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PC Gaming Alliance's New President Talks DRM, System Requirements

arcticstoat writes "It's been nearly three years since the PC Gaming Alliance announced its formation at GDC 2008, promising to 'advance the PC as a worldwide gaming platform.' Since then, Activision-Blizzard has publicly left the alliance, Sony DADC – developer of the controversial SecuROM DRM software – has signed up and some people are wondering if the PCGA is really acting in the best interests of PC gamers. However, in December 2010 the alliance appointed a new president — Intel's Matt Ployhar — who's promising to make some changes. In this in-depth interview, Ployhar reveals that he wants to tempt Activision Blizzard back to the alliance, saying that 'Activision's Kotick and Blizzard's Morhaime may be more aligned with our future objectives than they may realize.' He also discusses Sony DADC's role in the alliance, and the group's stance on DRM, explaining that its research can 'really help to influence Sony DADC's and other members' awareness of key trends taking place in the PC gaming ecosystem. Given the trend of retail's diminishing presence, free-to-play, games moving towards authentication, game streaming and so on, it's really hard to divine where DRM solutions fit into this equation in the future.'"

24 of 163 comments (clear)

  1. PC Gaming Alliance is a Joke by Kenichi+Tanaka · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Could this moron at the PC Gaming Alliance be even more vague? DRM and authentication for PC Games is a bad idea ... when they start talking about getting rid of it, then I'll listen. No wonder Sony and Blizzard left them.

    1. Re:PC Gaming Alliance is a Joke by Elbart · · Score: 2, Informative

      Sony joined, not left.

    2. Re:PC Gaming Alliance is a Joke by Elbereth · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Why, exactly, is it such a bad idea?

      I dislike it, but that's mostly because I'm a consumer. As a consumer, many things strike me as annoyances (or downright stupid) that are actually good business sense (or so I'm told). From the point of view of the corporate suits that actually run the gaming companies, I'm sure DRM looks very good: it protects their assets for a time (all they really need is for the DRM to last long enough for the first wave of purchases, which make the game a hit or not), it combats casual piracy, and it gives them a warm fuzzy feeling, kind of like taking an umbrella out into a tornado. Now, you may be saying, "But taking an umbrella out into a tornado is fucking stupid. It accomplishes nothing!", and you'd be right. But if the psychological effect is reassuring, you'll face a real uphill battle convincing the person to give up their security blanket. Or security umbrella, as the case may be.

      From your and my point of view, DRM is stupid and annoying. It does nothing for us but annoy the hell out of us. It's rather quickly subverted, as well. But consider that the gaming companies aren't looking for a 100% reliable solution; they're just trying to recover as much of their profits as possible. I can't really begrudge them that, though I can (and do) resent it.

      Is DRM doing what *they* want it to? They wouldn't keep using it, if it weren't, even if it merely gives them that warm fuzzy feeling. Does it seem stupid, useless, and a waste of money to you? Surely. But you need to look at it from their point of view, as well. I'm not saying that DRM is necessary or that it truly does increase revenues for them, but if it means that they'll pull out of the PC market without DRM, I'm at least willing to entertain the possibility of buying DRM-encumbered games. But as soon as it's on my hard drive, I download the no-cd, of course.

    3. Re:PC Gaming Alliance is a Joke by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Also where does it stop?

      Lets "Authenticate" you are allowed to play this dvd, read this book, etc.

      I understand they want to protect their products from been "stolen", but use other avenues like using the police and courts. I don't want to feel like I'm living in 1984 every time I want to watch/read/play something.

       

    4. Re:PC Gaming Alliance is a Joke by Lumpy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Sony just joined because of their draconian stance on DRM. Sony LOVES DRM.

      There is a standing fact; These guys HATE the players and customers. This is why the DRM is so bad that you have to pirate it to get a good gaming experience. I have actually stopped PC gaming completely. IT's not worth it anymore. Buy a game, go searching for the cracks and irate tools so I can play the damn thing without having to be connected to the internet or have the Disc in. I gave up and now travel with a DS and a PSP which is sad because I have a killer gaming laptop.

      At home I now really only play Xbox360 and Wii. Games have far more immersion on a 62" plasma than the 24" monitor, I dont have to fight or wait through a 20 minute install. put in disc and play. no register on their servers, no other crap, no entering a key code. insert disc->play. PC games can easily be this way with a install option so I dont need the disc.

      PC Gaming is dead to me. and all because of the PC Gaming Alliance.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    5. Re:PC Gaming Alliance is a Joke by Lumpy · · Score: 2

      If you like Eve Online then try Allegiance.

      Free to download and free to play. And it strips out all the crap and gives you combat-combat-combat.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    6. Re:PC Gaming Alliance is a Joke by MogNuts · · Score: 4, Informative

      Quitter.

      This is not a personal attack against u. But I hate this prevailing opinion.

      1) Buy from Steam or some other downloaded service. No CD required. No crack required. AND games are automatically updated in the background without user intervention

      2) You can hook up a gaming PC to a TV in your living room so easy it's not even funny. It requires the purchase of one $5 cable. That's so hard!

      3) 20 minute install? Easy answer. PS3 30-minute installs. And if u buy a game on Steam, once it's downloaded, it's installed. Done.

      4) Key codes. Yea I'll give u that one, again unless u buy on steam.

      5) Registering on servers. False. Now even console games do it. Recently I had to register to play Medal of Honor online on the console.

      6) And the biggest, a point u didn't say but I want to address. "U need a $1500-2000 gaming rig or upgraded ur computer with a $500 card every year." BS. I have a C2D Duo with 2GB RAM and a 8800 GTS 512. I still run most games on max settings. And gasp u can always try playing a game at High or medium settings instead of Highest/max. You still run a resolution 2x-3x the console version so it still looks nicer. What do u think consoles run it at? 900x400 at *lowest* quality graphics settings. And nowadays I can't get over how console graphics look totally like shit. I can't even play them anymore they look so bad.

      /end rant

    7. Re:PC Gaming Alliance is a Joke by MogNuts · · Score: 2

      so wait... you are taking 8 years of xbox live account subscription into this (never mind that it's the only console out there that charges for regular multiplayer for most games) and yet not accounting that within 8 years you WILL need new pc hardware?

      1) You make it seem like there are tons of consoles. News flash. There are only 2 consoles that do multiplayer. The Wii doesn't count because it's online multiplayer is well plain awful.

      2) You won't need new hardware unless you want to play SOME new games at MAX settings. Many are still playable at MAX settings and all are playable at HIGH or worst case MEDIUM. And how is this different from a console? When the PS4 comes out with better graphics, you can't play PS4 games on a PS3. I'm not seeing the sense here.

      In 2003 we were using 2ghz p4's with 512mb-1gb ram tops, do you seriously think a modern game can play on that machine by your 8 year lifecycle of pc's idea?

      360 came out the end of 2005 IIRC. At that time, the 7950 GTX was out. And 2 GB was normal then. Your specs were ancient when the 360 was released.

      Either cut back the xbox live subscription years in your equation (and hard disk since you wouldn't be talking about an ancient model) or add in the cost of significantly upgrading the pc over said time.

      I'll cut back on XBL, because yes PS3 is an option, the ONLY other option (although I would argue against this because a lot of gamers might want 360 exclusives). However, in the past 2 years you *must* have a bigger HD. So If you bought a 360 in the average time, around 06-07, the big HD was 20 GB. Nowadays, you download XBL titles or 1 downloaded AAA game from the store, you're SOL. So no, u must factor in the $130 upgrade. My PC on the other hand in '07 was 250 GB.

      The PC, no you wouldn't factor in the cost of upgrading. Did u even read what I wrote about still being able to play many games at max settings? I bought my PC in 07 with a 8800 GTS 512, 2 GB RAM, and a C2D 6400 2.13 ghz. That's ancient specs, yet I still play things fine.

      Also, I am presently running an otherwise very modern quad core, 6gb ram etc with an ancient (circa 2006) geforce 7950, if you seriously think that it is sufficient for most 'modern' pc games, you are sorely mistaken.

      I'd be happy to show you proof. List of games that I have that play at max settings on ACTUAL (not upscaled like consoles) 1920x1080 *on my HDTV* at 2x AA:

      Bioshock
      Bioshock 2
      Medal of Honor (new one)
      Borderlands
      CoD 4
      CoD WaW
      C&C RA3
      L4D
      L4D2
      Dead Space
      Resident Evil 4
      Resident Evil 5
      Age of Conan
      Assassins Creed 1
      Dark Sector
      FEAR 2
      Fallout 3
      Far Cry 2
      S.T.A.L.K.E.R
      Mass effect
      Mass effect 2
      Mirror's Edge
      Quantum of Solace
      Prototype
      Street Fighter IV
      All the new Tomb Raiders
      The Witcher
      Oblivion

      Man, can't run anything with your specs huh?

      You assume pc hardware requirements haven't went up because newer consoles haven't been released. In the pc only realm requirements have went up over time significantly.

      See the list of games above. And again, from my post, what's to stop you from turning it down from MAX to HIGH? Poor baby. My point exactly. You'd rather just bow out of PC gaming that play your precious PC game at HIGH settings?

      Again, quitters.

    8. Re:PC Gaming Alliance is a Joke by g_rampage · · Score: 2

      Many of those older games had some form of DRM in the physical media form. Also, and more importantly in my opinion, many older games (not 5 years old but definitely 10) won't run well on modern PCs. The GOG versions are tweaked to run properly on modern systems. That's worth 5 bucks alone in many cases.

  2. Re:Pc gaming = Too hard by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

    Which is about as relevant as gameboy 1 games not working on the DS.

  3. Re:Pc gaming = Too hard by W2k · · Score: 2

    Try something like Steam where buying and installing a game is something like four clicks (one to select the game, one to click install, one to confirm the payment information and one to start the game). They have quite a few "classic" games as well, updated to run on the latest version of Windows with sound and graphics.

    --
    Quality, performance, value; you get only two, and you don't always get to pick.
  4. Re:Pc gaming = Too hard by Sparrow1492 · · Score: 2
    You've got to be kidding. You're really expecting a 20 year old game to just work out of the box in 2010? If you took a console from that same era today like the Super NES and just slid the cartridge in chances are it's not going to work first try either, because that cartridge is old and not made to play 20 years later.

    If you want it to be easy, tools like DOSBox will do that. I routinely pull out the old dos games and they work like a champ, but I expect to at least take a little effort because of the age. I bet it would work for WC1 too. I put MS Virtual PC on my wife's PC and now she can run many of her XP games that don't like Vista or 7 either, so there's yet another solution.

  5. Re:Pc gaming = Too hard by sa1lnr · · Score: 2

    I had a similar problem. My twenty year old SNES cartridge just wouldn't work on my Wii no matter what I tried.

    For your problem I would suggest:

    http://www.dosbox.com/news.php?show_news=1

    I personally use:

    http://dfendreloaded.sourceforge.net/

  6. Sandy Bridge by ThatsNotPudding · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Starting now, the DRM will be baked into the silicon.

  7. DRM is slowly choking PC gaming by Drakkenmensch · · Score: 2

    It's a simple concept to grasp. DRM makes your legally bought games harder to play, more prone to fail and can potentially cripple your whole system. Pirated games have none of this. The industry needs to reverse this trend, and by reversing it I don't mean increasing it with harsher DRM schemes that only punish legitimate customers.

  8. So you want to "advance the PC gaming platform"? by Opportunist · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Here's a one step path to success: Don't devalue your own games and drive people to console gaming. It is actually that simple. Allow me to tell you how this can be achived.

    1. Create menus and controls that lend themselves to the way PC games can be played and are played.
    It should be a no-brainer, but it is anything but that. With more and more games you don't even only "feel" like they're cheap knockoff console ports, they very obviously are. Menus that can't be sensibly navigated with a mouse because they're made for console controllers. Controls that are harebrained at best until you somehow jury-rig a game controller into your PC. That blows twice as hard if it's a game that asks for keyboard/mouse input like a FPS or RTS game.

    2. Let me resell my game or at least make it cheaper than the console version.
    I can resell console games. Which in turn allows me to shave about 30-50% off the price of a game because that's what a second hand sale will net me. If the PC game isn't at least 30-50% cheaper, why should I go for the PC version? Especially if the game handles as badly as the console version, because of 1).

    3. Make sure it works!
    Again, should be a no-brainer, but more and more games require me to jump through more and more hoops just to play. Why does it work for Steam, GOG and Impulse?

    4. Don't devalue your games with pointless DRM.
    Note the pointless. DRM, as much as anyone hates it, is probably a requirement to make sure at least the "playground copying" stops being a problem. Ok. We got used to having CDs in our drives, and the consoles are even on this field. The new "be online or don't play" crap certainly puts a dent into this and again favors the console as the gaming platform of choice, because it does not feature this problem. And it is nothing but a source of problems for the customer, he doesn't really have any benefit from it.

    In short, if you want to promote PC gaming, don't cripple games 'til your customer rightfully thinks he's better off with a game console.

    --
    We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  9. Re:Pc gaming = Too hard by theaveng · · Score: 2

    It's clear someone is targeting C64love.
    Nothing in his post deserved a -2 modding.

    Correction: Easy to install, but making them work with my graphics card or audio card..... that's the real challenge. It's nowhere near as easy as my Atari or Commodore or Amiga where I just slide the disk in the machine, and it works, because the hardware is standardized

    --
    FOX NEWS.com should be BANNED from television and internet. Have the Congress take it over and give us Truespeak.
  10. That's cute by Dunbal · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I'm a serious gamer, and have been for the past 25 years. I've played everything from text based adventures, MUDs with pseudo-ascii maps, and today's fast paced shooters. I've killed, conquered and explored from the bottom of the earth's crust to different galaxies past and future.

    Yet somehow I've never heard of this PC Gaming Alliance which claims to be acting in my interest. They've never spoken to me or asked my opinion. Yet they say they represent me, the gamer.

    Well you can keep your political organizations, for all they're worth. I have games to play.

    --
    Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
  11. Re:So you want to "advance the PC gaming platform" by gl4ss · · Score: 2

    exactly! biggest problem with pc gaming currently is that the games are built by the limitations of the console releases, so even things like levels are done so that they're possible to use in the console environment, even if on the pc you could now use a gigabyte more.

    at it's infancy pc gaming kicked consoles to the curb because of the depth of gaming possible by hard discs and more memory.

    --
    world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
  12. As they would by symbolset · · Score: 2

    Sony is still a believer in the Holy Grail of content providers: A DRM that consumers will embrace. Perhaps it's because they own so much content. It's also probably why they backed Mariah Carey's entry into film, "Glitter" with a three-film contract they had to back out of with $50m cash. They let their motivations guide their judgments, and they don't understand western culture.

    Intel though, they should know better on several levels. Intel has enough smart people around to know that an acceptable DRM won't work for several reasons, of which here are a few:

    • It won't ever work on a technical level because of the analog hole. We're used to equipment that's HD now, but folk who pirate would take stuff that's recorded from HD which is good enough - better in some cases because a little blurring would add a lot to some HD movies.
    • And then there's the nerd problem. We like puzzles. Every new form of DRM is like an IQ test. We can't pass it by. There are so many nerds, and implementation of DRM will always be so imperfect, that it will be broken.
    • Then there's ABC problem: If Al needs to sent a secret message to Cindy across the untrusted carrier Bill he can encrypt it with Cindy's public key, Bill can carry it, and Cindy can decrypt it with her private key. This doesn't work when Bill and Cindy are the same person. They can try and work around this by making it so Cindy has no control over her equipment, but then it fails the "acceptable" test. Cindy then can't play the home movies she took herself, or stuff she downloaded that's not restricted, so she won't pay for it.
    • Then there's the end-around or "common knowledge" problem. If the message isn't a secret then it doesn't matter how well it's encrypted. Every piece of content is available now long before it's even available in a DRM'd version, to anybody who wants it, on the Internet. Perfectly encrypting it just ensures your DRM published version wasn't the public source. It doesn't prevent it from being jacked before it even was encrypted, and that hole will never close. This could be prevented by requiring that all equipment supports the DRM, but that won't be accepted. There is now, and always will be, equipment available to play open content because these are the same formats our family camcorders make of the holiday picnic - and we make content we care about too so much that we won't buy equipment that won't display it.
    • And then there's the incumbency problem. If a form of DRM were invented that defeated all of these, to succeed it would have to magically retrofit every video device ever made.
    • Then there's the real killer of DRM: the control problem. You see, DRM isn't really about monetizing content, it's about content owners being able to assert control over the content. If the technology gives them the power of control, they are insane enough to use that control in a way that prevents the DRM from being accepted, every time. They're sick, and that's why they want the control in the first place. If you give them the impossible perfect DRM tech they'll use it to ensure nobody buys that tech by asserting that control in implausibly ridiculous ways.

    Intel can't win here. They should not play this game. It makes them look bad. I have an idea why they try, and it doesn't reflect well on them as individuals, as a company, nor as a brand. In almost everything else they do I have a great deal of respect for Intel, but this stupid game gives me doubts.

    Get with it folks: the goal isn't to prevent people who won't pay from getting the content. You can't do that no matter how hard you try. The goal is to get all the money you can from the people who will pay. That is a goal you can achieve by being an easy place to buy the content.

    Content owners should get used to the idea that most people want to pay for what they get. They are decent people. They have pride. Sell them what they want. You're not going to sell stuff to the

    --
    Help stamp out iliturcy.
  13. Re:So you want to "advance the PC gaming platform" by MorpheousMarty · · Score: 2

    1. Create menus and controls that lend themselves to the way PC games can be played and are played.

    So true, it's almost criminal the way they have blown this one. I bought Fallout New Vegas, and instantly installed a mod so more options could be on the screen at once. The default scheme was obviously made for 640x480. After a while it was clear the menus were meant to be navigated with a controller. Simple things like navigating the inventory wouldn't work correctly with arrow keys.

    What saved me was that my Xbox broke and so I had 2 controllers I wanted to make use of for games like Assassin's creed and Batman which are just better with a controller. I got the usb adapter and picked up Fallout again. Like night and day. The only thing is that there is no button for quicksave, and while the Xbox controller is on, the keyboard has no effect on the game. I swear on Lucifer I will pirate the fuck out of Oblivion for charging me full price on this.

  14. Re:Every console game is DRM by tepples · · Score: 2
    Elbereth wrote:

    How are consoles different?

    Consoles differ from PCs in two main ways:

    • Consoles are generally connected to larger monitors than PCs. This allows for same-screen multiplayer. Same-screen multiplayer is far easier and cheaper than a LAN party, and some genres (such as fighting games or the party games popular on Wii) depend on it.
    • Consoles require all code to have been digitally signed by the console maker, and console makers such as Sony and Nintendo have categorically refused to sign code developed by a dedicated team of individuals working out of home offices.

    Unfortunately for indie developers, these two are tied: if your game is in a same-screen multiplayer genre, you must either make it for the apparently negligible home theater PC market or somehow get a dedicated office and "industry experience" (which I take to mean a prior commercial title in a PC genre).

  15. Console upscaling by tepples · · Score: 2

    Consoles run at 1920x1080p

    A lot of Xbox 360 games, such as Gears of War, Halo 3, Final Fantasy XIII, and both Call of Duty: Modern Warfare games, render in a resolution closer to 576p or 600p and upscale. A 576p render is not HDTV; it's the same size as PAL EDTV.

  16. The Tiers of DRM. by subanark · · Score: 2

    You want to make sure your product never gets used without permission. Its simple:

    The best DRM is to make an arcade at your head quarters where your games are. However, the arcade system is only the front end for the server that has all the logic. Invite others to use your game while under the careful eye of your security. To be extra sure, do a full search of all users before they interact with the game, along with an extensive background check of the security guards (and the rest of your staff). This way you can not only make the game virtually unpiratable, but also make cheating near impossible.

    Remove the "At your location", and just have the game servers send raw video feeds? What the gamer gains in convince in using your game, along with the reduced hardware you need, you lose in the ability to prevent bots from playing your game instead of people. Graphics are difficult but possible to steal, and music is somewhat easy. However, it would still require a lot of work to pirate.

    Keep the server side AI, but let the client manage the game resources? The client can now steal the graphic and music resources easily. You also open yourself to bots that can cheat much more eailsy, and other client side hacks that may try and subvert the communication between the client and the server that would allow the client to cheat. Speed hacks are common at this point. Or even simple bugs in the communication can allow cheating (e.g. Runescape had a bug at one point that allows a modified client to initiate a trade of 0 of a non-stackable item to another player that turned into 1 of that item when the trade was complete).

    Let the client have all the data, but only as it needs it, and you open up the possibility that the entire game can be pirated, although it may take a while for hackers to retrieve all the data from the servers, and recreate a fake server that provides it. However, at this point the client no longer suffers latency issues, and your servers don't need to work nearly as hard to provide the game.

    While your at it, you can ship the entire game, but have serial number authentication. At this point, the game is trivial to pirate, but pirated copies may have some difficulty in updating the game client. Your servers need only to perform very simple work.

    Next, you can just have a serial number without server side authenication. The user now can use your game without ever needing an internet connection, but can easily look up any serial number to give the game after pirating it.

    Finally, DRM free, just ship the game without any protection, Easy to pirate, but still difficult to make major modifications.

    Take it a step further and provide the source code with your game. Now the users can easily make mods for the game, extending life, for better or for worse. Only the terms of service can protect your game, and that only takes effect if you involve the legal system.