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Apple Disables Egyptian iPhones' GPS

Posted by timothy on from the just-extrapolate-a-bit dept.

floydman writes "Apparently the Egyptian government is paranoid about its community using GPS devices, to the degree that it demanded Apple remove any GPS functionality from its iPhone 3G. They claim that 'GPS functionality should be limited to military purposes.' Egyptian blogger Ahmed Gabr brought this issue up in another article, and talks about how this does not make sense, since Google maps and the like can be used. I also happen to know for a fact that most of the modern cars in Egypt have built-in GPS systems."

23 of 278 comments (clear)

  1. Why do Egyptians need GPS anyway? by RemoWilliams84 · · Score: 5, Funny

    Can't they just look around and figure out which pyramids they are standing between and go from there?

    --
    "I don't have to think. I only have to do it. The results are always perfect, but that's old news." - Meat Puppets
    1. Re:Why do Egyptians need GPS anyway? by Keith_Beef · · Score: 5, Funny

      Pyramid based triangulation...? No, that will never catch on.

      K.

  2. Swell plan by Opportunist · · Score: 5, Interesting

    In a country that consists to a good deal of desert and other not too pleasant terrain where getting lost means dying it's a really, really good idea to disallow tools that allow you to find out where exactly you are.

    Is it me or is this already beyond stupid and paranoid? What "advantage" could a terrorist/communist/boogymanoftheweek gain from knowing where he is? I guess those people are

    a) knowledgeable enough of the area to know where they are.
    b) Usually not interested in blowing themselves sky high in the middle of nowhere and
    c) Not too picky of where they strike, as long as it causes enough people to get terrorized (hence their description).

    So I'm waiting for a really good explanation why a potentially life saving function should be turned of for "security" reasons. I know, "national security" means "whatever keeps the government in power" these days, but shouldn't we at least keep the pretence up that it's about keeping the people safe?

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    1. Re:Swell plan by Lumpy · · Score: 5, Funny

      grab your iphone.. fire up urban spoon...

      shake...

      Choices are sand, sand, sand...

      Hmmm.... I think we'll have sand today.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    2. Re:Swell plan by Opportunist · · Score: 4, Insightful

      True, but let's imagine you have a car, a tank full of gas and are lost in the middle of some desert. You have enough fuel to reach anything within 100 miles but what is within 100 miles? More important, is there anything within 100 miles (hopefully you were clever enough to only use up to half your tank's contents...)?

      But let's imagine your car broke down and you're in the middle of the desert. Let's also assume you were smart enough to bring along a sat phone for emergencies (like this one). What do you want to prefer to tell a potential rescue team? "I'm in the middle of the Sahara, try to find me" or "I'm at xxxx'N, xxxx'E, come pick me up"?

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    3. Re:Swell plan by Free+the+Cowards · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Because of course any terrorist who's planning to build a GPS guided missile to blow up a market will suddenly change his mind and start growing flowers and raising puppies when he discovers that GPS receivers are banned by the government.

      --
      If you mod me Overrated, you are admitting that you have no penis.
    4. Re:Swell plan by TheMeuge · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "Other than, say the ability to drop a UAV bomb on government buildings or open markets from hundreds of kilometers away ?"

      Please design and execute this plan, while delivering more destructive power than a suicide bomber with pockets full of hand grenades... or an RPG (for government buildings). Oh, and do that with the economics means and know-how of terrorists... and make sure no one knows about it.

      There is a reason why UAVs are JUST getting into the fray in modern warfare. They are not EASY to build or guide. And even the most advanced UAVs, have a fairly limited payload... and we're talking about large craft, that cost hundreds of millions to design.

      Finally, GPS is available to terrorists through a billion other sources. Apple's position here nothing more than a publicity stunt. Kind of reminds me of handgun bans.

    5. Re:Swell plan by genner · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Other than, say the ability to drop a UAV bomb on government buildings or open markets from hundreds of kilometers away ?

      Meh it's cheaper to have a true believer strap explosives to himself and guide himself there. When you have that kind if resource at your disposal why would you pay for iphones and predator drones.

    6. Re:Swell plan by Yvanhoe · · Score: 4, Insightful

      They don't fear terrorists, they fear rioters.

      GPS and GSM is the first thing countries like China cut off when a riot occur.

      --
      The Wise adapts himself to the world. The Fool adapts the world to himself. Therefore, all progress depends on the Fool.
    7. Re:Swell plan by mikael · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Maybe the simplest of looters could find the coordinates of valuable archeological digs. Before GPS and Google maps, they would have needed maps, survey equipment and access to the journals. Now they could just surf the web and find the coordinates from a research paper.

      --
      Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
    8. Re:Swell plan by ultranova · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Other than, say the ability to drop a UAV bomb on government buildings or open markets from hundreds of kilometers away ?

      Ah, that explains it then. Cruise missiles and other long-range delivery methods are easy and cheap to obtain, while a GPS navigator is the nigh-legendary top-secret techical marvel only rumoured to exist...

      GPS + terrorists = disaster.

      GPS + terrorists = terrorists who can locate themselves.

      Most countries do not have the capability of even detecting the thing in-flight (and with the bomb light enough, flying close to buildings the us does not have that capability either).

      Most countries don't have the capability of detecting bombs taped into the bottom of a random car, set up to go off during rush hour.

      An iphone 3g (or any gps device, but iphone 3g is sturdy, cheap and available) controlling a low flying bomb would be a terrorist's dream weapon.

      Yeah. And with a GPS-enabled phone, all they are lacking is the flying bomb.

      I truly hope you are trolling. Otherwise I'm starting to get a bit scared, and not of terrorists. Maybe we should start a war on stupidity next ?

      --

      Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.

    9. Re:Swell plan by Animaether · · Score: 4, Funny

      Preamble: English is not my native language

      "Let's also assume you were smart enough to bring along a sat phone for emergencies (like this one)"
      How can that be misinterpreted to read that he meant the iPhone was a satellite phone?

      Simple substitution:
      "Let's also assume you were smart enough to bring along a sat phone for emergencies (like the iPhone)"
      Ahhh, so the iPhone is an emergency! Err, wait.

      If he wanted things to read like the iPhone was a satellite phone, he'd write:
      "Let's also assume you were smart enough to bring along a sat phone (like the iPhone) for emergencies"

      However, if you unsubstitute that:
      "Let's also assume you were smart enough to bring along a sat phone (like this one) for emergencies"

      Then you'd have to scan around for what "like this one" would be referring to.. his post doesn't refer to any specific phone at all.. if this wasn't slashdot with its auto-domain-appendage bits, I would move my mouse over the "like this one" expecting to find it linking to a satellite phone.. I would not assume he meant the iPhone.

      Going back to the original line, however, "like this one" easily finds context in "your car broke down and you're in the middle of the desert."

      That's not to say the original phrasing can't be improved...
      "But let's imagine your car broke down and you're in the middle of the desert. Let's also assume you were smart enough to bring along a sat phone for such emergencies."

      But to think he meant the iPhone was an example of a satellite phone? hm.

    10. Re:Swell plan by the_womble · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Maybe we should start a war on stupidity next ?

      No point. We would not stand a chance.

    11. Re:Swell plan by Frosty+Piss · · Score: 5, Insightful

      True, but let's imagine you have a car, a tank full of gas and are lost in the middle of some desert....

      Full tank? Ask the guy at the station for directions.

      --
      If you want news from today, you have to come back tomorrow.
  3. Location, location, location... by nycguy · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Is this really about wanting to keep citizens from knowing where they are, or is it more about not wanting to have a programmable GPS-enabled device that could be used to detonate a bomb when it nears a specified location?

    If the above is the case, it's a pretty dumb approach, since a GPS-enabled iPhone could just be smuggled in. Either way, it would be interesting to know what the real motives behind this ban are.

    1. Re:Location, location, location... by Opportunist · · Score: 3, Interesting

      That sound like a more logic reason, but bluntly, it's not like building a GPS device is in any way rocket science or requires any kind of "monitored" hardware. Actually, the iPhone would be a rather poor choice for such a device, not only for its price. And it makes little sense to build such a bomb in the first place unless you plan to send it through FedEx or postal service.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    2. Re:Location, location, location... by chrb · · Score: 4, Informative

      There are other options. The comparison with car GPS is interesting - ok, they don't mind people navigating and mapping roads, since they are public anyway. But small GPS devices that look like mobile phones - could these be more of a security risk? It is possible to walk to many more locations than can be reached on the public highway. It is possible that they could be used as trigger devices, just like in the Madrid train bombings. Consider that the phones are used as timers, and that one of the standard protocols in use in security sensitive areas now is to jam RF and cell phone frequencies to block this kind of trigger. It's not a huge leap to realise that a GPS device could be similarly linked, and would provide an accurate non-blockable trigger for a vehicle based bomb.

      It sounds as though Egypt bans or disables all personal GPS devices. I guess it shouldn't be that much of a surprise that a government is concerned about the military implications - remember that the United States only turned off Selective Availability 8 years ago, and this was only after they developed new technology to actively jam GPS signals in targetted regions. And don't forget the political fallout after the EU decided to implement the Galileo M-code overlay inside the same frequency band as the US military GPS in order to ensure that there was no way to block one without blocking the other. GPS technology has traditionally been militarily and politically sensitive, but at the same time we are now seeing the rise of a new world where most human are going to have cell phones and GPS devices. This is inevitably going to cause some social conflict as societies adjust to the new reality.

  4. Re:Anonymous Coward by Hognoxious · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Since Egypt is a poor country, claiming that most new cars have gps is ludicrous.

    Non sequitur. There might be very few new cars, but most of that few might have GPS.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  5. Re:Anonymous Coward by OeLeWaPpErKe · · Score: 4, Interesting

    You should visit a few poor countries and note the amount of GPS devices there. I mean even in India there more than just commonplace.

    Even on many things you wouldn't consider "cars" you find gps devices these days.

  6. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 4, Informative

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  7. Re:Anonymous Coward by Hognoxious · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Motre or less. Plus it's not uncommon for poor countries to have a very uneven weath distribution (yes Zimbabwe, I'm looking at you). Top of the range Mercedes with all the extras for the ruling clique, and nobody else can afford a car at all.

    In that case 100% of new cars have GPS, climate control and gold-plated ashtrays.

    --
    Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
  8. Re:Anonymous Coward by Idiomatick · · Score: 5, Informative

    I'd like to illustrate your point with superbly beautiful moving graphs! It is TED so you must click it.

    http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/hans_rosling_shows_the_best_stats_you_ve_ever_seen.html

  9. Re:fr1st pst by lysergic.acid · · Score: 4, Funny

    their nefarious plot is most transparent. by banning GPS the Egyptian government clearly means to induce a perpetually lost state in the population. this in turn would emasculate the entire civilian male population by forcing them to ask the military for directions, in essence surrendering every shred of their manhood to the Egyptian government in the ultimate act of sexual submission. the government, meanwhile, would have their throbbing virility cemented by their exclusive control of GPS technology--their GPS antennas standing fully erect, thrusting skyward as a potent symbol of their dominance over their now gelded population.

    oh, such cruel tyranny. if only they'd gotten the G1 instead...