US Army Will Upgrade To Windows Vista

MojoKid writes "While many organizations are preparing for an upgrade to Windows 7, the US Army is upgrading to Windows Vista. The upgrade will include getting rid of all the Office 2003 programs and installing Office 2007 in its place, and is scheduled for a Dec. 31 completion date. Half the Army's computers (they have 744,000 desktop units) have Office 2007 so far, and 13 percent are on Vista, which was released in January 2007. Windows 7 is supposed to launch before year's end, so the Army will be fully on Vista sometime after Microsoft's next-generation OS is already launched."

Comments

Doh!

[Un pobre guey]

Surely it must have occurred to at least a single person at the Pentagon to upgrade to Windows 7 and not to Vista?

Re:Doh!

[santax]

I am sure you are right, but I would keep very quiet too if the last good idea I had was to seek WMD's in a foreign country.

Re:Doh!

[houstonbofh]

As it will be a year before it is evaluated, tested, patched, and approved, they have time... Look how long it took Vista to get stable.

Re:Doh!

[Jurily]

Look how long it took Vista to get stable.

Who said it was stable yet?

Re:Doh!

[SpryGuy]

Vista is perfectly stable, and any insinuation to the contrary is incorrect.

I use Vista on several machines, and almost never have to reboot, and never crash. Uptime is 24/7.

Since SP1, Vista has been remarkably stable. I do development, and even when software crashes, the OS stays up and running.

I find Vista more stable than XP.

Vista got a horrible reputation out of the gate (and it was pretty well deserved), but since SP1, and as long as you run on sufficient hardware with mature drivers, it's an OS I like significantly better than XP. Sure, it took me some time to get used to the New UI (just as it took me a while to get used to XP after Windows 2000), but right now, any remaining slams against Vista are mostly lazy and uninformed.

Given the way the Military operates, it takes probably years to certify a new software acquisition. They've obviously gone through that work with Vista, and are satisfied enough to roll it out. It's likely they'll begin evaluating Win7 soon after it is released, and will likely upgrade to that in a couple of years or so.

Re:Doh!

[ae1294]

Activities include browsing, gaming, running Matlab (although small

whooh! I read this as "running a methlab"
ae

Re:Doh!

[Venik]

I had a Win 98 system like that. It was sitting under my desk at work and I used it as a foot rest. The uptime that thing had - you wouldn't believe. Granted, the only thing that computer did was keep my legs elevated and my feet warm. But still, it was up 24/7 for well over a year. Maybe Microsoft will use my story in one of their commercials.

Re:Doh!

[neomunk]

Moreover, Microsoft's abandonment of support for XP is a real issue to them. If you're ever in charge of a large number of computers, you may one day understand that.

This is the part of the issue I have a real problem with. I don't like the idea that the U.S. Army is at the mercy of a private entity's marketing strategy. I want rugged long term support for my nation's military. This could be easily achieved with either an in-house or open source based solution. Relying on the release schedule of one specific private entity just to keep functioning seems to be the very definition of folly. I cannot see any reason why SELinux isn't the standard installation for military PCs. It's open, it'll be maintained as long as the Army maintains interest in it, and it's as secure as a fully functional machine gets (IMHO)...

But I digress, this isn't about what they COULD do, this is about what they ARE doing; the U.S. Army is putting itself in a compromising situation under a multinational entity. I cannot fathom how this can be justified, let alone swept aside with corporate mumbo-jumbo about "getting things done". It's the "getting things done" department of any business that releases shoddy products to meet artificial deadlines, only after the "do it right" department has had time to look things over for awhile does the product get stable (if it ever does). This isn't acceptable for something like the military where you need your product to work right, the first time, every time, for as long as it needs to.

Free vista!

[x2A]

Cool, am gonna keep an eye out for harddrives on ebay now, might just come with a free copy of vista installed!

You can't wait forever..

[cbreaker]

If you always wait for the next release of that software, that car, or that style shoes you like you'll never end up with anything.

You need to draw a line somewhere. Windows Vista is a good move because it's been available for some time and they've had enough time to test it out with whatever software they might use. XP is getting more difficult with new machines, and if you want to stay on a Microsoft platform it's the way to go.

Windows 7 isn't so much different than Vista in terms of the operating system itself, and it's more similar to XP in interface than Windows 7.

I don't understand what the issue is here. I guess some people don't understand how IT works in organizations with more than a few hundred users.

Re:You can't wait forever..

[DoofusOfDeath]

You need to draw a line somewhere.

Yes, and the Army seems to have drawn the line with a Ford Pinto.

Re:You can't wait forever..

[Maniacal]

Agreed. I work for a company with 17,000 employees and it can take a while to 1) get something tested and approved 2) get something rolled out. When you are talking about an OS there is even more involved - Hundreds of apps to test for compatibility, security and group policies, compatibility with old hardware, etc.

Add to that the usual military BS. I did a 4 year stint in the Navy and if I remember correctly it takes 7 signatures just to go on vacation. I can't imagine how many signatures you'd need to roll an OS to 744,000 desktops (Geez that's a huge number. Can that be right?)

Aside from the time it takes to get things done in a huge organization you have the simple fact that Windows 7 is brand new. I wouldn't suggest my mom roll out W7 before SP1. Certainly the friggin military wouldn't do that either.

Re:You can't wait forever..

[A beautiful mind]

If you always wait for the next design of that shipware, that car, or that style shoes you like you'll never end up with anything.

You need to draw a line somewhere. The Titanic is a good move because it's been available for some time and they've had enough time to test it out with whatever seas they might use. The Olympic is getting more difficult with new cruise tours, and if you want to stay on a White Star Line platform it's the way to go.

The Queen Victoria isn't so much different than The Titanic in terms of the hull design itself, and it's more similar to The Olympic in interface than The Queen Victoria.

I don't understand what the issue is here. I guess some people don't understand how oceanic shipping works in organizations with more than a few hundred users.

Re:You can't wait forever..

[cbreaker]

Why does it have to be black and white? You defended them until Vista? Why did you do that? I just use software, I don't defend corporations.

I use Linux, Windows, and even some MacOS on my Hackintosh machine. As an IT professional, I think it's important to have some exposure to all of them.

If you can get by on Linux, then that's great! I love Linux. I really like the new KDE stuff they're doing quite a bit. But I use Windows too, and it's fine.

So you had problems with Vista on a machine or two and you got "OMG PISSED OFF M$ SUCKS!!" That happens when you install a new operating system on older hardware sometimes. Two years later now, it's a lot better. Better hardware support, better software support.

Go ahead, keep ranting on. I try to take a more pragmatic approach.

PS. I hated the first implementations of PnP. I much preferred cards with jumpers because you never had a problem. Now, with PCI, APIC and reliable IRQ sharing it's no longer a problem. It's called progress.

The US Air Force rollout

[Anonymous Coward]

At the Air Force clinic I work at, all the workstations are XP, and Office 2007 was pushed on to every computer last January. 2003 worked great, 2007 drags ass. Everyone's been having problems with templates breaking, macros requiring endless confirmations, and just plain trying to find where the hell everything is in that damned ribbon. Not fun.

The only Vista computers I've seen were down at the Education and Training center for test-taking. I can't imagine why they replaced them, the test program we use could fit comfortably on a Windows 98 box (and I think that's what it was originally programmed for). Nevertheless, the powers that be have decided that a monochromatic visual basic simple-text-and-button testing application requires dual core Vista machines with 2 gigs of ram each.

Your tax dollars at work.

no surprise

[smash]

... despite the naysayers....

Windows 7 basically = vista + a heap of untested code and new features.

Vista has been out for 3 years now and is a "known quantity". SP2 is out soon, and many people live by the policy with MS software of "wait for SP2".

The military deciding to roll out Windows 7 now would be rather foolish. They need to migrate OFF XP if they want continued support in 2010, so really, its either vista or Linux, etc. Like it or not, Vista is the path of least resistance.

Besides, vista isn't as bad as the reputation anyway... in the 3 years I've run it, none of the problems have been insurmountable, and there are plenty of benefits over XP. No one cares that it may be 5% slower at foo task when you're running it on hardware that is 500% faster than the gear you replaced.

I like vista

[alienunknown]

There, I said it. And I'm probably going to lose karma for this post as everyone seems to hate vista here but oh well.

I know there are going to be dozens (if not hundreds) of vista jokes about this article but I still don't know why everyone hates vista so much.

This is going to sound really weird, and I am not making this up. I'm a Linux user (kubuntu at the moment, used to use slackware and I'm thinking of installing fedora) and I have an old mac that I use regularly too. I wasn't too fond of XP, and I'm not a huge fan of microsoft either because of their dirty business tactics. I got Vista (with sp1) cheap because I'm a uni student. The first thing I did before buying Vista was to make sure that all the parts I had were compatible, and luckily they were as I only just built the computer. Anyway, so I installed vista expecting there to be a million problems, I had a preconceived negative opinion of vista and I was actually quite surprised. Its stable, fast (on my computer, at least) and I'm quite enjoying using it.

However, I never used Vista before SP1 and I didn't have the driver problems. And I guess because I don't use XP that I wasn't missing any of XP's features.

Anyway, I guess my experience isn't the usual experience. Sure, I'm not going to make Vista my main machine (I love kubuntu and os x too much to do that :)) but I don't regret installing Vista.

Don't be fooled!

[bensafrickingenius]

This is just Obama's plan to drastically reduce the size of the military!! Would YOU stay if you had to work with Office 2007 AND Vista? Think about it.

You have pulled the trigger...

[quonsar]

...this could be dangerous. Are you sure you wish to pull the trigger?

Taxpayers money being well spent

[jocknerd]

I should know. I work for a city government and we are getting ready to bring in Sharepoint. No business plan, no requirements documents like are needed for the small web apps I write. We're bringing Sharepoint in because the CIO is a sheep just like 95% of the other CIO's out there. If they see others doing it, they're going to follow suit. Meanwhile, due to budget constraints, our libraries will be open fewer hours. Yep, we've got our priorities in order.

Cyberwar

[gmuslera]

The 1st step to cripple enemy networks is convince them that something unsecure is the most secure system of the planet. That is really a subtle plan, but surely will work.

Military QA

[sanosuke001]

The place I work at (Air Force) runs a different copy of Vista than you can actually buy. It has to be thoroughly tested and OK'd by the Air Force before they are even allowed to install it on any machines on the network.

The Army probably does the same. Rolling out Vista now is like they started rolling it out on release date. They couldn't have rolled it out any sooner if they wanted to. Same for Windows 7. The earliest they'll see it ok'd for use is probably two years from release. Why people make a big deal out of it? Probably because they're ignorant and want to make a fuss.

Re:Military QA

[NoobixCube]

I'd like to preface this comment by saying I don't mean to be snarky, but given the general tone of it people are bound to misinterpret. This is Slashdot, afterall...

How much does the QA cost in terms of money and man-hours? How much is Microsoft billing the US government for 744,000 copies of Vista and Office? It just seems to me that no matter how big of a "discount" Microsoft is giving, you can't beat free. Linux is proven to be secure and stable, even without military QA. I'm sure it would still be put through it, and rightly so, but it would take much less work to get any gaps in Linux sealed up tighter than Windows ever could be.

Government waste

[pkbarbiedoll]

Ubuntu and Open Office would save this country millions of dollars.

Re:Obelix was right.

[NoobixCube]

All of the Latin I know, I learned from Asterix, so for those who know even less than I do (there must be at least one), SPQR is the Senate and People of Rome, SPQA in this case is of course the Senate and People of America. What santax is referring to is Obelix's often repeated phrase of "these Romans are crazy", and applying it to Americans instead. Perhaps now he won't be modded Offtopic :)

Re:US Army Will Upgrade To Windows Vista

[NoobixCube]

The NT kernel has many great features that put it on a par with Unix in terms of security and functionality. As yet, no operating system using the NT kernel has actually used those features. Even UAC is a bizarre hack of a permissive userland, and doesn't use the kernel's security features. It's about as secure as Windows 98, thanks to Microsoft's butchery of the userland in the name of backwards compatibility.