Slashdot Mirror
OpenMoko In Stores On July 4
ruphus13 writes "July 4 will be day when OpenMoko's Neo FreeRunner will be available to US consumers. Being Open Source, it is modifiable down to the core. From the article: 'The FreeRunner is based on a GNU/Linux, and it will initially ship with basic software to make calls, send and receive SMS, and manage contacts. But the company is encouraging users to write and install their own applications. Software updates will add features to the phone over time, and the company said an August update will enable location-based services.'"
The online store has already run out of the GSM 850 model.
Can I ask the powers that be ...
... if so, we have a problem
Could I run a program that can make calls the world over and charge to my account ?
G
They are triband 850 or 900 /1800/1900
:(){
Sorry, I went straight to the BUY NOW section, where it offers "GSM 850" & "GSM 900" which what they mean is 850/1800/1900 & 900/1800/1900.
Note to OpenMoko: You could make this a bit clearer.
Note to Moderators: Please be gentle :)
Although I stand by the EDGE comment.
When will UK carriers pick up these open source phones and supply them to contract customers is what I want to know! :)
You're right of course, on the BUY NOW section it lists the phone as 850 & 900 left me dazzed and confused.
Note to self: Don't comment first thing in the morning.
Note to self(2): Dont leave note to self on slashdot.
The 900 model isn't really sold out it's not arrived at the distributors yet so it's not currently available.
Also the reason it uses GSM is that the team have tried as far as possible to use OPEN HARDWARE ie fully documented and not lumbered with proprietary closed-source drivers. GSM was the only option as all 3G hardware is completely closed.
Also please everyone, don't start the "it's not as good as the iphone" flamewars. If you want an iphone you don't want this and if you want this you probably don't want an iphone.
Even though I readily admit I hate the shape of the case they put this thing in, I am otherwise quite interested in this phone from the "open" standpoint.
But assuming I were to buy one of these, what carriers in the US will let you put it on their network without grief or a number of hoops to jump through?
I want a new quote. One that won't spill. One that don't cost too much. Or come in a pill.
Though I am not a fan of the appearance, it is quite a powerful phone, with a 500mhz processor, which is not quite as powerful as the 700mhz processor on the iphone, but still decent nevertheless. Ofcourse, the benefiting factor being that it is open source, where as the iphone is not. It will be a great time when we are able to buy a phone, with the basic functionality installed, then choose what particular software we want to add on the phone, for free. The main problem with phones today is that there is really no way that the community can fix or improve the software without complications, but if the company is actually encouraging open source software to be developed they will provide the necessary tools (APIs etc) for the community to do these improvements themselves, saving them money in the process. It also appears that more phone companies are starting to follow this open source trend, but will probably still keep their strangle hold on their customer base by using DRM and SIM locks, you can read the article here. Openmoko are definitely in the right direction, I wish them much success.
What are you getting at? I can tell you're not trolling, but what do you mean?
This isn't like Europe and developed parts of Asia, we've got relatively low population density and spend far less money on cell phones than typical customers in those areas. As a result the time tends to be longer.
Of course we're also fans of bureaucracy and corporate malfeasance so it'll take even longer than it would in a sanely managed geographic region of similar specifications.
Oh really?
Verizon, a CDMA carrier, is starting trials using LTE, a GSM (4G) variant this year, eventually they'll switch over leaving only Sprint as the main provider of CDMA
I like CDMA, but I'll welcome GSM with Verizon if it means I can try out the OpenMoko. Oh yeah, what were you saying again about GSM?
Point is, this isn't an internet tablet. It's a phone. GSM is sufficient for this task.
I see it has built-in agps device...
:)
does anyone know what software it uses? map coverage?
and... what do you slashdotters suggest as alternative?
"I was gratified to be able to answer promptly, and I did. I said I didn't know." -- Mark Twain
it's good to see third world countries (and the United States) clinging to this ancient technology.
Give us a break. We're still trying to convince people that our species is older than a few thousand years.
"The fight for freedom has only just begun." - Geert Wilders
The website is remarkably information-free. "Basic software" doesn't tell me a damned thing. I'm all about x86 pizzabox servers and CentOS. I don't know anything about these mini-platforms or ARM processors to start with. Does it come with a compiler or does all development have to be done externally? Does it have any shell tools? Does it have a Perl interpreter? SSH? Is there any graphical internet stuff at all yet for the platform (browser, ftp, email?) or is this an entirely new "ground up" environment.
I'd love to have a Linux phone just on principle, but I don't want to have to build the whole damned thing from scratch.
Nothing worthwhile ever happens before noon
The thing is...when I first heard about the OpenMoko project, I loved the idea, I thought it was great, I couldn't wait for it to be released. But it took them so damn long, that by the time it get's released, you've got a better iPhone (not much better, but I'd still rather have it than the Freerunner), and you've got Android which should be out this year. Also the specs for OpenMoko which looked really good 2 years ago aren't so hot right now. I for one am sticking with my Nokia E51 for know, and will probably get an Android phone when they're released. Sorry, OpenMoko, you're just too late for the party.
Opem Moko Caca Loco
I hear Ricky Martin doing it now !!
I just had to bite the bullet a few months ago, retire my AMPS/TDMA phone and switch to GSM. (AT&T is the only cell carrier that covers my vacation/eventual-retirement home and they're shutting down the TDMA option.) Had hoped OpenMoko would be in time for me but they missed by about 9 months.
With them in mind I got one of the "free" locked phones - and checked what the unlocking and phone switching policies were. AT&T claimed:
- The PHONE is locked to the CARD, but,
- The CARD isn't locked to the PHONE (either by the card or by the network refusing to accept calls with that card and any other phone.)
Story is likely the same for any other GSM carrier. So just pull the GSM smartcard from any and shove it into your OpenMoko phone.
If you're signing up for new service, ask them if they'll credit you with the phone allowance if you bring your own phone rather than making them give you one of the "free" ones. Might not work but won't hurt to ask. (And if there's another GSM carrier in your service area, you might try hinting that you'll see if THEY'll credit you for the phone...
Of course don't tell them that it's an OpenMoko phone. I bet they're scared you - and thousands of others - will download some hack that lets you bypass some part of their service model. B-)
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
We're still trying to convince people that our species is older than a few thousand years.
Not to be disagreeable, but there's asbolutely no viable evidence of the geek species prior to the 20th century. Greek, yes; but geek, no.
Invenio via vel creo
Of course we're also fans of bureaucracy and corporate malfeasance so it'll take even longer than it would in a sanely managed geographic region of similar specifications.
Yes, I believe that's what he's getting at.
We hope your rules and wisdom choke you / Now we are one in everlasting peace
If you clicked on "gallery" then you would have seen screenshots:
http://www.openmoko.com/product-gallery.html
A list of applications is a bit harder to find, but it is on the wiki:
http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Openmoko_Core_Applications
Of course, this is just the "core applications". Since it is an open platform, there are quite a few more, in the usual mixed states of maturity. :)
And since this phone is targeted at developers, if you don't want to write apps then no reason you should get one.
Indeed, that was the missing feature that made me decide to go with the iPhone, even though the closed nature of the iPhone makes me grumpy.
And she did that mov....no, waitaminute, that's the other...no wonder I can't find the LINDA programming language!
No, but it will let you make all sorts of crazy calls and let you communicate with the Doctor...
Non impediti ratione cogitationus.
Yes, I too really, *really* wanted a Freerunner. But, now that it's here, it seems not quite as great as the iPhone, as far as I understand it the software is hardly stable as a basic cell phone (let alone as a useful pda).
I'm actually cancelling my group sales preorder because I prefer to use my ancient PalmT3 plus separate crummy old Nokia that can't even talk to my pda.
Lesson? Design your software around a virtual platform, then put together the hardware as late as possible. Maybe. I don't know.
"Good news, everyone!"
GSM is really only of use for making calls. Using it for data is insane - you won't get more than 9.6Kb/s
Not true - GSM allows for HSCSD, which is basically bonding of up to 4 GSM channels, giving you 38.4Kbps.
Also, depending on your application, using GSM CSD instead of GPRS may be very beneficial - GPRS has really high latency, which makes interactive stuff like SSH really painful (also makes establishing SSL connections terminally slow because of the number of round-trips needed for the handshake), whereas CSD is significantly lower latency. The upshot of this is that if you need to do something like administer a server over SSH, you want CSD, not GPRS.
GPRS gives you a maximum of about 5KB/s with 2 second latency in the real world
This is _really_ variable and depends on how busy the cell you are in is. If you're using CSD then once the circuit is established you are guaranteed the bandwidth, whereas the bandwidth available on GPRS will vary. I use GPRS a lot on Orange's network, and I can tell you that it'll go from "reasonable" to "shockingly bad" (~300 bytes per second, 5-45 seconds latency, over 50% packet loss) to "no connection at all" at a moment's notice - I certainly wouldn't want to rely on it for anything important.
Also, I see very frequent dropouts within Orange's network itself (i.e. not on the air-interface), but that is down to Orange's incompetence at running an IP network rather than the technology itself.
http://blog.nexusuk.org
I wonder how many of the people who make this OpenMoko thing speak Spanish, because a 'moco' is a 'bogey'. Who would want to buy that? Or are there no hispanic geeks in Gringolandia?
there's asbolutely no viable evidence of the geek species prior to the 20th century
Common sense also says that to be older than that, you need a breeding population.
(Captcha is "epaulet", which happens to be a type of mate position in chess).
Doesn't anyone find it kind of funny?
The Freerunner is about freedom; free software, free hardware designs. Launch date is 4th of July. I hear there was some freedom going on at the 4th of july some 232 years ago.
(sinister voice) Coincidence? I think not...
Who'd want to use a phone for that!
I will have a sig when the market demands it.
-Harry, there's someone in the house! Call 911!
-Can't you see it's compiling, woman?!?!? C'MON!!
Also the reason it uses GSM is that the team have tried as far as possible to use OPEN HARDWARE ie fully documented and not lumbered with proprietary closed-source drivers.
Too bad they did a shit job.
Now. What was that about this being an "open" cell phone design?
I think it's a great idea, but the current revision sucks. They have little software available for it, it's a huge pricetag, and for chrissakes, it's not even EDGE- only basic GPRS, which means you'll get at most about 10KB/sec line-speed.
Please help metamoderate.
On this side of the pond we're still a little bitter about the whole Independence thing, so we resort to cruel mockery.
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
In grand old /. tradition:
No 3g. Less space than an iPhone. Lame.
Should be interesting to see where this leads.
Unless I'm mistaken, it's more free than any other phone out there. We can't compare this to an ideal, we have to compare it to alternatives, and decide where to vote with our dollars.
Even my Debian desktop is not entirely free. I use a proprietary nvidia driver, and I use the flash player.
Someone invested a lot of money -- and might see much of it lost -- trying to make this phone. The revenue they generate indicates the demand, and will be the primary deciding factor for future investment.
There are pretty serious privacy concerns with cell phones -- arguably more serious than with desktop computers.
Right now it would be convenient for the police to mandate various kinds of back doors so that they can spy on you. I don't know whether this is true or not, but they may already be able to turn on your phone remotely, so that they can track you. They need the cooperation of the phone companies, but they already have companies like ATT under their thumbs ("do what we say, or we'll investigate you for anti-trust violations").
So, even though this phone doesn't really compete on technical merits, and isn't as free as we would like, it's still worth considering.
Social scientists are inspired by theories; scientists are humbled by facts.
And, when I post my problem in a linux forum, I'll get the always helpful answer
"try here: www.google.com"