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Introducing the Warpship

astroengine writes "Dr. Richard Obousy, a guy who has put modern science into the warp drive, has designed his very own warpship. Now, for the first time, he's shared it with the world. It might not be the sleek Starship Enterprise, but its structure has been optimized to harness local 'dark energy,' generating a warp bubble so faster-than-light velocities are possible." Now, the only question is: will the ship achieve faster-than-light travel ... or will the company hit those speeds once it has enough money from investors?

31 of 361 comments (clear)

  1. Let's not put the cart before the horse by ikirudennis · · Score: 5, Insightful

    How about we figure out how to warp time first and then figure out a ship to utilize that science for the sake of travel?

    1. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by T+Murphy · · Score: 5, Funny

      Because we all know from Douglas Adams that it takes so long to learn how to perform time travel you need time travel in order to do so. I don't recall what we're supposed to do instead, so just write 42 on everything and we'll be okay until we run out of towels.

    2. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by gnick · · Score: 5, Funny

      Yeah - Here's the kicker, found on Page 2 of TFA:

      Exactly how the 11th dimension would be expanded and shrunk is still unknown.

      Sounds pretty similar to the way I walk - I move my feet and the Earth rotates beneath me. I'm planning on starting to fly instead, it's just maintaining altitude after lift-off. But I won't let that small detail stop me from making travel plans - I'll work that out after jumping.

      --
      He's getting rather old, but he's a good mouse.
    3. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by Jurily · · Score: 4, Funny

      Where's the fun in that?!

      Not where, when.

    4. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by internerdj · · Score: 4, Funny

      How am I supposed to secure the patent if I wait until after someone else has discovered the underlying science?

    5. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by epiphani · · Score: 4, Funny

      Sounds pretty similar to the way I walk - I move my feet and the Earth rotates beneath me. I'm planning on starting to fly instead, it's just maintaining altitude after lift-off. But I won't let that small detail stop me from making travel plans - I'll work that out after jumping.

      Oh that part is relatively simple: Just throw yourself at the ground and miss.

      --
      .
    6. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by aardwolf64 · · Score: 4, Funny

      Steal their invention, then travel back in space-time and patent it.

    7. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by Razalhague · · Score: 4, Funny

      I've got one too, though unfortunately it's stuck going forward at x1 speed.

    8. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by DeltaStorm · · Score: 4, Funny

      Oh that part is relatively simple: Just throw yourself at the ground and miss.

      I never knew I had such good aim.

      --
      .sdrawkcab si gis siht
    9. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by ground.zero.612 · · Score: 5, Funny

      Mine varies by alcohol consumption.

      --
      "Be prepared, son. That's my motto. Be prepared." --Joe Hallenbeck
    10. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by gnick · · Score: 5, Funny

      "Honey, does this warpship make my ass look fat?"
      --
      Just because you aren't asking the question doesn't mean you aren't going to get the answer.

      If those are at all related, I'm guessing you're single. If you're going to tell your wife that her ass looks like it's bending space-time, at least let her ask the question first. That's not the kind of thing you volunteer.

      --
      He's getting rather old, but he's a good mouse.
    11. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by c6gunner · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So. Are they selling electric motors or perpetual energy devices?

      That's a false dichotomy. The great thing about pseudoscience is that it's "experts" can sell you anything you want!

    12. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by Junior+J.+Junior+III · · Score: 4, Informative

      Throw yourself at a clock, and miss. What's so hard about that?

      --
      You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
    13. Re:Let's not put the cart before the horse by smoker2 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Flight is a very good example IMHO. The first people who wanted to fly, jumped up in the air and promptly fell back down again. So next time they jumped out of trees or off cliffs to extend the time they spent in the air. Gradually they worked out that they needed some other components to slow the descent, and this gradually became a "wing". So they got as far as the hang glider. Wing shape was then concentrated on and eventually the concept of lift was discovered. Then the engines were developed to push that wing through the air fast enough to take off without needing to drop from height first.

      So deciding to do something is the very first step in learning how to do it. Nothing is invented in reverse. Except in computing, where a lot of solutions seem to always be in search of a problem.
      Your last sentence speaks the truth, but negates your argument. Yes, heavier than air flight was considered impossible, and yet boeing 747s are commonplace. But it all started from a few nutters jumping out of trees.

  2. Is it powered by bovine excretions? by whiledo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The physics behind the warpship is purely theoretical, however. 'Dark energy' needs to be understood and harnessed, plus vast amounts of energy needs to be generated, meaning the warpship is a technology that could only be conceived in the far future. That said, Dr. Obousy's warpship design uses our current knowledge of spacetime and superstring theory to arrive at this futuristic concept.

    Translation: We have a theory based on a lack of theory.

    --
    Moderators: Before moderating a comment Insightful/Informative, check to see if a child post has already refuted it.
    1. Re:Is it powered by bovine excretions? by Red+Flayer · · Score: 5, Funny
      I have a warpship, and the design doesn't need to rely on

      our current knowledge of spacetime and superstring theory to arrive at this futuristic concept

      Instead, the design relies upon our future knowledge of spacetime and superstring[1] theory. That's the nice thing about it... warping space time in a bubble around the ship can result not only in FTL travel, but also time travel. So why should I constrain myself to the currently available theory?

      [1] Also a little bit of sillystring theory, but it gets messy at that point, so I won't go into details.

      --
      "Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
    2. Re:Is it powered by bovine excretions? by The_Wilschon · · Score: 5, Informative

      I actually know this guy (he was a grad student where/when I was an undergrad). He's not crazy and at least mostly not a crank (I only say mostly because it's never possible to judge that sort of thing perfectly). The article, like most crappy science journalism, doesn't really go into details, so I'll try to recall for you all the contents of a talk I heard him give to a small group once.

      The basic idea, which you can probably get from the article, is to construct an Alcubierre bubble or Alcubierre warp drive. The Alcubierre bubble is a genuine solution to the Einstein field equations of general relativity; it is a spacetime metric which could conceivably exist. Part of the trouble with making one is that you (at least naively) need exotic matter of some sort (tachyons, negative mass, etc) in order to do it, but we obviously don't know of any exotic matter at all presently. What you really want is to make spacetime contract ahead of you and expand behind you. Well, we do know of something that makes spacetime expand: dark energy! So, if we had some way of manipulating the local strength of dark energy, then we could make spacetime expand behind us faster than normal and expand in front of us slower than normal (or maybe contract, I can't remember exactly how far that side of things went). There are apparently some suggestive features of superstring theory that indicate that we might be able to use the Casimir effect and/or cause an expansion or contraction of string theory's predicted extra compact dimensions to affect the local strength of dark energy. Here's another failure in memory, as I remember that the Casimir effect and extra dimensions were both involved, but don't remember which one was supposed to affect the other and which was supposed to affect dark energy. This is about all I can remember. My apologies that it is not more complete.

      Now, all this is of course very speculative. It depends on some things being true which might or might not be true. The existence of dark energy is at least strongly indicated by astrophysical data, whether or not it has a local strength is not known at all. The Casimir effect is quite well established. Compact extra dimensions and the rest of string theory remain a very good candidate for physics, but are of course notoriously difficult to test. If all of these things eventually work out, then Richard's ideas should work quite nicely. If any of them don't, then all bets are off; I don't know how his analysis would change then.

      Of course, even a few years ago when I heard all this presented, it was much more thoroughly developed. You have my poor memory to blame for a very incomplete and fuzzy account. I have no doubt he's been developing it further in the last couple of years.

      --
      SIGSEGV caught, terminating

      wait... not that kind of sig.
    3. Re:Is it powered by bovine excretions? by mcvos · · Score: 4, Insightful

      100 years ago, many scientists thought that almost everything had been discovered, and they only needed to work out the details. Turns out there were completely new worlds hidden in those details.

      We know for sure that there are gaps in our scientific knowledge. Who knows what kind of worlds are hidden in those gaps? It's too early to definitively rule out warp travel.

  3. Understand your target audience by Locke2005 · · Score: 4, Funny

    So, they are seeking funding from the same people that invested in the Moller Skycar, then?

    --
    I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
  4. Something about that... by hardwarejunkie9 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This article bothers me primarily because it simply recovers old ground on a theory of the possibility of warp travel. The idea of utilizing dark energy to create waves in space-time is hardly new or original and so what we end up seeing in front of us is a series of explanations about possible "space time bubbles" that we have no idea how to create, or even if they're technically feasible, supplemented by a few minor CAD renderings and a wonderful representation of a planar mesh. Pardon me if I'm not entirely enthused. There seems to be no real mention of any progress since this topic was last covered in the scientific press. In short, while a nice idea, it's an old theory and less than stellar (if you'll pardon the pun). This is more science fiction than science, in my opinion.

    --
    I like losing arguments, it just means that I can take your point and make it my own.
  5. I'm not against thinking outside the box by juanergie · · Score: 5, Insightful

    but this fully speculative article will only confuse people.

    I can already hear my non-scientific-inclined friends assuring that it has been demonstrated by Dr. Blah that faster-than-light travel is absolutely possible and we even have the ship ready.

    When Jules Verne wrote his masterpieces he made it clear that it was scientific fiction, and people thrilled shuffling the pages. He was later called a visionary, but he did not pretend to be a scientist, merely a very intelligent writer.

    It bothers me when plausibly smart people make interesting points but place them in the wrong category - nothing wrong with being smart, creative, and wild but, please, let us distinguish science from speculation.

    --
    Aeroespacio.org
  6. "with astronomical amounts of energy" by starglider29a · · Score: 4, Insightful
    From TFA #2:

    "but by manipulating extra dimensions with astronomical amounts of energy dot dot dot"

    Well, if we could manipulate astronomical amounts of energy, instead of sailing off to Alpha Centauri or Wolf 359, we could:
    • Have rolling roads (a la heinlein and Asimov) and eliminate the need for flying cars or rolling cars
    • Desalinate seawater to irrigate the arid lands
    • Control global climate change, or run a computer cluster model that can disprove it. Pick one.

    But we can't. I know this is a fun dream. But before you try to replicate the Federation, take a look at the world that they were based upon. The Earth of Roddenberry is VERY different than this one. Let us strive to achieve THAT before we strive for the fastest way off of here.

    1. Re:"with astronomical amounts of energy" by fiannaFailMan · · Score: 4, Insightful

      From TFA #2:

      "but by manipulating extra dimensions with astronomical amounts of energy dot dot dot"

      Well, if we could manipulate astronomical amounts of energy, instead of sailing off to Alpha Centauri or Wolf 359, we could:

      • Have rolling roads (a la heinlein and Asimov) and eliminate the need for flying cars or rolling cars
      • Desalinate seawater to irrigate the arid lands
      • Control global climate change, or run a computer cluster model that can disprove it. Pick one.

      But we can't. I know this is a fun dream. But before you try to replicate the Federation, take a look at the world that they were based upon. The Earth of Roddenberry is VERY different than this one. Let us strive to achieve THAT before we strive for the fastest way off of here.

      Imagine charities researching the causes you mention. Now imagine everyone giving a dollar to those causes every time someone repeats the "let's solve all the problems on Earth before we start exploring space" mantra. Those causes would then have enough money to fix all those problems, we'd have our utopia on Earth, and then we'd be free to go on exploring space.

      Personally, between 6 billion of us, I think we should be capable of working on more than one project at once.

      --
      Drill baby drill - on Mars
  7. Re:Only solving half the problem... by Amazing+Quantum+Man · · Score: 4, Informative

    Didn't Novikov solve that problem?

    --
    Fascism starts when the efficiency of the government becomes more important than the rights of the people.
  8. William Shatner said it perfectly by peter303 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    William Shatner: "You know, before I answer any more questions there's something I wanted to say. Having received all your letters over the years, and I've spoken to many of you, and some of you have traveled... y'know... hundreds of miles to be here, I'd just like to say... GET A LIFE, will you people? I mean, for crying out loud, it's just a TV show! I mean, look at you, look at the way you're dressed! You've turned an enjoyable little job, that I did as a lark for a few years, into a COLOSSAL WASTE OF TIME!"

  9. Futurama? by Fry-kun · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "The tricky part is that the ship wouldn't actually move; space itself would move underneath the stationary spacecraft. "
    FTA

    "I understand how the engines work now. It came to me in a dream. The engines don't move the ship at all. The ship stays where it is, and the engines move the universe around it."
    Cubert J. Farnsworth

    --
    Did you know that "FTW" ("for the win") is a direct translation of "Sieg Heil"?
  10. Re:Venture capitalists by EvilToiletPaper · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What was it someone said about "a fool and his money"?

    ... are my best friends

  11. Re:Investors? by fiannaFailMan · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I can't see this venture returning capital on anything that remotely resembles "short term". As such, I envision only government entities or wealthy individuals uninterested in ROI funding a project such as this.

    Honestly, what kind of question could there be about investors in this type of technology? I didn't see anything remotely relevant to a business plan in any of the links.

    I didn't either, but I do see a catastrophic sense of humor failure in your post.

    --
    Drill baby drill - on Mars
  12. Hrmph by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    I think you're just stringing us along.

  13. Re:Only solving half the problem... by bcrowell · · Score: 4, Informative

    I'll give a couple of examples, one using special relativity and one involving some general relativity, to amplify a little on what Geoffrey Landis said above.

    Let's start with a couple of definitions. An "event" in relativity means a combination of time and place. Event B is defined as lying outside event A's light cone if the distance from A to B, in light-years, is greater than the time-difference between A and B, in years.

    Example #1: Suppose that faster-than-light (FTL) were possible. Then it would be possible for event A to cause event B, where B lies outside A's light cone. You could simply travel in your FTL spaceship, starting at A and ending up at B, where you'd deliver a message. But according to special relativity, the time-ordering of events is not as absolute as in classical physics, because observers in different frames of reference disagree on the flow of time. Suppose the original setup was described according to one observer, O1, and now we have a second observer, O2, who is moving relative to O1 at an appreciable fraction of the speed of light. If the speed of the relative motion is high enough, then you can always get a situation where O2 says B happened before A, rather than after A. (This only happens if B is outside A's light cone.) So O1 says A caused B, but O2 says B caused A.

    Example #2: In general relativity, wormhole is a possible way to travel between different places, but since time and space are treated on the same footing in general relativity, there's every reason to believe that if wormholes exist, they would also go between different times, i.e., they would be time machines. But let's suppose for the sake of argument that you come across a wormhole that only goes between different places, with both mouths being synchronized in time. This would seem like FTL without time travel. But such a wormhole can always be used for time-travel as well. One method is to use gravitational fields to accelerate one mouth of the wormhole in some direction, bring it to a stop, and then use a similar acceleration and deceleration to bring it back to where it started. When you do this, you get something exactly like the twin "paradox" of special relavitity; the wormholes' times are no longer synchronized. So now if your no-time-travel FTL has been turned into FTL with time travel.

    There's nothing special about these two examples. The idea that FTL naturally makes time travel possible is tightly bound to the structure of relativity. Since time travel seems to lead to causality paradoxes (e.g., going back in time and killing yourself), the conclusion seems to be that FTL leads to paradoxes, and that makes physicists suspect that FTL isn't actually physically possible.

  14. Obligatory Futurama Quote by baKanale · · Score: 5, Funny

    The Professor: Where's the device that lets to speed up or slow down the passage of time?
    Fry: [pulls out a bong] Under the seat.