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Pandora Trying Out Invasive Commercial Breaks

Posted by kdawson on from the knew-it-had-to-be-coming dept.

Nathan Halverson writes "The popular online radio service Pandora.com has added brief commercial interruptions to its service. Pandora says this is a trial and is targeted to a subset of listeners at this point. In one case, a brief ad for the Fox TV show 'Lie To Me' interrupted the music stream for about 15 seconds after ten songs had initially played, and the same commercial interrupted 22 songs later. 'But [Pandora's] founder promised the site will never carry as many audio ads as broadcast radio, despite the fact it pays substantially higher royalty fees to the recording industry.'"

29 of 244 comments (clear)

  1. We need a spam filter for radio by captainpanic · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'd be willing to pay money for any program that filters out adds (without making too many mistakes).
    I've always wondered why this doesn't exist for TV.
    And I wondered what you should play during the adds... a random mp3 from your computer perhaps?

    Alternatively, you can also switch to another station :D

    1. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by Roland+Piquepaille · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'd be willing to pay money for any program that filters out adds (without making too many mistakes). I've always wondered why this doesn't exist for TV.

      Isn't that what TiVo is for?

    2. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by bytesex · · Score: 5, Interesting

      What I don't understand is why TVs don't yet have a function that not only mutes it, but also makes the screen almost dark. So that you can just spot when your program is back on.

      --
      Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
    3. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by xlotlu · · Score: 4, Informative

      I'd be willing to pay money for any program that filters out adds (without making too many mistakes). I've always wondered why this doesn't exist for TV.

      Sorry to disappoint you, but you don't need to pay for MythTV. From the features list:

      • Completely automatic commercial detection/skipping, with manual correction via an intuitive cutlist editor.
    4. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      My grandfather used to turn off the tv when the commercials came on, and we would sit there in awkward silence until he turned it back on. He became surprisingly good at turning it back on at the right time. We convinced him into something with a mute button in the early 90's

    5. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by xelah · · Score: 3, Informative

      From what I've heard the detector vans were an urban myth. They do now us a database to work out who hasn't bought a license, and then knock on the door now and again to check up on you.

      I don't have a TV, so I know how TV licensing behave. Enforcement is mostly based on fear. If you aren't on the licence database they will write to you every three-ish months with one of a rotating set of letters. These say things like 'WARNING AGAINST UNLAWFUL ACTION', or look like fake bills, or tell you you've been added to their enforcement list and that 'Enforcement Officers' will visit in compliance with PACE (and, presumably, the Geneva conventions and the nuclear test ban treaty....). They give you a phone number they want you to ring to get yourself on a database of people declaring they have no TV. Then they write to you and say they're going to visit you anyway (and then don't) and start the letters again six months later. Meanwhile they're running (billboard) adverts saying things like 'last year we caught 157,000 licence dodgers' and 'seven people in Ebscombe Close don't have a licence'.

      In eight years I've met exactly one Enforcement Officer (they're private sector contractors with no special powers). Conversation with them go like this: Him: Do you have a television. You: No. Him: Can I come in? You: No. Him: That's all I need to know [goes away].

      It appears they only catch people by knocking on the door and hearing a television. They have no power of entry, and need some shred of evidence of a crime to get a warrant from a magistrate. Besides, I get the impression they can't be bothered and are quite keen on getting through their list ASAP.

      BTW, you need a licence for watching television services at or nearly at the same time as it's being broadcast. This applies to using computers for that, too. But you can watch them later with no licence at all. (I don't do either, ICYWW, if I wanted to watch TV I'd have a TV).

    6. Re:We need a spam filter for radio by shark72 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Rather than looking for a third party to pay for the service of filtering Pandora ads for you, why not just subscribe to Pandora? It's $36 a year. That's $3 a month. You can afford it.

      Sadly, the tone of many of the posts so far is that Pandora is now evil. That's really quite sad. They've been providing you a free service for years, while absorbing the cost of broadcast royalties.

      I've been a Pandora subscriber for a while. Not so I'd get anything out of it (but as a bonus, I'm not hearing the ads), but because I believe in what they do and because they've helped me find a lot of great music.

      --
      Sitting in my day care, the art is decopainted.
  2. Whatever, it's a great service by gravos · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I for one am understanding of their need to generate revenue to maintain the excellent service. Especially they go to some of the background or portable options they've hinted at before, audio ads may be the only way to do that. I heard the McDonald's ad and considered it far less intrusive than the types of ads I get on other "free" Internet radio services. If they can design all their ads like that--NPR style, so to speak--and not make them constant interruptions to them music (start up and/or change of station are good ideas), then I say go for it. If that helps keep Pandora free and improving, I'm all for it.

    --
    This game will waste your life. Don't clicky!
    1. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by digitig · · Score: 4, Informative

      Bands who want to be known give their songs to a station which broadcasts it. Band becomes famous, and people pay for the concert. But then again, I also believe in Utopia :D

      That model does actually exist out there on the net -- the billboard at http://www.themusicwellhome.co.uk/ for instance.

      --
      Quidnam Latine loqui modo coepi?
    2. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by davester666 · · Score: 5, Informative

      > Hmm... of course the station needs to get money from somewhere. I always thought that record companies pay stations to play their songs. Radio is the best add for a song (and music is a product that is advertised on radio). Why advertise anything else when radio is almost 100% advertisement? :D

      Um, it's kinda crazy, but this is known as "payola". It's not illegal for the labels to pay stations to play their songs, BUT the station has to disclose that they were paid to play the song.

      Evidently, kids (who are the primary consumers of music) tend to tune out things they know are ads. So, the record labels have gone to extraordinary lengths (and have been caught MULTIPLE times) to pay radio stations to play their music WITHOUT saying they were paid to play it (easiest way to know a radio station was paid to play a song, the DJ will say it's the most requested song).

      The labels are trying really hard to get radio stations to pay royalties, so they can get some of their payola money back...

      --
      Sleep your way to a whiter smile...date a dentist!
    3. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by Nursie · · Score: 5, Insightful

      >Evidently, kids (who are the primary consumers of music) tend to tune out things they know are ads.

      Actually, I think pretty much all of us that have grown up with pervasive advertising have an internal trip switch these days. It's a sad fact, but the way to keep sane in the modern (urban) environment is to selectively ignore most of the world around you.

      Advertisers look for ever more invasive ways to get our attention, and then wonder why advertising has less and less effect. it's because we hate you and have learned to ignore you to the extent we don't even realise you're there half the time.

    4. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by ShieldW0lf · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Actually, I think pretty much all of us that have grown up with pervasive advertising have an internal trip switch these days. It's a sad fact, but the way to keep sane in the modern (urban) environment is to selectively ignore most of the world around you.

      Advertisers look for ever more invasive ways to get our attention, and then wonder why advertising has less and less effect. it's because we hate you and have learned to ignore you to the extent we don't even realise you're there half the time.

      You only believe that because they told you to. Advertisers fill your head with answers to questions you never asked, then when you are called on to make a decision and you're too lazy to do research or too tired to really think about what you want, you use the answers they gave you as your own.

      --
      -1 Uncomfortable Truth
    5. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by Nursie · · Score: 3, Interesting

      You only believe that because they told you to. Advertisers fill your head with answers to questions you never asked then when you are called on to make a decision and you're too lazy to do research or too tired to really think about what you want, you use the answers they gave you as your own.

      I don't believe that for a second. I'm the kinda guy that reads ingredients lists on everything from kitchen cleaners to pharmaceuticals. I am not under the control of advertisers or marketing fuckheads, thanks. If you are then I pity you.

    6. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by EdwinBoyd · · Score: 3, Funny

      "Next up we have the latest song from Rammstein, they're German so you know it's going to be good stuff"

    7. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by ShieldW0lf · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I don't believe that for a second. I'm the kinda guy that reads ingredients lists on everything from kitchen cleaners to pharmaceuticals. I am not under the control of advertisers or marketing fuckheads, thanks. If you are then I pity you.

      If you believe that, more power to you. But everyone gets tired, everyone has moments of vulnerability where they don't want to exercise diligence. If you haven't been exposed to advertising, you get a dull look on your face because you don't have an answer and you need one and you don't want to exercise the effort, but eventually you do because you have no other option. If you have been exposed to advertising, you take the easy out because it's there. It's just part of being human.

      You think you're some highly intelligent person who isn't vulnerable to these effects, and that the advertisers are preying on the sheep, who are all much stupider and less sophisticated than you are. But you're mistaken. The people the advertisers are preying on are just like you, and you're just like them.

      --
      -1 Uncomfortable Truth
    8. Re:Whatever, it's a great service by facelessnumber · · Score: 3, Informative

      I'd rather give Pandora a few seconds of my listening time for ads than pay them a subscription.

      And I'd rather give Pandora a few dollars of my paycheck than listen to their ads.

      Maybe this "entitlement generation" people keep talking about is just weary of being pestered by constant advertising shitting on every second of their lives. I feel like I'm walking downtown and every block there's a hobo with his hand out who won't take no for an answer. When I'm listening to music- actually listening, not just hearing it for background, it's because I'm trying to turn my mind off and enjoy a precious few minutes of free time. Between responsibilities at work and at home, being on call, being dad to a two year old, these minutes I have, say when I'm driving alone or wasting time in the garage with music playing, or just staying up for half an hour after everyone goes to bed... These moments are near sacred to me, and to be interrupted by a stupid commercial for shit I don't care about is infuriating.

      Pandora was the answer for me, but if they start advertising I'm going back to "stealing" mp3s.

  3. better than the alternative by wjh31 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    isnt that invasive, on seeing 'invasive' i imagined comming in in the middle of a song, the title is poorly worded. Plus id much rather hear a few adverts than pay money, ideally neither, but if high royalties means one advert per ten songs (15s advert per 10 2.5min songs is only one 1% advert time) then id rather that than have it disapear.

    However, If its the same advert over and over, that will get tedious, ive played a few free versions of games that have been ad sponsored, and to have the same advert over and over is just annoying.

  4. They will be replaced... by Joce640k · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The Internet shaped them, the Internet can break them. Look at what happened to Napster.

    --
    No sig today...
    1. Re:They will be replaced... by thermian · · Score: 5, Insightful

      What, so internet only media companies shouldn't be allowed to make a profit? Seriously?

      You need to revise your ideas I think. If all you want is good quality free services that don't advertise, you're going to have to do them yourself, because no-one else will.
      Companies that don't make a profit become one of two things, dead companies, or slowly degrading services that then get bought by larger companies.
      If the latter its rare that the original appeal survives the process.
      Twitter is a good example. They have no advertising, make no profits from their customers, and have millions of users. How long do you think Twitters going to last in its current form? I'd give it less than a year.

      --
      A learning experience is one of those things that say, 'You know that thing you just did? Don't do that.' - D. Adams
  5. Re:Can't be accessed outside of US by wjh31 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Its not really pandoras fault in this case, if you go to their home page.

    "We are deeply, deeply sorry to say that due to licensing constraints, we can no longer allow access to Pandora for listeners located outside of the U.S. We will continue to work diligently to realize the vision of a truly global Pandora, but for the time being we are required to restrict its use. We are very sad to have to do this, but there is no other alternative."

    plus there are plenty of alternatives that do work, i use lastfm in the uk, works ace

  6. *Sigh* I hate advertising by rolfwind · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Another service to stop using. I'd rather pay/subscribe than listen to ads (not that the same promise didn't stop ads on cable tv). Not even regular radio interrupts songs in the middle, although a lot of obnoxiously talk into the beginning or cut off the end with their chatter. And replacing Satellite Radio with an iPhone/data_contract + Pandora seemed like a decent idea a while back.

    What is it with advertising becoming so pervasive the last 50+ years that it actually ruins the medium it trojan horses itself in to the audience? On TV, the channels seem to enjoy ruining their shows with invasive in-show advertising for other crappy shows on the same channel. I cancelled my premium subscription when those sets of channels insisted on ruining all their shows, like a subtitled movie by covering the subtitles at the worst points with in-show ads. I know this is a reaction to TIVOing, but really, even with a DVR I usually just recorded something and forgot to skip ads half the time. I'd buy the DVD of that subtitled movie mentioned, but then I am forced to watch previews to "coming soon" movies that are long since gone from the theaters. Pirates are better off.

    Since I was a teenager, I stopped buying branded shirts, as I refused to pay to be a walking billboard for some corp. It's weird how that became popular. And it's strange that the internet is one of the few mostly ad-free places left if the user chooses (adblock, noscript, etc) yet I bought more based on word-of-mouth there than any actual advertisement in the real world. Just seems like a giant waste of $$$ to be honest.

    Hell, look at Geico commercials, at least they at least try to be entertaining. Maybe more advertising to follow the same route, becoming patrons of specific songs/etc (like in the middle ages) and actually add to the mediums rather than sabotaging them.

  7. Hulu does this and everybody doesn't mind that... by Vertana · · Score: 4, Informative

    Seriously, this is no big deal. According to the article, "On average, people will hear a 15-second commercial about every two hours, Westergren said, adding that it is a targeted ad campaign and not everyone is hearing the commercials." Other 'free' services have been doing it for ages, most notably Hulu.com. Plus I agree with the above comments... fuck country-specific services on the Internet and fuck those royalty fees. And yes... I'm looking at you the most RIAA...

    --
    "The best way to accelerate a Macintosh is at 9.8m/sec^2" -Marcus Dolengo
  8. Once upon a time, children.... by macraig · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Let me tell you a fictional bedtime story, kids. Once upon a time there were these cable TV services that were popular because they had no commercials! Then, like an evil virus, commercials started slowly creeping in, so slowly people didn't notice the prick of the blade at first....

  9. Headline over the top by bytesex · · Score: 4, Insightful

    These commercial breaks are not 'invasive'. Somebody groping you on the street on your way to work is invasive. You can still choose not to listen to web radio.

    --
    Religion is what happens when nature strikes and groupthink goes wrong.
    1. Re:Headline over the top by iamdrscience · · Score: 4, Funny

      I agree, but that means the real question is, can I get ad-free radio just for letting somebody grope me? If so, sign me up, it sounds like a win-win.

  10. Re:Hulu does this and everybody doesn't mind that. by iamdrscience · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Other 'free' services have been doing it for ages, most notably Hulu.com

    I know this is the internet we're talking about, but Hulu went live ~1.5 years ago and has only been accessible to the general public for less than a year (March 12, 2008). They haven't been doing anything "for ages".

  11. Re:*Sigh* I hate advertising by drinkypoo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    The fundamental problem with all of this is that Pandora is advertising. The Music Labels get a service which is not super-trivial for you to download music from (by no means impossible) so that you can sample their music - since Pandora won't just let you listen to it how you want when you want, you may be compelled to buy it. Now they want to add commercials for shit I'm not listening to as well? If companies want to advertise to me on Pandora they can pay to have their songs ranked up, so that I hear them more. Instead, I have to say goodbye to Pandora at a time when I'm considering actually having enough bandwidth to use it. But since there are many non-commercial internet radio options, I guess I'll use one of those instead. Station ID bumpers are annoying enough when I'm in a groove, commercials are simply unacceptable to me. (I'm one of those annoying "I don't watch TV" fucks, but even when I did, I muted all commercials.)

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
  12. Spotify does this too. by Skrynkelberg · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It plays an add every ten songs or so. For me, it is no big deal, but in case you should think so, there is also an add-free subscription option for 99 SEK ($12) a month.

  13. So? by Accursed · · Score: 3, Insightful

    It's their service, and they need to recoup costs for their bandwidth somehow. Really, this whole "ads are bad, everything should be free and beautiful" thing is getting old. Reality doesn't work like that.