 = 4.8, ~= 5 Anything that could possibly add up to 6 (~ 5.5 or greater) would be ~= 3.
    4. Re:Who knew? by redalien · · Score: 1

      a = 2.4
      b = 2.4
      int(a) == 2
      int(b) == 2

      a + b == 4.8
      int(a + b) == 5

    5. Re:Who knew? by jtev · · Score: 1

      Um, I think that static casting to an int always rounds down. But I'd have to check to make sure. Maybe you should do 2.6 instead of 2.6?

      --
      That which is done from love exists beyond good and evil
    6. Re:Who knew? by i_b_don · · Score: 1

      when i took programming back in college an "int(a)" call would truncate the variable "a". That means: a=2.9 b=2.9 int(a) = 2 int(b) = 2 int(a+b) = int(5.8) = 5 d

      --
      all language nazi's will burne in heil!
    7. Re:Who knew? by i_b_don · · Score: 1

      (sorry, return character's didn't come through... this is more readable.)

      when i took programming back in college an "int(a)" call would truncate the variable "a".

      That means:
      a=2.9
      b=2.9

      int(a) = 2
      int(b) = 2

      int(a+b) = int(5.8) = 5

      d

      --
      all language nazi's will burne in heil!
    8. Re:Who knew? by uglydog · · Score: 2, Funny

      You guys are all doing computer science, but I was thinking math too. So, let e>0: (3-e)+(3-e)=6-2*e now take the limit as e goes to 0. Course, the right left side terms become 3, but now let's turn to the magic of floats and doubles (C++, which I'm pleased to see you guys using too. If you're a geek, you know what I mean. And since you guys replied, clearly geeks.) for(double i=1;i>0;i/=10) printf("%f\n",i); Through out the loop, i>0, yet the result is 6. (Didn't check if it compiled. hope hope) Just a thought experiment, really. I'm typing this from my parents basement. :-(

  5. Science Journalism - Thumbs Down by MightyMartian · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I long ago learned never to use science journalists as primary sources of information. First of all, these guys are part of an infrastructure that needs to sell advertising (whether via TV, newspapers, web sites, whatever), so the more sensationalistic they can make things the better. Secondly, and most importantly, they often don't understand what it is they're reporting. It's rather like having a reporter covering Congressional sessions who doesn't understand any of the rules of the house, or what Constitutional powers and limits it has. You wouldn't accept financial reporters who didn't understand the essential concepts of stock exchange, and yet it seems people who don't understand the fundementals of science are given the "science journalist" hat and sent off to report on new data and new theories and hypotheses.

    There's nothing that makes me angrier than "New fossil rewrites human evolutionary history" and then when you actually go and read the source, it does not such thing.

    --
    The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
    1. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down by TheMeuge · · Score: 5, Interesting

      About 6 years ago, I was working in a virology lab, where one of the post-docs was doing some anthropological virology and investigating the possibility that one of the last extinctions was the result of a pandemic.

      Discovery Channel did a 30-minute segment about this, which I decided not to participate in, and will be happy not to have done so till the end of my days. When I saw the final product a couple months later, I just sat with my mouth open for about 20 minutes... because I couldn't figure out whether I've been an idiot and couldn't figure out what my colleague was doing until I saw the segment, or the editors/journalists massacred the subject to the point that the research was rendered unrecognizable within the mounts of selectively quoted pseudo-science bullshit.

    2. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down by Mr.+Underbridge · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It's rather like having a reporter covering Congressional sessions who doesn't understand any of the rules of the house, or what Constitutional powers and limits it has.

      Well there's an interesting tangent! But wait, it could get worse! We could also have congressmen who don't understand any of the bills they're voting on, or serving on committees without having any knowledge of the field they represent.

      I'm glad that'll never happen.

    3. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down by Assassin+bug · · Score: 1

      Agree. I have some first-hand experience. A local 'science reporter" (whom I know) for a local newspaper in my area recently reported on the the evil government institution (for which my wife worked for at the time) that didn't properly dispose of its waste that may contain prions. It was very interesting to me to here about what was actually going on within the institution versus what the reporter was telling the public. I am pretty certain that this particular reporter would be capable of sensationalizing toe lint.

    4. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 2, Funny

      There's nothing that makes me angrier than "New fossil rewrites human evolutionary history" and then when you actually go and read the source, it does not such thing. So it wasn't a fossilized time machine?
      --
      Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
    5. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down by ajs · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Discovery Channel did a 30-minute segment about this [...] the editors/journalists massacred the subject to the point that the research was rendered unrecognizable This isn't even unique to science. Every company I've worked for has had multiple articles in trade magazines where someone called up the CEO, got lots of quotes, and proceeded to write an article that said things that had no connection to reality.

      My current company has one article that we've framed and hung on the wall that says we've written all of our code in one particular programming language. What's really funny about that is that we're best known for using another programming language entirely, and any cursory background information search would have turned that up.

      Some journalists are excellent. Most are just like every other industry's mainstream employees.
    6. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down by tungstencoil · · Score: 1

      Hmmm... I might liken it to a "reporter covering Congressional sessions who doesn't understand English", much in the way my dogs don't understand English. Sure, some combinations of sounds are succeeded by certain events ("who wants a SNACK? who wants to go on a WALK?") and if I say something that sounds mean or loud they might get scared or apprehensive... just in the way "scientific journalists" get excited when something sounds scientific and scary (or like it might burn fat or cause cancer).

      They don't really understand what's being said, just that it sounds relevant and somewhat exciting to their universe... sigh... it's the world we live in, and sometimes I think my dogs understand it better.

    7. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down by Oktober+Sunset · · Score: 1

      Of course it wasn't, how would stainless steel fossilise?

    8. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down by RockModeNick · · Score: 1

      Our congressmen don't need to understand those bills, they just sell their votes on most of them to states that care and do understand in exchange for those states' votes on issues they don't care about but our congressman does.

  6. Is the problem the media, or the research? by BadAnalogyGuy · · Score: 3, Interesting

    On the one hand, the media is definitely at fault for overhyping every burp and gurgle coming from medical research. An old amino acid causes an unexpected hypertrophy of T-cells? OMFG! It's teh cure for cancer!

    On the other hand, grants seem to awarded to any post-doc with an itch to scratch. The problem is that most of those idiots (for want of a better term) can't tell the difference between the itchiness caused by an ingrown ass-hair and the ass-hair itself. That's what Zoe's ripping on in her article.

    There's something to be said for "pure research" which theoretically expands our collective knowledge. Without pure research, we wouldn't have found penicillin, US America, or bread-yeast. However, I can't even begin to understand what kind of expectations the grant awarders had when they supported "Boys like blue, Girls like pink" research.

    For a couple bucks, the researchers could have just as well satisfied their itch with a tube of Preparation H.

    1. Re:Is the problem the media, or the research? by DarkShadeChaos · · Score: 1

      When I read 'T-cells' I was hoping for 'T-Virus'... shucks

      And I already have a 12-gauge: simple point and click interface :D

      --
      The machine unmakes the man. Now that the machine is so perfect, the engineer is nobody. -Ralph Waldo Emerson
    2. Re:Is the problem the media, or the research? by Lemmy+Caution · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I can't even begin to understand what kind of expectations the grant awarders had when they supported "Boys like blue, Girls like pink" research.

      There are a couple interested parties:

      1. Those who for various religious and political reasons look for essential gender differences, to justify very stable, often traditional gender roles.

      2. Businesses who produce goods that are marketed to gender-based expectation, and who dislike it when their markets diverge too far from the behavior that is expected of them.

    3. Re:Is the problem the media, or the research? by turing_m · · Score: 2, Interesting

      There is another interested party, although they would pay for/conduct such research in order to prove the opposite.

      3. The same PC advocates who attempt to "prove" with fabricated research that men and women are the same, that nature has a small influence wrt nurture, the myth of the noble savage, etc etc. See Boaz, Mead, Freud, Gould et al.

      --
      If I have seen further it is by stealing the Intellectual Property of giants.
    4. Re:Is the problem the media, or the research? by Sleepy · · Score: 1

      >There is another interested party, although they would pay for/conduct such research in order to prove the opposite.

      I would say that's a bit of a stretch. From an economic point of view, and understanding the profit motive, the GP's post makes perfect sense.
      Those interested points of view have stockholder obligation to continue the march toward uniformity. In the US, the balance of power between people and corporations is about what it was in 1775. *shrugs*

      If you are trying to imply there's some sort of well funded lobby trying to say pink is for boys and blue is for girls, that's just silly. The number of people who REALLY feel that way must number in the tens.

      There's really no need to envision armies of communist same-sex pinko linux liberals... flush with their Microsoft Rebate cash. You should focus your efforts on all those "DNA types", who call your children mean names like "monkey" with all their evolution hocus-pocus...

    5. Re:Is the problem the media, or the research? by moderatorrater · · Score: 1

      I spend all day looking at the differences between male and female anatomy and often their interaction as well. Can I have a grant?

    6. Re:Is the problem the media, or the research? by moderatorrater · · Score: 1

      There's really no need to envision armies of communist same-sex pinko linux liberals What's interesting is that the GP didn't actually say that there was an army, just that there was a party interested in it. Most people realize that men and women are inherently different, and most people realize that those differences are more often an asset than a problem. People in both extremes have a vested interest; he was absolutely right.
    7. Re:Is the problem the media, or the research? by Sj0 · · Score: 1

      4. Social scientists who want to be able to say "boys like blue, girls like pink" as a definite, experimentally proven fact as a part of a greater hypothesis.

      I've been studying a lot of works on societies, and they tend to build a lot of big theories out of simple truths.

      --
      It's been a long time.
  7. It's like driving on the left by Colin+Smith · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Because everyone here drives on the left there must be a genetic predisposition.

    --
    Deleted
    1. Re:It's like driving on the left by flyingfsck · · Score: 4, Funny

      Well, yeah, it is due to Evolution. All the people predisposed to driving on the right are quickly removed from the gene pool.

      --
      Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
    2. Re:It's like driving on the left by Tribbin · · Score: 1

      Can you imagine that from an alien standpoint?

      Alien observers must have boggled their minds over this.

      --
      If you mod this up, your slashdot background will turn into a beautiful sunset!
    3. Re:It's like driving on the left by 2short · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Who modded this off-topic? That's the most spot-on analogy I've ever seen on slashdot (OK, that's not saying all that much...)

      But that's essentially the "researchers" argument: it's a really strong correlation, so it must be genetic, not societal. Bollocks.

    4. Re:It's like driving on the left by skeevy · · Score: 1

      That's because the dinosaurs drove on the right, too. Everyone predisposed to driving on the right died in head-on collisions with the dinosaurs.

      It also explains why the dinosaurs died out and why the Brits are so wacky!

    5. Re:It's like driving on the left by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There's a problem with your theory: Sexual maturity occurs before the issuance of drivers licenses. So right side drivers can still procreate before attempting to win a Darwin Award.

      p.s. Don't forget that if said award winner is male, a lonely female morgue technician could still impregnate herself. That would make for a REALLY creepy episode of CSI:Miami, so maybe it's a good thing they drive on the right in the US?

    6. Re:It's like driving on the left by Zaatxe · · Score: 1

      I drive on the right, because the left is where the incoming traffic is and I have a genetic predisposition to keep alive.
      I write with my left hand, though...

      --
      So say we all
    7. Re:It's like driving on the left by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You're getting ahead of yourself. It doesn't matter when an organism reaches sexual maturity. It matters when it successfully reproduces. Sure a right side driver can reproduce at the age of 14, but if the girls ignore him until he has his own car, his odds of creating descendents decrease quickly.

    8. Re:It's like driving on the left by throup · · Score: 2, Funny

      I did hear a suggestion once that, here in the UK, we should begin to drive on the right to bring ourselves in line with the rest of Europe. Obviously, there is bound to be opposition to any such plan, so the suggestion was to start with heavy goods vehicles only and see how they get on. :-)

    9. Re:It's like driving on the left by Danny+Rathjens · · Score: 1

      A genetic predisposition - I'd use the stronger word instinct, even - to mimic the creatures that look like you do is a good one to have for survival.

  8. Global Warming vs. Number of Pirates by Gothmolly · · Score: 5, Funny

    That's a study I'd like to see done.

    --
    I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
    1. Re:Global Warming vs. Number of Pirates by Tribbin · · Score: 1

      Global warming leads to rise of waterlevel.

      Rise of waterlevel leads to 'Waterworld-scenery'.

      You've seen the movies; lots of pirates.

      A [mutual stimulating] outcome in this research.

      --
      If you mod this up, your slashdot background will turn into a beautiful sunset!
    2. Re:Global Warming vs. Number of Pirates by Chyeld · · Score: 4, Funny

      While I was in college I happened to notice the following posted on the door of the office of my statistics professor.

      "My dear friends, I am here to warn you of a tremendous crisis we are facing today. We all remember times when we could go to sleep at night secure in the knowledge that our homes and lives are safe. But today, this is no longer so!

      Here are two charts, one showing the violent crime rate in our fair town as it has increased in the past decade, as reported via calls to 911!

      The second chart shows the rapid proliferation of telephone poles that have been placed in our fair community!

      Clearly, you can see that as the number of telephone poles goes from zero a decade ago to the dizzying heights we have today, the rate of crime being reported via 911 has drastically risen as well!

      The answer is clear! To protect our town we MUST cut down the telephone poles!"

    3. Re:Global Warming vs. Number of Pirates by Kazymyr · · Score: 1

      No, I submit it's the other way around.

      Increased number of pirates -> more ppl urinate in the oceans. Piss is warmer than ocean water, thus the average temperature of the ocean rises -> global warming.

      Q.e.d.

      --
      I hadn't known there were so many idiots in the world until I started using the Internet -Stanislaw Lem
    4. Re:Global Warming vs. Number of Pirates by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I want to leave my mutual stimulated outcome all over your ass.

    5. Re:Global Warming vs. Number of Pirates by lgw · · Score: 1

      Well, assuming this was a few years ago, cutting down all of the telephone poles would have resulted in a *dramatic* reduction in the number of 911 calls. Hard to argue with that conclusion! :)

      --
      Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
    6. Re:Global Warming vs. Number of Pirates by Hucko · · Score: 1

      Chairman, I humbly submit that in regards to the GP and PP, lgw should be forthwith requested to voluntarily retire, to return lu geek card, science enthusiast membership and Satire Comprehension Certificate of Achievement.

      --
      Semi-automatic amateur armchair Australian philosopher; conjecture ready at any moment...
  9. I remember by $RANDOMLUSER · · Score: 4, Funny

    Getting up at 4:00 AM or so to watch the first shuttle launch.
    Dan Rather, new at the job of anchoring liftoffs, said: (I am not making this up)
    "The skies are clear this morning, so we should be seeing some spectacular entrails...."

    --
    No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism. - Winston Churchill
    1. Re:I remember by Cajun+Hell · · Score: 4, Funny

      I think what he meant to say, was that the entrails predicted spectacularly clear skies. Stupid anchormen, getting their scientician terms mixed up. But don't let some idiot's malapropism get you down. What's important is that shuttle did get off, and deployed a telescope which has done wonders for astrology.

      --
      "Believe me!" -- Donald Trump
    2. Re:I remember by Beryllium+Sphere(tm) · · Score: 1

      That's nothing compared to his quote to the effect "most of the thrust comes from the three main engines".

    3. Re:I remember by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or, perhaps he simply meant "contrails," which is the correct term and not too different in spelling or pronunciation.

    4. Re:I remember by Thaelon · · Score: 1

      For optimal enjoyment of the parent comment, make sure you caught the part where he said "astrology".

      --

      Question everything

    5. Re:I remember by RealGrouchy · · Score: 1

      On the bright side, the astrologers made it back safely on that first space shuttle mission!

      - RG>

      --
      Hey pal, this isn't a pleasantforest, so don't waste my time with pleasantries!
  10. I read the zoe williams article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I think see misses the target. Knowledge is cumulative, knowing that there's a gender specific preference for color could be useful to researchers in other fields. The problem is the mainstream media which publishes such trivial research while managing to ignore scientific discoveries of far greater importance.

    1. Re:I read the zoe williams article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Except that they seem to have missed the cultural reasons for selection, and not shown a proper gender driven link.

    2. Re:I read the zoe williams article by IWannaBeAnAC · · Score: 1

      Wow, way to completely miss the point of the article. Obviously, you didn't read it. And also obviously, neither did the mods.

    3. Re:I read the zoe williams article by lysse · · Score: 1

      You read one of the articles? You must be new here...

    4. Re:I read the zoe williams article by Rams�s+Morales · · Score: 1

      Following Williams's reasoning, we should shut down all fundamental Astronomy research, effective immediately. According to her, research that to her won't "come in handy" should not be done. Furthermore, according to her, if you are trying to answer non-PC questions, you should be academically ostracized, as your field is turned into taboo.

      In short, her article is a disgusting display of ignorance about the value of science, evidence, and knowledge.

  11. Re:Add The Mainstream Media Not Covering by Kandenshi · · Score: 1

    Tell me, did you intend to link to a parody site? Or do you just not know the URL of the whitehouse website?

    I believe you wanted http://www.whitehouse.gov/ as should be fairly easy to tell if you'd loaded & read your own link.

  12. pure guesswork on my part.. by middlemen · · Score: 5, Funny

    Maybe it is because pink might have a higher wavelength than blue since it is closer to red. So males can see a woman, if dressed in pink, from far away and get ready to show off or think of instant one-liners, whereas if men are dressed in blue, then women cannot see men approaching from far away and might not have their guard up on time to hear the shitty one-liner from the guy...

    1. Re:pure guesswork on my part.. by jpetts · · Score: 1

      What dickhead modded this insightful? It's funny, really funny. But insightful? Says all you need to know about the moderation system...

      --
      Call me old fashioned, but I like a dump to be as memorable as it is devastating - Bender
    2. Re:pure guesswork on my part.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      pink might have a higher wavelength than blue Would that be a longer or shorter frequency?
    3. Re:pure guesswork on my part.. by Mantaar · · Score: 1

      Probably someone who had to learn it the hard way...

      --
      I'm an infovore...
    4. Re:pure guesswork on my part.. by Headcase88 · · Score: 1

      Parent is joking with GP but for those who are curious:

      Red = long wavelength, low frequency
      Blue = short wavelength, high frequency

      --
      "When the atomic bomb goes off there's devastation...but when the atomic bong goes off there's celebraaaaation!"
    5. Re:pure guesswork on my part.. by ampathee · · Score: 1

      I would consider it somewhat insightful, since "pure guesswork" is the same method the researchers in TFA used to come up with the whole "easier to find berries" thing. Illustrates the stupid, kind of thing.

    6. Re:pure guesswork on my part.. by MrHanky · · Score: 1

      Yes, the "funny" mod doesn't give karma. So if you really like a joke, mod it something else.

    7. Re:pure guesswork on my part.. by david_thornley · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Actually, males (if old enough) want to see females naked, while females don't seem to have the same desire to see males naked. Observe the dress of the sexes in Western cultures: the standard formal male dress leaves hands and head (not including neck) exposed, and everything else covered; females normally expose more skin, and sometimes much more. In business casual wear, a woman can expose quite a bit of leg, while men are required to wear long pants. Women can have lower necklines than men, too.

      Also, observe men's and women's magazines. Men's magazines often show scantily-clad good-looking women on the cover, which makes some sort of sense to me, but so do many women's magazines. I don't understand why (not that I'm complaining when I'm stuck in a slow checkout line at the supermarket).

      Therefore, as long as we're throwing out strange ideas, here's one: the natural state of a man in Western culture is clothed while the natural state of a woman in Western culture is at least less clothed. The dominant skin color in Western culture is pink (sometimes misstated as "white"), so the standard clothes suggest naked girls and clothed boys.

      The observations in the first two paragraphs are correct, as far as I can tell, and the standard colors for little boys and little girls are blue and pink, at least in the US. I'm not giving out any warranties on the reasoning and conclusion, though.

      --
      "When you have eliminated the unacceptable, whatever is left, however improbable, must be the truthiness" - Holmes
    8. Re:pure guesswork on my part.. by rp · · Score: 1

      As to your opening sentence: additionally, females (if old enough) also want to see females scantily dressed, while males don't seem to have the same desire to see males scantily dressed.

  13. And you wonder why by Enlarged+to+Show+Tex · · Score: 1

    there are so many people out there who believe in creationism (particularly the type with the earth being 6000 years old) and intelligent design...

    1. Re:And you wonder why by that+IT+girl · · Score: 1

      ...what does that have to do with colors?

      --
      10 FILL MUG WITH COFFEE
      20 DRINK COFFEE
      30 GOTO 10
  14. Hey, it's fun to read and hurts nobody by Tribbin · · Score: 1

    It's fun to read and think about these things even if they are not true.

    It's not as troublesome as plain lies from governments presented to you over and over again from all 'respected news networks' to gain support to nullify amendements, for example.

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  15. What... is your favourite colour? by BobNET · · Score: 4, Funny

    Blue! No, pink [SPROING] Aarrgghh!!

  16. Favorite color, favorite number...? by Associate · · Score: 1

    It's all arbitrary anyway. That said, I like pastel black and the number eleven.

    --
    Someone hates these cans.
    1. Re:Favorite color, favorite number...? by BadAnalogyGuy · · Score: 1

      I like pastel black and the number eleven

      Wow. I didn't think we'd get any homosexual furries in this investigation.

      Tell me, what ethnic food do you like the best?

    2. Re:Favorite color, favorite number...? by Tribbin · · Score: 1

      Uhm, that is what it is about yes.

      Arbitrary is not random; it is chosen.

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    3. Re:Favorite color, favorite number...? by Zero__Kelvin · · Score: 1

      "That said, I like pastel black and the number eleven."
      Personally I am a man who likes pink and the number 69. I also like women who have the same preference.
      --
      Guns don't kill people; Physics kills people! - John Lithgow as Dick Solomon on Third Rock From The Sun
    4. Re:Favorite color, favorite number...? by Associate · · Score: 1

      Chinese with heinz ketchup.

      --
      Someone hates these cans.
    5. Re:Favorite color, favorite number...? by Associate · · Score: 1
      I looked up arbitrary just to be sure.

      Determined by chance, whim, or impulse, and not by necessity, reason, or principle
      Yep, just what I thought it meant.
      --
      Someone hates these cans.
    6. Re:Favorite color, favorite number...? by Tribbin · · Score: 1

      The extended Collaborative International Dictionary of English v.0.48 version didn't get through because of junk characters, but was fairly similar.

      Wordnet 2.0:

      arbitrary
                    adj : based on or subject to individual discretion or preference
                                or sometimes impulse or caprice; "an arbitrary
                                decision"; "the arbitrary rule of a dictator"; "an
                                arbitrary penalty"; "of arbitrary size and shape"; "an
                                arbitrary choice"; "arbitrary division of the group
                                into halves" [ant: nonarbitrary]

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    7. Re:Favorite color, favorite number...? by ardle · · Score: 1

      He he :-)

      You realise this is all Maths lecturers' faults? They keep on doing things like choosing arbitrary points at distance 1 from the origin. Is that random or specific?

    8. Re:Favorite color, favorite number...? by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      Personally I am a man who likes pink and the number 69. I also like women who have the same preference
      That could go both ways...oh, I see what you mean.
      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
  17. The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everything by unassimilatible · · Score: 4, Insightful
    It isn't just science. The media screw up everything: Law, medicine, politics, sports of course since sportwriters all all nerds, you name it. We don't notice it in other fields because nobody is an expert in every field. As a lawyer, I notice how bad they screw up the law. I'm sure doctors, scientists - anyone who is an expert - notices it in their field. A degree in journalism doesn't teach you much about the real world.

    I have an extremely low opinion of journalism, and when I hear the term "journalistic ethic" I cringe. In addition to the reporter's biases we also have to account for their stupidity and laziness. Meanwhile, reporters run around and act like journalism is some sacred religion, exempt from the law, to be placed above God and country. Nonsense.

    --
    Slashdot "libertarians": Small government for me, big government for those I disagree with. -1, I disagree with you
  18. This just in! by argStyopa · · Score: 1

    Most media stories (carried by commercial media conglomerates) are motivated by a desire to sell products, and contain little to no actual science! (shock)

    "Caveat Emptor" applies to just about everything you see, read, or hear as well. Be (at least) skeptical of everything you hear, and you'll be just fine.

    --
    -Styopa
    1. Re:This just in! by socz · · Score: 1

      "Caveat Emptor" applies to just about everything you see, read, or hear as well. Be (at least) skeptical of everything you hear, and you'll be just fine.


      I agree that you should be skeptical, but not of everything you hear. The topic says "...regularly demonstrates how poor the mainstream media are at reporting science." I would say that being skeptical of what THEY say shouldn't be because of financial interests, but rather because of misinformation.

      How many people really research anything they hear? We're on a technical site talking about things that interest us. But people who watch news or read news don't really care about learning more in depth what they are reading about. So, it's good enough for the ignorant masses.

      But news isn't meant to go into depth anyways. I don't know how it is in other parts of the world, but in the US, no one cares! And if they explained too much people wouldn't watch the news. That's why they go something like this:

      "... 8 people were killed. Today was the 11th annual teenage beauty pageant of compton. Lets take a look at the winners!"

      Well, i actually lied earlier, Mexican news doesn't censor as much as american and actually shows too much sometimes. Too much = dead bodies and what the US was really doing during the "war on terror." Also interesting to note, they talked about american casualties, something that was unheard of in the US. But, i think i'm getting off topic.

      Anyhow, news isn't meant to be accurate and biased. But many times it comes across that way. The fox news channel wouldn't be fun if people like bill o`rielly didn't have an opinion, right? But like my buddy says, if you're gonna offend someone, might as well offend everyone!
      --
      My abilities are only limited by my imagination
  19. What about global warming... by MMC+Monster · · Score: 1

    Just look at mainstream media portrayal of global warming. They make it sound as if global warming is a contested theory in the scientific community. As was mentioned in _An Inconvenient Truth_, of the hundreds of journal articles on the subject, there was not a single one that disputed that global warming existed.

    --
    Help! I'm a slashdot refugee.
    1. Re:What about global warming... by Cajun+Hell · · Score: 1

      Global wha--? Oh, you mean climate change.

      --
      "Believe me!" -- Donald Trump
    2. Re:What about global warming... by Tsiangkun · · Score: 1

      seriously.

      I wish society would drop the term global warming and use "Catastrophic Global Climate Change"
      or something similar.

      Global Warming sounds so nice and pleasant.

    3. Re:What about global warming... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Someone please mark Tsiangkun's post as a troll.

    4. Re:What about global warming... by Toonol · · Score: 1

      Wow, you have a future in journalism.

    5. Re:What about global warming... by Straif · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Using "An Inconvenient Truth" as a basis for chastising the media coverage of Global Warming (or cooling, or climate change, or whatever it's being called today) when the very study they used was already 4 years out of date and was based on a survey of reports that are now up to 15 years old (the search was done on papers covering from 1993 to 2003) and done at a time when climate studies were really just starting to get real funding does not give you a very stable ground from which to throw stones.

      The fact is that after the exact same search parameters were used on more recent data (examining papers published between 2004 to present) only 7% outright endorsed the Global Warming hypothesis, 38% accepted it without explicit endorsement, 6% rejected it and the rest were neutral. (link)

      Even more interesting is that of all the papers published only one predicted catastrophic outcomes due to climate change. That's 1 out of over 500 published papers.

      So perhaps in this case the media you've been watching/reading (which from what I've seen are almost too happy to report that all weather related catastrophes as being caused by man-made global warming) are actually closer to the truth than you'd care to admit.

      --
      Of course that's just my opinion...... you could be wrong!
    6. Re:What about global warming... by Experiment+626 · · Score: 1

      of the hundreds of journal articles on the subject, there was not a single one that disputed that global warming existed.

      Saying that the climate is getting warmer is just a matter of comparing temperature readings to historic ones. What people argue over is why this is. Is human activity a factor in this trend? A major one? The predominant one? The sole thing driving temperature variations? This is the part you'll see theories being contested about.

    7. Re:What about global warming... by Tsiangkun · · Score: 1

      What ?, I'm being serious.

      Global warming does not sound like a problem that needs attention.

      Global warming, is just one symptom of catastrophic climate change.

      Catastrophic climate change is just one symptom of exceeding the
      earth's ability to support our current lifestyle.

    8. Re:What about global warming... by mshomphe · · Score: 1
      The parent poster links to a press release from Sen. James Inhofe. For an amusing take on the OP's "citation", read this. For a science-y take, read this. The money shot is that out of 528 papers (576 in the Deltoid search) in the Inhofe press release, only 3 reject the consensus. From the Deltoid article

      The three that do reject the consensus are Gerhard, which was published in the American Association of Petroleum Geologists Bulletin; Shaviv arguing for cosmic rays, which doesn't explain how they could make a difference over the past 50 years when the cosmic rayflux hasn't changed over that period; and Zhen-Shan and Xian, which is just a rubbish paper that should not have been published. (What is the next number in this sequence? 60. Their answer is 60.)
      --
      She sat at the window watching the evening invade the avenue.
  20. The media is about hype, not enlightenment by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Most science discoveries are boring. They don't bleed, so they don't lead. They don't get the scared parents to tune in at 11 to see what will kill their kids next.

    Most discoveries are small scale, and many merely confirm expectations. But the news needs to turn them all into cancer cures, or frame them into current politics, or turn them into earth shattering in scope.

    In fact, the expectation that the media would be good at science is the big lie. Since when has the media been about enlightenment? The media is all about drawing eyeballs with hype.

  21. Re:Add The Mainstream Media Not Covering by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Wow. Just wow.

    Apparently it's internet day at the retard home.

    YHBT

  22. You don't think it hurts anyone? by Colin+Smith · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Really? There's officially 163,000 homeless households in the UK and this research like virtually all research in the UK is government funded.

    Of course, that's nothing compared to the 6 billion pounds we've just spent upgrading our Channel Tunnel rail system so that wealthy commuters between London and Paris can shave 20 minutes off their journey.

    --
    Deleted
    1. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      Really? There's officially 163,000 homeless households in the UK and this research like virtually all research in the UK is government funded. Homeless - sans house
      Household - with house

      Me thinks you need to stop with the conspiracy theories.
    2. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by Colin+Smith · · Score: 0, Flamebait

      Homeless - sans house
      Household - with house household
      1. A domestic unit consisting of the members of a family who live together along with nonrelatives such as servants.

      A household is basically a family unit.

      And homeless are people without a place of permanent residence.

      Methinks you (and those who mod you up) need to improve your language skills.
      --
      Deleted
    3. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Oh I see. We aren't thinking about the families! WOE IS US!

      Methinks you need to put a cork in that aorta.

    4. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by mccalli · · Score: 1

      Of course, that's nothing compared to the 6 billion pounds we've just spent upgrading our Channel Tunnel rail system so that wealthy commuters between London and Paris can shave 20 minutes off their journey

      The link isn't to shave off 20 minutes. The link is to go through St. Pancras - a station linked to the north of London. At Waterloo the link was useless for both passengers but more importantly freight which came from the midlands, the north or Scotland. Now it's on its way to being useful again - this link was planned from the very conception of the tunnel.

      I'm from Sheffield originally though I now live nearish London - I remember the dismay in the Sheffield local paper (The Star) when this link was postponed. It was considered to be a big boost to the economy to be able to ship freight by rail directly to the European mainland. This is an investment in the economy, not a game to lose 20 minutes here or there.

      Of course, I live out to the west of London and was promised crossrail umpteen years ago. That too is an investment in the economy waiting to be made, but I'm not holding my breath.

      Cheers,
      Ian

    5. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by evilviper · · Score: 1

      There's officially 163,000 homeless households in the UK

      Hmm...

      Okay, somebody has to ask...

      WTF is a homeless household?

      --
      Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
    6. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As already outlined, Colin Smith is a fucking retard.

    7. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by The+One+and+Only · · Score: 1

      Yes, but a civil works project can employ people and cut down on the amount of unemployment so more people can afford housing. And a more efficient infrastructure will make the country as a whole wealthier, so there is more wealth to redistribute to the poor. "Let's stop doing anything else until we've ended poverty" is a great way to create more poverty.

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    8. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      which set of retards modded colin's post up?

    9. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by RealGrouchy · · Score: 1

      Are you like George Bush or something?

      Eliminating homelessness by changing the definition?

      Please, stop using semantics to dismiss social problems.

      - RG>

      --
      Hey pal, this isn't a pleasantforest, so don't waste my time with pleasantries!
    10. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by jsiren · · Score: 1

      Please define "homeless household".

      --
      Usage: km/h for speed (kilometers per hour); kph for very slow impulses (kilopond hours).
    11. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by identity0 · · Score: 1

      Household = family unit, you fucking retard.

      It's pretty obvious, unless you're an idiot.

    12. Re:You don't think it hurts anyone? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      No, cos it takes 20 minutes longer going in the wrong direction (northwards) to get to st pancras instead of waterloo. So it won't save time, except for people who live on the wrong side of the river (oop north).

  23. Zoe Williams and her "even more acerbic take" by Atario · · Score: 1

    She seems to be saying "I don't see why anyone should ask a question like this, therefore everyone should stop". That's not acerbic, that's obscurantist.

    --
    "A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
    1. Re:Zoe Williams and her "even more acerbic take" by null.account · · Score: 1

      She seems to be saying "I don't see why anyone should ask a question like this, therefore everyone should stop". That's not acerbic, that's obscurantist.
      I believe that there is such a thing as actual "science journalism".

      I understood the point of her screed to be "If you suck as a science journalist, just stop doing it". That would cut off most of them (maybe all as you suggest), but it's really just improving the signal-to-noise ratio.

      My biggest problem is that "journalistic integrity" or whatever the hell they're calling it now seems to require that journalists as a whole do not self-select for topical incompetence or lack of understanding. Evidently, telling the story at all, in whatever manner, is more important then telling it correctly.
  24. It's not the Media, it's the Scientists by E++99 · · Score: 2, Informative

    As the article points out, the speculation that the color preference was to help women gather berries was on the part of the scientists who wrote the paper, not the journalists. And of course, if men had preferred the redder colors, they would have said it was an evolutionary adaptation to give them sensory reinforcement when spearing a woolly mammoth. I agree with the article, and I always get annoyed reading the circular, baseless speculation on the evolutionary causes of whatever is discovered. It has no place in a scientific paper. Give a little room to the unknown. Don't just throw it in the nearest a bucket like a retard.

    BTW, the article, with the graphs from the study, which are interesting, is here: http://www.badscience.net/?p=518

  25. The colors were "good luck" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0
    I can't provide a source, but I once read something along the lines that blue was considered a kind of "protective color" for boys in some European cultures.
    Years later, girls needed a color of their own, so they just got pink.

    Sink your Roosterteeth into that!

    1. Re:The colors were "good luck" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's like that, but slightly different. Historically reds (including pink) were for boys, for the simple reason that red dyes were more expensive, and society was patriarchal. During Victorian times, however, they hit a period of unusually high male infant mortality, so they started dressing girls and boys the same to "confuse" the illness, then later boys were switched out of the "common" color to a color of their own again.

      Regrettably I am at this time unable to site a reliable source, as there seems to be no one on the interwebs who gives a damn about victorian infant fashions.

    2. Re:The colors were "good luck" by IWannaBeAnAC · · Score: 1

      Regrettably I am at this time unable to site a reliable source, as there seems to be no one on the interwebs who gives a damn about victorian infant fashions.
      Argh, that would seriously dent my faith in the internet, if there is truely not a single site out there devoted to victorian infant fashion. In fact, I don't believe it; google gives quite a lot of results for 'victorian infant fashion', and some of them might even be relevant.
  26. Stupid by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    That's stupid. A hundred years ago it was pink for boys and blue for girls.
    Google Answers

  27. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by grassy_knoll · · Score: 2, Funny
    Wait...

    A degree in journalism doesn't teach you much about the real world.


    You mean a liberal arts degree doesn't have anything to do with the real world?

    I'm shocked... SHOCKED I say!

    Well ok. Not that shocked.

    [snicker]
  28. Didn't that change in the last century or so? by seebs · · Score: 1

    I have a vague notion that it was the other way around in Western culture about 200 years ago. I could be wrong.

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  29. Why should they report science accurately? by tompaulco · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Whenever I watch a news story about something which I know something about, I find that they are inaccurate or misrepresentative. Interestingly, I find that even though I KNOW they have facts wrong on every single occasion that they reported on something I had knowledge of, it doesn't seem to shake me from accepting as accurate the items they report on of which I have NO knowledge. I believe this to be the case with most people.

    --
    If you are not allowed to question your government then the government has answered your question.
    1. Re:Why should they report science accurately? by kebes · · Score: 2, Insightful
      Michael Crichton calls this the "Murray Gell-Mann Amnesia effect"--people tend to continue to trust mainstream media even though they consider mainstream reporting on any subject they are knowledgeable about to be imprecise or outright erroneous.

      In this essay, Crichton writes:

      Media carries with it a credibility that is totally undeserved. ... You open the newspaper to an article on some subject you know well. In Murray's case, physics. In mine, show business. You read the article and see the journalist has absolutely no understanding of either the facts or the issues. ... then turn the page to national or international affairs, and read with renewed interest as if the rest of the newspaper was somehow more accurate about far-off Palestine than it was about the story you just read. ...

      I'd point out it does not operate in other arenas of life. In ordinary life, if somebody consistently exaggerates or lies to you, you soon discount everything they say. ... But when it comes to the media, we believe against evidence that it is probably worth our time to read other parts of the paper. When, in fact, it almost certainly isn't.
      Though this is a rather cynical interpretation of mainstream media, I've found the same thing. On any subject I consider myself knowledgeable, I have found mainstream media's reporting to be very lacking. As a result, I've given up trying to get useful information from those sources. Unfortunately, if you want to gain even a superficial understanding of a subject, you have to do some basic independent research, reading from different sources, engaging an expert in conversation, and so on.
    2. Re:Why should they report science accurately? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So because you don't know about some subject, along with a majority of the populace, they should just make up BS? It seems to me if most people are likely to believe news stories, media, etc, that they should report as accurately as possible.

    3. Re:Why should they report science accurately? by svunt · · Score: 1
      I'm glad this is coming up in the discussion, because it's something I've recently started to notice, in the context of technology. In Australia, our two big parties are fighting it out over who's going to bring enormous bandwidth to more of the masses. Knowing a wee bit about the subject, I've been staggered by the inability of our MSM to even notice that neither plan includes a single extra submarine cable...basically they're both looking at giving the whole population fibre to the node, or to the home, but have no plans to increase the bandwidth available to the nation as a whole, which is really what we need more than anything. I hear about how all of us will have 12mbps, but not much about sitting in latency hell for three days waiting to get to the head of the queue so you can check your email, which is what will happen when we all get super-duper internets with no increased capacity at a national level.

      Having noted that, I've been referring various folk with various skills to news stories that I'm iffy about, and there's a near-complete consensus that the media has not a fucking clue what it's talking about.

      You get a communications degree then you go directly into the field, reporting on anything BUT your field, which is communication.

    4. Re:Why should they report science accurately? by RealGrouchy · · Score: 1

      This is one of the things I love about wikis: when you see something you know is wrong, you can just go and fix it (yes, with all the requisite risks).

      I appreciate very much that the CBC has two links (among others) on their news stories: one called "report typo" and one called "Submit feedback". This is an admission that they sometimes make mistakes, and are willing to correct them.

      I once submitted a correction on an article that was two or three years old, and they still phoned me up to get the right information to fix it.

      For newspapers, I just read them at the coffeeshop and write comments in the margins about the angles that they totally missed. Bwa ha ha! The world is my wiki!

      - RG>

      --
      Hey pal, this isn't a pleasantforest, so don't waste my time with pleasantries!
    5. Re:Why should they report science accurately? by shilly · · Score: 1

      There's another way of looking at this, though. We've all heard experts droning on interminably about the minutiae of their field of knowledge when called to discuss a news story. Experts are frequently unable to see the wood for the trees, and insist that you can only understand in issue if you have comprehensive knowledge of every last nuance. This is just as unhelpful to the interested lay reader as a journalist's story which, when simplifying, gets important facts wrong.

  30. What an absurd hypothesis! by 0xdeadbeef · · Score: 4, Funny

    Everyone knows that men prefer blue because it stands out against the red Martian landscape.

    Women prefer pink because the thick Venusian atmosphere blocks the higher wavelengths of light.

  31. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down or Up? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    It does not matter what is said just so long as it was said well.

  32. which cultures did this cover? by amigabill · · Score: 1

    I was given a good talking to when I complained about the pink logoing for the Subaru STI cars. The dealer told me how in Japan that this "pink" in my mind is caled "cherry blossom red", which is a very masculine color in Japan, since the cherry blossoms come out in spring season, and spring is seen as a very masculine time of year in that country.

    This particular blue vs pink thing may have come out very different in different parts of the world. If it was all down to evolution and looking for berries, why would there be such differences from one region to another in terms of the "genderness" of these colors?

    1. Re:which cultures did this cover? by Jesus_666 · · Score: 1

      Obviousl, the only possible explanation would be that the Japanese evolved independently from us. It's just a freak coincidence that they happen to be genetically compatible. Otherwise the fine article would be wrong, which is completely and utterly ridiculous.

      --
      USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
    2. Re:which cultures did this cover? by walter_f · · Score: 1

      This particular blue vs pink thing may have come out very different in different parts of the world.

      Well said.

      In the sixteenth century it was the habit at the royal Spanish court to dress the royal boys in red/pink, their sisters wearing light blue - the classic "baby colours" of our days, just the other way round. In those days, the Spanish court had a lot of influence on the French court, which in turn influenced all the other courts in Europe.

      In my theory, babies' and childrens' clothes chosen like this (or the other way round) was a way to show extreme wealth and power. The material was mostly silk, the dyes were most probably indigo and purple (both very expensive then).

      These colors became affordable to the commoners only later when blue and bright red pigments became available as cheaper products from easier accessible overseas "sources" (such as big-scale farming in the colonies) and, eventually, the rising chemical industry.

      Somewhere in this "trickle-down" process from the royal household to Mr. and Mrs. Jenkins, the assignment of pink to boys and blue to girls was reversed. Maybe just a little misunderstanding. :-)

    3. Re:which cultures did this cover? by Sj0 · · Score: 1

      Actually, I read once that pink was considered a very masculine colour until relatively recently in modern times too. It was considered a lighter version of red, which is obviously the man's colour.

      --
      It's been a long time.
    4. Re:which cultures did this cover? by identity0 · · Score: 1

      Nowadays I think even they have gotten into the pink = girls thing, but I like how their traditional children's colors are bolder primary colors instead of the washed-out pastels of the west.

      IIRC, in Japan it used to be black for boys, red(crimson) for girls. Way more powerful, even for the girls.

  33. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by MontyApollo · · Score: 1

    >>Meanwhile, reporters run around and act like journalism is some sacred religion, exempt from the law, to be placed above God and country.

    It's amazing how many reporters are like that. It is particularly sad because of how lousy reporters generally are. Everybody I know that has been interviewed or questioned by reporters were misquoted. Often the reporter was trying to dress up a statement and ended up twisting what the person was actually saying, but they were too stupid or arrogant to realize it.

  34. No no its RED vs BLUE by UberHoser · · Score: 1

    Donut: It's not pink, it's lightish red.

    --
    Guns are for wimps... Use a crossbow.. this way you can pin them to their chair when you go postal.
  35. Guardian = Weekly World? by peter303 · · Score: 1

    Matt Drudge links to the Guardian all the time.

    1. Re:Guardian = Weekly World? by SEMW · · Score: 1

      Not at all. It's a respected, very well typeset, slightly left-of-centre British broadsheet (technically Berliner).

      --
      What's purple and commutes? An Abelian grape.
  36. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by myowntrueself · · Score: 1

    It isn't just science. The media screw up everything: Law, medicine, politics, sports of course since sportwriters all all nerds, you name it.

    And since, in a democracy, the majority of people who vote at all base their vote on what the media presents to them, the entire system of government is also screwed up.

    --
    In the free world the media isn't government run; the government is media run.
  37. My Answer To Your Question: by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Yes.

    K. Trout, C.I.O.

  38. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by AvitarX · · Score: 3, Funny

    and when I hear the term "journalistic ethic" I cringe.

    And coming from a lawyer it really drives the point home how bad journalists are.

    --
    Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
  39. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Agree completely - the media is a bunch of fuck-ups. On every news story where I've known the real story first-hand, on everything from articles specifically about me in small town papers to major news outlet coverage of national events they have gotten significant details completely wrong, often in cases where they had asked specific questions on that subject - ie. it wasn't interpretation or simply filling in the blanks. And it typically wasn't mistakes made in the name of sensationalism and such - just basic factual errors that I can attribute to nothing more then laziness and stupidity.

  40. ftw by ze_nexus · · Score: 1

    "This concentration on innate biological difference between (let's be frank) oppressor and oppressed is so discredited in the racial arena, it's functionally an academic taboo. How did we never manage to discredit the same impulse in the business of gender?" Well said. *applause*

    1. Re:ftw by cmpalmer · · Score: 1

      Because, genetically, race doesn't have a genetic or even a biological basis - gender most obviously does (biological, that is). More specifically, variations in epigenetic expression are broader within a "race" (grouped as an ethnic group or by skin color) than the genetic differences between the "races", and these variances greatly overlap the "racial" groupings. Therefore it is perfectly correct to investigate evolutionary biological factors, even if they might exist in a higher concentration within an ethnic group, particularly if their mating choices were limited, but not to research differences between "black" and "white" people or "Europeans" vs. "Chinese" since those categories have no genetic basis other than a few shared morphological traits which are expressed by a handful of genetic sequences. On the other hand, genetic influences that might be tied to cultural co-evolution are necessarily tied to neural development which is controlled by thousands of genes - hence the wider variance in possible expression independent of any concept of "race".

      An even better question is why the Creationists believe in variance in human nature (even though attribute it to original sin and free will rather than evolution) and believe that living in a "good" or "bad" environment also can affect your basic nature, but the modern social science movements accept the obvious facts of biological evolution, but deny that it has anything relevant to say about culture and behavior. It's probably the only think the Creationists might have right, even though their theory behind it is nonsense.

      It is increasingly obvious that the academic culture surrounding psychology and sociology (and other "humanistic" sciences) is increasingly dogmatic and close-minded. If they stay locked away, I think the biologists, molecular biologists, and cognitive psychologists will rightful take over their fields of study and render them obsolete.

      --
      -- stream of did I lock the front door consciousness
    2. Re:ftw by ze_nexus · · Score: 1

      I see your point. I agree with your comments regarding the close-mindedness of psychology and sociology. I have felt, for sometime, that these fields are taught and studied in too linear a fashion. It's not really the best analogy but: putting all energy into studying/examining a single puzzle piece won't solve the puzzle.

    3. Re:ftw by Sj0 · · Score: 1

      It might be their destiny to become obsolete.

      Back in the days when science first began to re-emerge after the dark ages, early Christian scientists found that the only way to escape persecution was to start with simple, verifiable hypotheses, and build from there. It's how the modern, highly systematic, scientific method was born. The greeks, for all their brilliant insights, lived very much in their own heads, which is why things like Democritus' theory of the atom was never as popular as the theory of four elements. Even though one was more correct, the other was more popular, and there was never anything but ideas at stake.

      Psychology and sociology, as sciences, they're more like the greeks. They form these sweeping, general theories, without any attempt to understand the frameworks in place. They'll sometimes stumble across an amazing revelation (Just like Alchemists discovered many things about chemistry despite understanding none of it), but in the end, I can't help but think that it'll be the biochemists who finally build the best model for the mind. Trying to understand the brain through the study of being a person inside that brain is like trying to understand motor vehicles by driving your car around. Sure, you'll get some insights, but I'd bet my last dollar that the guy who rips the car apart and puts it back together a million times is going to know it far better than you'll ever know it by driving it a million miles.

      --
      It's been a long time.
  41. It is always men and women by Glowing+Fish · · Score: 1

    One interesting thing about these studies is they always point out the difference between men and women. Perhaps because that is something that people can giving a knowing chuckle about over their morning tea, because everyone knows that women are naturally more sophisticated and men are naturally the hunters.
    Notice how none of these evolutionary geneticists are writing about how black people got a sense of rhythm because of some remnant of their stone age past, and that the Chinese aren't good at math because the proto-Chinese used math in their mammoth hunts, etc.
    That aside,

    A little over a year ago, I wrote my own critique, called Women, Men and the Bad Scientific Study of the Week

    --
    Hopefully I didn't put any [] around my words.
    1. Re:It is always men and women by Jesus_666 · · Score: 1

      Notice how none of these evolutionary geneticists are writing about how black people got a sense of rhythm because of some remnant of their stone age past, and that the Chinese aren't good at math because the proto-Chinese used math in their mammoth hunts, etc.

      Not to forget that the proto-Germans hunted animals by running over them with early cars and the proto-Swiss killed mammoths by covering them in liquid chocolate.

      --
      USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
    2. Re:It is always men and women by Glowing+Fish · · Score: 1

      Now I am imagining rosy-cheeked, blond-pigtailed Swiss misses drowning mammoths in floods of chocolate...

      And just when we think every type of porn has been invented on the internet!

      --
      Hopefully I didn't put any [] around my words.
  42. OMG PONIES!!!!1!!!1! by Tatisimo · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Shouldn't this article be tagged omgponies?

    --
    Give Kashyyyk back to the Wookies
  43. Re: Simpsons quotations by Dystopian+Rebel · · Score: 1

    Sir, while my peers were watching the Simpsons, I was doing homework.

    Now I depend on Slashdot and Wikipedia for all my facts. ;o)

    --
    Rich And Stupid is not so bad as Working For Rich And Stupid.
  44. Wow, What an Amazing Attack on Science by cmpalmer · · Score: 1

    Quite simply, basic research does need to be done to test hypotheses about whether behaviors are based on biologically inheritable traits or cultural environment and to what extent each has a role. Both extremes, "culture has nothing to do with evolutionary biology" vs. "human behavior has nothing to do with culture", are, of course absurd. So why is this research in any way contentious? Why would anyone be afraid of the idea that, horrors!, some behavioral tendencies are either genetic, sex differentiated, or both? It has been shown time and time again in research that there are both cultural constants that correlated to evolutionary biology and that there are behavioral variations within a culture that correspond to genetic makeup and to differentiated development due to variations in sexual hormones during fetal development. Blinding yourself to avenues of research or labeling those who honestly pursue those avenues of research as bigots and Nazis is just sticking your head in the sand and pretending that goal oriented social engineering is going to change human nature. I don't see where anyone can extract a value judgment or a sustain a bigoted attitude based on these studies. Nobody is saying, "Girls like pink, therefore they are sissies" or even that "All girls like pink", just that within a population, there is a statistically significant predilection that tracks gender.

    --
    -- stream of did I lock the front door consciousness
    1. Re:Wow, What an Amazing Attack on Science by Oktober+Sunset · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The problem is not that they decided to do the research. The problem is the utter bullshit way they did it and the absolute bollocks they concluded.

      What they said was was girls are genetically predisposed to like red, and boys are genetically predisposed to like blue. Now there is a problem with this because of one small fact. Their study does not show that at all! The British and Chinese group showed different results, and they were the only 2 cultures they tested, that doesn't eliminate cultural bias at all, and the results showed there was cultural differences, but they just ignored that.

      Second they then went on to say it was an evolutionary trait because cave women pick berries and cavemen went hunting. WTF???!?! A) There is no evidence whatsoever supporting that idea of primitive gender roles, someone just made it up. B) They measured preference, not ability to recognise the colour, plus, most berries aren't red, and what's more many poisonous red berries are poisonous, plus berries are tiny, other fruits are much better. C) they just pulled that straight out of their arses.

      No one said they are bigots or Nazis, they said they are chumps, complete and utter chumps, who wasted their time on a dumb subject, and fucked it up anyway, then talked utter shit about their own fucked up, incorrect results.

      Fact is evolutionary psychology is not science, and all the people who eat it up like it is are chumps, utter chumps. The basic structure of every evolutionary psychology study I've ever seen is this:

      1. Gather statistics on some human behaviour.

      2. Draw conclusion that confirms what most people expect.

      3. Pull from your ass some supposed beneficial behaviour based on stereotypical 'caveman' society, with an evidence whatsoever, and claim this is the purpose of said human behaviour.

      4. Call your self a scientist, and watch the journalists lap it up like a bunch of chumps.

    2. Re:Wow, What an Amazing Attack on Science by mdwh2 · · Score: 1

      Agreed. Also as far as I can tell, the research didn't show that boys had any preference towards blue, but the media assumed this to be true also.

  45. Revelations? by Porchroof · · Score: 2, Insightful

    There is no book named "Revelations" in the Bible. You may be thinking of the book of "Revelation", which is short for the "Revelation of St. John the Divine".

    --
    Fata viam invenient.
    1. Re:Revelations? by Sj0 · · Score: 0

      "Revelation of St. John the Divine", which is of course short for "Revelation of St. John the Divine who was bat-shit insane and wrote a long and ridiculously metaphorical tirade against the Romans which is even more nonsensical than your typical Slashdotters anti-SCO tirades, all because he got booted off out of Rome"

      No wonder people shorten it! Proof of Divinity though, how could anyone but God have known about slashdotters and SCO back in the year 30?

      --
      It's been a long time.
    2. Re:Revelations? by burndive · · Score: 1

      I believe the actual title (given within the book itself) is "The Revelation of Jesus Christ".

      --
      ...because "hacker" sounds way sexier than "code drone."
    3. Re:Revelations? by Spaseboy · · Score: 1

      If I was shipwrecked in a storm and suffered from a high fever while hiding in a cave, I may have a "revelation" myself. Of course now it would be called delusions.

      --
      "I don't want more choice, I just want nicer things!"
      -Jennifer Saunders as Edina Monsoon
  46. once upon a time... by penguinbroker · · Score: 2, Funny

    a professor i work with on autonomous modular robotics was interviewed a couple years back on the future implications of his research. generally our goals are search and rescue missions and possible space missions (reconfigurable robots are just so much more space-friendly) and the majority of our work has been towards these two milestones. the journalist, however, arrived at the interview with the fantastic vision of shrinking down these robots to nanoscale sizes and continuously (about a dozen times) asked if these robots would one day be able to enter the human body for medical purposes...

    as you can imagine, my professor wasn't too amused but eventually gave in after the twelfth time being asked the question with an emphatic 'sure, why not.' and what do you know, the headline that week was something along the lines of 'Scientists creating robots to enter the human body.' we still haven't heard from any doctors yet....

  47. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Isn't it funny how "journalism" is the only so-called academic discipline that ends in "-ism"? The only things I know of that end in "-ism" are either religions or diseases. So which is it?

  48. RE: Pink, Blue, and Bad Science by Cardiakke · · Score: 0

    Oh my God! It is in the Guardian! it must be TRUE!!!! (and if you doubt it, even just a little, you know in the back of your mind. WE KNOW WHERE YOU WILL END UP YOU FILTHY DEGENERATE RIGHTIST)

  49. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by Jesus_666 · · Score: 1

    Journalistic ethic is a bit like computer scientists' ethic - both have the power to screw up things in a horrible fashion (they misinform people by doing their work badly, we kill jobs by doing our work well) and both more or less follow a certain thic to keep us from abusing said power (they try to monitor themselves, many universities tell first-grade CS students that developing the control systems for cruise missiles is somewhat unethical).

    In the end we booth can do what we want - if you want to help develop a better cruise missile there are plenty of defense contractors who are happy to hear that; if they want to write bullshit there's plenty of maggazines, papers and TV stations who will employ them. Like the hippocratic oath, such work ethics are a nice thing to have, but in the end everyone can decide to ignore them. It's better to have them, though - by showing fledgling journalists/scientists/etc. an ideal of how they should be, some do keep aspiring to meet it. Of course they hide behind their ethic, but there often are other reporters who point out how much bullshit they're talking - a nice example for Europe's biggest tabloid would be http://bildblog.de/ [in German].

    Just imagine how bad journalists would be if they were told "write anything you want as long as it sounds good" from the get-go. *shivers*

    --
    USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
  50. Science and Denialism by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    One of the problems, is sometimes the media gets science wrong out of ignorance.
    Other times, there's a 'reason'. Either it's a well oiled PR firm or political gain.

    I love this site that blogs about bad science and reference the other CRANKS and WONKS out there that continuously spout off the wrong information and call it science.

    They've deemed it the art of Denialism:

    This one is classic:

    How to write a Terrible Science Paper:
    http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/2007/09/how_to_w rite_a_terrible_scienc.php

    Or Does Smoking Pot Cause Schizophrenia?

    http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/2007/07/does_smo king_cannabis_cause_sc.php

    http://www.scienceblogs.com/denialism/

    Great stuff!

    1. Re:Science and Denialism by Max+Littlemore · · Score: 1

      I just read the thing on smoking pot and I'm quite convinced the debunking is just as sciency as the study it seeks to debunk.

      There's a classic circular argument in there regarding smoking tobacco. I read some research (don't remember where) that nicotine reduces the symptoms of schizophrenia, which in part explains why they smoke so much. There is actually work going on to develop tobacco based drugs for this reason.

      Not saying the debunking is completely crap, in fact I agree with the main chicken and egg thrust of it, but it is about as solid as the story it's critisising, so it's a bit hypocritical and doesn't really offer anything of significant benefit to the debate. Thanks anyway.

      In answer to the inevitable "you're being a hypocrite too" comments, I'm posting on /., not blogging and attempting to pass myself off as an expert.

      --
      I don't therefore I'm not.
  51. Ben Goldacre's article is excellent by Pluvius · · Score: 2

    It describes exactly why the research isn't saying what the scientists claim that it's saying. Zoe Williams' article, on the other hand, is a piece of anti-scientific trash. She seems to think that research is pointless unless there's money to be gained out of it, and cowardly pulls out the race card on anything that looks into the differences between groups of people.

    Rob

    1. Re:Ben Goldacre's article is excellent by tehcyder · · Score: 0, Troll

      cowardly pulls out the race card on anything that looks into the differences between groups of people
      In the UK most intelligent people are not fundamentally racist, and therefore would agree with Ms Williams that pseudo-scientific research into proving the superiority of one race over another is simply a waste of time on principle, just as the attempt to prove sexist stereotypes is.

      Things might be different in other countries, of course.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    2. Re:Ben Goldacre's article is excellent by Pluvius · · Score: 1

      Looking at the differences between groups of people is the same as trying to prove that one race is superior to another... how, exactly?

      Rob

    3. Re:Ben Goldacre's article is excellent by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      Because in the past the results of such vague concepts as the average intelligence of a particular race has been used to support racist beliefs, so the whole idea is tainted, in the eyes of many people.

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
  52. How bout these blue apples: by happyemoticon · · Score: 1

    I prefer blue because I can see it. Like 10% of the male population, I'm red-green colorblind.

  53. Fight oppression! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Notice the Guardian moans about pop science to suit its agenda. To them, evolutionary psychology is a tool of white/male/rich/zionist oppression since it often comes to conclusions that are not politically correct. I don't expect to hear them moaning about the greater volume of environmentalist pseudoscience that's pumped out by the tree. Take this recent BBC article which misleads the audience in to thinking ordinary PCs have 1200 watt PSUs and this is melting the icecaps. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/click_online /6950960.stm

    1. Re:Fight oppression! by Sj0 · · Score: 1

      To be fair, I had to do a triple or quadruple-take when I saw 1kW supplies for sale. I remember when a regular PSU was 250W, and that'd do for whatever you wanted to do. seeing a 1kW PSU makes me seriously wonder about whether I'd want a hyper-modern PC in my home.

      --
      It's been a long time.
  54. Along those lines by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I've seen a real problem with researchers seeming to always want to report the results as though it supports their hypothesis, probably in the interest of continued funding. My experience with this is mainly limited to the behavioural sciences, mostly as related to cognitive psychology but man, you want to talk about some SHITTY papers that get published. They'll gloss over large portions of their methods, consolidate hundreds of points of data in to 3 numbers and not provide the originals, write conclusions that vastly overstate what was found and sometimes even run contrary to the evidence and so on.

    To be clear: This isn't crap in a newspaper, this is crap from actual academic journals. We are talking things bad enough that a smart undergrad can find sever problems with it in 5 minutes.

    As far as I can tell it is this attitude that to keep getting grants, you have to generate "results" and "results" mean being right. So doing a study and proving your hypothesis wrong isn't ok. Even doing a study that indicates something very weakly and suggests further research isn't ok. Nope, you've got to come to a strong conclusion, the evidence be damned!

    So I am with you in saying it isn't 1005 the media's fault. They cannot be expected to be experts in everything, you can't expect them to read over every paper and carefully review the whole thing. They more or less have to assume that's been done and take the abstract to be correct. In my experience, it isn't in a shocking number of cases.

  55. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by AvitarX · · Score: 1

    many universities tell first-grade CS students that developing the control systems for cruise missiles is somewhat unethical).

    Much better to carpet bomb than hit your target.

    --
    Wow, sent an e-mail as suggested when clicking on "use classic" banner, and got a fast response that addressed my msg
  56. Careful what you say... by Estanislao+Mart�nez · · Score: 2, Insightful

    In anthropological etymology [...]

    "Anthropological etymology"? What's that?

    Universal constraints on color vocabular inventories were one of the major paradigm cases of cognitive anthropology back in the 1960's (as was analysis of folk etymologies, and prototype concepts). However, it would be good if you didn't make up terms like "anthropological etymology" to refer to this sort of stuff.

    [...] it's common for the first two words for color in a language to represent warmer colors (reddish) and cooler colors (bluish or greenish, although which one of these comes first is split somewhat).

    Careful how you state this. In what sense are those two words "first"?

    As a language evolves to have more vocabulary, it's typical that finer distinctions are made among colors and more words are added to represent them.

    ...and the actual evidence for this is what?

    (We have cross-linguistic surveys of color vocabularies that support the hypothesis that color term systems must follow certain patterns. While this is certainly suggestive about possible patterns of language change, I don't think there is much in the way of direct evidence for what you're claiming here.)

    It's possible the color words which are perceived differently by a particular race or which made the most difference to survival (think poisonous plants and animals vs. food sources) for people at the time and place of the language's early development lead to different color words coming about in different orders.

    This is rank speculation on your part.

  57. Only if they are a minority by Estanislao+Mart�nez · · Score: 1

    The gene for driving on the right would thrive in a population where it outnumbered the gene for driving on the left. For example, if a small group of people with a recessive mutation for driving on the right were to be thrown together into an isolated island, driving on the right would have a good chance of becoming epidemic among their inbred offspring.

  58. Put up or shut up by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maybe those homeless people should get jobs so they could afford a place to live. That way, you know, people like you wouldn't have cause to get self righteously indignant over the cost of improving the transportation infrastructure. Seriously, until you're spending your nights and weekends volunteering in soup kitchens and homeless shelters, you're not doing anything but politically correct whining when you talk about the poor, poor homeless people. Put *your* time and money where your mouth is, or shut the fuck up.

  59. It goes both ways! by Amitz+Sekali · · Score: 1

    Consider the perspective of drivers in front of you!

    Therefore if more people drive on the right side, the left driver will be eliminated from the gene pool.

    --
    If you delay pleasure infinitely, the pleasure will be infinite. (YM)
  60. Pink because of favorite body part ... by AHumbleOpinion · · Score: 1

    Men picked the colors. Pink was chosen because it represents a favorite body part of women. For those slashdotters who are really confused, log out, leave the basement, and avoid coming back until this all makes sense.

  61. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down or Up? by Sj0 · · Score: 2, Funny

    Well said.

    --
    It's been a long time.
  62. Pink/Blue -- Litmus test by Torodung · · Score: 1

    Well, you see, it's all based on litmus paper. Girls are more acidic and therefore when dipped in liquefied girl, the paper stays pink. Boys are acerbic, so when dipped in liquefied boy, the paper turns blue.

    Brings a whole new dimension to "pH+ balanced for a woman," eh?

    --
    Toro

  63. Re:Science Journalism - Thumbs Down or Up? by Assassin+bug · · Score: 1

    Indeed. "What matters" is relative to the forum. I think election politics suit your thesis better than science writing.

  64. pink is for boys, blue is for girls by msblack · · Score: 1

    Anyone willing to do some basic research and reading (this takes effort!) could easily locate a preponderance of evidence that Gainsborough's famous painting The Blue Boy had significant cultural impact in changing gender color roles. Not too long ago, it was customary for boys to wear pink and girls to wear blue. This isn't bad science, but simply a matter of finding historic cultural references. But in this modern lazy Slashdot society, people want simple answers without having to search and read sources beyond Wikipedia and the World Wide Web. Peer-reviewed journals are by far the most credible source for new theories and research. Research can also go beyond journals by gathering cultural artifacts (a few counter examples does not necessarily disprove any theory) and interviewing individuals.

    --
    signature pending slashdot approval
  65. You Do Not Know What You're Talking About... by rmckeethen · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It isn't just science. The media screw up everything: Law, medicine, politics, sports of course since sportwriters all all nerds, you name it. We don't notice it in other fields because nobody is an expert in every field. As a lawyer, I notice how bad they screw up the law. I'm sure doctors, scientists - anyone who is an expert - notices it in their field. A degree in journalism doesn't teach you much about the real world.

    You're absolutely right -- a degree in journalism doesn't teach you much about the real world. It's not designed to. A journalist's *sources* are supposed to teach readers about what's important in science, technology, medicine, politics, legal affairs, etc. Journalists' own thoughts on any given subject should never be apparent in the finished product, specifically because journalists often do not know the first thing about science, technology, medicine, politics, legal affairs, etc. A degree in journalism isn't supposed to educate on any of these subjects; the degree teaches you how to write well, how to interview sources and, most importantly, how to get out and find news that's interesting to the average reader.

    I have an extremely low opinion of journalism, and when I hear the term "journalistic ethic" I cringe. In addition to the reporter's biases we also have to account for their stupidity and laziness.

    Interestingly enough, many journalists I know also have an extremely low opinion of today's mainstream media too. Over the past couple of decades, most working journalists have witnessed a strong shift in their organizations, from a previous focus on high-quality news gathering and journalistic integrity towards a profit-centered business structure that leaves little room for in-depth and/or investigative reporting. While I won't argue the stupidity comment -- but do keep in mind that it takes time to educate yourself in a subject, and time is a commodity few working journalists have much of these days -- I think you're dead wrong that today's journalists are simply 'lazy' in their efforts to report the news. Most modern newsrooms I know of have sharply reduced the number of reporters on staff from what they enjoyed a few decades ago, yet these organizations continue to churn-out the same number of news stories in a given period of time. See this recent memo from a Bay Area news organization to get a first-hand look at newsroom consolidation in action. Consolidation certainly doesn't speak to lazy reporters; is speaks to journalists who are, in almost every case, overworked, poorly-paid and under constant stress to produce something on deadline, anything that will help fill the daily news-hole. If you want to point the finger and place blame for the increasingly piss-poor reporting in newspapers, magazines and on television these days, you might want to try aiming your mark a little higher in these news organizations. I guarantee you that the problem is a lot more complex than the shoddy work of a few 'stupid' or 'lazy' reporters.

    Meanwhile, reporters run around and act like journalism is some sacred religion, exempt from the law, to be placed above God and country. Nonsense.

    Sadly, the 'sacredness' of their religion is just about the only thing left to motivate modern news reporters, so don't knock their faith; they sure as hell aren't in it for the money, and they definitely aren't in it for the respect. At least in my area, starting salary for teachers is higher than the starting salary for reporters, and I don't see too many teachers threatened with legal action or bodily harm just for doing their jobs.

    You may not like how today's reporters do their jobs, but keep in mind that their job is still an important one. I'm glad that someone is still willing to do that job. I don't think it's an easy one. But before you pop-off on the poor journalist, do yourself a

    1. Re:You Do Not Know What You're Talking About... by Stradivarius · · Score: 1

      You make a lot of valid points, and I agree we shouldn't knock reporters too much. I'm sure most are genuinely trying to do the best job they can with the increasingly limited time and resources they have. And it's certainly not possible for them to be experts in everything, so some mistakes will be made.

      But the GP's larger point is still valid, namely that we have a system in which the organizations responsible for informing and educating the populace about current events are doing a generally poor job. For every excellent organization like the Washington Post, New York Times, or Wall Street Journal, we've got dozens of embarrassingly poor newspapers in smaller markets. And even those are better than the 24-hour news networks. Despite being free of the space constraints of physical publishers, they manage to produce even less detailed stories, which they then simply repeat ad infinitum throughout the day. I've almost given up on watching them at all.

      I happen to think that reporters are more concerned with this problem than most people. I've often heard them lament the shrinking budgets for serious news reporting, versus coverage of celebrity misbehaviors and other classic tabloid fare. But how do we address the problem? Would media consolidation allow economies of scale to support better reporting, or would it just turn new outlets into the equivalent of Clear Channel?

  66. I wouldn't say most of them by Moraelin · · Score: 1

    Well, I wouldn't say _most_ of them. There is a lot of honest research, it just doesn't make headlines.

    E.g., since you mention all the "OMFG! It's teh cure for cancer!" articles, in at least 90% of cases that's not what the researcher said. The researcher usually said something closer to "hmm, well, it might possibly help against some types of cancers, but we don't know that yet, more research is needed. And, oh, it only worked on mice not humans so far, so hold your horses." It was the media that blew it out of proportion.

    This isn't to say that such flawed studies, or prejudice-motivated studies don't exist. They do. God knows the idea of trying to pack a prejudice or political agenda as only science is centuries-old, and PR dressed as pseudo-science is even more common. It's just that they get disproportionately more media attention than the honest research.

    Remember, journalism _needs_ big headlines. It also needs "controversy". In fact, a lot of the fucked-up idea of journalistic impartiality is based on showing at least two conflicting points of view, as equals, and without telling the readers that one is a recognized scientist and one is a quack with a faked diploma... and not even in the right field. If they told you that, then it would be taking sides, thus no longer "impartial".

    Another kind of research which the media loves is: PR disguised as research. I wouldn't be surprised if this kind of "blue vs pink" research was that.

    It goes sorta like this: let's say I had a company, Moraelin's Snake Oil Co. It does the normal advertising too, of course, but let's say I feel there's a need for an extra push to tell people to buy more snake oil. So I go to a PR agency. These guys are _good_ at faking journalism or faking research. So they write a bogus piece of pseudo-research that says "anti-cancer enzyme found in snake oil!" or "the formula for the perfect day to apply snake oil calculated!" (neatly timed to coincide with my product launch).

    Now so far it would look almost comical, if it was my company that released it. So they'll find someone with a Prof or Dr title to sign it. Most will say "take a hike", but eventually they find someone, let's call him Prof Weasel, who essentially has nothing to lose. It's not like he had a respected name in the scientific community anyway. Sure, he'll take their thirty silvers and sign their paper.

    And from there the PR agency carpet-bombs all newspapers and news agencies with it.

    So Joe Average buys the newspaper and or sees it discussed on whatever site, and thinks it's genuine. Now my purposes there are served regardless of whether he actually believes every word there, or goes, "ha ha, these 'scientists' are all such arse clowns. Why's my tax money paying for this crap?" Even in the latter case, now he's also less likely to listen to the real scientists telling him that my snake oil is just that: snake oil. At the very least, the seed of doubt has been planted into his brain: maybe we don't understand snake oil after all, maybe if you asked 5 scientists you got 6 different answers, and maybe there's really no difference between the quack telling him to buy snake oil and the doctor telling him to buy clindamycin.

    And either way, he's been reminded that snake oil exists, and at least one newspaper told him it even works, so essentially it was some disguised marketing.

    And the newspapers sold some extra copies with that headline, so they're happy too. They're not going to wring the neck of the goose that lays golden eggs, by debunking it instead of running the headline.

    *sigh* Perhaps the biggest damage that 20'th-21'st journalism has done is creating the false impression that all research is like that, and all researchers are a bunch of arse-clowns.

    --
    A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
  67. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by Jesus_666 · · Score: 1

    Yup, that's one of the small gotchas.

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    USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
  68. Only One of Many More and Worse by DynaSoar · · Score: 1

    The reported science and media coverage was bad. But not as bad as many more, present outlet included.

    Having grunt writers cover science stories from press releases rather than having science editors or at least science trained journalists cover makes it worse to print the resulting bilge rather than just leave it out. Invariably the under-, mis- and non-trained end up writing to the formula that makes it look like ever result reported is a breakthrough that nobody's ever seen before, which is almost never the case. Almost all are just another step built on many previous that showed the same thing, just maybe not in this particular fashion.

    I don't give a genus Rattus's posterior extremity reflecting lower frequency visible EM radiation how much science they actually know, they can well learn how to accurately report the science and where it fits into the history of relevant research.

    If Alan Boyle ever leaves MSNBC, I hope he gets a post at a university training both science and journalism students how to report to the public accurately and without the bogus sensationalizing. I'll travel to where ever and sign up for his first class.

    Maybe that kind of position would give you the time to finish your book, Alan.

    --
    "I may be synthetic, but I'm not stupid." -- Bishop 341-B
  69. What color should you paint the nursery? by argent · · Score: 1

    Beige.

    We didn't paint the kids rooms specific colors until they were ready to tell us what colors they wanted.

    My daughter (as it turned out) decided she wanted pink. Picked a color that looked good on the swatch from the store.

    Boy, did it look a lot pinker when the whole wall was covered with it.

    That was the pinkest damn room.

    Stick to beige, that's my advice.

  70. Re:The REAL lesson is the media is bad at everythi by tehcyder · · Score: 1

    You mean a liberal arts degree doesn't have anything to do with the real world?

    I'm shocked... SHOCKED I say!

    Whereas obviously a degree in maths/chemistry or whatever does?
    --
    To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it