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Bad Science Writer Talks About the Placebo Effect *NSFW*

The Guardian newspaper's Bad Science columnist Dr. Ben Goldacre does a stand-up routine about medicine, the placebo effect, and the mysteries of the human body at Nerdstock. From a scientific standpoint, I can't accurately say how funny it is because I was told it was great before I saw it.

23 of 131 comments (clear)

  1. Is he really talking fast? by KPexEA · · Score: 5, Funny

    Or do you just think he is because he said he was going to?

    1. Re:Is he really talking fast? by ColdWetDog · · Score: 2

      Or do you just think he is because he said he was going to?

      Placebo effect

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
    2. Re:Is he really talking fast? by northernfrights · · Score: 3, Insightful

      All I know is that the speed of his mouth and the speed of my brain were neck and neck the whole time.

  2. Bad Science book by flynt · · Score: 4, Informative

    I can highly recommend Ben's book "Bad Science". I bought a copy for each of my family members for the holidays. It gives a very realistic overview of the current state of medical research, both from the "mainstream" and "alternative" medicine worlds.

    1. Re:Bad Science book by drfireman · · Score: 4, Informative

      Let's not forget his column/blog (badscience.net).

  3. And now... by sconeu · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I can't accurately say how funny it is because I was told it was great before I saw it.

    And now, neither can the rest of us.

    --
    General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
    1. Re:And now... by Minwee · · Score: 2

      Don't worry. There's a pill you can take that will make that feeling go away.

    2. Re:And now... by proverbialcow · · Score: 2

      Not me - I just clicked on the video because I saw a link.

      What's this? A lemon party?

      --
      The only surefire protection against Microsoft infections is abstinence. - The Onion
  4. Re:Let me be the first to say: by inpher · · Score: 3, Informative
  5. Careful watching the video by elrous0 · · Score: 2

    If you try to watch it all the way through, you'll get diarrhea.

    --
    SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
    1. Re:Careful watching the video by MrHanky · · Score: 2

      Mod parent up. I thought he was joking, but then I really got diarrhea towards the end.

  6. Citations Granted by eldavojohn · · Score: 2

    Could not find the vomiting study in the rotating drum but I believe the muscle relaxant study was of Carisoprodol and can be found at this PDF. The asthma placebo effect study appears to be this study on this new bronchodilator.

    If you're saying "citation needed" to imply that the placebo effect is not real, then I ask you why so many reputable institutions almost require a placebo group? It's obviously so they are capable of renormalizing the results to account for the placebo effect and not wrongly attribute their drug to something the patients caused themselves to believe they felt or to actually feel.

    I might take issue with his claim that the placebo effect 'caused the muscle relaxant molecules to be more effective in relaxing the muscles' (or however he rambled it) as I have always thought that the placebo effect operated on a psychosomatic or neurological level.

    --
    My work here is dung.
    1. Re:Citations Granted by pesho · · Score: 2

      Here is the reference for the 1 vs 2 sugar pills effect on ulcers study (it is actually 2 vs 4 pills). http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2014313/

  7. Re:Just another way to say by snookerhog · · Score: 2
    "Did you make mankind after we made you?"

    (thanks Andy)

  8. Re:Fast talker by Somewhat+Delirious · · Score: 2

    only one, but they told him it was speed.

    --
    The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us.
  9. In review - Meh by pugugly · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Not that I don't find placebo effects interesting, but what is it about a certain species of skeptic that says (in this case, explicitly says) they think the concept of people healing themselves through mental processes, whether you call it psychic or otherwise, is uninteresting and entirely unscientific to investigate.
    Call the same thing "The Placebo Effect" however, and suddenly it's fascinating and scientific?

    WTF Over?

    Pug

    --
    An Invisible Entity of Vast Power whose existence must be taken on faith alone: Liberal Media
    1. Re:In review - Meh by zzatz · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The influence of the mind on the body is interesting, and well worth studying. What's not worth studying are the bullshit explanations that people come up with to psychically move money from the gullible to the promoters.

      Here are examples from a more easily studied area: perception of sound. The placebo effect is easily demonstrated with various audiophile gadgets and gimmicks. Make a change and it really does sound better. Or, more accurately, you perceive that it sounds better, because you expected it to sound better. But when blind tests are done, the difference can't be detected. Except when it is, which is why the change has to be hidden not only from the subject, but from the experimenter, to prevent the experimenter from unknowingly influencing the subject. It's amazing how people can no longer tell the difference between two devices when the tests are double-blind.

      Some differences are real, that is, can be reliably detected using double blind tests. But the explanations may be nonsense. Some people prefer vinyl to digital, or vacuum tubes to solid state. There's nothing wrong with preferences. But to claim that one is more accurate than the other is not preference, that's a claim that can be measured. Vinyl has limited accuracy, easily exceeded by inexpensive digital audio devices. It's OK to prefer the sound of LPs, it's not OK to claim that they are more accurate. It is well known that some sounds may be more pleasing with certain changes made; boost the mid-bass, add a little second harmonic, and so forth.

      The placebo effect is real. Homeopathy is a scam that uses the placebo effect. We can have the benefits of the placebo effect without rip-offs and mumbo-jumbo.

    2. Re:In review - Meh by Peeteriz · · Score: 2

      Anything that actually happens is 'scientific' enough to investigate.

      Nature and the truth doesn't care about what seems reasonable and interesting - what works, works, and should be studied scientifically.

  10. Re:Just another way to say by NatasRevol · · Score: 2

    Or that giving the patient a placebo *and letting them know that* is better than nothing, and better than most IBS medicine.

    http://ibs.about.com/b/2010/12/27/the-ibs-placebo-study.htm

    --
    There are two types of people in the world: Those who crave closure
  11. Re:Just another way to say by Maxo-Texas · · Score: 2

    It's the internet. He's just being a little fast and lose with his spelling.

    --
    She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
  12. Re:Just another way to say by BobMcD · · Score: 2

    Actually the base premise is factually infallible:

    Of the people that heal, they all heal themselves.

    Or, if you'd rather:

    A human body that will not heal cannot be helped by medicine of any sort.

    One more try, perhaps:

    Healing > Medicine

    My final point would be that we could be researching HOW the placebo effect works in order to harness that power without using placebos. Getting the body to heal itself would be the ultimate goal, and I believe that the observables within placebo effects can lead us down that path.

    Once those secrets are revealed, then not even cancer would be insurmountable, because again, exactly zero cancer patients who cannot heal have survived it. All of their bodies healed themselves. We need to figure out how to make that happen directly, and understanding the mind's impact on health would seem essential.

  13. Re:I wish we had television like this in the US by WarwickRyan · · Score: 2

    > Ah how you must want the BBC

    Don't worry, the quality of the BBC's output is going downhill at record places.

    The Wikileaks news coverage was closer to Fox News than it was BBC News circ 2005.
    BBC One is now 24-7 cooking, property, reality or any combination of the three. Preferably with dancing.
    BBC Two seems to be repeats of BBC One, plus snooker or darts.

    BBC Three and BBC Four are where the quality content is to be found.... so the BBC have decided to close them to cut costs.

  14. Re:Just another way to say by BobMcD · · Score: 2

    Your feigned disinterest is betrayed by your post count.

    Bad point is bad.

    Medicine is merely an aid to the underlying biological processes. Quality of life improvement, and little else.