Do You Hate Being Called an "IT Guy?"

An anonymous reader writes "The phrase 'IT' is so overused, I'm not sure what it means any more. OK, maybe it's an ego thing, but I spent a lot of years in grad school, lots of years getting good at creating software, and lots of years getting good at creating technical products and I don't want the same label as the intern who fixes windoze. I'm looking at a tech management job at a content company that is trying to become a software company, and they refer to everything about software development, data center operations, and desktop support as 'IT.' I'd like to tell the CEO before I take the job that we have to stop referring to all these people as 'IT people' or I'm not going to be able to attract and retain the top-tier talent that is required. Am I just being petty? Should I just forget it? Change it slowly over time? These folks are really developing products, but we don't normally call software creators 'product developers.' Just call them the 'Tech Department' or the 'Engineering Deptartment?'"

Comments

Can't see why this would matter.

[koreaman]

I can't see why this would matter. Hopefully potential candidates will look beyond whatever their official job title is. I'd change it slowly over time.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[x2A]

It's just not very descript, the connotations that the term 'IT' has attached are different to those of 'programmer', at least to myself, and I've no reason to believe I'm unique with that. IT in my experiences will tend to be more office/user facing; easing other peoples use of other peoples products, dealing with word processing, spreadsheets, all that kind of stuff. Programmers create the stuff that the people in IT use.

Personally I find it easy to escape the label of 'IT' by not having a clue how to use Excel or Word leaving me very much being not the person to ask :-) System architecture, coding problems, no sweat, that stuff interests me, so that's the stuff I'm interested in being associated with. I don't look down on people who fix the office printers or get peoples mail clients working with their AV or whatever... I don't look down on teachers, but it doesn't mean I wanna be one or believe that calling me one is an accurate description.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[Bent Mind]

I can't see why this would matter.

I can. Where I work (as in most places I imagine), the IT department handles the network and helpdesk. IT also includes database administrators. While the database admins can write some really good SQL, they don't know jack about networks or computer maintenance. This is all fine and good. However, management doesn't know jack about IT. So we end up with a bunch of database administrators trying to run a network and maintain computers. And management wonders why everything is falling apart all of the time.

Keeping the titles separate might help management make the distinction between the database guys and network engineers.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[Anonymous Coward]

"IT guy" or "computer guy" or whatever. People need a generic term to describe people who work in some area they don't (or won't be bothered to) understand. "doctor" or "engineer" or "lawyer" just the same. A cardiac surgeon doesn't know much otolaryngology; an EE doesn't know much about steam turbines; a personal injury lawyer isn't going to be much help with your corporate takeover. It's easier to lump all of the people who do similar work together and refer to the whole group by a generic term - eg, "IT people" for all the computer-centric jobs, whether hardware, software, or support; eg, "lawyers" whether they're finance, liability, or contract. "IT people" should probably have descriptive titles for internal use, once the group gets large enough for division of labor and effort to be important, but you shouldn't get too upset if people outside the group just see "computer people."

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[x2A]

There is a reason why we don't refer to screwdrivers, circular saws and sanding machines all as "hammers". There is a reason why we have different words for "poisonous" and "tasty"... if you're not eating them, then just "berries" might be a sufficient description to you, but language evolves for a reason, we have vocabulary for a reason, description is important. Not understanding the different between two different terms shows you haven't been exposed to it. Not understanding that there could be important differences that may lie outside of what you've been exposed to show narrow mindedness. Personally, I'd rather go with the label of 'petty over my label' than that of 'deliberately ignorant', so I respect even the differences that I don't understand.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[war4peace]

I absolutely agree. My company has a large sales department. I refer to them as the "sales people" and they refer to us as "the IT people". Nobody's bothered. Why bother? It's like you are angry because you are a Texan and somebody from Taiwan calls you an American. "Oh, wait, dude, I'm not American, I'm Texan!" - now that's plainly strange :)

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[The Unusual Suspect]

That would be a good start. Then all you'd have to do is get them to understand the difference between a database and a network.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[Kjella]

From what I've understood companies in the US are extremely tightfisted about giving information about employees, so you'd better take what little you get. If you were a DBA but all your resume says is "IT department" and that's all they'll confirm then you have an uphill battle just to convince them that you were in fact a DBA, and not the guy replacing broken keyboards and fixing paper jams who is now desperately seeking a new job.

Of course there's such a thing as title inflation so too excessive a title will set off bullshit detectors, but there's no reason to sell yourself short either. I'm hardly a career ladder climber, but I would react negatively to a job title that would sell me short with my next employer. While it's not as bad here as in the US, the resumes do get screen by recruiting companies and HR and not having the title could lose me interviews before I even got to talk about what I've been doing.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[piquadratCH]

A cardiac surgeon doesn't know much otolaryngology;

That analogy would be correct if people wouldn't know the difference between Java programmers and C++ programmers. I'm pretty sure every cardiologist would feel a bit insulted if a patient wouldn't know the difference between him and a nurse. Nothing against nurses, every hospital would collapse without their work.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[Dumnezeu]

There is a reason why we don't refer to screwdrivers, circular saws and sanding machines all as "hammers"

Yes there is such a reason and that's because they're not "hammers" an "tools," which is why we don't call them "hammers" but we call them "tools." And while we're at it, please hand me that "toolbox." No, not that "screwdrivers-and-circular-saws-and-hammers-box" just the "toolbox." Thanks.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[invisibastard]

Some of these people think the server is a "CPU" or a "Hard Drive". I get calls where they say "the internet is down" because they somehow deleted the IE icon. They don't even know how to use the address bar in their browser, they type the url into one of the 10 search toolbars they've installed. You face the wrath of god when you delete their Weather Bug crapware. "my weather doesn't work, the it guy broke it"

If I talk Java or C++ their eyes glaze over as they pretend to know what I am talking about. Never underestimate the stupidity of people. I say that as a stupid person.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[mikael_j]

A cardiac surgeon doesn't know much otolaryngology; an EE doesn't know much about steam turbines; a personal injury lawyer isn't going to be much help with your corporate takeover.

Comparisons:

• IT guy: helpdesk guy through to ph.d. who works with high-end clusters.
• Health guy: orderly through to highly specialized surgeon.
• Electric stuff guy: from the guy who moves crates of PCBs through electricians through to EE.
• Law guy: Secretary at law firm through to top tier lawyer who's spent his/her entire career specializing.

Now, don't you think those on the right side of the above descriptions would frown own being referred to as health/electric stuff/law guy if the terms had the meanings I gave them above? And for "IT guy" that's exactly how the term is commonly used, the guy who gives you a new keyboard when you spill coffee on it gets referred to as an "IT guy" and so do your senior developers and sysadmins, guess why they're grumpy about it...

/Mikael

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[Sponge Bath]

Except for us Prius driving Austin Texans. We prefer to be called "star child". Now pass the aromatherapy candle.

Re:Can't see why this would matter.

[hazem]

I don't look down on people who fix the office printers or get peoples mail clients working with their AV or whatever... I don't look down on teachers, but it doesn't mean I wanna be one or believe that calling me one is an accurate description.

I once worked at a university (doing "IT" for the engineering school) and during one of the staff meetings, the management suggested that they could save money by having the computer science professors take over all the IT tasks in the school.

Fortunately one of CS profs quickly suggested that the EE professors could fix wiring and changing light bulbs and the Civil Engineering profs could clean bathrooms and unplug toilets. The idea died almost quicker than it was born. But it belies the point of this article. Most people have no idea what "IT" even means and assume that if you can do one thing with a computer then you are automatically able to do all things.

You have an ego problem

[Anonymous Coward]

You're in IT. Deal with it.

Re:You have an ego problem

[realityimpaired]

Her understanding the difference between server admin and programming is irrelevant, and won't fix the problem: If your wife is telling you she thinks you're spending too much time at the computer, it's because she'd rather you spend the time with her, and were doing something romantic. Relationships work, and stay alive, on doing stuff together and having common interests.

When was the last time you brought her flowers? (assuming she likes them, I do know a couple of women who don't). When was the last time you went out on a date? Was it planned, or did you get home in the evening and say "let's go out tonight"? When was the last time you stayed in, and had a quiet evening snuggling? When was the last time you went dancing, or to the theater?

Getting married does not mean that you have to stop working at the romance side of things. You could probably earn yourself a week's worth of being left alone to program by taking her out on Friday. Try to do something romantic with her at least once a week, preferably more often, and you'll find that she stops feeling neglected, and will give you your time to do things like your hobby of programming.

*sighs*
Tara

Re:You have an ego problem

[sagematt]

Daddy, why is there a woman in Slashdot?

Grammar Nazi to the Rescue!

[Phat_Tony]

I don't think you're going to help attract a lot of talented engineers by changing the nomenclature to the "'Engineering Deptartment."

That aside, I think "Software Engineer," "Software Architect," "Analyst," "Lead Developer," and such are common titles for people who are creating things with software, as opposed to "IT's" tech-support implications.

Re:Grammar Nazi to the Rescue!

[cheesybagel]

In my experience when lay people say "IT" they usually mean tech-support and cannot conceive of any other job. Which is why I do not like being called an IT person, since programming is nothing like it.

Petty?

[clickclickdrone]

Sounds pretty petty to me. I have no problem at all with IT and don't see why anyone would. I don't care what my job's called as long as it interests/challanges me and provides a monthly paycheck. If you're that hung up with titles, I'd suggest your problem lies closer to home.

GOOD GOD

[Anonymous Coward]

Did the submitter forget his Twitter account password? Is his navel so big that he can't help but gaze into it?

I'm not an "IT guy".

[jcr]

I'm a software developer. In my experience, "IT" is a term used by non-engineers as a catch-all for "that which my English degree failed to equip me to understand". Kind of like when they say "microchip".

-jcr

Hrmm

[acehole]

In my view of the industry when someone says IT I think of the technical support, admin and sys planning teams. The ones who make the systems work and keep working.

Programmers and the such, I put in the developers group. Graphic designers, html jockeys or software developers. The ones who make what people see on their desktops look pretty.

You dont call someone who washes your car and gives it a bit of a polish a mechanic would you?

I'll let you

[OverlordQ]

call me Sue if you'll give me a job.

Quality Control

[lewko]

Just call them the 'Tech Department' or the 'Engineering Deptartment?'" [sic]

The spelling Deptartment just called. They need more budget.

Information Technology (IT)

[mysidia]

Information technology (IT), as defined by the Information Technology Association of America (ITAA), is "the study, design, development, implementation, support or management of computer-based information systems, particularly software applications and computer hardware."

IT deals with the use of electronic computers and computer software to convert, store, protect, process, transmit, and securely retrieve information.

You ARE in IT.

However, it's the equivalent of calling a Brain surgeon a Doctor

Or referring to a Nuclear physicist as a scientist.

It is kind of vague. Sometimes being more specific is good, as it points out people's specialty more.

Re:Information Technology (IT)

[psnyder]

I think it's more like calling a brain surgeon, "medical staff", since that can apply to interns and support staff in the same way as IT.

You're right, but I also see his point.

It matters to future employers

[Anonymous Coward]

Potential employees are probably more worried about future employers/their resumes, and it's not unreasonable of them to do so.

Frankly, a respectable-sounding title is one very cheap way for employers to compensate their employees that costs the company absolutely nothing yet is of material benefit to the employee. It's one reason nearly everyone in sales and marketing is a "director" or "head" of some tiny sliver of a given institution's sales/marketing operation. "Director, Central California Sales," "Head of E-marketing Business Development" etc. You're more likely to attract ambitious, driven people if your position comes with a nice title. These are also the sort of people who will work very hard for you, because they're hungry for advancement. Of course, they also are likely to leave the company as soon as a better offer comes along. But I'd rather get 3 years of work from a ambitious employee than 10 years from a just-getting-by timecard-puncher.

Re:It matters to future employers

[hairyfeet]

Of course if a company does hand out titles too much then you'll end up with a situation like this. Me I don't call myself an "IT guy" as I am quite happy being what I am-A PC fixit guy and system builder. I look at it no different than electrician or plumber. Folks break machines, or need new machines, so they come to me.

I think the reason the word "IT" rubs this guy the wrong way is it is a catch all phrase, but as far as I know it has always been, but that is why most are not JUST an "IT Guy" but a programmer, engineer, or guys like me that actually do "fix windoze". Oh yeah and bite me on the fix windoze remark. I'd love to see this turkey spend some time trying to get rid of a seriously nasty infection where he can NOT wipe the thing because they have data shotgunned all over the damned drive, or get to see a nasty pron bug that spews crap like bukkake all over the damned screen be the first thing HE had to look at first thing in the morning. You know, nobody respects the plumber either until their toilet is clogged. May your family get rootkitted!

Re:It matters to future employers

[Anonymous Coward]

Just from a developer: I think I really appreciate the "fix Windoze" people (if they know what they are doing), because I sure wouldn't want to do it. That's why I don't like to have "IT" used a catch-all, it means that during jobs searching you often have to sort out manually those jobs that are not relevant to you (how many developers are looking for and admin job and the other way round?) and even worse, as a developer with a bit of a more mathematical and OS-design background you also have to look at the "Research & Development" job openings for some countries. It really is quite a mess, and I just can't help the feeling that in many cases for the HR department everyone from the scientific supercomputing guy to the one switching out the graphics card they are all "computer guys" which obviously makes as much sense as lumping the guy cleaning the toilets together with the one making sure the air is clean in you chip manufacturing area.

I am a software engineer

[MichaelSmith]

IT guys are the scumbags who put desktop remote control software on my suse workstation. They are the reason I keep rootkits (ie, system rescue CDs) in my desk draw, and why most of the guys I directly work with run gentoo.

These are the people who solemnly told me they would improve my WAN latency issue by compressing the link. When I said that won't work they said they could always put two compressors in series.

When they replaced my Dell desktop with an equally crappy ASUS or something they replaced the Dell branded logitech keyboard and mouse with an ASUS branded logitech keyboard and mouse on the grounds that using the wrong type of peripheral might cause "incompatibilities".

Since they stopped supporting POP and SMTP I now have to use outlook inside windows inside vmware, except there used to be outlook web access which stopped working last weekend so I logged a call with the helpless desk and they got the whole story (running firefox on suse, etc) then they had to get me to give them the version of IE I had there (stuffed if I know why). So they didn't fix it (Exchange server cant authenticate me for some reason) and escalated it a few times then the second or third level guy called me back and asked if I had thought of restarting firefox. When I said yes he asked if I had restarted my system (said so, I had an import or ten on the go at the time). This after I had given them the error message which came back from exchange.

I wish I could sack these idiots. In theory they work for my organisation you know, but they seem to have their hooks in us.

Re:I swear

[stjobe]

Oh, you're in IT.

Sorry you don't have a shiny title to distinguish yourself from the lowly CPU-fixers and computer janitors, but there you go.

You're in IT. Face it. You're in IT. No way around it, might as well say it with me: You're in IT.

Anyone think of South Park after the summary?

[hagrin]

"Don't call me IT Guy, IT Buddy. Don't call me IT Buddy, IT Friend."

Nothing wrong with ego ;)

[Moraelin]

Hey, there's nothing wrong with ego. I, for one, always wanted to be called The High Priest Of The Sun. But then the barstards switched from Sun to IBM servers :p

IT Guy ?

[erica_ann]

yup, specially when the client realizes I am a woman, not a guy :)

Yes, I do. But people don't call me one.

[Kupfernigk]

I am a systems architect. I've been a systems architect on and off for 25 years. During that time my job title has included Engineering Director, CFO, Systems Manager and CIO, depending on the size of company I've worked for.

Would you call someone who designs aircraft engines a mechanic? Would you call someone who designs central heating boilers a plumber? Would you call someone who runs a team working on ALU design at Intel an electrician?

My point is that nowadays IT is actually a trade, and mostly attracts the sort of people who in the past would have become plumbers, electricians and mechanics. Which is not to knock them, because these are essential and valuable trades, but basically they implement what other people have designed and specified. Programmers who are not just coders, systems designers, user interface designers - these are creative professions.

In the UK we have a terrible tradition of confusing professionals with tradesmen, caused by our emphasis on "administrative" skills. We've just had the Government dismiss their principal expert on drugs because he dared to disagree with the irrational "omg smelling cannabis kills you I need a stiff drink or five before I can go back to work" culture of the Government and the Civil Service. In a properly organised world we would sack the Government for lying to us, but in the mind of the Govt., Prof. Nutt's status is about that of a plumber. The point is that you go to tradesmen for advice on implementation of what you want to do, but you go to professionals to tell you what to do in the first place. You somehow need to get back to that position (I say you. I hope to retire in 5-6 years; then it will be someone else's problem. For now, I am quite happy being a software architect, because that is actually what I do.