FSF's "Defective By Design" Targets Apple Genius Bars

mjasay writes "At OSCON this year, MySQL's Brian Aker made this bold statement: 'Microsoft is irrelevant ... We're more worried about Apple.' The Free Software Foundation appears to have caught the hint, and has turned its attention to all-things-Apple with a 'denial of service' attack on the Apple Genius Bars. The idea is to completely book all Genius Bars and then ask the 'geniuses,' over and over again, a few questions about Apple's proprietary ways (while, apparently, real customers with support issues are left to flounder). Lost in this anti-Apple fervor, however, is the Free Software Foundation's complete and conscious failure to protect the web. Richard Stallman has long felt that software that doesn't sit on his desktop doesn't affect his freedom, but isn't the opposite true? Why is the FSF focused on Apple when the bigger concern should be Google, Yahoo!, Amazon, and other web players, a point made by Tim O'Reilly recently at OSCON?" Defective by Design is just one of many FSF projects, remember; it hardly seems fair to say that the FSF has been ignoring the implications of software as a service.

Comments

Mean-spirited?

[SultanCemil]

You know, this isn't cool - its just damn annoying to anyone who actually *needs* to use the genius bars. This will just cause the general public to hate the FSF.

Re:Mean-spirited?

[Pluvius]

They don't already?

Actually, no, they don't; they don't know who the FSF is. And they still won't after this stupid publicity stunt.

Rob

Re:Mean-spirited?

[houstonbofh]

They might want to take a long and hard look at how well the RIAA campaign of "pissing off the people you are trying to convert" is working.

Re:Mean-spirited?

[pschmied]

I can imagine the withering looks that any of my non-geek friends / family would give the people who are holding up their trip to the genius bar. "Couldn't you do something useful like volunteer at a women's shelter? Maybe donate some time to your community bike shop?"

Seriously, this is like crowding the checkout lines in the grocery store to protest cigarette sales. The FSF isn't going to make friends or influence people.

Re:Mean-spirited?

[Jesus_666]

I think this works very well to get the FSF's message across. Of course, this only holds true if the message is "The Free Software Foundation is a horde of trolls".

That's just like PETA members standing in front of the local supermarket's deli counter, yelling and cussing at people who dare buy dead animal parts. It's going to make people remember them, but not in a positive way.

Re:Mean-spirited?

[MagdJTK]

Exactly. It's not even well thought through. It reminds me of a group of eco-warrior types here in Oxford who have been letting down the tyres of people with SUVs. Of course, it just causes people to hate them and the SUV owners end up leaving their engine running for half an hour to reinflate their tyres using electric pumps anyway...

Re:Mean-spirited?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's also a waste of the FSF's time! Apple Geniuses are hourly employees who work in shopping malls. Their influence reaches at most into the AppleCare part of the company (and not even very strongly there); they have no involvement whatsoever in the parts of Apple that are doing things the FSF doesn't like. This is like pestering your postal carrier about the reasons for the latest increase in the price of stamps. Interfering with the stores' ability to provide (largely warranty-covered) service doesn't even substantially affect the company's bottom line (unless they're preparing for a years-long siege to slowly drag it down). It's tactical idiocy. In one of these "conversations" between a Genius and an FSF tantrum-thrower, I think it's safe to predict that the average IQ will be about 100.

Re:Mean-spirited?

[PocketPick]

And do you know what is probably even less cool? The fact that the individuals who are trying to initiate this stunt probably have no intention of showing up at the genius bars themselves...

I'd be curious to find out whether the author of this article (or any of it's backers at the FSF) actually intend on showing up, or if the plan merely involves their zealots who would rather disrupt an business rather than lend their time to something more productive like charity.

Re:Mean-spirited?

[encoderer]

If you're an organization designed to affect change and shake-up the status quo, and nobody hates you, you're not doing your job.

Re:Mean-spirited?

[macslas'hole]

If you're an organization designed to affect change and shake-up the status quo, and everybody hates you, you're also not doing your job.

Re:Mean-spirited?

[bds1986]

Disclaimer: I do not drive an SUV, I never have, probably never will, and think that many SUV owners don't need an SUV.

That said, where do you get off calling all SUV drivers assholes and sociopaths? Did you ever consider that some people have a legitimate need to drive an SUV? Did you ever stop to consider the consequences of letting the persons tyres down? Maybe that meant they were late to pick up their kids from school, missed a doctors appointment, or perhaps they're a doctor on-call who then couldn't get to the hospital in time to help a patient? Who's the sociopath now? They could have just stuck some stickers on the windows or something but noooooo, it's not a "statement" unless we infringe other people's rights!

As for Apple, I'm fully aware of the FSF and their ideals. I use Linux. But I also use Apple products, because I have every right to decide to spend my money on Apples evil proprietary software if I damn well want. If the FSF wants to make a statement then they can stand outside and hand out some flyers or something. Chances are, if Apple customers are standing behind the FSF at the genius bar, they don't want to know about software freedom, THEY WANT HELP WITH THE APPLE PRODUCT THAT THEY DECIDED TO PURCHASE.

This is why they will never be taken seriously

[antifoidulus]

by large segments of the population. Immature bullshit like this. You have a point, you can advertise it on your web site, but grow the fuck up. Doing shit like this will only turn people AWAY from your message.

Re:This is why they will never be taken seriously

[SanityInAnarchy]

Advertising on their website has not worked. For years, it hasn't worked.

Going from "no one notices" to "everyone hates you" can't be bad -- it's worth a shot, anyway.

Re:This is why they will never be taken seriously

[Billly Gates]

Demanding Linux be called GNU/Linux even makes linux users not like the FSF very much.

A line from Microsoft used against Oracle and Netscape during the anti trust trials was that their competitors needs to stop whining to the government and start innovating.

So the FSF should shut up and stop whinning and create great software.

Nerds and business users use what is the best and not because of its philosophy. Apple has the better mouse trap and its an expensive one at that. Xorg needs to start from scratch and create the features of aqua and software needs to follow the Opendesktop standard like what Ubuntu is trying to do. But I doubt it will work that well considering how entrenched consumers are with win32 based apps.

Here's what they will accomplish:

[Daniel Dvorkin]

(1) Interfere with people who need tech support.

(2) Piss off Apple customers and turn them away from F/OSS.

(3) Absolutely no change in Apple policy.

I'm glad to use F/OSS on my Mac, including a great deal of software produced under the FSF umbrella, and I have released software, developed on the Mac, under the GPL. The success of OS X has created a huge new market for those who develop on Unix-type systems. Braindead stunts like this really don't help.

Re:Here's what they will accomplish:

[Blakey Rat]

No kidding. This reminds me when those Truth ad people who go to some quiet neighborhood with a megaphone and make loud obnoxious asses of themselves in the middle of the night. Because one of the houses, supposedly, was owned by someone who made money from tobacco. Michael Moore uses this tactic all the time, also-- you can't talk to the CEO of the company, just harass their receptionist and security guys. Great thinking, there.

Re:Here's what they will accomplish:

[kithrup]

(3) Absolutely no change in Apple policy.

I disagree -- it'll make it clearer to Apple executives that open source people are ungrateful jerks who should be ignored at least, and possibly actively campaigned against.

I can find plenty of fault with Apple's open source policies... but they do have some, and they have made some pretty significant offerings. Yes, they could do more, and I'm sure there are plenty of Apple engineers who argue for that every day.

And those arguments get a lot harder to make with stunts like this.

Re:Here's what they will accomplish:

[MagdJTK]

I admit that the problem is mine and not Apple's. It's just that everything about Apple's approach to marketing their products creeps me out and causes me to experience an anxious nausea whenever I come into contact with their products or with dedicated users of their products. It's hard to bask in the cultural phenomenon that is Apple when you're nauseous.

I love how you hate these Apple fanboys yet you are equally irrationally against them. Why not just chill out? If you don't like a company, then don't buy their stuff. Don't make up a load of bullshit about how you feel nauseous when you see them (if you don't realise that's bullshit then you don't understand what nauseous means).

Whatever

[hansoloaf]

Whatever happened to the concept of freedom of choice? Some may not like Apple or Microsoft but to act in a manner that denies others freedom to choose the product they want does not make sense.

I would go through the education route - educate people why buying from Apple/Microsoft is bad. Also would teach about the differences of open and proprietary software etc.
Best way to deal with the proprietary companies is by the bottom line of the companies not interfering with individual rights.

DoSing is OK now?

[Fex303]

Will the FSF complain when Apple releases a software update that makes every Apple machine hit the FSF servers every couple of minutes?

I mean, if you're going to start a DDoS fight, don't complain when someone steps up and gives you the same treatment.

Brilliant

[Nimey]

Waste the time of large numbers of people who have nothing to do with making decisions for Apple, and also the time of those people who actually need help with their Apple equipment.

That'll win hearts and minds for sure.

As a mac using free software supporter...

[John Allsup]

I'm appalled that the FSF could resort to such negative tactics.

They need to be setting a good example if they are to have any chance of convincing people of the importance of free software. This just plays straight into the hands of those that wish to paint free software advocates as over-idealistic zealots with no concern for practicality -- the exact opposite of what a group like the FSF should be doing.

IRL trolls FTL

[snarfies]

While trolling online can be entertaining, trolling IRL sucks. The guys working at these places are probably just trying to get by in this world - they have nothing to do with Apple's corporate decisions. They don't need this kind of harassment. And while they don't need that kind of harassment, the other people who are locked out of actually getting, you know, actual legitimate support REALLY won't appreciate this move - if anything, it'll make them hate the FSF.

Re:This is harassment

[mordenkhai]

While I agree that the concept used here is very silly and could likely do more harm than good, I think perhaps the moniker of "borderline terrorism" is a bit overblown. Perhaps there needs to be a Godwin v2.0 with terrorism as the focal point.

DOS attacks? What on earth?

[Calibax]

In the past I've supported the FSF. This is not what I expect from such an organization.

Denial of Service attacks (of any kind) should not be perpetrated by honorable people. Does this have the general support of the FSF? What the hell do they think they are playing at?

Shut Up and Make Something Better

[SteveM]

Want to make Apple irrelevant?

It's fucking simple.

Make something better. Something that users want to use more than Apple products.

DOS attacks on genius bars is pretty infantile. And certainly won't endear the FSF to the people they are trying to reach.

Maybe FSJ was right, they are freetards.

SteveM

Re:Shut Up and Make Something Better

[DaveV1.0]

It doesn't work because #1 is false for most people.

Re:For the Nth time...

[DeadChobi]

Crap like this stunt are what make it difficult to have any kind of serious discussion of the merits and drawbacks of using open source software without being branded a Luinix Zealot. Seriously, if you're going to advocate freedom you should at least understand what the word means. It shouldn't mean that everyone is required to produce and use exclusively modifiable software. It should mean that everyone has the right to choose the best software for their intended outcome.

For example, there are Linux distributions which don't carry any kind of closed-source or proprietary software in their package managers. I respond to that by choosing not to use those distributions. I don't campaign vehemently against them and ignore other possibilities. Right now I'm on Windows because it works for me and what I want to accomplish. The FSF sounds like an organization which would desperately like me to not be free to choose Windows. I tried Ubuntu, and it just wasn't my thing.

Can these zealots at least acknowledge that it's possible for more than one opinion to exist in the world?

Re:This is harassment

[PopeRatzo]

"this is blatant harassment and possibly borderline terrorism."

--You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

---You quoted 8 words. Perhaps it would be more constructive to identify which word you are referring to.

If you can't tell which word is being used improperly in the above sentence, then having it explained to you won't help.

Microsoft Irrelevant? Hardly...

[PocketPick]

Microsoft "irrelevant"? Those are odd words for a company that still maintains a 90% operating system market share, an equivalent market share percentage for office and productivity software, and what was (till a few weeks ago) the top selling current-gen video game console in the United States.

And that's not counting Microsoft Exchange Server, SQL Server, their development platforms such as Visual Studio and a host of other profitable and well known product lines.

I agree that some of their attempts at breaking into new markets (see Zune, Windows Mobile, Live) have been failures or mixed successes at best, but to regard MSFT as "irrelevant" because headlines about them are not plastering your favorite blogs seems to demonstrate a high disregard for the facts.

Re:sounds good to me

[LihTox]

does that mean that Apple customers will stop buying Apple? Good!
If you're a Microsoft fanboy, then I have nothing to say to you.

If you're a UNIX/Linux supporter, however, you need to realize how important Apple has been to you. By maintaining a just-large-enough marketshare during the past two decades, Apple has kept alive the idea in the general public that Windows isn't the only possible operating system, keeping the door openn for Linux. Every ad for MacOS is also an ad for "not Windows" and therefore an ad (in part) for Linux and Unix, an ad which the Linux/UNIX community can't afford to run by itself. Everytime a group of Apple fans force a company to support a second operating system in their organization, they make it easier for Linux users to force them to support three.

Apple products aren't perfect, but they are good enough to hold off the behemoth, and that's been worth something.

I want a statement from the FSF

[99BottlesOfBeerInMyF]

Seriously. I hereby challenge a representative of the FSF foundation to speak up and tell us if any of the money donated to them has gone to this 'project'. I've donated money to them in the past, but if they think trying to block Apple's customers from getting tech support is helping... well they can do it without my contributions from now on. I donate so that they can help out with lawsuits regarding consumer freedom, not so they can create frustration and suffering among people who just want somebody to diagnose a problem with their laptop.

Congratulations guys. You'll be getting not a cent more from me until it is clear that the money won't be wasted on this kind of asshattery.

Anti-Trust Violation

[plsuh]

Folks,

If you really care about the FSF, you would shut down this project NOW. IANAL, but I am a former anti-trust economist. It is one thing to conduct a protest (such as a picket line) against the policies or actions of a company; it is another thing entirely to interfere with the business of a company (see "illegal restraint of trade"). A court will come down *hard* on the FSF for sponsoring a DOS action on the Genius Bars. The FSF could be fined, enjoined against actions, or both. In addition, the staff of the FSF and individual participants can be fined or jailed. The money that it will cost to defend the FSF against the lawsuits could be better spent on more useful causes. While Apple's lawyers are not the Nazgul, they are not far off the mark either and Apple has shown itself to be willing and able to use them.

Besides, even if consumers are turned off to Apple, where will they go? WinCE? Symbian? PalmOS? Zune?Are *any* of those better? Get real.

For crying out loud folks, this is a true freetard idea at its worst -- an action against a company that alienates the intended audience, accomplishes nothing, and makes the protesters look like unreasonable, wild-eyed radicals.

--Paul

Re:WTF?

[pohl]

It took Android and the jailbreak community to force their hand, make them admit that a web browser was not an SDK.

That's a wild & unsupported claim. A much simpler hypothesis is that the SDK wasn't ready to ship, the App Store wasn't ready to go live, and the browser was just used to placate developers and buy some time.

Your interpretation may make the jailbreak community feel great about themselves, but it fails the law of parsimony, don't you think?

(Occam's Razor)