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Sci-Fi Author Peter Watts Beaten, Charged During Border Crossing
JoeGee writes "On December 8th, Canadian sci-fi author Peter Watts, author of the Rifters trilogy and Blindsight, was crossing the US/Canadian border at Port Huron, Michigan when he was involved in an altercation with US Border Patrol agents. According to Watts, he was beaten, left half-naked in a cold cell, and finally dumped on the Canadian side of the border with no coat. A legal consultant from the Electronic Frontier Foundation was successful in helping a civil rights lawyer in Michigan free Watts. Watts faces US charges of assaulting a federal officer. Based on the accounts, one can assume Watts did so by hitting the officer's hand with his face. If convicted, Watts faces two years in a US Federal prison."
They should give the border patrol the Nobel Peace Prize for keeping America safe.
This probably is a horrible abuse of power... but you never know with these things.
To quote Babylon 5:
"Truth is a three-edged sword. One side is your truth, the other side is their truth, and the third side is the truth."
I'd like more information.
I think I'd like to hear both sides of the story before I decide. Everyone who gets into an altercation with any sort of law enforcement officer always claims "I was like so totalllly innocent, dude!"
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
on the other hand, this may be another victory in the war on tourism.
We visited Canada this summer and our experience with the US border patrol when we were returning home leads me to entirely believe the story as told by Watts. I've honestly had better and more pleasant experiences with the East German border patrol in the mid-80s.
In a mature society, "civil servant" is semantically equal to "civil master." - Robert Heinlein
Never understimate the power of human stupidity -Lazarus Long
That actually gave me the idea that I might, somehow, be able to cause a stack overflow in the police. I guess I'll be trying that the next time I'm arrested...
Sorry, absolutely nothing justifies a beating. The only two options are either A. Arrest the man or B. Let him go. "Beat him" is not acceptable under any circumstances whatsoever.
who in his novel "Little Brother" had an obvious axe to grind against Homeland Security and law enforcement
Him and millions of other people who realize that a posted sign saying "Don't hijack the plane" would be about as effective and far less annoying than homeland security.
watt charged with resistance
(1.21 gigawatts) / (88 miles per hour) = 30 757 874 newtons
Maybe they thought that he'd stolen some precious joules.
When an unarmed man alone gets into a fight with multiple armed people, it's a rare case where the unarmed man is the aggressor.
Aide-toi, le Ciel t'aidera - Jeanne D'Arc.
Camping on quad since 1996.
http://www.thetimesherald.com/article/20091211/NEWS01/91211010/1002/Science+fiction+writer+charged+after+bridge+struggle
"Jones said Watts was crossing into Michigan from Point Edward when he was selected at random for a secondary Customs inspection. Watts exited his vehicle "angrily" and border officers began checking the black sport utility vehicle he was driving, Jones said.
Border officers ordered Watts back into the vehicle, and when he refused, officers attempted to handcuff him, Jones said. At that point, Watts began to resist and pull away from the officers "and became aggressive toward officers," Jones said.
Jones said a border officer used pepper spray to subdue Watts. Jones said Watts "choked" an officer during the struggle. "
I saw the video of that. The guy being arrested was drunk and belligerent and was holding his hand out when it hit the glass. It wasn't his head but his hand that hit the glass. Did you see the video someone recorded of it and put online? The guy was picking fights with people on the train. When the officer pulled him off the train, you could hear everyone in the train car clapping. It was pretty clear that the officer didn't do anything wrong.
Cory Doctorow talking about cloud computing makes as much sense as George W Bush talking about electrical engineering.
I am a Canadian citizen living in Canada.
I have been entering and leaving the USA for pretty much my whole life.
I am 53.
A few years ago I stopped going to the USA, except when absolutely necessary.
One of the most dangerous places I can think of is a US border crossing.
Maurice W. Hilarius Voice: (778) 347-9907
"I'm not saying that tapping an officer on the shoulder is assault,"
Good, because legally it is battery.
"it probably isn't a good ideal to initiate physical contact by surprising them with a tap on the shoulder from behind when they might have a (quite reasonable) expectation of being attacked."
Sure, I can agree with that. Do not touch police officers, ever.
"Also, cursing at an officer isn't assault but why be a jerk?"
We have the right to be jerks, that's why. Failing to exercise our rights means that we will eventually lose them.
"Cops have a difficult job"
So do plenty of other people. What makes police officers special is that they can legally hold a person against that person's will; this is a dangerous right to grant anyone, of course, so we have all kinds of laws protecting innocent people from cops.
"in my experience are pretty friendly even under adverse conditions."
Some cops are friendly and firmly believe in protecting the public, whom they serve. However, we no longer live in a world where the police only arrest dangerous people. There are too many laws on the books, and it is now difficult to be a law abiding citizen. Police officers are paid overtime regardless of whether or not they were clocking those extra hours interrogating a real criminal. DAs and other public, political figures want to look "tough on crime," and put pressure on the police to be more aggressive; and of course, appearing to be "part of the war on terror" is all to appealing to police departments.
Again, we grant the police the right to do things that would be illegal for the rest of us. We must be extremely careful about giving out such a right, and remain on the alert for any possible abuses.
Palm trees and 8
Well contrary to modern day practices, beating is not necessary to arrest someone. Even people that physically resist arrest should not be beaten. The amount of force required to arrest someone is what is required. Beating someone because your pissed off that they resisted means your in the wrong job. Everyone gets pissed off when someone doesn't do what you tell them to, that does not mean that beating them as punishment is ok. Cops are not, and should not be, in the punishment business. (that's a different department)
waiting for ad.doubleclick.net
Don't be a douche bag, know something about what you are talking about.
This year, 115 police officers have died in the line of duty. Half of those deaths were accidental or medical.
In terms of deaths on the job, police officer doesn't even make the top ten.
I stand by my statement. Police officers *are* rarely killed on the job. 50 people died as a result of tazering this year, and that's just *tazering*. Police kill more people that don't need killing than they themselves are killed. From a strictly numerical point of view, an innocent citizen being confronted by the police is more likely to be killed than a police officer is to be deliberately killed by an assailant.
Yet, in spite of this, we are supposed to bow down to the police who have chosen such a "dangerous" occupation, but when they attack an innocent citizen, no big whoop, they probably had it coming because they asked a question or something.
You do realize that America has over 2 million of its people in jail, with a good proportion in there for political reasons.
Like all successful police states these people aren't busted for expressing anti-Government views. Instead laws are passed taking away fundamental rights (remember your bill of rights is not an exhaustive list and IIRC amendment #9 basically states this) then the undesirables are targeted.
The favourite rights to be removed are things like the right to grow plants and have the products in your possession.
While this is bad enough, it's your country and if the citizens like having a police state so they can feel safe that is your right.
What really pisses me off about America is the way you treat foreign political activists. If they're lucky they get extradited and spend years in the inhuman American jails perhaps being raped. If they're not lucky they get tortured and/or killed.
Also you push other countries around to remove the same rights from their citizens. See drug laws and the most recent thing being IP laws with ACTA being pushed by Americans to take away my right to play the DVD I purchased on my computer and my right to make personal copies of stuff and lend stuff to you to make personal copies.
Shit, when the leader of a political party that I voted for is being threatened with the death penalty on a trumped up charge of money laundrying (making him a king pin) and a charge of selling seeds, a law that has only been enforced against political activists, there is something wrong. One article, http://peacesecurity.suite101.com/article.cfm/marc_emery_and_the_bc3 google Marc Emery for many more.
Of course like all police states if you are a respectable citizen you don't have much to worry about. Just keep your nose clean and you won't have your life ruined by being accused of diddling children.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
My father has been on the Maine border for the past 20 years.
From my memories as crossing 10 years ago, things have definitely changed- and there are many reasons why. One of the biggest is that since 2001, the number of border gaurds has increased by a factor of 4. There used to be high standards, with lengthy training. You had to learn spanish, and generally become reasonably educated in detecting lies, noticing suspicious people, etc. The handgun training weeded out a lot of people, and my father had to practice every 3 weeks, because if he didn't, he might not pass the handgun qualification test, which seemed to be at least 4 times a year. A lot of that went away when some politicians decided they needed to stack the border in the name of "Homeland Security". Immigration and Customs (2 separate groups 10 years ago) were rolled into Homeland Security after 2001. Instead of ambitious folk who didn't mind learning spanish, passing rigorous handgun tests, remaining current in their education, etc, you got the bottom of the barrel uneducated Joe. The kind who saw a cushy government job for little effort and took it.
Joe is not a fun guy. Joe does the bare minimum and nothing extra, collects his paycheck, and sits in the booth following his script.
Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
It seems the citizenry, officers, and/or agents of the U.S. gov't have forgotten a few, really pertinent, things...
e.g. A police officer and his partner (and/or dispatch)
My Favorite:
Or more accurately, assaulting an officer means trying to defend yourself from aggressive police.
I can't speak about this particular case, but there is always in regards to hierarchical organizations, especially military and law-enforcement, people draw into its ranks seeking authority and respect. To such a mentality any slight against their authority is in itself a crime worthy of physical punishment. And anyone from within their own ranks that dare speak up are themselves criminals and traitors; often such whistle-blowers are effectively committing career-suicide.
Unfortunately proving that law enforcers used excessive force is almost practically impossible, unless the incident were clearly recorded, or the victim is an obvious cripple of such a nature and appearance that it instils immediate feelings of sympathy in most people (read: media). For the rest of the citizenry the best they can hope for is to have the charges dropped. Peter Watts will, in my opinion, probably find himself banned from visiting the US for quite some time to come; regardless of how badly he might have been mistreated.
The Long Now Foundation
It's from a sci-fi series called Babylon 5. One of the sub-plots involves the ambitious Vice President of the Earth Alliance assassinating the President so he can advance his own agenda. That agenda includes the suppression of civil liberties and extreme xenophobia towards non-Earth influences/culture. He sets up an organization called the Ministry of Peace which runs another organization called the Night Watch. Night Watch is primarily made up of regular citizens whom are encouraged to inform on their neighbors if they notice any "subversive" activities.
It's a great show if you are into the genre. Worth checking out just for that storyline alone. It shows just how many people are willing to be co-opted into such a system but provides the occasional glimmer of hope as others see what's happening and refuse to go along with it.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
You do realize that you do have the right to speed don't you? Turn on the TV to the racing channel and you'll see lots of people speeding on private property and sometimes on public property. You just don't have the right to endanger others unless they agree.
I'm not arguing that you have the right to blow smoke in someones face or operate heavy equipment while under the influence of anything that can screw up your judgment/reflexes.
You also have a right to loud music. Try it sometime, go somewhere where people don't mind and turn up the music as loud as you want. As long as you are not interfering with other peoples right to quiet it is perfectly legal.
Just like you have a right to swing your fist. Just not to make contact with my face.
The drug laws are one of the few things where if you are not a danger to others and doing it in complete privacy the law can and if they don't like you will arrest you and convict you.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
Right. When that fist or nightstick is headed towards your face, don't throw up your arm to protect yourself, just take the hit. We have advanced dental science in America; once you get out of prison your teeth can be made almost as good as new. In fact, it's recommended that with every kick or punch, you say "Thank you sir may I have another".
Asshole.
Allowing cops to beat on people with no punishment for them and punishment for their victims even if the cops were in the wrong -- that's what's really anathema to the rule of law. That's rule of men, men with badges.
Peter Watts has put up a new post on the event. All emphasis mine:
"I'm at the point now where I can't talk a whole lot about ongoing proceedings. I am seeing a few common misrepresentations making the rounds, though, that I'd like to set straight:
That's it for the technical items. I have only two more things to say. Firstly, I am absolutely flabbergasted by the online reaction to this story, and by the support (both moral and financial) that's inundated me over the past few hours. I don't have a hope in hell of answering even a fraction of the incoming traffic at this point, so for the moment let me just say I'm humbled and a little bit scared. I did not start this campaign; it actually started when I was still in jail, and had absolutely no idea what was going on. But to the catalytic folks who orchestrated it, know that I am looking into having my vasectomy reversed so that I can sire a firstborn son and sacrifice him to you.
Secondly, I'm going to bed.
In principle you are perfectly right. The problem comes when the nation doing the pushing is 10 times larger (population) spends most of their money on weapons and you are economically dependent on them.
America has a long history of beating the shit out of countries that have something they want and don't give it. Just today I was reading in the paper Obama saying that he won't hesitate to enter a just war. And America is very good at twisting something into a just war, 2 of them happening right now. Iraq was disobedient and got invaded and Afghanistan wanted proof that Bin-Laden was behind the 9/11 actions and got invaded.
There is a reason that you guys have 10 or more carrier fleets spread around the world and it's not for self-defence.
Also it is kind of disheartening when our political activists end up in American jails where it is very hard to run for government.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_totalitarianism
SCOTUS disagreed, in the Bad Elk case, stating "If the officer had no right to arrest, the other party might resist the illegal attempt to arrest him, using no more force than was absolutely necessary to repel the assault constituting the attempt to arrest."
Expecting people to submit to kidnapping because the kidnappers have badges is not compatible with a free society.
I wouldn't expect courts to follow this precedent in our modern police state, but to my knowledge SCOTUS has not overturned it.
Tom Swiss | the infamous tms | my blog
You cannot wash away blood with blood
I often wonder if foresight wouldn't have lead to constitutional amendments preventing the restrictions since imposed, as I'm quite sure the right to bear arms explicitly disavows any future police state.
Its too bad really, when I look at America now and count off all the things they used to mock the Soviet Union for, all the freedoms those poor "commies" didn't have that Americans no longer have either. I specifically recall many political discourses and writers commenting on how evil it was for their governments to encourage snitching on your neighbours and how the KGB would make you disappear without access to representation.
Welcome to the era of the FBI snitch 800 numbers, and the ability to throw people in jail without access to a lawyer for security reasons, without an open hearing, with no public record. Sounds like something America fought against to me.
- Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)
The problem is not as clear cut as you think. I know it's a popular and misguided philosophy in the US to think that you can live and not affect the environment around you but this is not the case.
Now, the US simply doesn't ask for these laws to be put in place, they shoe horn, back door and in some cases force it. Most of the bad US laws entered onto Australian books came attached to trade deals (pretty one sided trade deals at that), the unenforceable DMCA came in on the free trade deal made by Howard in the early 2000's. In the case of many Asian 3rd world nations the introduction of these laws came attached to aid packages which is why the drug laws in Thailand became so draconian. In many cases the US has threatened sanctions and even military action for not adopting laws stipulated by the US, a lot of this happened in South America which is why much of Latin America is Europe friendly but not US friendly.
Honestly, let me fix this for you. If bob sells widgets and you need a widget for your douvalacky but Bob wont sell you a widget until you do something stupid and you do, who's fault is that? It is Bob's fault primarily, it's called coercion and in many cases does absolve the person who commits the stupid act as it was not their intent and the coercive party was the one with the motivation.
Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
In Canada we had a case which was captured on video of RCMP officers tazering a man to death. While legally it had been recommended to prosecute these officers, this is not going to happen without the cooperation of the RCMP. This is seriously fucked up.
Jumpstart the tartan drive.