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Coating a Motherboard In Thermal Resin?
Bat Country writes "I've had an idea in the back of my head for some time (and I'm surely not the only one) that it would be a worthwhile project to coat a motherboard in thermally conductive electrically insulating resin — complete with all of its various components — for the purpose of immersion, shock resistance, whatever. I'm curious to find out if anyone's undertaken a similar project or if it's known to be a shockingly bad idea (due to shrinkage during the curing process) already. Thoughts?" If you've done anything similar (even an experiment that failed), how did you go about it?
yeah, it's called conformal coating
Probably a lot easier to source yourself a few liters of Cray blood (or some similar non-conductive coolant) to submerge the board in instead.
Cheers,
The issue I see is with immersion. Sure you can coat the MB but what about the USB, VGA, etc connectors? Can you guarantee water will not leak in. Water has a way of getting inside any way it possibly can. Coating may be beneficial when you do not intend to put in case. Maybe to protect the MB as a bench system.
Wouldn't that conduct the heat from the CPU over to the other components?
The technical term you're looking for is Potting.
When they offered the SUN Crypto Accelerator cards for offloading SSL computations, almost the entire PCI card was coated in resin to prevent tampering. I don't think they're still available for purchase from SUN but I'm sure we've still got a few in storage at work somewhere.
"Ein Volk, ein Reich, ein Führer." -Adolf Hitler
"We are one Nation, we are one People." -The One 'leader'
Tomshardware had a computer in a fishtank full of mineral oil a bit ago. Works well but what a mess.
http://www.pugetsystems.com/submerged.php
This sounds almost exactly like something I did back in nineteen dickety two. We had to say "dickety" because the Kaiser had stolen our word for "twenty." I chased that rascal to get it back, but gave up after dickety-six miles.
I'm a big tall mofo.
It is electrically insulating and is commonly used for cooling electronics (think Cray supercomputers).
Part of the problem with conformal coat is that it makes it hard to service the electronics after it is cured. It also may or may not be uniformly distributed and thus may not pass muster in a tank of conductive liquid.
There are conductive epoxies like Stycast, but they're not particularly good conductors. The only reason to do immersion cooling is for good thermal contact to all components. A thick epoxy layer between your components and your liquid will quickly destroy that advantage.
Also, if you have connectors to the circuit board (like PCI connectors), then you cannot fill the pins. Last time I checked, most PCI connectors are just slots and have no bottom fill. Water will certainly get in under the coating through the slot.
Potting is used to keep the components from moving (usually in high-G environments. Sometimes you use it to keep close conductors from shorting (like solder-cup connector), but again the risk there is mostly movement of the conductors, not the environment. Potting materials usually do not have good thermal dissipation properties, and aren't really the best thing for environmental protection (humidity, liquid immersion etc) either. Conformal coating is what you want for the latter.
The IBM crypto processors had the module containing the key wrapped in wires (which, if broken, or changed in length, would erase the key) and internal to the module were thermal and x-ray sensors to prevent sniffing the contents of the module that way.
SirWired
My degree is Materials engineering, and I remember an undergrad design course where one of the groups was working with Rockwell Collins on this exact project.
They already commonly coat their boards in stuff for the very reasons you've listed. All kinds of circuit boards for radios, radar, anything electronic inside a jet fighter. The project was to find less-toxic alternatives that could match performance and cost.
People have been running PC electronics submerged in mineral oil for decades.
Advantages:
1. Not too hard to do
2. If push comes to shove, you can can probably burn the PC in your fireplace or other suitable container to keep warm. Or just because you are pissed at it.
Problems:
1. It's messy.
2. The oil tends to creep up any wires to the outside world (capillary action?) and eventually show up at the other end.
3. I'm not sure if non-gas tight connectors are used in modern PCs, but if they are, they may be a problem.
4. It's messy.
Did I mention that it is messy?
You can't see ANYTHING from a car, You've got to get out of the goddamned contraption and walk...Edward Abbey
Electronics has to be designed for potting, at least if it dissipates any significant power. You have to provide a heat path (usually a metal heat sink) out of the potted block. This is done routinely for DC-DC brick power supplies. But it's not going to work on a PC motherboard.
Years ago I worked at a company which had had problems with some telecom equipment in the field and no one could ever find any smoking gun. Random problems pointed to several different places on one particular board. One technician must have been working late, because apparently the CO filled with cockroaches once the sun went down. One of the theories was that bugs crawling across the board caused random short circuits. The customer was getting pissed, so management opted for a shotgun approach. Half a dozen shot-in-the-dark fixes were made, including adding an insulating coating. No one knows which one (or combination) of the fixes did the trick, but the random outages went away. That was engineering at its finest.
Power supplies for the C-64 were 'potted' as were many power supplies of the day.
The original C64 psu was renowed for its poor reilability, which was caused for the poor heat dissipation due to that very epoxy potting. They used big TO-3 transistors which got quite warm during normal operation.
In my former life I worked as an industrial electronics technician. My job was, in a nutshell, to modernize a manufacturing plant from its 1950s style, analog (pneumatic) technology, to digital electronic distributed control systems.
The environments these devices need to work in are quite harsh, with extreme temperatures and often corrosive atmospheres. The pneumatic control systems were quite robust in those environments... electronic devices need a lot of beefing up to survive these conditions.
One aspect of this was to treat all circuit boards with a conformal resin coating. The trick is to make sure the thermal coefficient of expansion of the resin, matches the expansion of the circuit board material. I am not a chemist, but I do know such coatings are available.
Another consideration which has been mentioned is how to treat connectors. The usual method is to apply a rubber like sealing compound after a connector is fitted and tested.
For less extreme environments, a much less expensive, but quite effective alternative, is to apply a cheap acrylic coating, using readily available sprays such as Krylon 1301. The procedure is...
Assemble the device (uncoated) and test thoroughly.
Disassemble the device.
Apply tape and / or petroleum jelly to connectors and contacts, to prevent damage from the spray.
Apply the spray to each component.
Assemble and re-test.
Hope this lights a bulb for you.
When I was doing a start up called Nisvara 2002 (now dead) we were building Silent computers and server rooms that didn't require air conditioning. Something like 50% power savings!
I was able to Pot or coat, power supply's, hard drive and motherboards in various materials.
The key is thermal conductivity. Yes some one here mention diamond, but that is expensive in unrealistic although diamond dust power was available from GE at a much lower cost then I expected. Carbon Fiber and other carbons are great except they are electrically conductive so they are ruled out (except diamond that is).
What worked great was epoxy with silicon carbide which is dirt cheap and sold as sand basting powder. Also boron nitride works great too, but this is a messy white powder and expensive.
Also a thin layer of silicon carbide or boron nitride epoxy could be applied then a layer of cheaper carbon black or chopped carbon fiber mixed epoxy could be use for making a thicker layer if needed. Non-metallic heat sinks work great using these materials.
We were able to take a Antec 450 Watt Power supply and run it at full load with no fans or heat sink fins as just one big white sold block of epoxy with boron nitride.
I am always doing that which I can not do, in order that I may learn how to do it. - Pablo Picasso
Molding & Casting (through replica propwork and creature prosthetic effecs) is a hobby of mine, so here's what I know about resins. Maybe it will help
Epoxy resin is good at holding up to high temperatures. It comes in a variety of cure times and is available in small quantities at hardware stores and large quantities at marine supply stores. The fumes are smelly and unsafe, but they at least dissapate soon after curing.
Polyester resin (aka fiberglass resin) is cheaper than epoxy. It is generally weaker. It's fumes are quite nasty and hang around for days, so it's really an outside thing. It's probably no good for this task as uncured resin ravenously dissolves polystyrene (I don't know if PCs ahve polystyrene, but I wouldn't risk it).
Polyurethane resins come in the widest variety of formulations. It varies from hard as rock to a very flexible rubber, and any mixture inbetween. It is very low odor, but the fumes are still nothing to mess around with. Some formulations use metal fillers like aluminum (reduces shrinkage/thermal warping), so look out for that. It will certainly shrink a bit, so thicker coatings should be done with more flexible varieties. Shrinkage can be reduced by adding loose chopped fiberglass, though this does raise thickness.
Silicone rubber, particularly Platinum cure silicone has low to zero shrinkage. It's also by far the least toxic. It's also the most expensive by volume. again wide range of cure times, thickness/thixotropy can be adjusted by adding fumed silica (just don't breath the stuff). It is thermally resistive, so you will want to keep coatings thin, and suppliment it with submersion. Still, if I was tinkering around with such hardhacks, I suspect I'd go this route. Silicone is a great electrical resistor and has fantastic waterproofing abilities
for thin coats of any of these materials, you'll want to brush or spray the liquid to minimize airbubbles. All types resins have sprayable formulations, either by using specialty spray devices sold by the resin manufacturer, or by thinning the resin with the appropriate solvent. The more solvent you add, the more shrinkage is an issue, which is supplanted by applying thin coats in good ventilation.
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