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A Tour of Taser HQ
Soychemist writes "Walk into the Taser headquarters in Scottsdale, Arizona and it may seem like you are on an episode of Get Smart. The foyer is like a fortress, with giant steel doors and biometric identification systems. Inside, factory workers meticulously assemble the less-lethal weapons by hand and then put them through a battery of safety tests. In addition to making pistol-shaped devices, the company also produces the electronic equivalent of a claymore mine, which hurls dozens of electrified needles at the push of a button and electronic shotgun cartridges that deliver a powerful jolt."
There is no intended non-lethal purpose, because it is non non-lethal.
Most /. readers USED TO BE Wired readers, back in the 90's when it was relevant, interesting, and had actual production value (of a sort).
Now it's just geek playboy. A couple interesting articles, 60 pages of glossy shwag for sale, and a desperate sense of self-promotion.
Well, maybe it hasn't changed THAT much... maybe my gadget pr0n tastes have evolved. Either way, leave it on Digg.
The term electronic police state describes a state in which the government aggressively uses electronic technologies to record, organize, search and taze its citizens.
If you treat me like an animal don't be surprised when i bite you in the face.
"Kill 'em all and let Root sort 'em out"
What exactly is the intended non-lethal purpose of such a thing?
I'm gonna take a totally wild guess here: to make profits for Taser Inc.?
If libertarians are so opposed to effective government, why don't they all move to Somalia?
The foyer is like a fortress, with giant steel doors and biometric identification systems...
Security like that for a business like theirs is just for show. It's there for all the "foreign dignitaries" with their big pocket books. Which makes me think of other elements of their corporate identity. These people market "non-lethal" weapons and then cover up the research that says that blasting tens of thousand of volts through the human nervous system might just have some negative effects. Not that there isn't a ton of historical evidence saying that when you science and law enforcement meet, a conspiracy usually results. Taser's products are not "non-lethal", they are "less lethal"... But the police and people who buy their equipment love to watch people scream and fall over because they smarted off to them, and for this, Taser Corporation delivers. And although their products could easily be designed to be more humanitarian, curiously these changes never make it to market.
#fuckbeta #iamslashdot #dicemustdie
I know this is offtopic (somewhat) so I won't mind if it's moderated out of usefulness, but I'll get on my soapbox at this point.
A taser should only ever be used as an alternative to shooting somebody. If you wouldn't shoot them in the same situation, you shouldn't taser them.
Resisting arrest alone should not mean tasering is on the table, even with a difficult struggle. Law enforcement is getting way to used to tasering simply to avoid any kind of physical confrontation.
If tasers didn't have the lethality question hanging over them I would think differently, but according to Amnesty International, at least, 334 people died after taser shocks between 2001 and 2008.
There is no intended non-lethal purpose, because it is non non-lethal.
Yes, non-lethal, except for the 100's of times it has killed people. Tasers are nothing but a torture device used like a cattle prod when people don't "comply" with police orders.
They were originally intended to be used in cases where a gun would have been used. These devices would never be used against people in the manner they now are in a truly free society.
If you have something that you dont want anyone to know, maybe you shouldnt be doing it in the first place -Eric Schmidt
Just like a club is less lethal than a sword... but it still does 1d6.
Personally, most taser incidents where the perp is not threatening the officer's safety should be replaced with a rap on the calf or elsewhere with a smaller billy-club. Still hurts, without resorting to electric shocks. Less likely to die from 'mysterious circumstances' from a sharp rap on a muscle than from electrical pulses (and less of an uproar, probably, when they do).
Write your representatives! Repeal the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics!
These guys are just grown up kids who liked to make toy guns when they were little. The security doors and all of this hi-tech warhgarble is testament to it too. They have no reason to need this kind of security at the front doors. It is a a front for games that they play in their minds. They are constantly at war with the unseen enemy and must constantly be on guard to protect themselves from this invisible juggernaut. So really, the 'electronic equivalent of a claymore mine' is to protect themselves from their imaginary enemies, nothing more. Sad thing is that people will use these things against innocent people, maybe some who aren't so innocent it will be used correctly, but occasionally used just because people like to impose their power upon others. Then all of their actions were justified, for here is a real enemy and our contraption did exactly what it was supposed to do! At least these guys don't try to make lethal devices, as once their power tripping is over there is at least someone who is alive in the end.
I understand the less lethal part, but doesn't anyone see the inherent danger of hurling electrified needles into the air. It could poke your eye out then send a electric charge right to the head. Into your mouth if your screaming or yelling. The jugular vein is basically unprotected and a unlucky shot there could puncture it. On another note, wonder if their testing includes a person wearing different types of clothing for like summer and winter. Also if the voltage needed to subdue someone fluctuates greatly between people of different weights.
Or the police could just go back to using guns...
No good deed goes unpunished. - Avon, Blake's 7
This foyer may look like the entrance to the Control headquarters from an episode of Get Smart, but this is the front door of the Taser plant. The corporation has plenty of reasons for high security. It recently launched an online warehouse for digital evidence, so keeping trespassers out is a top priority.
Looking at the image, my impression is that this is more about appearances than real security. It's all about looking high-tech and security oriented.
Because it's the exception.
People die in car crashes daily and regularly (one cite I saw said 115), but at best they're mentioned on traffic reports. "Fatal car accident on I-5, traffic backed up for miles..." You'll never hear about those outside of the local area unless someone famous is involved.
But a plane crash that results in fatailites gets reported nationwide for a good week.
The more statistically improbable a fatal incident is, the more probable it will be reported on.
Yeah, because when they used guns exclusively it was commonplace to shoot someone in cuffs for struggling against being put in a police car, or shoot someone, yell "get up" at them, then shoot them again cause they can't.
Using Tasers instead of guns is a good thing, but they are constantly being used in situations which would not warrent the use of a firearm, and Taser International's own training and marketing material is a least partly to blame.
# cat
Damn, my RAM is full of llamas.
Right, but that should be reserved for times when otherwise an officer would use a firearm to subdue the perp. Tasers have expanded their role to include instances where the officer would have just hit the perp and been rough with them.
There are some times when a taser can fit between these two places (some massive dude high on PCP is threatening to pummel a cop with his fists, I'm not going to require the cop to subdue him physically if he has access to a stun gun), but in general, I think that most of your taser stories ('don't tase me bro' guy or the naked wizard) would be better handled by just cuffing them roughly. Of course, when you have a dude covered in kerosene charging you with a lighter, a taser seems like a better alternative than an officer dying or needing to shoot the guy in the kneecaps.
Write your representatives! Repeal the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics!
The same can be said for airbags and seatbelts. Therefore, these things must all be banned, right?
Any sufficiently unpopular but cohesive argument is indistinguishable from trolling.
"Pain compliance"? In other words, torture.
The real "Libtards" are the Libertarians!
I see what you did there, you changed the words. Tasers are called less than lethal not non-lethal.
But I do agree with you they are over used. Personally I think that the officer should draw their gun when they would normally be allowed to tase the perp. If that doesn't work and its save to switch from a gun to a taser they should then do so.
Plus they can show off all their thank you letters from the governments of Burma, Iran, North Korea, China...
It's not the size of the dog in the fight.
It's the size of the fight in the dog.
Trust me on this.
I knew two female police officers, neither of which I would challenge, despite outweighing them. being significantly taller, more reach, and stronger by every objective measure. EVEN^H^H^H^HEspecially without their gun being handy. They do not need anything but their hands.
And one of them died when a drunk driver ran her over and then went back and beat her to death.
Tasers are no doubt used inappropriately, and police officers exercise bad judgement occasionally, possible even more often. But you never know what is going to happen as a police officer.
When I get pulled over, I put my hands on the dash, ask the officer what they want me to do, tell them what I am reaching for, where, and what it will look like. I want the officer to be confident they know what is happening. No surprises, nothing unexpected. I don't want to become a victim of bad judgement, knowing it will probably be my own mistake that sets off that series of events.
And yet, we should expect our officers to improve their practices and avoid killing us unecessarily.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
Tasers have expanded their role to include instances where the officer would have just hit the perp and been rough with them.
Actually, they've expanded their role to include instances where the officer just wants to punish someone when they don't do as they're told, like when they can't move because they're lying on the ground with a broken back.
The truth of the matter is simply that the perps know you (as a police officer) can not shoot them unless they are offering deadly force against you or another. It is however legal to taze them if they offer resistance. If you pull your pistol on a perp and he knows you have no right to shoot, he will laugh and keep doing what he is doing, pull a tazer and he will change his mind. It is legal for a police officer to taze some one anytime they have a reason to place their hands on them, this IMHO is inappropriate and should be judged according to the situation.
(IAaPO) not that it matters.
The rest of the blame can be attributed to how fun it is to taser someone, of course.
Yeah it definitely would not be a good tool for LE or riot control. The un-aimed barbs would have serious eye-injury potential.
Can you be Even More Awesome?!
Right, but that should be reserved for times when otherwise an officer would use a firearm to subdue the perp
Firearms are not used to subdue perps. Firearms are used to end a threat to the life of the officer or another innocent person. The only occasion I'm aware of where firearms are allowed to be used to "subdue" people is in the case of a prison guard shooting a prison escapee. Your regular beat cop is not allowed to use his firearm to "subdue" someone. He's only allowed to use it to save his own life or the life of another.
Tasers have expanded their role to include instances where the officer would have just hit the perp and been rough with them.
That's exactly what they are intended for. Situations where non-deadly force would have been used. Their role hasn't been expanded at all. What's been expanded is the willingness of officers to use force during inappropriate times. Tasing someone in handcuffs just because he said something nasty to the Judge is no more appropriate than hitting him would have been.
but in general, I think that most of your taser stories ('don't tase me bro' guy or the naked wizard) would be better handled by just cuffing them roughly.
Why? So you run the risk of injuring two people (the officer and the perp) instead of one? How is that better? Have you ever been trained in restraint techniques? I have been -- as part of my employment at a mental health facility. It's not that easy to take someone down without injuring them or yourself. How is injuring the perp while subduing him with your hands any better than injuring him while subduing him with a Taser?
Of course, when you have a dude covered in kerosene charging you with a lighter, a taser seems like a better alternative than an officer dying or needing to shoot the guy in the kneecaps.
You wouldn't shoot for the kneecaps in such a situation. You'd shoot center of mass. Shooting someone's legs/kneecaps/hand-holding-the-knife is a Hollywood myth. It's just too hard to pull off in the real world. If you shoot a 2" group with a handgun at the range with paper targets you are going to shoot a 10" group when being charged by some nutjob intent on ending your life. That's what happens when you get an adrenaline dump and your fine motor skills go to hell. That's why police officers are trained to shoot center of mass.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
Unfortunately, criminals have evolved.
In 1930s USA we had "beat cops" that would walk through neighborhoods in cities. Their very presence deterred crime. Should someone be as unwise as to steal an apple from a box outside a market, they would often be chased down and caught by the beat cop. At least that was the idea.
The beat cop did indeed have a tough life being on their feet for their entire shift and being only lightly armed, generally a club and a small revolver. Criminals of the day would often have more substantial weapons, but the Firearms act of 1934 attempted to change that making it a Federal offense to have an unlicensed machine gun. Things pretty much went back to the same level they had been at since the late 1800s or so.
Since that time, criminals have virtually cornered the market on firepower in the cities. Your average cop has a 9mm Berreta with a 15-round clip. The folks they are going up against have at a minimum guns like the Tec DC-9 with a 30 round clip and often operates in full automatic. The end result is of course that the police have no idea what they are going up against.
And you wonder why they might like to stay back from criminals?
"They" ... Why do you just through all Police under the same buss with some idiot who needs to be charged with assault and battery?
Just because some one dose something like this means all police think they can and should do it?
Well, obviously not a single cop or anyone working in any position in law enforcement there did ONE DAMN THING about that illegal immoral injustice.
So yes, every last single cop in that police department is morally bankrupt and clearly has NO objections to assault and battery of a 19 year old kid with a broken back, else they would have, I don't know, objected instead of providing excuses.
I mean, if you have proof otherwise, then please put it forward.
My proof however is their very actions, during and after what happened to the kid.
wow. just...WOW.
do not read this line twice.
Yep.
That there is a man who has fully accepted that it is the people's job to make the lives of the police easier rather than the police's job to make the lives of the people easier.
When information is power, privacy is freedom.