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William Gibson's Neuromancer Staged With Porn Star

destinyland writes "Sunday night saw a reading of the William Gibson's classic cyberpunk novel featuring porn star Sasha Grey at a New York art museum, along with sculpture-props simulating virtual reality. Artist Brody Condon promised to combine 'Gibson's 1980s dystopian techno-fetishism with early twentieth-century abstraction,' but the editor of H+ magazine challenges that description. 'In a 1993 interview, Gibson himself told me: "I think my world looks dystopian if you're a middle class white guy doing reasonably well in 1993... There are so many places in the world today that are so much crappier than anything I'm writing about."' And earlier this month William Gibson shared his response to a blog post about the event. 'Gol' dang! It's news to me!'"

204 comments

  1. Not a play, just by Zerth · · Score: 1

    "The performance event... occurring at the new museum is a deadpan reading of Gibson's reading, not a theatre piece. "

    .

    Rats

    1. Re:Not a play, just by lnlypaladin · · Score: 2

      Isn't that what books on tape are for?

      Oh well. I think it would be better as a movie than as a play anyway. Unfortunately the special effects department would probably get carried away when the characters jack in and suck up so much time that they'd forget to tell the story.

      --
      Even those with good senses of humor, honor, and saintly intentions must occasionally require the use of a strong shield
    2. Re:Not a play, just by Terminus32 · · Score: 0

      Is the film even in production yet?
      I read the book for the first time recently, brilliant stuff!

      --
      http://nathanlindsell.blogspot.com/
    3. Re:Not a play, just by sopssa · · Score: 1

      Well, it's probably more to do with the producer than the special effects team, as they're usually just following directors orders. It's kind of like theres both chocolate and vanilla ice creams, but it's possible to eat them together too and sometimes its even more delicious that way. Or you could also pour some chocolate dipping in to it, or cookie crunchs and m&m's on top.

    4. Re:Not a play, just by dskzero · · Score: 1

      Is there actually a film even planned?

      --
      Oblivion Awaits
    5. Re:Not a play, just by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      All this talk of chocolate and vanilla ice cream in response to an article about Sasha Grey makes my id go wild...

    6. Re:Not a play, just by ae1294 · · Score: 2, Funny

      All this talk of chocolate and vanilla ice cream in response to an article about Sasha Grey makes my id go wild...

      My ID would like to subscribe to your newsletter... RIGHT NOW...

    7. Re:Not a play, just by PopeRatzo · · Score: 4, Funny

      I've staged War of the Worlds in my living room with my cats as the aliens, but it didn't make it onto Slashdot.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    8. Re:Not a play, just by E+IS+mC(Square) · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I hope not.

    9. Re:Not a play, just by mujadaddy · · Score: 1

      Are you a female porn star?

      --
      Populus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur...
      "Force shits upon Reason's back." - Poor Richard's Almanac
    10. Re:Not a play, just by residieu · · Score: 1

      Have a look at Johnny Mnemonic if you want to know what Hollywood would do with a Gibson movie.

    11. Re:Not a play, just by qtzlctl · · Score: 1

      "I WANT ROOM SERVICE!!!!!!!!!!!!
        I WANT THE CLUB SANDWICH!!!!
        I WANT THE 10,000$ A NIGHT HOOKER!!
        I WANT MY CLOTHES LAUNDERED AND IRONED LIKE THEY DO AT THE TOKYO....IMPERIAL...HOTEL"

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmrNxrY8WJI

    12. Re:Not a play, just by savorymedia · · Score: 1

      Close. Very close. But, you forgot "I WANT THE COLD, MEXICAN BEER!" :)

      I whipped the DVD back out and watched this a few nights ago. It's a guilty pleasure. /pedant

      --
      1 is the square root of all evil.
    13. Re:Not a play, just by clem · · Score: 1

      Yeah. Needed more porn stars.

      --
      Your courageous and selfless spelling corrections have made me a better person.
    14. Re:Not a play, just by Ihmhi · · Score: 1

      It's kind of like theres both chocolate and vanilla ice creams, but it's possible to eat them together too and sometimes its even more delicious that way.

      Yeah, I like interracial lesbian porn, too.

      Wait, what's this book stuff in my porn story?

    15. Re:Not a play, just by e9th · · Score: 1

      For better or worse, there's one in pre-production. Lots of IMDB message board comments.

    16. Re:Not a play, just by Meski · · Score: 1

      The trick Hollywood use is to buy plausible existing book titles, and then hire lunatic monkeys on crack to come up with a script that is in no way related to the book.

  2. Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Informative

    Sasha Grey is the Queen of Loser Porn.

    Amazing to see that in 2009 movie makers would still be trying something as stupid as hoping that casting some second tier porn skank is going to help hype and sell their film.

    1. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What's "Loser Porn"?

    2. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      What's "Loser Porn"?

      It's "I can't even dream of having sex with a girl as pretty and intelligent as Sasha Grey, so I'll just call her a skank and call her work 'loser porn'".

    3. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 1

      Loser porn is like when the male role is played by a Slashdot reader living in his mother's basement. :-P

      No, seriously, I think the parent is referring to Grey's like of consensual degradation.

      Anyway, I wouldn't call Sasha Grey a "second tier porn skank." At one point she was pegged to be the next Jenna Jameson.

    4. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      Every "second tier porn skank" was "at one point pegged to be the next Jenna Jameson."

    5. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1, Funny

      What's "Loser Porn"?

      It's a redundancy, like "sweet sugar".

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    6. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Every "second tier porn skank" was - at multiple points - pegged, repeatedly.

    7. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Lord+Kano · · Score: 1, Informative

      I've never seen any of her films, so I can't comment on whether or not it's "loser porn", but someone who sucks dick for money is certainly a skank.

      LK

      --
      "Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
    8. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      A skank would be the one doing the pegging, not the one being pegged.

    9. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Clover_Kicker · · Score: 1

      I'll bite, who's a top tier porn star?

    10. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by R2.0 · · Score: 1

      Alternate explanation - a typo. He meant "looser" porn.

      --
      "As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
    11. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Rakshasa+Taisab · · Score: 1

      I checked out her picture and have to say Yuck. You spank to porn of someone like that when there's so much better looking girls to download?

      --
      - These characters were randomly selected.
    12. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Clover_Kicker · · Score: 1

      This thread is useless without pictures!

      Or at least links to these better looking girls.

    13. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sasha Grey.

      She fought out of porn and into mainstream acting. That's like swimming up a waterfall -- it can be done, but it's ridiculously hard.

    14. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "a girl as pretty and intelligent as Sasha Grey"
      Pretty? Maybe. But "intelligent". No, really? You probably meant something else...

    15. Re:Queen of 'Loser Porn' - Yawn by Lord+Kano · · Score: 1

      How is this offtopic? TFA is about a Porn "Star" in a play.

      LK

      --
      "Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
  3. Shiny Red Ball by SeeSp0tRun · · Score: 1

    I didn't RTFA, but from /. alone, I am unsure if this article is about porn or the film itself. My attention span stopped at...

    I didn't RTFA, but from /. (you get the idea).

    --
    Something witty.
    1. Re:Shiny Red Ball by SeeSp0tRun · · Score: 1

      And it isn't even a film. Fail.

      --
      Something witty.
  4. "sculpture-props simulating virtual reality" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    sculpture-props simulating virtual reality

    You get the sense that someone doesn't quite grasp the basic concepts.

    1. Re:"sculpture-props simulating virtual reality" by LordAndrewSama · · Score: 2, Funny

      maybe they're too busy grasping something else?

    2. Re:"sculpture-props simulating virtual reality" by The+Archon+V2.0 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      sculpture-props simulating virtual reality

      You get the sense that someone doesn't quite grasp the basic concepts.

      No, actually, they got it right. Something real styled after something that doesn't exist must be simulated.

      Thinking about any one of their props hard enough leads me to this train of thought: It's a real object, therefore it is real reality. So it can't be real virtual reality, it has to be simulated virtual reality which is what any real real reality made with real virtual reality in mind has to be, though since it's based on a cyberpunk novel it's really a simulated virtual fictional object, or a non-real non-real non-real object and now my ears are bleeding and I wonder why that is and it's all really real ooooh....

  5. Why.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    .. is this on slashdot?

    1. Re:Why.. by Schiphol · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Well, the interest of mainstream contemporary art in a cyber-punk novel may be deemed of interest to /.ers. But I agree with you that this publication is too close to "Drop William Gibson's name and I'll slashdot you".

    2. Re:Why.. by umghhh · · Score: 3, Funny

      Sasha Grey plays a vitol role in some of the documentaries that we so love to watch in our cellars - that is why.

    3. Re:Why.. by Neon+Spiral+Injector · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The first time I had ever seen Sasha Grey was in The Girlfriend Experience. She was awful, probably ruined the film (if it wasn't the writers who ruined it first). Anyway, it was a complete snooze fest. Also who hires a pron star to play a prostitute and has her keep her clothes on for 99% of the film?

    4. Re:Why.. by ae1294 · · Score: 3, Funny

      Why is this on slashdot?/quote
      Sasha Grey

    5. Re:Why.. by ShooterNeo · · Score: 1

      Also, she didn't have the hard body I was expecting from a famous porn star. For as much money as she has, one would think she could hire trainers to keep her in better shape.

    6. Re:Why.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I actually watched "The Girlfriend Experience" last night. It seemed dry and kinda dull but I followed it to the end. Sasha Grey was the reason I watched, primarily because I had found out she was doing "Case" during her fleshbot award acceptance speech.

      I actually think she's quite talented, beyond her obvious skillset. Kinda baffled by "The Girlfriend Experience" artsy feel, I checked out Roger Ebert's review which really put together what the film was trying to capture and made note that the very reasons I didn't enjoy the film were exactly what the director was going for.

      That said, it's clearly a decent film but often watched by the wrong people for the wrong reasons. Myself included.

    7. Re:Why.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The same people who hire porn stars to dub Hentai movies. Seriously, why do I care how hot the voice actresses are?

    8. Re:Why.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Not everyone wants their female porn stars to look like men.

    9. Re:Why.. by The+Archon+V2.0 · · Score: 1

      The same people who hire porn stars to dub Hentai movies. Seriously, why do I care how hot the voice actresses are?

      I think they do it partly so people will get that same bad acting experience they get from live-action porn.

    10. Re:Why.. by Creepy · · Score: 1

      Yeah - I can't imagine the roles offered are all that great to begin with. Not always the writer's fault, either, though they're often to blame. Sometimes the blame for a bad film can even go to a producer - either cutting funding, limiting funding (restricting retakes), or demanding script changes during filming.

    11. Re:Why.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Yes, because I'm sure Sasha Grey was desperately hoping to, one day, have her name on the front page of Slashdot. Why else would anyone get into porn?

    12. Re:Why.. by GodfatherofSoul · · Score: 1

      After watching my friend's girlfriend busting her ass waiting tables trying to get a break as an actress, these kinds of marketing-inspired hires have come to really annoy me.

      --
      I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
    13. Re:Why.. by adolf · · Score: 1

      Mmmm. Entitlement knows no bounds.

    14. Re:Why.. by Patrik_AKA_RedX · · Score: 1

      Also who hires a pron star to play a prostitute and has her keep her clothes on for 99% of the film?

      A dressed porn star? The perverts!

  6. I think my world looks dystopian... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    But the world looks utopian if you're a middle class white guy doing Sasha Grey.

    1. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 2, Funny

      But the world looks utopian if you're a middle class white guy doing Sasha Grey.

      Until the test results come back.

    2. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Prune · · Score: 1

      I don't get it.

      --
      "Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason."
    3. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      As in an STD test.

    4. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I don't get it.

      Yes. Yes, you do.

    5. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by TheKidWho · · Score: 0, Troll

      You mean, "Yes, yes you did."

    6. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Lord+Kano · · Score: 1

      But the world looks utopian if you're a middle class white guy doing Sasha Grey.

      Yes, because we all know how hard it is for middle class white men in western society.

      LK

      --
      "Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
    7. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Pray you never do... Soap won't wash it off.

    8. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by MBGMorden · · Score: 2, Interesting

      STD's are actually fairly uncommon in the mainstream porn industry. Some performers wear condoms (which if you wore during your little escapade with Ms Grey then you have little to worry about - it's not a 100% thing but it's close enough not to fret over it), and those who don't are constantly tested and essentially sign contracts explicitly stating that they'll only have sex with others in the porn industry who are subjected to the same tests. Generally they'll stick to that as, well, most people in porn are getting laid more than enough to seek out more action outside of the biz.

      When there's an outbreak of AIDS or something similar it literally hits national (porn) news. Haven't seen a scare in about 2 years, and the last one didn't affect too many in the industry.

      All in all, strap on your glove and bang who you want. Heck most prostitutes use condoms religiously to the point where you're probably safer there wearing your rubber than with some random chick you take home from the bar if she doesn't care if you wear it.

      --
      "People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
    9. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 5, Interesting

      If your boss gives you a car, you feel great.
      If your boss gives your co-worker two cars, now you feel badly.

      The last three decades have consisted of taking away pieces of white middle class males cars until now they are riding a used bicycle only very slightly better than everyone else's.

      The drop in status, income, prestige, and even the ability to retain a job has been painful and protracted. Very soon white males will be a minority in many areas and from what I've seen, the former minorities have a lot of illegal practices (like hiring only the same minority as they are) which no one is willing to fight against yet. I think that at some point very soon (the next 10 years), you will see a Mexican company based in the U.S. sued successfully for not hiring/promoting white males.

      --
      She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
    10. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by raddan · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I have a friend from college who is doing fairly well as a porn producer. He says that there's another factor preventing people in the porn industry from having sexual relationships with people outside of it: most people have tremendous hang ups about sex. As a result, it's very difficult to maintain a relationship with someone who is not a porn star when you yourself are, so people in the industry tend to date other people in the industry.

    11. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by misexistentialist · · Score: 1

      http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/5519313/US-porn-industry-hit-by-Aids-fears-as-16-cases-of-HIV-revealed.html Unfortunately raising calls for regulations requiring condoms, since unusual occurrences stimulate lawmakers

    12. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You must not be keeping up on the news.

      Also, though some in porn dispute it, herpes is part-and-parcel of working in porn -- condoms aren't effective in preventing the spread of herpes, and herpes can make you more susceptible to other diseases.

    13. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Beardo+the+Bearded · · Score: 1

      I ride a bike to work, you insensitive clod!

      --

      ---
      ECHELON is a government program to find words like bomb, jihad, plutonium, assassinate, and anarchy.
    14. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Slashdot+Parent · · Score: 1

      Sasha Grey has contracted both chlamydia and gonorrhea. Or so she claimed in her appearance on the Tyra Banks Show.

      I realize that both are easily treatable, but I'm not quite sure you can claim that "STD's are actually fairly uncommon in the mainstream porn industry".

      --
      They don't grade fathers, but if your daughter's a stripper, you fucked up. --Chris Rock
    15. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by NiteShaed · · Score: 1

      The last three decades have consisted of taking away pieces of white middle class males cars until now they are riding a used bicycle only very slightly better than everyone else's.

      Take away the word "white" and you're pretty much there. The middle-class has been under assault for years and is being systematically disassembled and turned back into a servant class for the rich. Welcome to the "service economy".

      Very soon white males will be a minority in many areas

      A minority to who? The only way that's at all possible is if you say we're a minority compared to everyone else added up, which is stupid. Here's what the CIA World Factbook says about U.S. ethnic makeup:
      white 79.96%, black 12.85%, Asian 4.43%, Amerindian and Alaska native 0.97%, native Hawaiian and other Pacific islander 0.18%, two or more races 1.61% (July 2007 estimate)
      note: a separate listing for Hispanic is not included because the US Census Bureau considers Hispanic to mean persons of Spanish/Hispanic/Latino origin including those of Mexican, Cuban, Puerto Rican, Dominican Republic, Spanish, and Central or South American origin living in the US who may be of any race or ethnic group (white, black, Asian, etc.); about 15.1% of the total US population is Hispanic

      So, even if the entire amount of the hispanic population was taken from the white population, we have 64.86% of the population being white. This number is still crap though, because that 15% can come from any ethnic group, so I'd be willing to bet at least a percent or two actually are being counted as black, but whatever. The point remains, even if you add up all of the non-white segments of the population, whites are still a super-majority (meaning we outnumber not only each group, but all of them put together).

      Now, if you'd like to change "many areas" to a few areas, you'd be closer to being right, but honestly, how many whites are fighting to get jobs in predominantly black or Hispanic neighborhoods? I'm willing to bet "not many".

      I think that at some point very soon (the next 10 years), you will see a Mexican company based in the U.S. sued successfully for not hiring/promoting white males.

      A company that does what? What kind of miracle-company are you expecting, and if you know of any in particular, let me know 'cause I want to buy stock. Tech, banking, pharma, automotive, all of those companies are run by not only by a majority of white executives, but a disproportionately large majority of white executives as compared to the general population. Therefore, this company that is out to stick-it-to-the-white-man is going to have to pop up out of nowhere, and immediately be successful enough for anyone to care if they can work at it.

      In short, don't worry white-guys, there's still a whole lot of us, we'll probably be okay for a while longer.

      --
      Some bring out the best in others, some the worst. Some bring out far more.
    16. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Latinhypercube · · Score: 1

      ...and it will be about time and a just thing.

    17. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 1

      The hispanic numbers of 15% are highly concentrated in a small number of states. For example, California is 76.6% white... but that breaks down to 37% hispanic and 39% non-hispanic.

      Estimates are for a Hispanic majority in California and Texas in the near future.

      This is a problem when they lose interest in fairness in proportion to their power.

      There are small manufacturing, cleaning, and food making companies in Texas which have already had some issues in this area.

      Oh.. and then there's this..

      http://www.eeoc.gov/eeoc/newsroom/release/archive/8-12-09.html

      SHELBY, N.C. - A nationwide freight management company violated federal law by refusing to hire non-Hispanics, the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) charged in a lawsuit it filed today. ...October 1, 2002, through June 30, 2004, Fort Smith, Ark.-based Propak Logistics, Inc. engaged in unlawful employment practices by refusing to hire an entire class of people for non-management positions at its Shelby, N.C., facility because of their non-Hispanic national origin. The complaint said that the company hired predominantly Latinos to the exclusion of equally or more qualified non-Latinos...

      Discrimination by whites is wrong. A large number of whites agree with that position. So is discrimination by everyone else. Some other minorities don't seem to agree with that half of the equation.

      But... as long as we are a nation of laws, it will fix itself eventually.

      My point was, it's been a long sucky multi-decade period for white males ("males" in general but white males benchmark to their dads and it's a pretty hopeless comparison). Once we hit parity, at least the pain will stop.

      --
      She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
    18. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by blueskies · · Score: 1

      STD's are actually fairly uncommon in the mainstream porn industry.

      Not true. You are thinking about AIDS which is rare and tested for every 30 days. That doesn't stop the rampant herpes.

    19. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Shimmer · · Score: 2, Informative

      A minority to who? The only way that's at all possible is if you say we're a minority compared to everyone else added up, which is stupid.

      You might think it's stupid, but that's what the word "minority" means!

      Minority means < 50%
      Majority means > 50%
      Super-majority means > 50% + X, where X is some positive number.

      They are not relative terms.

      --
      The most rabid believers in American Exceptionalism are the exact same people whose policies are destroying it.
    20. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Lord+Kano · · Score: 1

      The last three decades have consisted of taking away pieces of white middle class males cars until now they are riding a used bicycle only very slightly better than everyone else's.

      Nonsense. No one is "taking away" anything from white middle class males. The world is changing, middle class white males are now facing competition from more sectors than ever before. Women, black people, immigrants, these groups are no longer denied the educational opportunities that they once were. Now that the artificial barriers are down, middle class white males are forced to compete with people who were kept out of the process in previous eras.

      Very soon white males will be a minority in many areas

      They've always been outnumbered by white females. It'll be at least 50 years before whites are a minority here in the US.

      LK

      --
      "Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
    21. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 1

      Everything you say is true and, yet, you still missed my point.

      --
      She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
    22. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      STDs are actually fairly uncommon in the mainstream porn industry. Some performers wear condoms (which if you wore during your little escapade with Ms Grey then you have little to worry about - it's not a 100% thing but it's close enough not to fret over it)

      Ms Grey has had Gonorrhea (twice), Chlamydia and a severe case of anal warts.

      Generally they'll stick to that as, well, most people in porn are getting laid more than enough to seek out more action outside of the biz.

      Due to the stop-start nature of modern porn production, the women rarely get very excited by the experience. Also many porn stars simply do porn so that they can charge a lot more for private 'escorting'. $700-1500/hr is common for porn stars who 'escort'.

      When there's an outbreak of AIDS or something similar it literally hits national (porn) news. Haven't seen a scare in about 2 years, and the last one didn't affect too many in the industry.

      There was a new case reported just this year. At the same time Los Angeles public health officials disclosed 16 previously unpublicised HIV cases among porn actors since 2004.

      Now don't get me wrong, I'm a very big fan of porn and I would bet my life savings that the majority of users on slashdot are also. But let's not view the industry with rose coloured glasses, there are many aspects of it which are less than savoury.

    23. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by NiteShaed · · Score: 1

      Way to miss the point. We're talking about the sociological construct of minority, not hard math. Context is everything.
      From Wikipedia: A minority is a sociological group that does not constitute a politically dominant voting majority of the total population of a given society. A sociological minority is not necessarily a numerical minority — it may include any group that is subnormal with respect to a dominant group in terms of social status, education, employment, wealth and political power.

      Given the following:
      48% White
      13% Black
      6% Asian
      28% Hispanic
      5% Other
      In this instance, the "White" group is both numerically superior to each group being counted, and is politically and economically dominant as well.
      According to you, the "White" group is a minority because it's less than everyone else added up. You've just made the word pointless, in this context, because that means EVERY group by that definition is a minority (less than 50%).
      In the above grouping, "White" is clearly not a minority, no other group even comes close, either numerically or in terms of political or economic clout.

      White males are unlikely to become a minority in the United States anytime soon.

      --
      Some bring out the best in others, some the worst. Some bring out far more.
    24. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Shimmer · · Score: 1

      It's interesting that Wiki-sociologists have attempted to redefine the word "minority" in order to accommodate the view that whites are dominant even though they are a numerical minority. However, the dictionary definition takes precedence (see http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/minority). If you want to use "minority" as a technical sociological term in a popular forum, I would suggest you use the phrase "sociological minority" instead. At least it will be clear what you're trying to say.

      --
      The most rabid believers in American Exceptionalism are the exact same people whose policies are destroying it.
    25. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by NiteShaed · · Score: 1

      my apologies, I thought that on Slashdot I was likely to run across people who understood that the same word, when used in different contexts, can have different meanings. I'll try to take care in the future to dumb things down for those who don't understand that concept.
      For your clarification, I'll make sure from now on that if there's an article about trains, I will refer to the Engineer as "the choo-choo driver" so you don't think I'm talking about someone who designs bridges, or the conductor as "the nice man who sells you a ticket" so you aren't left wondering if I'm really referring to a material that allows electricity to travel across it, or someone who stands at the front of an orchestra.

      --
      Some bring out the best in others, some the worst. Some bring out far more.
    26. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Shimmer · · Score: 1

      I have never seen the word "majority" used the way you used it. Never. (I think Wikipedia is wrong as well, and I put a comment on the Talk page asking for evidence that supports their usage.)

      I should point out that your use of "majority" in this way left you without a term that means "> 50%". As a result, you commandeered the term "super-majority" for this purpose. This is just wrong. You ended up confusing yourself as much as anyone else.

      In short, I believe your usage is probably wrong, and definitely confusing. This is not "choo-choo" territory.

      --
      The most rabid believers in American Exceptionalism are the exact same people whose policies are destroying it.
    27. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by NiteShaed · · Score: 1

      I have never seen the word "majority" used the way you used it. Never.

      I guess Britannica is wrong too.

      Oh, and Encyclopedia.com.

      You'd better get cracking, obviously you need to correct them as well.

      I should point out that your use of "majority" in this way left you without a term that means "> 50%". As a result, you commandeered the term "super-majority" for this purpose.

      I'll give you this one. It was meant to be evocative, but clearly if you don't have a basic understanding of what the word "minority" in this context means, it may be confusing. It was clear to me, it was clear to several people I showed the post to, but obviously it was unclear to you.

      In short, I believe your usage is probably wrong, and definitely confusing.

      Believe what you like. All you've shown me so far is an unwillingness to learn a new use for a term, and a stubborn insistence that "if you don't know about it, it probably isn't right".

      --
      Some bring out the best in others, some the worst. Some bring out far more.
    28. Re:I think my world looks dystopian... by Shimmer · · Score: 1

      OK, I will grant you that several encyclopedias seem to recognize this usage of the word. I suspect it's just political correctness run amok, but I cannot prove it.

      I still maintain however, that the usage causes complete confusion. Witness this sentence from Wikipedia: "White minority rule describes a situation where Whites, comprising the minority of inhabitants in a given region or territory, lead countries where non-White populations are the majority of inhabitants." Who is the minority in this situation?

      Further (and rather hilarious) confusion can be found in the bizarre disagreement between the disambiguation page for "minority" vs. the actual page for "minority".

      Thank you leading me to investigate this. I definitely learned something.

      --
      The most rabid believers in American Exceptionalism are the exact same people whose policies are destroying it.
  7. Article written by... by _PimpDaddy7_ · · Score: 1

    R.U. Sirius

    This can't be real????

    1. Re:Article written by... by SolarCanine · · Score: 5, Informative

      R.U. Sirius has been writing for years, and was the editor of Mondo 2000 magazine during the '90s, as well as co-author of Cyberpunk Handbook:: The Real Cyberpunk Fakebook with St. Jude. So yes, it's very real (and not the first time his work has found the convergence of cyberpunk and porn, either...)

    2. Re:Article written by... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Too real, unfortunately. And beyond stupid.

    3. Re:Article written by... by _PimpDaddy7_ · · Score: 1

      Wow I didn't know! Thanks for the clarification.

    4. Re:Article written by... by ae1294 · · Score: 1

      convergence of cyberpunk and porn, either...)

      It's truely hard to think cyber without porn...

  8. I saw this... by PortWineBoy · · Score: 5, Funny

    I was at the reading yesterday as part of my sojourns around Performa 09. No one else recognized her (that I could tell) in the audience, but it was a durational piece and I was only there a half hour. I was almost positive it was her, but she had these huge sunglasses on and I couldn't be sure...and it didn't seem like a good question to just ask a random chick at a performance piece while I was there with my gf...

    --

    this sig deleted by another sig

  9. They're Still Dystopian by russotto · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The world of _1984_ would look great to someone from Somalia or some of the other hellholes of the world. _Brave New World_ even more so. Yet they're still both considered dystopian. Same goes for Neuromancer.

    1. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Neuromancer dystopian? Are you serious?
      When I read that as a kid I would have given anything to live in that world. I still wouldn't mind getting one of their awesome brain-interfaced computers ;)

    2. Re:They're Still Dystopian by King_TJ · · Score: 1

      Agreed.... The fact that you can point to even worse situations or living conditions somewhere doesn't mean the fictional world being described in a book like 1984 or Brave New World is any less disturbing or "bad".

      In fact, one can often infer that even in those fictional worlds, there are probably still places where people have things worse off than in the cities they're describing.

    3. Re:They're Still Dystopian by jollyreaper · · Score: 1

      Neuromancer dystopian? Are you serious?
      When I read that as a kid I would have given anything to live in that world. I still wouldn't mind getting one of their awesome brain-interfaced computers ;)

      And some people would love to live in Mad Max. Doesn't mean it's not dystopic.

      --
      Kwisatz Haderach
      Sell the spice to CHOAM
      This Mahdi took Shaddam's Throne
    4. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Who wouldn't want to live in Brave New World? It's a society based on instant gratification all the time. Sounds like heaven on earth to me.

    5. Re:They're Still Dystopian by jedidiah · · Score: 1

      > Who wouldn't want to live in Brave New World? It's a society based on instant gratification all the time. Sounds like heaven on earth to me.
      >

      Plus everyone is engineered to be suited (and satisfied) with whatever role they have in life.

      Geeks aren't forced to be salesmen.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    6. Re:They're Still Dystopian by jockeys · · Score: 1

      those of us that value liberty and individuality.

      A dying breed, I know.

      --

      In Soviet Russia jokes are formulaic and decidedly non-humorous.
    7. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Neuromancer dystopian? Are you serious?
      When I read that as a kid I would have given anything to live in that world.

      The gee-whiz gadgets are obviously blinding you from seeing the characters...

    8. Re:They're Still Dystopian by sarhjinian · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Liberty has a very low calorie content and you can't burn individuality to keep you warm during cold winter nights.

      I'm not saying they're not valuable, but they're also pretty far down the hierarchy of needs. There's a lesson to be learned here: if you keep people well-fed, sheltered, clothed and socially stable you can actually foster liberty and individuality (and innovation, creativity, etc) because the base needs are met. If you want to oppress people, make sure they don't have enough food to get up off their knees.

      It's very interesting that, throughout history, periods where the middle class grows coincide with leaps in "social betterment", while strife and stagnation are lockstep with polarization of rich and poor. You'd think we'd have figured this out after the first few cycles, huh?

      --
      --srj/mmv
    9. Re:They're Still Dystopian by jockeys · · Score: 1

      I'm not saying they're not valuable, but they're also pretty far down the hierarchy of needs.

      Only to those who would accept the death of their principles before the death of their bodies.

      --

      In Soviet Russia jokes are formulaic and decidedly non-humorous.
    10. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Have you ever, in your entire suburbanite life, been hungry? Cold?

    11. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Cool gadgets don't make it any less dystopian. The point of the whole genre is that reality sucks so badly that the only retreat is into an alternate reality. And, if you're truly cynical, it could be posited that their reason reality sucks is that anyone bright enough to fix it prefers cyberspace. I'm not advocating it, just saying that opinion exists.

    12. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Who wouldn't want to live in Brave New World? It's a society based on instant gratification all the time. Sounds like heaven on earth to me.

      "Sure as I know anything, I know this: they will try again. Maybe on another world, maybe on this very ground swept clean. A year from now? ten? They'll swing back to the belief that they can make people better. And I do not hold to that."

      "I'm going to grant you your greatest wish - I'm going to show you a world without sin." </malreynolds>

    13. Re:They're Still Dystopian by moeinvt · · Score: 1

      "...if you keep people well-fed, sheltered, clothed and socially stable you can actually foster liberty and individuality."

      You "could" do that, but if some central government figured out HOW to do it, they wouldn't have any desire to foster liberty or individuality.

      "If you want to oppress people, make sure they don't have enough food to get up off their knees."

      I think that might have been true once, but not any longer. A bunch of hungry people are also going to be desperate and angry people. Not exactly the recipe for tranquil servitude. These days, the best way to oppress people is to make sure that the pretzel bowl is full, there is beer in the refrigerator and there is plenty of mind-numbing entertainment on television with a big dose of propaganda letting people know that they are in fact "FREE".

    14. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Except in 1984 if you were in Somalia, you were pretty much part of a slave caste and your conditions wouldn't have changed regardless of who owned you. You were worth less even than the proles. [Rant] I wonder how many people that reference 1984 actually have read it, much less remember it. People talk about heading into a 1984 society where everyone is monitored and having no freedom but by and large the majority of the population did not experience this in the book. The proles like you and I were just disregarded and left to our devices unless we spoke up or showed some prowness towards helping Big Brother.[/Rant]

    15. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Xaositecte · · Score: 1

      I'm not the GP, but I agree with his sentiments.

      I also spent four years in the military, being at times too hot, too cold, too hungry, too tired, etc. There are plenty of people who are all talk but not action, and there are plenty of people who've taken action too.

    16. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      These days, the best way to oppress people is to make sure that the pretzel bowl is full, there is beer in the refrigerator and there is plenty of mind-numbing entertainment on television with a big dose of propaganda letting people know that they are in fact "FREE".

      s/pretzel/bread/g
      s/television/circus/g

      There's nothing new under the sun.

    17. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Well, aren't you just special.

    18. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm not saying they're not valuable, but they're also pretty far down the hierarchy of needs.

      Only to those who would accept the death of their principles before the death of their bodies.

      Which is, at the moment, 99.9999% of entire world's civilization, minus Islamic suicidal bombers.

      All those well-fed, and well-shed 'westerners' who'd said the opposite for themselves, are just full of shit. Beat them up a bit, leave them to rot in a cell with no food for a couple of days, beat them up a little more, and they would gladly renounce all of their beliefs. Some would fall much faster (just beat them up, or threaten them). At least I admit that I'd gladly renounce all of my beliefs if I was forced. Same goes to any non-hypocritic person out there... Except, maybe, for those 0.0001%.

    19. Re:They're Still Dystopian by Behrooz · · Score: 1

      I think that might have been true once, but not any longer. A bunch of hungry people are also going to be desperate and angry people.

      Spoken by someone who isn't hungry. Hungry and desperate people don't prey on the wealthy and powerful, they prey on other hungry and desperate people, because they don't have the same degree of social protection and insulation. There are plenty of hungry and desperate people in our society right now, and it has almost no effect on the majority who are not hungry and desperate.

      Providing at least a minimal level of social support to everyone does provide a vast benefit to society as a whole, but the resulting difference in safety and stability from the perspective of the upper classes is negligible.

      "The system works for me, there's no need to change it."

      --
      "We have to go forth and crush every world view that doesn't believe in tolerance and free speech." - David Brin
  10. Re:LOL! One of Sash's Loser Jerkoff Boys Speaks by PopeRatzo · · Score: 5, Funny

    Guess where I live loser? That's right, the San Fucking Fernando Valley. Fucking pornstars. Been there, done that.

    translation: I think I am Napoleon Bonaparte.

    --
    You are welcome on my lawn.
  11. MMMM Sasha Grey by Americium · · Score: 1

    I respect pornstars - is that wrong?

    1. Re:MMMM Sasha Grey by OrangeMonkey11 · · Score: 1

      I wouldn't really call that respect i called it worship

      We all know what you're really meant to say so just say it ;)

    2. Re:MMMM Sasha Grey by Americium · · Score: 1

      well said

  12. Better Dys topian then Dat topien by Zorlon · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Doesn't the Declaration of Independents and Constitution imply that there is no Utopia hence we need checks and balances.

    Is Dystopia the same as Non-Utopia?

    Whenever someone (or some group) thinks they know what Utopia is, they try to force everybody down the same path.

    --
    - Things are the way they are because they're coded that way -
    1. Re:Better Dys topian then Dat topien by moeinvt · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      "Whenever someone (or some group) thinks they know what Utopia is, they try to force everybody down the same path."

      Welcome to America! (i.e. The United States of). A bunch of bureaucrats and politicians develop the plans for their utopian society and then send out armed minions to impose that vision onto society. Doesn't matter whether it's rural Montana or downtown Los Angeles. The Federal solution MUST be implemented.

    2. Re:Better Dys topian then Dat topien by SimDarth · · Score: 1

      Yeah, I know. I played Bioshock too.

  13. I want to take der jerbs! by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 1

    Where do you get jobs like this? First there's the "MIT artist-in-residence" job where you can send messages into space that will never be received. Now this one where you can prattle on about dystopian piffle hoo-ha and people with higher educations will nod and shake their heads knowingly because they don't want to look unhip, or however you kids describe the squares these days.

    Hey, I have some lovely post-post-post modern retro-reconstructionist works that would make a great display somewhere. They fractalize the repetitive nature of our increasingly vapid 21st century existences via surrealist digital sculpture and open mike poetry reads by fast fading reality TV pseduocelebrities.

    1. Re:I want to take der jerbs! by maxume · · Score: 1

      I have trouble believing that they are in on the joke, so the first step is to convince yourself that it is significant, not piffle hoo-ha.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    2. Re:I want to take der jerbs! by raddan · · Score: 1

      It's also important to have a porn star. It's the frosting on the cup cake of faux-intellectualism.

    3. Re:I want to take der jerbs! by Anonymusing · · Score: 1

      Hey, I have some lovely post-post-post modern retro-reconstructionist works that would make a great display somewhere. They fractalize the repetitive nature of our increasingly vapid 21st century existences via surrealist digital sculpture and open mike poetry reads by fast fading reality TV pseduocelebrities.

      I have no mod points, but this made me laugh. Thanks. (former art major here!)

      --
      Liberal? Conservative? Compare perspectives at Left-Right
  14. Middle class "white guy?" by zhrike · · Score: 3, Insightful

    That kind of uncritical asinine blather never ceases to tweak me. Middle class anyone, Gibson, you tool. It's amazing that people spout (and think) racist shit like this, and it is left bare, unchallenged, validated by silence thus tacit approval. Fuck that. The assumption is what? If you're middle class but not white that your perspective is different? GMAFB. If you're middle class and white, like me, you can't possibly know about destitution? (I came from it).

    Idiocy.

    1. Re:Middle class "white guy?" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It is not only racist, but sexist as well. The war on white males continues in the USA.

    2. Re:Middle class "white guy?" by Prune · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Mod parent up. Best BS-call-out-despite-everyone-else's-blindfolds post I've seen on /. in a year. Bravo!

      --
      "Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason."
    3. Re:Middle class "white guy?" by maxume · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Well, except for the part where it is pretty clear Gibson is naming middle class white guys as examples of people who were relatively comfortable in 1993, not naming them as the only people who were comfortable in 1993.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    4. Re:Middle class "white guy?" by m.ducharme · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I would say that the world does look different to middle class black people, and even middle class white women, at least in North America. To pretend otherwise to to assume that we've successfully removed all race and gender barriers from our society. But we haven't. You can pretend that everything is all sweetness and light if you like, and that all the injustices of the past have been righted and anyone who says otherwise is just a whiner, but the facts simply don't bear that out. Despite affirmative action, despite equal opportunities, life is still better for white guys in North America than it is for anyone else.

      The fact that you came up from destitution isn't the point. The point is that it's easier for someone to pull themselves up from the gutter if they're white males than it is for anyone else. It's easier to stay out of the gutter if you're a white male, and it's easier to get from the middle class to the upper classes if you're a white male (which is not to say that it's easy, it's been getting harder for all of us to even maintain our financial positions over the last few decades).

      --
      Rule of Slashdot #0: You and people like you are not representative of the larger population. - A.C.
    5. Re:Middle class "white guy?" by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      For the most part, I would agree.

      There is some resentment up here in Canada based on 'minority status', rather than race, but that's due to a law (which I can't remember the name of at the moment).

      The general idea of the law in question is to fight racism, which is good, but the implementation of it is such that there is a requirement by law to hire a certain percentage of minorities into your workforce.

      I think by far and large racism isn't an issue up here, but it frustrates people that if it comes down to a white man and a minority (be it a disabled person, or a coloured person, a woman...whatever) with the exact same qualifications and general likabilty... the minority wins out because of the law.

      It's ironic that a law meant to combat racism seems to be promoting it, up here.

      And I believe Gibson is Canadian, so that's likely what he is refering to.

      Honestly, I can say i see it all the time. I'm considering applying for a new government job... I've already been told by most that I'm screwed because my lack of colour (red head), am a male, and have no disabilty.

      Almost 100% of the time something racist is said in my presence, it's been a total joke ...mostly from minorities, come to think of it.

    6. Re:Middle class "white guy?" by stagg · · Score: 1

      I believe that Gibson was implying that middle class, white North Americans are relatively privileged. A member of the middle class who happened to be a woman or was of African or Middle Eastern descent might still suffer from racism and other things that the white man would not. Furthermore, I do agree that it's fair to say that the middle class is privileged and as a rule doesn't experience extreme poverty. Some do climb out of extreme poverty, but most don't. The average North American also has a rather different idea of what extreme poverty does than someone in say India might. I actually think that Gibson's comments were remarkably insightful, and already took into account your response.

    7. Re:Middle class "white guy?" by zhrike · · Score: 1

      I would say that the world does look different to middle class black people, and even middle class white women, at least in North America. To pretend otherwise to to assume that we've successfully removed all race and gender barriers from our society. But we haven't. You can pretend that everything is all sweetness and light if you like

      Don't put words in my mouth on your way to build your straw man. I know that NOTHING is sweetness and light, and one reason for that is that we as a nation fail to strip away the bullshit, and continually presume and cite things that simply don't exist. Systemic injustices exist, and they are class-based. When this assumption (that all whites have easier paths to success) is not challenged, we do ALL humans an injustice. As we do ANY TIME we strengthen racist positions at all, and it is a racist position.

      The point is that it's easier for someone to pull themselves up from the gutter if they're white males than it is for anyone else.

      Based on what, exactly?

      The fact that you came up from destitution isn't the point.

      Oh, but it is, unfortunately. My perspective is one that is lost ... mine and that of people like me. I've watched loved ones die from drug addiction and systemic poverty, watched them bounce in and out of prison - with little to no social program to help them when they most needed it, and when they were at the age when it would have helped, they were in positions where they were the minority due to the racial makeup of those in poverty. The pressures, however, are applied regardless of race, a fact that is elusive for so many, unfortunately.

    8. Re:Middle class "white guy?" by m.ducharme · · Score: 1

      First of all, let me apologise for not answering this promptly. An illness intervened.

      Systemic injustices exist, and they are class-based. When this assumption (that all whites have easier paths to success) is not challenged, we do ALL humans an injustice. As we do ANY TIME we strengthen racist positions at all, and it is a racist position.

      I agree that there are systemic class injustices, but they are not the only injustices. Aside from class injustice, black people (and to varying extents other ethnic minorities) face systematic and personal race prejudice as well.

      A black woman doesn't see the world differently because she's somehow genetically different, she sees the world differently because she has to negotiate through a society that has set up subtle and gross barriers against her.

      This systematic discrimination exists independent of the social class discrimination and barriers that you're talking about. Although it is very hard for anyone to come up out of the lower classes and rise to the middle class, it's harder for ethnic minorities to do so because they also face the systemic discrimination. And furthermore, the black person faces this discrimination no matter what social stratum they currently occupy. So for example the black youth whose parents are both doctors or lawyers, who drives a nice care is likely to get stopped by police more often than his white friend who drives the same car.

      The black CEO of a Fortune 500 company (can you think of any? I can't.) is still likely to face difficulties because of his skin colour. They won't be the same difficulties that a poor black person faces, but they'll be difficulties just the same, and will make life harder for him than for his white colleagues.

      Based on what, exactly?

      Sorry, I'm not going to go dredge up the stacks of stats on disproportionate levels of incarceration, malnutrition, poor education, etc of black people or other ethnic minorities for you. They're out there, and they're real.

      Oh, but it is, unfortunately. My perspective is one that is lost ... mine and that of people like me.

      Padre, you're preaching to the choir. I've made a similar journey up from poverty to the middle class (well, making would be more appropriate, as I'm still in law school) and I've seen much the same kind of thing you have on that journey. My point wasn't to devalue your experience, but to point out that for a black person, they have to all the hard work a white person does, and get past the systemic racism at the same time. This is what I meant when I was agreeing with Gibson's point, and I'm pretty sure that Gibson meant the same thing.

      Anyhow, this thread is dying, so if you do want to debate me further or just discuss the issue more, my e-mail is exposed I believe. I'm sorry that I didn't make myself more clear in my earlier post.

      --
      Rule of Slashdot #0: You and people like you are not representative of the larger population. - A.C.
  15. The middle class by manekineko2 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I agree the race dropping was uncalled for, but he also was giving this response in an interview, where we can't always pick the perfect words for what we're trying to say. If he was just trying to draw a distinction between middle class in the privileged (and largely white) West versus the middle class in, say, India where by US standards you're still desperately poor, I don't think it's entirely illegitimate.

    1. Re:The middle class by stagg · · Score: 1

      If Gibson was implying that a lot of his readers are middle class, North American, white, and male, then I'd say he was probably right. ;)

  16. Dystopian is contextual by manekineko2 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Yes, they're all considered dystopian in the context of the West, but I think his point is astute, that whether something is a dystopia is contextual. The people living in positions of privilege, i.e. the West, wring their hands over and work hard to prevent these various dystopias from occurring, even while they may be actually working against the interests of the majority of humanity.

    What we have now, if it wasn't reality, could be easily portrayed as a dystopia in a novel. Worse, the people with power to change things (the powered and moneyed people who are citizens in the first world) are unwilling to consider a lot of possibilities that may be on the table because they seem worse than their own privileged positions, without considering how badly off the majority of humanity is under their current system.

    1. Re:Dystopian is contextual by The+Archon+V2.0 · · Score: 1

      Yes, they're all considered dystopian in the context of the West, but I think his point is astute, that whether something is a dystopia is contextual.

      Since all utopian and dystopian fiction (they're both the same genre anyway) is social commentary as seen from the point of view of the author, then someone is going to completely disagree with it. For instance, I read about three random pages of More's Utopia before I decided that it was one of the worst dystopias I'd ever seen. Assuming those three pages were characteristic, if I was Catholic with absolutely no sense of modern equality, it probably would've seemed great to me. With inferiors like children and women throwing themselves at my feet because they are so much more sinful than my perfect adult male form, what's not to love?

      Similarly, if one rewrote 1984 from the point of view of the uppermost tier of the Party, I imagine it could be very utopian indeed. The entirety of several continents working for you, even when they don't know who you are. Godlike power AND total anonymity!

      Some of these works give GREAT insight into their writers, though. I'm sure anyone, not just a psychologist or other licensed sort, could have a field day picking apart someone's brains based on what he/she sees as perfection in human society.

  17. Re:LOL! One of Sash's Loser Jerkoff Boys Speaks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    LOL, Thanks for making my morning. You know your post just makes me think you are indeed a fat fuck just trying to troll.

  18. i give this troll an 8 out 10 by circletimessquare · · Score: 4, Insightful

    the contrived outrage: well-played sir

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
    1. Re:i give this troll an 8 out 10 by zhrike · · Score: 1

      There was nothing contrived about it, so fuck off, sir.

  19. Molly Millions by Ukab+the+Great · · Score: 3, Insightful

    When you take into account the mindless sex-doll career of the character Molly, Sasha Grey is an apt choice for the part.

    1. Re:Molly Millions by TrentTheThief · · Score: 1

      Steppin Razor!. Sasha would be my choice for Molly/Sally.

      Mindless needs more clarification in the context of a meat puppet. Especially since Sally wasn't stupid (mindless) and worked as a meat puppet to make enough money to score her enhancements and then went off to be a private security consultant (merc).

    2. Re:Molly Millions by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      AC time!

      Not everyone's going to know who Sasha Grey is.
      Not everyone's going to have read Neuromancer and hence know what a meat puppet is.

      Let me help.

      In Neuromancer, one of the main characters, Molly, has a back-story in which she accepts money to be a "meat puppet". Using sci-fi technology, her mind is absent, while her body is used recreationally for purposes she is not aware of. Sometimes she is "a little sore" afterwards.

      Sasha Grey is a porn star who stands out (in my opinion). She is obviously very intelligent. Yet she takes part as the submissive role in fairly extreme scenes of consensual degredation, which she seems to relish.

    3. Re:Molly Millions by TrentTheThief · · Score: 1

      A much better explanation than I provided. Thank you!

    4. Re:Molly Millions by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0, Troll

      Excellent points. Sasha Grey is clearly very intelligent, as you state.

      It takes a very extraordinary mind to get facefucked and have one's mascara/tears agglomeration smeared about one's face by a hefty pair of shaved balls.

      I believe it was Feynman who initially stated, "Ahh yeah I love two hard cocks in my ass!! Yeeeaaahh harder! Pound that tight little asshole, let me taste my shit!", but it took the genius of Sasha Grey to add to that gem, "I am your bitch! I am your gutter slut!"

      I can only hope that future generations of young women will rise to her level of intellect, and use it in the manner she has pioneered. The world is a better place due to her brilliance.

  20. our core culture by Tom · · Score: 1

    Glad to see some celebrities finally appreciating Gibson's work.

    I mean - according to Wikipedia, roughly half of all famous people are porn stars, if you go by pagecount. There's something about that I haven't yet found words for.

    --
    Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
    1. Re:our core culture by maxume · · Score: 1

      What definition of fame are you using?

      I'm pretty sure that the output of the Disney tween machine are each many times more famous than the typical porn star.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    2. Re:our core culture by Pinback · · Score: 1

      Yes, and how long before Nintendo comes out with PornStar? You can imagine what the "instruments" will look like?

  21. Old by Das+Auge · · Score: 1

    You're only as old as the woman you feel. - W. C. Fields

  22. Re:LOL! One of Sash's Loser Jerkoff Boys Speaks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This just keeps getting better and better. You fucking jerkoff losers just can't help yourself.

    Keep wasting your mod points. Here's some advice loser. Save up your allowance and fly to either Reno or LA. Fork over the cash to put your little peepee in a real live pornstar who hooks and get back to your sad little lives knowing that your pathetic jerkoff fantasies are like in Reality.

  23. Sasha Grey is 93% skanky by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    This chick takes two dicks up the ass, does a2m, and does that boner-killing duck sound when she gives head. She also can't shut the hell up with the dirty talk.

    Some dirty talk == ok.
    Incessant, repetitive dirty talk == not ok.

    It's really unfortunate because she is really sexy as hell from a purely physical standpoint - but as soon as the action starts, the fun ends.

    1. Re:Sasha Grey is 93% skanky by Clover_Kicker · · Score: 1

      It isn't a "duck sound", she's got the guy's cock so far down her throat that she triggers her gag reflex.

      As far as the annoying dirty talk, Sasha Grey videos are best enjoyed with the sound off. (Or so I've heard.)

    2. Re:Sasha Grey is 93% skanky by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I whole-heartily agree to this statement
      "As far as the annoying dirty talk, Sasha Grey videos are best enjoyed with the sound off. (Or so I've heard.)"

  24. Porn Stars not what they used to be. by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 2, Interesting

    When I was growing up porn stars were very rare.

    Today they are very common.

    The stigma is less but so is the cachet.

    --
    She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
    1. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by invisibastard · · Score: 1

      They are much better looking than those fake-boobed idiots from back in the day. Today there are tons of top quality Eastern Block women available that no one would ever have a chance of seeing naked in real life. All readily downloadable. Living in the future has it's perks.

    2. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by invisibastard · · Score: 1

      um, forgot the post anonymously checkbox. What I said above was purely speculation, grabbed from the google.... I'm much too busy and happily married to know the first thing about Eastern Block top-notch lesbian porn.

    3. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Lol.

      What is missing from most porn (old and new) is the seduction.

      I've never found people screwing to be erotic (even if both are female). There was one I saw back in the late 80's/ early 90's tho-- I think it was directed by a female (back before females became so much more masculine) and she had two people, fully dressed, standing talking in front of a fireplace for about 5 to 10 minutes that was one of the most erotic things I've ever seen. Both were good but average looking without makeup.

      They went from casually talking to credibly aroused and there was the electric moment when both realized they were going to do something. I can't even recall the sex scene after but I still remember that scene two decades later.

      Sex is usually about rubbing one spot a lot. It often looks goofy. The seduction is the part that is interesting to me.

      --
      She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
    4. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Agreed. Porn is just so... empty. Sure, it will help you get arroused and get an orgasm... but after that... it's just so empty.
      I've never heard of Sasha Grey, found some movies on the net... it's just... emtpy, boring.

    5. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Porn is just so... empty. Sure, it will help you get arroused and get an orgasm... but after that... it's just so empty.

      Nothing like real chicks...

    6. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by mochan_s · · Score: 1

      This is like saying I went to see Schlinder's list and disappointed by the lack of robots from the future. Yeah, there was a movie I watched in 1992 that had robots from the future that I enjoyed and I think all movies should have robots from the future.

      There are lots and lots of variations and genres in pr0n. There are some excellent pr0n that are made like that - kind of half reality show, half pr0n stuff to some genuine acting and storylines. Others want a different take on pr0n where they let the viewers fill in the gaps.

    7. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful
      Lol.

      [Must remember to check "Post Anonymously" box.]

      What I miss are the cutaways to the guy's face during the sex scenes. Especially right before the pop shot.

      Seriously, am I the only dude that edits out all "guy only" shots from the scenes?

    8. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sex is usually about rubbing one spot a lot. It often looks goofy.

      Or to quote Robin Williams on the subject: "It's like an industrial film covered in fur".

      Even if the fur is fairly absent from todays repertoire *cough*

    9. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by couchslug · · Score: 1

      Not all porn actresses are "stars", but the term has stuck and sounds much better than "boring meat sockets".

      --
      "This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
    10. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by invisibastard · · Score: 1

      I agree. One of the things that was hot about the Eastern Block lesbian porn when it first appeared was that there was a good amount, 10 minutes or so, of passionate kissing. Now it is all fists being shoved into women and blah blah blah. One of the funniest trends I've seen pop up on the scene lately is amateur video of an attractive woman walking down the street. It is like porn has come full circle, the only hotness is what is imagined. Like seeing an ankle in 1920.

    11. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sex is usually about rubbing one spot a lot.

      You're doing it wrong.

    12. Re:Porn Stars not what they used to be. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      Wow, there *are* women on the internet!

  25. Middle-class White Guy? by flajann · · Score: 3, Funny
    "I think my world looks dystopian if you're a middle class white guy doing reasonably well in 1993..."

    How about if you are a middle class "black" guy doing reasonably well in 1993?

    1. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by canajin56 · · Score: 1

      Cry about the term WASP next. "Wah, you don't have to be a White Anglo-Saxon Protestant to be bland and indistinguishable! Call the racism police!"

      --
      ASCII stupid question, get a stupid ANSI
    2. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      it isn't 1993. Sasha Grey only got famous because she would do the nastiest stuff. Her first shoot she asked to be punched in the stomach repeatedly. She looks bored as hell in her scenes, something I'm not into. I'm too sophisticated for that crap.

    3. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "I think my world looks dystopian if you're a middle class white guy doing reasonably well in 1993..."

      How about if you are a middle class "black" guy doing reasonably well in 1993?

      Realistically, how many middle class black guys were wasting their time reading that crap?

    4. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by flajann · · Score: 1

      "I think my world looks dystopian if you're a middle class white guy doing reasonably well in 1993..."

      How about if you are a middle class "black" guy doing reasonably well in 1993?

      Realistically, how many middle class black guys were wasting their time reading that crap?

      That's not the point. And besides, I tried to read it, but the story didn't grab me, so I never finished the book.

      I just get annoyed when some mention race when there is no need. I recall once when some commentator on NPR was doing a story about the beginning of the micro-computer revolution, and said, off-handedly, "white guys", when race had nothing to do with the early hackers -- of which I was one, and I am hardly a "white guy", so to speak. So I felt excluded by this commentator about being a part of one of the great turning points in history.

    5. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by kubrick · · Score: 1

      I thought the point was that Gibson *is* a middle-class white guy... he can't really speak about his experience as a black man, can he?

      --
      deus does not exist but if he does
    6. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by flajann · · Score: 1

      I thought the point was that Gibson *is* a middle-class white guy... he can't really speak about his experience as a black man, can he?

      Why not? I can speak about my experience as a "white guy", even though I'm not!

    7. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by mochan_s · · Score: 1

      > "I think my world looks dystopian if you're a middle class white guy doing reasonably well in 1993..."
      > How about if you are a middle class "black" guy doing reasonably well in 1993?

      I think the white middle class joke comes from psychology. Most experiments that psychology professors did during the last few decades were done on undergraduate students who tended to be white middle class.

      So, all the psychology papers would sort of say, results on white middle class only.

    8. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by flajann · · Score: 1

      > "I think my world looks dystopian if you're a middle class white guy doing reasonably well in 1993..." > How about if you are a middle class "black" guy doing reasonably well in 1993?

      I think the white middle class joke comes from psychology. Most experiments that psychology professors did during the last few decades were done on undergraduate students who tended to be white middle class.

      So, all the psychology papers would sort of say, results on white middle class only.

      Well, even more specific -- "white middle class college students." Hardly a random sample in the least.

      Well, I'll hold off on my spiel about what it is supposed to mean to be "white" or "black" -- to me, it all rather a bit silly, anyway!

    9. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You wouldn't be the first one to speak in length from experience you don't have.

    10. Re:Middle-class White Guy? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Then you probably didn't feel like you were losing your whitey birthright.

  26. comment moderation needed .. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Given the quality of the replies so far, slashdot is sorely in need of commment moderation ..

  27. Trolls trolling trolls.... by m.ducharme · · Score: 3, Insightful

    trolling trolls trolling trolls.

    --
    Rule of Slashdot #0: You and people like you are not representative of the larger population. - A.C.
    1. Re:Trolls trolling trolls.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Aww, poor baby. Never ever had a pornstar tell him she wants him to take her home and fuck her brains out.

      But the little faggot does have good karma on Slashdot. We'll call it even ...

    2. Re:Trolls trolling trolls.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "Viral" (pun intended) for Californication?

      You losers got trolled by fucking Mulder! LOL!

    3. Re:Trolls trolling trolls.... by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      You have been have been on Slashdot bragging about banging pornstars since 8:30 am (Chicago time). The above post was at 10:59am. That means you've been on Slashdot bragging about banging pornstars for 2 1/2 hours.

      I would think that if you really had such a happening life, you wouldn't spend your morning trolling a web site.

      Nice try, Emperor Bonaparte.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
    4. Re:Trolls trolling trolls.... by m.ducharme · · Score: 1

      I think you replied to the wrong post...I was merely noting that this particular thread had long ago lost any signal in the noise.

      --
      Rule of Slashdot #0: You and people like you are not representative of the larger population. - A.C.
    5. Re:Trolls trolling trolls.... by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

      You're right, I replied to the wrong post. Sorry.

      I was referring to the goofball who's bragging about his San Fernando Valley porn-star banging lifestyle, on Slashdot no less.

      --
      You are welcome on my lawn.
  28. See... there is this thing about principles... by denzacar · · Score: 1

    They somehow never manage to survive the death of the body.

    Also, they seem to thrive in a well fed and groomed body, and whither away at the slightest danger to body's existence.

    --
    Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
    1. Re:See... there is this thing about principles... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > They somehow never manage to survive the death of the body.

      The only way they can survive is to SPREAD to another body!

  29. From the GPP: by denzacar · · Score: 1

    What definition of fame are you using?

    if you go by pagecount.

    --
    Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
    1. Re:From the GPP: by maxume · · Score: 1

      That is how he counted people he decided were famous, not how he decided that they were famous.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    2. Re:From the GPP: by denzacar · · Score: 1

      There is another criteria for fame other than simple recognition by large groups of people?

      --
      Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
    3. Re:From the GPP: by maxume · · Score: 1

      Where are you getting "simple recognition by large groups of people"?

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    4. Re:From the GPP: by denzacar · · Score: 1

      Same place I get that water is wet, fire is hot, sky (on Earth) is bluish color and other hard to find information.
      It is common sense.

      Or, you can look it up.

      http://www.thefreedictionary.com/fame

      http://www.yourdictionary.com/fame

      http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fame

      http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fame

      --
      Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
    5. Re:From the GPP: by maxume · · Score: 1

      Dude, context. What I was getting at was, what makes you think (or assume, or whatever) that is the criteria that the original poster applied? What definition of 'large' did he use. And so on.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
    6. Re:From the GPP: by denzacar · · Score: 1

      according to Wikipedia, roughly half of all famous people are porn stars, if you go by pagecount.

      Half is a HUGE number.

      Are you really that bored, that you need to keep trolling down this topic trying to make completely and utterly clear things appear "questionable"?
      Are you practicing for a job interview at FOX News or something?

      --
      Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens
    7. Re:From the GPP: by maxume · · Score: 1

      You don't even know what you are quoting, for all you know, the guy made it up!

      I looked, Wikipedia does not have a 'Obviously famous people' page, and if you are using their 'notability' guidelines to establish fame, I don't need to call you an idiot. I can't find any page that is conducive to sorting the obviously famous into people that are porn stars and the not porn stars, and so on.

      I'm not trolling, you simply don't understand that it isn't obvious.

      --
      Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
  30. Guys... It's an NYC Performance Art Piece...! by RobotRunAmok · · Score: 1

    ...which puts it roughly on professional par with a Community Theater production of Guys and Dolls in Toledo, except you don't leave the theater humming any of the tunes.

    And I'm not just being snarky... I remember my last such show in SoHo: the second act began with the performer crawling out of a giant garbage bag (featuring real garbage), singing a song about former UN Ambassador Jeane Kirkpatrick set to the tune of "Mr. Sandman" (that's Chordettes, not Metallica, as in "bung bung bung bung BUNG BUNG bung bung BUNG BUNG bung BUNG BUNG...!").

    Anybody -- ANYBODY! -- ANNN-NEEE-BODY!!! -- and I've dated more than my share, yet have somehow avoided therapy -- can have a "One Woman Show" in NYC (which looks great on a resume, of course); all you need to do is rent a theater (of which there are hundreds available -- it's a cottage industry) and, ummm, believe in yourself...

  31. Re:LOL! One of Sash's Loser Jerkoff Boys Speaks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    nothing more than a typical Valley night for me

    Doesn't that make you a loser too?

  32. staging events.. by arikol · · Score: 1

    I could stage a few events with Sasha Grey.. they would not be considered sci-fi (unless the props I were to use would be considered sci-fi... plasma powered "toys" anyone?)

  33. slurpee himplex III by beckett · · Score: 1

    STD's are actually fairly uncommon in the mainstream porn industry. Some performers wear condoms

    Genital herpes is endemic and ubiquitous in the mainstream porn industry.

    1. Re:slurpee himplex III by MBGMorden · · Score: 1

      While true, keep in mind that genital herpes in general is very prevalent in society as a whole. Depending on what stats you're looking at, estimates are between 10% and 25% of the adult population.

      http://www.herpes-coldsores.com/herpes_statistics.htm

      The realistic situation is that if you are sexually active at all herpes is out there. Condoms DO usually prevent outbreaks if the affected area is covered, and transmission of the disease is greatly reduced outside of an outbreak.

      --
      "People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
  34. gb2/b/ by Alex+Belits · · Score: 1

    gb2/b/

    --
    Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
  35. Re:LOL! One of Sash's Loser Jerkoff Boys Speaks by PopeRatzo · · Score: 1

    How pathetic can you losers possibly be where you ultimate fantasy is nothing more than a typical Valley night for me

    Translation: "I am Napoleon Bonaparte, and you aren't!"

    --
    You are welcome on my lawn.
  36. Re:LOL! One of Sash's Loser Jerkoff Boys Speaks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    > About as much fun to be around as picking weeds from your garden.

    You pick weeds from your garden? Who's the loser now?

  37. Re:LOL! One of Sash's Loser Jerkoff Boys Speaks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Fork over the cash to put your little peepee in a real live pornstar

    but my jerkoff fantasy involves real dead pornstars....

  38. For a more elite cultural critic view, AVN. by vaguestalker · · Score: 1

    It seems that Adult Video Network have outdone themselves as contemporary culture critics... http://business.avn.com/articles/36788.html reads like a Sunday Times supplement, who would have thought?