Slashdot Mirror


One Telescope Per Child

An anonymous reader writes "It seems one-<object>-per-child goes beyond laptops. A project from the International Astronomical Union (IAU) has designed a high-quality, $20 telescope they're calling the Galileoscope, hoping to spark interest in astronomy among kids and make good scopes available to many who otherwise could not afford one. But as OLPC learned, it's not that easy; they are struggling to get enough volume to get production ramped up and costs down, resorting to tricks like auctioning off a few autographed ones, and trying Give-One-Get-One."

18 of 63 comments (clear)

  1. Better than they need to be? by tylerni7 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    An interesting benefit in living in poorer countries is that there is far less light pollution.
    Maybe they could make these even cheaper by making some of the optics smaller (reducing the aperture), since something good enough to see Saturn's rings in rural America should be far more capable in an area with almost zero light pollution, like rural Africa.

    1. Re:Better than they need to be? by tylerni7 · · Score: 2, Informative

      It says in the article that one of the project goals was to be able to see Saturn's rings, and I know personally that one can see Saturn's rings with a fairly small telescope.
      (Of course it depends on the orientation of Saturn and its rings, but assuming they are ideally situated, I don't see why someone wouldn't be able to see its rings, although IANAA)

    2. Re:Better than they need to be? by Nyeerrmm · · Score: 2, Informative

      On its closest approach, Saturn is about 7 AU away. The diameter of its rings are about 360,000 km. Doing the math, this means that best case scenario, the angular size of Saturn including its rings is around 1 arcminute. The 2-inch diameter Galileoscope has a diffraction limited angular resolution of 0.05 arcminutes. The gap between the rings and the planet (around 6000 km) is going to be about 0.02 arcminutes. This is all large enough we can safely ignore atmospheric seeing.

      So basically this scope is going to be capable of seeing the rings of Saturn quite easily, although they won't be clearly distinguishable from the planet. This is exactly what early astronomers saw, and while it confused them at the time, any kid who has seen a picture is going to know immediately what it is. While the picture in a book or the view from a big expensive telescope is obviously going to be more impressive, there is something to be said for being able to see it at all with your own equipment in your own backyard. Personally, I bought myself a 5" newtonian for personal use even though my current work involves setting up and operating two 16" SCTs, for that very reason.

      And I'm not sure what it being a refractor has to do with it. Tripod is definitely an issue though. I personally like the Celestron FirstScope http://www.celestron.com/c3/category.php?CatID=92 better for that reason, plus it has an extra inch of aperture - it is $50 vs. $20 though.

    3. Re:Better than they need to be? by PopeRatzo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm thinking One Pocketknife Per Child.

      Telescope? How many bags of rice can you trade a telescope for?

      Sometimes, I get the impression that these do-gooders have never left their own neighborhood.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    4. Re:Better than they need to be? by Beowabbit · · Score: 2, Informative

      First of all you're going to need a stable tripod, probably costing as much as the telescope itself.

      It's designed to work with a camera tripod, which works well since it's so light. But the other night I was able to get a pretty good (if very small) view of Jupiter and a couple of its larger moons just bracing my elbows on a porch railing. When Saturn's inclination with respect to the earth is such that its rings are easy to see (not the case right now), I'm sure you'll be able to see them (meaning see that they exist, not necessarily get a good clear view) without a tripod.

      (I got one for myself and one for my girlfriend, and I think it was a great purchase. The instructions that came with the kit were ambiguous and incomplete, but there's a good thorough PDF with photos on the web site.)

    5. Re:Better than they need to be? by Omestes · · Score: 2, Informative

      My Dad bought one of these for $20 for the Galileo anniversary, they only go up to around 50x (by combining the 30x and 20x lenses), so a tripod isn't really necessary being that these are about as powerful as cheap binoculars. The 50x combination, though, has a VERY small angle of view though, meaning it might necessitate a tripod, the 20x and 30x lenses, though, probably won't need one. Without using a tripod, I managed to observe 2 of Jupiter's moons, with a largish amount of light pollution, without the assistance of a tripod. So I don't see this as a problem. This isn't intended for "hardcore" astronomy, so it fits its purpose just fine.

      That said, it does have a standard tripod mount, if you want to use it, as well. It also uses a rifle sight for aiming, which I found VERY amusing.

      The most interesting bit of this telescope is the fact that you must assemble it yourself, allowing you to muck around with the various lenses, thus learning the proper placement for your optics. The "hands-on" aspect of this is probably more important that the actual use as a telescope. Believe it or not, it gave me the opportunity to spend around an hour teaching my dad basic principles of optics, without him getting too bored. I can imagine this would be even more useful as a teaching aid to the intended audience.

      --
      A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government. -edward abbey
    6. Re:Better than they need to be? by Omestes · · Score: 2, Informative

      I've actually used one of these; A tripod isn't strictly necessary. With the 50x lens combination (combining the 20x and 30x) I could see Jupiter's moons without the assistance of a tripod, though sighting it was a bit "odd" using the built in rifle sights. I couldn't test it on Saturn, thanks to bad weather and light pollution.

      This was at my fathers, so I didn't have my usual $70 photography tripod around, but he had one that was around $14.99 at Fry's Electronics, which worked fine with the Galileoscope. You really don't need quality with this telescope, its pretty much an educational toy meant for children. Also, as stated, the main interest of this is the DUY aspects of installing your own lenses.

      I have seen $70 reflectors with base mounts included that are higher than max 50x before (yes, cheap, and very simple), so getting a $50 tripod is a bit silly. The main joy of this is that it is a quick, easy, kit for learning. The design doesn't really lead to "quality" observations thanks to a ton of light leakage, and less than accurate plastic lenses. In a certain sense, it is inferior to cheap binoculars. But that isn't the point.

      --
      A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government. -edward abbey
    7. Re:Better than they need to be? by Omestes · · Score: 2

      Food and water are important, at least as far as short term survival goes. Education is MORE beneficial in the long term. That is the large problem with developing nations, you can feed them, and throw money at them until your blue in the face, and you never approach the long term problems that cause the problems.

      As someone here on /. once said (sorry for the vague attribution, and general butchery, whoever you are); "give a man a fire and you keep him warm for the night; set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life".

      --
      A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government. -edward abbey
    8. Re:Better than they need to be? by herojig · · Score: 3, Informative

      Here in rural Nepal, we would use the telescope to see when ama was going to get up the hill with fresh water, or dada was returning from the hilltop with a bit of fresh meat. A similar thing is happening with the $200 netbook project, they are becoming the village telephone and whatnot when the power goes out for the mandatory 6 hours or so. But this is not to say that new low-cost educational tech is not useful or not needed more then fresh water, sanitation, shelter, and food. The low cost cell phone microscope is saving lives, and laptops are powering entire comm links for villages without power most of the time. Keep it all coming!
      Jigs in Nepal

      --
      I think therefore I can't be ~TTNH
  2. Should go well with the slashdot-crowd. by elFisico · · Score: 2, Funny

    Given that most of us watch real life only through keyholes and telescopes... :o)

    *ducksandrunsforcover*

  3. A direct link by dakameleon · · Score: 3, Informative

    A direct link to the Galileoscope project site would be great, wouldn't you think?

    --
    Man who leaps off cliff jumps to conclusion.
  4. Re:Kids will be bored by Colonel+Korn · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Noble intentions indeed.
    Call me a skeptic, but when you can get a basic refractive telescope plus tripod (which will easily cost more than the scope itself) for under $40 I'm not exactly enthusiastic about this. And when kids find out that all they can do is look at the moon and get headaches, they'll learn one thing: Astronomy without super-expensive equipment is boring.

    Even with only your eyes and the night sky, astronomy isn't boring. It requires effort, however. Sure, most kids may not care about the sky. But like most interests, it becomes more engrossing as more effort is put into it. Go outside at midnight every night, sit on a roof, and sketch the sky. Learn the names of the things you can see, figure out when they'll be where, watch the planets move, look up notable events like meteor showers.

    Now go buy a good pair of 10x50 binoculars. Look at the Orion Nebula. It's easy to find and it's cool. Now go looking for Messier objects. Andromeda's a good choice - it's quite visible in binos even in a city like San Jose on the right night, but it takes a little effort to find at first. Work your way to more difficult objects. Learn what they are. Learn what they do.

    There's as much to keep you, or a kid, entertained in astronomy as there is in anything else. It just takes some effort, and after the night sky sketching it will likely be fun all the way. Or it may not be for you, but it doesn't hurt to try.

    --
    "I zero-index my hamsters" - Willtor (147206)
  5. I've used one by abarrow · · Score: 3, Informative

    A buddy brought one of these on our last backpacking trip. Nice an light, and surprisingly good for something with plastic optics. A couple of words of warning: the images are inverted, so they are great for looking at the sky but not as good for spying on your fellow backpackers. Also, the focus is a simple slide, so it's tough to get a good focus without moving the scope around. I can see how a kid might grow impatient with those faults. You are going to want to put this on a secure tripod - they aren't so good holding in your hands.

    Aside from that, I agree that this is something that every kid should have. Perhaps it will get them outside looking at the sky instead of inside immersed in some FPS game.

  6. Re:Done! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    1girl1telescope

    I'm so sorry I said that.

  7. Re:Kids will be bored by tunapez · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Don't forget the impending moon impact in a couple weeks, lunar eclipses, passes of the space station. How many stars can be seen in the Pleiades Constellation? (there's more than 7 sisters)

    What really changed my attitude when I was younger was to visualize the sky not as a 2 dimensional canvas with bears and dippers, but in the third dimension by imagining the distance variations between the brighter and smaller stars. Judging distance by size/luminosity proved to be inaccurate, but it was good for a start. The planets/stars size comparison videos really drive that lesson home.

    --
    Imagination drew in bold strokes, instantly serving hopes and fears, while knowledge advanced by slow increments...
  8. Re:Kids will be bored by LordVader717 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    True. I would probably say though that Astronomy without a telescope is more interesting than with one. You can learn the constellations and see how the planets move across them. Or how meteor showers originate from the same patch of sky. Or viewing predicted transits or man-made satellites. With a telescope you try to concentrate too much on how good you see something rather than what you're seeing.

  9. My daughter's arrived last week by StyroCupMan · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I am an amateur astronomer and bought one of these for my 12-year-old daughter's birthday. I thought it would be a fun daddy-daughter project putting it together and that it would be a good first telescope for her. I got it before they raised the price recently, so mine was around $23 shipped.

    Here is my honest review of the scope and my buying experience. It took about two months longer than they said for it to arrive and their communication was non-existent. I was billed but never got a shipping notification. The invoice said it would take 4-6 weeks for delivery. After 6 weeks had passed, I tried to contact them to find out what the status was.

    They have a phone number and email address listed on the site you can use to contact them, but the phone is never answered and just goes to voicemail, which was full the two times I called it. My emails were never answered. They eventually put up some vague delay information on their website, and I did finally get the telescope 11 weeks after I ordered it.

    It was a fun project putting the scope together. The instructions were not very good, but we printed off some more detailed instructions from their website and everything went smoothly. The optics are good quality. Much, much better than your standard cheap department store telescope. We took it out on the first night and got a pretty good view of Jupiter. Note that the scope does not come with a tripod. I knew that (it is clear on their website) and had a couple photo tripods ready to use it on.

    There are two main downsides to the scope. The first is the focuser. If you have used a regular telescope, you know that they all come with rack-and-pinion focusers. With this scope, you slide the eyepiece tube in and out (like an old pirate-y telescope) to focus. It is very difficult to keep an object in view (like Jupiter) when you have to slide the tube in and out. There is a lot of friction, but there has to be or it will just slide out of focus. So focusing is an exercise in frustration. My daughter was unable to do it and I had a pretty hard time myself.

    The second is that it cannot use a diagonal. There is not enough travel in the focuser to allow a diagonal. That means that you strain your neck trying to see objects higher in the sky.

    Having laid that information out for you, I still think it is a good scope. I hope my daughter gets some use out of it. I think that with practice the focusing will get easier.

    --
    If I may say so, life is a game, and there's so much to do and so few turns.
    -Reiner Knizia
  10. Re:light pollution? by Lord_Byron · · Score: 2, Informative

    While I disagree with your aggressively hostile attitude towards the Galileoscope project, an Internet-connected scope sounds like a really good idea. I took a quick Google & found a couple already, such as The Internet Telescope but what they seem to lack is real-time control. Sending off an email to request an image of something that a backyard astronomer cannot see is cool, but lacks the visceral thrill of twiddling the knobs.

    I remember seeing a robot arm on the Internet in the early days - you could move it, stack blocks, etc. Maybe something like that would be interesting - mount a scope on a tripod with servos (a ham radio satellite tracking mount, maybe?) with a camera (what type?) mounted to the end.

    I'm going to need a good think about this, and I sadly lack a place to *put* it. Thanks for the idea, though. I wish you'd signed a name to your post so I could credit you if I manage to go somewhere with this.