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3G iPhone on the Way?
mooseman93 wrote to point out Forbes is suggesting that if you haven't purchased an iPhone yet, you may want to wait just a little bit longer. Supposedly the next generation of iPhone will offer some substantial upgrades, including 3G capabilities. "To be sure, a 3G iPhone likely won't pop up over the next several weeks. The Unofficial Apple Weblog reported this week that Apple is hiring a television production firm in preparation for a high-profile late February announcement. That event, however, will likely detail the widely anticipated release of a software developer's kit for Apple's iPhone and iPod Touch. But the wait can't drag on much longer. AT&T is building out its high-speed wireless network as quickly as it can, announcing Wednesday that it will expand its 3G wireless broadband service to more than 80 additional cities by the end of the year for a total of roughly 350 markets."
You have a choice: you buy a product NOW, or you read the news: oh, there is a quad-GPU graphics card scheduled in 6 months. By the time it's ready, you read again: there is another one with 64 GPU's ready in one year. So, if your choice is to never be happy, don't blame it on tech.
http://revj.sourceforge.net
More Apple advertising?... could you keep me informed about the SATA drives that Dell is offering too?
The iPhone invention/launch was news-worthy because it was a new "innovative" product, its network transfering speed and/or type is a service feature, something you'l find out when you go to buy an iPhone.
What is with all of these articles (particularly Apple articles) that have absolutely zero substance? I read the summary and the article, this looks more like guerrilla marketing in the form of speculation piled on rumor piled on speculation via anonymous tip. I'm not trying to flame here but sites like Engadget, Gizmodo, and Digg are completely flooded with this crap and it's sad to see it seeping into Slashdot as well.
It's as though any headline ending in a question mark has a better than 50% chance of being an advertisement or a troll/flamebait piece.
When the iPhone was first announced here, they said that it'd be here about a year later. As 3G is pretty much the standard (soon to be replaced) the timing of this doesn't really surprise me. However, if it's Japanese functionality doesn't improve over the iPod Touch's, it's not going to make much of a dent, I don't think.
"It's as though any headline ending in a question mark has a better than 50% chance of being an advertisement or a troll/flamebait piece."
Geeks get laid this coming week?
A 3G iPhone isn't coming out soon. They just released double storage capacity. If 3G was coming soon, they'd hold on for a couple weeks. There's no reason to add an extra SKU for a few months. No one would want a crippled version if the same phone with 3G was available. The alternative is to confuse the customer by forcing them to choose between 3G or extra capacity, and most people would probably put 2+2 together and decide to wait until they could have both in the next one to come out. Sure, 3G iPhones probably will exist some day, but not for at least 6 months or more.
GUSH!! As the economy loses it's support with the deflation of all the fanboys...er, wallets!
Why in the world would Apple prepare a high-profile media announcement for an SDK? That's just about the LEAST Apple-ish move anyone familiar with them could imagine! Consumers don't give a crap about SDKs. Even if they had major 3rd party software to launch with the SDK release, I can't think of a time Apple has ever made a big deal on TV about a specific piece of software. Forbes needs a reality check on their crystal ball.
It's far more likely that the "Get a Mac" commercial campaign is changing, as rumors have been circulating for a few weeks.
Recursive: Adj. See Recursive.
Oo,ooo,,ooo,o,o,,ooo I'm as happy as a little girl
Apple! Oo,,,o,o,o,o,o,oo
3Gs for an iPhone? Now THAT is an expensive phone!
Whatever the validity, Apple should release a 3G iPhone soon. AT&T's 3G network works great. I get 700kbps on a Samsung Blackjack. It would be nice to have a phone with a decent browser to use on the network. 3G beats the crap out of Edge and there is no cost difference in the data plan (at least for a black jack).
Sometimes my arms bend back.
This is exactly why I never adopt 1st Gen technology.
Advertisements don't tell you to wait.
The news for me is that the 3G network isn't already all over United States. Here in there city I live (Porto Alegre) in Brazil there is already a 3G network on 800Mhz and another in 1.2Ghz is expected to start this year, so I was expecting US would be already much more advanced.
This and the e-voting makes me wonder if those news about US being beaten technology by other countries isn't only for Japan/Asia/Europe, seems like in many areas even in-development countries are starting to be better.
Whilst Apple seems to be gearing up for the Next Big Thing, it would be good to get the existing iPhone in Australia, UK, etc...
Or are Apple going to simultaneously release in all regions.
Here's hoping it will be HSDPA compatible....
It could be taken other way, that current generation iPhones will be cheaper, and that is definitely good news for people like me with somewhat shallow pockets.
hilarious
I am a classic Apple fanboi, and a UK resident. Often, I find these two facts in opposition with each other - particularly over the iPhone.
Apple's continued US-centricity is a ridiculous holdover for such a large company with even larger intentions. Their insistence on selling first to a US market which has always lagged behind the rest of the world in terms of mobile phone infrastructure is a case in point.
If Apple instead decided to throw their weight behind launching the iPhone that the rest of the world wants, it would force the US phone market to modernise, kicking and screaming on the way.
We already have data that iPhones exist (illegally and unlocked...) in most countries around the world, even some surprising locations. This shows what a strong global brand and product Apple has sitting ready to be unleashed. But instead, they insist on catering to the often backwards, domestic US market first.
Even worse, they have then tried to force a US-based model for phone subscription services on the rest of the world, where such practices don't exist.
I posit that the slow uptake of iPhones in Europe is due to a combination of initial outlay for the phone, high subscription rates not in keeping with the service provided, limited number of networks you can legally sign up to, and ultimately network lock-in. Each of these devices exists in the US. The do not exist in Europe for any phone other than the iPhone, and this is what the market is finding hard to swallow, even though we really love the product.
So my final message is this - Apple, get your head out of your arse and realise that there is a world outside the USA.
A better analogy would be someone who is stuck in the stone age on dialup and wants to have broadband. You aren't seriously suggesting that people buy the iPhone now and then buy another in a few months?
Here are some questions that Forbes should have asked:
Again, Forbes shows that journalism takes the back seat. There are plenty of great articles that could be written. Instead, we get an article that isn't even worthy of an unpopular rumor blog. Like mine.
Teasers trailers don't stop people 'buying' current films, in theory...
It's a definition of "good" based on what is available in my local market in the USA. Over here you are lucky to be able to get 7Mbps over cable let alone wireless. I consider 700kbps "good" compared to Edge which was giving me about 200kbps at maximum. Edge being the maximum you will get on an iPhone.
Although I fail to see how much use 7Mbps would be with a restrictive transfer limit. You can get an unlimited plan over here.
Sometimes my arms bend back.
This only point of this article seems to be don't buy an iPhone. Even the headline is designed to taunt people that already bought one.
What evidence does the article provide?
- AT&T said a new iPhone was coming in 2008. Of course this leaves 10 more months assuming that AT&T even knows what Apple is working on which previous reports have said they don't. http://www.wired.com/gadgets/wireless/magazine/16-02/ff_iphone
- Apple recently hired a television crew for... something. According to a Mac rumors site.
- Broadcom has started sampling a new lower power 3G chip. Which is implied to be a panacea, completely ignoring that redesigning the iPhone is more complicated than popping in a new chip -- there are antennas to redesign and software that has to be rewritten just to start -- and the chip isn't even shipping yet.
- "Apple can't wait much longer." The author uses this argument several times, backing it up with AT&T's plans to roll out 3G to more cities by the end of 2008.
Hasn't it occurred to anyone that it's going to take 6 months for the FCC to test a new iPhone and no one has turned up anything to show the FCC has even started this yet?
But if I can't save or work with attachments from email or even do simple things like copy and paste, it gets pretty worthless.
If people want a reason to wait, then they should wait for the "business iPhone" that has been predicted by some previous iPhone related article that made its way here some time ago. As a Blackberry user, I have grown accustomed to certain levels of functionality that, if not duplicated, will make iPhone feel broken somehow... and I'm sure one will come out because Blackberry has been working on competition for iPhone and I can't imagine it will take long to release.
It's also a matter of motivation. Most US cell phone users are locked into two-year contracts by now. This limits the pace of change-over from carrier to carrier, limiting the forces of the free-market economy, limiting competition, limiting carriers' motivation to offer better service. Why spend millions and millions of dollars to upgrade a network if your customers are locked in anyway?
Bob Sullivan's book Gotcha Capitalism makes some good points about this, as well as about how we almost never pay the advertised price for service.
If it weren't for my stupidity, I'd be some kind of genius.
It's always the same, wait for the better version etc..
But the difference here is that you're locking yourself into an 18 month contract typically. The iPhone is a bit behind the times now, in 18 months it will be way behind.
There are some things you can wait for and others you need. For instance you might decide to wait for a new model of a car, but if you don't have a car then you can't really wait.
What am I to be sorry about? I've been using a really great phone since August. My option was to not be using a really great phone over the past seven months. Gee, Forbes really nailed this one!
Isn't it totally OBVIOUS that a KILLER APP for the iPhone, one that would put it parsecs above all other cell phones is . . . . DICTATION SOFTWARE? After all, the device does have a microphone and an operating system. First, VOICE DIALING is needed, and then, after that, true dictation software, like iListen or Dragon Naturally Speaking, that would let a user dictate an outgoing Email, that could later be retrieved on a home computer, then to be filed or printed. Dr. A. N. Feldzamen 3 Arrowood Lane Ithaca, New York 14850-9793 607-257-8080 alfeld@twcny.rr.com
if i could pick someones brains.
if you leave a 3G region will you just switch to a lesser protocol or do you lose connection completely?
my wife has one of the original iphones(waited for the price to drop) and has really liked it.
now I'm thinking about getting another for me and i'm wondering if this new one would be useless on long trips or will it just drop down to a slower speed.
the new chipset sounds like it will extended battery life which is awesome. that was one of my complaints of the current one
Yep, iphones will be 4G so don't buy one now, wait till they are even better.
Some drink at the fountain of knowledge. Others just gargle.
I've been quite content with EDGE. The primary places I use the iPhone (work, home, cafe, even the auto repair shop) have WiFi. "On the road" I use Maps and Mail, and EDGE is sufficient.
Without a doubt, 3G will open the door to new applications - video in particular. But here in New Hampshire, AT&T coverage is spotty at best. I'd rather see AT&T invest in improving basic coverage before expanding their 3G network.
Anyway, it's my understanding that the current iPhone was announced 6 months in advance because the FCC required public filings 6 months in advance. Does anyone know if these FCC filings apply to a second gen handset as well?
Won't we see Apple pre-announce the 3G iPhone by 6 months?
Is it going to have 3G (just UMTS, 384kbps) or "3.5G" (HSPA, 3.6Mbps or 7.2Mbps depending on the area)?
They really should go for HSPA support, UMTS is old news, it's been common functionality in phones for years now.
AT&T currently offers about 18 different phones that are 3G capable. While I'm sure that AT&T is looking forward to a 3G-capable iPhone, I think it's much more likely that their ongoing 3G expansion is more about supporting their current customers and current product lineup than about supporting future products.
You're missing the point. iPhone over EDGE is a premature product, because the phone is meant to serve as both mobile phone and internet browser. You won't get that benefit before you reach 3G speeds.
That's odd, because I seem to be using maps, browsing the web, and checking in for flights online just fine today and I have been ever since I bought the phone at launch. Both over WiFi and Edge. A few million other people seem to agree with this assessment.
Yes 3G will make some of those things faster, but Google Maps is already plenty good as it is on Edge. Hardly missing any kind of benefit thanks.
Will I upgrade to the 3G phone when it comes out? Probably not, I'll wait a year or two for further improvements. 3G is not as required as some would like to believe, even if you buy the device for constant network connectivity.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
The problem with thinking of these network technologies in simple marketing terms like "3G" is that so many different companies and consortiums are working on so many different technologies, and they don't arrive in lock-step. Verizon went with a "sure thing" a few years ago, and invested heavily in EVDO, their "3G" network.
This gave Verizon an edge over EDGE, since EVDO is three or four times faster than EDGE in theory, and also because AT&T deployed a lousy back end infrastructure, making EVDO, in practice, infinitely faster than EDGE, which, in practice, offered zero throughput about half the time in about half the places I tried to use it. EDGE's reputation suffered greatly from experiences of early customers like me, who couldn't get 56k modem speeds from ATT nor TMobile, because their EDGE networks were so poor. AT&T fixed their EDGE network by adding capacity to the backbone (publicly declared) and I suspect by doing other things like upgrading software on their radios, tuning, adding capacity to the radio networks, etc. (which they haven't talked about publicly that I've seen anyway) to support the iPhone, and EDGE works really well now. I use it often to check email, use Google Maps, and fetch web pages. EVDO, however, is still 3 or 4 times faster than EDGE can ever be, and EVDO is now already available everywhere Verizon offers service, and has been for at least a year. EVDO offers 2.4 Mbit/s data rates, with an upgrade path to 3.1 Mbit/sec. Like other iPhone users, I used WiFI networks whenever available (which is often) but I use EDGE at other times and it works better than I expected it to. I'm amazed at how well it works with Google Maps, and I use that feature a lot more often than I thought I would.
Verizon's plans for their "4G" network won't be based on this CDMA2000 family of networks, they'll be switching to the family used by AT&T (and most other phone companies worldwide). Hooray! This is good news for U.S. customers because future roaming agreements between carriers will mean better service for everybody. Why would Verizon switch, though? Well, it's mainly because the other family of radio technologies leapfrogged 'em. AT&T is following the path of "3GPP" networks, and are currently rolling out their HSDPA network which apparently supports speeds up to 14.4 Mbit/s in some places in the U.S. already today (although most handsets apparently don't support those speeds yet). Verizon got an early lead with wide area data networks in the U.S. with EVDO, but they will have a hard time keeping the top tier of their customer base, all those early adopters still have early adopter personalities, and they'll be migrating in droves to AT&T when they become aware of the fact that AT&T's 3G network is five times faster than EVDO. Verizon's decision to switch to the UMTS camp will put them on the same playing field with AT&T in the 4G market. Both will use HSOPA. Check out the features, variable bandwidth usage, MIMO. Mmm... yummy. Slashdot iPhone H8trz will be not buying an iPhone because they're waiting for 4G any day now.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
Expect Apple's future iPhone products to be announced using the same general patterns as their iPod and Mac products. Major product refreshes are likely to be announced at an event like MacWorld, or a "special event" where they invite the press and the product is available for purchase that day, to be shipped that day or within a week or two. Minor revisions, like models with additional memory that were released last week will be press releases with shipping products. The six month lead on the original iPhone was an aberration.
When Apple pre-announced the iPhone by six months, they were in a relatively unique position and didn't really have the option to follow their traditional model for "Surprise! Buy Now!" product releases. The rumor mill was already onto the iPhone, and Apple was in a position where they had to provide samples of the unit to AT&T to test it on their networks, file for FCC approval, make commercials and whatnot. They were at the point where they had to go from maybe a dozen people even knowing for sure that the project existed, to at least a few hundred people working actively on production ramp-up, software design, testing, and marketing materials. Furthermore, Apple didn't have any existing sales to cannibalize, so a pre-announcement was pretty safe. Apple will avoid pulling the rug out from existing sales by pre-announcing a new version too far in advance, a marketing phenomenon named the Osborne Effect after a computer company of which nobody has heard, because it's been dead a long time.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine.
Go with the HTC Touch on Verizon's very nice network next month (next month according to rumour, anyway). Oh, and spend a lot less on it and not have to worry about whether you're in a '3G roll-out city'. And I'm assuming the battery life will be better, what with not having to power the RDF and all...
I'm sorry to bother you, but I noticed you mentioned you live in the South Florida area same as I do (I live in Palm Beach County regrettably at the moment, but I frequent Broward and even Dade counties for work and fun in that order). And I've been with AT&T since it was the original AT&T Wireless that brought GSM to the area (circa 2002). I don't know if its just my perception, but since Cingular bought them out and made "Fewest Dropped Calls of any network" their mantra, I've noticed that their data side speed and even just usage straight up, is abysmal now. Everyone I know that's on AT&T/Cingular that had a dedicated PC card for their laptop gave it up over a year ago now because 56K modems were faster and more reliable! Paying $80/month for that on top of your regular cellphone bill and then a land line based Internet connection for your home or office is ludicrous.
December of 2006 I bought my first ever BlackBerry to replace my previous lineup of Windows Mobile powered Motorolas that I just got fed up with finally and I put up with the $30/month extra for the BlackBerry service on the premise that I could use the unlimited Internet to just surf at times I was bored or needed quick info when I wasn't in front of a computer. But even with the Opera mobile browser installed (the BlackBerry browser isn't so bad, but still), its just stinking slow if not completely unusable. It doesn't matter if everywhere I go I have full or pretty close to full signal. The speed and reliability of accessing anything is just pathetic. When you have to try over 5 times to get a site to come up, something's damned wrong. Its been that way since I had Windows Mobile Smartphones though, as I had previously a 1MB for $8 quota that I just rarely used, so I know its not because of any one phone I have being setup wrong or outright broken.
To make a long story short, I've since suspended my BlackBerry service since I can't really afford it at the moment (in transition between jobs unfortunately), but when I get back on my feet, I've been seriously considering switching networks entirely (I've also had the same number for roughly 6 years, 3+ girlfriends and would like to start fresh again). And I've heard a lot of good about Verizon's EV-DO. And I had no idea until just yesterday that apparently EVERY network carries BlackBerries. And AT&T has no 3G BlackBerries (I know, not likely their fault, but RIM's fault) but if I were to upgrade from my Pearl, they have an 8820 with WiFi (which may or may not prove to be useful), or Verizon has their version the 8830 without WiFi, but still sports GSM along with 1xEV-DO so I could still roam internationally (I like to travel to at least a couple latin countries because of family and some friends).
So my question to you or anyone else is, is Verizon's EV-DO really worth it as the price appears to cost roughly the same (service-wise which I have no problem with if its actually usable and as fast as they claim). Because even though the 8820 from AT&T has WiFi, somehow I get the feeling that won't really be useful for much if anything at all. And I'm sick of AT&T's idea of EDGE being fast and roll over minutes are more of a marketing ploy as I never use them (and I doubt very many people do) and the last remaining reason was the international roaming, which the Verizon 8830 apparently takes care of. Any feedback is greatly appreciated, especially the part related to how reliable/fast it is, and the difference between Sprint and Verizon's implementation of 3G.
Sincerely resentful AT&T/Cingular customer...
Sly
OK. In specific we are discussing speeds on one carriers networks - AT&T. We are discussing which service on said network the iPhone can use. AT&T brands their earlier, slower sped network as EDGE. AT&T refers to their upgrade speed network as 3G. Within the context of discussing this carriers MARKETED SERVICES these terms are what AT&T uses.
When my phone is connected to the lower speed network it has the letter "E" displayed for "EDGE". When it connects at AT&Ts higher speed it displays "3G".
In this context given that people shopping for an AT&T service will be told "EDGE" and "3G" by both AT&T marketing and sales people (as for example I was in the AT&T shop) using these terms to refer to AT&T's service levels is appropriate.
Joe average is not going to understand what HSDPA is. There is a different between technical standards definition and marketed terms. If I were discussing the broad spectrum of services available across carrier networks world wide your point would make sense. In this case I am not.
Sometimes my arms bend back.
Over here in Japan, 3G is exorbitantly priced and you pay by the packet for network connectivity. I don't touch the browser button on my phone anymore because the last time I did I payed 2300 yen (about USD 20) to read an MSNBC article. Ability to hook up to a PC, if possible, is completely unadvertised. And I pay about USD 70/mo.
The only benefit I can find to having a 3G phone in Japan is that it's the only way to get a GSM phone that works in any country (Japan is mostly CDMA). That's exorbitantly priced as well, of course, but nice to have if someone needs to talk to you when you're at a conference or something.
That being said, my building FINALLY got "wired" for fiber-optic (been waiting 3 years), and for less than 4000 yen/mo I have 83Mbit down and 8Mbit up!
Just out of curiosity, do you find that your friends tend to nod off while you're explaining every last detail before actually getting to the point?
As I wrote back just two months ago, just 38 states have some form of 3G support, and in most of those access is limited to just a handful of major metropolitan areas (read one or two city centers at most).
So the real question isn't whether or not a 3G iPhone is coming, but is one coming, and will you be able to use it? If your town or area isn't going to be covered until late '08 or even '09 or '10, then who cares?
Besides, it isn't even public yet, so if they DO announce it in late February we still have to wait another three or four months for FCC certification and testing. Could easily be yet another June "anniversary" launch date.
Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
3g is just one of those things that you get and then can't go back, like broadband internet.
Great UI is one of those things yhat you get and you can't go back - and for a lot of people it trumps corner cases of connectivity. Remember, the iPhone has WiFi so if I'm in a WiFi zone I can do all those marvelous things you speak of as well, faster than 3G - but I don't really miss it much if I can 't find a hotspot.
Oh, and call me when iPhone has GPS and a removable battery. Then I'll be interested in its fabulous interface.
It already has location finding, and a battery you MAY have to replace once every two YEARS if you use it heavily, four or so if not. For long plane flights I have an external solar charged power pack, which is not much more bulky than a second battery would have been and I can also use to recharge other devices...
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
This isn't a completely infrequent occurence, and you are not alone in your desire for a better accidentally-awarded-modpoint-nullification-system.
Edge is faster than people think. My edge connection often reaches 200 kbps, which is actually not noticeably slower than what I used to get using UMTS. Downstream speed is perfectly usable for internet browsing; what I often find is that slow roundtrips is what makes Edge seem a bit poky.
My external battery can be charged by solar or from mains. And like I said, I can use it to provide emergency power to any device I own and not just an iPhone (since it also has a 12V cigarette lighter adaptor as an option). And I can get extra power from the window of a plane in motion in coach on any plane ever made.
Not to mention sunlight in different countries doesn't require an adaptor.
Basically a well made external power supply is far superior to any extra battery for any device because it's not much larger and it far more flexible.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
(of which I am proud owner)
That if everyone waits for the $400, 10-inch, 64GB-flash model, Asus will drop the product line... and there will be none.
It's better to be the foot on the boot than the face on the pavement. ~~ tkx Kadin2048