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First-Ever Photo Tour of Defcon's Network Center
Kugrian writes "With over 9,000 hackers, freaks, feds, and geeks attending Defcon 16, the temporary wireless network setup there is considered the most hostile on the planet. Run by a dedicated group of volunteers known as Goons, the basement Defcon Network Operations Center is secured by means of a chain-link fence and armed guard. The 20-megabit connection, which is twice as fast as Defcon 15, runs over a point-to-point wireless link to another hotel that has point-of-presence in their basement. Wired's Threat Level blog managed to secure the first ever photo tour of the Center showing Goons, hardware and sniffer dogs." Reader TXISDude, who was at Defcon, doubts that attendance was as high as 9,000. Update: 08/13 18:14 GMT by T : Dave Bullock, the Wired photographer who shot these pictures, backs up that figure, though: "I interviewed Joe Grand, the badge designer a few weeks before the con. They ordered 8,600 total badges. They ran out of badges. There were hundreds of people with paper badges."
OVER 9000!!!!
Pure sycophancy.
...is that they are always humping your legs as soon as you put them in promiscuous mode.
...showing Goons, hardware and sniffer dogs.
These guys must be extremely high-tech if their security dogs can sniff wireless!
He's getting rather old, but he's a good mouse.
seriously, what is so special about this ?
MP3 Search Engine
They've got... network cables! and, and, switches and stuff! There's even some fiber there! It's almost like they're trying to get a bunch of people on the Interweb... crazy.
You are using English. Please learn the difference between loose and lose; they're, there, and their; your and you're.
I only just got back from defcon 16, and already I missed 20?
> DefCon 20
It's DefCon 16 this year.
The dog is security theatre but little substance.
They don't really need to sniff your crotch like that but the like to.
If these guys wanted any kind of openness with security, these pictures would be on the DEFCON index page instead of some kinda "security through obscurity" nonsense where only just now are we seeing how they are running the network. If it gets hacked, that should be part of the conference -- how it was compromised, what to do to protect it better, etc.
stuff |
The Defcon network is bad if you are a sheep, but if you jsut treat it like you are going to visit China (with a return trip through US Customs), its not that bad...
New system, everything through an SSH tunnel, only your necessary working set, and temporary login credentials to throwaway accounts, and its all good!
Test your net with Netalyzr
"...wireless link to another hotel that has point-of-presence in their basement"
boy, they truly make everyone feel right at home!
please don't pee on the routers!! You will void Cisco's warranty.
From TFS:
With over 9,000 hackers, freaks, feds, and geeks attending Defcon 16, the temporary wireless network setup there is considered the most hostile on the planet.
It's temporary. It's not going to have to be maintained for years on end, which is the point of textbook wiring jobs. Otherwise it's a waste of effort.
More Twoson than Cupertino
It's also probably set up for the conference, and taken down when it's over. Why would you bother neatly tying your cables and making everything proper lengths if you're going to just take it apart a week later? I'd be willing to bet most of their setup fits in that transit case under the firewall and switch.
"In case of emergency, break glass. Scream. Bleed to death."
They have the new nano-snout mods. Hi-fi!!
Yes, their network setup looks.. uhmmm... temporary and built with something less than a multimillion dollar budget. So, how would you build a wireless network for '9000' hackers?
Pretend you have some assets already plus $10,000 to spend. How would you build the temporary network?
I've seen a lot of 'how they did it' infrastructure articles, and lots of smirking here, so how would YOU build that network?
Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
A bunch of world class hackers set up a wireless network.
What could possibly go wrong?
Now granted it doesn't need to look neat to function correctly.
I've seen servers die because their power cables were dislodged by the weight of badly installed cables, also seen servers go offline when network cables get crushed and damaged. I'd say there is a fairly strong argument that it does need to look neat to function correctly, for permanent installs anyway.
This network was only built to last a few days so I doubt they're too worried ;-)
Not to state too much of the obvious but this is also a con(ferance) so I assume the network is setup temporarily and then brought back down once defcon is over.
The temporary nature tends to lead to less stringent cable management and gfn (good for now) physical security. Although it's impractical to have a guard stationed at the network devices 24/7 for most companies for a conference it's probably the easiest and cheapest method.
I trully thought I was going to see something spectacular. Better keep those pictures in file, rather than on the web.
Try going to Europe. Last time I went to the CCC Congress in Berlin the uplink was 600 mbit. They usually put up signs on the second deay stating "use more bandwidth."
Usually crappy US show network. Go over to Europe where they know how to put on a show. Very few rules and even those are flexible.
Oh, and the number of machines stolen over the past 23 years can be counted on one hand.
http://events.ccc.de/congress/2005/fahrplan/attachments/652-slides_network_review.pdf
It's not the size of your stack that matters, it's how you push and pop
I am not sure of the exact attendance, but Joe Grand made over 8,000 circuit board badges. If I recall correctly, the number was 8,500. I heard that by Sunday they ran out of badges and some people were stuck with the paper badges. Most people I saw this year did have the circuit badges by Sunday. Of the ones that did not, I don't know how much over 8,500 it is, but I suspect the "over 9,000" is probably overstated.
DT didn't give an attendance amount at the wrap up this year, so I don't know what the official count was.
Are other colors of makeup safer for APs?
"It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education." -Albert Einstein
This is weak compared to what STLP students in Kentucky setup for a convention of school teachers. How did this make the front page. Our inventory has a chain link fence. Our server room is protected by an inch thick steel door and physical firewalls (the kind that prevent burning) As well as a hacked motion activated halon fire suppression system. And several caffeine hyped, sleep deprived teens stationed outside the door.
TFA says that "...a quad-core Xeon running OpenBSD and employing pf to filter and shape traffic" is in place. I think it'd be excellent if they'd release the config for this so that we may all learn from it.
Release it after the con, that is, just in case there's a hole found in it...
Um...these volunteers set this up for free. Sure they could have spent serious $$$ on providing free wireless to a bunch of miscreants who are too cheap for mobile service and wired it up to look prettier. That's not the point. Unless you are volunteering to bring out your equipment, and setup and run this show, and do it just as securely and reliably, a simple THANK YOU will do. Otherwise, STHU. As wise old Ben said "Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do."
This is really a lame non-story. A technical document of the map and setup of their network might be interesting (though obviously too technical for Wired) but this? Am I supposed to be impressed? I see more Cisco gear on a daily basis and I don't work for a particularly large department. That's not to knock the Defcon people, they get the amount of gear they need to do the job, not to look impressive. However Wired should find something better to report about, especially if they are doing a photo tour. I can see doing a photo tour of a major fibre hub site for something large. I've been in the one at the university I work for and it is really cool, and not something most people get to see, even most tech people. However this is just a small pile of network gear. Wow. Yay.
Slashdot shouldn't have given Wired the traffic for this non-article.
U da foo if u run 20 mbps n 08 !!
Still it is sloppy for a temporary setup. Especially with a grandiose title of "First-Ever Photo Tour or Defcon's Network Center". I was expecting to see something Epic. Not just a hacked cabling job to some wi-fi access points. being that it is such a hostile network. I would expect in cases where things get out of hand they should be able to quickly unplug a rouge access point from the network ASAP, giving them a bit of time to view the logs block the mac address, before the guy moves in range of an other access point and starts again. Thus needing a little more organized designed.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
The reason there were so many badges is that speakers have the option of receiving their honorarium (small payment for speaking) in the form of three "Human" badges instead of cash. This is a very popular option because the badges are usually some really cool piece of kit and people want to play with them.
I would expect in cases where things get out of hand they should be able to quickly unplug a rouge access point from the network ASAP, giving them a bit of time to view the logs block the mac address, before the guy moves in range of an other access point and starts again. Thus needing a little more organized designed.
That is why they use Aruba AP's. MAC's are banned automatically. Why would they ever to that manually?
I've never been to DefCon before, so I'm just curious... do people actually get in trouble for any of the things they do there? If you do a man in the middle attack, do people get mad? Or is it just assumed that anyone on this network is fair game and you can 0wn them as you see fit?
Beware of bugs in the above code; I have only proved it correct, not tried it.
Old internet meme that was snuck in. This video might shed some light on it.
Murphey's fighting Occam, and we're in the stands.
The roster shows 121 speakers. If all of them opted for the three badges that would only add up to 363 badges. I do remember Joe saying the total number of badges ordered was at or over 8,500 (he gave a specific number, but I don't remember it). There were also badges for vendors, press, goons, and "hackers" (black badges). So "human" badges were probably 8,000, with the rest of the 500 made up of there rest of the colors. So even if you removed the ones given to the speakers, we would still be talking about over 8,000 people in total.
This year's badge session pdf's didn't list the breakdown like last year.
"Over 9000" is a joke/meme, Timothy. http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=over+9000 http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Over_9000
HASSEN IJOU DA!
(In the original Japanese audio, he actually says "It's over 8,000", which is funny because there are doubts the attendance was over 8,500).
During Defcon III it was all we could do to find a POTS line. This is pretty spiffy, and more than I would have expected if I were to attend. Defcon 6 had some internet thing going, as well as a large piece of butcher paper with usernames and passwords from those refusing to use secure channels.
I guess this would naturally be the standard evolution of things.
4) Profit!
Interested in a Flash-based MAME front end? Visit mame.danzbb.com
The Heat Map planning tool looks pretty nice. Does anyone know the name of this tool? I'm squinting at the image, but I don't recognize the interface and can't read some of the words.
"Can of worms? The can is open... the worms are everywhere."
By "Armed", I assume this article means "Guns".
A chainlink fence makes sense. A guard makes sense. Pepper spray makes sense. Locks make sense. Insurance makes sense. But do you really need an armed guard? Are you afraid of some armed heist or something?
Look, if a group of armed thugs tries to steal your network switches, let them have it. No need to risk your life over it, and no reason to kill someone for it. This is the intelligent way out. It's just a piece of hardware. You can replace the hardware, change your passwords. A good set of locks will deter thieves long enough for you to call the cops.
Guns are acceptable to protect you & your family from criminals, protect your constitutional rights, etc. But there are better, non-lethal ways to protect or replace your 'stuff'. Honestly, this isn't much different then killing someone because they stole your Nike sneakers.
It's like a paranoid materialistic fantasy used to justify a macho reason to own guns.
Or many the guns are just a deterrent.
A question,
There's mention of Aruba's Analytics and Threat Prevention System.
How does ForeScout Technologies' ActiveScout Intrusion Prevention Appliance stack up? - for those of you that know.
Much thanks.
~hylas
20Mbps? Are they kidding me?
PyCon 2008 used a 45Mbps DS3.
And, then, that's nothing compared to SCinet
That's just what they want you to think! http://tim.movementarian.com/archives/computer_bomb.jpg
Is 20 Mb supposed to be impressive? The Gathering (a norwegian computer party) had a 3 Gbit connection this year. http://www.gathering.org/tg08/TG08Nettverk.html
DEF CON organisers told us (the press) that there were 8,000+ (of which 3,800+ also attended Black Hat).
I was at DefCon this year (for the third straight time). It didn't feel like attendance was 9,000, but that's a really hard number to guess. There are:
- five lecture rooms running at all times (seating, I would estimate, between 1,000 and 3,000 per)
- a couple game rooms (about 150 and 300 in each at any given time)
- a few "villages" (with an average of maybe 150).
- hallways, always people in transit
- the "chillout" area
- the nearby eateries - hotel rooms, because many people don't attend every minute of the conference
So making a good estimate from personal experience is hard.
9,000 is probably a good guess, though, according to the guy who runs the event. According to DarkTangent in the closing cerimony, there were 8,500 official badge passes sold, with lesser quality badges going to those who showed up after the official badge supply was depleted. All 8,500 badges sold out, and I saw quite a few people wearing the backup plastic badges. So 9,000 seems like a good estimate.