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Getting Beyond the Helldesk
An anonymous reader writes "I've been working as a helpdesk monkey for over a year in a small-medium sized law firm of around 200 users and I don't know if my patience and sanity can last much longer. I'd like to remain in IT, but in less of a front-line role where I can actually get some work done without being interrupted every five minutes by a jamming printer or frozen instance of Outlook. There isn't really any room for progression at my current employer, and with the weak job market it seems I can only move sideways into another support role. I've been considering a full-time Masters degree in a specialized Computer Science area such as databases or Web development, but I don't know if the financial cost and the loss of a year's income and experience can justify it. Do any Slashdotters who have made it beyond the helpdesk have any knowledge or wisdom to impart? Is formal education a good avenue, or would I better off moving back home, getting a mindless but low-stress job, and teaching myself technologies in my free time?"
Now's a great time to do your MSc because you can weather the economic storm in academia and pray that the job market will be better when you're out. Heck, you might even get funding so it won't be as much of a financial burden.
...
But that said - What degree do you have that left you stuck on the frontlines of an IT helpdesk? If you don't have a BSc, speak now... (Formal education IS a go
I've noticed that most people are getting smarter, understand technology, privacy, business, free enterprise, propoganda, and are becoming less reliant on help desks, friends, church groups, retailers, and especially the government for help.
Just stick with it, I'm sure it will get better! How bad can it really be, they are just lawyers?
"I say we take off, nuke the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."
" I'd like to remain in IT, but in less of a front-line role where I can actually get some work done without being interrupted every five minutes by a jamming printer or frozen instance of Outlook."
Um. If you are on the helpdesk - unjamming printers and unfreezing outlook is your job. Your work isn't being interrupted every five minutes, but rather you are being called on to do your job every five minutes.
IT is a support function, deal with it or find a different career field.
You seem to be under the misapprehension that it gets better once you are out of the helpdesk. It only looks like it does. You get less stupid end-users, and more stupid bosses.
Get out, now, while you still can. Go get a degree in plumbing, or electrical work. (Heck, if you want to stay with computers, get certified to install fiber. It's only going to grow, and I've had trouble finding anyone to install it in the new house.) Something that doesn't expect you for the rest of your life to be answering the phone at 12:45am on random nights.
Got to run, the pager's going off...
'Sensible' is a curse word.
They have master degrees in "database" and "web development?"
Ahhhh, my Television is moving!!!
First thing you should do is get a first post on Slashdot, like the parent did. Trust me, within the week anonymous here will be getting a call from a fortune 50 company, with a job offer most of us only have wet dreams about. Why do you think people keep getting first posts?!
However, if you're a slow typer (like me), just reply to the first post and you might get a job sharpening Anonymous Coward's pencils, junior pocket protector executive or something. But let me be blunt (like the pencils): nobody got nuttin' in this world for a second post, as Abba sang: 'First Post takes it all'.
Not sure what you get for a last post, maybe a job as a barman, 'last post at the bar gentlemen, please!'
If you really want to stay in IT and don't want to learn a programming language learn a UNIX. Even half way decent UNIX admins are few and far between, I know a number of companies hiring.
Just download a BSD, Linux distro or Open Solaris and use that for your desktop at home. Tinker, read and study and you can get a job out of helpdesk.
Hate to break it to you but you won't necessarily get away from distractions and you may not entirely move away from support. Every job I've ever worked in included distractions and some amount of support work.
I currently work as a software developer but I also work to troubleshoot the existing systems, and I do take second tier customer calls (so less problems, but usually harder ones). I even work shifts and do on-call support. My job's a good one - prestigeous, reasonable pay so I'm not complaining.
That's not to say I would rather be on a help desk, or that you shouldn't try to better yourself. Just make sure your expectations are realistic.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
Go back to school. Have sex with college girls while you still can. Go to any open lectures and take some off the wall classes. Study abroad or save your money for six months and party in Brazil. Meet some people who have lofty ideas, and try to get jobs at companies with the same.
You aren't going to learn anything but how to take shit and wallow in misery at your current job. If you think that's a valuable skill that you need to learn, then stay.
Way back in the day, I worked at Creative Labs tech support, and those of us in higher positions were made to sit on a Helpdesk, consisting of 4 stations. When an agent would get stumped, they'd call the helpdesk and get one of us at random. Now, some of the folks who had to sit on this thing were not the sharpest tools in the shed. So one day, to screw with a particularly stupid self important idiot, I sat next to him, just up the hunt group chain, so that if my phone was busy or didn't answer the call would go to him.
So I turned my phone down to almost no ring volume, and every time my phone would ring, I'd wait til the 3rd ring, point over to his phone, and say "Your phone will ring... now". The dumbass got mad because he couldn't figure out how I was doing it for over an hour.
I did of course, get a "stern" talking to afterward, BUT, the supervisor was doing his best to not laugh his ass off as he was telling me to please not do it again.
Two other things:
1. A masters may not help as a developer. I have a masters but it's in Astronomy and I did it with no intention of taking on Astronomy as a job. Every time I add the qualification to the list, HR takes it back off. I'm not even sure certain HR staff know the difference between Astronomy and Astrology.
2. You might find it easier to get your foot in the door somewhere else rather than try to move into a development role in your current company. If you're already doing a job well, the company has less incentive to move you elsewhere (until they realise you'll leave otherwise, by which time it's too late). It'll be tough in this market.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
First provide me with your employers contact information. Then quit so you'll feel motivated to find somthing else. I'll apply for your old job so you won't feel tempted to go back to it.
http://news.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/04/30/1823242
http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/07/01/173205
http://ask.slashdot.org/askslashdot/08/12/01/0145255.shtml
http://it.slashdot.org/story/09/06/09/2028202/How-Do-IT-Guys-Get-Respect-and-Not-Become-BOFHs?art_pos=2
http://news.slashdot.org/story/09/05/11/0126212/Go-For-a-Masters-Or-Not?art_pos=14
It depends on if you want to be a database one trick pony or a programmer or a sysadmin.
A help desk job is where you cut your teeth for being a sysadmin. If you want to be a dba or programmer, you don't need any experience in the real world. You just go to school and hope it's real life.
If you are interested in being a sysadmin, then understand that you are supporting users, and there are sysadmins supporting you.
Hang out with them and ask them to show you how they do their jobs. Learn about the stuff schools can't and never will be able to afford to teach you. SAN's, Fiber switching, the proprietary tools for HP, Sun, IBM, Dell. Use lunch, free time, smoke breaks, after work- whatever.
Sysadmins always have job offers or know people at other companies with job offers that may not be at their level, but at yours. There is no downside.
Secondarily, you should take advantage of their education program. If it's a law firm, they have one. Put in for your RHCE or LPI or MCSE or whatever the hell it is you're working on. Buy or download the book and make them pay for the tests. A cert will get you more pay than a Master's in anything. Unless you are bucking for middle management or want to write obscure code, a Master's won't do dick.
If you really want to leave though- and you know this because you go home, lay in bed, and literally say "I have to get out of this place" every day- then leave. You ain't gonna learn shit. Follow your gut first, head second.
School is a fine fallback if you have money, but if you don't then guess what. This is your school. You won't ever forget working help desk. People in pain learn their maximum threshold for bullshit, so it's good to learn yours early so you don't spin out when you get a job that actually pays the bills. Helpdesk is hell by repetition. DBA, Sysadmin, and maybe Programmer are hell by catching shit from all sides.
I can't tell you what to do. I can tell you that I, and many of the people here, were in your exact position. If you don't want to kill yourself yet, then you aren't finished. Take advantage of what's around you and then opportunities will open up.
Stay with it , its the people who who are longest in the job that become managers.
Hell, that's good enough reason to quit! Manager of a help desk means you have to take the calls of the screamers who escalate themselves above the first line monkeys, and you take the blame every time you're short staffed because Joe and Jane didn't show up 'cause they're hung-over again.
John
You might consider pursuing a job at a smaller organization where the IT department consists of you, possibly a non-profit. Compensation will be lower but there are often other "benefits" of working non-profit, such as reduced hours or a rewarding culture. These organizations are looking for somebody with experience but realize they can't afford the most experience. You'll get a lot of experience with a wide range of administration, preferably including managing a few servers, although you will still be working with the end users. Variety is wonderful, though.
Due to the current job market this plan may still leave you in your current position for a while, but that could be a good thing for your marketability anyway, as it's good not to look too fickle when an employer doesn't want to have to hire a replacement for you again in another 12-18 months.
There are a few excellent reasons to go to school:
- your field has you using multi-million dollar equipment that you simply cannot access outside of the academic world
- you don't know what you want, and need someone to plot a course through life for you
- you can't read and need to be taught the alphabet
In this field, help-desk, databases, web-development are all the same:
- exceptionally well and accurately documented
- always using very inexpensive or free tools
- catering to intelligent people
If you want to learn web development, grab as many books as you like, read through MSDN and your favourite firefox wiki. Read, tinker, play. Read the HTML specifications. Keep playing. In school, you'd simply have shorter hours, and someone telling you to read chapter 1, then telling you to read chapter 2, then telling you to read chapter 3. Oh yeah, and they'd tell you that you read only 92% of chapter 2.
If you want to learn about databases, install mysql with about ten clicks, and read the mysql documention. It's not a puzzle, it's just a process. By the time you've read the, what 500 pages of syntax, you'll be able to play forever.
You don't need someone else telling you how to do something when it's written down. After all, there aren't that many people who know more about mysql than is written in the documentation. Maybe six of the people who built it. Everyone else simply read the documentation before you. Professors included. The story would be different if your goal were to build databases for enormous applications. But like I tell all of my clients when they ask if my selection of mysql as a database can meet their company's needs: "your company has 500 clients and 10 employees, the database world is concerned with millions of records. we'll talk again after your widget takes over manhattan".
The biggest reason to dodge formal education in these types of areas is that the curiculum is set-in-stone well before you start the course -- actually well before your sign up for the course, and even well before they decide to offer the course. So you're guaranteed to be learning old technologies. In this industry, six months counts as old. This all means that when you're done, and out, you won't have any confidence in your skills simply because you will not have used them in the real world. Academic assignments are useless.
So in the end, you'll have a very valuable piece of paper. It has the following values: .H.R. departments, look for that stuff. These are the same .H.R. departments that wanted 6 years of Java from me when Java was 2 years old. It's actually quite funny, or would be if it weren't so very very sad.
- you spent time and money to acquire it. that alone is an achievement recognized not only by many but will certainly be a point of pride for you.
- some others, namely
Clients will never ask you for credentials, or certificates, or diplomas, or degrees. Clients ask for guarantees, and you don't supply those either in our industry.
So if you really want to do something about your skills, then the following is what you truly desire:
- assistance (not guidance) in acquiring the skills
- a forum for testing and experimenting with those skills
- confidence in those skills
- an understanding of the applications of those skills
Then what you want is a job in a company where you will learn those skills on your own. Offer to work for very little pay. Either for businesses outside of the industry where they will benefit from whatever you actually can produce as you learn to produce it; or for a company in the industry who will gladly help to train you in the hopes that eventually you'll be good enou
you could go back to school & work at the university while you're there. Generally, the IT Departments at universities are pretty big and they give you a good idea of anything you're going to encounter. At my university when someone shows initiative and they're competent and not a douche they pretty much always get the chance to prove themselves - ymmv, but I get the impression that quite a few universities are like this.
If you get on as a student, that's cool, part time, focus on school, show some initiative and try to get a full time job
If you get on as a full timer - awesome for you - most universities offer pretty good benefits, a lot of them include stuff like tuition wavers (full or partial - either way, you're going to end up paying less.)
and finally, working at a university IT department doesn't necessarily mean being in a support role -
our it department has an application development group, a services group (support), a project management group, a system administration/network admin group, a business group that handles contracts & such with other departments/companies, a research computing group (super computers), a dedicated security group, an administration group (payroll), and an HR group. Of those, sysadmins, services, and app devs have to do support. Everyone else is only rarely customer facing. The likelihood that you're going to get into the non-support groups right away is pretty slim, but movement has a tendency to be really fluid.
In case you didn't get the main point of this - the important thing is showing initiative. Show that you're interested in doing something new and interesting - show it by talking to people who do it already and trying to shadow them. Work with your bosses to get involved in projects, do things to get noticed. =)
With a 200 person law firm, you're probably the lowest of 2 or 3 people. Find a position somewhere where you're the jack-of-all-trades -- you do the tech support, server management, web development, purchasing, etc. You'll work long hours because the tech support prevents focused work on the other things, so be prepared. But you'll learn alot if you're driven and you can finally have "Server Administration" or "Web Design" on your resume. It won't get you into Google, but experience may get you a junior admin job.
To find this entry level everything job, look at 100 person or less businesses or colleges. Colleges will be easier as they aren't money driven.
Alternatively, in this job market, go to school.
You could be working with George.
I answered the phones and staffed the front desk at the student help desk when I was in college. It was the best paid student job on campus - $10 per hour your first semester, and a lot of the time you weren't busy and could surf the net or do your homework. There were a few other Computer Science majors there with me, and we got to help out all levels of student, faculty, and staff with their problems. What I took away from that job is not that I dislike working in the service industry, but rather, that there were certain universal truths about end users that I couldn't learn about anywhere else.
The help desk is your opportunity to study the areas where computers and human interactions break down. Learning computer skills in some high level language like Java or C# while working at the help desk is a way to advance your career. Start out with a book, but have goals in mind. Computer Science education is all about leading you to the water. Buy or borrow a few good books, classic computer science texts, etc. Work through the examples and do the exercises when you're not on the phones.
Most importantly, design some UI on paper (I like graph paper for this because you draw a lot of boxes in designing UI). Figure out what you *want* the program to do when you click the buttons. Then use a free program like ant or Visual C# Express and build the UI. Take apart the generated code. Look at it. Study it. Solve a problem that is interesting to you. Do it for fun. If you don't enjoy making programs, then Computer Science is simply not for you. There are plenty of people in CS departments who are very smart and study very hard, but their heart is just not in it. You can tell because they stop writing software when the day is done.
If you want to practice on Linux and you have Windows, you can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 (free) or VMWare player (also free) and install Ubuntu on a virtual drive. Put that virtual drive on a USB key chain or iPod, and you have a mobile development platform that you can take home. The internet is full of human knowledge on the subject of Computer Science and other computer topics. A degree from a reputable college or university is not necessarily a requirement.
But you need to prove to most engineering firms that you have what it takes, and the best paying jobs ($75K+ benefits) usually require solid interviewing and development demonstrations with someone who has 5 to 25 years of development experience and typically a Bachelors or advanced degree in Computer Science, Computer Engineering, Math, Physics, or something equally challenging. A degree won't get you in the door though. We see tons of people straight out of college with their Sc.B. degree who can't solve a problem involving a linked list, binary search on an array, binary search tree, hash table, dealing with memory management, and many other problems you need to be able to solve on your own as an engineer.
I started writing code sometime around the age of 6 in the early 80's because I wanted to make a game. I ended up discovering that game writing is interesting, but what I love to write are tools that interact with pixels and musical notes. Software engineering can be grueling work. In my best weeks, I write hundreds of lines of code. In my worst weeks, I spend long hours debugging and poking and proding and pulling out all the tricks, but get no closer to solving a bug which eventually is found to be something trivial in another part of the code. Highs are higher than in technical support, but lows are awfully low, too.
IT Manager has an opportunity to frame the IT function in terms of ROI when talking to the suits.
Do not underestimate the value of a perception among suits that your role reduces liability or generates revenue.
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
Engineerus Originalus:
At the very pinnacle of the IT world, these are the people who invent the things that the rest of the IT world relies on for THEIR jobs. The ones who truly deserve the word "engineer" in their job titles. They work for places like Intel, Google, Microsoft, Cisco, etc. Getting here requires nothing less than a Master's degree.
Managerius Pseudogeek:
These people got a four-year CS degree and jumped straight into the job market. They lack the rigors of graduate school, and the practical knowledge that comes with real job experience and/or industry certifications. A lot of front-line software developers fall into this category, though all the really good ones actually belong to the species Scholarus Basementi (see below). In a healthy and growing economy, these folks can get jobs in a variety of fields, from webdev to DBA. In a down economy, they are frequently passed over by experienced people who are already in the industry and desperate to do whatever is necessary to stay there. It should be noted that this species belongs to the Genus Managerius because four-year degrees carry power in the corporate world, but these individuals lack the real intellectual rigor to rise to the top of their fields technically. This leaves middle management as the usual endpoint for their careers.
Genericus Certificans:
Probably the single largest species of IT professional, they bear a great superficial resemblance to Scholarus Basementi but lack the distinctive colors, odors, and sounds that Basemeni uses to distinguish itself when interacting socially. Many have two year Associate CS degrees, but the majority can be identified by the way they build their nests out of an accumulation of IT industry certifications. If you look inside their cubicle and find both Project+ AND "IBM Certified Solution Designer" certificates posted up then you know you've identified a Certificans. Older members of the species will still proudly display their Novell CNAs. Virtually all IT professionals with the word "Administrator" in their job title belong to this species, though the ones that self-identify as "BOFH" will desperately try to pass themselves off as Basmenti.
Scholarus Basmenti
This species is entirely self-taught, and their individual skill levels vary wildly. The less able members of this species frequently flock around the more advanced individuals in order to camouflage their weaknesses. These packs of Basmenti, led by an Alpha, are highly territorial and competitive. It is believed that their incessant desire to compete for control over FOSS projects or to get credit for "clever hacks" is rooted in their job insecurity. Those who are not unemployed are often found working entry-level helpdesk jobs. Those who do better economically are typically Alphas who went out and obtained a degree or an industry certification to validate their ample innate talents. Basmenti can easily be distinguished from Certificans when asked about their credentials. While Certificans will speak proudly of their achievements, Basmenti will ridicule their own credentials as "worthless paper" or boast about how they passed their exams hung over without bothering to study. Occasionally, especially talented Basmenti who also show aptitude forming healthy human relationships will be able to obtain Venture Capital and will eventually rise to the very top of the "Foo Chain." Once at this point, they will spend lots of the "Foo's" money to hire members of all three other species, who will look at the unschooled savant with naked resentment and envy.
I'll second this - my previous job wasn't in the IT sector, but it WAS call center and it DID involve a lot of IT; my company was developing new LOB software in-house for which I was consulting, and I was working on some of my own projects involving process-and-procedure documentation and some automation using Office to make up for some of the shortcomings of the new system which the developers could not/would not address.
I was promoted to supervisory status for my above-and-beyond work performance and contributions to the company. I was ecstatic at first - with the burden of constantly taking phone calls lifted, I was free to complete these projects I was working on faster...or so I thought. Managers often seem like idiots because they're dealing with everyone else's problems and have no time for their own. Be careful what you wish for.
...and then I got laid off, along with most of my team (save two people, who where able to relocate) and the entire rest of the building. Wheeeee economy!
CAn'T CompreHend SARcaSm?
I personally would be happy if I could get a competent help desk monkey, but unfortunately after downsizing, I was lucky enough to have help desk monkey added to my network admin responsibilities. I'm going to make some assumptions here: You already have a bachelors degree, your work pays all or part of certification and/or formal education, and you actually like IT work.
First thing you need to do is get exposure to some of the things you think you may like to do in IT. Read about them, talk to admins, dba's, etc. in your own company, or find someone in another company you could talk to about their work.
Once you have a good idea what you want to do, start going to school or training courses for it. Whether you choose online training, night classes, etc. is up to you, but education will help you move out of help desk work.
You will also need hands on work aside from just learning about the trade you pick, so I would suggest (as other have) to load software at home and start working with it. Hands on work is an excellent complement to book learning, and will ensure you know the material.
As far as dealing with your current job while you are working towards your goal, it would help if you changed your attitude towards your work. Instead of getting pissed that you have to unjam paper or help someone with their software, try showing the person how they can fix it themselves. If they don't want to learn it, then that's fine. I think most people would rather not have to call someone and wait for help if they can fix the issue on their own. Get creative. If you are working towards being a DBA or web designer, try setting up a self-service web site where the user can type in a problem and your program lists common fixes. It would be a great way to get the experience you need and definitely something to put on your resume.
Remember that there are a lot of people without jobs, some with families, that would kill to just be getting a steady paycheck. Be thankful.
Move to somewhere with very few people, like the Yukon Territory. That's how I started my IT career when it became obvious that in the big city it didn't matter how good I was, I was looking at doing my time in helpdesk. If you're serious about IT as a career, and can't stand doing your time on the line, that's one alternative. By the end of my 5 years up there I had run a regional ISP, and been the head network person for the Dept of Eduction. Also nothing makes you look good like being able to tell the cliche bear stories. My favorite though is the time the internet went out because a hunter with bad aim missed a moose and hit the waveguide on one of the microwave towers I was using!
Now here's the bad news: :)
I've been doing IT for almost 20 years, I manage the architecture team for a mid sized business with offices in 3 cities and 2 countries, I hold a CISSP and am responsible for the security of the company, and the owners/CEO/Execs STILL asks me to fix their computer. On the plus side I'd say my average between interruptions is down to about 20 mins. The interruptions tend to also be bigger problems. Some days I wish rebooting the PC would solve the tickets that get assigned to me, but my desktop support guy is good at that
Min
On the whole, I find that I prefer Slashdot posts to twitter ones because I don't get limited to 140 chars before
But before you do, listen in the above poster so you can learn the lingo.
Until you can optimize the ROI of a value added function by providing excellence in service provisioning within the ITIL framework, you really haven't lived.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.