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PDF Exploits On the Rise

An anonymous reader writes "According to the TrustedSource Blog, malware authors increasingly target PDF files as an infection vector. Keep your browser plugins updated. From the article: 'The Portable Document Format (PDF) is one of the file formats of choice commonly used in today's enterprises, since it's widely deployed across different operating systems. But on a down-side this format has also known vulnerabilites which are exploited in the wild. Secure Computing's Anti-Malware Research Labs spotted a new and yet unknown exploit toolkit which exclusively targets Adobe's PDF format.'"

183 comments

  1. Not to worry. by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'm sure Secure Computing has a product for that. :-/

    1. Re:Not to worry. by electrictroy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Don't set your browser to auto-load PDF files. (Or any other file for that matter.) Download it first; scan it; then open it externally.

      --
      The government is not your daddy. Its purpose is not to raid middle-class neighbors' wallets and give it to you.
    2. Re:Not to worry. by Big+Nothing · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Or don't use Adobe Reader, instead use one of the many competent and more secure open alternatives.

      --
      SIG: TAKE OFF EVERY 'CAPTAIN'!!
    3. Re:Not to worry. by Mateo_LeFou · · Score: 1

      I was wondering whether there was any hope of getting websites to start saying "requires a PDF reader" instead of "requires Adobe's PDF reader". The non-Adobe readers I've used have pretty much all rendered docs fine and twice as quickly to boot.

      --
      My turnips listen for the soft cry of your love
    4. Re:Not to worry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      care to list them? and the feature set of xpdf doesn't cut it.

    5. Re:Not to worry. by mpe · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I was wondering whether there was any hope of getting websites to start saying "requires a PDF reader" instead of "requires Adobe's PDF reader".

      This is only going to happen after this kind of thing is called an "Acrobat Reader exploit" rather than a "PDF exploit" though.

    6. Re:Not to worry. by jonnythan · · Score: 4, Informative

      I've been using Foxit exclusively for some time now.

      There's nothing about Adobe Reader that I miss. Foxit seems to handle everything I come across just fine. And it's way faster and never crashes. Adobe Reader seemed to crash on me all the time on multiple machines.

    7. Re:Not to worry. by larry+bagina · · Score: 3, Informative

      I use Apple's Preview/display PDF. The only time I've needed to use Acrobat was for filling out IRS tax forms (Preview didn't save the data I entered).

      --
      Do you even lift?

      These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.

    8. Re:Not to worry. by houghi · · Score: 1

      I do that even for htm, txt and css file types.

      Seriously, technically you are right. However the danger is not for the people here on /. The danger is with the people who have no clue on how to do this. Could you explain my grand parrents who still have problems with handling a mouse on how to do that?

      Can I give them your number so that each time they see something like this, they can call you on what to do. Because that will happen for many people.

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    9. Re:Not to worry. by jofer · · Score: 2, Informative

      Kpdf/Okular is great if you're running KDE as your desktop. With kde4, I think okular will eventually be available for windows as well. (I'm not sure on that...) The main advantage is that it's very quick to load and tightly integrated with Kdesktop. If you don't use kde, it has fewer advantages over the others.

      You can annotate and review pdfs in okular just like you do in acroread. It doesn't have editing capability, but neither do the free versions of almost anything else, to my knowledge. (PDFedit is an exception, but it's too clunky for day-to-day use as a reader.)

    10. Re:Not to worry. by bugeaterr · · Score: 3, Insightful

      And missing features.

      Like script execution turned on by default.
      Nothing could go wrong there.

    11. Re:Not to worry. by spazdor · · Score: 2, Informative

      Evince works flawlessly for me.

      --
      DRM: Terminator crops for your mind!
    12. Re:Not to worry. by c0p0n · · Score: 2, Informative

      Aye, Foxit is really quick and it's a very good viewer. Okular in KDE is also very good rendering files, although it does lack a few features.

      --

      Your head a splode
    13. Re:Not to worry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Ummm..wouldn't that be McAfee?

      http://www.thetechherald.com/article.php/200839/2100/What-now-after-McAfee-snatches-Secure-Computing-for-465-million

      From the TFA: "On Monday, McAfee announced its plan to buy Secure Computing for $465 million USD. The announcement marks the second-largest acquisition for McAfee and Secure Computing, and is just the latest in a string of purchases led by Dave DeWalt, McAfeeâ(TM)s CEO."

    14. Re:Not to worry. by lysergic.acid · · Score: 2, Insightful

      oh, you mean the inability to start up in less than a minute? or the ability to act as a virus vector?

    15. Re:Not to worry. by c0y · · Score: 1

      Not to mention that Foxit doesn't require downloading huge updates (requiring a reboot to install) every other week.

      I actually had a new windows install at work yesterday and replaced Acrobat with Foxit. You even have to reboot to uninstall that crapware. WTH? It's not like it's loading a damn driver, is it?

      I cursed Adobe the whole time the machine was rebooting. Fuck them. I will go to lengths to ensure I never spend a single dime on any product of theirs.

    16. Re:Not to worry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Or don't use Adobe Reader, instead use one of the many competent and more secure open alternatives."

      Indeed. I personally use Evince (GNOME application) for viewing PDF files. Acrobat Reader is INSANELY resource-hungry and bloated package and using Evince makes you wonder how the heck is it even possible for a PDF reader to go that bad. Anyway, I doubt the alternative PDF readers suffer from the security issues present in Acrobat Reader. Most of them don't support scripts or such stuff. Not that I mind, I use PDF files for viewing-only and I think they should stay that way.
        -GayGirlie

    17. Re:Not to worry. by Ethanol-fueled · · Score: 2, Informative

      ...and the 80 megs of bloat is also a dealbreaker.

      Foxit FTW.

    18. Re:Not to worry. by Saint+Stephen · · Score: 2

      Yeah, but there was already a buffer overflow security fix a little while back. I am using Foxit too because I finally got sick of Adobe when they wanted to install some Flex or god awful runtime and phone home constantly. Adobe has gotten stupid.

      Time for a "Firefoxpdf" kind of thing. Foxit is it for me. Hope it doesn't have any more buffer overflows, but I bet it does.

    19. Re:Not to worry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Or don't use Adobe Reader, instead use one of the many competent and more secure open alternatives." - by Big Nothing (229456) on Tuesday September 23, @09:56AM (#25119623)

      Yes, that'd be 1 way around it... but, you CAN make it safe, by disabling its ability to use javascript!

      E.G.-> TO DISABLE JAVASCRIPTING IN ADOBE ACROBAT READER:

      1.) Use Adobe Acrobat Reader's EDIT menu

      2.) PREFERENCES submenu

      3.) Javascript section (in left-hand side column of options)

      APK

      P.S. => It's THAT, or, as others here have suggested - there are alternate freewares that can read/write/create Adobe Acrobat documents also... apk

    20. Re:Not to worry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Unless you want to fill in forms correctly. I hear that's popular functionality these days.

    21. Re:Not to worry. by netringer · · Score: 1

      I was wondering whether there was any hope of getting websites to start saying "requires a PDF reader" instead of "requires Adobe's PDF reader".

      This is only going to happen after this kind of thing is called an "Acrobat Reader exploit" rather than a "PDF exploit" though.

      Yeah sure. You expect to hear that things are called a "Windows exploit" rather than "Web exploit," too?

      --
      Ever dream you could fly? Get up from the Flight Sim. I Fly
    22. Re:Not to worry. by db32 · · Score: 1

      To be fair my experience with Secure Computing has been great. I haven't dealt with a lot of their stuff, but the Sidewinder Firewall is an incredible firewall.

      --
      The only change I can believe in is what I find in my couch cushions.
    23. Re:Not to worry. by Grishnakh · · Score: 2, Informative

      I use kpdf, and it works great for almost all PDFs. The only problem I have with it is PDFs that have fillable forms; I haven't found an open-source PDF viewer that can do that yet, so I usually use Adobe Reader or some German-made closed-source program whose name escapes me at the moment (I believe it starts with "C").

    24. Re:Not to worry. by drachenstern · · Score: 1

      Could that be due to the 3MB download versus the 300MB download? Have you seen the latest reader suite? It's ungodly.

      But yeah, I've been having my office users use Foxit more and more. Most love it, except for the one holdout that swears we should open all PDFs in Acrobat 5 so we can edit them, just in case we need to edit them. My response? Open Acrobat 5, File, Open, find PDF, Edit, Save.

      I mean, really...

      --
      2^3 * 31 * 647
    25. Re:Not to worry. by AmiMoJo · · Score: 2, Interesting

      The rendering quality of Foxit is sub-par, try SumatraPDF which is open-source. The visual quality is much better.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    26. Re:Not to worry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Anyway, I doubt the alternative PDF readers suffer from the security issues present in Acrobat Reader -GayGirlie" - by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 23, @11:53AM (#25121643)

      Well, I went & checked on EVINCE for you, & it too has KNOWN security vulnerabilities as of the date of this posting (same w/ FoxIT PDF reader):

      Vulnerability Report: Evince 0.x:

      1 Secunia advisories
      1 Vulnerabilities

      http://secunia.com/advisories/product/12767/

      APK

    27. Re:Not to worry. by Apple+Acolyte · · Score: 1

      Apple Preview handles forms properly, so it's possible to do it without Reader.

      --
      Part of the hardcore faithful who believed in Apple long before it was cool again to do so
    28. Re:Not to worry. by Idiomatick · · Score: 1

      Or never ever use PDF since they are bloated pieces of shit. I have no idea why this fileformat is still clinging to life. They could easily all be replaced by png files or rft the only differences would be the files would be smaller load in 1/10 the time and you wouldnt need another useless bloated product to load them.

    29. Re:Not to worry. by Intron · · Score: 1

      Not only does evince not have "KNOWN security vulnerabilities as of the date of this posting", it was already fixed at the time Secunia reported it in 2006:

      http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=383485

      --
      Intron: the portion of DNA which expresses nothing useful.
    30. Re:Not to worry. by davester666 · · Score: 1

      Actually, I liked the speed of Acrobat Reader 5 on the Mac. But since then, Acrobat Reader has just become a bloated waste of disk space. Even though it's only a 40 Mb initial download, when you actually install it, it's 190 Mb.

      And with Acrobat Reader 9, Adobe has begun using it to push their stupid Adobe AIR system with it [which it doesn't actually use, it's just to artificially increase their install base].

      Now I mainly stick with using Preview and I haven't come across any PDF's it has a problem with.

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
    31. Re:Not to worry. by BlackSnake112 · · Score: 2

      I think Adobe calls shutdown.exe on windows for a reboot. Usually I say reboot later and use the thing right away. Most times I do not need to reboot. Sometimes (lastest version) it complains that I need to reboot in order to use the software.

    32. Re:Not to worry. by Corwn+of+Amber · · Score: 1

      No it doesn't. I know, I tried. I edited a PDF in Adobe Reader, and now when I open it in Preview, the fonts (in form fields) are illegible. Complete gibberish : some characters are mirrored (i.e. read an 'e' in a mirror, some'e' chars appear just like that), others are replaced by international characters (a capital 'c' with an accent on it? In what language? I filled it in English btw)

      So, yes, you can do without Reader, but not if you have to read PDF forms that have been filled using it.

      --
      Making laws based on opinions that stem up from false informations leads to witch hunts.
    33. Re:Not to worry. by Dolda2000 · · Score: 1

      Evince has been doing that for quite a while now, thank you.

    34. Re:Not to worry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not to worry? do you even have googled for exploits on Foxit, Evince or xpdf? there are many.
      Don't feel so secure for using free software, everything has bugs.

    35. Re:Not to worry. by failedlogic · · Score: 1

      I learned that the hard way. Computer was infected with that annoying Windows 2008 Antivirus with a PDF launching in a browser.

    36. Re:Not to worry. by westyvw · · Score: 1

      KDE's Okular does forms. Get it. Its very Nice! And if you want to make that form obey your commands use pdfedit. Apt-get install okular pdfedit man i like linux!

    37. Re:Not to worry. by westyvw · · Score: 1

      Whats Okular missing? Is it anything that PDFedit adds? I like Okular, it added the one missing thing: rotation. It also added some nice markup and other neat little features.

    38. Re:Not to worry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You expect to hear that things are called a "Windows exploit" rather than "Web exploit," too?

      I'd like to hear people say "prohibition-related crime" instead of "drug-related" crime.
       

    39. Re:Not to worry. by (Score.5,+Interestin · · Score: 1

      Sumatra has a quirky user interface that makes it rather a pain to use. I've also never really seen any evidence that its rendering quality is better than Foxit or Acrobat or whatever. It is nice and quick though.

    40. Re:Not to worry. by richlv · · Score: 1

      okular is supposed to support fillable forms.
      haven't yet had a chance to test that, still using kde3 :)

      --
      Rich
    41. Re:Not to worry. by conan1989 · · Score: 1

      no, i got this web page changed.. just had to email he web master.

    42. Re:Not to worry. by c0p0n · · Score: 1

      Mainly a better way of selecting text and images for c&p. Mind you, it's what I use most of the time and I rarely need to c&p big amounts of text so it's not really a problem.

      --

      Your head a splode
    43. Re:Not to worry. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That's just known vulnerabilities. So what about unknown ones? There are going to be those, there always are.

    44. Re:Not to worry. by Grishnakh · · Score: 1

      I'll have to try that out. Thanks for the tip!

    45. Re:Not to worry. by AmiMoJo · · Score: 1

      http://www.donationcoder.com/Forums/bb/index.php?topic=8268.0

      It's a bit out of date now but the quality of Foxit has not changed in V2.3. Compare the font rendering to Adobe or Sumatra.

      --
      const int one = 65536; (Silvermoon, Texture.cs)
      SJW, n: "Someone I don't like, and by the way I'm a fuckwit" - AC
    46. Re:Not to worry. by jonnythan · · Score: 1

      FWIW, I just opened a similar document in Foxit and Adobe Reader simultaneously and they look almost identical. Nothing like the link. Foxit's actually a little sharper and clearer.

      http://i33.tinypic.com/192uqo.jpg

  2. Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    It's an owned & bloated container / format. What is really needed is an open and efficent network print protocol.

    Any suggestions?

    1. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by martinw89 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      No, it's just that for some people PDFs are a hammer and every single printed word on the tubes is a nail.

      I have had plenty of times where I was turning in papers electronically or needed to transfer documents between computers where PDF came in quite useful. When I'm turning in a paper electronically, I have no idea what version of Office the professor has. Nor do I even have Office. PDFs are very useful in this case.

      Also, it may not be as bloated as you perceive. Acrobot reader is slow as hell. Evince and KPDF, both on Linux, are noticeably faster for me. There are alternatives for Windows as well that are better than the "official" reader.

    2. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by querist · · Score: 5, Interesting

      As a university professor, I actively encourage my students to use PDF files if possible. OS X and Linux come with PDF output, and I'm sure there's a way to do it in Windows without paying Adobe.

      I also specifically PROHIBIT MS Office 2007/2008 .docx, .pptx, .xlsx, .xlwx, etc. formats. I'm not paying for an "upgrade" that completely changes the UI and introduces a new format without providing any real benefit to me.

      Yes, I accept OpenOffice.org documents (as well as .dvi, .ps, and the formats from iWork)

    3. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      There is a free .docx, .pptx,. xlsx, etc. format plug-in to do that.

    4. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by ais523 · · Score: 1

      Probably OpenOffice is the easiest way to create PDFs on Windows, there's a save-as-PDF button on the toolbar.

      --
      (1)DOCOMEFROM!2~.2'~#1WHILE:1<-"'?.1$.2'~'"':1/.1$.2'~#0"$#65535'"$"'"'&.1$.2'~'#0$#65535'"$#0'~#32767$#1"
    5. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by JustinOpinion · · Score: 4, Informative

      There are alternatives for Windows as well that are better than the "official" reader.

      Specifically Sumatra PDF and Foxit Reader are alternative PDF readers for Windows.

      They are both orders-of-magnitude faster than Adobe Acrobat. Part of the reason for this speed boost is that they don't implement the hundreds of plug-ins that Acrobat supports. But frankly for >99% of the PDFs you encounter, those additional plug-ins are not required. (In the rare case where a PDF needs one of those features, I guess you can load up Acrobat.)

      In addition to a speed advantage, using an alternate PDF reader is probably more secure. Both because it is less well-known (fewer exploits tailored to it), and because they don't implement those hundreds of plug-ins (some of which enable certain kinds of code execution).

    6. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Jason+Levine · · Score: 5, Informative

      For Windows the best (and free/open source) tool I've found is PDFCreator. It installs a "printer" on your computer that outputs to PDF. Using PDFCreator, you can make a PDF in any application that allows you to print. Using some of the "advanced" features (not really advanced, but slightly more complex than Print->PDF), you can even combine multiple print-outs from different applications into a single PDF.

      --
      My sci-fi novel, Ghost Thief, is now available from Amazon.com.
    7. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by larry+bagina · · Score: 1

      Two suggestions: postscript. DVI.

      --
      Do you even lift?

      These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.

    8. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by jefu · · Score: 1

      I do the same - PDFs only - except that I don't accept open office files or any other binary format. I do accept TeX, HTML and Docbook though (not that any of these are popular among my students).

    9. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by querist · · Score: 2, Informative

      I'll look into it, but the last time I tried the one for OS X it didn't work. It caused major problems with the formatting of the document, amongst other things. (And I have Office 2004 installed on my machine.)

    10. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or, he's running Mac OSX, like he said, and so that compatibility pack doesn't work for him.

    11. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by querist · · Score: 1

      I will make sure that I provide that information to my students. Thank you!

      I would gladly accept Office 2007/2008 format documents if I could read them. The converter for OS X provided by Microsoft does not preserve the document formatting and it does not convert equations correctly. Since I teach graduate level computer science courses, both of those considerations are very important.

      Fortunately, Office 2007 and 2008 both provide an easy to use "Save As" option that allows the students to save the document in an earlier format.

      If Microsoft can make their converter work correctly, or I can obtain a copy of Office 2008 LEGALLY, then I will start to accept those formats as well.

    12. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by houghi · · Score: 1

      HTML? Nice, I can make it with FrontPage [ducks]

      --
      Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
    13. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Fujisawa+Sensei · · Score: 1

      Learning to deal with twits dictating from their high horse is part of the real world... deal.

      --
      If someone is passing you on the right, you are an asshole for driving in the wrong lane.
    14. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by I+cant+believe+its+n · · Score: 1

      Sumatra PDF looks really nice!

      I just tried it out since I hate when Adobe PDF viewer says "would you like to update now or in a little while (your computer is ours anyway - hahaha). You will not even be given the option of 'not at all' - hahaha".

      I know someone here is thinking "Well, yea! You gotta keep up with the patchin'". But Adobe would like to infect my machine with flash. I prefer my coffe black and my PDFs as non-executables.

      --
      She made the willows dance
    15. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As a university professor, I actively encourage my students to use PDF files if possible.

      Your students hate you.

    16. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Goatie · · Score: 1

      "or I can obtain a copy of Office 2008 LEGALLY" Isn't it simply a case of buying a copy? Don't you get some discounts through your place of work? I know I can get my hands on it for £17 from my work. You should check if there's any schemes in place for you and your employer.

    17. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by mishehu · · Score: 3, Informative

      Actually, that only works for documents that you can view/edit in Open Office. For general purpose use, you can always opt for PDFCreator. We use it at our clients' offices, and have excellent results.

    18. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by DrSkwid · · Score: 1

      Postscript.

      Or just plain text.

      Postscript is a programming language though. It can infinite loop and read / write files.

      --
      There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
    19. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by RaceProUK · · Score: 1

      Is that better than PrimoPDF? The latest version of PrimoPDF annoys the hell out of me sometimes.

      --
      No colour or religion ever stopped the bullet from a gun
    20. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by X0563511 · · Score: 2, Informative

      CutePDF. It shows as a printer. Print to it, and you get a file save dialog asking where to put the PDF.

      As a bonus, it uses GPL Ghostscript as it's backend.

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    21. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by RulerOf · · Score: 1

      Or one could read his post and discover that was never mentioned.

      --
      Boot Windows, Linux, and ESX over the network for free.
    22. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by RulerOf · · Score: 1

      Learning to deal with twits dictating from their high horse

      I somehow expect more from one who claims to be a university professor.

      --
      Boot Windows, Linux, and ESX over the network for free.
    23. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Sax+Maniac · · Score: 2, Funny

      MS has always offered free Office document viewers, since the early Jurassic. But, don't tell your students that. Get them used to PDFs while you have some authority!

      --
      I can explanate how to administrate your network. You must configurate and segmentate it, so it can computate.
    24. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by iainl · · Score: 1

      He's no fanboy - read the other responses on the thread. Just someone who has problems with the compatibility pack being not all it's cracked up to be.

      --
      "I Know You Are But What Am I?"
    25. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by rnelsonee · · Score: 1

      I found that Sumatra and Foxit didn't render as nicely as Adobe's Reader, which is a shame because I really wanted to use them. But you can make reader as fast as Foxit (actually, a tiny bit faster) by just renaming the "plugins" folder found in the folder where AcroRead.exe resides so it doesn't know where all that code is. It starts up without throwing errors at you too. I ended up putting the search.dll back in, but haven't missed anything else yet.

      Should I assume that without all that extra plugin crap, this security issue is null?

    26. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

      CutePDF will work for any program that can print.
      Shouldn't all professors accept papers in at least one open format like PDF? Or even only accept documents in specific open formats? Just seems like the right way to do it. That way you don't require a student to buy any one specific program or use any specific OS.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    27. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by LWATCDR · · Score: 1

      I like PDFCreator but the last time I checked it didn't work with Vista.
      Still a good program but I am sure that some students are stuck with a Vista machine.
      CutePDF works with Vista and XP.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    28. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by querist · · Score: 1

      You are correct in that I neglected to mention that. I am sorry that my omission has lead to this misunderstanding.

      It is strictly a technical issue. I want to be able to read my students' assignments. The OS X .docx converter converts to .rtf and does not preserve equations or formatting.

      I will support .docx as soon as I can read the file format properly. I have contacted my university IT department and we have an arrangement with Microsoft to provide Office 2007/2008 to faculty. I will be picking up my copy of Office 2008 shortly and I will inform my students that the "ban" on Office 2007/2008 documents has been lifted because the reason it was imposed has been addressed.

      I realize I should have _asked_, but on the secured site where we can download the software that our arrangement with Microsoft makes available to us there is only Windows software, no OS X versions of anything. It appeared that they were only providing Windows-compatible software. Fortunately, in this case, I was mistaken.

    29. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you're using MS Office anyway, the xml format converters are free...

    30. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's wrong with you downloading the FREE Office 2007 Compatibility tool from Microsoft, which lets you deal with the 2007 formats in Office 2000 and later?

      http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/products/HA101686761033.aspx

    31. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by ApproachingLinux · · Score: 1

      can anyone answer why i can't get a pdf writer that renders a web page reasonably? two recent examples (which have different problems) from the front page of slashdot are:
      http://www.expatica.com/be/articles/news/European-Patent-Office-staff-on-strike.html
      and
      http://www.newscientist.com/blogs/shortsharpscience/2008/09/precrime-detector-is-showing-p.html

    32. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Adobe Reader 9 also shovels Adobe AIR onto your system without asking, as well as a program(?) called "Acrobat.com." Don't know what it is since I didn't run it to find out, but it dropped a shortcut onto my desktop and listed itself in Add/Remove Programs. Both of these unwanted parasites were nuked immediately.

    33. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      If you need to send these to a professional printer, don't forget to enable "Download as Softfont".

      This will include all fonts in the PDF document.

      Open the "Properties" of the PDFCreator printer, click "Printing Preferences..." , click "Advanced" under "True Type Font" choose "Download as Softfont".

    34. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 1

      Actually, PCs are assembled from components that originate from all over the world.

      ASUS, for example, which made the motherboards of every 1 in 3 PCs sold worldwide in 2007, is headquartered in Taipei (which is not in China, no matter what the Chinese government would like everyone to think), and has manufacturing facilities in mainland China, Mexico, and the Czech Republic.

      Intel has facilities worldwide, including Costa Rico, Mexico, and Taiwan.

      Most often, to avoid tariffs, PCs sold in the U.S. are assembled in the United States, Canada or Mexico.

    35. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 1

      Errmmmmm.....wrong thread. Never mind.

    36. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by multimediavt · · Score: 1

      CutePDF(free) to create, and PDF Annotator(shareware), well, to do everything else. We (Virginia Tech) actually got a site license for Annotator and it was $4 a copy.

    37. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by ScrewMaster · · Score: 1

      For Windows the best (and free/open source) tool I've found is PDFCreator [pdfforge.org]. It installs a "printer" on your computer that outputs to PDF.

      I agree. I like the fact that PDFCreator can automatically open a file in the default PDF reader (I use Foxit, myself, but I hear SumatraPDF is worth looking into) which is great when I'm developing printed reports. Saves a lot of trees.

      --
      The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
    38. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I am happy with this:

      ======== CUT =======
      #! /bin/sh
      [ -z $1 ] && {
              echo "No file? (Good chice)..."
              exit 0
      }

      TF=`basename $1 .pdf`.txt
      pdftotext $1 && fmt tmp-$$.txt && mv tmp-$$.txt $TF && vim $TF
      ======== CUT =======

      Replace vim $TF with whatever print spooler you like and you got network printing protocol.

    39. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by GuidoW · · Score: 1

      I prefer pdflatex.

      --
      If it's so secret, then how come I've never heard of it?
    40. Re:Good news cause PDF's should be shunned by mishehu · · Score: 1

      I've never used PrimoPDF before, so I do not know how it compares. With PDFCreator, we set all the parameters for them and then all they do is print and save to file or e-mail. A few of the more advanced users have been able to handle the combining of documents in the PDFCreator spool into one PDF document. Note, however, that we do not install the goofy IE/Firefox toolbars when we do the install.

  3. Could you infect a jpg by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    with an .std format ?

    1. Re:Could you infect a jpg by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I knew I shouldn't have allowed my jpgs to mate freely with my binary files.

  4. Time for PDF Lite? by davidwr · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Most PDF files have nothing more than text, vector graphics, and images in "read-only" formats. They don't have fill-in-the-blank fields or load-a-codec-and-play-a-video, or active content.

    Web browsers need a "simple PDF" plugin that will activate on PDFs. If the "simple PDF" plugin loads a file with content it can't display, it will display what it can and give the user an opportunity to load the file in a full-fledged PDF plugin or external viewer.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
    1. Re:Time for PDF Lite? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      But then it would load fast and not have all the EEE features that locks-in users into Adobe's PDF Reader.

      /Sarcastic ADOBE PDF shill

    2. Re:Time for PDF Lite? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      I second this idea. If the file format is so complex that it's vulnerable to this kind of attack, and the advice we get is "make sure your OS and browser are updated because the format can't be fixed reliably," then the format is too complicated for its own good. It's fallen victim to feature creep.

    3. Re:Time for PDF Lite? by nneonneo · · Score: 1

      Safari on Mac will, by default, load Preview unless Adobe Reader has decided to override it.

      Preview is the Mac OS X general-purpose image/PDF viewer. It loads very quickly and displays PDFs using Apple's renderer (which also underlies a lot of their GUI -- a number of the UI elements are actually PDF files!).

      On Linux, most browsers will use Xpdf or similar and are not hard to configure to use a different viewer.

      It seems that the problem exists mainly on Windows, where the lack of well-known alternatives force the majority of users to use Adobe Reader.

    4. Re:Time for PDF Lite? by romanval · · Score: 1

      Mac Safari already does that.. when you don't have Acrobat Reader installed.
      That's because of quartz library, which is Mac OS X's pdf based graphics rendering subsystem.
      It's great because it'll show pdfs directly in Mail app as an inline attachment. (no need to open it!).

    5. Re:Time for PDF Lite? by ElectricEuphonium · · Score: 0

      Does anyone besides me think it's silly that a document format that most people intend to use for reading contains so many unneeded extras that it becomes an exploit vector?

      What people really want is an easy way to share formatted documents. We need to re-examine the PDF format itself and what we have let it become.

    6. Re:Time for PDF Lite? by mpe · · Score: 1

      Does anyone besides me think it's silly that a document format that most people intend to use for reading contains so many unneeded extras that it becomes an exploit vector?

      It certainly wouldn't be the first example of a format which contains "features" (which may or may not be documented) which are virtually exclusivly used maliciously.

      What people really want is an easy way to share formatted documents.

      Often along the lines of "it would look like this if printed". Something which sending the likes of word processor documents can easily fail to do.

      We need to re-examine the PDF format itself and what we have let it become.

      It probably dosn't help here that PDF is a proprietary format. With Adobe selling software for PDF creation. Many of the "features" may have come into being so that a marketer can say "it does X" rather than much in the way of user demand to be able to do X or considering if doing X is an especially good idea.

    7. Re:Time for PDF Lite? by Tacvek · · Score: 1

      Funny that you should claim EEE, when Adobe not only created PDF, but are the maintainers of the format.

      --
      Stylish sheet to fix many problems in Slashdot's D3: https://gist.github.com/801524
  5. Or as teh hackers will call it by eclectro · · Score: 1

    Portable Virus Format, PVF

    --
    Take the cheese to sickbay, the doctor should see it as soon as possible - B'Elanna Torres, "Learning Curve"
  6. YAY for JavaScript and Flash support in PDFs! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Functionality at any cost

  7. Security article by digitaldc · · Score: 1

    And don't forget to not only patch the latested operating system and browser vulnerabilities, but also keep an eye on third-party browser plugins like Adobe Reader, Flash Player and QuickTime.

    Why do all these security articles end up basically saying the same thing?

    Patch & update, rinse, repeat.

    Everything else in these security/warning articles just show you what happens to the people who never patch anything and open anything & everything.

    --
    He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
    1. Re:Security article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Why do all these security articles end up basically saying the same thing?

      You mean that none of those companies even consider thinking of giving the user a possibility to run their stuff in a (default) secure setting (not giving the reader/PDF permission to do anything else than display the content) ?

      I personally had to remove, by hand, a number of accompanying DLLs to Acrobats PDF-reader from which I never seem to use their functionality (like web-buying thru a PDF) but get loaded every time (slowing it down).

      Instead of them I really would like to be able to add information to the PDF (like my own remarks and bookmarks), even if it would be stored in an extra file (and not in the PDF itself).

  8. PDF exploit? Or Adobe Reader exploit? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    What if you use a PDF reader that's not made by Adobe?

    1. Re:PDF exploit? Or Adobe Reader exploit? by eclectro · · Score: 5, Funny

      What if you use a PDF reader that's not made by Adobe?

      You download the virus using flash.

      --
      Take the cheese to sickbay, the doctor should see it as soon as possible - B'Elanna Torres, "Learning Curve"
    2. Re:PDF exploit? Or Adobe Reader exploit? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Right. I use Foxit reader, which is fairly limited in functionality but allows me to read most PDFs just fine.

  9. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  10. I wonder why? by Nerdposeur · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Hmmmm. Maybe this is because they've crammed all kinds of interactive content into a Portable Document Format?

    I mean seriously. I thought the idea of PDFs was "this is as simple as a printed copy, and looks the same."

    1. Re:I wonder why? by Shados · · Score: 1

      Wouldn't that describe PostScript better? And even Microsoft's XPS! PDF was pretty much always doing too much IMO... but its what caught on, meh. The features it provides are very very useful. Just not so useful in non-trusted environments.

    2. Re:I wonder why? by Dr_Barnowl · · Score: 3, Informative

      Postscript can contain function calls and as such, is often marked as a potential scripting threat. Google, for example, refuses to send raw eps files as attachments.

      A similar principle to Windows MetaFile, which is essentially a list of calls to the Windows graphics library ; several Windows exploits owe their birth to WMF calling unchecked functions in the graphics library.

      Note that just because a file format doesn't contain function calls or scripting does not make it secure. A poor implementation of any file reader can be vulnerable to a well crafted file. But active content makes things much easier, because it's much harder to check for security.

  11. PDF Excellent Target for Phishing by hksdot · · Score: 0

    It's always been the case that human (generally users rather than admins) are the weakest link in the security chain, and this trend only increases as technologies to thwart network and malware attacks become more sophisticated. In the wild, you increasingly see targeted phishing attacks against companies and government agencies.

    Unencrypted e-mail only works to the extent that it does because humans can *usually* decide whether a received e-mail is legitimate based on the content. However, in organizations it is common to receive fairly generic e-mails that contain office documents, so if the sender looks right (and does not trigger any of the technological tripwires), an office worker is pretty likely to open a document attached to a generic e-mail -- or worse yet, one that has been tailor-made just for the recipient by attackers.

    Of course there are many other mediums over which to transmit PDFs, the clients of which have been rife with bugs despite their ubiquity in the office, but e-mail for the time being is the main vector. This problem won't go away until we either have:

    1. Suitable, ubiquitous, open-source software to open office documents with security as a main focus of the projects, AND/OR
    2. Authenticated e-mail with secure PKI structures (glwt).

  12. Sumatra PDF Reader by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    Use the Sumatra PDF Reader. It is a very lightweight reader. Since it doesn't have all the other useless bloat crap that Adobe's reader has, I'm sure it is a lot less vulnerable. It is also open source, so you don't have to rely on downloading an even more bloated version of Acrobat Reader to fix the exploits.

    http://blog.kowalczyk.info/software/sumatrapdf/

    I have this installed on all of the PCs here at the office. It has eliminated just about all of the issues i had with the adobe crapware.

    1. Re:Sumatra PDF Reader by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      Also if you want to create pdf files without paying the adobe tax, check out CutePDF writer. It has to be one of the best free PDF creaters i've found for windows. I also have this on all of the office PCs.. http://www.cutepdf.com/

    2. Re:Sumatra PDF Reader by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I use this also, but for some reason it doesn't render part of text correctly on a few PDF, so I'm mainly using ghostview (that I have installed for another software).

      captcha: despair

  13. Postscript by Rinisari · · Score: 1

    PDF is essentially a compressed, higher ability Postscript, right? Postscript is a language, and that therefore would be how malware writers exploit it--they exploit bugs in the readers, which are essentially compilers--to compromise a system.

    1. Re:Postscript by Angstroem · · Score: 5, Informative

      PDF is essentially a compressed, higher ability Postscript, right?

      On the contrary, PDF is (originally) a subset of PS plus the ability to embed fonts into the document, apply some overall compression where sensible, and stitch everything together into one carrier.

      And while it is true that the past knows about "PS bombs" which e.g. will render your printer useless cause its interpreter is stuck in a loop (after all, PS is a Turing-capable programming language opening all sorts of fun if your idea of fun are stack-oriented languages), the problem with current PDF exploits comes from the fact that this format gets increasingly overloaded.

      I can see why one would love to see Javascript and embedding all kinds of multimedia stuff within PDF. Would bring PDF on par with Powerpoint with respect to animations etc. -- which wouldn't be the worst thing for me, cause I love doing slides with PDFtex and beamer, and Adobe of course would like to present their format as a vital alternative to those nasty office formats.

      But it also adds complexity. Instead of a simple postscript renderer you end up with a gazillion of helper libraries, bringing in their very own bugs.

    2. Re:Postscript by Flying+Scotsman · · Score: 1

      You're correct that PostScript is Turing-complete programming language, but PDF is not. PDF is more or less just a description of the graphics to draw. Here's a Wikipedia link regarding the difference.

    3. Re:Postscript by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      PDF isn't Postscript but Adobe did see fit to add javascript capabilities to their reader. I remember thinking to myself many years back (the days when fresh js exploits for IE6 were emerging on a daily basis), "this is gonna cause problems".

    4. Re:Postscript by romanval · · Score: 1

      Postscript is a Turing complete language, but it's output can only be a page buffer. Kind of hard to spread a virus that way.

      PDF is a parametric page description format similar to (although nothing like) HTML... it's only Turing complete when it includes Javascript (although the percentage of pdfs created with embedded javascript are very small, certainly <1%)

      If anything, this means Javascript should be a separate OS library that the user can configure separately (and use different interpreters/engines) since adobe just static-binds a 3rd party javascript interpreter into acrobat anyways.

    5. Re:Postscript by tayhimself · · Score: 1
      Do you know if the bug is in Javascript portion of Acrobat Reader rather than the pdf portion.

      You can turn of Javascript for Acrobat Reader so that could be a temporary fix (or permanent depending on security prefs).

    6. Re:Postscript by piers_downunder · · Score: 1

      Actually Postscript (starting with level 2, and further improved with level 3) also supports compression. You can internally compress using CCITT (fax), JPEG, Deflate and probably others I have forgotten. Any L3 compliant Postscript device can handle it too.

      I know this because I added image compression support to a Postscript driver a few years ago (at a time where there were precious few reference materials on the web - ugh).

  14. New PDFs in my inbox... by Jonah+Hex · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Interestingly enough, I have gotten 3 PDFs in the past few days in my corporate email inviting me to various "seminars" on technology subjects. All were very well written and professional looking but for products I have never used and companies I had not heard of. They passed both my email server's scanning and the local virus scan on my company laptop, however since I have very rarely gotten PDFs in the past I am now very suspicious.

    Jonah HEX

    1. Re:New PDFs in my inbox... by MyLongNickName · · Score: 4, Funny

      I have a link to a white paper on how to tell if a PDF is a security threat. I can share it if you like. PDF format of course.

      --
      See my journal for slashdot ID's by year. Mine created in 2005. http://slashdot.org/journal/289875/slashdot-ids-by-year
  15. Logical Step for Exploits by neonprimetime · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Exploit the Windows operating system cause the majority of users have it. Exploit Internet Explorer because the majority of users have it. Exploit Office products because the majority of users have it. Exploit Adobe's PDF format because the majority of users have it.

    There is now Mac OS, various Linux distros, etc. There is FireFox, Opera, Chrome, etc. There is Open Office, etc. Maybe Adobe needs some good competition in the eyes of the public?

    1. Re:Logical Step for Exploits by Miamicanes · · Score: 1

      > Exploit the Windows operating system cause the majority of users have it.
      > Exploit Internet Explorer because the majority of users have it.
      > Exploit Office products because the majority of users have it.
      > Exploit Adobe's PDF format because the majority of users have it.

      Fortunately, you seem to be right. Remember back around 1998, when ActiveState Perl installed itself as a CLIENT-SIDE BROWSER SCRIPTING LANGUAGE for Internet Explorer, sitting alongside VBscript and JScript... but no real limits on what it could do? Had more than a few thousand people installed it at the time, it could have gone down in history as the most outrageously dangerous exploit of all time. A hidden time bomb that would have enabled someone with even minimal knowledge of Perl to embed it in innocent-looking HTML pages and do... well... just about anything you COULD do with Perl, which was "basically everything". Adding insult to injury, it would have burned PRECISELY the group of people to whom these kinds of things "never" happen ;)

      Interestingly, the capability of installing Perl as a browser scripting language was still present in modern releases of ActivePerl the last time I felt curious and looked it up... but you had to finish the job manually to enable it, and I think one of the requirements was that you hand-insert a registry key whose name and value was something like "IAmTrulyInsane=1" just to drive home the point that it was an exceptionally bad idea.

    2. Re:Logical Step for Exploits by isorox · · Score: 1

      just about anything you COULD do with Perl, which was "basically everything"

      $#/%% ^!&**//!\\|!($$

      There, just wiped your harddrive

  16. I don't see any PDF files by paniq · · Score: 0

    no, literally. The screenshot of this baby blue office-vista-style malware app has made me blind.

    --
    Do not trust this signature.
  17. SCAM Research Labs? by StarEmperor · · Score: 3, Funny

    Wait, we're supposed to trust the findings from SCAM Research Labs?

    Personally, I'm waiting to get a job at Secure Computing's Over-The-Counter Hardware Research Lab.

    1. Re:SCAM Research Labs? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Personally, I'm waiting to get a job at Secure Computing's Over-The-Counter Hardware Research Lab.

      That's the one way out on Islay, is it? I hear they have relaxed workdays.

  18. Patch and Update by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As much as "Patch and Update" is a mantra with many other pieces of software, Adobe Acrobat is the quintessential example of bloatware-gone-wild. I stick with Reader 4.0 simply because I can't stand the awful evolution of the software; for things that Reader 4.0 can't open, I use Ghostscript/GSView32. Would Reader 4.0, on account of its antiquity, still be vulnerable to these exploits? I'd really prefer to not have to have whatever current iteration of Acrobat that's out there on my machine.

  19. Update by pzs · · Score: 4, Interesting

    When I used to use Windows, I found Acrobat to be the most intrusive software ever because of its auto-update. Pretty much every time you try to open a document it's in your face demanding you allow it to update itself and then it often requests a reboot (a reboot? For a PDF viewer??)

    This seemed to happen every other week, even if appeased it by letting it do its thing. I suspect this update would be one possible attack vector.

    Yet another case in which a "fuck off" key would be a useful addition to the Windows keyboard.

    1. Re:Update by mako1138 · · Score: 1

      If you don't run as Administrator, none of that stuff shows up.

    2. Re:Update by GFree678 · · Score: 1

      Why didn't you disable the auto-update?

      Run Acrobat -> Help menu -> Check for updates

      Let it check, then click on Preferences, disable the "Automatically check for Adobe updates" checkbox

      Of course, I've noticed many supposed geeks rant about such thing instead of actually getting in there and working out how to fix the issue. Instead of simply finding the option to change in an existing program, they instead just move to another program or even worse, change operating systems instead of actually spending some time doing a little poking around/research.

    3. Re:Update by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      When I used to use Windows, I found Acrobat to be the most intrusive software ever because of its auto-update. Pretty much every time you try to open a document it's in your face demanding you allow it to update itself and then it often requests a reboot (a reboot? For a PDF viewer??)

      Which is why you should use a software firewall to restrict which applications can access the internet. Don't want your PDF reader to access the internet ever? Done. Want to allow it to only contact some IP addresses at adobe? Done.

      Yet another case in which a "fuck off" key would be a useful addition to the Windows keyboard.

      See above. Software firewalls work wonders.

  20. If using Adobe's version, turn everything off by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    The Javascript stuff, the embedded media formats, all the other scripting nonsense, e-mail, the "phone-home-to-Adobe's-servers" auto-update junk, and other fluff that is irrelevant to presenting an ordinary document, and you end up with A) a faster and less bloated program, B) a less vulnerable program.

    Alternatively, use a third-party PDF viewer and save yourself the grief of stripping that stuff out of Adobe's version, because Adobe doesn't make it easy to do without plenty of trial and error. For that matter, Adobe could get a clue and ship a "Lite" version themselves.

  21. alternatives? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    are xpdf, kpdf, etc safe (i.e this is just an implementation error in adobes product) or are any of these problems systematic of the format (e.g you need to let the file access font files to check if it has them, bad example but you get the idea)?

  22. Overuse of PDF by owlnation · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The biggest issue is overuse and inappropriate use of PDF.

    The only reason to ever use PDF is if it is NECESSARY for your audience to print the document in question.

    Way too often websites have PDFs that are the only alternative for information. If you want to look up a train time for example, once and once only, you almost always have to download a PDF -- why? Sure, give people the choice of doing that if they want to, but there's no reason to slow down the internet for one-off pieces of information.

    With concerns about the environment (perceived real or theatrical, regardless), you'd think that firms would stop encouraging frivolous use of paper. With the extortionate cost of printer ink, you'd think that firms would also be cost-conscious.

    Uploading a 2 or 3 page document to the web in a PDF format is a criminal waste of resources, it's also an irritation that I don't need. I do not (and will never) work in a corporation. I do not need Office or PDF format -- ever. It's slow, and it's crap to read online.

    I can cheerfully live my entire life without it, and I sincerely wish retarded developers and content managers would stop forcing it on me.

    1. Re:Overuse of PDF by Ardeaem · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Often, the reason for this is that either 1) the document in question was first designed for a print medium, or 2) The material was dumped from some kind of database as PDF. Often to redesign the output to be a better in web format is nontrivial. Why should they waste so many workhours on such a thing? It would provide no benefit in terms of the information that is available. It would only keep you from being annoyed.

      Given that many of the organizations doing this are government organizations, and they use tax dollars, do you want your tax dollars spent on just redesigning output to be appropriate for HTML? I'll just deal with the (small) annoyance, thanks.

      Any format can be exploited. The (over)use of PDF is not the issue here.

    2. Re:Overuse of PDF by gtall · · Score: 1

      Bullshit. Ever write a mathematics paper? You won't be doing that anytime soon in html (or some variant) and you are just plain not in mathematics if you attempt it in Word. The only system is (La)TeX and it generally produces .pdfs.

    3. Re:Overuse of PDF by Locklin · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Additionally, plenty of academic papers, presentations, and posters are written with LaTeX. I would rather see people posting such material to the web (in PDF), rather than the alternative of not posting it, or spending time fighting to convert things to HTML and having it look awkward.

      --
      "Knowledge is the only instrument of production that is not subject to diminishing returns" -Journal of Political Econom
    4. Re:Overuse of PDF by SL1200MKII · · Score: 1

      I'm definitely with you on this one. My biggest gripe is when people send us scaled engineering drawings in PDFs that are formated for 8.5 x 11! How on earth do you expect us to give you accurate to scale estimates when you have just taken an ANSI E or (insert other page size here), CAD drawing and shrank it down to letter size? And of course not be able to tell me what the original paper size was when I ask you! There is an option to specify the appropriate paper size when you create a PDF! Why go through all the trouble of converting a perfectly good dxf or drw file into a pdf? IP concerns?.... well that's why we both signed NDAs. Besides, just because its in pdf format, doesn't mean I can't modify it.

    5. Re:Overuse of PDF by innocent_white_lamb · · Score: 1

      The only reason to ever use PDF is if it is NECESSARY for your audience to print the document in question.
       
      I read a lot of e-books, many of which begin life as either a text file or a html file.
       
      I use OpenOffice and cups-pdf to create a PDF file from those, and read them with acroread.
       
      It's very convenient, much more "book-like" than simply reading the original text file. And acroread remembers the page you left off at and opens back up at that page (if you set the default options to do so, that is.)
       
      Now that I've gotten used to it, I find that I like e-books better than p-books. I can set the type size that I prefer, and the computer holds the book for me so all I have to do is sit back and read.

      --
      If you're a zombie and you know it, bite your friend!
  23. Articles as Ads by prgrmr · · Score: 1

    There should be a disclaimer on these sort of product-placement articles. Oh wait, there is, it was posted by timothy.

  24. Offices are still stuck in the paper world by Alwin+Henseler · · Score: 1

    I'm no fan of the PDF format, but it has a place in this world because a) it serves a specific purpose, b) it works reasonably well for that purpose, and c) there isn't any popular format out there to take its place.

    Compared with other popular formats, the defining feature of PDF is that it's designed to be turned into sheets of dead tree at some point. Separate pages, with fixed vertical and horizontal size. PDF is very useful for that purpose, but it's often used in places where it makes no sense.

    I come accross PDF's mostly as technical documentation like datasheets (for electronic components). Mostly these are scanned pages (dead tree original), linked together as a single PDF file. I use those PDF's only for viewing on a computer, they don't ever make it back to paper. For this use, I would much rather have plain HTML, with illustrating pictures and so on packed in a single file. This would take much less space (text-based vs. scanned images), load up faster (browser!) and allow for easier navigation, searching, and editing. But you know what? Clicking on a .pdf is more convenient than unzipping a directory filled with with HTML, and opening an index file in there (for the user). And scanning 20 pages, linking them into a .pdf file is easier than doing a full conversion to text, and create decently formatted HTML (for the producer). Therefore PDF usually wins, even though there's more efficient ways to bring the info from A to B.

    For above application, the reason for PDF's popularity stems from the form of the original (dead tree), and that users are expected to turn the documents back into that format. Why use online viewing all over your office, when you can *wastefully* turn things back into paper and drag around briefcases filled with the stuff?

    From what I've seen, the average office still isn't used to going all electronic when it comes to documentation. When you follow a course, you don't get an USB stick stuffed with HTML to crawl through (or pointer to internal company webpage). You get a pile of A4 sheets.

    For stuff that I create myself, I prefer HTML, or in general: the simplest format that will bring the info from A to B and is easy for online viewing. How you can turn it into A4 sheets is of secondary importance. But until a true '21st century' paperless office becomes the norm, PDF will have its place.

    1. Re:Offices are still stuck in the paper world by Duradin · · Score: 1

      The problem with any sort of OCR is it will introduce errors.

      For your example of a 20 page document, it could be feasible to manually proofread the OCR text.

      For a large document, especially one with a poor quality source, unless it's something frightfully important it is not worth the effort to manually proof the OCR and then redo all the layout and formatting to bring it to a different media format (i.e. dead tree -> html). As long as the scan is of sufficient quality to leave anything questionable human decipherable it'll do, the more original information retained, the better. An OCR produced text loses a lot of information.

      As for the paperless office, it won't happen until you have as much screen space as you have desk space. It's far more convenient to have a ton of reference materials in dead tree format laid out on your desk than it is to have the same number of windows open on your crappy econoline standard business monitor.

    2. Re:Offices are still stuck in the paper world by Grishnakh · · Score: 1

      PDF is basically a newer version of Postscript, and it's quite efficient. For datasheets that are scanned pages, there's really no good solution there; either you have to save them as an image format, or PDF (which internally stores them as an image format). But for new documents, PDF works quite well, since it is text-based.

      HTML really sucks, IMO. If you're trying to make something that looks like a printed page, with images and such, you're better off with PDF. HTML can look totally different based on how your browser decides to render it, since text size can vary dramatically, and browsers are not totally consistent in rendering. Hit Ctrl-+ in Firefox a bunch of times and see if the webpage you're viewing doesn't look screwed up. With PDF, everything is fixed. HTML sounds good in theory, because you're not limited to a specific page size or aspect ratio, but in practice it really doesn't work that well. That's why Flash is so popular with many web developers who want to do fancy things. If you're trying to put technical data in a page-like format where everything is located in a specific place, and it looks the same regardless of which software you use to view it, there's simply not much that beats PDF.

      While your dream of a "paperless office" (which people have been predicting for decades, just like flying cars, and still isn't any closer to becoming reality) might obviate PDF, its replacement is certainly NOT going to be HTML. It's simply too lacking.

  25. non-FOSS feature proposal by Dystopian+Rebel · · Score: 3, Funny

    Yet another case in which a "fuck off" key would be a useful addition to the Windows keyboard.

    Although I usually decry any MS Windows-only feature proposal for not supporting Linux, I feel it is appropriate in this case.

    --
    Rich And Stupid is not so bad as Working For Rich And Stupid.
    1. Re:non-FOSS feature proposal by pzs · · Score: 1

      Other use cases where a "fuck off" key would be useful:

      - You are trying to download a file: cancel/allow (defaults to allow)

      - Millions of overlapping windows and popups (defaults to return to desktop)

      - This application has shat itself. Would you like to file a bug report (that will probably crash as well.) (Defaults to "no thanks")

      and of course the number 1 case:

      - You seem to be trying to type a letter, would you like some help with that? (defaults to hunting down the clippy developer and stabbing them with a rusty spoon)

      (apologies if my phrasing is wrong - I hardly use Windows these days)

    2. Re:non-FOSS feature proposal by The+Cisco+Kid · · Score: 1

      Since a keyboard is a piece of hardware, and 'Windows' is a piece of sh.. ahem.. software, I don't think there should be any relationship at all.

      If Windows needs a 'fuck off' function, it would best be implemented in software. Of course the simplest way is just deleting it in its entirety, of course, and I'd rather not have remnants of it left in hardware.

  26. Firefox should come with a minimal PDF reader by Animats · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Firefox should ship with some minimal PDF reader instead of Adobe's. There's an incredible amount of junk in Adobe's PDF reader, which adds both vulnerabilities and load time. Has anyone ever used the WebBuy feature of Adobe PDF Reader?

    1. Re:Firefox should come with a minimal PDF reader by tinkerton · · Score: 3, Informative

      Not disagreeing here but you might like to know there is a common habit of disabling the loading of all the plugins in adobe. I forget how it is best done, but a cheap trick is renaming the plugin directory.

    2. Re:Firefox should come with a minimal PDF reader by Minwee · · Score: 2, Funny

      C:\> del /f C:\Program Files\Adobe is probably the command you were thinking of.

      If it wasn't then I heartily endorse it as an alternative.

    3. Re:Firefox should come with a minimal PDF reader by Locklin · · Score: 1

      It would be nice to see someone use Poppler to create a fast loading plugin or firefox extension to view pdf files in the browser. I find that's one of the nicest features of Konqueror.

      --
      "Knowledge is the only instrument of production that is not subject to diminishing returns" -Journal of Political Econom
    4. Re:Firefox should come with a minimal PDF reader by innocent_white_lamb · · Score: 1

      cd /opt/Adobe/Reader8/Reader/intellinux
      mv plug_ins plug_ins.disabled

      --
      If you're a zombie and you know it, bite your friend!
  27. Post accompanied by ad for Acrobat by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Could this be a feature?

  28. CutePDF by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Its freeware. Does same thing.

  29. The format? by The+Cisco+Kid · · Score: 1

    I suspect, that its not the PDF format itself that has 'vulnerabilities' but it is in fact a certain well-known software the *reads* PDF format. And possibly only when running on a certain well-known software platform that is itself not famous for its lack of vulnerabilities.

    Of course, the vast majority of PHB's and Joe Sixpacks don't have the capacity or inclination to understand those distinctions, so TFA didn't bother to make it.

  30. Infected PDF symptoms by British · · Score: 3, Funny

    1. Has a tendency to make your browser freeze up
    2. Tries to infect some sort of TSR in Windows called Acrord32
    3. Will frequently pop up a "checking for updates" dialog
    4. Makes the fastest of computers slow to a crawl.
    5. a super-jumpy scrolling interface

    No wait, those aren't malware symptoms, that's just in Adobe's product. Next week we will discuss the incredible annoyances of the "java runtime environment" daily annoyances & clog-ups in "Add/Remove Programs". Do ANY software vendors know how annoying their software can be at times? Even Apple is guilty of forcing add-on installs you have no choice to get out of.

  31. Really easy to fix this one by Sloppy · · Score: 1

    PDF displayers are a great example of the kind of application that should be trivially sandboxable. The process needs access to hardly anything; no network access needed, no filesystem access is even needed (just pipe the data in).

    It should run as nobody.

    --
    As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
    1. Re:Really easy to fix this one by Overzeetop · · Score: 1

      You've never had to (legitimately) get into an verified PDF, I presume. ProtectedPDF is a company which make a living on keeping honest users from accessing their content. Luckly, once you've activated, there are ways to convert the data to a more useful format.

      --
      Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
  32. The link is in pdf format... by hesaigo999ca · · Score: 1

    Is the link in pdf format???

  33. .txt file exploits on the rise by David+Gerard · · Score: 1

    This title begs for a notnews. I just can't think of any ideas for it. Although WordPad for Windows 7 is probably vulnerable.

    --
    http://rocknerd.co.uk
    1. Re:.txt file exploits on the rise by Shados · · Score: 1

      Meh, im sure a text file in Unicode or another more archaic encoding could screw up Internet Explorer or some word processor or another. I mean, databases have had encoding based attacks for SQL strings (not the same as SQL injection attacks), so why not text processors =P Especially if that have some inner scripting support. That would be amusing. Fear the txt of doom!

  34. So can Mac Firefox by Mwahaha · · Score: 2, Informative

    Mac Firefox users can get a similar lightweight pdf plugin that uses the same libraries with this plugin.

  35. Plug-in not found... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Adobe PDF plugin was removed sometime ago permanently due to machine crashs it provoked.

    Acrobat reader also removed.

  36. PDF has been problematic for a long time. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    PDF vulnerability has been known for about 10 years.
    I had a long chat with Jim King, chief scientist
    at Adobe, back at Seybold 99. Even back then it
    was easy to write PDF files to delete things off the
    local disk or create and execute programs on the local system.
    Mac, PC, Solaris all vulnerable
    and have been for a long, long time.

    PDF is a target rich environment. I will be sad to
    see it go the way of USENET and reliable email.

    One of the reasons XPS is designed with no
    execution environment is because it is well known
    that PDF is a nightmare. XPS has its own series of problems.
    Does anybody need to know how to
    use XPS as an attack vector?

    Keath de TT: I told you so!

  37. parent is interesting by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    +1

  38. Re:Not to worry. No... DO WORRY! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "Anyway, I doubt the alternative PDF readers suffer from the security issues present in Acrobat Reader. -GayGirlie" - by Anonymous Coward on Tuesday September 23, @11:53AM (#25121643)

    Don't be too sure...

    ( ... &, this is just 1 single example thereof, since I saw it mentioned here on this site about this topic, as to Adobe Acrobat Reader replacements/alternate programs)

    FOXIT PDF READER 2.x SERIES:

    http://secunia.com/advisories/product/12995/

    Affected By 2 Secunia advisories, 3 Vulnerabilities

    You might want to check your EVINCE program @ SECUNIA.COM as well, just to be sure.

    APK

    P.S.=> You may find SECUNIA.COM useful in researching any applications you might be using, for this kind of information... &, for choosing the alternates you intend to try out on your machines as well, for this very application's (Adobe Acrobat Reader) replacement (FoxIT is just one I saw suggested here, & I was aware of it having security vulnerabilities, & that's why I used it to illustrate my point here)... apk

  39. Exactly The Kind of Analysis We DON'T Need by Alexander · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I'm sorry, but in that very brief article linked, I saw absolutely ZERO analysis concerning frequency.

    YAY! There's an exploit and toolkit. The existence of which is, in some sense, a useful piece of prior information for establishing the probability that there MIGHT BE an increase in frequency in the future - but it's quite a leap to have a freakin' /. link to a corporate article that uses hyperbole in claiming that there is some State of Nature or State of Knowledge that points to .pdf attacks being "On the rise".

    --
    "oohhh... I didn't know Schopenhauer was a philosopher!" ..."uhhh yeah, he's the one that begins with
  40. scan + OCR = searchable image by davidwr · · Score: 1

    The solution to the imperfect scan is to scan the image and present that to the reader, but OCR it and use that as the basis for searching. Sure, the search results will be imperfect but they'll be useful.

    Google Books is essentially this.

    --
    Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
  41. Recommendations by zoward · · Score: 1

    Since Adobe Reader has such a bad rep, can anyone recommend a good free alternative for my windows box at work?

    --
    "Can't you see that everyone is buying station wagons?"
    1. Re:Recommendations by Big+Nothing · · Score: 1

      "Since Adobe Reader has such a bad rep, can anyone recommend a good free alternative for my windows box at work?"

      Yes. Ubuntu Linux is a great alternative to Windows.

      Oh, you meant an alternative to Adobe Reader?

      My personal favorite is pdf995, but it's not open and might be too much for you (if you just want to VIEW pdfs). If you want a JUST VIEWER (or if openness is important to you) you should probably go with xpdf. It's simple and fast although not the flashiest piece of software out there.

      --
      SIG: TAKE OFF EVERY 'CAPTAIN'!!
    2. Re:Recommendations by Cato · · Score: 1

      For Windows, try Foxit Reader, it's very lightweight and generally works fine. For Linux, try Evince, it's also very lightweight.

  42. Know how to read? by Mathinker · · Score: 1

    From the link you reference:

    Unpatched 0% (0 of 1 Secunia advisories)

    Most Critical Unpatched

    There are no unpatched Secunia advisories affecting this product, when all vendor patches are applied..

    That vulnerability is from 2006, it was patched long ago.

    1. Re:Know how to read? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      That is just known security vulnerabilities. Since the program you note has had them before, what makes you think that it will not turn up different and as yet unknown security vulnerabilities in the future?

  43. FUDdy duddy? by Mathinker · · Score: 1

    From the link:

    Unpatched 0% (0 of 2 Secunia advisories)

    Most Critical Unpatched

    There are no unpatched Secunia advisories affecting this product, when all vendor patches are applied..

    Adobe Reader v.8, OTOH, still has an unpatched vulnerablity --- but v.9 is clean, as far as Secunia is concerned. The statistics for total vulnerabilities:

    Adobe Reader v.7 = 22 vulnerabilities (all patched)
    Adobe Reader v.8 = 12 vulnerabilities (all patched but 1)
    Adobe Reader v.9 = 0 vulnerabilities
    Evince = 1 vulnerability (patched)
    Foxit = 3 vulnerabilities (all patched)

    Note that Secunia does not recommend blindly comparing statistics in this way, and they're right.

  44. Is PDF the Issue or Acrobat/Acroread? by ab · · Score: 1

    We provide xpdf and (Sun's build of) gpdf on our Solaris machines here. On the SPARCs we (and Sun) also provide Acroread and the plugin. I'm more worried about problems in the plugin since that's more likely to get weird stuff loaded. I was about to update it on the SPARCs anyway.

    Of course Adobe still refuses to provide acroread for x86 Solaris. Though they do on the SPARC and I am about 100% sure the same source code would work there as well (everything else does...). In fact, why would it be different from any other UNIX/X11 version?

    So why can't we get it? Because they refuse to provide it, not on any technical grounds, but just because. They just won't do it because... because they're jerks? I guess. So if the security problem's in their implementation, I'll just remove it from the SPARCs and make all our Solaris machines the same.

  45. PDF files by Hognoxious · · Score: 1

    PDF Files? Are the editors of this webroom a bunch of kiddy fiddlers?

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  46. Wow, I'm shivering in FUD! by Mathinker · · Score: 1

    Duh, all software use has risks. This whole sub-thread is a discussion about the relative benefits, including risks of future vulnerabilities, of various PDF display programs.

    Adobe Reader, in terms of the number of known vulnerabilities, doesn't give a very good impression. The last 3 versions, versions 7-9, have had a total of 34 vulnerabilities. Unfortunately, it is practically impossible to quantitatively compare this with the 1 vulnerability found in Evince, since:

    • The severity of the vulnerabilities is not taken into consideration.
    • The periods of time involved may be different.
    • There is more incentive for blackhats to find vulnerabilities in Adobe Reader, since it has a much greater market share and is used under Windows.