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When Will the Automotive Internet Arrive?
DeviceGuru writes "European researchers are developing a cooperative traffic system, known CVIS (Cooperative Vehicle-Infrastructure Systems), comprised of vehicle-, roadside-, and central infrastructure-based communications hardware and software, including vehicle-to-vehicle (V2V) and vehicle-to-infrastructure (V2I) wireless. Among other capabilities, cars communicate with each other and with 'smart traffic signals' to smooth the flow of traffic and avoid accidents, or with 'smart traffic signs' to avoid dangerous driving conditions. The CVIS project is in the midst of undergoing field trials in Europe, and Audi has recently deployed 15 test vehicles in a similar project. The ambitious vision of intelligent transportation systems (ITS) includes goals such as reduced traffic congestion and fuel consumption, enhanced safety, and improved driver and passenger comfort. Ultimately, the developers envision a sort of Automotive Internet."
I sense a great disturbance in the force, as if dozens of anti-virus executives where salivating all at once.
"Have you ever thought about just turning off the TV, sitting down with your kids, and hitting them?"
If they're smart, they'll build it out on IPV6.
(Those who consider this to be obvious should remember that the government is involved.)
s/Audio/Audi/
So much for the "Don't text and Drive" billboards, now we'll have don't "4Chan and Drive" or "/b/ and Driving = Death you friggin B'tards"
Sheldon
there is a small problem with the current aproach: until "every" car gets the system installed, it's nearly useless. The protocol need to "know" that every other vehicle is going to act accordingly its specification. The false sense of security these devices can provide is very dangerous in case a car break the rules (not only by malice, just think in a malfuction like the infamous toyota) because the react time will be reduced ("The car from the back is too near, lets send a message to brake", "Ups, no response, maybe an interference, lets try again", "wow, its must be broken, lets speed up, i'll send a message to the front car to speed too", "Ups, no r...CARRIER LOST"),
I hope the Automotive Internet never arrives. Why? Because of three issues: privacy, security and bugs. First, this system is basically a giant handout to authoritarians and fascists world wide. One of the goals of all governments that don't care about privacy is to track every private car. They know that measure has to be phased in gradually, so we need to fight against every step of the way. Second, security is a huge issue. We know that we can never provide a %100 percent secure desktop platform - so how in the world are we going to provide a secure automotive platform? Third, bugs are going to be a huge problem - see the Toyota situation. If we have 100 million lines of code, and we have 1-2 bugs per thousand lines, we get 100-200 hundred thousand bugs in the car's software. It's surprising that we don't have more cars flying down the highway uncontrollably. I hope we have less computers in cars in the future, maybe even none if we really could. It'll be tough but it would save a lot of money and a lot of hassle.
Responsibility is an addiction
Virtue is a temptation
Community is a cartel
I'd always assumed everyone would have to be plugged into an automated system, but actually, maybe it only takes a relative few cars. In fact, if you just drove a line of cars side by side along the freeway at the speed limit so that nobody could pass them, and just kept such barriers every 10 or 20 or 30 miles, then I think it would help to eliminate the incentive for everyone to act so crazy to gain 30 seconds' advantage, thereby causing congestion. I've always thought it was the lange changes and sudden maneuvers that cause the most problems in traffic.
Currently hooked on AMP
At some point, it might make more sense to reduce congestion by building enough roads with enough lanes for the cars.
Or just the small bit of programming that lets my iPhone know when it is in my car?
Then it can give me all that data and I don't have to buy the expensive, soon obsolete hardware in the car.
Our car analogies will become apt!
Hopefully NEVER.
For everything good that could come out of this, several somethings BAD will come out of it. Speed tracking for automatic tickets and insurance increases, and - NO TIN FOIL NEEDED - government tracking. The Brits will be the first to require this.
As soon as it's possible, the insurance companies will require this and jack your rates through the roof without it. As well, if your driving does not fit their statistical profile, your rates will goe up. As technology improves, if you take those right-turn-on-reds too fast, your rates will go up. Spend too much time in the "wrong" part of town? Your rates will go up.
The government will for sure figure out a way to leverage the information from this technology for some sort of tax increase.
There is no real benefit to having an Internet connected auto. Flying cars are a fantasy, road / highway technology has reached it's zenith.
"Who are in control, they are not in control of anything - they don't even control themselves!" - Glen Beck
No really it is.
Thought experiment. You have a road. You can safely put a car along the road every 2 seconds. What is the capacity of the road? 1800 cars per hour.
You put a parking garage at the end of the road. it takes 15 seconds to get a ticket and enter the garage. What is the capacity of the road now? 240 cars per hour. You just cut road capacity to 13% of nominal and created a huge traffic jam. Welcome to reality.
Our traffic problems are created because we don't get cars off the roads fast enough when they get to their destination. What're need are lots of high bandwidth parking garages. Traffic lights and junctions also don't help at all.
Deleted
In a way, you are right. Idiots running side by side at the same speed causes people to figure out ways to get around them. Multiple-lane highways exist for a reason, and the *right* lane is the *slow lane* and the *left lane* is the fast lane. As near as I can tell doing as you suggest is a violation in all 50 states of the union.
BTW, truckers passing through Kentucky on I-75 (and probably elsewhere) were protesting the different speed limit for trucks and cars by lining up side by side at the border, and running exactly the speed limit all the way across. That resulted in absolute carnage as people tried to pass on the shoulder, and lined up for miles behind them. If your proposal were implemented, I would expect a huge increase in accidents as people got around the "blocker cars".
Traffic accidents are not caused by excessive speed to any great extent, they are caused by bad driving and discourteous driving - and your proposal is a classic example of both.
Brett
Then you should also be worried about fighter aircraft which have been using fly by wire systems for quite some time now. As for using old cars, your sense of risk is skewed; you are concerned about the drive by wire systems more than the fact older cars tend to be built to older (read out-dated) safety standards. Even then, you are much more likely to be killed in a car accident of your own making than by a hardware failure; by at least an order of magnitude.
Sigs are too short to say anything truly profound so read the above post instead.
If any article deserves that tag, you think it'd be this one.
I worked on fighters with electronic flight controls (F-16A/B/C/D) for years.
They are built far better than automobiles, which are and will remain consumer junk by comparison.
BTW, even the F-15 and F-16 engines have a stopcock mechanical throttle just in case of an auto-acceleration.
"This post is an artistic work of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."
Do they have fly by wire systems that are connected to the big dirty outside internet full of 733t h4x0rs? Thought not.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
Actually the right lane is the default lane and the left lane is for passing. If you aren't passing anyone or preparing for a left exit you shouldn't be in the left lane. It is a violation to do otherwise.
I am becoming gerund, destroyer of verbs.
If something like this were to be implemented, your location would always be known. If not to the public, at least to the "authorities".
I just do not see a practical way to keep the Big Brother aspects out of it, unless they were to build some kind of filter so that "the authorities" could not see personal information without a warrant or something. Heck, they could even set up a totally automated system to mail out speeding tickets. No police cars required.
I'll pass, thanks very much.
I think it would be loads better to push telecommuting over all this expensive rube goldberg computer controlled meatsack commuting. These are wild ass schemes that are ignoring the basic problem of physical commuting, which is the "necessity" thereof. How much is *really* necessary, and how much is just archaic holdover from the 1800s and 1900s office? Yes, people HAD to travel to the office then, because all the data was physical hard copy, all the communication was speaking directly to people or sending a snail mail or real high tech, a courier to the telegraph office. But *now*? WTF? Why are we still doing this by the millions and millions when it is all digital and can be done over wires and fiber? Why are we still insisting that people who sit in front of a computer screen have to commute daily to "the office" to do this? Aren't we past that quill pen era yet? And if they don't have to physically commute, shazzam, we don't have to waste money on these billion dollar massive corporate ego office towers either, another huge savings. Wouldn't it be cheaper to push better connectivity, run a lot more fiber, than to build more whizzbang commuter trains and computerized self aware vehicles and all that stuff just to sit in front of a computer? Isn't this the whole point of the internet in the first place, to allow communication of any type to be accomplished without having to physically move a human or a courier sack?
And what would an F-16 be like if mass-produced for the $35,000 market? and of course, if each didn't come with its own team of crack mechanics. Call it what, about 1% of the quality control an average F-16 is accustomed to??
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?