CERN LHC Reaches Its Goals For 2010

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CERN LHC Reaches Its Goals For 2010

Posted by CmdrTaco on Thursday October 14, 2010 @04:59AM from the christmas-break-woohoo dept.

Anonymous Dupaeur writes "The goals for the first run of the most powerful particle collider (and the most energetic storage ring since ISR) were recently surpassing the 10^32 level of luminosity, with a destructive 15 MJ energy per-beam. This is a significant milestone, opening the way to collect more and more data. The current plan is to stop the proton collisions soon, and provide an ion (Pb) beam and conclude this year with a X-mass break. The next year is expected to bring at least one inverse femtobarn of data, which is achievable with such beam power. After that, the entire accelerator complex will be shut down for a year, due to budget costs for science in Europe."

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X-mass? by suso · 2010-10-14 04:59 · Score: 4, Funny

conclude this year with a X-mass break.
Is that supposed to be some kind of punny joke?
1. Re:X-mass? by WrongSizeGlass · 2010-10-14 05:01 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  conclude this year with a X-mass break.
  Is that supposed to be some kind of punny joke?
  It's just a subtle reminder to never cross the beams.
2. Re:X-mass? by geekoid · 2010-10-14 05:23 · Score: 1
  
  what about cross beams?
  
  --
  The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
3. Re:X-mass? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-10-14 05:29 · Score: 1, Informative
  
  conclude this year with a X-mass break.
  Is that supposed to be some kind of punny joke?
  Yes? :)
  Later on they say The next year is expected to bring at least one inverse femtobarn of data. Barn is a unit of area. inverse femtobarn is collisions per that unit of area (10^-28 m. sq.) which is related to luminosity. The brighter the beam (ie, more crap in it that is focused properly) the brighter the luminosity, the more data you get.
  From, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barn_%28unit%29
  "It took Fermilab over a decade to achieve 1 /fb" (fb is femtobarn)
  And yes, physics like to make these little puns everywhere. Physicists may not all like to play baseball, but you are sure to hear lots of jokes about how difficult it is to hit a round ball with a cylindrical bat such that it goes in the right direction...
  Why do you think they called it a barn? To make jokes about it!!!
  Why is Higg's Boson referred to as "god particle"? So it seems more important!
  Puns are only thing physics have to relate to the "everyday world". Without that, you enter the strange world of a mathematician! :P
4. Re:X-mass? by Monkeedude1212 · 2010-10-14 05:36 · Score: 1
  
  If it was, I didn't even get it until you mentioned it.
  I don't know if that's the best kind of pun, or the very very worst...
5. Re:X-mass? by PingPongBoy · 2010-10-14 05:42 · Score: 1
  
  It's just a subtle reminder to never cross the beams
  Yet another cross to bear
  
  --
  Know your pads. One time pad: good for cryptography. Two timing pad: where to take your mistress.
6. Re:X-mass? by zAPPzAPP · 2010-10-14 06:26 · Score: 1
  
  Does colliding beams head on count as crossing?
7. Re:X-mass? by f3rret · 2010-10-14 08:09 · Score: 1
  
  I thought crossing the streams was the whole point of the LHC.
  Well crossing the streams and bringing about the apocalypse.
  
  --
  Admit nothing. Deny Everything. Make Counter-accusations.
Shutting down by us7892 · 2010-10-14 05:06 · Score: 1

The cost is too high to run next year. That is disappointing.
1. Re:Shutting down by Stenchwarrior · 2010-10-14 05:13 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  It seems like they could solicit money from the rest of the world since their studies benefit everyone. I'm sure someone smarter than me has thought of that already.
  
  --
  Loading...
2. Re:Shutting down by the_other_chewey · 2010-10-14 05:52 · Score: 5, Informative
  
  The cost is too high to run next year. That is disappointing.
  Bad reporting. The LHC has scheduled maintenance in 2012.
  
  However, CERN has more accelerators than just the LHC, and those will
  be shut down due to financial constraints. They don't do much cutting edge
  research anyway, so the science output is largely unaffected.
  
  Shutting down the LHC for other than technical reasons isn't planned at all.
3. Re:Shutting down by gbeagle2112 · 2010-10-14 06:34 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  The reason for the shutdown in 2012 is to replace the faulty interconnects (too high resistance) in the quench protection system (QPS) which caused the accident in fall 2008. With the interconnects they have now they can only run the magnets at less than nominal current and still have the QPS protect the magnets from damage if there is a quench. Once these are replaced, the LHC should be able to operate closer to the design beam energy.
4. Re:Shutting down by f3rret · 2010-10-14 08:17 · Score: 1
  
  Well as I understand it, it is not just because of budget constraints that the LHC is being shut down, I seem to recall there being a story here on /. about a number of upgrades being planned for the LHC over the next few years.
  Even so, the accelerator has produced a lot of data already, which needs to be processed by some theoreticians.
  
  --
  Admit nothing. Deny Everything. Make Counter-accusations.
Soo.... by BadAnalogyGuy · 2010-10-14 05:07 · Score: 1

So you editors are going to go ahead and just post any old gibberish?
1. Re:Soo.... by rakuen · 2010-10-14 05:20 · Score: 1
  
  As said in a comment below, an inverse femtobarn is a measurement of collisions, not data, so he might actually be right on this one.
Inverse!!!! by epiphani · 2010-10-14 05:07 · Score: 1

The next year is expected to bring at least one inverse femtobarn of data, which is achievable with such beam power.
Provided the inverse femtobarn doesn't react at a quantum level with the inverse tacheons (they're BOTH inverse!) then we should be fine.
I hope someone has thought of the possible interactions here.
wtf is a inverse femtobarn? Great term though

--
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1. Re:Inverse!!!! by BadAnalogyGuy · 2010-10-14 05:10 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Well, if a femtobarn is a really really small barn, then its inverse would be a really really small anti-barn.
  When two such particles collide, you'd better get the flock out. At least that's the little I've herd.
2. Re:Inverse!!!! by epiphani · 2010-10-14 05:12 · Score: 2, Informative
  
  Ok, wow, its an actual term explaining the number collisions. From wikipedia:
  The "inverse femtobarn" (fb1) is a measurement of particle collision events per femtobarn. Over a period of time, two streams of particles with a cross-sectional area, measured in femtobarns, are directed to collide.
  However, an "inverse femtobarn of data" still makes no sense.
  
  --
  .
3. Re:Inverse!!!! by epiphani · 2010-10-14 05:16 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  This is my favorite bit:
  10^-40 meters square = picobarn
  10^-43 meters square = femtobarn
  10^-46 meters square = attobarn
  10^-52 meters square = shed
  
  --
  .
4. Re:Inverse!!!! by DirePickle · 2010-10-14 05:20 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  You take the number of inverse femtobarns ( units of 1/area ) times the cross-section of the interaction/particle/whatever that you're looking for (which varies with energy) to get the total number events that you should see. So, inverse femtobarn is a good unit for amount-of-data-collected.
5. Re:Inverse!!!! by Rising+Ape · 2010-10-14 05:23 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  It's not really a measurement of collision events, though it is proportional to it. Think about it classically, for a beam of billiard balls, say. The number of collisions you get will be proportional to to the area of beam, the number of particles per unit area for beam 1, the same for beam 2 and the cross-sectional area of the balls. All the factors apart from the last are shoved together in the luminosity figure - which has dimensions of inverse area and the barn is a unit of area.
  So the integrated luminosity (in inv. barns) * the cross-section of the process you're interested in (in barns) gives you a number.
  In reality, the cross-sections don't correspond directly to physical areas (it's all quantum after all) but the principle is the same.
6. Re:Inverse!!!! by BadAnalogyGuy · 2010-10-14 05:24 · Score: 4, Funny
  
  Wow. Your analogy didn't make anything clearer. I'm just as confused now as I was prior to reading your comment. Perhaps more so!
  *sniff*
  I'm so proud
7. Re:Inverse!!!! by BadAnalogyGuy · 2010-10-14 05:33 · Score: 1
  
  My favorite bit is 1<<12
8. Re:Inverse!!!! by maxwell+demon · 2010-10-14 05:38 · Score: 1
  
  Actually, the inverse of something very small is very large. For example a millionth is very small. The inverse of it is a million which is very large.
  
  --
  The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
9. Re:Inverse!!!! by petschge · 2010-10-14 05:42 · Score: 1
  
  wtf is a inverse femtobarn? Great term though
  Enough collisions that you expect to see a collision with a cross section of one femtobarn once.
10. Re:Inverse!!!! by AJWM · 2010-10-14 06:03 · Score: 1
  
  Thank you. Clearest explanation of an inverse femtobarn yet.
  Since I have an idea how small a femtobarn is*, enough collisions to see one with that cross section is one hell of a lot of data.
  (*Take a half teaspoon (about 3ml) of stuff, stretch stuff out into a strand a megaparsec long. It'll have a cross section of about 1 barn. Now take a quadrillionth of that.)
  
  --
  -- Alastair
11. Re:Inverse!!!! by pahles · 2010-10-14 07:03 · Score: 1
  
  My favorite bit is 0. Where 1 is looking so inflexible, 0 shows the roundness I like.
  
  --
  Sig?
12. Re:Inverse!!!! by srussia · 2010-10-14 07:19 · Score: 1
  
  10^-52 meters square = shed
  Hey, don't knock it until you've experienced a shedload of uhhh... collisions with Caltech girls.
  
  --
  Set your phasers on "funky"!
13. Re:Inverse!!!! by Ihmhi · 2010-10-14 07:35 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  Could you tell us the formula for converting femtobarns into Libraries of Congress so the rest of us can understand this?
  
  --
  Random Thoughts From A Diseased Mind (Not For Dummies)
14. Re:Inverse!!!! by Jeremi · 2010-10-14 08:28 · Score: 1
  
  My favorite bit is 0. Where 1 is looking so inflexible, 0 shows the roundness I like.
  ... and my favorite light-switch is "off". Wait, what?
  
  --
  
  I don't care if it's 90,000 hectares. That lake was not my doing.
15. Re:Inverse!!!! by tibit · 2010-10-14 11:50 · Score: 1
  
  Epic explanation -- thank you!
  
  --
  A successful API design takes a mixture of software design and pedagogy.
16. Re:Inverse!!!! by md65536 · 2010-10-14 13:41 · Score: 1
  
  ... and my favorite light-switch is "off".
  My favorite number is potato.
17. Re:Inverse!!!! by treeves · 2010-10-14 14:09 · Score: 3, Funny
  
  Reminds me of that guy in a Monty Python skit: Arthur "2x10^-52" Jackson.
  
  --
  ...the future crusty old bastards are already drinking the Kool-Aid.
NOT shutting down due to budget cuts by Anonymous Coward · 2010-10-14 05:09 · Score: 5, Informative

Summary is incorrect. The LHC is NOT shutting down due to budget cuts. It was planned to shut down to accommodate the upgrade to full 7TeV beams. The budget cuts are responsible for shutting down other accelerators (not LHC). If you can even name one of these other minor accelerators, you know more about CERN than I do (and IAAPP).
1. Re:NOT shutting down due to budget cuts by TooMuchToDo · 2010-10-14 05:42 · Score: 1
  
  You're correct (as I glance at my LHC run schedule PDF that I probably shouldn't provide a link to). It appears the LHC is doing ion beam setup in a week or so (for two weeks), and then begins ion physics runs starting Nov 1st for 4 weeks. Still, lots of science to do before the upgrade.
2. Re:NOT shutting down due to budget cuts by afidel · 2010-10-14 07:28 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  It's also shutting down because the peak demand for electricity in that part of Europe is during the winter. It was always planned to be shutdown for upgrades and repairs during the peak demand months.
  
  --
  There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
I wonder if.. by mswhippingboy · 2010-10-14 05:11 · Score: 3, Funny

they'll have to take the femto-hay out to make room for all that data.

--
Sometimes the light at the end of the tunnel is the headlight of an oncoming train.
1. Re:I wonder if.. by Anonymous Coward · 2010-10-14 05:35 · Score: 1, Funny
  
  I think they're more worried about what to do when the femto-chickens come home to roost.
2. Re:I wonder if.. by Xyrus · 2010-10-14 13:31 · Score: 1
  
  They won't have to. They'll just feed it to the atto-cows.
  
  --
  ~X~
Thank You Recession! by Tablizer · 2010-10-14 05:12 · Score: 2, Funny

After that, the entire accelerator complex will be shut down for a year, due to budget costs for science in Europe.
The Great Recession that Saved the World! Don't worry, our politicians are dutifully working on more.

--
Table-ized A.I.
1. Re:Thank You Recession! by md65536 · 2010-10-14 13:47 · Score: 1
  
  It's due to it's power requirements.
  But shutting down the LHC will cost too many jobs. They need to keep drilling with the 15 MJ beams, even if it causes another black hole in the gulf of mexico.
Re:I haven't been following this. by schmidt349 · 2010-10-14 05:14 · Score: 4, Funny

There you go again, always complaining about black holes. You can bet that if they produced a whole gang of planet-destroying white holes it wouldn't even make the back page of the crime section.
15 MJ energy by Tablizer · 2010-10-14 05:15 · Score: 2, Funny

with a destructive 15 MJ energy per-beam.
Actually, it's only 14.9999999.... MJ, so we're safe. Thank goodness!

--
Table-ized A.I.
Re:I haven't been following this. by suso · 2010-10-14 05:20 · Score: 5, Funny

Have they used the Large Hardon Collider to make a black hole yet?
There has never been more of a need for the -1 obvious flag.
Summary failure? by Pteraspidomorphi · 2010-10-14 05:22 · Score: 1

The article says 2012. Is it 2011 already? Did my nap take THAT long???
1. Re:Summary failure? by maxwell+demon · 2010-10-14 05:35 · Score: 1
  
  Well, maybe the true reason is that they don't want to be blamed for the world ending in 2012 :-)
  
  --
  The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
Its goals? by gmuslera · 2010-10-14 05:23 · Score: 1

But Earth still exis
In the future... by Un+pobre+guey · 2010-10-14 05:27 · Score: 1

In the future you will be able to buy reproductions of tacky watercolor paintings depicting landscapes with inverse femtobarns. Will they have a weathered texture to their walls? Will they be colorful or drab? Will they be upside down? Will they sell them at Ikea?
Re:I haven't been following this. by sznupi · 2010-10-14 05:33 · Score: 1

I'm somewhat disappointed by this, it seems some at CERN might be, too (text in lower left part of the image)

--
One that hath name thou can not otter
Technological Terror? by digitaldc · 2010-10-14 05:41 · Score: 1

"The goals for the first run of the most powerful particle collider (and the most energetic storage ring since ISR) were recently surpassing the 10^32 level of luminosity, with a destructive 15 MJ energy per-beam."

Wait, are they trying to study particle behavior or build a Death Star?

--
He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
femtobarn? by Laxori666 · 2010-10-14 05:45 · Score: 1

One inverse femtobarn of data? Is that the euphemism they're using nowadays for "one shitload of data"?
1. Re:femtobarn? by maxwell+demon · 2010-10-14 05:52 · Score: 1
  
  It's a unit.
  1 barn = 10^-28 square meters
  1 femtobarn is 10^-15 barn, i.e. 10^-43 square meters.
  1 inverse femtobarn therefore is 10^43 per square meter.
  
  --
  The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
What is the particle energy? by catchblue22 · 2010-10-14 06:04 · Score: 1

The summary didn't mention how many MeV's the particles had. Is it that they weren't colliding the beams?

--
This and no other is the root from which a tyrant springs; when first he appears as a protector - Plato (423 to 327 BC)
The universe is at it again.... by Anonymous Coward · 2010-10-14 06:07 · Score: 1, Funny

You do realize that "Budget cuts force CERN to shut accelerators for year" is yet another example of the God particle coming back in time and preventing its discovery. Indeed I'd wager that this entire "Great recession" is do to the God Particle's insistence on anonymity. That or the theory that in this universe the CERN collider cannot operate else a black hole would open and swallow us all.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE68G3NL20100917
1. Re:The universe is at it again.... by melikamp · 2010-10-14 07:02 · Score: 1
  
  I am sure they thought of it. They will probably just open a micro-wormhole into the future and send Gordon Freeman, PhD, to smash the God particle with a crowbar as it starts moving back in time.
And the goal for 2010 were... by Cylix · 2010-10-14 06:18 · Score: 1

* LHC did not explode into bits.
* finally find the other side of that wormhole (spills out into a closet in it).
* 30 consecutive days of no spontaneous human combustion.
* Do not destroy the galaxy with spurious black hole generation.

--
"You should always go to other people's funerals; otherwise, they won't come to yours." -- Yogi Berra
Re:I haven't been following this. by damien_kane · 2010-10-14 06:24 · Score: 1

There has never been more of a need for the -1 obvious flag.
Why is that?
If they did happen to make a black hole at the LHC, it would surely not be large enough to sustain itself.
It would loose its own mass via Hawking radiation much faster than it could absorb the mass around it (which, with it being in a vacuum, is quite a large distance, relative to the size of the bh itself).
Any blackholes created within the LHC shouldn't exist for more than a few femtoseconds.
Re:I haven't been following this. by Mechanik · 2010-10-14 06:49 · Score: 1

Have they used the Large Hardon Collider to make a black hole yet?
There has never been more of a need for the -1 obvious flag.
Obligatory: http://hasthelargehadroncolliderdestroyedtheworldyet.com/
Re:I haven't been following this. by Chris+Burke · 2010-10-14 07:18 · Score: 2, Funny

Look, call me prejudiced if you want, but to me Supermassive Black Hole just sounds more threatening than White Dwarf. Or any kind of dwarf for that matter.

--

The enemies of Democracy are
Correction by Roger+W+Moore · 2010-10-14 07:50 · Score: 1

....to get the total number events that you should see.
Actually that gives you the number of event that should be produced. The number that you should see also depends on your detector's acceptance and efficiency.
1. Re:Correction by DirePickle · 2010-10-14 08:37 · Score: 1
  
  You're right, of course. I was omitting the caveat "with perfect efficiency".
Re:I haven't been following this. by marcosdumay · 2010-10-14 08:17 · Score: 1

And, just notice that this site uses Javascript to calculate its result. The answer is by no means hard coded in it...

--
Rethinking email
How can their goals be considered reached? by Drakkenmensch · 2010-10-14 08:26 · Score: 1

The earth hasn't been swallowed by a man-made pinpoint black hole yet!
What happened to all the black holes? by tp_xyzzy · 2010-10-14 08:27 · Score: 1

Isn't LHC supposed to destroy the universe by creating some black holes? It'll be very disappointing if the 2 billion investment for LHC will not even destroy the universe. If I were putting my money on it, I would immediately want them back.
Re:I haven't been following this. by sharkey · 2010-10-14 10:57 · Score: 1

Hey, there is a large genre of pr0n dedicated to colliding Large Hardons with Black Holes. Lots of money to be made.

--

--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
Don't You Mean "Extort"? by Greyfox · 2010-10-14 11:16 · Score: 1

As in, "Give us money or we'll point our giant particle accelerator at your country and give you all cancer!" Evil laugh is optional...

--
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
Just turn it up to max already... by jonwil · 2010-10-14 13:09 · Score: 1

They should just turn it up to whatever the full power is and answer the question about the "higgs boson" once and for all...
1. Re:Just turn it up to max already... by funwithBSD · 2010-10-15 02:51 · Score: 1
  
  It goes to 11^32, man!
  
  --
  Never answer an anonymous letter. - Yogi Berra
Re:Perspective by lxs · 2010-10-14 20:55 · Score: 1

Or one Domino's pizza.