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Steve Fossett's Unfinished Project

MazzThePianoman writes "Steve Fossett left behind a secret vessel project called the Deep Flight Challenger. Fossett was funding the development of a winged submersible being designed by Hawkes Ocean Technologies in California. The intent was for the vehicle to be capable of travel to the very bottom of the ocean — the Mariana Trench, more than 11,000 meters beneath the surface. 'It would have dramatically, dramatically opened the oceans for exploration. It would have been a game changer,' said Graham Hawkes, the designer. Testing had been completed at Department of Defense facilities. Field testing was only four weeks away when Fossett's untimely death, a year ago, put the project on hold." Hawkes Ocean Technologies owns the design, but the vehicle itself is owned by Fossett's estate.

26 of 97 comments (clear)

  1. And the story continues! by TheModelEskimo · · Score: 5, Funny

    "Take Fossett off the grid immediately," he ordered. "We need to wrap this up with a minimum of red tape." The response was quick. Within a week, Fossett's "corpse" was found in the Nevada Desert, the naked visitors from Titan had their submarine, and the President had yet another embarrassing affair off his plate.
    It was still Fossett's move, however. Much as he enjoyed false identities, Brazilian women, and homes built from Cold War nuclear bunkers, the time was right to begin his next project.
    It would begin with a small dog, two pairs of socks, and a rolled-up copy of People magazine.

    1. Re:And the story continues! by TheModelEskimo · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Dude, if anybody mods me interesting, ALL the blame is going in your lap.

    2. Re:And the story continues! by flyingsquid · · Score: 5, Insightful
      It's hard to know what to think about Fossett.

      I mean, the dude flew around the world in a balloon. Flew around the world again, nonstop, solo, in an aircraft. Set all kinds of records in sailboats and sailplanes. He was building a submarine to "fly" to the deepest point on earth, but meanwhile he killed himself while scouting for a location to run his 800 mph rocket car and break the land speed record.

      My first thought was, "man, this guy has a freakin' deathwish, or else he's a goddamn idiot. It's amazing that someone with so little sense of self-preservation lived this long." Doesn't the guy know that there are old pilots, and bold pilots, but there are no old, bold pilots?

      But after thinking about it for a while... he probably did know that. He was flying long enough that he must have come to understand that if he kept it up the way he did, he wasn't going to die in his bed. Any one of his record-setting endeavors could have resulted in his death. But he must have decided that he'd rather live a brief life on his own terms, than a long, safe, boring life. After reading his Wikipedia entry, it's no surprise that he didn't die in an assisted living facility, but I think he'd probably be OK with the way he went out. Vicious downdrafts smashed his plane into bite-sized pieces against a granite escarpment of the Sierra Nevada mountains, while he was scouting a location to break the land speed record in a jet car, and he wasn't found for a year... the man had a hell of an interesting life, and one hell of a death, and packed more living into 63 years than most people could pack into 100. He did things on his terms, took chances, pushed things, and went out doing so. Personally, I'll play things a bit safer, but I do respect the guy's choices.

    3. Re:And the story continues! by justinlee37 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Are astronauts really bold? Or are they meticulous, training for years for a single flight?

      The point is that it's not good to rush, you might overlook details.

    4. Re:And the story continues! by jalefkowit · · Score: 2, Informative

      Doesn't the guy know that there are old pilots, and bold pilots, but there are no old, bold pilots?

      I dunno, Chuck Yeager is pretty bold and he's pushing 90. Scott Crossfield was 85 when he died (flying).

    5. Re:And the story continues! by LWATCDR · · Score: 2

      You hate that saying because it is miss quoted.
      There are old pilots and there are bold pilots but there are very few old bold pilots.
      Every pilot knows that the wost thing that a pilot can say is "I can make it"
      But Fossett did keep the unspoken rule. Only kill yourself. If you are going push the limits you do it by yourself. My guess when flying with passengers Fossett crossed every T and doted every I.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
  2. What's that pressure again? by NormalVisual · · Score: 3, Insightful

    "The pressure is about 20,000 pounds per square inch, approximately 15,000 times the atmospheric pressure," Hawkes said.

    I hope Mr. Hawkes was a bit more careful with the math in his design than the math in that statement.

    --
    Please stand clear of the doors, por favor mantenganse alejado de las puertas
    1. Re:What's that pressure again? by tygt · · Score: 2, Informative

      Seat-of-the-pants.... 32' of water is about 1atm = 14.7psi, so 36k ft = about 1,125atm, on the order of 16.5kpsi, plus or minus. 20,000psi is in the ballpark, and that's "approximately" 1,500 atm; perhaps the reporter added a zero?

    2. Re:What's that pressure again? by Nutria · · Score: 4, Informative

      Or the reporter misquoted him...

      1 Atmosphere = 14.7 psi.
      Pressure increases 1A every 33 feet
      36,000 / 33 = 1091 Atmospheres.
      1091 * 14.7 = 16038 psi

      16,000 ~= 15000

      http://www.onr.navy.mil/Focus/ocean/water/pressure1.htm

      --
      "I don't know, therefore Aliens" Wafflebox1
    3. Re:What's that pressure again? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      you americans and your funny buggers math... every 10M of water adds 1 atmosphere of pressure. 10m = 2 atm, 20m = 3atm, 11000m = ~1101atm. why would you opt to use such "lovely round numbers" as 32 and 14.7, when you can use metric. IT'S SUPERIOR, BITCHES!

    4. Re:What's that pressure again? by rrohbeck · · Score: 2, Informative

      1 atm per 10 meters. 11km => 1,100 atm.
      1,082 atm to be a little more exact.

    5. Re:What's that pressure again? by EaglemanBSA · · Score: 2, Funny

      Next time you're watching a rugby match, let me know how many pounds are in a stone again.

      --
      Quiz: True or False -- On a scale of 1 to 10, what is your middle name?
    6. Re:What's that pressure again? by the+eric+conspiracy · · Score: 3, Informative

      I call bullshit. The metric unit for pressure isn't the atmosphere. It's the Pascal, aka N/m^2. Atmospheric pressure is 101325 Pa, or alternatively 1 Pa = 9.8692×106 atm. Very convenient? NOT PARTICULARLY.

      SI is useful in calculations because it is self-consistent. You don't have weird factors like 32.2 lb-f/lb-m in calculations. But natural values like the atmospheric pressure at sea level are NOT metric values and are at exactly as difficult to work with in both systems.

    7. Re:What's that pressure again? by the+eric+conspiracy · · Score: 3, Informative

      Yar. I can count to 21 if I pull down my pants.

      Seriously, base 12 is very practical because it has more factors than 10. 2,3,4, and 6 vs 2 and 5. We really should be using a base 12 decimal system rather base 10.

      The Sumerians used a base 60 system which can be represented using two hands while counting. On your left hand there are three parts on each of four fingers (excluding the thumb). The parts are divided from each other by the joints in the fingers. Now one can count up to 60 by pointing at one of the twelve parts of the fingers of the left hand with one of the five fingers of the right hand.

      This is the root of our 60 seconds per minute / 60 seconds per hour.

    8. Re:What's that pressure again? by Teun · · Score: 5, Informative
      I'm afraid you're mixing up two Decimal systems, the older Metric and the newer SI system.

      Bar, Kg/cm2 and Atmosphere are certainly valid expressions for pressure in the Metric systems.
      Another Decimal system is the SI and it prefers the use of Pascal for pressure.

      A more complete explanation can be found here:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SI

      --
      "The likes of Facebook and WhatsApp are free to those whose privacy is of zero value."
  3. The Delta Flier by jflo · · Score: 3, Funny

    If Star Trek Voyager has taught us anything, when you need to go deep into the ocean, just send the bad boy Tom Paris with trusty sidkick Ensin Kim in the Delta Flier. Thats more than enough to get hte job done. The only downside is that Lt Paris may make everyone listen to some drawn out letter hes writing to his father.... and quite frankly, its too dramatic for my tastes.

    --
    WWPD - What Would Picard Do?
    1. Re:The Delta Flier by MobileTatsu-NJG · · Score: 5, Funny

      If Star Trek Voyager has taught us anything, when you need to go deep into the ocean, just send the bad boy Tom Paris with trusty sidkick Ensin Kim in the Delta Flier. Thats more than enough to get hte job done. The only downside is that Lt Paris may make everyone listen to some drawn out letter hes writing to his father.... and quite frankly, its too dramatic for my tastes.
      --
      WWPD - What Would Picard Do?

      Man... you really buried the needle on my virgin meter with that one.

      --

      "I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)

    2. Re:The Delta Flier by NeuroManson · · Score: 2, Funny

      Crow T Robot, "People have such cute names for sex."

      There, that should have made it overload and melt down. I hope you didn't have it on your lap.

      --
      Just because you can mod me down, doesn't mean you're right. Shoes for industry!
    3. Re:The Delta Flier by jo7hs2 · · Score: 3, Funny

      If Star Trek Voyager has taught us anything, when you need to go deep into the ocean, just send the bad boy Tom Paris with trusty sidkick Ensin Kim in the Delta Flier. Thats more than enough to get hte job done. The only downside is that Lt Paris may make everyone listen to some drawn out letter hes writing to his father.... and quite frankly, its too dramatic for my tastes.

      -- WWPD - What Would Picard Do?

      Man... you really buried the needle on my virgin meter with that one.

      Well, at least the needle isn't a virgin anymore.

  4. Eulogy for Deep Space "Challenger" by sssmashy · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Oh, I have slipped the surly bonds of land, And danced the seas on laughter-silvered fins;

    Deepward I've fallen, and joined the tumbling mirth

    Of sun-absent fathoms...and done a hundred things

    You have not dreamed of...propelled and plummet and swung

    Deep in the sunless silence. Hov'ring there, I've chased the shouting currents along, and flung

    My eager craft through footless halls of water.

    Down, Down, the long, delirious burning blue I've bottomed the current swept depths with easy grace

    Where never jellyfish, nor even tubeworm grew.

    And while with silent, buoyant mind I've trod

    The low untrespassed sanctity of the abyss...

    ...put out my hand, and touched the face of God.

  5. How about Jupiter by linzeal · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Come on fellow Mechanical Engineers, what do we need to see the core of Jupiter? Lets design it and open source it, because it will likely not be seen in our lifetimes.

    1. Re:How about Jupiter by zippthorne · · Score: 2, Funny

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jupiter_(novel)

      Mediocre idea: 100% liquid "atmosphere." Good from a structural point of view, but terrible from a biological point of view, since you're pretty much guaranteed to breath everyone's pee.

      On the whole, not nearly as good as Mars.

      --
      Can you be Even More Awesome?!
  6. Fossett's Real Unfinished Project... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    Landing a plane safely.

  7. Color me skeptical... by DerekLyons · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Color me skeptical... Quoting from the summary;
     

    The intent was for the vehicle to be capable of travel to the very bottom of the ocean -- the Mariana Trench, more than 11,000 meters beneath the surface.

    The vehicle, as shown, wouldn't seem to be capable of more than a fraction of that - the pressure hull seems far, far too thin.
     
     

    It would have dramatically, dramatically opened the oceans for exploration. It would have been a game changer

    Um - how exactly? Globally we have plenty of capability to reach all but the deepest portion of the oceans, and beyond archeology, a little geology, and exploring a few famous wrecks... There hasn't been all that much demand.
     
    Quoting from the article:
     
     

    "In 1960, the U.S. Navy sent a bathyscaphe, the 'Trieste,' down to the bottom," said Karen Hawkes, Graham's wife. "That was essentially a big underwater balloon. No one has been back since. No one has a submersible capable of diving to 36,000 feet - except this one."

    Mostly because there isn't any real value in visiting the truly deep ocean - the view is not really all that impressive. Imagine being in a dry side canyon of the Grand Canyon on a cloudy night... with only a glo-stick for illumination. That's what it is like being down in the truly deep.
     
     

    "This is an ocean planet," Hawkes said. "The U.S. declared a 200-mile exclusive economic zone, which actually doubled the sovereign territory of the nation. It's like there's suddenly a whole continent full of unexplored territory, and it's ready for a Lewis and Clark expedition."

    I don't know where he's been... But the ocean bottoms have been in the process of intense exploration and mapping for several decades now.

  8. Re:Color me skeptical... - or a luddite by jfb2252 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    In deep water submersibles the occupied portion is a sphere to best resist pressure. The rest of the craft is filled with water at ambient pressure. The drawing in the article shows this one to follow that pattern. Your first comment is refuted.

    The Trieste was a tethered bathyscape. It went down on a cable and back up again. No ability to survey an area. I'd like to survey deep trenches as possible nuclear waste sites. Put the stuff in wedge shapped containers and drop it into deep muck at the bottom of such trenches. If it's 20m down in muck under 7-11 km of water it's going to be easier to produce new nuclear material than to retrieve

    An untethered deep submersible with ability to survey an area could find many useful things on the sea floor. Like how to harvest methane:
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/exclusive-the-methane-time-bomb-938932.html

    The land area of the Earth has been the subject of intense exploration for millenia yet we're still learning about it. Satellites, a 50 year old vehicle for exploration, have helped immensely. Why do you think a new undersea vehicle will not have a similar effect on ocean exploration?

  9. Re:Color me skeptical... - or a luddite by JerryP · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If you spend a couple of seconds to check the wikipedia entry, you'll find that the Triest was not tethered unlike earlier vessels. The principle used was the same that makes a balloon fly - fill a container with something that is lighter than the surrounding medium to produce lift. The balloon uses hot air or helium, the Trieste used gasoline.

    While I find the idea of exploring the abyssal regions of the oceans intriguing, I tend to agree with the GP poster in his opinion that the vessel pictured in TFA would not be capable of going there. The Trieste used a sphere with walls made of 5 inches of steel - somehow the bubble cockpit in the picture in the article does not seem like it has an equivalent structural strength.

    Oh, btw - did anyone notice that Trieste's inventor was name Piccard? And that his grandson was part of the team that traveled around the world non-stop in a balloon? To boldly go where no man has gone before, indeed :-)