Nokia Releases Linux Handset

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Posted by CmdrTaco on Thursday August 27, 2009 @03:15AM from the where's-my-root-prompt dept.

galaxy writes "Nokia releases their first Linux mobile handset, the N900 The handset is based on the latest release of Maemo, the Nokia mobile Linux platform, and includes e.g. GSM and 3G access (with HSPA, giving datarates of up to 10Mbps downlink and 2Mbps uplink on suitable networks), WLAN, Bluetooth, camera, assisted GPS and, most importantly, a touchscreen complemented by a hardware QWERTY under a slider. The beast is powered by an ARM Cortex-A8 processor at 600 MHz, has PowerVR SGX with OpenGL ES 2.0 support, 32GB internal memory etc."

484 comments

how much is it? by alen · 2009-08-27 03:17 · Score: 1

specs are better than the iphone and the interface looks nice. how much is it? I think the $299 price point is the most that most people are willing to pay
1. Re:how much is it? by Plug · 2009-08-27 03:21 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  500, in October..
  That works out to $712 USD as of this post (click for a more up-to-date rate), but that will probably be European style - unlocked and with no contract.
  It will be up to carriers in countries like the US to decide how much to subsidise the phone, over what contract term.
2. Re:how much is it? by jroesner · 2009-08-27 03:22 · Score: 1
  
  Available in select markets in October for about $710 according to Phonescoop. I'm sure that's an unsubsidized price.
3. Re:how much is it? by Plug · 2009-08-27 03:25 · Score: 1
  
  My apologies, Slashdot ate my euro symbol. That's 500 euro.
4. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:26 · Score: 0
  
  Except the $299 isn't the iphone price, the list price here is 650 â (16GB iPhone 3G S).
  The N810 was around 300Ââ at launch so one might guess that the price is 300-600 â.
5. Re:how much is it? by Hellasboy · 2009-08-27 03:29 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  It's headed for T-Mobile. It cleared all the FCC requirements a few weeks ago and the specs list the 1700/2100 band that T-Mobie USA uses.
  
  --
  
  "Tread softly because you tread on my dreams"
6. Re:how much is it? by pak9rabid · 2009-08-27 03:32 · Score: 4, Informative
  specs are better than the iphone and the interface looks nice. how much is it? I think the $299 price point is the most that most people are willing to pay
  How are these specs better then the iPhone 3GS? The 3GS contains:
  
  CPU: ARM Cortex-A8 running at 600 MHz (same as N900)
  Memory: 256 MB (same as N900)
  GPU: PowerVR SGX (same as N900
  Max Internal flash: 32 GB (same as N900)
  Aside from the hardware keyboard, I'm not seeing how it's better hardware-wise.
7. Re:how much is it? by swb · 2009-08-27 03:35 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  You missed the part where it said "it runs Linux". At that point whatever stats it has you multiply by 911 to get the real stats. If comparing to the iPhone, you multiply by 911 *twice* to get the comparison stats.
  Act, Gary, act.
8. Re:how much is it? by tecnico.hitos · 2009-08-27 03:41 · Score: 1
  
  I can only say: Ouch!
  It will translate into a fortune with my country's taxes.
  
  --
  The good, the evil and the vacuum tubes.
9. Re:how much is it? by alen · 2009-08-27 03:43 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  much better camera and 16GB removable SD cards are supported in addition to the internal memory
  i have an iphone 3GS 32GB and if this thing is good in 2 years i'll trade my iphone for it. I like the iphone but it has enough problems for a competitor to come in and take market share.
  My BB Curve has much better battery life than my iphone when comparing push email
  Apple screwed up contacts importation and allows double and triple contact creation. RIM is better at this.
  Apple seems to have taken a cue from Microsoft and if you read the forums, the magic fix is to restore as a new phone. Just like reinstalling Windows.
  I like the iPhone mostly for it's flexibility. i have 150 apps on mine which take up over 1GB of space. with RIM's ancient OS it's impossible to do this. The Pre is still in beta but is looking very promising.
  even though I'm an MCSE, Microsoft is dead in the mobile space. I don't even think they care. They licensed Active Sync to Apple, Palm and Google but you can't access MS Exchange from most WinMo phones or the Zune.
10. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:43 · Score: 0
  
  Way too expensive. I won't buy it and neither will anyone I know or work with.
11. Re:how much is it? by TheRaven64 · 2009-08-27 03:44 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  It's pretty close to the GS, but it's ahead of the earlier ones. One obvious example is the GPU which, prior to the GS, only supported OpenGL 1.1 (i.e. no shaders). One thing I found interesting was:
  
  Built-in FM transmitter
  Given that these are illegal in much of the world (although the relevant laws are not enforced for low-power transmitters), I wonder if this will limit adoption.
  
  --
  I am TheRaven on Soylent News
12. Re:how much is it? by ArcherB · 2009-08-27 03:46 · Score: 5, Informative
  specs are better than the iphone and the interface looks nice. how much is it? I think the $299 price point is the most that most people are willing to pay
  How are these specs better then the iPhone 3GS? The 3GS contains:
  CPU: ARM Cortex-A8 running at 600 MHz (same as N900)
  Memory: 256 MB (same as N900)
  GPU: PowerVR SGX (same as N900
  Max Internal flash: 32 GB (same as N900)
  Aside from the hardware keyboard, I'm not seeing how it's better hardware-wise.
  Up to 1 GB of application memory (256 MB RAM, 768 MB virtual memory)
  Data transfers over a cellular network 10/2Mbps
  Removable battery
  Wide aspect ratio 16:9 (WVGA)
  Video recording file format: .mp4; codec: MPEG-4
  Video recording at up to 848x480 pixels (WVGA) and up to 25fps
  Removable battery
  Video playback file formats: .mp4, .avi, .wmv, .3gp; codecs: H.264, MPEG-4, Xvid, WMV, H.263
  5 MP camera with Carl Zeiss lens and LED flash
  3D graphics accelerator with OpenGL ES 2.0 support
  Removable battery
  32 GB internal storage
  Expandable to up to 48 GB with external microSD card
  Removable battery
  800x480 resolution screen
  Removable battery
  There's more, but I'm tiered of copying and pasting. Don't get me wrong, the iPhone is nice, but these specs are better as far as I know (not sure about the widescreen). Oh, and there's a Removable battery
  --
  There is no "I disagree" mod for a reason. Flamebait, Troll, and Overrated are not substitutes.
13. Re:how much is it? by idontgno · 2009-08-27 03:46 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  € symbol is available by HTML entity: €
  If you just poked it in by keyboard, I think slashcode will eat it.
  Why? Cuz it's slashcode.
  
  --
  Welcome to the Panopticon. Used to be a prison, now it's your home.
14. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:47 · Score: 1, Funny
  
  Of course it's "Slashdot ate my euro symbol" and not "I failed to use preview."
15. Re:how much is it? by jfanning · 2009-08-27 03:49 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Much, much higher resolution screen, 800x480.
16. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:50 · Score: 0
  
  You missed the part where it said "it runs Linux"
  Hate to break it to you, but a lot of people on this site enjoy BSD as much as Linux, as it is a much more free (as in speech) OS. That is what the iPhone is running.
  Of course, I fully admit it is BSD *from apple* which will bias most everyone on this site one way or the other.
17. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:52 · Score: 0
  
  Yes, but will it run Linux?
18. Re:how much is it? by dissy · 2009-08-27 03:52 · Score: 5, Funny
  
  I think you forgot the most important new feature.
  It has a removable battery!
19. Re:how much is it? by tecnico.hitos · 2009-08-27 03:55 · Score: 1
  specs are better than the iphone and the interface looks nice. how much is it? I think the $299 price point is the most that most people are willing to pay
  How are these specs better then the iPhone 3GS? The 3GS contains:
  
  CPU: ARM Cortex-A8 running at 600 MHz (same as N900)
  Memory: 256 MB (same as N900)
  GPU: PowerVR SGX (same as N900
  Max Internal flash: 32 GB (same as N900)
  Aside from the hardware keyboard, I'm not seeing how it's better hardware-wise.
  Up to 1 GB of application memory (256 MB RAM, 768 MB virtual memory) Data transfers over a cellular network 10/2Mbps Removable battery Wide aspect ratio 16:9 (WVGA) Video recording file format: .mp4; codec: MPEG-4 Video recording at up to 848x480 pixels (WVGA) and up to 25fps Removable battery Video playback file formats: .mp4, .avi, .wmv, .3gp; codecs: H.264, MPEG-4, Xvid, WMV, H.263 5 MP camera with Carl Zeiss lens and LED flash 3D graphics accelerator with OpenGL ES 2.0 support Removable battery 32 GB internal storage Expandable to up to 48 GB with external microSD card Removable battery 800x480 resolution screen Removable battery
  There's more, but I'm tiered of copying and pasting. Don't get me wrong, the iPhone is nice, but these specs are better as far as I know (not sure about the widescreen). Oh, and there's a Removable battery
  Is that a webcam in the front? I hope so, Skype calls would be weird otherwise.
  Oh, and do they send an extra stylus? :P
  --
  The good, the evil and the vacuum tubes.
20. Re:how much is it? by Palmateer · 2009-08-27 03:57 · Score: 1
  
  They may be dead in terms of units delivered but certainly not in the number or variety of useful applications available. I have only used HTC WinMo phones with 6.1 Standard and Professional. One of the most compelling features was the seamless Exchange email connectivity. Plus the Office Communicator Mobile and RDP clients. Battery life leaves something to be desired but my CDMA HTC Touch is quite small and light. I wouldn't recommend it for the uninitiated as the UI isn't as friendly as say an iPhone, but the versatility is unmatched in my opinion.
21. Re:how much is it? by twoboxen · 2009-08-27 03:57 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  FM transmitter, micro-USB.
  
  --
  TODO - Insert Creative/Witty Signature
22. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:00 · Score: 2, Funny
  
  > Removable battery
  That does it for me - I'm getting the iPhone!
23. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:04 · Score: 0
  
  You missed the part where it said "it runs Linux". At that point whatever stats it has you multiply by 911 to get the real stats.
  Five seconds with Google found this: http://hackaday.com/2008/11/28/iphone-linux/
  So the iPhone runs Linux, too...
  
  If comparing to the iPhone, you multiply by 911 *twice* to get the comparison stats.
  Oh, I see, I forgot the prejudice coefficient! Now it all adds up. ^_^
24. Re:how much is it? by the_crowbar · 2009-08-27 04:05 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  Low power FM transmitters are very common in the US. Many people use them to connect their MP3 player to their car's radio system. I'm guessing that is what this one is for. With 32GB (or 48GB) of storage you could use this instead of an iPod or other MP3 player.
  Cheers,
  the_crowbar
  
  --
  Have you read the Moderator Guidelines
25. Re:how much is it? by Plug · 2009-08-27 04:07 · Score: 4, Interesting
  
  N900 has a single-touch resistive touchscreen, compared to the iPhone's capactive, multitouch screen. The demo video shows an interesting single-touch zoom method on the N900 - draw a spiral, like winding a display closer or further away.
26. Re:how much is it? by root_42 · 2009-08-27 04:11 · Score: 4, Interesting
  
  Actually the real things that set it apart from the 3GS are the following:
  * Expandable storage with up to 48 GB with external microSD card (vs nothing)
  * 800x480 resolution screen (vs 320x480)
  * Video playback file formats: .mp4, .avi, .wmv, .3gp; codecs: H.264, MPEG-4, Xvid, WMV, H.263 (vs. some Quicktime codecs & FLV, not sure which)
  * Removable battery
  The rest is basically the same, especially CPU and GPU wise. I am not sure about the virtual memory stuff. Might be interesting for multitasking applications, although I am not sure how well this works out on the Maemo platform.
  The iPhone has on the other side the advantage of a really slick interface and IMHO very good usability. We will definitely also buy one or two N900s for development, and so far I haven't seen one in real life. But I am looking forward to compare them to the iPhone in both performance as well as usability. Also I am looking forward to see what the SDK looks like, never worked with Maemo before.
  Cheers.
  
  --
  [--- PGP key and more on http://www.root42.de ---]
27. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:13 · Score: 0
  
  From the hardware specs pages of iPhone and the N900, looks like the iPhone only has Assisted-GPS (useless when there is
  no carrier signal) while the N900 has an integrated GPS with Assited-GPS, so you can use both ur carrier as well as satellites. Thats way more useful than the iPhone.
28. Re:how much is it? by SpooForBrains · 2009-08-27 04:13 · Score: 1
  
  Data transfers over a cellular network 10/2Mbps
  Yeah, bullshit. HSDPA (or HSPA or whatever it's calling itself these days) - is all lovely and fluffy, but it never stands a chance of getting anywhere near those speeds on any real-world network. And if you're not standing stock still, expect it to be barely faster than GPRS.
  5 MP camera with Carl Zeiss lens and LED flash
  My E71 has a 3.2 MP camera with Carl Zeiss lens and LED flash. It's also SHIT. Really, unusably shit. Google "E71 Camera" if you don't want to take my word for it.
  I'm really excited about this handset, but lets not just swallow the marketing whole, OK?
  
  --
  "The dew has clearly fallen with a particularly sickening thud this morning"
29. Re:how much is it? by joaommp · 2009-08-27 04:19 · Score: 1
  
  better than "my dog ate my euro symbol"
  
  --
  Onda Technology Institute
30. Re:how much is it? by jfanning · 2009-08-27 04:31 · Score: 1
  
  About the E71. You do realize you have to press the "T" key to focus it before taking a picture don't you? Then the viewfinder guides turn green.
  And the E71 doesn't have a Zeiss lens. It has the standard Nokia cheap one.
31. Re:how much is it? by Hurricane78 · 2009-08-27 04:46 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  Hmm... what is thin "European" style you are speaking of. I don't know how it's in other European *countries*, but here in Germany, you got two options:
  Either you buy it without any contract or anything (like simlock and branding), and pay the full 500€, or you buy a plan for two years, and depending of the size of that, you will pay between 150€ ($213) and 1€ initially. With branding at the network providers themselves, without branding at independent (and usually cheaper) resellers, and simlock would be a rare surprise to see (perhaps on "prepaid with phone 'plans'")
  But if you wait some months, you usually get it for 50€ ($71) or less.
  
  --
  Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
32. Re:how much is it? by hattig · 2009-08-27 04:46 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  Shame you don't know what you're talking about.
  A-GPS == "integrated GPS with Assited [sic] GPS"
  I.e., it's GPS with Assistance, like the name suggests. Both devices are equivalent.
33. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:47 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  OSX is not "BSD." You have likely heard that some of OSX's userland came from FreeBSD, but the kernel certainly did not.
34. Re:how much is it? by somersault · 2009-08-27 04:51 · Score: 1
  
  you can't access MS Exchange from most WinMo phones
  Windows Mobile devices have supported DirectPUSH since version 5 (my HTC TyTN had it 3 or 4 years ago). I doubt "most" Windows Mobile devices are running on an earlier version of the OS. All of our devices have worked fine with DirectPUSH over the years.
  Perhaps your Exchange server has not been set up correctly: it will need to be at least Exchange 2003, have Outlook Web Access enabled, and have an SSL certificate from a trusted CA (or as we do, simply install an appropriate certificate on each phone so that it can trust the server).
  
  --
  which is totally what she said
35. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:51 · Score: 0
  
  I get all of my Exchange information on my WinMo phone. Contacts, Email, Calendar, Tasks...all of it. Works in both directions. I can be standing in a doctor's office, enter a new appointment on my phone, and when I get to work I'll find it on my calendar in Outlook or on OWA.
  Honestly, I like the WinMo platform better than anything else I've seen at this point. It's mature. There's an app for just about anything I really want to do. If I can't find an app that does what I want I can write it myself and I don't have to have someone else's permission to do it.
  All of this and I don't have to install Apple software on my PC - something I'm unwilling to do. I love my slide-out keyboard that doesn't take over my screen. And I can run multiple apps at once - talk on the phone while checking my calendar then switch to a web browser to look something up or open GoogleMaps to get directions somewhere.
  The biggest downside to WinMo is a little bit of Windows (desktop) grade stability. I do find myself rebooting my phone about once a week. Other than that the only thing I'd really like is a bigger screen and multi-touch - and even multi-touch doesn't draw me all that much considering I >like my stylus.
  All of that said, I'm curious about a linux-based phone. As long as it syncs with Exchange as easily as my WinMo phone I might be convinced to switch.
36. Re:how much is it? by smallfries · 2009-08-27 04:55 · Score: 1
  
  And it has the latest in HCI research - an interaction device that allows tactile feedback on the edges of different controls. It should overcome one of the main limitations in the iPhone touchscreen...
  
  --
  Slashdot: where don knuth is an idiot because he cant grasp the awesome power of php
37. Re:how much is it? by Hurricane78 · 2009-08-27 05:00 · Score: 1
  
  And you don't think a real freakin' keyboard, including the keys that you need for using a shell & co, which the iPhone does not have at all, and real physical tactile functionality, is a killer feature? ^^
  Seriously, no matter how good a phone is. If it has no phone, it is right out of the contest. :)
  
  --
  Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
38. Re:how much is it? by tolan-b · 2009-08-27 05:01 · Score: 1
  
  It's less than the Touch Pro I bought that's got a similar target market I think. That was 617 euros without a contract (yes ouch ;).
  At 500 euros I think it's pretty competitive, you'll see it for 150 with contract before long.
39. Re:how much is it? by Zarf · 2009-08-27 05:01 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Removable battery was mentioned in the parent. This should be redundant not insightful. Oh well, can't expect moderators to read posts before modding them can we?
  Personally, I can't believe no one has mentioned the removable battery now that is a big deal!
  
  --
  [signature]
40. Re:how much is it? by Totenglocke · 2009-08-27 05:04 · Score: 1
  
  .....but there's one overwhelming advantage that the iPhone has in the US - a carrier that actually has a usable network. I realize that some people here whine about AT&T, but I've never met anyone in real life who's had problems with them. Even if you do hate AT&T, you have to realize how utterly pathetic and unusable T-Mobile's network is. Their 3G coverage is like less than 20 square miles.......of the WHOLE US. Just getting a signal to make a regular phone call is hard with T-Mobile once you go outside the major cities.
  Here's their phone coverage http://www.t-mobile.com/coverage/pcc.aspx?WT.z_unav=mst_global_cvg
  Here's their data coverage http://www.t-mobile.com/coverage/pcc.aspx?WT.z_unav=mst_global_cvg
  
  --
  "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
41. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:04 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  You must have a part time job for under 15 year olds.
  *Everyone* I know at my workplace has an iPhone/Blackberry/Nokia Smart phone worth that much or more.
42. Re:how much is it? by xaxa · 2009-08-27 05:08 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Slashcode supports UTF-8. Slashdot doesn't.
43. Re:how much is it? by gtbritishskull · 2009-08-27 05:11 · Score: 1
  
  Whoosh!!!
44. Re:how much is it? by Plug · 2009-08-27 05:11 · Score: 1
  
  I meant that there is an option to buy it unlocked and unbranded. You can't generally buy an iPhone or Palm Pre in that state.
45. Re:how much is it? by BlackCreek · 2009-08-27 05:11 · Score: 1
  
  According to Engadget that is the price *before taxes*
46. Re:how much is it? by tolan-b · 2009-08-27 05:14 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Yeah the iPhone is so free as in speech you can't install arbitrary apps unless you jailbreak it. Also as the other replier to your message mentioned, OSX doesn't have a BSD kernel, it has a Mach kernel with a BSD compat layer and some BSD userland.
47. Re:how much is it? by Bert64 · 2009-08-27 05:15 · Score: 1
  
  What's "office communicator mobile" ?
  The iphone talks to exchange just fine, and it has rdp (and vnc) clients available for it..
  
  --
  http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
48. Re:how much is it? by BlackCreek · 2009-08-27 05:15 · Score: 1
  
  The Nokia has a much higher definition, 800x480. Iphone is 480x320.
49. Re:how much is it? by Bert64 · 2009-08-27 05:18 · Score: 1
  
  You may not have to install Apple software, you have to install Microsoft software instead, something many of us are also unwilling to do...
  But i do agree with you, being forced to install/use something you don't want is not very pleasant, hopefully these linux based phones will follow open standards.
  
  --
  http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
50. Re:how much is it? by tolan-b · 2009-08-27 05:18 · Score: 1
  
  Wooosh!
51. Re:how much is it? by drachenstern · 2009-08-27 05:21 · Score: 1
  
  You and the PP you're quoting seemed to get this part wrong, it's
  
  Maximum speed PS 10/2 Mbps (DL/UL) WLAN IEEE 802.11b/g
  10Mbps over 802.11b/g, not over some wireless network.
  
  --
  2^3 * 31 * 647
52. Re:how much is it? by Bert64 · 2009-08-27 05:21 · Score: 1
  
  The video playback formats can be added to with software updates, there are ports of vlc to both of these phones, and with similar spec processors they should have about the same performance for playing video.
  
  --
  http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
53. Re:how much is it? by Bert64 · 2009-08-27 05:25 · Score: 1
  
  I second that...
  As a european who sometimes visits the US on business, my personal phone roams on AT&T and my work phone roams on t-mobile (since it's supplied by a european version of tmobile)...
  AT&T always seems to have a signal and reasonable quality service, yet i've seen the tmobile phone lose signal or break up calls in manhattan of all places.
  
  --
  http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
54. Re:how much is it? by Mr+Z · 2009-08-27 05:27 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Where's the iPhone's 3GS 5 megapixel camera with flash (and Carl Zeiss optics and integrated lens cap), and 800x480 @25fps video? Oh, wait, iPhone 3GS only goes up to 640x480 on the video and 3 megapixels on the camera, no flash, no lens cap.
  Also, what's the display resolution? The N900 ix 800x480, a whopping 384K pixels. The iPhone 3GS weighs in at a paltry 480x320, sporting less than half the screen real estate at 153K pixels.
  Identical specs indeed.
  
  --
  Program Intellivision!
55. Re:how much is it? by rtfa-troll · 2009-08-27 05:33 · Score: 1
  
  Judging by the way my phone behaved when it's GPS antenna was breaking (reception later broke completely) A-GPS is really great. When in coverage I could lock on pretty much immediately and get an acceptable fix. Without coverage it would just never work. That same calculation works in bad GPS coverage or just when you want it to start fast. Plus, if you have a flat rate data plan A-GPS doesn't cost anything and saves battery (since you can lock on faster you don't have to run GPS all the time). Well recommended. In fact the only thing against it is that I suspect that it makes it difficult to check the GPS receiver in the phones. Remember to turn A-GPS off if you want to test what performance you will get in the Wilderness.
  
  --
  =~ s,(.*),<sarcasm>$1</sarcasm>,g if any_point_you_wish();
56. Re:how much is it? by OeLeWaPpErKe · 2009-08-27 05:35 · Score: 1
  
  Perhaps people who like the specs might consider the openpandora. It's the same hardware, and has a hardware keyboard, but it has no 3G connectivity. It's also a machine focused on emulating old games, and has pretty amazing emulators for that, including a type of joystick.
  If that is what you require, though, it supports 3G usb sticks perfectly well. I'd go with a usb stick personally. Why ? It's upgradeable.
57. Re:how much is it? by roc97007 · 2009-08-27 05:36 · Score: 1
  
  It's got a removable battery!
  And, a real keyboard and a micro-SD slot.
  Things the i-Phone will never ever have.
  
  --
  Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
58. Re:how much is it? by SEWilco · 2009-08-27 05:55 · Score: 1
  
  500 pieces of Hawaiian lava? Well, things are more expensive there than on the mainland.
59. Re:how much is it? by Jazzbunny · 2009-08-27 06:05 · Score: 1
  
  Well of course it has to have removable battery because this beast is made for torrenting porn on the go. Yes I'm buying one myself.
60. Re:how much is it? by wasabii · 2009-08-27 06:08 · Score: 1
  
  SDK? Funny.
  It's Linux. With Debian. You build .deb packages and install them. Really. That's it.
  The UI, at this point, is still Gtk+ based. Hildon. They're changing it to Qt though.
  So.. really. You just write normal Linux apps for it.
61. Re:how much is it? by Runaway1956 · 2009-08-27 06:20 · Score: 2, Funny
  
  Bad dog! Get off my lawn!! And, take your dumb kid with you!
  
  --
  "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
62. Re:how much is it? by JernejL · 2009-08-27 06:21 · Score: 1
  
  superior camera and a real physical keyboard, i call that: superor.
63. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:22 · Score: 0
  
  If it's anything like the previous nX00 devices it can boot directly into a custom root filesystem off MMC which means you can install ubuntu-arm (also released in october) on a MMC card and dual boot into it any time you want. And all the hardware already works in linux, because it runs linux.
64. Re:how much is it? by Runaway1956 · 2009-08-27 06:26 · Score: 1
  
  "but only to americans"
  Some Americans, anyway. No one in my family has a contract. We use the cheapo phones sold with a pre pay plan. Even the cheapos are getting to be moderately sophisticated - especially if you bear in mind that when I was growing up, about the only people with portable telephones were President Kennedy, and James Bond. Oh yeah, don't forget Dick Tracy!! ;^)
  
  --
  "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
65. Re:how much is it? by irockash · 2009-08-27 06:28 · Score: 1
  
  Which is pretty interesting, since most manufacturers will go with AT&T's 850/1900 UMTS mix. Nokia does release a "North America" version for its high end phones with these bands... it's weird to see it already on a phone. If you want a little farther explanation, Phone Scoop has a visual guide.
66. Re:how much is it? by More_Cowbell · 2009-08-27 07:03 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Well... I'd have to say maybe, but it's certainly not limited to T-Mobile.
  Scroll down to 'Operating frequency'
  * Quad-band GSM EDGE 850/900/1800/1900
  * WCDMA 900/1700/2100 MHz
  My guess is it will be sold unlocked in the US, much like many of their high end phones.
  
  --
  Experience teaches only the teachable. -AH
67. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 07:11 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  Multitasking.
  800x480 resolution.
  Multitasking.
  Multitasking.
  All the apps I use on my N800 are free (1000s of them) - no app-pay-me-store needed.
  mplayer works.
  Skype works.
  Flash and javascript work.
  Pidgin works.
  Clam works.
  rss feeds work.
  I've never visited a website that didn't work, including the full Zimbra webmail with javascript.
  Google Voice works.
  Google Maps work.
  GPS works without a cell tower around too.
  Any questions?
68. Re:how much is it? by koiransuklaa · 2009-08-27 07:34 · Score: 1
  
  My E71 has a 3.2 MP camera with Carl Zeiss lens and LED flash. It's also SHIT. Really, unusably shit.
  It's not a Zeiss actually, it's just shit.
69. Re:how much is it? by nschubach · 2009-08-27 07:34 · Score: 1
  
  I read that out loud and thought: "My dog ate my gyro"
  
  --
  Every time I start to have faith in humanity, I ruin it by driving to work between 7 and 8 am.
70. Re:how much is it? by wall0159 · 2009-08-27 07:36 · Score: 1
  
  I realise you meant that as a joke, but if the platform is Linux you'll actually be able to _use_ the hardware you buy -- sounds like a better spec to me!
71. Re:how much is it? by Zen+Hash · 2009-08-27 07:40 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Also I am looking forward to see what the SDK looks like, never worked with Maemo before.
  http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide
  
  Nokia also hosts VM images with the development environment already setup. http://tablets-dev.nokia.com/maemo-dev-env-downloads.php
  
  --
  Here I sit, all broken hearted.
  Came to poop, but only farted.
72. Re:how much is it? by harmonise · 2009-08-27 07:42 · Score: 1
  
  It has a removable battery!
  Hans Reiser will be pleased.
  
  --
  Cory Doctorow talking about cloud computing makes as much sense as George W Bush talking about electrical engineering.
73. Re:how much is it? by rthomanek · 2009-08-27 07:48 · Score: 1
  
  Shame you did not really understand what the AC said and chose to nitpick instead. The AC was right and pretty precise in his description.
  There is no real GPS in iPhone. There is a real GPS in this Nokia device. If you are still having a hard time understanding what the difference between them is, go check some navigation software for mobile phones. Take a close look at its accuracy (or lack thereof).
  Even funnier: check some recent Ericsson phone (C905), they have Google Maps installed -- a special build that can use the internal GPS. If you download Google Maps from Google website, you get a different version that is unable to use the GPS.
  BTW, "A-GPS" means exactly nothing. It's a marketing terms.
74. Re:how much is it? by navyjeff · 2009-08-27 08:20 · Score: 1
  
  Low power FM transmitters are legal in the US if their measured field strength is under 250 microvolts/meter at 3 meters. I believe the requirements in Canada are less stringent, but the UK requirements are similar. The EU may adopt a measure that allows only lower power, but hasn't yet AFAIK.
  
  http://www.fcc.gov/ftp/Bureaus/Mass_Media/Databases/documents_collection/pn910724.pdf
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FM_transmitter_(personal_device)
75. Re:how much is it? by AliasMarlowe · 2009-08-27 08:30 · Score: 1
  
  My E71 has a 3.2 MP camera with Carl Zeiss lens and LED flash. It's also SHIT. Really, unusably shit. Google "E71 Camera" if you don't want to take my word for it.
  The E71 is the shittiest shit that a shitter ever shat. Shitty battery life, shitty camera (with a shitty non-Zeiss lens, BTW), and a shitty UI. The internal qwerty keyboard was OK for a few months, now one key is dead, and another two are jammed. The external telephone keypad has a major design failure - the keys used in combination to lock/unlock the keypad stick up further than the others, guaranteeing that the combo is pressed with the phone in your pocket, with variable results (black photos or videos, inadvertent outgoing calls, drained battery). My employer inflicts this shit on me, alas. A couple of colleagues "lost" or "accidentally broke" their E71s, to find the replacement was a brand new E71.
  
  --
  Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. - Voltaire
76. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 08:38 · Score: 0
  
  you can bet your ass multitasking works very well. It already works great on the N810. The N900 with lots more MHz and RAM and improved OS will be even better for sure.
77. Re:how much is it? by nolifetillpleather · 2009-08-27 08:51 · Score: 0
  
  His Gyro is Gone
78. Re:how much is it? by BikeHelmet · 2009-08-27 09:01 · Score: 1
  
  It's running Linux, which means less OS overhead and easier access to the hardware.
  I know some people will argue that the specs are identical, but that's like saying a single-core Vista computer with 512MB of RAM is just as fast as a single-core XP computer with the same amount of RAM. It simply isn't true, despite what the specs say.
79. Re:how much is it? by nashv · 2009-08-27 09:09 · Score: 1
  
  Incidentally, that winding gesture has existed on HTC phones running Windows Mobile 6.1 for about 2 years now in the picture album application.
  
  --
  Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem.
80. Re:how much is it? by PixetaledPikachu · 2009-08-27 09:27 · Score: 1
  
  FM transmitter, micro-USB.
  I hate micro usb. I used to be able to carry a single cable for my phone, card reader, ext hard drives, camera, etc etc... Now I have to bring yet another cable just for the phone. I'm so glad that the Nokia E-series stick with mini-usb
81. Re:how much is it? by xeno · 2009-08-27 09:28 · Score: 1
  
  Bollocks. I've had T-Mo for years, and never had a problem with coverage except in the wilds of rural Nebraska (where AT&T has no signal, and even Sprint is roaming on some local podunk telco). Oh, yeah. I also have no signal in the basement parking garage three levels down.
  Please. With T-mo and a decent phone**, I had good usable signal just about everywhere I travel... every US metro area, every town big enough to have a McDonalds, all up and down both coasts, fercrissakes my phone even rings when inflight between Seattle & Portland when I've forgotten to turn it off because the coverage on the i-5 corridor is so strong. I got clear signal all cross India and a dozen other countries, roamed seamlessly between Israel and Syria (a diplomatic feat), and my father rang me up when I was on Grimsey above the Arctic circle on the north side of Iceland... and he thought I was at home because the signal was crystal clear.
  Sooo..... exactly where is it you commute from? And why do you travel by tunnel-boring machine?
  That said, my smartphone has better reception than most. I truly dig the **Sony Ericsson P1i. It doesn't have a catchy name, but it does have the smallest full-qwerty keyboard in any smartphone, and the usual field of email/unified msg, web, office/doc, mapping, wifi/voip, photo/video stuff. Sadly, with the demise of SymbianUIQ and lack of updates, I'll be in the market for a new device (and because I travel a lot, CDMA is a non-starter). I paid $500+ for an unlocked P1i when it came out, and if the N900's reception is as good as the P1i, I'll be buying it too. I might even consider getting off my soapbox and getting a locked one if it saves me a few hundred. Maybe.
  
  --
  I think not...(*poof*)
82. Re:how much is it? by fuqqer · 2009-08-27 09:29 · Score: 1, Troll
  
  *The 5 Megapixel camera with flash.
  
  *The 800x480 screen resolution.
  
  *TV-OUT
  
  *FM Transmitter for wireless stereo access.
  
  *Internal storage is 32GB, plus the microSD slot adds another 16GB of capacity (soon to be 32GB, when sandisk releases 32GB micro sdhc cards)
  
  *Flash support with a real browser
  
  *24 fps video Most importantly though, IT'S NOT AN APPLE PRODUCT!
83. Re:how much is it? by Totenglocke · 2009-08-27 09:56 · Score: 1
  
  Even if you have a decent signal for talk / texting, how's that non-existent 3G working for you? Sorry, but it's ridiculous to think people can realistically do email / web apps over EDGE.
  
  --
  "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
84. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 09:59 · Score: 0
  
  You are wrong. iPhone 3G and 3Gs has real GPS.
85. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 12:16 · Score: 0
  
  Aside from the hardware keyboard, I'm not seeing how it's better hardware-wise.
  Umm... because you only listed the specs that are equal and conveniently ignored the ones where N900 has more:
  * 5-megapixel digital camera (iphone 3gs 3.2 mp)
  * Carl Zeiss optical lens
  * Dual LED flash (iphone 3gs none)
  * 800 × 480 resolution video recording (iphone ... etc.)
  * 3.5" WVGA display
  * 800 × 480 resolution
  * Tactile and onscreen QWERTY keyboards
  * Removable battery
  Go hide somewhere iTroll!
86. Re:how much is it? by edxwelch · 2009-08-27 12:21 · Score: 1
  
  "One obvious example is the GPU which, prior to the GS, only supported OpenGL 1.1 (i.e. no shaders)"
  that dinstiction is pretty theoretical as to date there are no games in iPhone, nor any other mobile platform that actually use shaders.
87. Re:how much is it? by fuqqer · 2009-08-27 12:28 · Score: 1
  
  Good troll sir!
  
  I don't think I've ever seen so many responses to a blatantly stupid comment. You even got me once!
88. Re:how much is it? by Brain+Damaged+Bogan · 2009-08-27 12:34 · Score: 1
  
  how the hell did this fanboyism get modded informative??? cpu: same memory: same, wait... no... the n900 also uses up to 768Mb virtual memory, and since the 32gb memory is flash memory it should work just as fast as the 256Mb RAM... not to mention that since it's linux it won't be long before somebody out there figures out how to repartition the drives and add some extra swap space. gpu: same max internal flash: same, wait... nice use of the words "max INTERNAL flash", the iPhone doesn't have ANY external flash... the n900 has a microSD slot allowing you to expand your storage to 48Gb. camera: iphone 3gs = 3mp, n900 = 5mp keyboard: as you metioned there is an actual keyboard, so you can actually tell which damn button you are pressing. conclusion: the hardware is FAR superior to the iphone
  
  --
  -- Sex is the antonym of pringles. Once you pop it's time to stop.
89. Re:how much is it? by thethibs · 2009-08-27 14:18 · Score: 1
  
  First-off, like me, you aren't cool enough to have an iphone. That said, the iphone isn't even in the N900's league.
  You get a souped-up N810 (ipod on steroids and linux, $200), 3G phone ($250), GPS ($200), Five-megapixel camera with Zeiss Lens ($250), all for $700. I'd say a great deal better.
  
  --
  I'm a Programmer. That's one level above Software Engineer and one level below Engineer.
90. Re:how much is it? by mvdwege · 2009-08-27 18:50 · Score: 1
  
  Since the E71 only has one keypad, an external QWERTY one, I'm calling you a liar.
  Mart
  
  --
  "I know I will be modded down for this": where's the option '-1, Asking for it'?
91. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 18:59 · Score: 0
  
  - iPhone 3GS screen resolution is 480x320.
  - Nokia N900 screen resolution is 800x480.
  There are some other features also if you care to check out the spec.
92. Re:how much is it? by 10Ghz · 2009-08-27 20:58 · Score: 1
  
  specs are better than the iphone and the interface looks nice.
  
  There are more to phones that just specs and screenshots. Or do we buy cars based solely on which car has more HP?
  My Nokia E71 has good specs as well. expandable memory, WiFi, web-browser etc... But it's still crap when compared to my 1st gen iPod touch. Just because device has certain features does not mean that those features are actually usable.
  Of course it remains to be seen how good those features are on the device, but we can't just stare at specs on a screen and say "it's better than this other device".
  
  --
  Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.
93. Re:how much is it? by 10Ghz · 2009-08-27 21:00 · Score: 1
  
  Aren't both iPhone and pre unbranded? iPhone at least has no AT&T-stickers on it or something.
  
  --
  Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.
94. Re:how much is it? by apeteryx · 2009-08-27 21:07 · Score: 1
  
  Pricing is important. The top Nokia (N97), the blackberry and iphone are all around $NZ 800 -- 1000 unlocked. The HTC magic (Android G2 is the same price as the iphone... What we are facing is competition. Nokia (correctly, INHO, having used a N95) realises symbian does not "cut it" @ the high end. Maemo might -- the RIM OS needs work, PalmOS is no longer developed and Windows is worse. I want to play with this: good camera, GPS, and if it is functional as a communications 3G/wifi device it can replace the camera, basic cellphone and Eee I use when travelling. But it has to hit the right price point. And that is around the point where you don't have to think much about it: the iphone and magic are $319 -- 639 on a 2 month contract in NZ (depends on what contract you sign) and that makes buying them reasonable
  
  --
  Chris Gale Dunedin, New Zealand. http://www.pukeko.net.nz
95. Re:how much is it? by jfanning · 2009-08-27 21:28 · Score: 1
  
  You are right. Both the N900 and iPhone have a real GPS chip in them. The main difference is that the N900 (Ovi Maps) can be operated without a network connection since you can pre-load the country maps. The iPhone always needs a network connection to get the maps from Google. That is unless you use the new TomTom app or equivalent.
96. Re:how much is it? by SpooForBrains · 2009-08-27 21:28 · Score: 1
  
  Yup, know about the "t" thing (which, wtf?). Camera is still shit.
  
  --
  "The dew has clearly fallen with a particularly sickening thud this morning"
97. Re:how much is it? by teh+kurisu · 2009-08-27 21:39 · Score: 1
  
  The reason for this is that mobile phone manufacturers have agreed to standardise on micro-USB for charging. Sure, it means you'll need another cable now, but it means you'll never have to worry about having the wrong charger again.
98. Re:how much is it? by teh+kurisu · 2009-08-27 21:53 · Score: 1
  
  BTW, "A-GPS" means exactly nothing. It's a marketing terms.
  
  It does mean something, you just don't know what it is. A-GPS does not replace 'real' GPS, it is a technique for getting a quicker fix on the GPS signal that uses data provided by your current cell. Without A-GPS, it can take a few minutes to get a fix. With A-GPS, a few seconds.
  The original 2G iPhone did not have GPS, and relied on cell and WiFi locations. The iPhone 3G and 3GS have 'real' GPS and use A-GPS for quick fixes.
99. Re:how much is it? by RockDoctor · 2009-08-27 22:18 · Score: 1
  
  My apologies, Slashdot ate my euro symbol.
  It's SlashDot that owes us (it's users) an apology, not you (or any other user) owing an apology to SlashDot for trying to use it.
  (I'd be slightly mollified if SlashDot's masters mentioned the need for HTML entity coding in the "Allowed HTML" footer, with examples, but this seems too multi-cultural for SlashDot's California-Basement-Dwelling Overlords.
  
  --
  Birds are not dinosaur descendants;birds are dinosaurs, for all useful meanings of "birds", "are" and "dinosaurs"
100. Re:how much is it? by teh+kurisu · 2009-08-27 22:24 · Score: 1
  
  The physical keyboard on these Nokias is the biggest reason that I won't be buying one. I'm too used to the iPhone soft keyboard. It requires a feather touch to activate a key (no sore thumbs from having to push a physical key down), and it's very forgiving if I miss a key. I've yet to find a physical keyboard that handles gracefully my hitting two keys at once. And I have the opportunity to change the function of the keys based on context or the language that I'm using.
  The layout of the Nokia keyboard is also pretty awful. It's way too wide and there's too much lateral thumb movement required (at least on the iPhone you get a choice of portrait vs landscape), and the location of the space bar is awkward. The layout of the keys isn't even proper QWERTY - the keys are lined up vertically which I find is really irritating to type on.
  I don't mind people saying they prefer hardware keyboards, because that's your opinion and it's just as valid as mine. But stop acting like a phone with a hardware keyboard is objectively better than one with a soft keyboard, because it's not.
101. Re:how much is it? by Plug · 2009-08-28 06:14 · Score: 1
  
  Unbranded maybe (I'm not in the US so can't comment), unlocked, no.
102. Re:how much is it? by sjames · 2009-08-28 06:52 · Score: 1
  
  The more compact removable battery is a big deal. Not only can you keep a spare charged and ready, if it goes unstable, you can throw the battery much further so it can explode harmlessly in your back yard.
  I'm just waiting to hear of someone charged with terrorism because they threw a "grenade disguised as an iPod" in the airport.
103. Re:how much is it? by centuren · 2009-08-28 06:59 · Score: 1
  
  Well... I'd have to say maybe, but it's certainly not limited to T-Mobile.
  Scroll down to 'Operating frequency'
  * Quad-band GSM EDGE 850/900/1800/1900
  * WCDMA 900/1700/2100 MHz
  My guess is it will be sold unlocked in the US, much like many of their high end phones.
  This is what history seems to have shown. For some reason the great Nokia phones don't get pushed by the major US carriers, unfortunately leaving consumers to face the price of a new computer.
104. Re:how much is it? by Kelvie · 2009-08-28 07:26 · Score: 1
  
  I did not know this; I was wondering why all my pictures turn out like crap. Thank you.
105. Re:how much is it? by DaVince21 · 2009-08-28 14:44 · Score: 1
  
  That much? Seems like the low cost of Linux went into the high cost of developing the software for it instead...
  
  --
  I am not devoid of humor.
106. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-28 17:38 · Score: 0
  
  Better screen. And BY FAR better software. (Apple fans seem to like Apple's.. I think they'd call it "integrated"... experience. But I consider it closed and restricted. The N900 will not be restricted).
107. Re:how much is it? by jfanning · 2009-08-29 00:22 · Score: 1
  
  Well, they still might look like crap, but it does improve them quite a lot.
  It is possible to get reasonable pictures with the E71. I have taken extremely good ones at times, but the camera does not have good exposure control and the white balance is off at times. I have found that giving the camera a few seconds to settle down helps quite a lot.
  I have heard that the latest firmware improves things, but I haven't upgraded yet.
  It is also possible to get location tagging via the GPS with the E71. Just download and install Location Tagger from Nokia Betalabs.
  http://betalabs.nokia.com/betas/view/location-tagger
108. Re:how much is it? by MasterMnd · 2009-08-29 01:34 · Score: 1
  
  Well... I'd have to say maybe, but it's certainly not limited to T-Mobile. Scroll down to 'Operating frequency' * Quad-band GSM EDGE 850/900/1800/1900 * WCDMA 900/1700/2100 MHz My guess is it will be sold unlocked in the US, much like many of their high end phones.
  Perhaps, but even so, the 3G will only work on T-Mobile, just like the G1. For 3G AT&T uses 850/1900 while T-Mobile uses 1700/2100.
109. Re:how much is it? by More_Cowbell · 2009-08-29 09:58 · Score: 1
  
  Did you forget to read what you quoted? 850/1900 are two of the frequencies the phone operates on...
  
  --
  Experience teaches only the teachable. -AH
110. Re:how much is it? by MasterMnd · 2009-08-29 12:52 · Score: 1
  
  Did you forget to read what you quoted? 850/1900 are two of the frequencies the phone operates on...
  The phone operates on 850/1900 in EDGE mode only (same as the G1), but 3G (WCDMA) is limited to 900/1700/2100 which will work for T-Mobile but not AT&T.
111. Re:how much is it? by More_Cowbell · 2009-08-29 15:11 · Score: 1
  
  Citation please?
  
  --
  Experience teaches only the teachable. -AH
112. Re:how much is it? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-30 08:09 · Score: 0
  
  800x480? I'm not sure in what other ways it could be considered better.
113. Re:how much is it? by MasterMnd · 2009-08-30 22:26 · Score: 1
  
  Apparently I should have said HSPA not WCDMA, since that's the highest rate protocol while WCDMA has only slightly faster data rates then EDGE.
  Look at the "Data Network" part of the specifications:
  GPRS class A, multislot class 32, maximum speed 107/64.2 kbps (DL/UL)
  EDGE class A, multislot class 32, maximum speed 296/177.6 kbps (DL/UL)
  WCDMA 900/1700/2100. Maximum speed PS 384/384 kbps (DL/UL)
  HSPA 900/1700/2100. Maximum speed PS 10/2 Mbps (DL/UL)
  
  EDGE (which is the only protocol that this phone supports in the 850/1900 frequency range) is limited to 296kbps down. To get higher speeds you need HSPA, which this phone only supports on but only on 900/1700/2100, but not AT&T's 850/1900 frequencies.
114. Re:how much is it? by drb_chimaera · 2009-08-31 00:59 · Score: 1
  
  My year-old E71 uses Micro-USB, as does my finacee's E75...
115. Re:how much is it? by Tuntematon · 2009-08-31 02:27 · Score: 1
  
  There are more to phones that just specs and screenshots. Or do we buy cars based solely on which car has more HP?
  My Nokia E71 has good specs as well. expandable memory, WiFi, web-browser etc... But it's still crap when compared to my 1st gen iPod touch. Just because device has certain features does not mean that those features are actually usable.
  Of course it remains to be seen how good those features are on the device, but we can't just stare at specs on a screen and say "it's better than this other device".
  I would say your E71 makes better phone calls. Also it's good to compare apples and oranges.
  
  --
  By Tuntematon
116. Re:how much is it? by freddie.benjamin · 2009-09-01 01:06 · Score: 1
  
  yes finally someone noticed the linux part. i scrouged this discussion to find it so that i am not reposting how gr8 it is that the 900 is going to run Linux.cant wait for this...though i might have to give up dinner for 6 months to afford it.
Releases? by gmuslera · 2009-08-27 03:17 · Score: 1, Troll

When? Coming soon is not releasing... yet.
1. Re:Releases? by jfanning · 2009-08-27 04:33 · Score: 1
  
  I think it was October this year.
2. Re:Releases? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:47 · Score: 0
  
  it's right around the corner, just like duke nukem forever... oh wait. :)
3. Re:Releases? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 14:56 · Score: 0
  
  Nokia has officially said it will be October you dork.
4. Re:Releases? by AVee · 2009-08-27 20:23 · Score: 1
  
  Sure, but at least Duke Nukem 3D is already available: http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/duke3d/
Impressive hardware by gmuslera · 2009-08-27 03:22 · Score: 0, Troll

Their website seem to be running on one of those phones. From fully responsive to slashdotted in 10 secs.
1. Re:Impressive hardware by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:43 · Score: 0
  
  If the web server on the phone can't handle a slashdotting then it's not the phone for me.
2. Re:Impressive hardware by jfanning · 2009-08-27 03:51 · Score: 1
  
  Yep, 1 million hits in 50 minutes will tend to do that.
Design?! by DaleCooper82 · 2009-08-27 03:23 · Score: 2, Funny

But looking at the phone picture, the design is not very much attractive, is it? Just scroll to top of the page
- it is right there above Linux Penguin.
This is Slashdot, we are not supposed to click on TFA link to see more details....

--
:: There is no light at the end of a tunnel. There is a tunnel after a tunnel : Thom Y. ::
Re:WiFi? by Plug · 2009-08-27 03:23 · Score: 1

It's a mobile internet device that does telephony, not a phone. Phone capability is quite low on their feature list! And yes, it supports wifi..
Too lazy? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:23 · Score: 1, Informative

FTFA:

* 3.5G and WLAN connectivity
* Quadband GSM with GPRS and EDGE
* Data transfers over a cellular network 10/2Mbps
* Data transfers over Wi-Fi 54Mbps
* Flash 9.4 support
* Full-screen browsing

Dumbass.
Re:WiFi? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:25 · Score: 0

WLAN == WiFi
Sigh by epiphani · 2009-08-27 03:26 · Score: 1, Funny

32GB internal memory etc.
If it has 32GB of internal memory, bend me over and call me nancy.
memory != storage. Please don't do that.

--
.
1. Re:Sigh by Aranykai · 2009-08-27 03:37 · Score: 1
  
  Your right, 256MB memory with 768MB virtual. It as 32GB of internal storage. You editors should know better.
  
  --
  If sharing a song makes you a pirate, what do I have to share to be a ninja?
2. Re:Sigh by capnkr · 2009-08-27 03:38 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Dearest Nancy -
  
  It uses flash memory as it's storage method. Call it memory or storage, whichever you prefer, & it doesn't matter, since it's both...
  
  FTFW:
  
  Mass memory
  
  * 32 GB internal storage
  * Store up to 7000 MP3 songs or 40 hours of high-quality video
  * Up to 16 GB of additional storage with an external microSD card
  
  --
  "...there are some things that can beat smartness and foresight. Awkwardness and stupidity can." ~ Mark Twain
3. Re:Sigh by capnkr · 2009-08-27 03:40 · Score: 1
  
  Re: above, in my writing - 'method' should be 'medium'. Or perhaps 'media'. You pick, I don't care. ;)
  
  --
  "...there are some things that can beat smartness and foresight. Awkwardness and stupidity can." ~ Mark Twain
4. Re:Sigh by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:44 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_(computers)
  FTL: "Computer data storage, often called storage or memory, refers to computer components, devices, and recording media that retain digital data used for computing for some interval of time."
  elitist != superior. Please don't do that.
5. Re:Sigh by randallman · 2009-08-27 03:48 · Score: 1
  
  Guess you missed that episode of IT Crowd.
  Jokes aside, this is an example of the poor terminology used in the computer systems field. Storage is memory so that's OK, but can be confused depending on its context. I think the relevant difference is persistent vs. volatile memory; so maybe we should use terms such as P-MEM AND V-MEM. It's about time we came up with some proper terms. I'm tired of hearing things like "Just plug the jump drive into the front of the CPU."
  BTW, I paid $400 for my N800 when it came out and would pay between $600-$800 for this since it's also a good still/video camera, gps and phone.
6. Re:Sigh by darthflo · 2009-08-27 04:02 · Score: 1
  
  I'm tired of hearing things like [...] it's a [...] gps
  Right.
7. Re:Sigh by randallman · 2009-08-27 04:15 · Score: 1
  
  Would you care to elaborate?
  On the one hand CPU is an acronym for a specific item and to use it as a reference to an entire system is unacceptable even from a layman's point of view. It is unavoidably confusing in nearly every context.
  And the terms you chose to criticize:
  * video/still camera
  * gps
  * phone
  Those are not ambiguous, confusing or misused in describing the N900's functions, especially in the context of this article.
8. Re:Sigh by darthflo · 2009-08-27 05:39 · Score: 1
  
  The N900 is a video/still camera, a phone, a portable computer -- it's a lot of things, but it is by no means a Global Positioning System (i.e. a network of several sats orbiting the earth broadcasting a signal allowing GPS receivers just like the N900 to quite precisely determine your position). It's like calling your modem "the Internet". It's a device providing access to the big network/system, not the net/sys itself.
9. Re:Sigh by Ant+P. · 2009-08-27 05:52 · Score: 1
  
  Since it's running Linux, you could put a 30GB swapfile on there if you wanted to.
10. Re:Sigh by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:09 · Score: 0
  
  Also, no apostrophe in it's. Shitcock.
11. Re:Sigh by randallman · 2009-08-27 06:28 · Score: 1
  
  Correct, but in the context GPS is obviously short for GPS Receiver as nobody would mistakenly understand that it comes with satellites too. There's never any confusion when someone says they have a GPS Nav in their car or that their phone has a GPS. Very unlike the CPU example I gave which is altogether incorrect. Context DOES matter and allows for some level of inexactness. Otherwise, communication would be too cumbersome. And that was my point. I get confused when a semi-knowledgeable computer user says their "CPU is broken" because it's confusing even in the context of computer systems.
  The original post was about misinterpretation and/or misuse of the term "memory". It was ambiguous to slashdot users and in my experience this happens too frequently in computer system discussions among both laymen and professionals. I think it's somewhat to blame on the lack of sufficient terminology.
12. Re:Sigh by teh+kurisu · 2009-08-27 22:38 · Score: 1
  
  Short-term/long-term memory? The analogy works, and they're terms that everybody understands.
13. Re:Sigh by teh+kurisu · 2009-08-27 22:43 · Score: 1
  
  This makes me think of the Halfords sponsor ads on Dave, where the cartoon man says, "Your MP3 plugs in here..."
  Bloody luddites!
Re:WiFi? by Old97 · 2009-08-27 03:26 · Score: 2, Informative

RTFA, It does.

--
Very often, people confuse simple with simplistic. The nuance is lost on most. - Clement Mok
Re:WiFi? by Clandestine_Blaze · 2009-08-27 03:27 · Score: 1

I could be wrong, but I think it has Wi-Fi. Looking at the link provided by the summary:

For the first time get high-speed broadband that's as fast as an internet connection at home. Enjoy rich interactive content across the web and view pages the way they should be seen with stunning full-screen browsing.
* 3.5G and WLAN connectivity
* Quadband GSM with GPRS and EDGE
* Data transfers over a cellular network 10/2Mbps
* Data transfers over Wi-Fi 54Mbps
* Flash 9.4 support
* Full-screen browsing
Yeah, at such a high price range, it better have Wi-Fi! :-)

--
Best "String" Ever!
Re:WiFi: check by Robb · 2009-08-27 03:27 · Score: 1

It has wifi, just read the link
Re:WiFi? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:27 · Score: 0

"Data transfers over Wi-Fi 54Mbps"
Re:WiFi? by monoqlith · 2009-08-27 03:28 · Score: 3, Informative

It does. "WLAN" - from the site:

Data network: GPRS class A, multislot class 32, maximum speed 107/64.2 kbps (DL/UL) EDGE class A, multislot class 32, maximum speed 296/177.6 kbps (DL/UL) WCDMA 900/1700/2100. Maximum speed PS 384/384 kbps (DL/UL) HSPA 900/1700/2100. Maximum speed PS 10/2 Mbps (DL/UL) WLAN IEEE 802.11b/g
Re:WiFi? by Froze · 2009-08-27 03:29 · Score: 1

(me clicks 'see all specifications') and poof... Right at the end of data network I see 'WLAN IEEE 802.11b/g' OK, I am exhausted, will quit posting now.

--
-- The morphemes of your disquisition are ascertainable, but they have eschewed an ambit of transpicuous exposition.
T-Mobile's 3G by NitroWolf · 2009-08-27 03:29 · Score: 1

I don't suppose there's any chance in getting this phone in a flavor that supports TMobile's 3G network?
1. Re:T-Mobile's 3G by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:41 · Score: 0
  
  Another dumbass that doesn't bother reading the tech specs:
  Operating frequency
  * Quad-band GSM EDGE 850/900/1800/1900
  * WCDMA 900/1700/2100 MHz
  Yes, it will work on T-Mobile or AT&T.
2. Re:T-Mobile's 3G by JSBiff · 2009-08-27 04:01 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  "Another dumbass that doesn't bother reading the tech specs [nokia.com]:"
  Whoa, some people don't *understand* those tech specs. Seeing "* Quad-band GSM EDGE 850/900/1800/1900" doesn't necessarily make it obvious to people who aren't familiar with which signaling standards and frequencies a given carrier uses.
  I think it's a little harsh to calls omeone a "dumbass" just because they don't understand the particulars of cell phone networks. Granted, this is /. so you hope most of the readers understand, but, even though someone is a 'nerd' doesn't make them knowledgeable iin *every* area of technology. They might know more than you ever will about astronomy, or quantum physics, or computer programming, and not know anything about cell networks.
3. Re:T-Mobile's 3G by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:30 · Score: 0
  
  He's not a dumbass for not having previous knowledge of the terms. He is, however, a dumbass not having looked them up. I might not know about $subject, but that doesn't mean I will ask trivial questions about it. Trivial question being anything that an answer can be found to via a few minutes of web search.
4. Re:T-Mobile's 3G by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:44 · Score: 0
  
  * Quad-band GSM EDGE 850/900/1800/1900
  * WCDMA 900/1700/2100 MHz
  So yes, it supports T-Mobile's 3G.
5. Re:T-Mobile's 3G by CityZen · 2009-08-27 13:32 · Score: 1
  
  As near as I can tell, those specs tell me that the device _won't_ work on AT&T's 3G network.
  T-Mobile uses 1700/2100 Mhz (paired together) for its 3G/WCDMA network.
  AT&T uses 850/1900 Mhz (independently) for its 3G/WCDMA network.
  I don't understand exactly how AT&T uses 850/1900 Mhz for both 2G/GSM and 3G/WCDMA.
  Perhaps they use distinct subblocks of each band for 2G vs. 3G?
6. Re:T-Mobile's 3G by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-28 07:34 · Score: 0
  
  you forgot 'and how to pick up hot chicks'
Sure, but... by andrewd18 · 2009-08-27 03:31 · Score: 3, Funny

Sure, but does it run Lin... oh. Nevermind.
1. Re:Sure, but... by ArcherB · 2009-08-27 03:49 · Score: 1
  
  Sure, but does it run Lin... oh. Nevermind.
  I was literally asking the same question. Sure, I know the phone is Linux based, but will I be able to sync it up with Ubuntu desktop?
  
  --
  There is no "I disagree" mod for a reason. Flamebait, Troll, and Overrated are not substitutes.
2. Re:Sure, but... by Splab · 2009-08-27 04:05 · Score: 0, Flamebait
  
  Which would be answered if you read about the phone...
  Unlike the google phones this will be based on a normal Linux distribution with all drivers open sourced - and first generation will be on GTK, but should be changed to QT soonish since Nokia happens to own that piece of .... code.
3. Re:Sure, but... by ArcherB · 2009-08-27 04:15 · Score: 1
  
  Which would be answered if you read about the phone...
  Unlike the google phones this will be based on a normal Linux distribution with all drivers open sourced - and first generation will be on GTK, but should be changed to QT soonish since Nokia happens to own that piece of .... code.
  Being based on GTK code means nothing as far as being able to sync up with other GTK or even QT apps.
  I read about the phone. It seems to be able to link up with exchange email, calendar and contacts with no problems so I know it will have software that runs on Windows (what phone doesn't?!!?). Will it sync up with my Kontact Calendar and contact list? If not Kontact, how about Evolution? Or will it have a proprietary, online calendar like Google's?
  I ask because I've had a hell of a time getting my Centro to sync up with my Linux desktop. Seeing that this thing runs Linux itself, will syncing it with Linux be comparable with syncing it with Windows, if it syncs with Linux at all?
  
  --
  There is no "I disagree" mod for a reason. Flamebait, Troll, and Overrated are not substitutes.
4. Re:Sure, but... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 17:04 · Score: 0
  
  Ha ha ha
  You are a funny person.
  I'm liking this phone. It might not be as pretty as the iPhone, but it isn't ugly either. It beats the iPhone on features, and if I can run any Linux app it would be the only choice. Nobody likes being locked into the apps the manufacturer chooses.
5. Re:Sure, but... by Casandro · 2009-08-27 18:16 · Score: 1
  
  It's not a PDA, it doesn't 'sync up' to anything. It's a full fledged portable workstation. It's not meant to manage your appointments there are _far_ cheaper solutions for that. It's meant to give you a way to do more complex calculations where ever you are, or if it's to complex, log into a more powerfull machine. You can also log into it from your desktop computer. This new version should easily be able to sustain hundreds of user logins.
  It's like a laptop, but truely portable.
6. Re:Sure, but... by broeman · 2009-08-28 01:54 · Score: 1
  
  Maybe you should look at it like any other computer you have around (hey, this is slashdot, our rooms are filled with computers :P). They way I "sync" or "backup" is mainly through scp/ftp.
  
  --
  
  (yes this can be compared with sex)
Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by popo · 2009-08-27 03:31 · Score: 5, Interesting

The iPhone was a 'fail' for me for several reasons, but most of all:
1) No real keyboard.
(The N900 has a pull out keyboard)
2) No support for Flash
(The N900 has Flash support)
3) No real multitasking
(The N900 has multitasking)
4) Skype
(The N900 has Skype)
Add the fact that this baby runs Linux, and I'm 100% sold. This has huge promise.

--
------ The best brain training is now totally free : )
1. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by TheGratefulNet · 2009-08-27 03:35 · Score: 1
  
  ...except that nokia is still one of those 'do evil' companies.
  or, has that changed? they are still on my do-not-buy list, same as apple.
  until they stop wanting to spy on their own employees and threatening to 'leave the country', they are still on my shit list.
  
  --
  
  --
  "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
2. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:36 · Score: 0
  
  And what's your problem with Android then?
  I'm not saying I prefer Android, I was just wondering if you considered it.
  Personally I don't care for Android because it's so Javafied. I really truly detest Java.
3. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:38 · Score: 0
  
  I'm in your camp, however this is too good to be true.
  SOMETHING is amiss. There's a heavy negative attached to this thing somewhere, we just haven't heard about it yet.
4. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by TheGratefulNet · 2009-08-27 03:38 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  supporting article: http://arstechnica.com/business/news/2009/02/nokia-to-finland-let-us-spy-here-or-were-going-elsewhere.ars
  I don't trust nokia. why would you?
  
  --
  
  --
  "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
5. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:46 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  5) No removable batteries
  (The N900 has removable batteries)
6. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:47 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  I don't trust Apple, why would you? ;)
7. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by Hijacked+Public · 2009-08-27 03:56 · Score: 1
  
  So what cell phone/provider do you currently have?
  
  --
  "Sacrifice for the good of The State" - The State
8. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:57 · Score: 0
  
  Dude iPhone has skype iPhone can multitask and get used to the keyboard it's fast enough and google "jailbreak"
  eom
9. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by TheGratefulNet · 2009-08-27 04:04 · Score: 0
  
  So what cell phone/provider do you currently have?
  none, actually.
  people got by JUST FINE without being tied to a cellphone. for quite a long time.
  I like not being reachable 'all the time'. plus, I like not having my geo location tracked, all the time.
  just too much privacy issues involved in cellphones these days. the contracts are obnoxious, the text fees (some vendors won't let you avoid paying for INCOMING texts! ie, spam) are annoying and most people really don't NEED to have a phone 'on them'.
  now, get off my lawn.
  
  --
  
  --
  "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
10. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by TheGratefulNet · 2009-08-27 04:06 · Score: 1
  
  no, I don't trust apple, either. I'll never own one of their phones.
  I have no need for 'style accessories'. I'll leave that for teenagers who 'must have' apple phones to be cool.
  
  --
  
  --
  "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
11. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by Kokuyo · 2009-08-27 04:14 · Score: 1
  
  I am reachable whenever I pick up the phone. Which is my choice.
  I like being able to CALL people whenever I want. I like being able to surf the net whenever I feel like it.
12. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by neiras · 2009-08-27 04:18 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Personally I don't care for Android because it's so Javafied. I really truly detest Java.
  People who "detest" programming languages are posers. Go back to writing the Next Big Rails App on your aluminium Unibody Macbook (if you can distract yourself from admiring the reflection in the glossy screen) and spare us the ego.
  I'm asking too much, aren't I.
13. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:42 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  Dude, you're getting a wedgie! Dude!
14. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by tolan-b · 2009-08-27 05:24 · Score: 1
  
  iPhone can't multi-task actually dude.
15. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by guruevi · 2009-08-27 06:15 · Score: 1
  
  I have a N800 which is basically an N900 without the GSM radio (as far as I can see from the specs). It doesn't have a pull-out keyboard either but I never saw the need for one. Either way I wouldn't wish the Flash 9 support on anyone. As a matter of fact I have removed the package (apt based!) from the system because the Flash stuff simply doesn't work. I know why Apple decided not to have Flash support, it simply does not work well on these low-power systems. Even on a somewhat older full-featured computer (4-5 years old) Flash doesn't run good.
  Well, eventually it does work on the Nokia but it locks up the system for 1-5 minutes while it's trying to load something (try BBC and don't even talk about YouTube). Skype I don't see the need for, it has SIP support which is much better.
  
  --
  Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
16. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by chill · 2009-08-27 06:27 · Score: 1
  
  Mmmm...not quite.
  I had the N770, but skipped the N800 and N810 for the reason you mentioned -- poor video support. The reason was a hardware design that limited the pipeline between the graphics co-processor and the CPU. It was technically impossible to get decent accelerated video on the N770 and N8x0 models. They were hardware crippled. (Search the Internet Tablet Talk forums for discussions on this.)
  The N900 doesn't have that issue. It was fixed essentially with the upgrade to the Cortex CPU and a better design.
  The iPhone can play video just fine. It is, however, Quicktime video, where Apple has everything it needs to do it right. The whole "lack of Flash" strikes me as a licensing issue, or maybe a lack of hardware acceleration support on ARM by Adobe. If they don't the Cortex-A8 may have enough oomph to get proper Flash video rates.
  Here's hoping HTML-5 catches on an Flash dies a horrible, agonizing death.
  
  --
  Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
17. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by vakuona · 2009-08-27 07:15 · Score: 1
  
  It can. Apple just won't let you write apps that take advantage of it. How do you think you can be playing music, whilst writing an email when you receive a call. Multitasking can be really bad for a resource (as in battery) limited device. It's called making a trade off.
18. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by CliffH · 2009-08-27 08:37 · Score: 1
  
  1) No real keyboard.
  (The N900 has a pull out keyboard)
  I agree with that one. I got used to the touch interface on mine but, yeah, I miss a real keyboard.
  2) No support for Flash
  (The N900 has Flash support)
  You say no support for Flash like it's a bad thing??? :)
  3) No real multitasking
  (The N900 has multitasking)
  If you jailbreak you have multitasking, if you don't you have multitasking of Apple-only apps. This is what depletes peoples batteries quicker than anything. Now, if Apple would use a higher quality battery with their products I think they wouldn't have an issue with officially enabling multitasking but, alas, they're too friggin cheap to do it.
  4) Skype
  (The N900 has Skype)
  Uhm, I use Skype all the time from my iPhone. Are you talking about the original one? I've got a 3G and I regularly use Skype in Skype-to-Skype calls and Skype-to-phone calls all around the world. Then again, I'm in NZ (not that it should make any difference) and use it only on WiFi, not 3G.
  So, my only question about the N900 is how much it will cost over here. The 3G I just bought cost me $979NZD. If the Nokia N95 costs $999NZD I'm hating to see that price. It looks like a very nice piece of kit but damn, I BARELY got the iPhone past my wife (I had to buy the aforementioned N95 for her) and if this thing costs what I think it will cost over here (my guess, $1700+NZD), I've got no chance.
  
  --
  sigs are like a box of chocolates, they all suck remove the underscores to email me
19. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by nolifetillpleather · 2009-08-27 10:00 · Score: 0
  
  Isn't the biggest iPhone gripe AT&T?
20. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by TheGratefulNet · 2009-08-27 13:04 · Score: 1
  
  I like being able to CALL people whenever I want. I like being able to surf the net whenever I feel like it.
  generational thing, I guess.
  I can wait until I get home before I start landline calling. almost never is there a *need* to yak on the phone while I'm away from home or office.
  surf the net? too expensive, too much of a time waster on a phone. I suppose if you're standing in line or something, its nice to have 'things to do' but I get by just fine not having remote net access on a small cellphone.
  I like the fact that I'm NOT helping the phone carriers get richer. they make me sick with their outrageous fees.
  
  --
  
  --
  "It is now safe to switch off your computer."
21. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by BitZtream · 2009-08-27 15:36 · Score: 1
  
  Mine does just fine, things you buy from the App Store can't, but the phone has no problem doing it. Hence why people get their mail, listen to the iPod, get SMSs and web browse all at the same time.
  
  --
  Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
22. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by guruevi · 2009-08-27 16:19 · Score: 1
  
  The N800 can play video just fine too (of course not too high of a resolution but 640x480 plays fine) - it's just the Flash that eats up all the CPU cycles when browsing. As I said, the iPhone could probably support Flash but it would just cripple the browsing experience like it did with mine on the N800. Flash is a resource hog on any platform - it's just that you don't notice when your dual-core eats 50% of a core since you got the other half available. Single core and slower/older systems (try a Via CPU at 1GHz or a PowerPC G4) are crippled when running the latest Flash (9 & 10).
  
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  Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
23. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by bemenaker · 2009-08-27 16:48 · Score: 1
  
  Any phone can be spied on, just ask the NSA
24. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by AlterRNow · 2009-08-27 19:40 · Score: 1
  
  Out of curiosity, what would you do in the event of breaking down in "the middle of nowhere"?
  
  --
  The disappearing pencil trick. Let me show you it.
25. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by upside · 2009-08-27 20:39 · Score: 1
  
  Please, put this in context. An employer in Finland was not allowed to even look at the recipient or subject line of outgoing emails, and Nokia wanted that changed. OK, I also disagree with their tactics if they actually made such threats.
  Now compare this situation with how US companies treat their employees to have some perspective.
  
  --
  I'm sorry if I haven't offended anyone
26. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by randomsearch · 2009-08-27 21:05 · Score: 1
  
  iPhone has Skype, though it can be used only over wifi iirc.
27. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by mano.m · 2009-08-28 03:53 · Score: 1
  
  Behind every great fortune lies a crime. - Balzac
  As a consumer, I choose not to let my political opinions or moral distaste dictate my purchases. If I did, there wouldn't be anyone left for me to buy from. Every company has something sinister in its history.
  I don't care my handset manufacturer is spying on citizens back in its home country. I don't care my neighbourhood gas station is owned by a company that has global warming deniers in its pay. I don't care that a museum I visit is maintained by a government fighting a war I oppose. I don't care the company that manufactured my reasonably-priced, smoothly-functioning printer is accused of dumping heavy metals. It is unlikely that any major company can show ethically flawless conduct.
  
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  Karma fed to this user will be promptly burnt. Be warned; be wary.
28. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by mano.m · 2009-08-28 03:56 · Score: 1
  
  In defence of teenagers, a lot of iPhone must-havers are adults (age-wise, at least).
  Teenagers have to put up with a lot of peer pressure at an emotionally vulnerable time in their lives, when cliques and being seen as cool matter. What excuse do adults have?
  
  --
  Karma fed to this user will be promptly burnt. Be warned; be wary.
29. Re:Answers all my biggest iPhone gripes by hitmark · 2009-08-29 15:44 · Score: 1
  
  it can even run a root shell out of the box.
  
  --
  comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
DO WANT by Becausegodhasmademe · 2009-08-27 03:31 · Score: 5, Insightful

Open source? Check.
Looks stylish? Check.
Hardware built by reputable supplier? Check.
Did I mention it was open source?
I know what my next phone will be!
1. Re:DO WANT by capnkr · 2009-08-27 03:43 · Score: 0, Offtopic
  
  OOPS! Forgot to hit that "Post Anonymously" checkbox, did we?
  
  --
  "...there are some things that can beat smartness and foresight. Awkwardness and stupidity can." ~ Mark Twain
2. Re:DO WANT by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:49 · Score: 1, Interesting
  
  Built by a corporation that supports wiretapping and sells wiretapping equipment to governments? Check.
3. Re:DO WANT by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:52 · Score: 0
  
  That troll had id less than 20K. Surprised by that.
4. Re:DO WANT by rho · 2009-08-27 04:11 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Keyboard missing a dedicated number row? Check.
  UI a mishmash of whizzo gimmicks without much thought put into them? Check.
  Instantly abandoned as soon as Nokia sees another shiny object? Check.
  I want to like this thing. I do not. This is neither a BB nor an iPhone killer.
  
  --
  Potato chips are a by-yourself food.
5. Re:DO WANT by Archimonde · 2009-08-27 04:15 · Score: 1
  
  Shaped, sized and weighted like a nonpocketable brick? Check.
  
  --
  Trolls are like broken clocks. They show the truth two times a day. The rest of the day they talk nonsense.
6. Re:DO WANT by steelfood · 2009-08-27 04:53 · Score: 1
  
  Also, there was mention about a removable battery.
  
  --
  "If a nation expects to be ignorant and free in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."
7. Re:DO WANT by Blakey+Rat · 2009-08-27 05:58 · Score: 1
  
  According to the Slashdot image accompanying the post, it looks like a Motorola brick circa 1996. Hardly stylish.
  (Or maybe Slashdot's icons are just a freakin' decade out of date.)
  
  --
  Comment of the year
8. Re:DO WANT by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 06:05 · Score: 1
  
  That troll had id less than 20K. Surprised by that.
  On the other hand, it is over nine thousand. ...Eight thousand in the original Japanese.
  
  --
  Bow-ties are cool.
9. Re:DO WANT by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 06:07 · Score: 1
  
  Shaped, sized and weighted like a nonpocketable brick? Check.
  It's a high-end smartphone. Par for the course.
  It's smaller than my four-year-old Treo 650, so I see it as a step up. XD
  
  --
  Bow-ties are cool.
10. Re:DO WANT by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:30 · Score: 0
  
  an iphone? Duck
11. Re:DO WANT by White+Flame · 2009-08-27 06:30 · Score: 1
  
  I carry around my N800 in my pocket all the time, no problem. This appears to be a bit smaller than the 800.
12. Re:DO WANT by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:59 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  This is neither a BB nor an iPhone killer.
  
  Have you seen the N900? No. Have you tried the N900? No. I have, and it wipes the floor with the iPhone. Unlike the iPhone, it works properly, has a huge variety of free applications, and costs significantly less than the iPhone...
  
  There's no comparison.
13. Re:DO WANT by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 07:49 · Score: 0
  
  quick, sell the neo freerunner before people realise there is a real competitor!
14. Re:DO WANT by BlueLightning · 2009-08-27 08:47 · Score: 1
  
  Agreed, the n800 doesn't look like it will fit in your pocket but it fits in my jeans pocket just fine.
15. Re:DO WANT by xeno · 2009-08-27 10:39 · Score: 1
  
  Hmm. Trolling from a high-numbered n00b, I see. Phhhhbt! :)
  Seriously, there's a nice and very thorough review of the n900 interface at
  http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-rx51-n900-en.shtml
  I'd hardly call that a mishmash; it has numerous very well thought-out features in a consistent UI (based on a solid OS & window manager), organized so that the on-screen touch interface doesn't stomp all over the keyboard-oriented shortcuts. That's no small feat.
  Nokia may be momentarily distracted by shiny things, but from a Symbian big-picture perspective, they've been reasonably persistent about chosen technologies for many years.
  I want to like this thing too. I'll hold my verdict until it's in my hands. Otoh, the iPhone killed its credibility when the smudgy no-keyboard-havin' design made it through to production. iPhone is a cool personal device with whiz-bangery? Check. Useful tool for business email/forms/web apps/admin/docs? Bzzzzzzt. God no, I know it's fun to use, but have you ever been on the *receiving* end of messages/emails from iPhone users? I don't recall receiving *any* message from an iPhone user that *didn't* have weird characters or inexplicable word replacement errors. Gawd.
  
  --
  I think not...(*poof*)
16. Re:DO WANT by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-28 03:57 · Score: 0
  
  Built by a corporation that supports wiretapping and sells wiretapping equipment to governments? Check.
  Like every other phone in the world. If you aren't aware of the "security" features required to get type-approval for any mobile phone then I suggest you don't try using a mobile phone in any country with an oppressive government.
  The worry with Android is how much additional snooping is going on and being provided back to Google, a private corporation headquartered in a country with no privacy protection at all?
Wireless. Bigger than an iPhone. Lame. by network23 · 2009-08-27 03:34 · Score: 4, Funny

Â Wireless. Bigger than an iPhone. Lame. Â
1. Re:Wireless. Bigger than an iPhone. Lame. by Meumeu · 2009-08-27 04:05 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Â Wireless. Bigger than an iPhone. Lame. Â
  Yeah, a wired mobile phone is so much more practical...
Positioned as a high end device - not a phone. by Plug · 2009-08-27 03:34 · Score: 4, Informative

Look at the N900 feature list - "Phone" is fourth down.
Maemo may power Nokia's high-end devices, but this is no reason to sound the death knell for Symbian. With regard to Nokia, they make a lot of phones that are not the N900, and do not cost 500 euro. There are also dozens of other companies supporting the Symbian Foundation, including many other manufacturers like Samsung and Sony Ericsson.
Symbian^4 will use Qt as its UI layer, and Maemo is moving into a similar direction (that's why Nokia bought Trolltech!) - targeting both platforms should be quite simple.
1. Re:Positioned as a high end device - not a phone. by fredan · 2009-08-27 04:33 · Score: 1
  
  Maemo may power Nokia's high-end devices, but this is no reason to sound the death knell for Symbian.
  What the f*ck are you smoking? I have an Nokia N97 and I can tell how much Symbian sucks on this phone. It is upgraded to the latest version 12.
  
  Yesterday I had to pull out the battery to reset the phone, cause it had "hangd". No, the powerbutton didn't work to power it off.
  
  You cannot put whatever you want on the "startpage" (you know, where you can add "contents") like the calculator, bluetooth on/off etc... BUT you can put application for Youtube, Facebook, Amazon in the "content". Hello?
  
  If you want to develop (the SDK) for this phone, you NEED to have Windows installed, because noone is using Linux, right?
2. Re:Positioned as a high end device - not a phone. by Plug · 2009-08-27 05:25 · Score: 1
  
  I have never used an N97 personally, but I'm sorry to hear that you're having so much trouble with it. It is not the only Symbian-powered device in the world!
  Bugs get fixed. Technology improves. It looks like Nokia will use Symbian as their smartphone OS, and have their MID class use Maemo. They are easily big enough to support both. Other Symbian Foundation member companies will improve the OS and use it on whatever devices they want to do. The Samsung i8910HD and Sony Ericsson Satio are another couple of current Symbian S60v5 phones, and as the platform moves forward as open-source software, anything could happen. Android's Dalvik VM could be ported to Symbian. That could be interesting!
  As for the SDK, I think that it's built on Eclipse, and there's a GCC toolchain - maybe not with S60 5th Edition, but with Symbian^1 or Symbian^2 (the OSS releases). It takes time for a commercial product to adjust to a new open source life. Give a while. No harm.
3. Re:Positioned as a high end device - not a phone. by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:27 · Score: 0
  
  Symbian must die. It is a hell of a OS for developers.
4. Re:Positioned as a high end device - not a phone. by LiquidFire_HK · 2009-08-27 06:04 · Score: 1
  
  Having compiled a Qt app for my Nokia 5800 just last night (on Windows though) I can confirm that the GCC toolchain and Carbide.c++ do work with S60 5th just fine.
5. Re:Positioned as a high end device - not a phone. by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 07:42 · Score: 0
  
  I kind of hate this, because I really liked the Maemo platform but I was always mad that Nokia would never listen to people and release a phone on it. Now they're doing that, but Maemo is becoming a different platform. I feel like the one that I liked never had a chance.
6. Re:Positioned as a high end device - not a phone. by kurt555gs · 2009-08-27 12:51 · Score: 1
  
  I had an N95 8GB. Wonderful phone. I bought the N97 on the 1st day. What a piece of shit. Some one over at Nokia wanted to make an iPhone experience with an Ovi app store full of useless crap you have to pay for. By crippling a perfectly good VoIP stack so Gizmo won't work. by making ..... I could go on forever.
  On the other hand , I have an N770 and N800 and N810 which are awesome. I always wondered why Nokia didnt use it for the high end platform.
  So despite being thoroughly fuxored by Nokia on the N97, I will be 1st in line for the N900.
  
  --
  * Carthago Delenda Est *
7. Re:Positioned as a high end device - not a phone. by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-28 12:14 · Score: 0
  
  No. No, no, no. No. Some technologies simply die, because something better emerges. I started using it on Psion 5. I loved it. I had several Symbian phones , 2 Nokias and one Sony-Ercisson. And i can assure you - from my point of view Symbian platform is worse with every next generation. It seems that its simply not up to the task. My current phone is G1. I'm really glad that i moved forward from Symbian. And i will give Nokia a try as soon, as my contract expires.
8. Re:Positioned as a high end device - not a phone. by Anonymous Coward · 2009-09-06 12:14 · Score: 0
  
  Look at the N900 feature list - "Phone" is fourth down.
  Maemo may power Nokia's high-end devices, but this is no reason to sound the death knell for Symbian. With regard to Nokia, they make a lot of phones that are not the N900, and do not cost 500 euro. There are also dozens of other companies supporting the Symbian Foundation, including many other manufacturers like Samsung and Sony Ericsson.
  Symbian^4 will use Qt as its UI layer, and Maemo is moving into a similar direction (that's why Nokia bought Trolltech!) - targeting both platforms should be quite simple.
  I'm an avid fan of Nokia and Symbian phones from Philippines, and I'd like to share my interest in exploring new features in mobile technology particularly this new device and its Maemo platform for mobile communicators.
  I'd like to witness how it performs well as a device, mobile communicator, and internet tablet, and be able to know what lies behind this new mobile OS.
  I also want to know how worthy to have this device over the other existing and upcoming competitors and rivals in its level, and chat and meet people with the same interest.
  I hope we can share each and everyone's knowledge on this stuff among all of electronic gadgets we've had. http://www.Nokia-N900.org is nice place to hangout.
CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-27 03:36 · Score: 2, Interesting

*snooze* Wake me when there's a CDMA phone worth getting. I live in a place with next to zero GSM service and absolutely zero 'home' GSM service. AT&T won't even let me get an iPhone with a number local to anywhere in my own state, for instance.
1. Re:CDMA by swb · 2009-08-27 03:42 · Score: 1
  
  What state do you live in? Hawaii or Alaska? Is there a lower 48 with AT&T coverage that bad?
2. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:54 · Score: 0
  
  Just 30 miles north of milwaukee WI their service sucks.
3. Re:CDMA by eric_brissette · 2009-08-27 04:04 · Score: 1
  
  The northern half of Maine is that bad.
4. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:10 · Score: 0
  
  Yup. GSM in the four corners area (Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado, Utah) seems to be quite a bit worse than Verizon.
5. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:41 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  WCDMA is the technology behind UMTS (AT&T, T-Mobile). 3G CDMA is CDMA2000 (Sprint, Verizon).
6. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-27 04:41 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  AT&T's coverage map. See all that vast, empty area? Here's a map from AT&T themselves. Still lots of empty areas, and if you zoom in on their interactive coverage map you'll find that the additional orange is actually "partner" service. What that means is that you can't get AT&T 'home' service if you are in those areas.
  
  Also, I happen to live in one of the supposedly "Best" AT&T service islands in the middle of the vast empty area on the first map, and typing in my ZIP code on the AT&T "build your package" wizard returns a message that "this is one of the few areas we haven't reached yet."
7. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-27 04:43 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  I should add that I am with Alltel and everyone here I know who isn't with them is with Verizon. All CDMA service. And I can place a call from anywhere in that vast empty area except for places where the terrain doesn't prevent it (which happens in the bottom of the Badlands). I can even use the Gmail and other apps on my BlackBerry from those areas.
8. Re:CDMA by Mulder3 · 2009-08-27 04:55 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  WCDMA IS NOT CDMA.... WCDMA is 3G GSM, 3G CDMA is called CDMA2000
9. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:00 · Score: 0
  
  You're kidding right? Or do you mean specifically in the four corners area?
  My girlfriend had Verizon in Colorado and she routinely had dropped calls and no signals whereas I always had a signal in those areas with T-mobile.
  In my experience, Verizon is good primarily on the East coast but sucks elsewhere.
10. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:03 · Score: 0
  
  Wisconsin. This is the reason I have been with US Cellular for the past 7 or 8 years now. Alltel is not to bad either but still not covering as well as US Cellular. :(
11. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:04 · Score: 0
  
  GSM coverage in the midwest is absolutely dismal. If you're not on an interstate or in a city with a population over 30,000, coverage is extremely hit or miss. Compare that to CDMA coverage, and you'll find that even some extremely rural areas are covered.
12. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:11 · Score: 0
  
  Copy and paste from Tech Specs:
  Quad-band GSM EDGE 850/900/1800/1900
  WCDMA 900/1700/2100 MHz
  Now if carriers such as VZW used WCDMA instead of CDMA/EV-DO that'd be sweet
13. Re:CDMA by melstav · 2009-08-27 05:14 · Score: 1
  
  Well, pisser.
  You're right.
  Wikipedia page on WCDMA
  and CDMA2000
  I guess that'll teach me to get my hopes up. /me goes to send Nokia some feedback asking them to support 3G CDMA.
14. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-27 05:18 · Score: 1
  
  Your experience is limited. Verizon coverage is even better than Alltel coverage in some areas here in the upper Midwest. And I'm talking about areas where you can look in every direction and not find any solid evidence of civilization. Both providers have amazing CDMA coverage out here. There is no GSM.
15. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-27 05:21 · Score: 1
  
  From Wikipedia's WCDMA article, it looks like it'd be the same amount of work to change from CDMA to WCDMA as it is to change from CDMA to GSM. But I could be wrong. All I know is that this phone won't work wherever I am 99% of the time.
16. Re:CDMA by the+Atomic+Rabbit · 2009-08-27 05:22 · Score: 1
  
  The HTC Hero is landing on Sprint in October.
17. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:35 · Score: 0
  
  WTFU (wake the f*** up) and RTFS (read the f******* specs)
18. Re:CDMA by dbcad7 · 2009-08-27 05:36 · Score: 1
  
  A mess isn't it ? .. but hey we're Americans.. When cell phones started taking off in the US., GSM which was already overwhelmingly the standard in the WORLD, was the redheaded stepchild here in the US.. and people would post here on Slashdot that this CDMA was superior.. blah blah blah.. But the thing is with GSM it is easy to swap phones and carriers.. Then along comes 3G.. You would think, "lessons learned".. but nooooo.. now you have swappable GSM phones but the 2 major GSM carriers have different 3G frequencies... I don't know where the FCC is in all this, and maybe there is some logical explanation behind it, but regardless it has screwed over the consumer in the US.. All the really cool stuff in phones is childs play elsewhere in the world.. So to those who posted way back when, their love for Qualcomm and the superior abilities of CDMA.. well here you are.
  
  --
  waiting for ad.doubleclick.net
19. Re:CDMA by ColdWetDog · 2009-08-27 05:40 · Score: 1
  
  Alaska, the rather small part of it that has cell phone coverage at all, has ATT. Whether that is a feature or a bug is left up for discussion.
  
  --
  Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
20. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:56 · Score: 0
  
  Verizon is joining the rest of the world with LTE for 3.9G/4G, and they already have test cells in Boston and Seattle. 30 markets are on track to go live in 2010. So soon enough, you won't have to worry about cdma vs gsm
21. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:02 · Score: 0
  
  Actually WCDMA is not the same as CDMA 2000 which is what Verizon and Sprint use. The more common name is UMTS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WCDMA), the precursor to HSDPA.
22. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-27 06:06 · Score: 1
  
  I did. Which spec are you referring to that implies it will be offered on CDMA networks? If you are referring to WCDMA, you should follow your own advice and read up on it. It's not the same thing.
23. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-27 06:08 · Score: 1
  
  Seems unlikely. 30 markets going live in 2010 ... how many "markets" are there in total in the continental USA? How long until my parents' farm (which gets perfect coverage for Verizon and Alltel CDMA users at present) is iPhone-friendly?
24. Re:CDMA by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 06:10 · Score: 1
  
  The northern half of Maine is that bad.
  Yeah, but there's nothing up there. XD
  I kid, I kid. I don't think I've ever gone farther North in Maine than Bangor. But I have family in the Augusta area, for instance, and it sucks to go somewhere and get no service... That's the nice thing about my (CDMA) Treo 650, old as it is, it actually is pretty good at the telephone part of its job...
  
  --
  Bow-ties are cool.
25. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-27 06:12 · Score: 1
  
  Ugh. Bad proofreading after editing my sentence. In the incoherent part, "except for places where the terrain prevents it" was the intended meaning.
26. Re:CDMA by dbcad7 · 2009-08-27 07:13 · Score: 1
  
  Just a simplified FYI.. CDMA, and GSM.. These are the phone frequencies.. WCDMA, is the broadband (3G) Frequency, which is an "add on" to your mobile phone, so you can have things like Internet.. and this can be added on to the phone regardless of whether you have CDMA or GSM.. this is up to what 3G technology (there are others than WCDMA) the carrier decide to use..
  Here is what happened.. In the majority of the rest of the world.. GSM is the standard for "phone" frequency.. In the US, Qualcomm came up with the CDMA phone frequencies, and the US carriers used it.. although AT&T (Cingular) switched to GSM, and the other GSM carrier "Voicestream" was bought by TMobile.... CDMA "the phone freq technology" did not take off in the rest of the world.. In the rest of the world GSM is still king.. So it is easy for the manufacturers of phones to design and build for GSM, and it's easy for consumers to swap phones from carrier to carrier, or to just get a new phone.. When you throw the US CDMA into the mix, then the phone has to be specially made.. and that means that the manufacturer of the phone, has to do some serious work to sell the phone to the CDMA carrier, like Verizon or Sprint.. who may or may not decide to carry it.
  To put it mildly.. The use of CDMA in the US is not retarded.. it's "special".
  
  --
  waiting for ad.doubleclick.net
27. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 07:42 · Score: 0
  
  *snooze* Wake me when there's a CDMA phone worth getting. I live in a place with next to zero GSM service and absolutely zero 'home' GSM service. AT&T won't even let me get an iPhone with a number local to anywhere in my own state, for instance.
  Move.
28. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-27 07:45 · Score: 1
  
  Mod parent down, -1 Ridiculous.
29. Re:CDMA by Mulder3 · 2009-08-27 09:39 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  /me goes to send Nokia some feedback asking them to support 3G CDMA.
  Why should they support 3G CDMA??? It's a crappy and outdated technology that will die soon(4G/LTE will not work on CDMA, only GSM)
30. Re:CDMA by dlevitan · 2009-08-27 10:20 · Score: 1
  
  US cellular service is actually not too difficult to understand. CDMA is technologically superior to TDMA. It provides better call quality. The original GSM was based on TDMA (UMTS is, in fact, CDMA). In the US, where the government decided to let companies develop their own networks, AT&T and Verizon became the two dominant carriers (I'm ignoring a lot of the history here).
  AT&T used to be TDMA (I'm guessing because it was an easy upgrade from AMPS). They then switched to GSM, but because the European frequencies were in use here, they used different frequencies. AT&T is continuing on the GSM upgrade path.
  VZW deployed a technologically superior CDMA network. Since most Americans don't travel between countries all that much, it's not really a major problem. The upgrade path for CDMA was much easier than switching everyone from CDMA to GSM. So Verizon continued to use that path to EV-DO.
  4G would require a massive hardware upgrade regardless of what network the carriers were using originally, so VZW is pushing LTE (the 4G GSM standard). LTE will likely use VoIP for voice calls, so within a decade, most of the US should be on the same system as Europe.
  Basically, the point is that there's a good logical explanation for the network progression in the US. It doesn't help that AT&T has poor network coverage, customer service, and just about everything (except phones). VZW's obsession with locking out consumers is annoying, but most of the people who care about this can get around many of these limitations, and the rest don't care.
31. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 16:43 · Score: 0
  
  It's rumored that Motorola is coming out with an Android powered phone for Verizon:
  http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/30/motorola-sholes-android-phone-headed-for-verizon/
  http://www.engadget.com/2009/07/31/motorola-sholes-android-phone-for-verizon-appears-in-the-flesh/
  Motorola should be announcing this at their September 10th event, but until then it's unconfirmed. I'm really hoping this is true though.
32. Re:CDMA by Guy+Harris · 2009-08-27 20:20 · Score: 1
  Just a simplified FYI.. CDMA, and GSM.. These are the phone frequencies..
  No, not really. "CDMA" is a term that can either refer to
  
  the Code Division Multiple Access mechanism for allowing multiple devices to share the same frequency range;
  the cdmaOne (IS-95) and CDMA2000 (IS-2000) mobile phone protocol stacks, which use Code Division Multiple Access at the lowest layer.
  "CDMA", as in "Code Division Multiple Access", doesn't use any particular frequencies. "cdmaOne" and "CDMA2000" have particular frequency ranges (plural) that they use.
  GSM is a mobile phone standard that also includes a protocol stack; it uses Time Division Multiple Access at its lowest layer. GSM has particular frequency ranges (again, plural) that it uses. Some frequency ranges are used by both GSM and cdmaOne and/or CDMA2000.
  
  WCDMA, is the broadband (3G) Frequency
  WCDMA is a lowest-layer mechanism for mobile phones, using Code Division Multiple Access. It's one of the lowest layers that the Universal Mobile Telecommunications System uses. UMTS is more-or-less the 3G flavor of GSM, just as CDMA2000 is the 3G flavor of cdmaOne.
  
  which is an "add on" to your mobile phone, so you can have things like Internet.
  You don't need WCDMA - or any other flavor of 3G, such as CDMA2000 - to have Internet access on your phone. (I have an original iPhone, which has Internet access but doesn't support UMTS, just GSM, including the General Packet Radio Service (GPRS) and Enhanced Data Rates for GSM Evolution (EDGE); GPRS and EDGE are what are used for Internet access on 2G/2.5G GSM phones such as the original iPhone.)
  
  and this can be added on to the phone regardless of whether you have CDMA or GSM.. this is up to what 3G technology (there are others than WCDMA) the carrier decide to use..
  A 2G-only phone can't, in general, have 3G support added to it. (Perhaps some such phones have radio hardware that can support it with an upgrade to the firmware; I don't know of any that can, however.)
  A particular carrier can upgrade to 3G on its network; GSM carriers will probably go to UMTS, and cdmaOne carriers will probably go to CDMA2000.
  
  Here is what happened.. In the majority of the rest of the world.. GSM is the standard for "phone" frequency.. In the US, Qualcomm came up with the CDMA phone frequencies
  Yes, although I'd say "protocol stack" rather than "frequency". Qualcomm were, I think, the first people to use Code Division Multiple Access; their "CDMA", however, involves more than just Code Division Multiple Access as the radio layer - it also involves higher-level protocols, which are different from the higher-level protocols used by GSM.
  
  and the US carriers used it.. although AT&T (Cingular) switched to GSM, and the other GSM carrier "Voicestream" was bought by TMobile....
  ...so that's probably better stated as "some US carriers used it" - others, such as AT&T (who switched from Digital AMPS - which uses TDMA at the lowest layer, as does GSM - to GSM) and Voicestream", didn't.
  
  CDMA "the phone freq technology" did not take off in the rest of the world.. In the rest of the world GSM is still king..
  By and large true, although I think cdmaOne and CDMA
33. Re:CDMA by CAIMLAS · 2009-08-27 20:46 · Score: 1
  
  The center of that "no coverage" area? That's where I live - in the Black Hills of South Dakota. I can't even get AT&T to ignore me, it's so bad.
  But I've got a friend who comes here on occasion; he's from here, see, so he's got a legitimate reason and everything! The thing is, he's got AT&T.
  I live in a canyon and have Verizon. I do not get signal anywhere but on the third story of the house. He, on the other hand, gets it throughout the house - yes, GSM signal, as his phone(s) lack CDMA chipsets. This seems to be mostly true out here; if AT&T has no coverage, there is at least a carrier which will take your signal for GSM.
  
  --
  ~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers
34. Re:CDMA by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 22:55 · Score: 0
  
  How is the north-most tip of Alaska? I imagine it's quite cold. At least you don't need a back-light on your phone half the year.
35. Re:CDMA by calix0815 · 2009-08-28 01:00 · Score: 1
  
  I'm quite shocked to see that map! I drove from Missouri to the Rockie Mountains NP (through Kansas), then on to Yellow Stone and back through Nebraska and had never lost signal with my prepaid T-Mobile. In the West coverage was usually provided by a roaming partner but at no extra cost.
  I would have thought that AT&T should have coverage there...
36. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-28 02:50 · Score: 1
  
  As I've pointed out elsewhere, I'm not in remote reaches of Alaska. I'm in the Midwest. The simple fact is that GSM service is only available in metropolitan areas in the USA, and AT&T 'home' service (where you can actually get a phone number on their network) is limited to major metropolitan areas. I don't know of a metro under 1 million people that has AT&T home service. I'm sure they're out there, but there are none even remotely close to where I am. And I'm not that remote: I'm in my state's capital.
37. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-28 02:54 · Score: 1
  
  Hello from your northern neighbor! I love the Black Hills - best motorcycling canyon roads in nation, as long as you go when it's at least 2 weeks before or 1 week after the rally and can evade the RV's. At any rate, I wonder how GSM service is up here. AT&T claims 'partner' service in parts of ND, but not even close to all of it - definitely not at my parents' house, for instance. But I do know that I can't even get an AT&T plan because of where I live. Supposedly, they're buying out Alltel in our area, but we'll have to wait and see whether they get us transitioned to GSM before the iPhone becomes obsolete.
38. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-28 02:55 · Score: 1
  
  Apparently there is some GSM service in those areas, so AT&T has partner coverage, but I can't get an AT&T plan where I live. I also don't know who the supposed home provider is of these GSM hot spots (which don't extend far beyond the edge of the interstate highways, BTW). I don't know anyone in my city who has anything but Verizon or Alltel.
39. Re:CDMA by CAIMLAS · 2009-08-28 12:21 · Score: 1
  
  You've got at least some coverage in the Dickinson area. A cursory look at maps shows they at least advertise -some- coverage there. Coverage maps show no coverage here.
  My friend on ATT claims that he usually gets better coverage on his ranch near Ashby, NE and across that state than Verizon customers do. I believe him, because I don't think he'd be using the service otherwise.
  Forget the iPhone. IMO, it was obsolete when it came out (feature for feature, half what Windows Mobile 6 is). Shoot, the iPhone doesn't even do multitasking and you could only recently change default sounds (I think). That's nuts. Linux (Maemo and Android, as well as others) and WinMo phones, Blackberry, and the like will be providing a great deal more functionality and become much more ubiquitous.
  
  --
  ~/ssh slashdot.org ssh: connect to host slashdot.org port 22: too many beers
40. Re:CDMA by ari_j · 2009-08-28 14:51 · Score: 1
  
  I'm actually in Bismarck, and we are advertised as having AT&T service. However, you can put in my ZIP code on AT&T's "select a plan" wizard and get the "sorry, that's one of the few areas we don't serve yet" message. I don't know about roaming because I don't know anyone in my entire state who actually has a GSM phone to try.
Nokia finally sees the limits of Symbian by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:37 · Score: 4, Interesting

Symbian (from the famed Psion PDAs of the early 90's) can't be expected to evolve into the kind of operating system that competes with these new "smartphones" which are really computers with phone capabilities - iPhone, Pre, Android-based phones. Symbian is more a device controller than an O/S. It was designed for devices with very limited resources which is no longer the case. I'm glad Nokia has recognized that and has chosen a more powerful computer O/S on which to base their platform. I have an iPhone 3Gs, but I'm very happy that Apple has some tough competition because even though I may stay with the iPhone, it will only get better faster as Apple responds to the competition. I'm also happy that those who don't want iPhones have some worthy devices to choose from . Now, what worries me is Palm because the Pre is off to a good start, but is Palm big enough to sustain competition with giants like Apple and Nokia?
1. Re:Nokia finally sees the limits of Symbian by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:54 · Score: 0
  
  Symbian isn't the problem. Symbian is probably the most advanced mobile OS, but S60 that sits on top of it isn't so great.
  S60's ability to innovate has been strangled by the shackles of staying backwards compatible.
2. Re:Nokia finally sees the limits of Symbian by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:14 · Score: 0
  
  > Symbian is more a device controller than an O/S
  I beg to differ. Nokia's S30 and S40 are operating systems which run on feature phones, and are much, much simpler than Symbian.
  Symbian is a full fledged multitasking (threading) OS with a full driver model, virtual memory, all the bells and whistles, that you could even run on a netbook:
  http://www.engadget.com/2009/05/20/symbian-foundation-boss-talks-up-symbian-for-netbooks-and-more/
  Only the current S60 UI would need a little help (same as Android for example, UI also lacking for that). This should be addressed with the new QT UI, coming soon. See Symbian^4 here:
  http://blog.symbian.org/2009/04/30/reviewing-the-release-plan/
where your root prompt is by marnanel · 2009-08-27 03:38 · Score: 5, Informative

from the where's-my-root-prompt dept.

$ sudo gainroot

There it is!

--
GROGGS: alive and well and living in
1. Re:where your root prompt is by CannonballHead · 2009-08-27 04:42 · Score: 1
  
  Can I send a text message with that in it?
2. Re:where your root prompt is by PolygamousRanchKid+ · 2009-08-27 05:05 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  From the Nokia press release that showed how to get root access ( http://flors.wordpress.com/2009/08/27/software-freedom-lovers-here-comes-maemo-5/):
  "If freedom is your concern then you donâ(TM)t need to âoeunlockâ or âoejailbreakâ Maemo 5. From installing an application to getting root access, itâ(TM)s you who decide. We trust you, and at the end itâ(TM)s your device. Nokia also trusts the open source community in general and the Maemo community particularly helping in getting casual users through the experience path. The N900 might just be a new and successful entry point for a new wave of open source users and developers."
  
  --
  Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
3. Re:where your root prompt is by coogan · 2009-08-27 05:11 · Score: 1
  
  Just this is enough to get me excited. As the poor guy who had to help countless friends root their HTC's and iPhones to get tethering working....
4. Re:where your root prompt is by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 09:32 · Score: 0
  
  Sold!
  The reason I never bought an Android, was the lack of root access.
No native Vorbis support... by shtrom · 2009-08-27 03:41 · Score: 4, Interesting

The spec says "Music playback file formats: .wav, .mp3, .AAC, .eAAC, .wma, .m4a"
Being Linux-based, I suppose it would not be too hard to hack it to support Ogg Vorbis. It's however rather annoying that such support is still not provided by default...
1. Re:No native Vorbis support... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:51 · Score: 0
  
  Fennec play Ogg Vorbis natively, and you may aswell use it as the default browser too :)
2. Re:No native Vorbis support... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:56 · Score: 0
  
  The n800 has Ogg Vorbis support by default. I would guess that the n900 would too.
3. Re:No native Vorbis support... by b3d · 2009-08-27 03:56 · Score: 1
  
  My thoughts exactly! It's a Linux based phone for crying out loud. Why not support open codecs? Out of the box?!
  I'm going to get an iRiver player just to support the fact that they support Vorbis formats.
4. Re:No native Vorbis support... by rkhalloran · 2009-08-27 03:59 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  Given this looks like a major upgrade from the existing Nokia tablets, this link might fill in the gap
5. Re:No native Vorbis support... by PeterBrett · 2009-08-27 04:10 · Score: 1
  
  My thoughts exactly! It's a Linux based phone for crying out loud. Why not support open codecs? Out of the box?!
  I'm going to get an iRiver player just to support the fact that they support Vorbis formats.
  I believe that Maemo uses GStreamer, so horror of horrors, you might need to install a package to provide Ogg support!
  Oh wait, that would be absolutely unthinkable. Nokia are totally evil to not install the appropriate GStreamer backend by default. You would be much better taking your money elsewhere. </sarcasm>
  
  --
  Pirate Party UK
6. Re:No native Vorbis support... by drizek · 2009-08-27 06:49 · Score: 1
  
  Somebody who generally knows what he is talking about says that it is actually built on Gstreamer, which means that it will support Ogg unless Nokia intentionally crippled it.
7. Re:No native Vorbis support... by BhaKi · 2009-08-27 16:28 · Score: 1
  
  Why don't they just use Xine? It gives much better quality than GStreamer and is free (in both senses).
  
  --
  The largest prime factor of my UID is 263267.
8. Re:No native Vorbis support... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 18:03 · Score: 0
  
  N800 definitely does not have vorbis support.
9. Re:No native Vorbis support... by WebCowboy · 2009-09-02 16:56 · Score: 1
  
  Being Linux-based, I suppose it would not be too hard to hack it to support Ogg Vorbis.
  Being Linux-based I would've assumed it would support OGG from the factory, as the HTC Dream and Magic phones do. OGG is the format of choice for digital storage of my music being it is the least encumbered of all choices and provides more than adequate quality for my needs. It was one of the many appealing features that made me decide to go with the Magic when I replaced my phone this summer--plus it was cool to have something my American friends couldn't get for another month ;-)
No OGG Vorbis support by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 03:44 · Score: 0

Most media devices with music playback abilities do not have the function to play ogg (or flac for that matter). I have always wondered why. Isn't ogg relatively free to implement because it's GPL?
1. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by ArcherB · 2009-08-27 03:53 · Score: 0
  
  Most media devices with music playback abilities do not have the function to play ogg (or flac for that matter). I have always wondered why. Isn't ogg relatively free to implement because it's GPL?
  I am no expert, but I believe that OGG requires some sort of hardware to be able to play. Nothing specific to OGG, but something like a math coprocessor or something that simply isn't needed in mp3 players.
  That said, my Centro plays oggs just fine with Aero Player.
  
  --
  There is no "I disagree" mod for a reason. Flamebait, Troll, and Overrated are not substitutes.
2. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by b3d · 2009-08-27 03:58 · Score: 1
  
  iRiver seems to be the only vendor that consistently supports Vorbis formats. /.ers please correct me if there are others.
3. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:02 · Score: 0
  
  you are no expert. No extra processor is needed.
4. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:19 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  The regular OGG/vorbis library requires no special processor, but it uses floating point arithmetics, whereas mp3 uses only fixed point arithmetics. That makes ogg/vorbis a little bit battery consuming. However, there is a library called tremor, which uses fixed point to decode vorbis.
5. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:22 · Score: 0
  
  Check out OGGPlay on SourceForge; I used it 2 or 3 years ago on my Nokia Communicator as my main mp3 player. I'm sure there's an equivalent for more recent devices.
6. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:24 · Score: 0
  
  Actually, the predecessors to this device, the N810, N800, and even the 770 play OGG Vorbis files and streams just fine with a simple package from the extras repository or maemo.org.
7. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by ArcherB · 2009-08-27 04:28 · Score: 1
  
  you are no expert. No extra processor is needed.
  I believe I said, "something like a math coprocessor".
  Not to worry as an another AC reminded me when he/she said, "it uses floating point arithmetics..." Most older mp3 players do not support this in hardware, making it nearly impossible to get them to play ogg files. I don't think this phone will have that problem.
  
  --
  There is no "I disagree" mod for a reason. Flamebait, Troll, and Overrated are not substitutes.
8. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by Dr_Barnowl · 2009-08-27 04:28 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  There is a fixed-point version of the Vorbis codec called Tremor. Floating point is nice but not required.
  My piddly little iRiver T20 plays OGG just fine, and it's about 4 years old and runs off a single 900 mAh AAA battery for many hours. This has a 1320 mAh battery and processors that must be several generations better in terms of power consumption.
  If you really needed floating point, you could probably leverage the integrated GPU anyway.
9. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by Froze · 2009-08-27 04:37 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  OGG is faster when it runs a floating point decode, but it has an integer decode engine (tremor http://www.xiph.org/vorbis/) that will run on anything fast enough to keep with the bitrate you are using.
  
  --
  -- The morphemes of your disquisition are ascertainable, but they have eschewed an ambit of transpicuous exposition.
10. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:38 · Score: 0
  
  at first it the decoder used floating point math. They now have a integer decoder. The problem is that there is hardware decoder that I know that does ogg. All the decoding is done on the cpu so your battery life is significantly shorter than say with mp3.
11. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:14 · Score: 0
  
  And nevermind the "The regular OGG/vorbis library" part?
12. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by gabebear · 2009-08-27 06:17 · Score: 1
  
  Ogg on devices with no floating point sucks... I have a iPod 2G and a DS which I have installed Ogg software on. Even to a non-audiophile it sounded terrible... I'm guessing way to much rounding.
13. Re:No OGG Vorbis support by Josh+Coalson · 2009-08-27 08:52 · Score: 1
  
  Most media devices with music playback abilities do not have the function to play ogg (or flac for that matter).
  nope, there are dozens of devices, including portables, that play vorbis, and dozens that play flac. flac is particularly cheap to decode. a partial list:
  http://flac.sourceforge.net/links.html#hardware
  http://wiki.xiph.org/index.php/PortablePlayers
  
  --
  FLAC - Free Lossless Audio Codec
Supported Media Formats... by Dr.Dubious+DDQ · 2009-08-27 03:47 · Score: 1

I'm a bit surprised that "Maemo media player" does not list Ogg Vorbis or Theora as supported formats...
I assume there are add-on packages that do support them, but it seems like an odd omission for a Linux-based platform that's been around plenty long enough to have developed support for legally-free codecs.
(I still want one...)

--
Hacker Public Radio is our Friend
1. Re:Supported Media Formats... by Bralkein · 2009-08-27 03:54 · Score: 3, Interesting
  
  Yeah, it's a bit poo, I have all my music CDs ripped into ogg myself. However, it uses GStreamer so just install the proper plugins and away you go, I guess. This really looks like the phone I've been waiting for, I'll just wait for a few reviews to come out to see if there are any glaring faults, then my money is theirs :-)
2. Re:Supported Media Formats... by fatphil · 2009-08-27 04:18 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  Vorbis is surrounded by IP FUD. All the guys with deep pockets are scared of it.
  
  However, gstreamer's plugin-based, so it should eventually be possible to find community support for the standard.
  
  --
  Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
3. Re:Supported Media Formats... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:20 · Score: 0
  
  Who cares what maemo media player supports. Mplayer supports virtually everything, and is easy to install on maemo. :)
4. Re:Supported Media Formats... by chill · 2009-08-27 06:04 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Surprised? You need to keep up on your geek news.
  This is a NOKIA phone. Nokia is one of the two main companies that objected to OGG formats (vorbis & theora) being specified in the HTML5 spec. They aren't fully confident about the patent situation regarding OGG.
  
  --
  Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
5. Re:Supported Media Formats... by Dr.Dubious+DDQ · 2009-08-27 10:18 · Score: 1
  
  "Nokia is one of the two main companies that objected to OGG formats[...]"
  That's a good point, actually - I'd forgotten about that.
  The whole "If it's free, who do we pay protection money to in order to avoid patent lawsuits?" is the new "If it's free, who do we yell at if it breaks?"
  Previous posts mention a port of VLC to the platform, so I doubt it'll be too hard to activate support for Legally Free formats...
  
  --
  Hacker Public Radio is our Friend
6. Re:Supported Media Formats... by chill · 2009-08-27 10:33 · Score: 1
  
  It is simpler than that. Maemo 5 uses gstreamer and there is an ogg-support package in the Extras repository. Add repository, install package, and the existing media player should now support vorbis. Ogg support was added fairly quickly for the older versions of the software. I wouldn't be surprised to see FLAC added fairly quickly as well.
  
  --
  Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
Skype? by danaris · 2009-08-27 03:48 · Score: 2, Informative

The iPhone does have Skype now, you know. True, it's only allowed to work over the 802.11 connection, not the cellular, but it's definitely there.
Dan Aris

--
Fun. Free. Online. RPG. BattleMaster.
1. Re:Skype? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:07 · Score: 1, Insightful
  
  iPhone: the platform of "but", "only" and "limited to".
2. Re:Skype? by spinkham · 2009-08-27 05:19 · Score: 1
  
  Not to mention no push or background support, so even on wifi it's useless for incoming calls..
  
  --
  Blessed are the pessimists, for they have made backups.
3. Re:Skype? by 21mhz · 2009-08-28 20:44 · Score: 1
  
  The iPhone does have Skype now, you know. True, it's only allowed to work over the 802.11 connection, not the cellular, but it's definitely there.
  Does it also work when you switch out of the Skype application? Which is, by the way, a separate application, not integrated into the main phone UI or the address book.
  
  --
  My exception safety is -fno-exceptions.
2 Years? by Nursie · 2009-08-27 03:49 · Score: 1

I would think that by then both of these things will have been thoroughly outclassed.
The US is funny - most europeans (with contracts) get a new phone every year, though the companies are trying to elongate that at the moment.
Oh, go ahead by JSBiff · 2009-08-27 03:49 · Score: 1

Go ahead and ask. This is /. after all. We *like* to post questions here which would be answered by reading the headline, article summary, or first paragraph of the linked to article.
FM "Transmitter"? by itomato · 2009-08-27 03:50 · Score: 1

Connectivity
* 3.5mm AV connector
* TV out (PAL/NTSC) with Nokia Video Connectivity Cable
* Micro-USB connector, High-Speed USB 2.0
* Bluetooth v2.1 including support for stereo headsets
* Integrated FM transmitter
* Integrated GPS with A-GPS
I'm sure they mean receiver, from the other pieces I've read, but I still wonder if they have low-wattage TX capability for hands-free calls, a'la iPod transmitter for use in the car, the john, or other places where an FM receiver and speakers are available.
1. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by PeterBrett · 2009-08-27 04:07 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  It's a low-powered FM transmitter, so that you can use it to play music over your in-car stereo without needing an interface cable.
  
  --
  Pirate Party UK
2. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:13 · Score: 0
  
  It really means transmitter.
3. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by Asic+Eng · 2009-08-27 04:17 · Score: 1
  
  Why wouldn't it have an FM transmitter? My wife has an LG KM400, that has a built-in FM transmitter, too. I think it's a "to be expected" feature in that price class.
4. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by Arthur+Grumbine · 2009-08-27 04:20 · Score: 1
  
  Dear Sir,
  You appear to have made a post that is not about OGG Vorbis support, although it should have been clear to you, based on the three previous posts and the time at which you posted, that your obligation was to make such a post, in as redundant a manner as possible.
  
  Thank you,
  The Management
  
  --
  Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure everything I just said is completely wrong.
5. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:22 · Score: 0
  
  You have an FM receiver and speakers in the can?
  Are you really in there that long that you need to set up your own music?
6. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by fatphil · 2009-08-27 04:25 · Score: 1
  
  It's indeed a transmitter - for playing through the car stereo, for example.
  
  --
  Also FatPhil on SoylentNews, id 863
7. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by ArhcAngel · 2009-08-27 04:59 · Score: 1
  
  I thought they meant receiver as well but someone on another site mentioned it is there to allow you to stream audio to your FM receiver (car or home or wherever). Hands free also sounds plausible. The N900 looks like the kitchen sink of mobile gadgets on paper. I hope it can deliver.
  
  --
  "A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it." - K
8. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:31 · Score: 0
  
  I was confused by that as well, now it makes sense, thank you PeterBrett, and to a less extend itomato.
9. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by roc97007 · 2009-08-27 05:38 · Score: 1
  
  ...but with stereo bluetooth, you'll only need the FM transmitter for grandpa's truck.
  
  --
  Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
10. Re:FM "Transmitter"? by Chelloveck · 2009-08-27 05:39 · Score: 1
  
  Hope it's better than the transmitter in my Garmin. Less than one meter, direct line-of-sight (through the windshield glass) to the radio's antenna -- and the signal's still too weak to tune in half the time, even when there's no other tunable station on the frequency.
  
  --
  Chelloveck
  I give up on debugging. From now on, SIGSEGV is a feature.
Resolution by Colonel+Korn · 2009-08-27 03:55 · Score: 5, Insightful

No one here ever mentions resolution as a feature on phone screens, and they should. I have eyesight just good enough to pass the DMV tests without corrective lenses and that's sufficient for my old iPhone's 320x480 screen to be painful for me in comparison to the 640x480 screen on my new phone. I can read significantly smaller text, meaning I can see much larger chunks of real web pages, on the higher resolution screen.
The N900 described in TFA has an 800x480 resolution. That should get people very excited!

--
"I zero-index my hamsters" - Willtor (147206)
1. Re:Resolution by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 10:10 · Score: 0
  
  I totally agree. I have the N810 and the screen is just perfect for web browsing. Even though many sites today are designed for 1024x768 as they should be the device handles them sufficiently still despite the lack of physical screen space. No other device provides a full desktop web browsing experience like the Nokia NXXX series in such a small package. The iPhone just sucks in so many ways yet people still buy it. It amazes me how psychologically attached we are to advertising and other public distribution of propaganda and social needs. People who play violent games aren't ill yet those who purchase products like the iPhone are. The reason is all logic goes right out the window- yet people playing violent games retain the ability to distinguish reality from game play. That just isn't the case for iPhone users and those purchasing most Apple, Microsoft, and to a large extent Adobe products. Now to say that all those purchasing some companies products are ill is excessive- as there are reasons you might go with what everybody else uses-however I think that generally we find most people to fall into the ill category.
2. Re:Resolution by TheModelEskimo · 2009-08-27 12:57 · Score: 1
  
  I have an n810, and the screen resolution's the same. I think it works out to around 225 dpi, enough that even though I'm a pixel-pusher at work, I find it impossible to discern individual pixels on this screen when antialiasing is used. It's pretty amazing to look at.
  
  The only problem I foresee with this device is Nokia's "hey it's open so we can abandon it any time we want, right?" attitude toward their internet tablets. But at least this one can act as a cell phone too...that may expand their audience a bit. PIM-apps are a joke on my n810 though; I wouldn't buy this device unless you can really see yourself doing things like I do: using the web browser, checking GMail and using all its features, listening to internet radio, watching youtube videos, or reading ebooks.
3. Re:Resolution by zobier · 2009-08-30 13:40 · Score: 1
  
  Just curious how that helps. I guess you can always zoom in, but more text on the same sized screen == smaller text.
  
  --
  Me lost me cookie at the disco.
Thanks for obseleting my N97 by Gyorg_Lavode · 2009-08-27 03:57 · Score: 0, Flamebait

I'd like to personally thank nokia for screwing me. I bought an N97 expecting it to be THIS phone. It was supposed to have a fresh Symbian with a lot of power and a solid software base. Instead it's a feature packed piece of hardware with neglected software, an inappropriate processor, and absolutely no future.
So now I'll have to sell it and pick up an N900 when (and if given the n97 took half a year from it's announchement) taking a massive loss on the N97. Again, thank you nokia for keeping me from making an informed decision.

--
I do security
1. Re:Thanks for obseleting my N97 by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:16 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Umm... what is exactly are you mad about?
  
  Thanks for obseleting my N97
  If you're mad that they've released something better, that just doesn't make sense. Should companies stop releasing newer, better products because this would mean existing customers are getting "screwed"? It's not like your current device is any worse than it was before the announcement, you know.
  
  I bought an N97 expecting it to be THIS phone.
  If you're angry that you bought the N97 expecting it to do things that it actually cannot do... then, um... shouldn't you be mad at yourself for not properly researching the product, rather than mad at the manufacturer for not automatically including features you assumed would be present...? Or perhaps they should have read your mind and prohibited you from buying it, knowing that you'd be dissapointed?
  
  It was supposed to have a fresh Symbian with a lot of power and a solid software base. Instead it's a feature packed piece of hardware with neglected software, an inappropriate processor, and absolutely no future.
  
  "Supposed" to? Can you explain. Are you saying that Nokia lied and misrepresented the capabilities of the N97 in marketing material and spec documents after it was released? If that's actually true, then it is a valid complaint... but you have not provided any specific evidence thereof.
  
  thank you nokia for keeping me from making an informed decision.
  What exactly are you saying that Nokia should have done to help you make more informed decisions? Obviously companies can't announce products in the pipeline before they reach a certain level of maturity (e.g. many projects get canceled or altered). So they couldn't exactly tell you, when you bought your N97, that the N900 would eventually be released and what exactly it would look like.
  
  When you bought your N97, you should have just made a decision about whether it suited your needs or not, and whether those features were worth the price. If the purchase was "worth it" then it remains "worth it" regardless of what new things are released. If, on the other hand, you are accusing them of producing bad products, or lying in their marketing material, then please give the specifics (with links, if possible).
2. Re:Thanks for obseleting my N97 by Plug · 2009-08-27 04:22 · Score: 1
  
  The Symbian software marketplace dwarfs the Maemo marketplace, which to date seems to be mostly open source apps (in line with the audience of the N770/800/810, which was mostly Linux geeks). And new versions of the firmware are still being released - with more major releases due in Sep/Oct.
  Is it really fair to say it has no future?
3. Re:Thanks for obseleting my N97 by Langfat · 2009-08-27 04:23 · Score: 1
  
  ditto.
4. Re:Thanks for obseleting my N97 by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:40 · Score: 0
  
  The N900 has new software and few apps, so it's a different category of product.
  Also, in Europe, many people upgrade once a year, so by the time you can get an N900, your N97 is obsolete anyway.
N900 = N810 with GSM + smaller screen by Exp315 · 2009-08-27 03:58 · Score: 4, Interesting

This is the long-awaited phone incarnation of the N800/N810 Linux/Maemo tablets. It's similar to the N810 in having the slide-out keyboard, built-in GPS, and micro-SD slot. I've been using the N800 for the last 2 years, and while I like it as in internet tablet, I'm not sure I would like it so much as a phone. Some reasons: - The tablet is cheap and not tied to a contract, so possible to forgive many faults - Tbe tablet has a bigger screen (4.3" vs. 3.5"), which makes it more practical for browsing and ebooks - Lots of Maemo Linux software available, but mostly amateurish/undocumented/90%-complete quality - User interface is not nearly as smooth as iPhone, particularly the web browser - Most programs can't rotate, designed for landscape mode only
Dvorak? by FencingLion · 2009-08-27 03:58 · Score: 1, Insightful

Qwerty only? You insensitive clods!

--
Just keep swimming.
1. Re:Dvorak? by ColdWetDog · 2009-08-27 05:44 · Score: 1
  
  Troll? Come ON mods. Take your medicine! You'll help us all out.
  
  --
  Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
capacitive touchscreen? by jbigboote · 2009-08-27 04:01 · Score: 1

I believe all previous touchscreen Nokia phones have featured resistive touchscreens. I hope this one is an exception.
1. Re:capacitive touchscreen? by atezun · 2009-08-27 04:50 · Score: 1
  
  No dice. It's a resistive screen. http://mobile-review.com/review/nokia-rx51-n900-en.shtml
Fixes gripes about n810 by itomato · 2009-08-27 04:02 · Score: 3, Informative

The n810 is great, except when you need to make a (non-skype) phone call.
The new keyboard looks good, although it will take me another 9 months to adjust to the new key layout.
The black plastic finish should take more of a beating (drops, in particular) compared to the metal finish of the current unit, but Man! It looks so thick! http://www.sizeasy.com/page/size_comparison/23639-Nokia-N810-vs-N97-vs-Nokia-N900
The diplay appears to be the same, which is great, unless you're viewing through polarized lenses. The biggest complaint I have with the n810 display is the PDA-class GPU. The PowerVR chip should turn things around. Is it the same core as in iPhone?
Good to see the stand present on the rear.
Alert me when the price & demand drop so I can pick one up for $250.
1. Re:Fixes gripes about n810 by hitmark · 2009-08-29 15:48 · Score: 1
  
  funny thing is that the N810 has a powervr gpu in it as well, but nokia never bothered getting drivers working...
  
  --
  comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
I'll say this again by killmenow · 2009-08-27 04:02 · Score: 1

I have both an N800 and an N810. I've recently been developing Maemo apps for them. I SO FREAKING WANT THIS PHONE but damn that's expensive. Still, I'll try to get one. Verizon can blow me.
Too thick... by bdptcob · 2009-08-27 04:03 · Score: 1

And that's not what she said in this instance. It's 19+mm while the iphone is less than 12.5mm. I'm really growing tired of my iphone for a multitude of reasons. I'd go for this (depending on battery life) but that's just too thick for my tastes.
But does it ..... by line-bundle · 2009-08-27 04:08 · Score: 0, Redundant

Never mind.
UMA support? by UID30 · 2009-08-27 04:11 · Score: 2, Interesting

Anybody know if this device has UMA support on it?

Skype is not the win imo ... I'd rather just have my cell communicate directly to my carrier over my household broadband connection and not mess with an extra "skype" address to hand people for when I'm out of cell coverage area ... UMA is preferred since I don't need any special network hardware (other than a wireless access point) to support it.

T-Mobile supports UMA pretty well ... I'm using it with my BB 8900 at the moment.

--
"Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever." - Napoleon Bonaparte
1. Re:UMA support? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:58 · Score: 0
  
  That's my only question. My T-Mobile Blackberry 8820 jumps on my @Home Hot Spot and I can make UMA calls all day long. It's the whole reason I got the phone, as I live in a heavily wooded area and all cell signals are terrible.
  I really hope it supports T-Mo UMA but very few of their new devices bother to support it.
2. Re:UMA support? by UID30 · 2009-08-27 05:10 · Score: 1
  
  Exactly. I've got the same problem at home ... having already given my local Bell land-line provider the finger, my cell is my only phone.
  
  Many providers are leaning toward 3G micro-cells ... which provide a similar service with less complexity on the phone, but rest on the somewhat shaky stance that the FCC is OK with consumers running what are equivalently low power 3G towers all over the place.
  
  --
  "Glory is fleeting, but obscurity is forever." - Napoleon Bonaparte
3. Re:UMA support? by hitmark · 2009-08-29 15:52 · Score: 1
  
  how about going with google voice?
  one number, multiple endpoints.
  all wireless calls will be voip eventually anyways, with the carrier radio being a "dumb pipe", tho i would really like to see skype get a smackdown for not providing generic SIP support...
  
  --
  comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
Now they are getting somewhere.. by Seth+Kriticos · 2009-08-27 04:12 · Score: 1

I own an N800 and this thing is a huge improvement compared to it and the N810. The keyboard is not new, but there are features that are just making this thing right:
1., It's a phone. How much I which the N800 would have that. It's an actual phone!
2., They added a very good camera, but no video conferencing, which is smart. Skype video conferencing still does not work on Linux (yay, closed source software) and the early tries to make video conferencing work just went horribly wrong (they closed the video conferencing portal for the N800 series, the camera became quite useless). I can just guess, that in reality nobody wants video conferencing. (bring, bring: yea, what's up? Answer: Gosh, you look like shit today..)
3., Massively more storage and battery life.
Added with what was there earlier (Maemo Linux) this thing is quite impressive, and could in fact become a disruptive peace of technology in the market, especially if you consider that it is not monopoly chained to one phone service provider. Finally some real competition.
*takes out popcorn*
CDMA by melstav · 2009-08-27 04:15 · Score: 2, Informative

You missed a big difference for people in the USA... Quoting the specifications page
Operating frequency
* Quad-band GSM EDGE 850/900/1800/1900
* WCDMA 900/1700/2100 MHz
That's right. This device will be available with CDMA support. Which means that people in the US who are customers of carriers who didn't adopt GSM like everybody else in the world ( eg: Sprint, Verizon ) will, in theory, be able to use the phone, too.
And before you say that we should all "get with the program" and switch carriers to one that uses GSM, for many of us, for various reasons, it really isn't an option.
Better resolution by BoostFab · 2009-08-27 04:16 · Score: 1

did you catch that the N900 lcd has 800 x 480px resolution
Imagine... by elFisico · 2009-08-27 04:17 · Score: 1

Imagine a beowulf-cluster of these!
Only compared to an iPhone by itomato · 2009-08-27 04:20 · Score: 3, Insightful

The iPhone is a fashion accessory, and fashion accessories do not require removable/swappable anything.
You dispose of, and replace.
1. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by H0p313ss · 2009-08-27 05:00 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  The iPhone is a fashion accessory, and fashion accessories do not require removable/swappable anything.
  You dispose of, and replace.
  And it even takes care of that for you by conveniently exploding when it's done.
  
  --
  XML is a known as a key material required to create SMD: Software of Mass Destruction
2. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by justkeeper · 2009-08-27 05:30 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Except that quite a few times I found when the iPhone got frozen there is no way to do a cold start, the only option is to wait until the battery drains out, which was not even an option when I was boarding a plane.
3. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by Deanalator · 2009-08-27 06:07 · Score: 0
  
  Meh, I still have yet to see another mobile phone with mapping application that can get me from where I am to where I need to go in about 5 taps, and easily switch between public transit routes and walking routes with a single tap. The map navigation is significantly better than anything I have seen on other phones. I use transit/walking maps maybe 5-10 times a day, and it is a godsend when I am at a conference in another city. I have a hard time imagining how I could live without it. Every time the iphone adds a feature, it takes other phone companies about two years before they realize that it's actually a good idea.
  I think the iphone is still (unfortunately) the best phone on the market, and if you don't want to put up with apple's shit, it's almost trivial these days jailbreak it, and use it to teather, do obex transfers, bittorrent, spoof caller ID/SMS, google voice, customize the UI, or whatever.
  Hopefully these features will soon all be a part of android, and google will release a tool to install android on the iphone, treo, nokia phones, freerunner, etc. That might still be a couple years off though.
4. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by BlackCreek · 2009-08-27 06:26 · Score: 1
  Every time the iphone adds a feature, it takes other phone companies about two years before they realize that it's actually a good idea.
  Which killer features?
  like multitasking then?
  Video recording support?
  Flash support?
  Skype? (first on WinMo a couple of years before the iphone)
  You certainly meant Google Voice then?
5. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by jqweezy · 2009-08-27 06:41 · Score: 1
  
  Meh, I still have yet to see another mobile phone with mapping application that can get me from where I am to where I need to go in about 5 taps...
  
  Pretty much any blackberry with google maps can do this. It's called a convenience key. Use convenience key to launch google maps (1 click/tap), enter address (assuming here that you have to enter address on your iphone since your new to the city - several clicks/taps), route (1 click/tap).
6. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by daveime · 2009-08-27 07:15 · Score: 1
  
  Bloody kids these days, don't they teach you anything at school ?
  If something is frozen, it needs warming up. Ergo you should have done a warm-start.
7. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 07:51 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  Uhh yes there is. What the heck are you talking about? You hold the home and power buttons simultaneously for a few seconds, ignore any on-screen shutdown prompt and it will do a hard reset. I'm laughing at you waiting till the battery drains to start using your phone...read the manual.
8. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by cmseagle · 2009-08-27 08:00 · Score: 1
  
  Hold both the home button and the sleep/wake button for ~15 seconds. That should solve your problem.
9. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by justkeeper · 2009-08-27 08:20 · Score: 1
  
  What do you mean by "hold the sleep/wake button"? It's a switch, not a button.
10. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by justkeeper · 2009-08-27 08:25 · Score: 1
  
  Oh, I see what you mean, thanks, neglect the previous reply.
11. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by immcintosh · 2009-08-27 08:51 · Score: 1
  
  Um, no it's not... the only "switch" on the iPhone is the silent/ring mode switch... at least going by any definition of "switch" I'm familiar with.
12. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 10:44 · Score: 0
  
  Hold the power/sleep button down for a very long time.
13. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 15:01 · Score: 0
  
  If the iphone becomes completely frozen, you can hold both lock and home at the same time for about 5 seconds to hard shut down it (kindof like the power button on a computer).
14. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by i_liek_turtles · 2009-08-27 16:38 · Score: 1
  
  You hold the button on the top and the button on the bottom of the device...
15. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by 10Ghz · 2009-08-27 21:10 · Score: 1
  Which killer features?
  
  like multitasking then?
  
  For what do you need multitasking on a phone? How would multitasking be different from how iPhone does things (you switch between apps)? Only use I could think of it is audio-streaming or something like that. Multitasking might make sense on normal computers, where you can have several app-windows open, and you could move stuff between them. But that is not possible on a phone. Phones display one app at a time.
  Hell, you don't really multitask on a computer either. Or do you edit spreadsheet and presentations at the same time? No you do not. You do your tasks one at a time, switching between different apps. And you can do that just fine on the iPhone as well.
  
  Video recording support?
  That might be nifty, but hardly a major shortcoming.
  
  Flash support?
  I remember a recent review of a phone that had a "full flash-support". Flash was so slow on the phone that it was useless. Why waste resources on supporting features that would be useless in actual usage? Just so you would have a useless paper-spec?
  --
  Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.
16. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by randomsearch · 2009-08-27 21:17 · Score: 1
  
  I've had the same experience as justkeeper... nice choice of the phrase "cold start". The iPhone was clocking away, unresponsive and slowly getting warmer and warmer... fortunately, the battery died before it caught fire ;-)
17. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by Veyasu · 2009-08-27 21:57 · Score: 1
  Which killer features?
  
  like multitasking then?
  For what do you need multitasking on a phone? How would multitasking be different from how iPhone does things (you switch between apps)? Only use I could think of it is audio-streaming or something like that. Multitasking might make sense on normal computers, where you can have several app-windows open, and you could move stuff between them. But that is not possible on a phone. Phones display one app at a time.
  Hell, you don't really multitask on a computer either. Or do you edit spreadsheet and presentations at the same time? No you do not. You do your tasks one at a time, switching between different apps. And you can do that just fine on the iPhone as well.
  One thing I can think of which would be extremely useful would be an IM client.
18. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by 10Ghz · 2009-08-27 23:52 · Score: 1
  
  One thing I can think of which would be extremely useful would be an IM client.
  Would it? what would multitasking accomplish that push-notifications does not?
  
  --
  Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.
19. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by gcobb · 2009-08-28 03:38 · Score: 1
  
  Hell, you don't really multitask on a computer either. Or do you edit spreadsheet and presentations at the same time? No you do not. You do your tasks one at a time, switching between different apps. And you can do that just fine on the iPhone as well.
  I don't multitask (my wife would say that is because I am a man) but my computer certainly does. While I am switching between my spreadsheet and my presentation my computer is playing my music (streamed or accessed locally) and is also downloading my email in the background so I can read it once I get on the plane. And, as this is a full Linux device, it is probably also updating my svn working copy so that I can work on tracking down that annoying bug in the application I develop while I am on the flight as well.
  Or, while I am driving and talking on the phone (using my handsfree, of course), the satnav function is continuing to track where I am and the speed camera application is pinging as I approach cameras.
20. Re:Only compared to an iPhone by Tuntematon · 2009-08-31 02:08 · Score: 1
  
  One thing I can think of which would be extremely useful would be an IM client.
  Would it? what would multitasking accomplish that push-notifications does not?
  Maybe let me listen to music/talk on the phone/take photos/write email, sms while the IM program is running?
  
  --
  By Tuntematon
Let me be the first to say... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:23 · Score: 0

Oh my god oh my god oh my god oh my god
[breathe] ...oh my god oh my god oh my god oh my god
Google n810/n800 GPS... by itomato · 2009-08-27 04:24 · Score: 1

...for more unusably shit Nokia components. They have A-GPS, because the things takes 10 minutes to get a fix. I can locate a map, find my position, chart a course to destination, and re-fold the map (properly) in less time than it takes to get a GPS fix.
Then, it's just a flat map, with your current position displayed. Granted, it will show my path from the Coffee Shop counter to the toilet, and back, but what the world needs now is Nav, sweet Nav..
1. Re:Google n810/n800 GPS... by jfanning · 2009-08-27 04:28 · Score: 1
  
  That's bollocks. I get a fix with my N810 in less than 30seconds pretty much all the time.
  Uh, all maps are flat. Wayfinder works perfectly well in the N810 and I use the full voice navigation all the time. But in any case the N900 will be using Nokia's own Ovi Maps.
2. Re:Google n810/n800 GPS... by RoccamOccam · 2009-08-27 06:46 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  That's bollocks.
  Not exactly. We bought two N810s for a project. The first one is extremely slow to get a fix. The second one, which was purchased several months later, establishes a fix MUCH more quickly.
  In other words, it appears that you and the GP are both right.
3. Re:Google n810/n800 GPS... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 07:28 · Score: 0
  
  That's bollocks. I get a fix with my N810 in less than 30seconds pretty much all the time.
  Good for you. I usually have this happen: I put the bloody thing on the dashboard and start the map program. I start driving (because I know the N810 GPS is a pos, I've checked the route beforehand). After 25 minutes I've arrived and found the place I was looking for. The GPS still doesn't have a fix.
  Nowadays I have a N85 which also has a GPS. I don't even have to put it on the dashboard, it'll get a fix in about 20 seconds anywhere in the car.
4. Re:Google n810/n800 GPS... by jfanning · 2009-08-27 21:23 · Score: 1
  
  Of course you should install the AGPS daemon software from the repository as well. Without that it sucks shit.
Providers by AP31R0N · 2009-08-27 04:24 · Score: 1

Any word on which providers can support it? Without the right provider or options for providers, this might go the way of the Moko (in the US).
Hint: i've never seen a Moko in the US.

--
Utilizing the synergization of benchmark e-solutions to pre-workaround action items!
1. Re:Providers by speedtux · 2009-08-27 04:32 · Score: 1
  
  It's quad-band GSM and tri-band 3.5G. In the US, it should work on T-Mobile and AT&T, since both carriers allow unlocked phones. It will also work pretty much anywhere else in the world.
2. Re:Providers by Microlith · 2009-08-27 04:33 · Score: 1
  
  Any GSM provider should, though from the reports it supports Euro/T-Mobile(US) 3G bands.
  Also, the OpenMoko failed for reasons above and beyond not having a US carrier not selling it.
Hardware drivers free and updateable Linux? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:28 · Score: 0

That's what would make the real difference...
Parent makes joke about lame GPS.. by itomato · 2009-08-27 04:29 · Score: 1

People claim that Nokia nNNN functions as a GPS.
Any owner will testify to the contrary.
1. Re:Parent makes joke about lame GPS.. by randallman · 2009-08-27 04:38 · Score: 1
  
  I see. The N810 is the model with the GPS. I have an N800 and a bluetooth GPS, which works but can be a pain. Hopefully Nokia listened to complaints and put a decent GPS in the N900.
yet another platform by speedtux · 2009-08-27 04:30 · Score: 0

The hardware looks great, but otherwise, I'm not sure what to make of this. But the N900 is yet another platform, and it's not even a stable one, since they are moving from Gtk+ now to Qt in the near future.
Virtual memory on a phone's flash... by RalphBNumbers · 2009-08-27 04:34 · Score: 2, Interesting

The product page says it has 256MB of physical RAM, and 1GB virtual...
Using virtual memory on a phone's flash storage strikes me as questionable. There have to be reasons that the iPhone/Pre/Android don't do that.
Isn't all the swapping going to wear out your flash pretty fast? And, assuming this thing only has one or two flash chips like most phones, and therefore can't bond a bunch of channels together with a fancy controller for speed like a SSD, isn't it going to be really slow?
Do the previous Mameo devices do this? If so, how does it work.

--
"The worst tyrannies were the ones where a governance required its own logic on every embedded node." - Vernor Vinge
1. Re:Virtual memory on a phone's flash... by Mr+Z · 2009-08-27 05:52 · Score: 1
  
  Well, there's 32GB to wear level over, so that helps, assuming they do proper full-volume wear leveling and not zone-based. I imagine much of the swap is fairly static on the phone. One hopes, at least. I know I won't be storing a bunch of stuff on it if I buy one. I'll use removable storage for that.
  
  --
  Program Intellivision!
2. Re:Virtual memory on a phone's flash... by theManInTheYellowHat · 2009-08-27 05:55 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  I have the N770 with only 128mg RAM, I get by very well and have not wore out my 1 gig flash by all that swapping. The apps are not from win32land, they are quite well suited to low memory. What the N770 lacks is CPU and the N900 delivers 600mhz (read: I am jealous!!). These Internet Tablets are very well designed and each revision is greatly improved. I am very happy to see a new model as I was worried that Nokia was throwing in the towel on Maemo, which is another great asset for this line.
3. Re:Virtual memory on a phone's flash... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:59 · Score: 0
  
  Most future phone OSes will likely do this as well. Maemo is just one of the first.
4. Re:Virtual memory on a phone's flash... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 07:08 · Score: 0
  
  I have the N770 with only 128mg RAM...
  You measure RAM in milligrams?
5. Re:Virtual memory on a phone's flash... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 08:31 · Score: 0
  
  Can people pretty please with sugar on top STOP with the BS about flash wearing out? And even if it does after 10 years: get a new $10 (current dollars!) sd card and go on for another 10 years. FCOL think for yourself and quit replaying broken records!
  And there's also other kinds of virtual memory:
  http://code.google.com/p/compcache/
  Hopefully in mainline soon, but already available for N800/N810.
6. Re:Virtual memory on a phone's flash... by hitmark · 2009-08-29 15:55 · Score: 1
  
  not just a clock increase, but doing more pr clock. i think ARM claims their cortex architecture (see iphone 3G, palm pre) can do double the work on the same amount of cycles as the previous gen.
  
  --
  comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
A few questions for a Maemo developer . . . ? by PolygamousRanchKid+ · 2009-08-27 04:35 · Score: 1

Have you (or anyone else for that matter) tried the Maemo 5 SDK yet? Is there a version available as a VMware Appliance, like for the N800 (which I have and use)? Anyone use the SDK installer on SuSE 11.1, instead of Debian?
It would be fun to get this and play around with it while I am waiting for it to hit the stores.

--
Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
1. Re:A few questions for a Maemo developer . . . ? by killmenow · 2009-08-27 05:49 · Score: 1
  
  I have not yet. I use 4.1.2 on xubuntu.
  
  But I'm thinking now I should get the 5 SDK (still in Beta status) and start working with it.
"Year of Linux on the *Desktop*"? by Hurricane78 · 2009-08-27 04:37 · Score: 1

I think we have to rephrase that, because apparently, Linux got the future covered, and now only waits for the desktop to die. ;)

--
Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
No, but your fantasy being open to all by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:38 · Score: 0

would give *normal* people a pause.
Then again, I suppose you *like* thinking of big black cocks going up someone else's ass. Probably whilst fingering your own saying "oh, you're a DIRTY FOSS zealot, aren't you...".
Queer.
OGG over FM? by itomato · 2009-08-27 04:39 · Score: 2, Interesting

Since we have clarified that there is indeed an FM transmitter, and that OGG format is available, does this mean that I can now broadcast a Truly Free (TM) radio station of my own design to any listeners within 4 meters?
Can we now, thanks to Nokia, create a new HAM radio scene, operating on Free (TM) Codecs over public wavelengths?
The return of Slow-Scan, via 5MP Carl Zeiss (TM) optics and WLAN?
I want to use OGG format for my audio, because I identify OGG and its apparent lack of mainstream support with all things underdog. The struggle is a significant component of my mission statement.
Will the n900 support OGG Theora for encoding and streaming video directly from the device? Does this require specialized hardware?
1. Re:OGG over FM? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:55 · Score: 0
  
  FYI: I use nothing but FLAC and Ogg Vorbis to store my own music. I'm rooting for Theora. Go Xiph go!
  That said...
  I identify OGG and its apparent lack of mainstream support with all things underdog. The struggle is a significant component of my mission statement.
  Dude, are you serious?
Where does this device fit in the Enterprise? by bbhorrigan · 2009-08-27 04:39 · Score: 0

This device got my really excited, it has great specs, but it really isn't a enterprise friendly device. It seems that the market right now thrives of having enterprise functionality at the core. ie: BlackBerry, even iphone really wants to get into the enterprise market. As an administrator, what good does this device do for me? I guess if it had a middle ware server like BES or something. It supports imap pop3 etc: But from an admin stand point, there is no way to control the device. Although thinking about it now, no real way to control the iphone either. Maybe it is aimed at the consumer market and not really at an enterprise level?
1. Re:Where does this device fit in the Enterprise? by rtfa-troll · 2009-08-27 06:15 · Score: 1
  
  Errrr; it runs "linux".
  Remote management ; cfengine / ssh / vnc / apt. I guess eventually tivoli and evil stuff like that may be ported.
  Encryption; all standard linux encryption devices.
  Firewalling; iptables built in.
  If you aren't able to cope with a device like that then I guarantee you that there are business units out in your company that are just going ahead and running systems you are failing to support. Yes. They have sign off on that.
  Personally, though, I think the corporate use is really a thing that comes after. First people build applications and get to want to use the device. Then, after some time the device is "needed" in a corporate situation because it has a feature someone wants.
  
  --
  =~ s,(.*),<sarcasm>$1</sarcasm>,g if any_point_you_wish();
Sync with Linux PIMs by HigH5 · 2009-08-27 04:40 · Score: 2, Interesting

If I could synchronize my PIM data from my Evolution, then I'm sold! I've been looking for seamless and headachless synchronization with Linux PIMs for years!

--
Ceterum censeo Microsoft esse delendam.
1. Re:Sync with Linux PIMs by Yuioup · 2009-08-27 07:47 · Score: 1
  
  I second that! The big reason why my wife won't use Linux (even though she prefers it over Windows) is that she can't sync her phone with Linux. If I can get a Linux based phone that can sync with Evolution/Thunderbird/WhateverBasedOnLinux then that would be great!
No compass? by Dr_Barnowl · 2009-08-27 04:42 · Score: 1

With all that CPU grunt, and a GPU for 3D overlays, Augmented Reality apps would be a natural fit for this phone, but it doesn't have a magnetometer (listed) like the iPhone and the HTC Android phones.
There's no accelerometer either :-(
It's not enough on it's own to put me off it, but dammit, it smarts a little to not have all the toys that the others have :-)
1. Re:No compass? by chill · 2009-08-27 11:34 · Score: 1
  
  Correction:
  Additional features
  * 3D Accelerometer
  * Ambient Light Sensor
  * Nokia Maps
  * Ovi Files
  * Ovi Share
  * Proximity Sensor
  http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=31005
  
  --
  Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
realnice... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:45 · Score: 0

...but how will it compare to android?
damn, now what do i do? get a G1 or wait the N900?
New Maemo? Looks like OLD Maemo to me by erroneus · 2009-08-27 04:46 · Score: 1

The web browser is based on Mozilla stuff rather than Webkit. The other software capabilities sound pretty much the same as my current N810 device. Scanning the other various Maemo sites, I see nothing about any OS newer than the 2008 series being released. It seems the phone is being released before the newer Maemo.
One neat little part of the device that I hadn't noticed before in previous announcements of the N900 is the built-in FM transmitter. Pretty handy for interfacing to your car stereo.
The most important feature: by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 04:48 · Score: 2, Insightful

The most important feature is that you can legally write applications for it without having to get the approval of Big Brother Apple. Although this may result in a severe shortage of Fart Applications (of which the iPhone currently corners the market), it will still appeal to people who want to write actually useful applications.
Not separately.. by itomato · 2009-08-27 04:49 · Score: 1

They are part of single, integrated unit. They commonly refer to it as 'jam box'. Must be shorthand for something or another..
Good effort, but not enough by 1+inch+punch · 2009-08-27 04:53 · Score: 1

While the marketing checklist is targeted at the iPhone (emphasis on running Flash, copy-paste which iPhone did not have until iPhone OS 3.0 etc), what is going to happen is that it is going to fragment the smartphone market even more.
We now have Maemo, Android, webOS, WinMo, Symbian, BlackBerry OS and iPhone OS as the major visible players, with Apple being the only one who has figured out how to incentivize their developers through the App Store, despite all its shortcomings. And Nokia has tried before too, with its N-gage system, and that didn't turn out too well either. So no, I don't think this handset is going to affect iPhone sales very much, if at all.
1. Re:Good effort, but not enough by josepha48 · 2009-08-27 05:41 · Score: 1
  
  Not completely true. While it probably wont have much of an impact on the iphone, people who don't want att or a jail broke iphone and want something else may find this pretty nice.
  
  There are loads of applications and games for the maemo platform already. Also you can program it in many different languages from python to C.
  
  I have an N810 and this is just the next step in the evolution of the N-series. Symbian is slowly dieing and maemo will probably end up replacing it in the long run.
  It also looks like this has 2 cameras, one on the front and one on the back.
  
  --
  Only 'flamers' flame!
  Does slashdot hate my posts?
90% Complete is generous.. by itomato · 2009-08-27 04:54 · Score: 1

I would estimate something closer to 65%.
The app catalog alone is embarrassing. Twenty-five categories, some duplicated, some contain one app, and few really deliver.
I have had the best experience installing Debian, and running ARM ports. I wish I could bypass Maemo altogether.
Xmodmap your way to happiness by itomato · 2009-08-27 04:58 · Score: 1

http://dvorak.mwbrooks.com/unix.html#xmod
http://austinche.name/maemo/xmodmap.dvorak
http://maemo.org/downloads/product/OS2008/ukeyboard/
Happy to help.
Why does it have to hurt iPhone? by JSBiff · 2009-08-27 05:23 · Score: 1

For a product to succeed, it's not necessarily true that it has to take sales away from other products (that is often the case, but not always). "Smart phones" are, as an 'industry' or 'market segment' or whatever, are still pretty new - most people don't have high-end portable digital handsets yet. So, it's easily possible that this Maemo platform can succeed without hurting Apple or the iPhone at all. Not saying that will necessarily happen, but possibly.
I have little interest in an Apple iPhone (I go back and forth on whether I want one or not), but I am definitely interested, at some point, in getting a phone with more computing and web browsing capabilities. I'm just biding my time, looking for 'the product' that I can finally feel comfortable buying. So far, I'm not interested in the iPhone because it's way too locked down - too much Apple control. I had some initial interest in the Android, but I wasn't particularly pleased with the T-Mobile G1, and no one else seems to be offering any Android devices in the US, so that seems to be going nowhere. Maybe Nokia can do what Google couldn't, in terms of getting an open, Linux-based platform for handheld devices, for which different hardware is available (or, maybe not, time will tell).
aGPS by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 05:26 · Score: 1

Shame you don't know what you're talking about.
A-GPS == "integrated GPS with Assited [sic] GPS"
I.e., it's GPS with Assistance, like the name suggests. Both devices are equivalent.
Ah, I thought it just meant that the phone had, you know, a GPS.

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Bow-ties are cool.
doesn't have anti-virus .. :) by rs232 · 2009-08-27 05:27 · Score: 0, Troll

Why doesn't it come with an up-to-date anti-virus utility like most modern innovative operating systems?
--

Bill Gates' hurricane stopper

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davecb5620@gmail.com
Andoid is dying by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:29 · Score: 0

netcraft confirms it. yet more google crapware. film at 11
N900's keyboard by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 05:30 · Score: 1

And you don't think a real freakin' keyboard, including the keys that you need for using a shell & co, which the iPhone does not have at all, and real physical tactile functionality, is a killer feature? ^^
Seriously, no matter how good a phone is. If it has no phone, it is right out of the contest. :)
I lust after this phone the way your mom lusts after the many strange and exciting men who come her way...
But I have to say that I'm not sold on their keyboard design. I have to try it first. I've been quite happy with my Treo 650's keyboard, which is more cramped than this thing but (due to not being a sliding design) has room for the keys to be really be defined, vertically. This thing's keyboard has the advantage of more real estate, but it's flat, and I can't help but think that if the slider were to slide a little further the keyboard could benefit from the extra space.
I'm not saying I think the keyboard is going to be bad - I'm just saying I gotta try it out... 'Course probably various people with older Nokia tablet devices can vouch for the keyboards on these things...

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Bow-ties are cool.
Not that "CDMA" by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 05:32 · Score: 0

"CDMA" means a way of determining how to split-up the airwaves to support multiple handsets in the area (connected to the same tower).
WCDMA is the 3G version of GSM, which switched from TDMA to CDMA.
It has no other relation to Sprint or Verizon (except very tangentially, such as Vodafone--who has a steak in Verizon--uses WCDMA throughout the rest of the world).
Basically, it means jack, other than it *finally* starts introducing decent 3G world smart phones, just as we'd finally started to see quad-band GSM phones.
(And the first anon coward said this a while ago, before some idiot voted this plus five. Also captchas are brain-dead stupid idea. )
N810 WiMax first with cell connectivity by Zantetsuken · 2009-08-27 05:42 · Score: 1

Everybody on here and Ars seems to be acting like this is the first of the N770/800/810's with a cell connection - when the N810 WiMax edition had support for Sprint's XOHM network since it was released April 1, 2008.

The biggest reason I would say that failed is because the XOHM network only covered like New York and Chicago at the time AFAIK.
1. Re:N810 WiMax first with cell connectivity by crunzh · 2009-08-28 02:06 · Score: 1
  
  The first with cellphone functions. The N810 only used wimax for data, not voice.
  
  --
  Visit http://www.crunzh.com/ for free software. Mac/Lin/Win
Look again by chill · 2009-08-27 05:53 · Score: 2, Informative

Maemo 5 aka Freemantle: http://flors.wordpress.com/2009/08/27/software-freedom-lovers-here-comes-maemo-5/
Official Nokia Site: http://maemo.nokia.com/
Developer's Guide: http://wiki.maemo.org/Documentation/Maemo_5_Developer_Guide
Forums: http://talk.maemo.org/forumdisplay.php?f=40

--
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
1. Re:Look again by erroneus · 2009-08-27 07:59 · Score: 1
  
  I did, thanks. According to the forum, it is Maemo 5 and still based on GTK and GNOME. It will be Maemo 6 that will be based on Qt and Webkit for browsing and the like.
  Maemo 5 is a more polished version of the previous. I'm sure it will be better and faster and more efficient and all that. I have yet to see a load available for my N810 which is a little disappointing.
2. Re:Look again by chill · 2009-08-27 08:20 · Score: 1
  
  From what I understand, Maemo 5 is a mix of GTK+ and Qt, as horrid as that sounds. It is a "transition" release, mostly more polished than previous versions but with the hooks necessary for multi-core, multi-processor, accelerated 3D graphics, accelerometers and Qt support.
  If the N810 is your first, then you might be disappointed to not see a load for it. If you'd been around before, this would come as no shock. There was no official support for the N770 beyond the initial release, except in a community-supported "hacker edition". Mer came along nicely.
  [searching...]
  It seems the alpha of the Freemantle SDK worked on the N810 but the beta and later did not. Speculation is because of the closed-source 3D accelerated graphics drivers that were introduced in the beta. You might see a "hacker edition" but without all the extra hardware (new CPU, accelerometers, 3d graphics, etc.) it'll probably just disappoint.
  Oh, and Qt is v4.5. http://blogs.forum.nokia.com/blog/kate-alholas-forum-nokia-blog/2009/03/02/qt4.5-for-maemo-5-fremantle-sdk
  
  --
  Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
3. Re:Look again by erroneus · 2009-08-27 08:23 · Score: 1
  
  Interesting and sad... if I want the new stuff, I have to buy the new toy.
Duck test applied to phone-like device... by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 05:54 · Score: 1

It's a mobile internet device that does telephony, not a phone. Phone capability is quite low on their feature list! And yes, it supports wifi..
So, what's the difference?
Seems to me it's just a matter of terminology. It's not a "smartphone" because Nokia has not chosen to call it such. But in terms of what you can do with it, it's a phone, and its form factor makes it a bit large for a phone these days but still within the smartphone size range (smaller than the old Palm Treos, 1cm longer and 2mm thicker than the Palm Pre, or 5mm thicker than the iPhone but with a slightly smaller profile...)
Whether you call such thing a "phone that can browse the web" or "an internet device which can make calls" seems a matter of preference - a matter of which features you want to emphasize as the device's main selling points.
If you don't think this thing is a phone, consider this: holding the device in vertical orientation launches the phone application. Why do that if the machine wasn't intended for use as a phone?

--
Bow-ties are cool.
1. Re:Duck test applied to phone-like device... by Plug · 2009-08-27 15:07 · Score: 1
  
  So, what's the difference?
  The parentage (evolution from a non-phone N770/N8x0, rather than from the phone N9x), and the cost. :)
Languages I detest, I detest for a reason. by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 05:59 · Score: 4, Informative

Personally I don't care for Android because it's so Javafied. I really truly detest Java.
People who "detest" programming languages are posers.
How's that, exactly? Some of us have simply worked with a particular language or tool long enough to know some good reasons to hate it...
Personally I'm down with Java as a language, I just don't see the point of running everything through a VM on a pocket machine. Translate the app to native code when installing it to the phone or something, there's no point JITing or VMing the code at runtime.

--
Bow-ties are cool.
1. Re:Languages I detest, I detest for a reason. by Belial6 · 2009-08-27 06:26 · Score: 1
  
  The reason is that the designers were looking at the big picture and not just the release date. Yes, today VMing every app seperatly keeps the phone from being even more cool than it already is, but just like every other piece of computer technology, every year, they percentage of the systems resource that is used by the VMs will go down. The VMs are pretty well fixed on their performance draw. The hardware will improve. Certainly, it has to be clear that running each app in it's own VM will be huge in helping with this OS's security. Sure they could spend a huge effort in creating an install time compiler, but they could also just work on making the OS better in other areas knowing that new hardware will soon make the install time recompile obsolete.
2. Re:Languages I detest, I detest for a reason. by kramulous · 2009-08-27 08:35 · Score: 1
  
  Java, it's like the girl next door.
  She ain't pretty, but she'll do what you want.
  
  --
  .
3. Re:Languages I detest, I detest for a reason. by IamTheRealMike · 2009-08-27 08:37 · Score: 1
  Android uses a Java interpreter because:
  
  Dalvik bytecode is significantly more compact than native code. On a memory/Flash constrained device like a phone, the more you can pack into memory/flash the more you can do. Given that the apps are meant primarily to direct the native code libraries and tell them what to do, that works OK.
  You get security, no memory errors etc. Did Android have a remote-root buffer overflow in the SMS engine? No, that'd be the iPhone, written in a derivative of C.
  But you can write native code JNI extensions for Android anyway, so if you really want to write your apps in C++ or D or whatever then go write ahead .... you'll only need a small shim to Java to interact with the OS.
4. Re:Languages I detest, I detest for a reason. by ignavus · 2009-08-27 11:55 · Score: 1
  
  Java I like as a language.
  I don't like running programs in a big VM that has to load gigabytes of library files before it can execute "Hello world". Startup latency. So I don't like the Java VM. (Yes, I realise it is not literally "gigabytes")
  I don't like humongous libraries that have factored in every possible use, so that you have to load gigabytes of files yada yada... So I don't much care for the huge Java library. It reminds me of criticisms of PL/I and Ada - the language (library) is just too big. So I don't like the Java libraries. Java is like a Swiss Army knife with 300 blades - it can do anything, except that it is too cumbersome to do anything.
  So Java is a nice language saddled with a huge library and a big VM. But I don't mind the syntax. Through learning Java I finally realised what C++ was trying to do - Java made sense, C++ didn't. Friends? Copy constructors? Dots versus arrows? Arrrggh!
  Objective-C suits me better: no VM, no mandatory libraries (you can avoid Foundation Kit etc if you want), although the syntax isn't as nice as Java. Mind you, these days I just use PHP because it is faster to write and has all the string-handling tools I want.
  YMMV (in other words, I don't care if you love Java or C++ and gag at what I wrote - that's how your brain works, not mine).
  
  --
  I am anarch of all I survey.
5. Re:Languages I detest, I detest for a reason. by randomsearch · 2009-08-27 21:11 · Score: 1
  
  I wouldn't call them "posers", but having an emotional liking or disliking for a language usually betrays an inability to select languages appropriately as needed. Let go of your anger.
  Java is a fantastic language - as borne out by its huge take-up and popularity. It addresses many, many, issues with C++ and provides true portability and good performance. The language design and Sun's hard work allows for a plethora of development tools that aren't possible to implement in C++ without huge amounts of work and/or efficiently.
  I wouldn't touch Java for low-level development, but "hating Java" is just ridiculous. It's just a language, like the gazillion others out there, and happens to be one that has proven to be particularly useful and well-designed (ok, so it's not as idealistic as Ruby or Smalltalk, but it is a pragmatic compromise for its time).
  Less Java-bashing please Slashdot.
6. Re:Languages I detest, I detest for a reason. by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-28 01:41 · Score: 0
  
  Not on a phone, I agree with that.
  It does on a net facing server (think about it).
7. Re:Languages I detest, I detest for a reason. by Tetsujin · 2009-08-28 03:00 · Score: 1
  
  Not on a phone, I agree with that.
  It does on a net facing server (think about it).
  And why's that?
  Bounds-checking could be implemented just as effectively in compiled, native code as in a virtual machine. If you don't want the programmer to have to worry about it, you build it into a library and have them use that.
  Of course, if you look at the typical "net facing server" (like a web server) it's very common for web code to be interpreted PHP, Ruby, or Python. Using byte-compiled VM code would be a step up from that scenario in terms of performance. :)
  
  --
  Bow-ties are cool.
8. Re:Languages I detest, I detest for a reason. by Tetsujin · 2009-08-28 03:03 · Score: 1
  
  I wouldn't call them "posers", but having an emotional liking or disliking for a language usually betrays an inability to select languages appropriately as needed. Let go of your anger.
  Java is a fantastic language - as borne out by its huge take-up and popularity. It addresses many, many, issues with C++ and provides true portability and good performance. The language design and Sun's hard work allows for a plethora of development tools that aren't possible to implement in C++ without huge amounts of work and/or efficiently.
  I wouldn't touch Java for low-level development, but "hating Java" is just ridiculous.
  I don't see why.
  Programmers' work must be expressed through languages like Java. If a language doesn't suit the programmer for whatever reason I think it's perfectly reasonable to hate it.
  
  --
  Bow-ties are cool.
Down-side to the n900 by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 06:03 · Score: 1

I'm in your camp, however this is too good to be true.
SOMETHING is amiss. There's a heavy negative attached to this thing somewhere, we just haven't heard about it yet.
Well, it's expensive (don't know what the subsidized price would be like, but I've heard some dire warnings about T-Mobile lately so I don't know if I'd be comfortable going under contract with them) - the battery doesn't have as much capacity as I'd like (around 1300mAH - similar to the iPhone but less than my old Treo 650) - and it's a GSM phone, which may pose a coverage problem for those of us in the US. (Same is true of iPhone)
If I've missed anything, chime in. I still think this thing is gonna be awesome.

--
Bow-ties are cool.
Re: Does is support SIP / VOIP? by operator_error · 2009-08-27 06:05 · Score: 1

I refuse to buy any phone unless SIP is supported in the OS, like the fine phones on this list: http://www.forum.nokia.com/main/resources/technologies/voice_over_IP/voip_support_in_nokia_devices.html
FWIW, I have an N95 connected to Asterisk all day/night long, and I get far better battery life than when I run a 3rd party application like Fring. )Note to iPhone folks, SIP via apps like Fring aren't even possible in your need-to-be-approved world.)
But since it is open Linux, I image someone will come up with something, better than Fring. Not that Fring is all that bad. But SIP in the OS on my N95 makes this a Telephone for me. What I really want is a nice clients to my servers. I remain optimistic on this device.
Re: Does is support SIP / VOIP? by chill · 2009-08-27 06:11 · Score: 1

Maemo 5 includes the Telepathy framework, which seems to either be working on or has SIP integration.
The phone includes Skype that works over WiFi or 3G, so there is no inherent restriction on VoIP. I'd expect to see Google Voice for it fairly quickly as well.

--
Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
Limited coverage of GSM in US by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 06:13 · Score: 1

AT&T's coverage map. See all that vast, empty area?
That map is nearly six years old...
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not going to say GSM service is everywhere I want it - I just think the discrepancy between that "cellularmap.net" map and the AT&T map might be somewhere in that six years...

--
Bow-ties are cool.
1. Re:Limited coverage of GSM in US by ari_j · 2009-08-27 06:34 · Score: 1
  
  It really isn't, though. At least not for any areas that I checked. The AT&T map just includes roaming, partner, and shitty service in its orange zone. They have not made any inroads in my area in those 6 years.
Where's the source? by Hognoxious · 2009-08-27 06:19 · Score: 1

Where's the source? If other Nokia products are anything to go by, it'll need fixing.
I have an Archos PMA, the community built software is ten times better than the original.

--
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
1. Re:Where's the source? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:42 · Score: 0
  
  The source is right here: http://www.maemo.org
2. Re:Where's the source? by Ecyrd · 2009-08-27 06:55 · Score: 1
  
  Source is available (already, albeit in beta form) from http://maemo.org/development/sources/. Includes deb packages and direct SVN access.
Why I favor native code execution... by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 06:36 · Score: 1

The reason is that the designers were looking at the big picture and not just the release date. Yes, today VMing every app seperatly keeps the phone from being even more cool than it already is, but just like every other piece of computer technology, every year, they percentage of the systems resource that is used by the VMs will go down. The VMs are pretty well fixed on their performance draw. The hardware will improve. Certainly, it has to be clear that running each app in it's own VM will be huge in helping with this OS's security.
I'm still not convinced that it does much for security, really. Anything you can do, security-wise, for security can be done with an OS with memory protection anyway.
It just seems like one more thing that's nickel-and-diming away the benefits of that improved performance. If they want the VM to keep the platform from being tied to a specific architecture, it'd just be rather nice if they'd translate the instructions once, like when loading the app onto the device...
Then on Android - there's hardware (on the G1) specifically for accelerating Java - and they don't use it because Android uses its own bytecode format that's not compatible... <sigh>
If I buy a phone today, that phone will not improve every year. Other phones will appear which are better... I'm happy for platform designers if they feel comfortable making choices that make their lives easier in terms of the long-term maintenance of their platform - but these choices are not what I want on my phone, right now... I want all those cycles working for me. :)

--
Bow-ties are cool.
1. Re:Why I favor native code execution... by Belial6 · 2009-08-27 07:53 · Score: 1
  
  That is what WinCE is for.... Perhaps Android is not for you. For me, I would rather have a well thought out OS that is prepared for the future than one that is only concerned about what is available today.
2. Re:Why I favor native code execution... by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 08:31 · Score: 0
  
  That is what WinCE is for.... Perhaps Android is not for you. For me, I would rather have a well thought out OS that is prepared for the future than one that is only concerned about what is available today.
  There's a separate issue here - which is that even if the official development target for a platform is a VM, there's still various ways to minimize the performance compromises of that choice. For instance, if you've got the ability to translate VM code to native code, do that once. Then you're prepared for the future switch to whatever comes after the ARM processor, and you don't have to store a copy of the VM byte code on your phone or waste time interpreting or repeatedly re-JITing it.
  I am not generally keen on the idea of a VM on a portable device - but where it's done I think it should at least be done smartly. This does not conflict with the goal of "future-proofing" the OS. For instance, as I said before - the Google G1's hardware has that "Jazelle" extension on its ARM processor - that's hardware support for running Java bytecode faster... and Android doesn't use it, because Google decided to invent their own bytecode format for Android. They had their business reasons for doing this, but from a technical standpoint it seems stupid.
  I do remember the days before ARM was basically the default choice of processor for all portable devices. I, too, have seen what can happen to a platform that's had to migrate to a new architecture (as with Apple and Palm...) - and I don't imagine that ARM will be the one true processor forever. But I also don't frequently find myself needing to run ten-year-old PalmOS apps, you know what I mean? More changes on a platform in ten years than just the processor - and if the software isn't kept up to date with those changes then probably I'm not going to be using it much anyway.
  At any rate, I'm already pretty sure Android isn't for me. Actually I believe I've been pretty clear and consistent on that point. I thought it looked promising at first, but I'm not happy, overall, with their technical decisions. That's why I'm excited about the n900! I am aware that this choice may limit my options for third-party software - too bad about that, but that issue hasn't managed to draw me into the iPhone crowd, either. A straight Linux environment, running ARM code on an ARM processor sounds heavenly to me.
Wont be available on Sprint by SLot · 2009-08-27 06:50 · Score: 1

just got an email from my account rep:
I am not aware of any nokia devices on our road map.
[name redacted]
Sr. Account Executive
Sprint...Together With Nextel
All together now... by neiras · 2009-08-27 06:50 · Score: 1

Personally I'm down with Java as a language, I just don't see the point of running everything through a VM on a pocket machine.
If we were talking about running a huge J2SE-compliant VM on a phone, your outlook might be justified.
Java the Language and Java the Platform are not the same thing.
The Android virtual machine, Dalvik, does NOT have a Just-In-Time compiler and does NOT understand Java bytecode (no .class files here!). It's register based, which means it uses fewer VM instructions to execute the same application code as a standard JVM. It's actually quite efficient to run multiple Dalvik instances on a single device! This is not your father's JVM.
Java is not bound to heavy VM implementations. You can compile it to native code (gcj); you can compile it with the Mono stack; or you can use any number of JVM implementations, from Kaffe to IBM Java to OpenJDK to whatever else.
VM advantages for mobile devices: security (VM sandboxing), system updates (update the VM software, not the actual phone OS), deal with hardware differences (port the VM to your device, hello instant app ecosystem, no ARM build vs. Intel build vs. MIPS build problems), crash protection (whoops the VM crashed, but the phone can just start another).
Everyone has their language preferences, and that's fine - but chiming in with an ambiguous opinion because you recognize a keyword in a discussion is not particularly helpful.
N900 Video doesn't work on Linux desktop by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 06:53 · Score: 0

So I go to the Nokia site to watch this video http://maemo.nokia.com/videos/introducing-maemo-5 and it doesn't work on my Linux desktop. Boooo Nokia. Boooo.
BTW, I'm a current N800 owner and LOVE IT!
Not certain I want my cell phone to be this large. Also, I like controlling how my N800 connects (via BT or WLAN) to keep the costs low, but the 32GB of memory would be nice. Now if the running OS gets more - perhaps 2GB, that would be nice too. The N800 has 128MB for the OS and I've added 2x8GB SDHC flash for storage.
1. Re:N900 Video doesn't work on Linux desktop by jfanning · 2009-08-27 21:39 · Score: 1
  
  Uh, I was there yesterday on my Ubuntu desktop and it worked fine for me.
Really need FLAC by CranberryKing · 2009-08-27 07:35 · Score: 1

Sure someone will add it, probably pretty quick. But most users won't go get it and its lame that it won't be there out of the box.
Video Conferencing talks to the hand by CranberryKing · 2009-08-27 07:41 · Score: 1

Disappointed that most devices still place the camera on the back. I was hoping for the next iPod Touch w/ camera to do video conferencing via skype (example), but you have to flip it around to show your face. I'm surprised this is still the norm. It could be very cool functionality.
1. Re:Video Conferencing talks to the hand by Cisst · 2009-08-28 02:20 · Score: 1
  
  The n900 has a front facing vga cam for video calling. most 3g phones have this functionality, at least in europe they have.
Let's all be patronizing asshats! by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 07:43 · Score: 1

Personally I'm down with Java as a language, I just don't see the point of running everything through a VM on a pocket machine.
If we were talking about running a huge J2SE-compliant VM on a phone, your outlook might be justified.
The Android virtual machine, Dalvik, does NOT have a Just-In-Time compiler and does NOT understand Java bytecode (no .class files here!).
It also, as I understand it, means that the Java software on the phone cannot take advantage of the Java acceleration features of the hardware...

Java is not bound to heavy VM implementations. You can compile it to native code (gcj); you can compile it with the Mono stack; or you can use any number of JVM implementations, from Kaffe to IBM Java to OpenJDK to whatever else.
I don't believe I ever said otherwise.
Now, how many of these options are available on Android? Which of the above do you target if you're writing for Android?
One. You write code for Android, you compile it for Dalvik. This is one of the reasons Android tends not to appeal to me.

VM advantages for mobile devices: security (VM sandboxing), system updates (update the VM software, not the actual phone OS), deal with hardware differences (port the VM to your device, hello instant app ecosystem, no ARM build vs. Intel build vs. MIPS build problems), crash protection (whoops the VM crashed, but the phone can just start another).
VM sandboxing and VM crash protection are no better than the process-level sandboxing and crash protection you'd get from native code on a decent OS. At best, maybe the hardware will contain some nasty privilege escalation bug - which, I'll grant you, is worth something - but then only if the platform is designed so that nobody (including those who do actually need it) has native code execution privileges. But it's worth a lot more to Google, the folks investing in the OS and the platform, than it is to me, who would be running and maybe coding for the platform.
I don't really understand your point about being able to update the VM. What's the benefit there? What's so great about being able to update the VM without updating the rest of the phone's OS? Seems like, either way, you're replacing a critical component upon which large chunks of the phone's ability to operate depend.

Everyone has their language preferences, and that's fine - but chiming in with an ambiguous opinion because you recognize a keyword in a discussion is not particularly helpful.
Fuck you. I made my statement perfectly clear. To repeat: Someone's not a "poser" just 'cause they don't like a programming language. I actually do like Java, just not the VM baggage that comes with it. I don't think that's an unreasonable or uninformed position.

--
Bow-ties are cool.
1. Re:Let's all be patronizing asshats! by MaerD · 2009-08-27 08:59 · Score: 1
  
  So you're saying they took the body of a mustang and put in an electric engine from a 1981 golf cart and you can't understand why anyone would want to drive that?
  
  What? I'm just taking the title and the sig to a natural progression :)
  
  --
  I put on my robe and wizard hat..
2. Re:Let's all be patronizing asshats! by Tetsujin · 2009-08-27 10:00 · Score: 1
  
  So you're saying they took the body of a mustang and put in an electric engine from a 1981 golf cart and you can't understand why anyone would want to drive that?
  What? I'm just taking the title and the sig to a natural progression :)
  I make analogies, it doesn't mean I understand 'em. XD
  
  --
  Bow-ties are cool.
3. Re:Let's all be patronizing asshats! by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-28 00:10 · Score: 0
  
  Fuck you.
  I had respect for you post until that point. Then, for some reason, it disappeared.
  Fuck you, indeed.
4. Re:Let's all be patronizing asshats! by Tetsujin · 2009-08-28 02:47 · Score: 1
  
  Fuck you.
  I had respect for you post until that point. Then, for some reason, it disappeared.
  Fuck you, indeed.
  The situation called for a "fuck you". I could give two shits about whether Mr. Anonymous Coward respects me or not based on whether I tell a condescending prick to fuck off. It sounds like the whole validity of my post hinges on whether or not I bust out the effective vocabulary. What a crock of shit.
  
  --
  Bow-ties are cool.
Cortex-A8 by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 07:48 · Score: 0

" The beast is powered by an ARM Cortex-A8 processor at 600 MHz, has PowerVR SGX with OpenGL ES 2.0 support, 32GB internal memory etc."
The best part is.... It plugs directly into your cerebral cortex
Dude, am I serious? by itomato · 2009-08-27 07:57 · Score: 1

No.
I am padding my response with extra (crocodile) redundancy, in keeping with the theme of the thread.
Year of Linux on mobile by thetsguy · 2009-08-27 07:59 · Score: 0

Not sure about year of Linux desktop, this year is a Year of Linux mobile.
...between? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 08:03 · Score: 0

Make the difference between what and what?
Between you liking it and not liking it? Buying and not buying?
Heh?
Mystery solved! by AliasMarlowe · 2009-08-27 08:15 · Score: 1

Hold both the home button and the sleep/wake button for ~15 seconds. That should solve your problem.
So that's what makes them explode!

--
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. - Voltaire
You missed the point. It is Linux, and truely open by alukin · 2009-08-27 08:20 · Score: 1

Guys! You all missing the point that N900 as previous N700, N800 and N810 is truly open Linux platform with big and growing community around maemo.org I have Debian on my N810 co-existing with official OS with all it's bells and whistles. N900 is much faster so Debian will run on it smoothly and easily. It means you can have many thousands of applications of your choice running on your phone. Just install "Easy debian" package and put Debian's image on your microSD card. It means that you have full-featured computer in your pocket with a lot of possibilities opened by free software.
Besides it, new community developed OS "Mer" is synced with Ubuntu and developes quickly. It may became an OS of next generation for such devices.
Opportunity by 6031769 · 2009-08-27 08:55 · Score: 1

I think alukin has the key point here (for me, at any rate).
Mobile phones are very handy for making phone calls, but when you go beyond that what I would really like is a device that fits in my pocket with a decent battery life that I can use with OpenVPN/OpenSSH so I can actually do productive stuff when I'm stuck in (relatively) the middle of nowhere.
If this phone (or any other) can do that at a reasonable price then, yes, I'm definitely interested.

--
Burns: We're building a casino!
McAllister: Arrr. Give me 5 minutes.
Android compatibility by jspenguin1 · 2009-08-27 09:05 · Score: 1

I heard the folks at Canonical are working on an Android execution environment for Ubuntu, so you can run Android apps in a real environment. Somebody out there will port this to Maemo, and there will be no reason to have a phone that runs Android natively.
N95 + N800 = N900 by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 09:30 · Score: 0

It's like someone smushed an N800 and a N95 together.
I regularly use the N800 for VNC/RDP through SSH tunnels, Canola for music (with ogg support!) and video, Evince to read PDFs and DJVUs, phone calls with Skype, Python programming, Fennec or Iceweasel for web surfing, Pidgin for instant messaging, and Xournal for taking notes. It can take two 16GB SDHC cards. The Wi-Fi quality and range is amazing! It can multiboot Maemo/Android and run Debian (slowly). I find web browsing on the N800 far more pleasurable than using an iPhone. While the interface isn't as smooth, it doesn't have to be due to the higher screen resolution. You're not pinching your way in and out on a web page. Multi-touch is sadly lacking on the n800. The n800 with two 16GB SDHC cards cost me under $200 last year.
The N95 8GB is a decent slider phone with a great 5MP camera and a so-so GPS.
The N800 and the N95 pair well. Having the capabilities of both in a single device will be great.
Let me guess by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 09:43 · Score: 0

Locked in to one carrier so that half the country can't use it, ala iPhone.
Development environment? by Mrrrrrrr · 2009-08-27 11:49 · Score: 1

Can someone comment on the development environment for this item? Thanks.
Comparing with iPhone by magi · 2009-08-27 11:57 · Score: 1

I didn't find any good comparison, so I wrote a simple comparison table: http://markogronroos.blogspot.com/2009/08/n900-vs-iphone.html
Looks like N900 wins iPhone easily on hardware specs, though iPhone does have a few advantages (slimmer, possibly better touchscreen). N900 wins on some very important software issues as well, such as Flash and Skype, though iPhone does have much more software (commercial), at least until old maemo software works in Maemo 5 (if it doesn't directly).
My guess is that iPhone will win in usability and responsiveness, but that's just a guess, Nokia has a chance to surprise us there. I'll be waiting for N900 eagerly and will possibly buy it at some point, although my E90 is just 2 years old and has much much better keyboard than even N900...
Oh, I really hate the three-row keyboard concept in N810, N97 and now N900. I've actually had real nightmares about using Nokia's bluetooth keyboard, which also has the numbers and qwerty row combined. That's definitely the worst thing in N900.
Next year's Orphan device by Tekoneiric · 2009-08-27 13:30 · Score: 1

Nokia doesn't have a good track record at maintaining support to their previous Linux devices. I've owned a 700 and currently own an 800. Both models had issues. When I first bought a 700 I had to exchange it because the screen was DOA, the second one's screen eventually degraded into a colorful unuseable display. Again with the 800 I bought one then had to exchange it because it was DOA. While it hasn't died yet, they never seemed to correct problems with the OS that causes it to rapidly discharge the battery. Of course they aren't going to port Maemo OS5 to the older hardware, it's only for the newer device. I ended up buying a netbook and my n800 will probably end up sitting on a shelf somewhere as a clock, weather or photo viewer till it dies. I've sworn off buying Nokia products.

--
*It's not what you can do for the Dark Side but what the Dark Side can do for you!*
Linux on the AP only, not the BaseBand, right? by CityZen · 2009-08-27 13:47 · Score: 1

Every (?) smart phone has (at least) 2 CPUs: the Applications Processor and the BaseBand unit.
The AP runs all your fancy UI + user software, while the BBU just deals with phone calls
(well, interfacing with the cell phone network, at any rate).
I presume that BBUs are still very proprietary and locked down, or else cell phone companies
would (rightly so) freak out over the possibility of network hacking?
But! by rhinokitty · 2009-08-27 13:54 · Score: 1

That is better than the laptop I am typing this from, the specs are simply cramtastic!

But does it run Linu-- Nevermind.
Debian by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 16:06 · Score: 0

Awesome to see another Debian-based distro have success in the marketplace! Now if only Debian could be successful!
Bringing the locks into linux world by BhaKi · 2009-08-27 16:24 · Score: 1

It doesn't matter that it runs linux. It runs a pretty locked-down linux-based distribution. It doesn't even have a terminal application. How do I create shell scripts? What kind of freedom is this? It's absolutely not for power users. I'd rather buy an OpenMoko or Android rather than this.

--
The largest prime factor of my UID is 263267.
1. Re:Bringing the locks into linux world by Slashcrap · 2009-08-27 20:33 · Score: 1
  
  It doesn't matter that it runs linux. It runs a pretty locked-down linux-based distribution. It doesn't even have a terminal application. How do I create shell scripts? What kind of freedom is this? It's absolutely not for power users. I'd rather buy an OpenMoko or Android rather than this.
  You seem to have just made some shit up and then criticised them for doing the shit you just made up. This is generally frowned upon.
2. Re:Bringing the locks into linux world by Meumeu · 2009-08-27 22:04 · Score: 1
  
  Instead of making shit up, you can probably help this guy. And before you start bullshitting again, yes, you have a root access.
3. Re:Bringing the locks into linux world by Explo · 2009-08-29 23:06 · Score: 1
  
  Where did you get the idea that it doesn't have a terminal application? A bit of googling proves this to be not quite true:
  http://flors.wordpress.com/2009/08/27/software-freedom-lovers-here-comes-maemo-5/
  
  --
  Everyone who makes generalizations should be shot.
Despite your UID by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-27 22:43 · Score: 0

You seem to have just made some shit up and then criticised them for doing the shit you just made up. This is generally frowned upon.
You must be new here.
Less sucky than android? by Anonymous Coward · 2009-08-28 01:35 · Score: 0

I might drop Android for Maemo. Nokia is doing a fine job lately.
I want my PIPE "|" on the keyboard by 1_brown_mouse · 2009-08-28 02:42 · Score: 1

Please!?
I'll trade you the Euro or the British Pound symbol for the Pipe.
Hmmm, maybe I can swap the symbols in the OS.
BRB
N900 vs iPhone v3 vs Palm Pre by t482 · 2009-08-28 06:43 · Score: 1

In terms of hack-ability it seems like the ranking is Nokia Maemo(with slimmed down X.org), Pre (directfb - framebuffer driver), Android (java rendering), Apple (I don't know about Symbian). I have to hand it to Palm - their approach of porting webkit to run in directfb is a nice Idea. Personally I think the future of app development on these phones is simply to use HTML 5