Slashdot Mirror
Attachmate To Retain Novell Unix Copyrights
angry tapir writes "Novell's copyrights for the Unix operating system will remain under Attachmate's control as part of the companies' pending merger, a Novell spokesman has revealed. The confirmation, which came in a terse message posted to Novell's website, seems to rule out questions of whether Unix assets are part of some 882 patents being sold to a Microsoft-led consortium, CPTN Holdings, as part of the deal."
As the internet developer/it communities. and even corporations. its better off outside microsoft's reach, in ANY case, even if a claim cannot be laid.
why cant we set up a consortium to buy it and release it as open source ? and donate to that consortium ?
Read radical news here
Anyone who uses Linux, BSD, OS X, or any other Unix or Unix-like OS* should care, since the SCO insanity showed that there are numerous bottom-feeders out there who will try to use "owenership of Unix" -- whether or not they actually own it -- as a weapon. It doesn't matter if there's any infringing IP to go after, either; they'll still cause loads of trouble. I have no idea what Attachmate's business practices are like, but Microsoft being able to claim any kind of Unix ownership would be a guaranteed disaster.
*Which, of course, means anyone who uses the internet, even if they don't know it.
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
There are no Unix patents.
Warning: this article may contain humor, sarcasm, parody, and perhaps even irony. Read at your own risk.
Sequent patented read-copy-update, now owned by IBM. There may be others. But none from Novell, as far as I know.
That's not what Darl McBride says... >;)
Is it Microsoft, through the 'backdoor?' I hope not.
i'd say the identity management offerings from Novell are what Microsoft are after. Novell's idam system is superior to pretty much anything bar TIM/TAM or OIM/OAM.
We played dungeons and dragons for 3 hours.....then i was slain by an elf
Anyone who uses Linux, BSD, OS X, or any other Unix or Unix-like OS* should care, since the SCO insanity showed that there are numerous bottom-feeders out there who will try to use "owenership of Unix" -- whether or not they actually own it -- as a weapon. It doesn't matter if there's any infringing IP to go after, either; they'll still cause loads of trouble. I have no idea what Attachmate's business practices are like, but Microsoft being able to claim any kind of Unix ownership would be a guaranteed disaster.
*Which, of course, means anyone who uses the internet, even if they don't know it.
Why exactly should the BSDs care? They were cleared by the original lawsuit many years ago, and every line of code can be accounted for since as they've been using a version control system every since so that it wouldn't happen again (which is what got Linux in trouble in the first place because a lot of things could not be tracked back to its origins). Logically (which is sadly not the way the world works) if there's a dispute in the BSD code an CVS / SVN "annotate" command can trace it back and things can be cleared up.
Apple's Mac OS X should be similarly clear to a large extent as well, as they've used FreeBSD (as have Isilon, Cisco, etc.).
Solaris should be okay because Sun (when it existed) would get licenses for all of these things to be on the safe / paranoid side. It's why they indemnified their customers, as they were fairly sure they had everything they needed (in so far as even getting a license from Xerox PARC for the GUI AFAIK). I would bet that similar things could be said about AIX and HP-UX, but I don't have as much experience with those.
Properly run organizations can deal with any such Unix IP claim with little to know effort (though it's still a hassle). AFAICT, Linux is the main Unix-y system that has a problem because of a lack of organization, especially on the documentation side of things during its early development.
(This is for copyright and trademark claims of course. Patents are a whole other kettle of fish.)
The issue of copyrights and unix has been taken care of already. Both SCO and Novel released the linux kernel and other parts of the operating system under the GPL. Any claims for copyright infringement are rendered moot. Once those codes were released under the GPL by the "owners" of the copyright then the game is over. Thank you Novel for buying and releasing SUSE under the GPL. (Never thought that I would be glad about anything done by SUSE but there you go....)
Patents only last for 20 years. Any on Unix are long expired.
Here is the MISSING LINK:
http://www.novell.com/company/ir/message.html
And this is still NOT GOOD.
Regardless of whether these are valid or not, and regardless of whether there even should be IP, trademark, or copyright... at this point in time this BS still exists and "The Unix Patents" that novell own[s|ed] need to be in the hands of FRIENDLY *NIX entities and most definitely NOT MS, EVER, PERIOD!
Turn them over to the EFF, OSF, or Linus himself, but this needs to be put to bed to kill off any more SCO Zombies in the future.
There are also needs to be disclosure on exactly what it is ms is getting.
Pretty obvious this is a way to kill off the WordPerfect litigation. But what else?
Oh... and Attachmate you STILL BLEW IT! Send monoboi packing! ! ! ! ! We don't want him or his disease! He desperately wants to work for ms, so grant his wish already.
So SUSE is still embargo'd and can't be used. Sad, really sad, for a once great distro.
1311393600 - Back to Black
You are assuming all patents on any portion of Unix were taken out on it's original creation date, which would be a bad assumption to make. Unless you are saying nothing of importance (or nothing that could be patented) was ever done to unix in the past 20 years, or improved upon in the past 20 years. I wouldn't want to bet on that.
I am wondering what happens to Mono?
The GP:v3 focused on patent protections for a reason. Microsoft has been saber rattling about patents and Linux for years now. (http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x36tn1_steve-ballmer-threatens-redhat-with_news). Novell actually *owned* significant patents in networking technologies. SCO had no case, and dragged it on successfully for most of a decade. Microsoft could, theoretically, abuse Novell patents even without them actually being valid or applying to threaten Linux in similar fashion.
Whether they'll do so has little to do with the actual validity of the patent, but rather on the other business results of such an attempt.
Why is it that the editors seem to assume that we all know who Attachmate are?
I have a limited idea since taking a look at the wikipedia entry but come on Ed's a bit of backgound info in the summary wouldn't kill you.
Andy Warhol got it right / Everybody gets the limelight
Andy Warhol got it wrong / Fifteen minutes is too long.
... not that we were really worried or anything. The MS Police won't be kicking in my door to strip Slackware off my system any time soon. Whew!
Nocturnal Slacker
I would disagree. The copyright claim is totally bogus, so there really is no ownership of unix claim anymore. The only problems left are patents to stop unix/linux, and guess what was sold.
I thought they owned Xenix and still has some of their copyrighted stuff in Unix? Are we in disaster now?
You don't know what you don't know.
Novell's Chief Marketing officer stated:
That is, Novell will be a subsidiary of Attachmate and Novell will continue to own the copyrights.
Wrong.
At least a couple of the networking patents (the really scary ones) apply to any network device there including some of the fundamentals on the way iptables, marking and QoS are interfaced. You can basically wipe out the current prevalence of Linux in the home networking market in no time with these and a suitable budget to back the effort.
There are other scary ones there as well from the days when Novell still did networking.
Baker's Law: Misery no longer loves company. Nowadays it insists on it
http://www.sigsegv.cx/
There are already three consortiums distributing open sourse Unix:
The FreeBSD Foundation
The NetBSD Foundation
The OpenBSD Foundation
is damn fine splendid by me...cos then they ain't gonna get any warning of what is about to hit them!!!!!When I've finished with those bastards they are gonna think twice about fingering assholes for the rest of their naturals!
A closed mouth gathers no foot.
A terse message posted to Novell's website? Look, Novell... you sold patents to Microsoft period. Of course people are worried. Shame on you.
Microsoft wouldn't buy them if the patents were completely worthless.
"They've fallen behind in so many ways, and have become so incredibly in-grown." - by postbigbang (761081) on Wednesday November 24, @11:07PM (#34339486)
Answer the question in my subject above, and tell us again about "falling behind", ok? Toss on MS' software like Office, Visual Studio, & others as well?? Well - That % number I asked you for (95% or so)??? It even grows larger!
So, better luck next time with the 'F.U.D.' + your personal opinions (that don't have a backing vs. what's actually going on out there in the real world - so, keep yourself in "fantasy-land", the rest of us prefer reality).
See subject line, and please - quit avoiding the question I asked you to put up some larger numbers in % of what is the MOST USED OS there is (Windows, by far, vs. all others for PC's/Servers): DO tell us what the % of Windows NT-based OS' out there is vs. any other OS type... ok? Running from answering a SIMPLE QUESTION from myself to you of what is the % of Windows systems in use vs. others for PC's &/or Servers?? Well... it just doesn't look too good for you, now does it?? Nope.
Especially since you said "Microsoft is 'falling behind'"... hmmm, last time I checked, IF you're the leader/most used, you're actually ahead... unless you live in "bizarro world" as YOU seem to (lol).
So, again - If you can show us that any other software makers' wares are more widely used overall than Microsoft stuff is (especially operating systems, & from everything from a home PC, to a departmental workstation node, to a departmental server, up thru "enterprise-class" level server usage), then you can get away with saying "Microsoft is falling behind" as you have...
(Funny part is though, again - YOU RAN FROM ANSWERING THAT QUESTION (which OS is more used overall on PC's &/or Servers than Windows is)).
---
"You pull numbers from your hat." - by postbigbang (761081) on Thursday November 25, @12:48PM
(#34343840)
LMAO - and YOU RAN FROM BEING ASKED TO PROVE WHAT I ASKED AGAIN ABOVE, which is show us a more widely utilized OS out there than Windows is... then, maybe, you can say "Microsoft is 'falling behind'"...
(Additionally? LOL, you "StRaNgELy" lack ANY NUMBERS @ ALL to back YOUR statements... why is that? Heh, because you KNOW Windows is more widely used is why!)
---
"Nice try." - by postbigbang (761081) on Thursday November 25, @12:48PM
(#34343840)
Sure was, but it wasn't just a "try" on my part: It was utterly successful! Simply because it certainly showed you cannot back up your b.s. (lmao).
---
"Their Kool-Aid is getting old." - by postbigbang (761081) on Thursday November 25, @12:48PM
(#34343840)
LMAO, yours though? Heck, it's not even made (you ran from making it)... too, Too, TOO EASY! Just TOO easy.
Regardless of validity or value, patents in Microsoft's hands are far more dangerous than copyrights. By abusing legal process as has been its habit Microsoft can employ its huge cash reserves to cause a great deal of trouble for honest competitors, including volunteers.
In my opinion, Microsoft gaining control of Novell's patent portfolio is a gross violation of antitrust law and this violation should be pursued vigorously and immediately, not in reaction to dirty tricks that are sure to follow (caveat: I am not a lawyer).
Have you got your LWN subscription yet?
"Like any Microsoft Shrill/arse licker you are focusing on products sold whereas he was focusing on the technology itself." - by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 27, @07:26AM (#34357274)
Is an "ad hominem attack" the best you've got? Apparently so, and all I can see is postbigbang running from answering a fairly simple question.
---
"Yes, through their monopolostic and illegal deals they make with hardware sellers Microsoft do have a large percentage of users out there"." - by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 27, @07:26AM (#34357274)
So much for postbigbang's statement that "Microsoft is falling behind" then, eh? Again, last time I checked?? If you're in the lead in a product line in its category, you're actually doing WELL.
(Lead != falling behind)
Yes, you can try all your slogans (MS = Evil etc.) but the proof's in the #'s... argue with the numbers, ok?
---
"but as far as their product is concerned it is far behind everybody else"." - by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 27, @07:26AM (#34357274)
Again: Last time I checked? Lead does NOT equal "falling behind"...
---
"They were late to the game with the internet, networking, directory services, firewalls, OS secruity, user security etc etc.." - by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 27, @07:26AM (#34357274)
Funny they are in the lead as far as who has the most market share then, eh?
---
"Can you not see this?." - by Anonymous Coward on Saturday November 27, @07:26AM (#34357274)
Can you not see that Lead != falling behind?
APK