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Stephen Hawking Turned Down Knighthood

Posted by CowboyNeal on from the camelot-is-a-silly-place dept.

schliz writes "Professor Stephen Hawking has revealed that he turned down the offer of a knighthood over 10 years ago. The scientist has released correspondence showing that he was approached with the offer of a knighthood but refused it on principle. Professor Hawking has also revealed correspondence showing harsh criticism of what he sees as the UK government's mismanagement of science funding. He is particularly critical of the merger of the Particle Physics and Astronomy Research Council and the Council for the Central Laboratory of the Research Councils."

36 of 201 comments (clear)

  1. What do you get with knighthood? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Lots of women? The ability to do +2 damage? What's the deal and why would someone want it?

    1. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by Shemmie · · Score: 4, Interesting
      I'm sure there are perks that come with it, but I believe the main thing is the honour of being recognised nationally for your achievements.

      I find it particularly interesting, as I'd backed a Downing Street petition to get Prof. Hawking Knighted - and the Government response was:

      Thank you for taking the trouble to sign this e-petition.
      The Prime Minister recognises the achievements of Professor Stephen Hawking and the widespread regard in which he is held. But it is of course the case that only about 60 Knighthoods are granted each year and there are many deserving candidates for each honour.
      However, the government can assure you that your support for this suggestion will be taken fully into account.
      To be fair, as one of the best scientific minds of his generation, it's typically British to ignore him during his lifetime - give it 200 years or so after his death before it'll be realized how important he was.
    2. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by cp.tar · · Score: 4, Interesting

      To be fair, as one of the best scientific minds of his generation, it's typically British to ignore him during his lifetime - give it 200 years or so after his death before it'll be realized how important he was.

      Only he wasn't ignored: he refused the honour.

      --
      Ignore this signature. By order.
    3. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by Shemmie · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Only he wasn't ignored: he refused the honour.

      I appreciate that now, the petition was conducted before this news broke.

      Having said that, it is a norm for the UK to have less focus on rewarding people like Prof. Hawking, instead focussing on a popular celebrity - a New Labour way of showing that they are 'in touch' with the populace.
    4. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by caramelcarrot · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Hawking is pretty much a "popular celebrity" - there are a lot of other just as smart physicists/scientists out there. This isn't to degrade his achievements, and it's in some way useful for there to be a popular point of contact/figurehead with advanced physicsts.

    5. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by TommyMc · · Score: 5, Interesting

      as one of the best scientific minds of his generation, it's typically British to ignore him during his lifetime

      Stephen Hawking is hardly "ignored". In fact, I'm struggling to think of a physicist less ignored. He's the Lucasian Professor of Mathematics at Cambridge, has had a book stay on the British bestseller list for 5 years, and has been the subject of numerous documentaries, to name a few. If he's as well appreciated 200 years after his death as he is during his life, then he'll have been proved important.

      --
      Stupid people think it's cool. Smart people thinks it's a joke; also cool.
    6. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by hey! · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Well, it's an honor. It's recognition, which is nice, but which Hawking doesn't exactly need more of.

      If Wayne Gretsky was denied membership in the Hockey Hall of Fame, it wouldn't diminish his stature one bit. He might be annoyed at not being inducted, but in truth it's the Hall of Fame that is diminished. If he had a reason to refuse membership, he could do so, knowing of course that he'd effectively have to be in it, because players of the era couldn't be honored without mentioning him.

      As far as women are concerned, apparently Einstein had plenty of 'em, and he wasn't exactly physically attractive. I'm sure that if Hawking's equipment is functional, he could use it on a different woman every day if he wanted to. So he doesn't get more women, no. But a lesser luminary might. Consider if you are introduced to a woman as "Dr. So and So, who is a physicist" as opposed to "Sir So and So, the physicist." To the degree being a physicist might move you towards home base (or whatever the cricket equivalent is), I'd imagine the knighthood might get you a bit farther.

      --
      Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
    7. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by Kingrames · · Score: 5, Funny

      You get to move one space to the left or right whenever you walk forward.

      The chicks love it.

      --
      If you can read this, I forgot to post anonymously.
    8. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by thsths · · Score: 5, Informative

      > In fact I have trouble thinking of an example that fits your claim. Basically the key to British (and most) fame is to be famous in your lifetime first.

      What about Alan Turing? Of course he is still much better received abroad than in his own country, but he is a perfect example of an unrecognised genius. He was used to win the war, and then dumped like a hot potato.

    9. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by cp.tar · · Score: 4, Interesting

      And good for him. I already had a lot of respect for him and now it's gone even higher. It's a wise man whose sense of self-worth isn't influenced by titles he's given.

      Then again, there is a purpose to accepting such honours.
      You can return them afterwards as a sign of protest, and it echoes more loudly than simply refusing them in the first place.

      --
      Ignore this signature. By order.
    10. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      His wheelchair will now be able to strafe.

    11. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by Lemmy+Caution · · Score: 4, Interesting

      A good example, but it seems the exception. The British are usually ready to laud anyone they can. Turing was generally turned away because of his homosexuality and a suspicion that he might be Communist.

    12. Re:What do you get with knighthood? by RockDoctor · · Score: 3, Insightful

      What about Alan Turing? Of course he is still much better received abroad than in his own country, but he is a perfect example of an unrecognised genius. He was used to win the war, and then dumped like a hot potato.
      You forgot some important elements :
      1. He was :
      2. used to win the war;
      3. accounted a security risk due to his being an unapologetic homosexual;
      4. chemically castrated under order of the courts (the alternative being jail);
      5. he started to grow breasts as a result of the "chemical castration" (a large dose of progesterone IIRC) ;
      6. he started to lose control of his thinking and reasoning capabilities;
      7. only then was his "dumping like a hot potato" getting properly into gear, so he decided on suicide as being his best option.
      If, of course, it was suicide.
      --
      Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
  2. Re:Ixnay on the Itlestay by youthoftoday · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I reckon there's a difference between a title and a position. Yes, 'professor' is a title, but it's a professional one. 'Sir' isn't.

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    -1 not first post
  3. You want some Knighthoood? by Recovering+Hater · · Score: 5, Funny
    "We want you to be our Knight Professor Hawking."

    (robot voice)"No, you can keep it. I will not risk valorous death for someone who mismanages the government funding of my chosen profession.

    "No, you don't understand..."

    (loud robot voice)"I SAID KEEP IT!"

    --
    My humor is probably your flamebait
    1. Re:You want some Knighthoood? by onedotzero · · Score: 4, Interesting

      It does make me wonder if the good Professor does indeed use all caps to shout, a la IRC.

  4. source of knighthood vs source of funding by magarity · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I thought knighthoods were handed out by the monarch as special recognition of one's accomplishments. It's the queen's way of saying thanks for being such an outstanding citizen. If you have a beef with the prime minister(s) and their budgeting priority that's not the queen's fault. Seems rather rude to slap her thanks down for something she's not in charge of.

    1. Re:source of knighthood vs source of funding by Richard_at_work · · Score: 5, Informative

      Generally knighthoods and other honours are given out based on recommendations by ministers of the current government, the queen actually has very little say in the matter - she controls the Order of the Garter completely however.

    2. Re:source of knighthood vs source of funding by Allicorn · · Score: 3, Informative

      Its the govt who decide who gets "honored". The monarch is pretty much just the person who makes the announcement. So, Hawking's "slap" was fairly squarely aimed at Blair and co.

      Regarding who honors actually get dished out to, y'know the Darling brothers - Codemasters founders - got honored just recently? Its really not just celebs, musicians and sporty types.

      http://arstechnica.com/journals/thumbs.ars/2008/06/18/codemasters-founders-honored-by-queen-of-england

      --
      OMG!!! Ponies!!!
    3. Re:source of knighthood vs source of funding by kestasjk · · Score: 5, Funny

      Generally knighthoods and other honours are given out based on recommendations by ministers of the current government, the queen actually has very little say in the matter - she controls the Order of the Garter completely however. Are you saying the Queen isn't personally appreciative of Hawking's work on the mathematics behind black holes? Are you saying she doesn't read Nature and publish papers on quantum loop gravity and super-symmetry all day?! Then what the hell does she do with all her time and wealth?!
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      // MD_Update(&m,buf,j);
    4. Re:source of knighthood vs source of funding by expatriot · · Score: 3, Interesting

      There is a popular urban myth that Charles Dodgson wrote a book about magic rabbits that the queen (Victoria) liked and wanted a copy of the next book he wrote. Unfortunately for her, it was a book on mathematics.

  5. I hate when that happens by SEWilco · · Score: 5, Funny

    He is particularly critical of the merger of the Particle Physics and Astronomy Research Council and the Council for the Central Laboratory of the Research Councils.
    Yeah, I hate it when someone creates a PPARCCCLRC.
    1. Re:I hate when that happens by ettlz · · Score: 4, Funny

      STFC. Depending on who you ask, this means "Swindon Town Football Club" (STFC offices are in Swindon), or "Screw The Fucking Collider".

  6. Good for him by teslatug · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This knighthood business is such pomposity, it doesn't belong in the modern era. I have to get permission from a queeen before calling someone Sir?

    1. Re:Good for him by smittyoneeach · · Score: 3, Insightful

      It's all advertising. Hawking effectively calls more attention to his issues by rejecting the honour than by accepting.
      Much wisdom in that ravaged body.

      --
      Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
    2. Re:Good for him by Dunbal · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I have to get permission from a queeen before calling someone Sir?

            No, you can call anyone "Sir", but only the Queen can make it mean anything.

            It's tradition, you know? Although monarchies are now a thing of the past, it was still the only form of government that allowed Europe to survive the endless petty battles and feuds between regional warlords. That constant feuding would have kept us in the dark ages. The concept of the monarch as the overlord with the biggest army (and artillery!) to keep everyone in line brought peace to the lands (and at least confined war to overseas where other people's countries/crops/towns/culture got destroyed instead). That way civilization could begin to flourish.

      --
      Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
    3. Re:Good for him by lattyware · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Medical Dr. vs Real Dr. is a fun one, as the majority of Medical Doctors, are not actually doctors (don't have a doctorate), and yet people often say that someone who is a doctor, but not a medical doctor, is a fake doctor, which in fact, it's the other way around.

      I was told a story about a Pharmacist in a hospital who had his name - 'Dr. Bob Smith' (example) on the door. Now, the hospital forced him to take the Dr off, despite him actually having a doctorate, unlike most of the doctors who have it on their doors in the hospital, because he wasn't a medical doctor and it'd confuse people. I, personally, think that's insane.

      --
      -- Lattyware (www.lattyware.co.uk)
    4. Re:Good for him by h4rm0ny · · Score: 5, Informative

      It's all advertising. Hawking effectively calls more attention to his issues by rejecting the honour than by accepting.

      It is not all advertising. He quietly refused the title ten years ago and this is the first we've heard of it as far as I'm aware. Everything points to this being a point of principle for him, not a means of gaining publicity. I guess you've shown that it sometimes is possible to be too cynical after all.
      --

      Aide-toi, le Ciel t'aidera - Jeanne D'Arc.
    5. Re:Good for him by Daniel+Dvorkin · · Score: 3, Informative

      Depends on the country. In the US (and in Canada, I'm pretty sure) the degree which allows you to practice medicine is indeed a doctorate (MD or DO.) I understand that in Britain it's actually a bachelor's degree (BM) and that MD is a title you only get if you do additional research work; the US equivalent is MD/PhD. But in any case, it is a shame that the work "doctor" is so inextricably associated with medicine is most people's minds. Medical doctors have to work very hard to earn their title; so do other kinds of doctors, and all of them should be recognized for it. If you need to make the precise distinction, the right word to use is "physician."

      My grandfather, a retired professor of literature (with a PhD, of course) has a number of health problems and often has to call up new hospitals or specialty practices. He always leads the conversation with, "This is Dr. Hardy ..." Amazing how much red tape that can cut through.

      --
      The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
    6. Re:Good for him by Ian+Alexander · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Monarchy totally did _not_ move European wars overseas. The stupidest and most wasteful European wars have been nothing more than petty spats between two feuding European monarchs. See the Hundred Years' War, The War of Two Peters, The War of the Roses and the English Civil War for just a few examples of idiots fighting for the monarchy (With the exception of the English CW, it was a fight to establish a commonwealth which degenerated into a protectorate). Monarchies just supersized the stupid wars.

      Monarchs weren't even decent domestic governors. You can thank Ferdinand and Isabella for the Spanish Inquisition, which set back Spain by hundreds of years. Speaking of the Church, lots and lots of European monarchs were only too happy to waste untold resources and let untold numbers of their citizens die fighting stupid Crusades to "take back" Jerusalem, or kill the wicked Cathar heretics, or what-have-you.

      In fact, you didn't see things settling down and stabilizing in Europe until people began to put checks against the power of the monarchy.

  7. That's a COVER STORY! by Bogtha · · Score: 3, Funny

    The truth is that he has fallen out of favour with the government since Torchwood uncovered evidence that he is working with Davros.

    Personally, I think the government shouldn't be in the business of giving out meaningless awards and I would refuse one on that basis.

    --
    Bogtha Bogtha Bogtha
  8. Reading comprehension by rgmoore · · Score: 5, Informative

    It looks to me as though you're confusing two parts of the article. It's actually talking about two sets of correspondence, one about the knighthood and one about funding disputes. On the knighthood, it says:

    "Professor Hawking does not like titles. In fact he dislikes the whole concept of them," a spokesman told The Times.

    So he turned the knighthood down because he dislikes knighthood in principle. That seems like a reasonable position, and a willingness to turn down personal advancement on a matter of principle seems like an honorable decision. The arguments about funding were a separate issue and, apparently, one that came about some time after he turned down the knighthood.

    --

    There's no point in questioning authority if you aren't going to listen to the answers.

  9. It is perfectly understandable by damburger · · Score: 3, Interesting

    A lot of people are refusing knighthoods, because association with our tired, old absurd Imperial rituals is more of a detriment than a benefit to someone who is already famous in their own right.

    The people who tend to accept them are the ones whose careers are on the slide anyway.

    --
    If we can put a man on the moon, why can't we shoot people for Apollo-related non-sequiturs?
  10. Re:He is using his knighthood by silentcoder · · Score: 4, Insightful

    That may have been true if he had done so AT THE TIME. Hawking SILENTLY rejected the knighthood many years ago, but OTHER people have been calling for him to be knighted every year. These constant requests from the public ultimately led to Hawking choosing to end the suspense by just saying that it was HIS OWN decision not to be knighted many years ago and that they can stop pestering the UK government about it.

    --
    Unicode killed the ASCII-art *
  11. Re:Ixnay on the Itlestay by osu-neko · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Maybe he changed his mind. It does happen. If people's opinions were immutable, we'd be incapable of learning anything.

    In America, if you're capable of learning, you're supposed to hide the fact. Demonstrating the capacity to learn is guaranteed to get to ridiculed for being a "flip-flopper". It's considered a sign of strength and character to never change you mind no matter what you learn or how circumstances change. :p

    --
    "Convictions are more dangerous enemies of truth than lies."
  12. Informative response... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Bet this doesn't get modded up, but here goes:

    In 1865 the holder of the Christ Church Mathematical Lectureship, one Charles Dodgson, published an amazing childrens book, 'Alice in Wonderland' under the pen name of Lewis Caroll.

    The book was a great success, and Queen Victoria was one of his fans. Greatly appreciative, she arranged for an audience with 'Caroll', and insisted that she be provided with a copy of the next book this author would write.

    Imagine her surprise when, next year, she was sent a copy of a complex technical book on Symbolic Logic!