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100 Years Ago, No Free Broadband Pneumatic Tubes

TheSync writes "The Division of Labour blog spotlights a report written 100 years ago by a commission appointed by the Postmaster General, that came to the conclusion: 'That it is not feasible and desirable at the present time for the Government to purchase, to install, or to operate pneumatic tubes.' Here is a scan of the original NYTimes article. If only we had gotten the free government Intertubes in 1908!"

13 of 293 comments (clear)

  1. Snarky article by SatanicPuppy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The reason the government wasn't into buying the pneumatic tube system is because there was no real standard and no guarantee the system would be worth installing anywhere else. I can't see how anyone who researched it at the time would come to any conclusion but that the last thing the government needed was to be saddled with an expensive, hard to maintain, experimental system...Especially given that they already had the postal service.

    The modern situation is a bit different. Government owned local data infrastructure is actually a pretty good idea. Small towns who can't interest the big telecoms in investing have bought bonds and done it themselves with good results, and it really opens the door to local competition since the competition is based around providing actual service...not around providing infrastructure. The technology is also standardized, and much more mature.

    Telecoms are getting too uppity these days. Some kind of smackdown is required.

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    ad logicam Claiming a proposition is false because it was presented as the conclusion of a fallacious argument.
    1. Re:Snarky article by corsec67 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The last mile is going to be a monopoly, whether it be water, sewer, cable, electricity, phone, or fiber.
      You aren't going to have people running a cable to your house in case you might want to use it. If there is already a cable TV connection to a house, the value of adding a second one is very low.

      What shouldn't be a monopoly at all is the service provider. The last mile is going to be a monopoly, but the service provider doesn't have to be. Let any company hook up their DSL/phone equipment to the cable going to your house.

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    2. Re:Snarky article by SatanicPuppy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So the government owned water and sewer pipes that serve your house are a bad thing? You want to see multiple competing water and sewer companies building multiple competing water and sewage treatment systems, and multiple and competing reservoirs, etc? How about competing highway infrastructure? No?

      Or maybe you prefer the current system, where one company is granted a monopoly in exchange for shouldering the infrastructure cost?

      If we own the infrastructure, we can actually HAVE competition based on service. We sure as hell can't have it when the telecoms own all the pipe.

      Educate yourself.

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      ad logicam Claiming a proposition is false because it was presented as the conclusion of a fallacious argument.
    3. Re:Snarky article by thrillseeker · · Score: 4, Interesting

      then the last mile should belong to the homeowner.

    4. Re:Snarky article by TheSpoom · · Score: 4, Insightful

      IMHO, the last mile should belong to the municipality. That way, you avoid arguments as to who is responsible for issues that happen to cables outside anyone's ownership, or in communal ownership.

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      It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
      - E. Debs
    5. Re:Snarky article by ensignyu · · Score: 4, Informative

      Most people only own the land up to their driveway. From there on, it's usually owned by the city.

      That's why if the water pipes break (due to an earthquake or something) in the middle of the street, it's not your responsibility to fix it. You'd have a hard time dividing up the bill, in any case.

      And for obvious reasons, a company can't just dig up a road and install new pipes or cables. They need a permit, and the city doesn't want the road being dug up every other week so they grant exclusive rights for ONE group to do it once.

      Now arguably since it's public land, the network connections ought to be owned and controlled by the city and leased out to any ISP that wants to hook you up, but that's much different from the homeowner owning the last mile.

    6. Re:Snarky article by spun · · Score: 4, Informative

      The last mile is going to be a monopoly,

      Why? Just because you cannot think of a way?

      No, because the last mile is a natural monopoly.

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      - None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
    7. Re:Snarky article by north.coaster · · Score: 4, Informative

      We have similar laws for electricity and phone, so why not internet.

      Perhaps you need a history lesson. Rural areas of the United States originally got electric service through public cooperative organizations because the private utilities would not provide service in these areas. While laws were passed to provide government loans to these co-ops, private companies were not forced to provide service.

      Private utility companies later purchased many of these co-ops, but there are still co-ops providing electric service in many areas today.

  2. So... by pitchpipe · · Score: 4, Funny

    Ted Stevens was right, just 100 years late!

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    Look where all this talking got us, baby.
  3. Actually, Ted Stevens wasn't so wrong by StCredZero · · Score: 4, Interesting

    From Wikipedia:

    Technical analysis

    Stevens's speech was analyzed by Princeton computer science professor Edward Felten, who said that he disagreed with Stevens's argument but felt that the language "series of tubes" was entirely reasonable as a non-technical explanation given off-the-cuff in a meeting.[12]

    The term pipe is a commonly used idiom to refer to a data connection, with pipe diameter being analogous to bandwidth or throughput.[13] For instance, high-bandwidth connections are often referred to as "fat pipes."

    Most routers use a data structure called a queue to buffer packets.[14] When packets arrive more quickly than can be forwarded, the router will hold the packets in a queue until they can be sent on to the next router or be dropped.[15] On links that become congested, packets typically spend more time in the queue than they do actually moving down wires or optical fiber...

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Series_of_tubes

    I too disagree with Steven's argument. But people who jump on "tubes" often do not even know the concepts behind the analogy. In a lot of cases, the people that laugh at his comment are even less informed about the topic than Stevens.

    1. Re:Actually, Ted Stevens wasn't so wrong by Chris+Burke · · Score: 4, Insightful

      My main issue with the analogy is that, to the extent that the internet is like a series of tubes, how is it not like a truck? Data flow is not continuous, it's sent in discreet packets of variable sizes, it can take multiple routes to get to a destination, and every so often at a switching point there's a collision so the data never arrives and has to be resent. Honestly, I think roads and trucks is a much better analogy. Given that, I think it's safe to say that he still really had no idea what he was talking about, and the plausibility of one of his analogies is due to chance alone.

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      The enemies of Democracy are
  4. Re:WTF? by hey! · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I actually think that technology history is a very interesting topic.

    For example, in 1684 Robert Hooke presented a scheme to the Royal Society for setting up lines of towers to relay semaphore signals over long distances. This was an eminently practical suggestion. In fact the Royal Navy in the following century developed the capability of coordinating complex land and sea operations using semaphore. Still it wasn't until over a hundred years later that an attempt was made to make a practical land based network. By that time, the first practical demonstrations of electrical telegraphy had already taken place. Electrical telegraphy was both cheaper and nearly 8x as fast. Once electrical telegraphy was possible, semaphore was doomed.

    What's interesting about semaphore is that it is intrinsically low tech. It's most efficient with some kind of mechanical shutter system, but you can make do with a pair of flags. The Romans certainly had the engineering ability to connect their empire with a series of semaphore towers; the only thing wanting was the idea. You can imagine how history would have been different if it had occurred to them. At the very least, the slow and easily intercepted nature of semaphore might have lead to many computer science and cryptography ideas being discovered thousand of years earlier.

    A pneumatic tube system, on the other hand, is only possible for a civilization that has at least stem engine technology. Such systems were unlikely to scale beyond local service in any case. It's an interesting concept, but not nearly as potentially revolutionary as semaphore might have been.

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  5. Re:WTF? by fm6 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Why? Because pneumatic infosystems are "obviously" a silly idea? If you think that, you need to crack a book now and then. If you did, you'd know that pneumatic mail delivery was widely used in Europe from the late 19th century well into the 20th. (The Paris system didn't shut down until 1984!)

    They were also widely used in the U.S. for internal business mail and similar stuff. Many large department stores used pneumatic systems instead of cash registers. The clerk put your money and bill into a tube, where it got sent up to the bookkeeping department, which sent back a receipt and your change. That's more cost effective than totaling out dozens of registers at the end of the day, and also minimized the amount of cash in places where it could be ripped off. Back in the 70s, there were still a few stores that used this system; it took the rise of networked POS systems and credit cards to kill it completely.

    So the folks that wanted to build a national pneumatic system had some solid technology and experience to build on. Sure, they failed — but their failure is worth studying now that we're busy arguing about the best way to install a telecom infrastructure that's half as good as the ones in Asia.