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Five Ways Microsoft Could Change After Gates

Might Squirrel noted a perfectly mediocre story to chat about on a boring post-holiday weekend Monday. This one is a look at 5 ways Microsoft could change after Gates. From accepting Open Source to serious interoperability work, there are definitely 5 things on that list there. Nothing about my solid gold rocket car.

35 of 304 comments (clear)

  1. Don't expect any radical shift by elrous0 · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Most of the best ways that MS could change would be way too risky for all but the most gutsy (and possibly most reckless) leadership to embrace.

    They could design a whole new OS from the ground up, abandoning much of the legacy code in Windows that makes it a bit flaky and adopting the "Ã la carte" modular design. They could even make it more secure. But that would risk alienating a huge chunk of traditional Windows users (who still want their old stuff to work, will be confused by a modular design, and who *hate* security popups asking for a password every time they install something). It would be a major risk to the dominance of one of their two big cash cows and could open the door for Apple to swoop in for some market share.

    They could fully embrace open source. But that means risking the dominance of Office--their other cash cow. And they're not going to do that.

    Basically, I don't expect them to change much at all in the post-Gates era. They may embark on some new initiatives and head in some new directions. And I do expect they will be a LOT more internet-oriented in the future. But they're not going to change their fundamental business model, or abandon their core apps to some radical new ideology.

    --
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    1. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by setagllib · · Score: 5, Insightful

      They're boned as far as operating systems go. They can't break backwards compatibility, but that same backwards compatibility is killing them as they try to improve the system.

      Think about it - if you're making a clean break from Windows, would you choose a mature, well established alternative like Linux or MacOSX, or would you choose a completely new, unproven and completely incompatible and unstandardised operating system from Microsoft? Even if the new Microsoft OS is cleaner, being incompatible with EVERY operating system out there would absolutely kill it.

      So they can't keep going with the Windows they have, and they can't start over without losing the only asset Windows has, its backwards compatibility. The superior technology of Linux and MacOSX will keep them alive long after Windows' architecture crumbles, and Vista is the first huge sign that's happening.

      The drop dead obvious confirmation of this is that Windows 7 was meant to be modularised and cleaned up, and all of that has been cancelled already.

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    2. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by PhysicsPhil · · Score: 4, Interesting

      They could design a whole new OS from the ground up, abandoning much of the legacy code in Windows that makes it a bit flaky and adopting the "Ã la carte" modular design. They could even make it more secure. But that would risk alienating a huge chunk of traditional Windows users (who still want their old stuff to work, will be confused by a modular design, and who *hate* security popups asking for a password every time they install something). It would be a major risk to the dominance of one of their two big cash cows and could open the door for Apple to swoop in for some market share.

      Some years ago I remember reading an article that argued that Microsoft should dump Windows and shift to Linux. Specifically it argued that MS should code the Windows desktop as a window interface running on top of a Linux core. At the time I dismissed it as the ravings of a Linux fan, but I wonder more and more if there isn't some value in the argument.

    3. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by mitgib · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Think about it - if you're making a clean break from Windows, would you choose a mature, well established alternative like Linux or MacOSX, or would you choose a completely new, unproven and completely incompatible and unstandardised operating system from Microsoft? Even if the new Microsoft OS is cleaner, being incompatible with EVERY operating system out there would absolutely kill it.

      I don't see why they would need to keep backwards compatibility with their base OS, there are enough choices for running those old programs in some sort of container, be it a VM, or WINE-like process, or a legacy machine that users can RDP to, which might even be a VM itself.

      --
      Being a spelling & grammar Nazi is a sign you do not poses the intelligence to contribute to the conversation
    4. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by setagllib · · Score: 4, Insightful

      All of which still tie you to Windows. What are you going to do, run Microsoft Ubersystem as a pure RDP client to Windows XP, which will be unsupported by then? Let's face it - as soon as you're not compatible with Windows, you may as well run Linux anyway, and Microsoft knows that very well.

      WINE is the most mature Windows compatibility layer there is, and the best Microsoft could do is contribute to it, which you know very well they won't. At that point they may as well make their own Linux distribution or pull an Apple and rebase on BSD. They're totally screwed. The Windows upgrade model is not sustainable and Windows 7 will prove it even more clearly than Vista did.

      --
      Sam ty sig.
    5. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by PhoenixAtlantios · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I don't understand what the major aversion to implementing some sort of transparent virtual machine to run legacy applications is. The idea has been floated hundreds of times by many smart people, yet Microsoft don't seem to want to do it; even though implementing one or more virtual machines to run legacy applications would free them from backwards compatibility in their core system.

      Is there some long-term business reason for not doing this that I'm not seeing? It'd benefit everyone, including Microsoft, in the long term if they did it :\

    6. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by Greger47 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      No it wouldn't benefit Microsoft becasue if they drop old-Windows and introduce this fantastic new new-Windows it doesn't matter how good it is, since they are forcing their customers to upgrade to a completly different OS said customers may just as well evaluate all OSes on the market since any OS can run old-Windows in a VM.

      How many do you think will opt to run old-Windows on top of Linux or OS X instead of betting on Microsofts unproven new-Windows, especially considering their track record on their previous offerings? /greger

    7. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by mhall119 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Even within a distribution, there's a completely new version of Linux seemingly every 6 months. That's enough to keep my business far, far away from Linux.

      You don't _have_ to upgrade when the new version comes out. Do you complain that your car manufacturer puts out a new model of your car every year?

      --
      http://www.mhall119.com
    8. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by dc29A · · Score: 3, Informative

      Microsoft have already done one kernel rewrite, going from Windows 9x/Me to Windows NT.

      Erm ... no. Microsoft had already finished the NT kernel when they decided to ditch the Win9x/ME "kernel" for the one in NT 4.0 and Win2K (NT came out ages before ME). It wasn't a kernel rewrite at all, just two different kernels running side by side until MS decided to kill the weak one and use the good one.

    9. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by swb · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You can already get the Linux flavor of your choice and install Wine on it.

      Which is kind of like saying you can buy a Shelby Cobra kit and drop any engine you want in it. Sure you *can*, but when the competition is factory-built Ford that works out the door, who's going to do it outside of hardcore hobbyists who always had choices anyway?

      Yes, there are desktop Linux distros that ship with it ready to go (more or less), but the fact that they *still* haven't supplanted Windows in any meaningful way means that it must not be as good a solution as advocates have made it out to be.

    10. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by Hal_Porter · · Score: 3, Informative

      Erm ... no. Microsoft had already finished the NT kernel when they decided to ditch the Win9x/ME "kernel" for the one in NT 4.0 and Win2K (NT came out ages before ME). It wasn't a kernel rewrite at all, just two different kernels running side by side until MS decided to kill the weak one and use the good one.

      The plan was to replace Windows 9x/Me from the start. In fact the original plan was that Windows 98 would be the last Windows based on the old kernel mode code and the transition to the NT kernel would be complete by Windows 2000. Windows Me was launched by popular demand. By the time Windows XP was launched the transition finally happened.

      So the plan was always to kill off 16 bit Windows and replace it with an NT based OS. This wasn't quite ready as of Windows 2000 so they had to launch on extra 16 bit OS, Windows Me as a stopgap waiting for Windows XP.

      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
    11. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by torkus · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I trust a multi-trillion dollar company that I have multi-million dollar support contracts with.

      I'm not a MS fanboy by any stretch, I'm just a realist with responsibility in the IT field. If my support team finds a critical bug in a key system at 4AM I'm confident we can have a 3rd level engineer on the phone to address and resolve the issue immediately. I've had beta patches made available, even alpha-code written to address a particular fault in the past.

      Sure, if I offered a F/OSS team leader a million dollars a year he'd promise to live at his desk in my office building. In reality that wouldn't be the case and I still couldn't draw on the 1,000's of other engineers and programmers MS has networked and available 24x7x365.

      Is MS software buggy? Sure, some is...and some more than others. Is Linux buggy? Yep, its got its own list of bugs out there too. In the end both platforms have their advantages and disadvantages. We use both and - guess what - there's no plans to replace the linux servers with MS or vice versa. They can co-exist and allow us poor tech geeks to take the best of both worlds for each implementation.

      --
      You can get rich if you own a politician, but you have to be rich to buy one in the first place.
    12. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by DogDude · · Score: 3, Informative

      Seriously, are you going to trust a mission-critical program to run on a Windows box in the first place.

      Sure. I have several in place right now. As do millions of other companies. Suggesting that it's a bad idea, or that it doesn't happen is FUD.

      --
      I don't respond to AC's.
    13. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by tobiasly · · Score: 4, Insightful

      WINE is the most mature Windows compatibility layer there is, and the best Microsoft could do is contribute to it, which you know very well they won't.

      Um, no, Windows is the most mature Windows compatibility layer there is, and unlike everyone else, Microsoft has the source code to it. They could very quickly create a compatibility layer in any new OS they come up with, much like Apple did when moving from OS 9 to OS X.

      What are you going to do, run Microsoft Ubersystem as a pure RDP client to Windows XP, which will be unsupported by then?

      Don't think RDP, think hypervisor. And Microsoft will support whatever it comes up with. All those old apps will continue to work, but just like OS 9 apps they will gradually be phased out and deprecated for their shiny new native counterparts, which Microsoft will gladly sell to everyone at their upgrade prices.

      Which do you think your typical corporate PHB will favor, running their old apps in WINE on Linux, or running them in a Microsoft supported emulation layer in the newest Microsoft OS?

    14. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by Metal_Militia · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If my support team finds a critical bug in a key system at 4AM I'm confident we can have a 3rd level engineer on the phone to address and resolve the issue immediately.

      For that, there is Red Hat.

    15. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by raddan · · Score: 5, Insightful

      but the fact that they *still* haven't supplanted Windows in any meaningful way means that it must not be as good a solution as advocates have made it out to be.

      This reminds me of something Eric Raymond talked about in The Art of UNIX Programming

      [T]he most dangerous enemy of a better solution is an existing codebase that is just good enough.

      I think that's what you're seeing here in the Windows world. Because the cost of the operating system is hidden (bundled with PC), most people don't really feel the impact of having to pay for it-- i.e., they don't need to evaluate it against the alternatives. And, as long as it works for them, there are no issues. Raymond's quote specifically refers to the Plan 9 operating system vs UNIX. But the same thing applies to Windows vs Linux.

      I think what you're starting to see, and the reason why this topic is coming up with more and more frequency, is that for a lot of people, Windows is not "good enough" anymore. Obviously, the "good enough" threshold is much higher if you're a technical user, and I think that's why a lot of technical users have made the switch to Linux-- the added cost of switching, mainly in terms of retraining time, is worth the effort. But for most people, who simply need a web browser, an email client, and a text editor, Windows works fine for them-- most of the time.

    16. Re:Don't expect any radical shift by DrgnDancer · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Ok, now you're being dishonest. I'm a loving Linux kinda guy, I have an old laptop running a file server over ndiswrapper'ed wireless driver FFS (yeah it's not very fast, but I'm not sending large amount of data back and forth and it's easier than running cable to my back office). Installing Windows is rarely if ever that difficult unless you are trying to install Windows 98 on a new Core2 Duo machine, and let me tell ya that installing old version of Linux on new hardware is no picnic either.

      I have Never Ever had install storage drivers on a workstation, laptop, or desktop class machine while installing Windows XP. I've done it on some pretty new hardware too (Including a box that I DID have to install storage drivers to get SuSE 9.0 on, which is a roughly concurrent OS). Server class hardware is a different matter, but hardware RAID cards are often fidgety in any OS install.

      Nearly every Video card I've every worked with is capable of showing XP at install with a much higher resolution than 800x600. Usually you only need to install the video drivers to get 3D acceleration working. This is more or less the same as Linux, which can usually display X in some way or fashion at install, but need proprietary drivers to use the fancy features of a card.

      Network cards are far MORE likely to work out of the box on a Windows install than a Linux install. Especially wireless networks cards. Linux's support for WiFi is notoriously poor. This is not really the fault of the Linux community or the distro vendors of course, but it doesn't change the fact that it's a bitch and a half to get wireless going on most Linux distros for all but a handful of cards.

      I use Linux extensively as both a server and desktop OS, I also use MacOS and Windows (though I avoid Windows very much, and we're considering switching to Macs for our admin staff). Misrepresenting Linux's warts or making Windows sound worse than it is doesn't accomplish anything. Especially here where people know better. I'd almost get the impression that the last time you install Windows was a Win98 box and you're assuming nothing has improved in ten years.

      --
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  2. 5 ways by tom17 · · Score: 5, Funny

    1. It could get much worse
    2. It could get worse
    3. It could stay the same
    4. It could get better
    5. It could get much better

    1. Re:5 ways by L4t3r4lu5 · · Score: 5, Funny

      6. CowboyNeal.

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    2. Re:5 ways by Doug+Neal · · Score: 3, Insightful

      1. It could get much worse

      My money's on this one. Bill Gates was a mild-mannered geek. Steve Ballmer's just a psychopath.

    3. Re:5 ways by capnkr · · Score: 4, Funny

      And the one thing that won't change:

      6. Profit

      --
      "...there are some things that can beat smartness and foresight. Awkwardness and stupidity can." ~ Mark Twain
  3. Working to standards rather than making the code by RichMan · · Score: 5, Insightful

    From Microsoft's attempts at documenting their file formats and interfaces I can say that Microsoft does not work to specifications or standards. They make the code work then make the working code the standard. That is bad practice and leads to, as all can see, bloated, undocumented and overly large interfaces.

    I believe the biggest change for Microsoft, whether or not they embrace openness, is to work to a specification driven development rather than a code driven development system. Spend the timing working on the specification and interfaces, get a workable interface and security model then implement it.

  4. Slashdot in 'not as good as it used to be' shock by Harold+Halloway · · Score: 5, Funny

    So Slashdot is now posting 'perfectly mediocre' stories? Come back Roland, all is forgiven.

  5. Isn't #5 already the case? by Lord_Frederick · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Without Gates Microsoft runs the risk of becoming a faceless super-corporation focusing on sales rather than developing the tech that could give the company an edge.

    Runs the risk? Isn't this what Microsoft is now?

  6. Open source Windows Vista? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    And kill linux and OSX at the same time...

    1. Re:Open source Windows Vista? by Alex+Pennace · · Score: 3, Funny

      And the Internet, too, if everyone grabs the Vista .tar.gz.

  7. Re:Slashdot in 'not as good as it used to be' shoc by ghoti · · Score: 3, Funny

    Yeah, it seems Taco is having a bit of an identity crisis. Either that, or he's just grumpy about having to work at such an ungodly early hour.

    --
    EagerEyes.org: Visualization and Visual Communication
  8. ok, let's chat by Tom · · Score: 5, Insightful

    #1:
    Yes, Gates has been an opponent of Free Software ever since his famous first letter. However, he's not been as vocal regarding Open Source Software, and that's where it's our loss that we forgot about the difference between them. MS has made some early attempts with "shared source", and like other stuff, they'll refine it.

    #2:
    Nonsense. That's got absolutely nothing to do with Gates, and everything with the fact that MS simply can't write another windos. After the entire NT team packed up and left, it's been going downhill, and one of the reasons Vista sucks so much is that they shipped something that nobody in the company understood how it worked. If you thought Vista was a trainwreck, wait for Win7.

    #3:
    What this shows even more is how MS works. Despite their total lack of experience and ability, they enter the game like they own it, and get a bloody nose. But they come back - and get another beating. Just that they keep coming back. You can see that modus operandi in almost every area. Hardware, consoles, much of their non-core software. Usually, it doesn't matter much because they don't learn and keep on sucking, but sometimes along the way they get some wits, or acquire another company, and suddenly they matter (e.g. hardware) or the market is just so small that by sheer power they force their way in (e.g. consoles).

    #4:
    Pfft. Unless you've been living under a rock for the past 20 years or so, you know that MS announcement regarding ODF is simply the opening stage of EEE. MS has replaced the "then you win" step of the "first they laugh at you..." thing with "then they embrace you, extend you, extinguish you", and fairly successfully at that. With MS as you enemy you don't win when they give up the fight. That's just their way of saying "ok, the cheap and easy way didn't work, we'll have to take you down the old way".

    #5:
    Yes, maybe. The only point that holds some merit, and even includes both sides of the story. Personally, I think MS will break apart. It'll be a long time, but a disorganized, never-grown-up company like MS simply needs a strong man to hold it together, and for all I know, the ape simply won't do.

    --
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    1. Re:ok, let's chat by Graymalkin · · Score: 3, Informative

      It appears the point completely missed you and apparently impaled an innocent bystander behind you. The XBox 360 has a long history which you're not properly accounting for. Before the 360 was the original XBox which did unexpectedly well especially considering the fierce competition of Sony and Nintendo. However before the XBox was Microsoft's work on the Dreamcast which did not do so well and sank Sega's hardware business. Before the Dreamcast was Microsoft's PC gaming division which only had a handful of real hits to its credit. Microsoft did what smaller companies could not do, fail repeatedly until they managed to get something working right. They were able to buy out game studios like Bungie and Rare in order to get some heavy hitting first party titles developed for their console. The XBox 360 is a good console because Microsoft has spent more than a decade struggling with a gaming business. XBox Live has a similar story, they bought out "The Village" which got rebranded Internet Gaming Zone which eventually became the MSN Gaming Zone and served as the conceptual basis for XBox Live. Again because of their size and money they could throw resources at a lackluster product and eventually make it stick. Other companies don't have that same luxury, look at Sega. Two successive market failures and it was lights out for their hardware division.

      --
      I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
  9. change by mark72005 · · Score: 4, Funny

    "are you sure you want to change Microsoft?" (confirm) (cancel)

    "are you really sure you want to change Microsoft? Like sure, sure?"
    (confirm) (cancel)

    "performing this action can be dangerous, are you sure?"
    (confirm) (cancel)

    "ok really this time...

  10. Ballmer by sveard · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Maybe Microsoft will change for the better after Ballmer leaves. But not while he's in charge. At least, that's what I think.

  11. Re:my personal preference by thermian · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Would be for microsoft to simply go away.

    Really? And what would you replace them with? An Apple Monopoly? an IBM one? Linux?

    Notice how many Linux distro's are being sponsored by big companies these days? Ok, this is a good thing as part of an active OS ecosystem, but name one you'd happily hand a majority share of the OS market to.

    Microsoft can't be excised from the IT world. If they, for the sake of argument, collapsed next week, there would be a worldwide IT company crash of epic proportions. We would all suffer.

    Like it or not, we need them to stick around. In order to survive they will have to evolve as a company, just like IBM did. I hope they do, as much as I like Linux (and I do, a lot), I wouldn't like it if that was all there was aside from Apple's OS.

    --
    A learning experience is one of those things that say, 'You know that thing you just did? Don't do that.' - D. Adams
  12. I hope that nothing changes by dotancohen · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I hope that nothing changes. That way, people will continue to pour over to Ubuntu. More people using Ubuntu will mean more apps written for Linux. Everybody (for values of everybody outside Redmond) wins.

    --
    It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong.
  13. Microsoft can't change.... by mario_grgic · · Score: 4, Interesting

    and as we know from history of extinct species, those who could not adapt and change died out and made way for the ones that could.

    And the reason Microsoft can't change is because they are catering now to huge bureaucratic corporations (think insurance companies, banks, etc, some of whom are still running Windows NT 4.0), and these are not exactly at the forefront of technological adoption let alone innovation. I.e. they cater to a market that doesn't like change.

    If Microsoft decided to do an "apple" and ditch Win32 for solid proven UNIX kernel and build their own APIs around that, these businesses would be creaming bloody murder and literary make Microsoft support their old crud.

    Now this could be done through VM these days (but then again most of businesses don't have powerful machines for their users), or perhaps MS could split consumer and business OS further, since consumers are more likely to follow latest trends.

    But all this seems to iffy and risky decision for Microsoft to make. So I don't expect any change from them.

    --
    As the island of our knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance.
  14. And yet, a radical shift could save Microsoft by Anonymous+Brave+Guy · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I guess the approach to this depends on your medium-term strategy. If you are concerned that Linux and OS X market share is likely to increase significantly based on current trends, and you acknowledge that Vista has been a failure in the market but there is still a lot of demand for XP today, then this indicates a need to move in a different direction where you can compete effectively with Linux and OS X a few years down the line but no desperate need to shift dramatically in the near future.

    If you assume that the thing most holding back Linux and OS X today is application (including driver) support, and you acknowledge that this is the major technical reason people are still using Windows, then from the previous assumptions you must expect software companies to focus more on portability and use of cross-platform libraries in future as the target markets using alternative operating systems grow. However, you can use this to your advantage, because it means if your new direction plays nicely, it will continue to be at least as attractive for software developers to support your platform as any of your rivals when they go cross-platform.

    If you look at the major competition in Linux and OS X, both are based on decades-old concepts that are tried and tested, but also aren't particularly well suited to current trends in networked access, mobile devices, and the like. This creates an opportunity for your new direction to provide genuine improvements for the users while learning from the successful ideas that have gone before, and thus to make your new platform the more attractive one.

    And here's the kicker. If you're Microsoft, you are one of the few companies on the planet that has sufficient development resources, financial reserves and attention from software developers to have a credible shot at this. But you need to be honest about the situation, and make a few hard choices about who you're going to put in charge, since your problem is not your generally very smart technical people or your generally very effective marketing people, it's your generally missing the point management people.

    I don't really expect them to do this, because I don't think they have the guts to bet the house on such a big move. But I honestly believe their best strategy in the market today is to sit in a holding pattern on the XP/Vista line for the near future (when neither Linux nor OS X is a serious threat to their dominance), aim to have a serious alternative a few years down the line that can compete on merit in a market where one-OS software is increasingly rare and the threats from alternative platforms like Linux, OS X, and whatever new trends emerge in web-based and mobile computing are growing. Along the way, they could move towards open standards and continue their strategy of basically giving away powerful development tools that support their platform, which would undermine some of the key selling points of the opposition, and continue to support the company via sales and incremental improvements to XP and Office for the immediate future.

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