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Energy Star Program Needs an Overhaul

Posted by kdawson on from the you-will-sleep-now-and-when-you-wake dept.

Martin Hellman writes "DeviceGuru.com ran my piece raising questions about the EPA's Energy Star program. For example, an Energy Star compliant TV that claims to draw 0.1 watts in sleep mode appears to do that — but only seems to sleep about 25% of the time that it is 'off.' The other 75% of the time it draws about 20 watts, for an effective sleep power draw from the user's perspective that is 150 times what the manufacturer claims. Based on the observations described, it is also questionable how many PC's really are sleeping when their screens are blank, even if the user has turned sleep mode on. Given the billions of dollars and tons of CO2 that are at stake, this situation demands more attention."

13 of 306 comments (clear)

  1. Phantom power has it's use. by LostCluster · · Score: 4, Interesting

    You do want your TV to respond to your remote control, download it's clock-setting and other background data, and be ready to boot up in a timely manner? Don't ya?

    We can reduce it, but this is something that ain't going to zero.

    1. Re:Phantom power has it's use. by LWATCDR · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Why the heck does a TV need to download the time or background data or Boot up?
      For the remote you could just have a very low power pic listen for the remote and turn the the set. user a super cap to run it and every few days if you don't use the TV have it power it's self up and charge the cap.

      --
      See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
    2. Re:Phantom power has it's use. by Lumpy · · Score: 5, Informative

      but it can be darn near zero.

      The energy to power a tiny pic and a IR reciever to initiate the power up sequence is less than 100mw This can EASILY be done. They choose not to because it's far easier and cheaper to do it with the main processor. or In most Cable boxes case, simply turn off the screen and led's The comcast cable box really does not turn off, it simply blanks the screen and turns off the led display. This is a pain in the arse for us integration companies as you cant detect power draw to detect if a low grade device is on or off. (high end devices have discreet on and off IR signals or RS232 control)

      The manufacturers want to save $2.95 per device made and refuse to have a discreet "on" response circuit that will allow the set or device to completely power down. but then most manufacturers are too cheap to properly design the hardware for remote control anyways. Not having discreet codes is simply shoddy workmanship.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    3. Re:Phantom power has it's use. by LostCluster · · Score: 4, Informative

      Comcast wants its boxes to stay connected to the network at all times... remember, they're still using coax while the rest of data delivery went to multiple twisted pairs. Coax networks become unstable if users are constantly logging on and off. Back in the "bad old days", universities had to keep computers powered even when the employee who normally sits at that desk isn't there because too many shutdowns would cause there to not be enough draw on the RF signal, and the network would start burning out faster than usual.

    4. Re:Phantom power has it's use. by slazzy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Even if the TV does need to have some background processing going on, there's no reason it can't have a timer to turn on once a week or whatever is needed.

      --
      Website Just Down For Me? Find out
    5. Re:Phantom power has it's use. by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So, unplug and replug your TV every time you want to watch it. I honestly don't care if my TV uses 20 Watts when it isn't turned on or not, that is a rather insignificant part of my electric bill for a major part of my (and most people's) life.

      At 15 cents per kWh, that's $26 per year. That's like having to buy a case of beer for your TV every six months.

      If it's technically feasible to have the TV *not* consume 20W, I'd prefer to keep the beer money for myself.

    6. Re:Phantom power has it's use. by KlomDark · · Score: 4, Insightful

      20 minutes? I'd say a whole weeks worth of listings data is no more than a megabyte. What's the bandwidth on an HDTV channel? Something immense I'm sure. Store the channel scan results in flash, no need to rescan each time. Download a meg of text, parse and store it, and you're up and running in two or three seconds.

      Are you FUDding for an energy company or something? Several hundred million devices suddenly using 200 times less power has got to be worrying the publicly traded energy companies.

    7. Re:Phantom power has it's use. by russotto · · Score: 4, Informative

      20 minutes? I'd say a whole weeks worth of listings data is no more than a megabyte. What's the bandwidth on an HDTV channel? Something immense I'm sure. Store the channel scan results in flash, no need to rescan each time. Download a meg of text, parse and store it, and you're up and running in two or three seconds.

      Not so easy, if you're using the ATSC EPG information. It's broadcast; you have to wait for the data to come around, you can't request it. And the data for each channel is available only on that channel. So to get the guide data, you have to scan to each channel sequentially and wait for the data on it; this can take a while. You can't do it while the TV is on (because your tuner is otherwise occupied). It takes significant power to run the tuner. Fortunately, you do only have to do this once every three hours.

    8. Re:Phantom power has it's use. by Detritus · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Two words. Passive termination. You don't need to leave the cable box on.

      --
      Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
  2. Re:How about fixing cable / sat DVR's and boxes by LostCluster · · Score: 4, Informative

    Cable/Sat DVR's don't know when they're going to get hit with a data download being addressed to them. They have to always be ready to take it, therefore always spinning. Besides that, it doesn't take that much power to keep the disc spinning, compared to frequent re-starts after stops.

  3. And What Part of This is News? by twmcneil · · Score: 5, Informative
    The Energy Star Program has needed an overhaul since the day of inception.

    From http://www.energystar.gov/ia/partners/product_specs/eligibility/tv_vcr_elig.pdf

    4) Test Methodology: Manufacturers are required to perform tests and self-certify those models that meet the ENERGY STAR guidelines.

    Self-Certify? You've got to be kidding.

    --
    "The ferrets, they're every where I tell you!"
    1. Re:And What Part of This is News? by LostCluster · · Score: 5, Informative

      This is just like the IRS... you're expected to report income and deductions and self-certify your filing. If the government thinks you got it wrong, or just picks you out of a hat, they audit. If they allege you cheated, you're on the defensive.

  4. Re:I'm getting a bit tired of this.... by db32 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Speaking of drinking the koolaid. Why is it that wackaloon right wingers always insist on using "MSM"? I know enough of them to know that they are talking about the main stream media like it is some vast liberal conspiracy...but seriously...it isn't clever...it is actually pretty stupid. But hey, you go ahead and call me when that "MSM" stops running advertisements 24/7 for some of the most evil right wing run megacorps around and then we can talk about how much of an evil liberal conspiracy it is.

    --
    The only change I can believe in is what I find in my couch cushions.