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Pandora Trying Out Invasive Commercial Breaks

Posted by kdawson on from the knew-it-had-to-be-coming dept.

Nathan Halverson writes "The popular online radio service Pandora.com has added brief commercial interruptions to its service. Pandora says this is a trial and is targeted to a subset of listeners at this point. In one case, a brief ad for the Fox TV show 'Lie To Me' interrupted the music stream for about 15 seconds after ten songs had initially played, and the same commercial interrupted 22 songs later. 'But [Pandora's] founder promised the site will never carry as many audio ads as broadcast radio, despite the fact it pays substantially higher royalty fees to the recording industry.'"

46 of 244 comments (clear)

  1. We need a spam filter for radio by captainpanic · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'd be willing to pay money for any program that filters out adds (without making too many mistakes).
    I've always wondered why this doesn't exist for TV.
    And I wondered what you should play during the adds... a random mp3 from your computer perhaps?

    Alternatively, you can also switch to another station :D

    1. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by Roland+Piquepaille · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'd be willing to pay money for any program that filters out adds (without making too many mistakes). I've always wondered why this doesn't exist for TV.

      Isn't that what TiVo is for?

    2. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by bytesex · · Score: 5, Interesting

      What I don't understand is why TVs don't yet have a function that not only mutes it, but also makes the screen almost dark. So that you can just spot when your program is back on.

      --
      Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
    3. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by xlotlu · · Score: 4, Informative

      I'd be willing to pay money for any program that filters out adds (without making too many mistakes). I've always wondered why this doesn't exist for TV.

      Sorry to disappoint you, but you don't need to pay for MythTV. From the features list:

      • Completely automatic commercial detection/skipping, with manual correction via an intuitive cutlist editor.
    4. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      My grandfather used to turn off the tv when the commercials came on, and we would sit there in awkward silence until he turned it back on. He became surprisingly good at turning it back on at the right time. We convinced him into something with a mute button in the early 90's

    5. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by daveime · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Yup, and for which you pay a hefty fee every year for, otherwise the detector vans come round and scan your ass (do they still have those, haven't been in Blighty for nigh on 8 years ?).

      It's a similar situation with the cable TV here. While they don't run "traditional" commercials as such, they still manage to interrupt the show every 15 minutes with pointless trailers for other shows which will be airing during the week.

      SO I don't think you EVER get a full 60 minutes of programming in each hour ... which is perhaps just as well, otherwise when would you run to the toilet, or make a cuppa ?

    6. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by xaxa · · Score: 2, Informative

      Yup, and for which you pay a hefty fee every year for, otherwise the detector vans come round and scan your ass (do they still have those, haven't been in Blighty for nigh on 8 years ?).

      £140 a year. The alternative seems to be that the money comes out of general taxation.

      It's a similar situation with the cable TV here. While they don't run "traditional" commercials as such, they still manage to interrupt the show every 15 minutes with pointless trailers for other shows which will be airing during the week.

      The BBC never interrupt a show. Any trailers are shown between programmes.

      SO I don't think you EVER get a full 60 minutes of programming in each hour.

      You get about 58 minutes though.
      08:00.00 trailer for a program
      08:01.00 screen saying what's on now/next on a few channels
      08:01.39 programme starts
      08:59.30 programme ends
      08:59.31 now/next again

    7. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by xelah · · Score: 3, Informative

      From what I've heard the detector vans were an urban myth. They do now us a database to work out who hasn't bought a license, and then knock on the door now and again to check up on you.

      I don't have a TV, so I know how TV licensing behave. Enforcement is mostly based on fear. If you aren't on the licence database they will write to you every three-ish months with one of a rotating set of letters. These say things like 'WARNING AGAINST UNLAWFUL ACTION', or look like fake bills, or tell you you've been added to their enforcement list and that 'Enforcement Officers' will visit in compliance with PACE (and, presumably, the Geneva conventions and the nuclear test ban treaty....). They give you a phone number they want you to ring to get yourself on a database of people declaring they have no TV. Then they write to you and say they're going to visit you anyway (and then don't) and start the letters again six months later. Meanwhile they're running (billboard) adverts saying things like 'last year we caught 157,000 licence dodgers' and 'seven people in Ebscombe Close don't have a licence'.

      In eight years I've met exactly one Enforcement Officer (they're private sector contractors with no special powers). Conversation with them go like this: Him: Do you have a television. You: No. Him: Can I come in? You: No. Him: That's all I need to know [goes away].

      It appears they only catch people by knocking on the door and hearing a television. They have no power of entry, and need some shred of evidence of a crime to get a warrant from a magistrate. Besides, I get the impression they can't be bothered and are quite keen on getting through their list ASAP.

      BTW, you need a licence for watching television services at or nearly at the same time as it's being broadcast. This applies to using computers for that, too. But you can watch them later with no licence at all. (I don't do either, ICYWW, if I wanted to watch TV I'd have a TV).

    8. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by shark72 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Rather than looking for a third party to pay for the service of filtering Pandora ads for you, why not just subscribe to Pandora? It's $36 a year. That's $3 a month. You can afford it.

      Sadly, the tone of many of the posts so far is that Pandora is now evil. That's really quite sad. They've been providing you a free service for years, while absorbing the cost of broadcast royalties.

      I've been a Pandora subscriber for a while. Not so I'd get anything out of it (but as a bonus, I'm not hearing the ads), but because I believe in what they do and because they've helped me find a lot of great music.

      --
      Sitting in my day care, the art is decopainted.
  2. Whatever, it's a great service by gravos · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I for one am understanding of their need to generate revenue to maintain the excellent service. Especially they go to some of the background or portable options they've hinted at before, audio ads may be the only way to do that. I heard the McDonald's ad and considered it far less intrusive than the types of ads I get on other "free" Internet radio services. If they can design all their ads like that--NPR style, so to speak--and not make them constant interruptions to them music (start up and/or change of station are good ideas), then I say go for it. If that helps keep Pandora free and improving, I'm all for it.

    --
    This game will waste your life. Don't clicky!
    1. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by captainpanic · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hmm... of course the station needs to get money from somewhere. I always thought that record companies pay stations to play their songs. Radio is the best add for a song (and music is a product that is advertised on radio). Why advertise anything else when radio is almost 100% advertisement? :D

      I immediately admit that I am not aware of the business model of radio in 2009 (both internet or the good ol' fashioned one with photons hitting your antenna).

      In the ideal case, the record company should be omitted. Bands who want to be known give their songs to a station which broadcasts it. Band becomes famous, and people pay for the concert. But then again, I also believe in Utopia :D

    2. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by digitig · · Score: 4, Informative

      Bands who want to be known give their songs to a station which broadcasts it. Band becomes famous, and people pay for the concert. But then again, I also believe in Utopia :D

      That model does actually exist out there on the net -- the billboard at http://www.themusicwellhome.co.uk/ for instance.

      --
      Quidnam Latine loqui modo coepi?
    3. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by davester666 · · Score: 5, Informative

      > Hmm... of course the station needs to get money from somewhere. I always thought that record companies pay stations to play their songs. Radio is the best add for a song (and music is a product that is advertised on radio). Why advertise anything else when radio is almost 100% advertisement? :D

      Um, it's kinda crazy, but this is known as "payola". It's not illegal for the labels to pay stations to play their songs, BUT the station has to disclose that they were paid to play the song.

      Evidently, kids (who are the primary consumers of music) tend to tune out things they know are ads. So, the record labels have gone to extraordinary lengths (and have been caught MULTIPLE times) to pay radio stations to play their music WITHOUT saying they were paid to play it (easiest way to know a radio station was paid to play a song, the DJ will say it's the most requested song).

      The labels are trying really hard to get radio stations to pay royalties, so they can get some of their payola money back...

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
    4. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by Nursie · · Score: 5, Insightful

      >Evidently, kids (who are the primary consumers of music) tend to tune out things they know are ads.

      Actually, I think pretty much all of us that have grown up with pervasive advertising have an internal trip switch these days. It's a sad fact, but the way to keep sane in the modern (urban) environment is to selectively ignore most of the world around you.

      Advertisers look for ever more invasive ways to get our attention, and then wonder why advertising has less and less effect. it's because we hate you and have learned to ignore you to the extent we don't even realise you're there half the time.

    5. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

      OK, I have to get this off my chest.

      1) It's AD, not ADD. FFS.

      2) RADIOS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY! That is to say, they don't use photons for any portion of their operation.

      This message brought to you by your local science and english teachers.

    6. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by captainpanic · · Score: 2, Informative

      Thanks for the correction. It's a silly mistake.

      Regarding point 2, the electromagnetic spectrum goes from Gamma rays, through X-rays, UV, visible light, IR, to radio waves. Those are all photons. And they're also all waves.

      It's just that we like to think of radio as waves, and X-ray and gamma as particles. In the end, all of them are both: both wave and particle.

    7. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by ShieldW0lf · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Actually, I think pretty much all of us that have grown up with pervasive advertising have an internal trip switch these days. It's a sad fact, but the way to keep sane in the modern (urban) environment is to selectively ignore most of the world around you.

      Advertisers look for ever more invasive ways to get our attention, and then wonder why advertising has less and less effect. it's because we hate you and have learned to ignore you to the extent we don't even realise you're there half the time.

      You only believe that because they told you to. Advertisers fill your head with answers to questions you never asked, then when you are called on to make a decision and you're too lazy to do research or too tired to really think about what you want, you use the answers they gave you as your own.

      --
      -1 Uncomfortable Truth
    8. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by Nursie · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You only believe that because they told you to. Advertisers fill your head with answers to questions you never asked then when you are called on to make a decision and you're too lazy to do research or too tired to really think about what you want, you use the answers they gave you as your own.

      I don't believe that for a second. I'm the kinda guy that reads ingredients lists on everything from kitchen cleaners to pharmaceuticals. I am not under the control of advertisers or marketing fuckheads, thanks. If you are then I pity you.

    9. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by EdwinBoyd · · Score: 3, Funny

      "Next up we have the latest song from Rammstein, they're German so you know it's going to be good stuff"

    10. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by kabocox · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Actually, I think pretty much all of us that have grown up with pervasive advertising have an internal trip switch these days. It's a sad fact, but the way to keep sane in the modern (urban) environment is to selectively ignore most of the world around you.

      Advertisers look for ever more invasive ways to get our attention, and then wonder why advertising has less and less effect. it's because we hate you and have learned to ignore you to the extent we don't even realise you're there half the time.

      Reminds me sort of at college to. I mean walk down any given hall way and you'd have all sorts of crap posted by various professor and such on each wall. Now the only board that we'd all stop and spend 30 seconds reading over was just a general post it board outside of the cross roads to several buildings. It was where students posted things like used books for sell or looking for a roommate or party at such and such. What format where they generally in? One sheet of paper with a single large header, 2-3 paragraphs stating what the heck it was about, then phone number/address/time ribbons along the bottom or around the entire edges for you to tear off and take the contact info with you.

    11. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by Gulthek · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hear hear!

      I, for one, am throughly sick of the notion that all content on the Internet must be free as a matter of principle.

      Things cost money, get over it. I'd rather give Pandora a few seconds of my listening time for ads than pay them a subscription. Although I'd seriously lean towards subscribing if they ever provide the option again.

    12. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by ShieldW0lf · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I don't believe that for a second. I'm the kinda guy that reads ingredients lists on everything from kitchen cleaners to pharmaceuticals. I am not under the control of advertisers or marketing fuckheads, thanks. If you are then I pity you.

      If you believe that, more power to you. But everyone gets tired, everyone has moments of vulnerability where they don't want to exercise diligence. If you haven't been exposed to advertising, you get a dull look on your face because you don't have an answer and you need one and you don't want to exercise the effort, but eventually you do because you have no other option. If you have been exposed to advertising, you take the easy out because it's there. It's just part of being human.

      You think you're some highly intelligent person who isn't vulnerable to these effects, and that the advertisers are preying on the sheep, who are all much stupider and less sophisticated than you are. But you're mistaken. The people the advertisers are preying on are just like you, and you're just like them.

      --
      -1 Uncomfortable Truth
    13. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by ShieldW0lf · · Score: 2, Interesting

      "If you haven't been exposed to advertising, you get a dull look on your face because you don't have an answer and you need one and you don't want to exercise the effort," Answers to what? What exactly are we talking about here? the meaning of life? Which catfood to buy? (hint, the one the cat likes wins) What? Because to me advertising is pretty much just noise.

      We're talking about the cat food you grab off the shelf when you have no cat food at home, the one your cat likes is sold out, you don't know enough to tell the difference between the ones you see in front of you and you're late for supper so you grab the one with the logo you recognize because it's a symptom of the human condition that things that are familiar are deemed safer than things that are not familiar.

      We're talking about making peoples decisions for them, so when they're psychologically vulnerable, as in the circumstances described above, they give themselves permission to not consider what they're doing before they do it.

      Most purchases happen in this fashion, and the more people make decisions in this way, the more they train themselves not to be critical thinkers.

      --
      -1 Uncomfortable Truth
    14. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by Nursie · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I also think that this is nothing like the initial point of my comment - that it is getting harder and harder for any advertiser to get their message across in the sea of advertising noise, and the sea of noise makes it easier to ignore.

      Because there is SO damned much of it and most of it does not get through, in order to be heard you have to be both annoying and pervasive, which is not cheap and doesn't always produce a good result.

      What's your argument? That regardless of exposure we're all like a blank page for advertisers to scrawl all over as much as they want because of their advanced psychological techniques?

      I don't think so. I'll repeat, I barely notice ads these days, and the ones you can't help noticing because they are invasive ensure that I never buy that brand again.

    15. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by facelessnumber · · Score: 3, Informative

      I'd rather give Pandora a few seconds of my listening time for ads than pay them a subscription.

      And I'd rather give Pandora a few dollars of my paycheck than listen to their ads.

      Maybe this "entitlement generation" people keep talking about is just weary of being pestered by constant advertising shitting on every second of their lives. I feel like I'm walking downtown and every block there's a hobo with his hand out who won't take no for an answer. When I'm listening to music- actually listening, not just hearing it for background, it's because I'm trying to turn my mind off and enjoy a precious few minutes of free time. Between responsibilities at work and at home, being on call, being dad to a two year old, these minutes I have, say when I'm driving alone or wasting time in the garage with music playing, or just staying up for half an hour after everyone goes to bed... These moments are near sacred to me, and to be interrupted by a stupid commercial for shit I don't care about is infuriating.

      Pandora was the answer for me, but if they start advertising I'm going back to "stealing" mp3s.

  3. better than the alternative by wjh31 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    isnt that invasive, on seeing 'invasive' i imagined comming in in the middle of a song, the title is poorly worded. Plus id much rather hear a few adverts than pay money, ideally neither, but if high royalties means one advert per ten songs (15s advert per 10 2.5min songs is only one 1% advert time) then id rather that than have it disapear.

    However, If its the same advert over and over, that will get tedious, ive played a few free versions of games that have been ad sponsored, and to have the same advert over and over is just annoying.

  4. They will be replaced... by Joce640k · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The Internet shaped them, the Internet can break them. Look at what happened to Napster.

    --
    No sig today...
    1. Re:They will be replaced... by thermian · · Score: 5, Insightful

      What, so internet only media companies shouldn't be allowed to make a profit? Seriously?

      You need to revise your ideas I think. If all you want is good quality free services that don't advertise, you're going to have to do them yourself, because no-one else will.
      Companies that don't make a profit become one of two things, dead companies, or slowly degrading services that then get bought by larger companies.
      If the latter its rare that the original appeal survives the process.
      Twitter is a good example. They have no advertising, make no profits from their customers, and have millions of users. How long do you think Twitters going to last in its current form? I'd give it less than a year.

      --
      A learning experience is one of those things that say, 'You know that thing you just did? Don't do that.' - D. Adams
  5. Re:Can't be accessed outside of US by wjh31 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Its not really pandoras fault in this case, if you go to their home page.

    "We are deeply, deeply sorry to say that due to licensing constraints, we can no longer allow access to Pandora for listeners located outside of the U.S. We will continue to work diligently to realize the vision of a truly global Pandora, but for the time being we are required to restrict its use. We are very sad to have to do this, but there is no other alternative."

    plus there are plenty of alternatives that do work, i use lastfm in the uk, works ace

  6. *Sigh* I hate advertising by rolfwind · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Another service to stop using. I'd rather pay/subscribe than listen to ads (not that the same promise didn't stop ads on cable tv). Not even regular radio interrupts songs in the middle, although a lot of obnoxiously talk into the beginning or cut off the end with their chatter. And replacing Satellite Radio with an iPhone/data_contract + Pandora seemed like a decent idea a while back.

    What is it with advertising becoming so pervasive the last 50+ years that it actually ruins the medium it trojan horses itself in to the audience? On TV, the channels seem to enjoy ruining their shows with invasive in-show advertising for other crappy shows on the same channel. I cancelled my premium subscription when those sets of channels insisted on ruining all their shows, like a subtitled movie by covering the subtitles at the worst points with in-show ads. I know this is a reaction to TIVOing, but really, even with a DVR I usually just recorded something and forgot to skip ads half the time. I'd buy the DVD of that subtitled movie mentioned, but then I am forced to watch previews to "coming soon" movies that are long since gone from the theaters. Pirates are better off.

    Since I was a teenager, I stopped buying branded shirts, as I refused to pay to be a walking billboard for some corp. It's weird how that became popular. And it's strange that the internet is one of the few mostly ad-free places left if the user chooses (adblock, noscript, etc) yet I bought more based on word-of-mouth there than any actual advertisement in the real world. Just seems like a giant waste of $$$ to be honest.

    Hell, look at Geico commercials, at least they at least try to be entertaining. Maybe more advertising to follow the same route, becoming patrons of specific songs/etc (like in the middle ages) and actually add to the mediums rather than sabotaging them.

  7. Hulu does this and everybody doesn't mind that... by Vertana · · Score: 4, Informative

    Seriously, this is no big deal. According to the article, "On average, people will hear a 15-second commercial about every two hours, Westergren said, adding that it is a targeted ad campaign and not everyone is hearing the commercials." Other 'free' services have been doing it for ages, most notably Hulu.com. Plus I agree with the above comments... fuck country-specific services on the Internet and fuck those royalty fees. And yes... I'm looking at you the most RIAA...

    --
    "The best way to accelerate a Macintosh is at 9.8m/sec^2" -Marcus Dolengo
  8. Music is being advertised on radio by captainpanic · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Why advertise anything else?
    People hear music, like it, buy the CD or visit the concert.

  9. Once upon a time, children.... by macraig · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Let me tell you a fictional bedtime story, kids. Once upon a time there were these cable TV services that were popular because they had no commercials! Then, like an evil virus, commercials started slowly creeping in, so slowly people didn't notice the prick of the blade at first....

  10. Headline over the top by bytesex · · Score: 4, Insightful

    These commercial breaks are not 'invasive'. Somebody groping you on the street on your way to work is invasive. You can still choose not to listen to web radio.

    --
    Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
    1. Re:Headline over the top by iamdrscience · · Score: 4, Funny

      I agree, but that means the real question is, can I get ad-free radio just for letting somebody grope me? If so, sign me up, it sounds like a win-win.

  11. Re:Hulu does this and everybody doesn't mind that. by iamdrscience · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Other 'free' services have been doing it for ages, most notably Hulu.com

    I know this is the internet we're talking about, but Hulu went live ~1.5 years ago and has only been accessible to the general public for less than a year (March 12, 2008). They haven't been doing anything "for ages".

  12. Re:Truly the American dream by ettlz · · Score: 2, Funny

    So don't buy it.

  13. Re:*Sigh* I hate advertising by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The fundamental problem with all of this is that Pandora is advertising. The Music Labels get a service which is not super-trivial for you to download music from (by no means impossible) so that you can sample their music - since Pandora won't just let you listen to it how you want when you want, you may be compelled to buy it. Now they want to add commercials for shit I'm not listening to as well? If companies want to advertise to me on Pandora they can pay to have their songs ranked up, so that I hear them more. Instead, I have to say goodbye to Pandora at a time when I'm considering actually having enough bandwidth to use it. But since there are many non-commercial internet radio options, I guess I'll use one of those instead. Station ID bumpers are annoying enough when I'm in a groove, commercials are simply unacceptable to me. (I'm one of those annoying "I don't watch TV" fucks, but even when I did, I muted all commercials.)

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  14. Spotify does this too. by Skrynkelberg · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It plays an add every ten songs or so. For me, it is no big deal, but in case you should think so, there is also an add-free subscription option for 99 SEK ($12) a month.

  15. That's OK by rrohbeck · · Score: 2, Informative

    They get their ad revenue for sending them, not for you listening.
    Filtering them out can't be too hard and won't cost them. Just like AdBlock downloads the ads but doesn't display them.

    --
    thegodmovie.com - watch it
  16. Re:*Sigh* I hate advertising by rolfwind · · Score: 2, Insightful

    That explains why you're a slashdot subscriber, as denoted by the asterisk by your username. You've posted about 150 comments, you obviously don't hate the place.

    Oh wait, there's no asterisk by your username.

    Google indicates my post count is about 1,700 comments although it's probably be higher. I think signed up before subscriptions (~1999) but am not entirely sure. Alway's been using no scipt and adblock since they've been available, not specifically for this site. I'm just not up-to-date on the site's features/developments actually, so I don't know what the subscription is supposed to buy me, sorry. Looking at the subscriptions page, it has a page count rather than a time length....

    Conversely, I do buy flash games or donate to certain flash projects and support a few websites.

    It's not that I harbor an illusion that people are altruistic and projects will get as much funding as with advertising (PBS's constant pleading is testament to this and little better than intrusive adverts), but there is a correct way and an incorrect way to do things. Modern mainstream advertising stopped riding the coattails of the content that brings the audience and just actively subverts it - Television's new intrusive techniques was an example although I'm not entirely sure if that is also some type of way to prevent people from recording a perfect example of a movie they want rather than getting it on DVD. Another example would be those magazines that were once useful but then became so overrun by ads they easily outnumbered the content - and a magazine is bought and paid for. It's also brings to mind the law of declining returns - all those ads are fighting among themselves to be noticed - which is probably why Geico does the shtick it does.

    As for Internet advertising - if the website stuck to a simple advert jpeg/gif or even flash file coming from its own servers and inserted them as static content to the page, along with a link to the sponsor - it would be less of a problem and hard to block anyway coming in.

  17. Re:The NERVE !! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    When will these swine learn that we don't need no stinkin interruptions !! Transcoded 256 kbps from 112 kbps mp3 all the way !! And crank it up !! Turn up the Veeeeez !! I hear one commecial and back to Virin radio I go !! The whole point of internet radio is that it is free !! Free !! FREE !!

    Check your medication. Seriously.

  18. Sorry Pandora, it's been fun by rAiNsT0rm · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I have been using Pandora for years and have found a few new artists by using it, and I know they have struggled to make a profit, but this is the end for me. Besides the ads they have also shortened the time you can just listen tremendously now stopping the music and popping up the "Are you still listening?" dialog every 5 minutes.

    Pandora is a company/project that could be profitable in so many creative ways but the asshats behind it seem to only know intrusive ads in one way or another. It is a classic case of tunnel vision and a complete lack of creativity and effort.

    I plan on emailing them my thoughts before just disappearing, and I'd urge anyone who uses it to do the same.

    --
    http://teasphere.wordpress.com - A little spot of tea
    1. Re:Sorry Pandora, it's been fun by aegis17 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why the indignant rage over a free, amazing service? I've only heard one ad over the course of ~10 hours listening, and while the "are you still listening?" dialog is rather annoying, it is trivial compared to what I receive from them. If you truly dislike what they have become, why not try donating and getting a premium account? They don't offer ads, and the dialog pops up once every five hours, rather than every half hour.

      On second thought, everyone should donate; that's the only way to get around the ads. After all, they exist so the company can stay afloat, while handing out free music to anyone who cares and is willing to be inconvenienced for five seconds of every half hour. By leaving them, you force them to find new ways to generate revenue, which results in more ad time, etc.

      I plan on donating to them for listening, and I'd urge anyone who uses it to do the same.

  19. So? by Accursed · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It's their service, and they need to recoup costs for their bandwidth somehow. Really, this whole "ads are bad, everything should be free and beautiful" thing is getting old. Reality doesn't work like that.

  20. Vans were certainly possible - and trivial. by Ungrounded+Lightning · · Score: 2, Informative

    From what I've heard the detector vans were an urban myth.

    While I can't state authoritatively whether the vans were a myth, the technology was real. Also simple and cheap.

    Television and radio receivers of the era were all superheterodyne - down-converting a signal to a low and standard "intermediate frequency" ("IF"), where a fix-tuned amplifier/filter combination did most of the boosting and rejection of out-of-band signals before the detector stage. (Fixed-tuned filters are easier than variable-tuned and filter selectivity is in terms of a percentage of center frequency so lower frequencies are easier to band-pass filter than higher.)

    The down-conversion was done by "mixing" (multiplying, or using other non-linear approximations) the incoming signal with a sine wave at a frequency from a "local oscillator" ("LO"), displaced from the signal of interest by the IF frequency. (Yes I know "IF frequency" is redundant.)

    This "mixer" stage is preceded by a small number (one or two) of variable-tuned amplifier stages - which reject the other "image" (incoming signals on the "other side" of the local oscillator frequency) and to provide SOME attenuation of the local oscillator energy in the mixer as it "leaks" toward the antenna. The isolation is enough to keep the local oscillator frequency from radiating enough energy (through the antenna or out through the box or other wiring) to jam other channels - but far too little to keep it from being trivially detectable by a radio tuned to (or sweeping across) its frequency.

    So it's trivial to put a "panoramic" (sweeping) receiver in a van, with a directional antenna on the roof, and hunt down the local oscillator radiation of any receiver that is operating and tuned to a BBC channel.

    This technology predates the TV tax. It was used in WWII (at least by the Germans and probably by the British as well) to hunt down receivers tuned to the enemy's news outlets (which carried embedded messages to embedded spies) and "numbers stations" (which carried encrypted messages ditto).

    They do now us a database to work out who hasn't bought a license, and then knock on the door now and again to check up on you.

    Much simpler in an era of cheap computing and document copying. But more intrusive. Detection is STILL possible and cheap. So I'd be surprised if they knocked on the door before checking to see if there was a receiver running.

    --
    Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way